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True. The disintegration of the UK would definitely be an added bonus.

[Brexit could lead to a lot of unintended consequences]

Brexit would not be economically advantageous for the UK. Brexit could lead to a lot of unintended consequences. The Tories are hostage to their eurosceptic wing and Labour are led by Corbyn, neither of which are ideal in this case.

That is the politics of fear. It is an old broken record at this stage. A more imaginative approach is needed.

As Suzanne Moore says:
"Surely I know, really, that when you want someone to vote a certain way you have to frighten them into thinking that any alternative is worse."
http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2015/jul/01/fear-mongering-enemy-of-democracy-from-greece-to-camerons-eu-referendum-euro-crisis

One thing you should keep in mind stew is that Russia and the American right have many values in common. Both have a visceral hatred of the kind of liberal bullshit that has taken over discourse in both the US and Europe. The US and Russia don't have to be enemies. I can easily envision a future where family values, the church and security are restored to their proper place in society. It will take some left field thinking on the part of both countries. The truth is that the rump of both countries have enough enemies without and within to form an alliance. The US must give up their hopeless idealism though. That view is not sustainable going forward.

Define "family values".

And what is the "proper" place of "the church "?

Do you have a family yourself and do you live in Europe ? the US ?

Seems the EU don't care too much for cultural senstivities......not to mention the economic impact of any delays along with a possible failed world cup bid

http://www.independent.ie/sport/gaelic-games/shock-as-30m-pirc-u-chaoimh-grant-facing-eu-probe-34158532.html

The GAA's ambitious plans to completely revamp Páirc Uí Chaoimh are in disarray, the Sunday Independent has learned. The famous old ground is in the early stages of a massive €70m redevelopment but an unexpected intervention from officials in Europe has alarmed the GAA and put the proposed new stadium under threat.
   
Last month, the Cabinet signed off on a €30m grant to the Cork County Board for the project but this is now being investigated by the EU. It's understood the grant was flagged in Europe because of its size, and the government will be quizzed by officials in Brussels, who are concerned that it is in breach of very strict rules around State aid.

This investigation is a lengthy process and even if the government gets the green light to hand over the money in full to Cork County Board, it could be delayed by up to 12 months.

Ireland has fallen foul of the European Commission's State aid rules in the past and is currently awaiting the outcome of an investigation into its relationship with Apple amid claims that the tech giant was offered a favourable tax deal here. These claims have been strenuously denied and defended by the government, which is now set to mount a strong defence against this latest intervention.

On the weekend that a hugely successful Rugby World Cup in England and Wales came to an end, this news is a blow as Ireland prepares to launch its bid to host the competition in eight years' time.

The GAA supports the IRFU's bid and Páirc Uí Chaoimh and Casement Park in Belfast were central to it, but there are now major question marks over both.

Planning permission for a proposed £77m redevelopment of Casement Park was halted by a court ruling last year. And just last week it emerged that one of the key figures in the project, Ulster GAA official Ryan Feeney, is taking up a new position with Queens University Belfast.

Meanwhile, there remains considerable local opposition to the plan to revamp the stadium into a modern 38,000-seater venue in time for the Rugby World Cup.

The GAA lobbied the government for significant input of taxpayers' money into the project in Cork, citing the potential benefits of the Rugby World Cup to the country as part of its argument. The association also pointed to the potential value of a new, ultra-modern 45,000-seater stadium to the local economy in Cork. Reports estimated that the project would create up to 400 jobs and provide a €22m boost to the area.

Other GAA stadia which may form part of the IRFU's bid are Semple Stadium in Thurles, the Gaelic Grounds in Limerick, Pearse Stadium in Galway and McHale Park in Castlebar. The GAA had been expected to seek further government input to carry out improvement works where required to support the IRFU bid.

Croke Park and Munster Council sources said yesterday they weren't aware of any substantial hitches to the redevelopment plan. Both suggested any questions raised were a matter for Cork County Board.

However, it's understood that senior GAA officials are seeking urgent meetings with government representatives for clarification and reassurance following this dramatic eleventh-hour EU intervention.

The €30m grant had been initially announced last year by Minister for Public Expenditure and Reform Brendan Howlin, but concerns over the size of the award were subsequently raised. Earlier this year it emerged that officials in Howlin's Department had expressed concern over a cost benefit analysis submitted by the Cork board to support the grant request. Concern was also flagged in the Department of Transport, Tourism and Sport, although it had no direct role in the process.

But while the Cork board dealt with these concerns and secured final confirmation that the money would be handed over in full just last month, beginning with an initial payment of €10m, its projected estimates around revenues from concerts are understood to have formed part of the EU's unease. Cork County Board and Department officials now face a lot of legwork over the coming months if they are to satisfy EU concerns.

It's not clear if work on the ground will continue in the interim. The Cork board did not respond last night to questions submitted by email.

Earlier this year, before this latest setback, the GAA's director general, Paraic Duffy, said he was confident that both Páirc Uí Chaoimh and Casement Park would be redeveloped in plenty of time to bolster Ireland's World Cup bid.

However, the clock is ticking for Ireland: the deadline for confirmation from unions to tender is June next year, and the announcement of the winning bid will be made in May 2017. The Cork board had planned to reopen Páirc Uí Chaoimh by July 2017.

Let me start by saying the EU/US should be assisting in placing refugees in their respected countries, but when refugees refuse accommodations based on unreasonably expectations, its time to boot them. Sweden in this example below are averaging 10,000 refugees a week and had to borrow more money to help with assisting the refugees. It's mind boggling on how people (refugees) in horrible circumstances can refuse or not be satisfied with aid being provided to them.

http://www.theguardian.com/world/2015/oct/29/refugees-refusing-leave-bus-too-cold-sweden-removed

4000 over 4 or 5 years might be manageable but there are 8000 entering every day and the supposed winter slowdown is not happening. I expected the other 4 million next summer but it looks like they'll be here long before then. That's just the 4 million in Turkey/Lebanon etc. There are a further 8 million displaced internally. The total population is 28million and if , as it looks likely, Syria will simply cease to exist in the future they will all have to live somewhere.

That's just Syria, there are 60milion refugees world wide. A huge slice of that is within striking distance of Europe. Merkel has stated that "The rights to political asylum has no limits on the number of Asylum seekers" so this is the political will of Europe as it stands..and what Merkel wants is what you want.


And that's just the refugees. It does not even consider economic migrants.

Same story, family tragedy

http://www.washingtonpost.com/news/morning-mix/wp/2015/10/19/boy-6-fatally-shoots-toddler-brother-while-playing-cops-and-robbers-dad-arrested/

What a fvckin idiot.  An illegal gun, wrapped in a pair of old pajamas and the left on top of a fridge. Then he shows the 6 year old where it is......

Trace all these guns back to source and prosecute anyone (as accessories to murder) along the line who violated protocol

The NRA and Republicans are the ones standing in the way of such common sense traceability.

Indeed. You hit the nail on the head.

One thing that people don't seem to realize , and its staring them in the face, is the connection between gun control and US foreign policy. The same mentality reigns.

I find the IS claim strange. If it was over Syria/Iraq etc maybe , but Sinai ? Don't get me wrong, I'm not naïve, I have no doubt IS are active all over the middle east from  Sinai, Gaza, lebanon etc however If they have that kind of weaponry why would they have it in Sinai when they could be using it in Syria ? It doesn't add up.

If it wasn't IS then I think we are heading into false flag territory. Somebody claiming to be IS claims it to divert attention.

I don't think we should ever discount US involvement either.   

Typical western response. Everybody else is a corrupt. Only we can get to the truth. 

Thanks Bertie, McCreevy, Barney, Cowen, Lenihan ya mean!
Right wing  neo liberalism got us into the mess.

and what do you think the EU is but a neo-liberal project ? Even their own EU funded research says so 

http://www.forschungsnetzwerk.at/downloadpub/neoliberalism_eu_SR%2003-07.pdf

[like some of it, but for you it is worthy of revolution.]

Do I have this right?

You are a Sinn Fein supporter, who wants both us and Briton out of the EU, you want the USA isolated, and you want us all to worship Putin?

Bang on muppet.

Christ, another liberal bed wetter  The reason the US is banjaxed is because of wekness like this.

I have also noticed your constant theme of anti political correctness.

Most of us give out about it, even if we subconsciously like some of it, but for you it is worthy of revolution. You want to restore religion and 'family values' by taking Ireland out of the EU and sending us back to the 1970s. If you add in your obvious hatred for the USA, it is incomprehensible the damage that would be done to our economy if anyone listened to you.

I had thought originally you were another Shinner bot (where have they all gone?), but I was wrong, they all follow the party message at all times. Views such as yours are not represented by any party.

revolution 

Its the opposite. Its the scale of rapid economic and social change being imposed by unelected entities that I have a problem with.

Apparently I (and you and everybody else) owe $60000 each, the second highest debt burden in the world. Thanks EU !

Terrible tragedy. may they RIP

IS claiming they downed it. Russia saying it was a technical fault.

It depends what your reference point is I suppose and there is a lot of subjectivity. For example Saudi Arabia is ranked one of the worst in the world but I think many muslim countries (at least of the Sunni persuasion) would strongly dispute that ranking.

People are happy to consume Saudi oil whilst complaining about Saudi human rights violations. I don't think people are willing to sacrifice anything so the situation will never change. 

There are, of course, more extreme approaches that can be taken.

lets take an example. We have about about 3000-4500 people in Leixlip that are expert in designing and producing world class processor chips. What would happen if we simply nationalized that plant ?

This is some of the greatest nonsense posted on this board. And that's some feat.

How do we nationalise the plant? How exactly does that work? The government won't own any of the intellectual property. It's not a case of kick out the bosses and continue production. The private companies own the products. And then other companies see these attempts to "nationalise" and run a mile.

Now, I was deliberately vague on the exact number of employees at that plant. The truth is I don't know how many employees are indigenous. There are are probably a thousand (?) highly skilled foreign workers employed there. These people are basically a "globalized" workforce that can be moved around on a whim. This labour force is subsidised by the Irish government to keep the multinational in the country to keep the other 2000-3000 "natives" in lower scale employment. These elite employees are actually the ones that design/produce  the product and take these skills with them when the leave. meanwhile the natives are kept on lower wages and the illusion of a "knowledge" based economy is maintained.

I am not saying that dumping this model will be without pain. However, we need to have an honest discussion about what is good for the country. We should stop kow-towing to the corporations.

And now you're suggesting that the highly skilled workers are the foreign ones. In the totally unlikely scenario that the company was nationalised, this workforce would be "moved around on a whim". So now we have no one with the skills to make the product (even if we could).

Not only is this suggestion nonsense, it also manages to totally contradict itself in the space of a few sentences.

Renationalization would not be without its problems , for sure, and it is much easier to do with things like raliways (e.g. corbyns ideas) and oil (see Venezuela and Iran). I picked the lexlip plant because we don't have an oil industry to speak of and people know about the lexlip plant. It's not the best example but maybe that's why it is interesting to consider it.

As for the workforce. I believe that there has been enough expertise built up over the years to sustain production. It would mean lads would have to step up of course but you have to back your own people eventually right ?

as for intellectual property .. China has risen stealing circuit designs and fabrication processes for years  and now account for 20% of of worldwide fabless IC industry. Anything is possible if you just stop playing by US hegemonic rules. There is a vicious cycle whereby all the best talent in the world ends up working for US companies who then reap all the ideas of the best minds of India, asia, Europe etc. It is intellectual inequality writ large.

and can we stop the childish insults and confrontational reaction. Is it really such a controversial thing to imagine a future without US domination ? 

well, hang on a minute. There are some genuine questions that need to be answered about Benghazi. You cant simply dismiss them because you take a particular side in the (fatuous) American debate. It is ridiculous that a so called world power can allow their embassy to be overrun by a rag-tag bunch of allahu akbars. Surely something was wrong ?

There was, clinton got hundreds of requests for more security and denied them all, the top man begged her in some of the last ones and she claimed never to have gotten the emails.

I cant figure you out. One minute you are agreeing with Muppet then you surprise me !

The real weakness is the fact that you are having these "inquiries". Cant you see that this constant self questioning will lead to your ruin. Seriously, a bunch of allalu akhbars overran your embassy, murdered your envoy and you are looking within to find a scapegoat.

Jesus wept, you lads make it too easy for vlad to step in 

I am Irish an from Armagh, I have live in the States twenty years.

No figuring out required, I am conservative thinking over here, if I had lived in the North I would have voted to keep a Unionist out and if living in England I would have voted Labour.

The tories are hateful b**tards but the sheep elected them and are now paying the price and I am a big fan of the SNP.

That is all.

Whilst I am with you on the tories being bastards (from an Irish perspective) due to the historical associations i.e. Thatcher etc it makes no sense to declare yourself a conservative in the US and hating conservative policies in the UK since being conservative in the US puts you even further to the right than a UK conservative !

I'm not having a go I am just pointing out that this is what seems to be the problem in Western society. This "identity" politics where everybody votes for one thing in the secrecy of the ballot box and then go to great pains to maintain a neutral PC identity in public discourse because they don't want to get hammered for their views.