Eighth Amendment poll

[Syferus]

The de-catholicisation of Ireland by itself has been such an incredible positive for society over the last twenty years. This country has modernised itself at an incredible rate.

Don't answer this if you don't want to syferus as I understand it's quite a personal question did you/ would you get married in a Catholic Church, will you have your funeral in a Catholic Church?

I couldn't give a shít either way. It's not entirely my decision either so asking me the question is a bit facetious.

The only time I go near a church is if someone has died or it's Christmas for family reasons. I know very few people my age who have any engagement with the church.

Having a catholic funeral is 100% your decision. I'll give you the marriage one as it is a decision for both.

You kind of made my point for me by saying yoj go at Christmas for family reasons. We have a massive culture in this country of running the CC down and mocking the church and those belonging to it m yet when it comes to funerals, weddings (and Christmas) was use the church for our own gain.

I only go for my parents' sake. I'm utterly bored to tears and wouldn't go otherwise. I'm not using the church in any manner whatsoever besides sitting on a wooden bench in a chilly hall for 40 minutes. I don't think the Catholic Church has any monopoly on dignified funerals either. Once a certain generation die off were likely to see many more secular funerals.

What? A man of great principle like you. What will happen to your parents if you don't go - will they explode or something? I know Roscommon is a bit backward but surely a grown man can decide if he is going to church or not?

I really don't want to know what your personal life is like if the attitude you're displaying here transfers to it.

[Itchy]

Always wanted to go to a Eucharistic conference serious craic I'd say.

[grounded]

The de-catholicisation of Ireland by itself has been such an incredible positive for society over the last twenty years. This country has modernised itself at an incredible rate.

Don't answer this if you don't want to syferus as I understand it's quite a personal question did you/ would you get married in a Catholic Church, will you have your funeral in a Catholic Church?

I couldn't give a shít either way. It's not entirely my decision either so asking me the question is a bit facetious.

The only time I go near a church is if someone has died or it's Christmas for family reasons. I know very few people my age who have any engagement with the church.

Having a catholic funeral is 100% your decision. I'll give you the marriage one as it is a decision for both.

You kind of made my point for me by saying yoj go at Christmas for family reasons. We have a massive culture in this country of running the CC down and mocking the church and those belonging to it m yet when it comes to funerals, weddings (and Christmas) was use the church for our own gain.

I only go for my parents' sake. I'm utterly bored to tears and wouldn't go otherwise. I'm not using the church in any manner whatsoever besides sitting on a wooden bench in a chilly hall for 40 minutes. I don't think the Catholic Church has any monopoly on dignified funerals either. Once a certain generation die off were likely to see many more secular funerals.

Didn't say they'd a monopoly on dignified funerals, but there are plenty of places you can have a funeral which are non religious. Same as with weddings.

I understand fully your reason for going at Christmas. Personally, I prob am one of those hypocrites people talk about. I 100% class myself as a Catholic, I don't attend mass as often as I should, I have had a child out of wedlock. But you know, I still believe in the catholic teachings, I still pray to god I still feel that as a religion it is what I identify most with, I do t believe in every teaching and I fax I've had many discussions/ arguments with priests with regard to how the church has to interpret and include the modern era. I do know quite a lot of priests who are forward thinking and have their own views which they tend to keep to themselves, like any massive worldwide organisation there are going to be people with different views.
I completely understand people's choice to leave the Catholic Church as is their right I just did that when they need something for example a wedding or a funeral they expect the church to facilitate it no matter how out of sync they are

You'll not get too many on here admitting it, but we are all hypocrites to a greater or lesser extent. I've similar views about the church as you have. I suppose the question for the church is do they close the door on those members of the congregation(who they fundamentally disagree with) or do they try and remain as open as possible and keep these people in the fold.
      Mary mcAleese being a good example.

Luke 15:11-32

This is it. Maybe its the aul Irish begrudgery!

[Itchy]

The de-catholicisation of Ireland by itself has been such an incredible positive for society over the last twenty years. This country has modernised itself at an incredible rate.

Don't answer this if you don't want to syferus as I understand it's quite a personal question did you/ would you get married in a Catholic Church, will you have your funeral in a Catholic Church?

I couldn't give a shít either way. It's not entirely my decision either so asking me the question is a bit facetious.

The only time I go near a church is if someone has died or it's Christmas for family reasons. I know very few people my age who have any engagement with the church.

Having a catholic funeral is 100% your decision. I'll give you the marriage one as it is a decision for both.

You kind of made my point for me by saying yoj go at Christmas for family reasons. We have a massive culture in this country of running the CC down and mocking the church and those belonging to it m yet when it comes to funerals, weddings (and Christmas) was use the church for our own gain.

I only go for my parents' sake. I'm utterly bored to tears and wouldn't go otherwise. I'm not using the church in any manner whatsoever besides sitting on a wooden bench in a chilly hall for 40 minutes. I don't think the Catholic Church has any monopoly on dignified funerals either. Once a certain generation die off were likely to see many more secular funerals.

What? A man of great principle like you. What will happen to your parents if you don't go - will they explode or something? I know Roscommon is a bit backward but surely a grown man can decide if he is going to church or not?

I really don't want to know what your personal life is like if the attitude you're displaying here transfers to it.

When I was 16 or so, maybe 15, I said to the auld lassie this Church is some pile of shite mother - I think I will give it a miss. She said sound, its your decision. She goes to mass and I don't. Now I know Roscommon is 10 years socially behind the rest of Ireland but still...

[longballin]

I asked my mother how she felt that none of her children now goes to Mass... she said, "I dont care - Im here to save my soul not yours!"

[Eamonnca1]

Catholic funerals are anything but dignified. The deceased is sidelined and almost forgotten, it's as if the priest is more interested in sticking to the standard Saturday night/Sunday morning script and the dead person is thrown in as a sideshow. Last one I was at was for those kids who died in the Berkeley balcony collapse. There was about five priests present and they spent the first ten minutes buttering each other up and congratulating each other for the great fellas they were. It was a standard mass with a few extra convoluted rituals thrown in, but other than that the dead barely got a look in. We later went to a secular service for one of the dead girls at her university. They had photos up on display, snacks and soft drinks served, and people got up on stage and spoke about their memories of the deceased in a celebration of their lives. It was far more fitting and appropriate.

There'll be no priests anywhere near my funeral. Shower of self-important gobsh!tes, the whole bloody lot of them.

[Eamonnca1]

I only go for my parents' sake. I'm utterly bored to tears and wouldn't go otherwise. I'm not using the church in any manner whatsoever besides sitting on a wooden bench in a chilly hall for 40 minutes.

Is it just me or is that the most pathetic thing that has ever been said here? I could understand if you're still a young cub in your teens, but if you're an adult...

[Syferus]

I only go for my parents' sake. I'm utterly bored to tears and wouldn't go otherwise. I'm not using the church in any manner whatsoever besides sitting on a wooden bench in a chilly hall for 40 minutes.

Is it just me or is that the most pathetic thing that has ever been said here? I could understand if you're still a young cub in your teens, but if you're an adult...

Don't join the twat brigade, Eamonn. One mass a year doesn't kill me. Look beyond yourself for a second.

[ned]

I only go for my parents' sake. I'm utterly bored to tears and wouldn't go otherwise. I'm not using the church in any manner whatsoever besides sitting on a wooden bench in a chilly hall for 40 minutes.

Is it just me or is that the most pathetic thing that has ever been said here? I could understand if you're still a young cub in your teens, but if you're an adult...

Don't join the twat brigade, Eamonn. One mass a year doesn't kill me. Look beyond yourself for a second.

It's easy to pontificate from afar. Many of us do or don't do things to appease or keep life simple into adulthood whether we agree or not. There's no harm in going once a year and sure isn't a chance to catch up with old acquaintances. I attended an anniversary mass for a relative last year. That was the first time outside of a funeral or wedding that I had set foot in a chapel for 25 years. My ma was delighted and I caught up with a few folks I hadn't seen in years. No great hardship.

[seafoid]

The de-catholicisation of Ireland by itself has been such an incredible positive for society over the last twenty years. This country has modernised itself at an incredible rate.

Don't answer this if you don't want to syferus as I understand it's quite a personal question did you/ would you get married in a Catholic Church, will you have your funeral in a Catholic Church?

I couldn't give a shít either way. It's not entirely my decision either so asking me the question is a bit facetious.

The only time I go near a church is if someone has died or it's Christmas for family reasons. I know very few people my age who have any engagement with the church.

Having a catholic funeral is 100% your decision. I'll give you the marriage one as it is a decision for both.

You kind of made my point for me by saying yoj go at Christmas for family reasons. We have a massive culture in this country of running the CC down and mocking the church and those belonging to it m yet when it comes to funerals, weddings (and Christmas) was use the church for our own gain.

I only go for my parents' sake. I'm utterly bored to tears and wouldn't go otherwise. I'm not using the church in any manner whatsoever besides sitting on a wooden bench in a chilly hall for 40 minutes. I don't think the Catholic Church has any monopoly on dignified funerals either. Once a certain generation die off were likely to see many more secular funerals.

Didn't say they'd a monopoly on dignified funerals, but there are plenty of places you can have a funeral which are non religious. Same as with weddings.

I understand fully your reason for going at Christmas. Personally, I prob am one of those hypocrites people talk about. I 100% class myself as a Catholic, I don't attend mass as often as I should, I have had a child out of wedlock. But you know, I still believe in the catholic teachings, I still pray to god I still feel that as a religion it is what I identify most with, I do t believe in every teaching and I fax I've had many discussions/ arguments with priests with regard to how the church has to interpret and include the modern era. I do know quite a lot of priests who are forward thinking and have their own views which they tend to keep to themselves, like any massive worldwide organisation there are going to be people with different views.
I completely understand people's choice to leave the Catholic Church as is their right I just did that when they need something for example a wedding or a funeral they expect the church to facilitate it no matter how out of sync they are

You'll not get too many on here admitting it, but we are all hypocrites to a greater or lesser extent. I've similar views about the church as you have. I suppose the question for the church is do they close the door on those members of the congregation(who they fundamentally disagree with) or do they try and remain as open as possible and keep these people in the fold.
      Mary mcAleese being a good example.

The question is maybe look at modernising your fecking doctrine if everyone has decided it's rotten.

Why can't women be clergy? Is it the tits or the vagina that's the issue?

It's the property ownership implications. the catholic Church owns a lot of property. Single men don't have anyone to feed or any wives looking for a fair share.

[Puckoon]

Wouldn't be much of a Church fan - but fair enough if they extrapolate "the rules" and continue to take a hardline on their remaining congregations who for all intents and purposes can be called 'A la Carte' Catholics. They are going to have to draw some hard lines in the sand should their resolve to stamp out any degree of A la carte Catholicism and we could end up with tens of new variations of Protestantism coming out of the OG Catholic Church.

When the coffers dry and the diocese needs some Weddings and Christenings back in the door, we will see if money talks.

Personally I don't think they'll be allowed to let it get there. Rome will intervene but the Church as we know it, will not continue to endure. If it does persevere it will be come a minority religion.

[AZOffaly]

Wouldn't be much of a Church fan - but fair enough if they extrapolate "the rules" and continue to take a hardline on their remaining congregations who for all intents and purposes can be called 'A la Carte' Catholics. They are going to have to draw some hard lines in the sand should their resolve to stamp out any degree of A la carte Catholicism and we could end up with tens of new variations of Protestantism coming out of the OG Catholic Church.

When the coffers dry and the diocese needs some Weddings and Christenings back in the door, we will see if money talks.

Personally I don't think they'll be allowed to let it get there. Rome will intervene but the Church as we know it, will not continue to endure. If it does persevere it will be come a minority religion.

Agreed. I foresee a sort of Vatican Council, with more liberal re-interpretations of things like contraception and gay marriage. I also foresee women priests, or at least that male priests will be allowed marry. They have to do something about the number of vocations or it will die out anyway.

[Eamonnca1]

Wouldn't be much of a Church fan - but fair enough if they extrapolate "the rules" and continue to take a hardline on their remaining congregations who for all intents and purposes can be called 'A la Carte' Catholics. They are going to have to draw some hard lines in the sand should their resolve to stamp out any degree of A la carte Catholicism and we could end up with tens of new variations of Protestantism coming out of the OG Catholic Church.

When the coffers dry and the diocese needs some Weddings and Christenings back in the door, we will see if money talks.

Personally I don't think they'll be allowed to let it get there. Rome will intervene but the Church as we know it, will not continue to endure. If it does persevere it will be come a minority religion.

Agreed. I foresee a sort of Vatican Council, with more liberal re-interpretations of things like contraception and gay marriage. I also foresee women priests, or at least that male priests will be allowed marry. They have to do something about the number of vocations or it will die out anyway.

They tell us that morals don't change over time, but over time they've had to adjust their morals through events like Vatican II. Crowd of eejits.

[The Iceman]

Wouldn't be much of a Church fan - but fair enough if they extrapolate "the rules" and continue to take a hardline on their remaining congregations who for all intents and purposes can be called 'A la Carte' Catholics. They are going to have to draw some hard lines in the sand should their resolve to stamp out any degree of A la carte Catholicism and we could end up with tens of new variations of Protestantism coming out of the OG Catholic Church.

When the coffers dry and the diocese needs some Weddings and Christenings back in the door, we will see if money talks.

Personally I don't think they'll be allowed to let it get there. Rome will intervene but the Church as we know it, will not continue to endure. If it does persevere it will be come a minority religion.

Agreed. I foresee a sort of Vatican Council, with more liberal re-interpretations of things like contraception and gay marriage. I also foresee women priests, or at least that male priests will be allowed marry. They have to do something about the number of vocations or it will die out anyway.

they can't build seminaries quick enough in Africa for the amount of young men entering the priesthood. Vocations are not dying they are just not being answered in the western world. Like Irish priests were planted all over the world in the last few hundred years, we will see African, Indian and Asian priests moving into parishes everywhere there is a shortage.
The Church wont change and it won't crumble, I believe. It's been here for 2000 years and faced many pressures from the masses (pardon the pun) and it's still here. I have never met a woman who said she was called to be a priest...I've never heard of it AZ and I move around in quite a lot of Catholic circles. My Mrs Aunt is a Mother Superior in PA and they have a load of young women joining the ranks every year.  The mission that the two Armagh priests belong to up in NY has 2 lads going into seminary in September one from Belfast and another from Tyrone.
I don't have my head in the sand and freely admit people are moving away but we're not all jumping ship.

I appreciate the respectful approach of you and Puck to the discussion. Pax

[gallsman]

The Church wont change and it won't crumble, I believe. It's been here for 2000 years and faced many pressures from the masses (pardon the pun) and it's still here.

In those 2000 years, the Church has changed beyond recognition.

You understand the Church you so devoutly follow bears little resemblance to that which Christ left behind, yes?