Quinn Insurance in Administration

[Rossfan]

Nice to see the government's way of handling the Quinn/Anglo mess is shaping up well for them...

Aye and don't forget the €1.6Bn shortfall WE have to make up.

[sammymaguire]

Nice to see the government's way of handling the Quinn/Anglo mess is shaping up well for them...

Aye and don't forget the €1.6Bn shortfall WE have to make up.

Blame Anglo for that - Shame on them for their wreckless and illegal lending policy.

And thank the Financial Regulator for doing his job impeccably.

Sean Quinn was hung out to dry!

[Rossfan]

Nothing to do with Anglo. It's the shortfall left in Quinn Insurance from their British business that we in the 26 Cos. have to pick up.
We'll be paying that as a levy on our Insurance premiums (premia?) till Kingdom come.
Yes indeed - the plain people hung out to dry again as a result of big business ways of doing things - in this instance you're heroes Quinns.

[supersarsfields]

The shortfall came about because Liberty refused to take resonsibility for the open and historic claims on QIL books. All insurance companies have open liabilities, but these usually come out of the profits of the insurance company. But in this case, Anglo were allowed to seperate all open liabilities against the company and push them aside to be paid for by the insurance fund. Had the company not changed ownership these liabilities would have to be met first before any profit by the company. In this case anglo are now making money via the company while of-setting their liabilities against the fund. I honestly don't understand how there's not more of a noise about it? I assume it's just that they are happy to believe that SQ is the bad guy rather than start to ask questions about it.

[orangeman]

The High Court has been told that Seán Quinn Snr, who is serving a nine-week prison sentence for contempt of court, has dismissed his lawyer.

Miss Justice Elizabeth Dunne was told that during a professional visit Mr Quinn told his lawyer his services were no longer required.

The judge was also told that Seán Quinn Jnr has a new legal team.

She was told that Mr Quinn Jnr needed time to note lengthy correspondence from IBRC and that it was his intention to purge his contempt.

Miss Justice Dunne said this sounded very promising, and she adjourned the matter to 13 December

[orangeman]

SEAN Quinn Junior has given "unequivocal" instructions he wants to purge his contempt of the court orders which led to his serving a three month jail term, his lawyers told the High Court today.

Ms Justice Elizabeth Dunne, who jailed Mr Quinn on July 20 last, said this "sounds very promising and hopefully that will turn out to be the case" after being informed of Mr Quinn's intention by Ross Aylward BL.


Given the continuing exchange of correspondence between lawyers for Irish Bank Resolution Corporation (IBRC) and the Quinn side, Shane Murphy SC, for the bank, said the sides had agreed the contempt proceedings against Mr Quinn Jnr, his father Sean senior and his cousin Peter Darragh Quinn, could be further adjourned to December 13.


Those contempt proceedings arose in the context of the bank's proceedings against the Quinn children and some of their spouses, as well as against Peter Darragh Quinn and several companies, aimed at protecting up to €430m assets in the family's international property group.


Mr Murphy said new lawyers had come on record for the Quinn children and some of their spouses but not for Sean Quinn Senior or Peter Darragh Quinn.


The court heard today there was still no appearance by or on behalf of Peter Darragh Quinn who was jailed in his absence at the same time as Sean junior was also jailed.


A warrant issued by the judge for his arrest remains unexecuted as he continues to live at his home in Northern Ireland.


Sean Quinn Senior was jailed last month for nine weeks and the judge was told by Karen Nolan BL he had instructed his lawyers on November 7 last he no longer wished them to represent him.


An application by those lawyers to "come off record" for Mr Quinn will be dealt with by the court next week.


The bank's counsel, Mr Murphy, also said today that correspondence from IBRC had been sent to the Quinn side related to its intention to "recalibrate" some 30 coercive orders made by the judge last July aimed at reversing asset-stripping measures.


The bank has initiated that "recalibration" process in light of a Supreme Court decision that the High Court was not entitled to jail Sean Quinn Jnr indefinitely on foot of those orders in circumstances where there was no actual findings he was involved in most of those asset-stripping measures.


Also today, Mr Justice Frank Clarke ruled a "material change of circumstances" justified granting a separate application by IBRC to set aside a previous court decision referring a legal issue raised by the Quinns to the European Court of Justice.


That issue was whether the courts here or in Cyprus should determine the dispute between IBRC and the Quinns about their international businesses.


The Quinns had argued the Cyprus courts should decide the matter but the judge directed the reference should be set aside given several developments in the case, including the loss of a court action in Cyprus by the Quinns.


In the changed circumstances, the legal proceedings here will be over long before the Quinn Cypriot proceedings can even get significantly off the ground, he noted.

[Lone Shark]

The shortfall came about because Liberty refused to take resonsibility for the open and historic claims on QIL books. All insurance companies have open liabilities, but these usually come out of the profits of the insurance company. But in this case, Anglo were allowed to seperate all open liabilities against the company and push them aside to be paid for by the insurance fund. Had the company not changed ownership these liabilities would have to be met first before any profit by the company. In this case anglo are now making money via the company while of-setting their liabilities against the fund. I honestly don't understand how there's not more of a noise about it? I assume it's just that they are happy to believe that SQ is the bad guy rather than start to ask questions about it.

Be careful what you wish for. If QI was sold with historic and future claims attached, nobody would have touched it. By no measure is it worth the amount that will be paid out over the next 10-15 years. People knew this - the current deal was the best way of saving at least some of the jobs in the company.

That's not to say that Liberty haven't made out like bandits - time may reveal that they have. But this is a consequence of QI's pricing and their inaccurate assessment of future risk. My guess is there was political pressure to try and save the employment and let insurance customers take the hit.

[sammymaguire]

Sean Quinn Jr reported to be appearing on the Late Late tonight.

[AQMP]

Sean Quinn Jr reported to be appearing on the Late Late tonight.

Will I watch this or will I just crash the car??

[Billys Boots]

Sean Quinn Jr reported to be appearing on the Late Late tonight.

Will I watch this or will I just crash the car??

Well, don't expect to make a successful claim! 

[AQMP]

Sean Quinn Jr reported to be appearing on the Late Late tonight.

Will I watch this or will I just crash the car??

Well, don't expect to make a successful claim!

[supersarsfields]

The shortfall came about because Liberty refused to take resonsibility for the open and historic claims on QIL books. All insurance companies have open liabilities, but these usually come out of the profits of the insurance company. But in this case, Anglo were allowed to seperate all open liabilities against the company and push them aside to be paid for by the insurance fund. Had the company not changed ownership these liabilities would have to be met first before any profit by the company. In this case anglo are now making money via the company while of-setting their liabilities against the fund. I honestly don't understand how there's not more of a noise about it? I assume it's just that they are happy to believe that SQ is the bad guy rather than start to ask questions about it.

Be careful what you wish for. If QI was sold with historic and future claims attached, nobody would have touched it. By no measure is it worth the amount that will be paid out over the next 10-15 years. People knew this - the current deal was the best way of saving at least some of the jobs in the company.
That's not to say that Liberty haven't made out like bandits - time may reveal that they have. But this is a consequence of QI's pricing and their inaccurate assessment of future risk. My guess is there was political pressure to try and save the employment and let insurance customers take the hit.

I'll disagree with you. For a start it had £1B in CASH reserves that's in exclusion to the assets that are attached to the company. They had assets well in excess of the levy. The levy was put in place as a tax. They were given an opportunity to put in place a tax that they could blame someone else for. It was perfect for them. The debt from PMPA had just been paid of and this was a perfect chance to put in place something similar. and remember the historic debt wasn't going to be paid out in one lump sum, it would have been spread over numerous years so could have been handled from the profits of the company.

It's a pre-recorded interview with Sean Quinn. They wouldn't do a live one.

[AQMP]

The shortfall came about because Liberty refused to take resonsibility for the open and historic claims on QIL books. All insurance companies have open liabilities, but these usually come out of the profits of the insurance company. But in this case, Anglo were allowed to seperate all open liabilities against the company and push them aside to be paid for by the insurance fund. Had the company not changed ownership these liabilities would have to be met first before any profit by the company. In this case anglo are now making money via the company while of-setting their liabilities against the fund. I honestly don't understand how there's not more of a noise about it? I assume it's just that they are happy to believe that SQ is the bad guy rather than start to ask questions about it.

Be careful what you wish for. If QI was sold with historic and future claims attached, nobody would have touched it. By no measure is it worth the amount that will be paid out over the next 10-15 years. People knew this - the current deal was the best way of saving at least some of the jobs in the company.
That's not to say that Liberty haven't made out like bandits - time may reveal that they have. But this is a consequence of QI's pricing and their inaccurate assessment of future risk. My guess is there was political pressure to try and save the employment and let insurance customers take the hit.

I'll disagree with you. For a start it had £1B in CASH reserves that's in exclusion to the assets that are attached to the company. They had assets well in excess of the levy. The levy was put in place as a tax. They were given an opportunity to put in place a tax that they could blame someone else for. It was perfect for them. The debt from PMPA had just been paid of and this was a perfect chance to put in place something similar. and remember the historic debt wasn't going to be paid out in one lump sum, it would have been spread over numerous years so could have been handled from the profits of the company.

It's a pre-recorded interview with Sean Quinn. They wouldn't do a live one.

Quinns or RTE??

[supersarsfields]

RTE

[sammymaguire]

RTE

Why not? Afraid of something?