Quinn Insurance in Administration

[supersarsfields]

<sup>7 August 2012 Last updated at 12:00 Share this pageEmail Print Share this page

Fermanagh council to send letter of support to Quinns Sean Quinn was once Ireland's richest man

Fermanagh District Council is to offer its "moral wishes of support" to bankrupt billionaire Sean Quinn and his family.

Chief Executive Brendan Hegarty will be sending a letter in light of the "significant contribution" by the Quinns to the border area.

Last month, a judge ruled that Mr Quinn, his son, Sean Quinn Jr and nephew, Peter Darragh Quinn, were in contempt of court. They hid millions in assets from the former Anglo Irish Bank.

Despite the legal proceedings, support for the Quinn family has been strong in the border areas.

A spokeswoman for Fermanagh District Council said that the chief executive would be writing to the Quinn family on behalf of the council.

It will say: "In light of the significant contribution by the Quinn family to the economic and community well-being of Fermanagh and the border area, the council took a decision to write acknowledging that this was a very difficult time for the family."

Sean Quinn jnr and Peter Darragh Quinn were both sentenced for contempt of court
The Enniskillen-based Impartial Reporter said that Independent councillor Bernice Swift had brought forward a proposal to write to the family "in their time of distress" at Monday night's council meeting.

Describing the Quinns as a family who have "provided a lot of employment to the border county" in the past, Ms Swift said she believed it was important the council showed support "in good times and bad".

The former Anglo Irish Bank was bailed out by Irish taxpayers and is now controlled by the Irish Banking Resolution Company (IBRC).

Following last month's proceedings, Sean Quinn Sr avoided jail but must co-operate with the IBRC within three months.

Mr Quinn jnr and Peter Darragh Quinn were given three-month jail terms.

Sean Quinn jnr is now in prison, although Peter Darragh Quinn failed to appear for sentencing and a warrant for his arrest was issued by the High Court in Dublin.

Several thousand people attended a rally in Ballyconnell, County Cavan, on 28 July Sunday to show their support for the family.

Among those attending was prominent priest Father Brian D'Arcy who described what has happened to the Quinn family as a "tragedy".</sup>

[deiseach]

Like myself you were probably brought up to 'pay your dues', but if I were you I'd be mightily pissed off having to pay the dues of other greedy bankers, bondholders, shady business men (including Sean Quinn and his CFD's) and the dumb politicians who foisted this debt on the Irish taxpayers for the next few generations at the behest of the ruling classes in the IMF and Brussels.

When it comes to Seán Quinn, too much is made of the taxpayer angle because it opens up the he-didn't-foist-it-on-the-taxpayer defence. Forget about the State-funded takeover of Anglo. Even if Anglo had been liquidated Seán Quinn would still have owed the money, the liquidators would still be chasing it and Seán Quinn would still be refusing to pay his debts, because that's what he does

[boojangles]

If that's all you took from the article then it is obviously wasted on you.

You're right, it's wasted on someone who believes in paying their debts

You're a great man Deiseach. We should all aspire to live our lifes with the same honesty as yourself. If we lived in a country that upheld and enforced the law equally among all citizens then the law and the courts would be something to believe in but in Ireland that is not the case as you know. As the article mentions, when the politicians, regulators and bankers are held responsible and humiliated the same way Sean Quinn has been and the malaise in the system is fixed then the Quinn defenders may be silenced.
I won't hold my breath.

[deiseach]

As the article mentions, when the politicians, regulators and bankers are held responsible and humiliated the same way Sean Quinn has been and the malaise in the system is fixed then the Quinn defenders may be silenced.

Not a chance of that. The part about Quinn's defenders being silenced, that is. No amount of evidence of his lies and corruption will change their opinion of him

[supersarsfields]

Like myself you were probably brought up to 'pay your dues', but if I were you I'd be mightily pissed off having to pay the dues of other greedy bankers, bondholders, shady business men (including Sean Quinn and his CFD's) and the dumb politicians who foisted this debt on the Irish taxpayers for the next few generations at the behest of the ruling classes in the IMF and Brussels.

When it comes to Seán Quinn, too much is made of the taxpayer angle because it opens up the he-didn't-foist-it-on-the-taxpayer defence. Forget about the State-funded takeover of Anglo. Even if Anglo had been liquidated Seán Quinn would still have owed the money, the liquidators would still be chasing it and Seán Quinn would still be refusing to pay his debts, because that's what he does

I agree too much is being made about the Taxpayers. But that's the line being taken by the papers as it sells copies. Anglo are only too happy to have it as a Taxpayer vs Quinn fight. Takes the limelight of them.
Quinn isn't refusing to pay a dept just for the hell of it Deiseach, you do realise that? He believes that the loans aren't legit. And the fact that the state decided to enforce the Loans before ad ressing that issue doesn't change that nor would it inspire justice in the system. 

[boojangles]

As the article mentions, when the politicians, regulators and bankers are held responsible and humiliated the same way Sean Quinn has been and the malaise in the system is fixed then the Quinn defenders may be silenced.

Not a chance of that. The part about Quinn's defenders being silenced, that is. No amount of evidence of his lies and corruption will change their opinion of him

You're 100% right. And no amount of spin, lies and propaganda from the media and the establishment will change that.

[orangeman]

Reading some of the papers as past while, some of the reporting has been akin to the red tops in England - rags like the Sun etc.

Who gives a shite how much Sean Quinn's wifes handbag cost, what make of jeans or pair of shoes she's wearing or how many bathrooms are in her apartment and what size a television she watches or what her parents worked at etc etc.


I thought Irish newspapers set themselves apart from the gutter type journalism that the English papers peddled, but obviously for the Quinns and a few others, they're going to make an exception.

[Rossfan]

Ahh fcuk it I think I'll say I don't believe the loans I have are legit.
I'm going to refuse to pay the Credit Union , Building Society and the Bank.
Hopefully a few thousand people will turn out to support me especially the "GAABoard Community" and various Priests and MEPs.
Time we all stopped paying our debts because otherwise " decent people" ( Traitors/corrupt greedy arrogant b****s more like) like the poor Quinns might be expected to pay theirs.
And we couldn't be having that now.

[deiseach]

I thought Irish newspapers set themselves apart from the gutter type journalism that the English papers peddled

That was your first mistake

[Tony Baloney]

Like myself you were probably brought up to 'pay your dues', but if I were you I'd be mightily pissed off having to pay the dues of other greedy bankers, bondholders, shady business men (including Sean Quinn and his CFD's) and the dumb politicians who foisted this debt on the Irish taxpayers for the next few generations at the behest of the ruling classes in the IMF and Brussels.

When it comes to Seán Quinn, too much is made of the taxpayer angle because it opens up the he-didn't-foist-it-on-the-taxpayer defence. Forget about the State-funded takeover of Anglo. Even if Anglo had been liquidated Seán Quinn would still have owed the money, the liquidators would still be chasing it and Seán Quinn would still be refusing to pay his debts, because that's what he does

I agree too much is being made about the Taxpayers. But that's the line being taken by the papers as it sells copies. Anglo are only too happy to have it as a Taxpayer vs Quinn fight. Takes the limelight of them.
Quinn isn't refusing to pay a dept just for the hell of it Deiseach, you do realise that? He believes that the loans aren't legit. And the fact that the state decided to enforce the Loans before ad ressing that issue doesn't change that nor would it inspire justice in the system.

If the boul' Sean had made another few billion off the back of these loans I don't think he would be crying about their legality.

[AQMP]

<sup>7 August 2012 Last updated at 12:00 Share this pageEmail Print Share this page

Fermanagh council to send letter of support to Quinns Sean Quinn was once Ireland's richest man

Fermanagh District Council is to offer its "moral wishes of support" to bankrupt billionaire Sean Quinn and his family.

Despite the legal proceedings, support for the Quinn family has been strong in the border areas.

A spokeswoman for Fermanagh District Council said that the chief executive would be writing to the Quinn family on behalf of the council.

It will say: "In light of the significant contribution by the Quinn family to the economic and community well-being of Fermanagh and the border area, the council took a decision to write acknowledging that this was a very difficult time for the family."</sup>

Wow.  The last bit is fine, that is just stating a fact.  But what exactly are "support" and "moral wishes of support".  Just for the record as a rate payer in Fermanagh I was not consulted on this move by the Council!

[the Deel Rover]

Like myself you were probably brought up to 'pay your dues', but if I were you I'd be mightily pissed off having to pay the dues of other greedy bankers, bondholders, shady business men (including Sean Quinn and his CFD's) and the dumb politicians who foisted this debt on the Irish taxpayers for the next few generations at the behest of the ruling classes in the IMF and Brussels.

When it comes to Seán Quinn, too much is made of the taxpayer angle because it opens up the he-didn't-foist-it-on-the-taxpayer defence. Forget about the State-funded takeover of Anglo. Even if Anglo had been liquidated Seán Quinn would still have owed the money, the liquidators would still be chasing it and Seán Quinn would still be refusing to pay his debts, because that's what he does

I agree too much is being made about the Taxpayers. But that's the line being taken by the papers as it sells copies. Anglo are only too happy to have it as a Taxpayer vs Quinn fight. Takes the limelight of them.
Quinn isn't refusing to pay a dept just for the hell of it Deiseach, you do realise that? He believes that the loans aren't legit. And the fact that the state decided to enforce the Loans before ad ressing that issue doesn't change that nor would it inspire justice in the system.

If the boul' Sean had made another few billion off the back of these loans I don't think he would be crying about their legality.

Exactly he took a massive gamble and it backfired .

[supersarsfields]

Like myself you were probably brought up to 'pay your dues', but if I were you I'd be mightily pissed off having to pay the dues of other greedy bankers, bondholders, shady business men (including Sean Quinn and his CFD's) and the dumb politicians who foisted this debt on the Irish taxpayers for the next few generations at the behest of the ruling classes in the IMF and Brussels.

When it comes to Seán Quinn, too much is made of the taxpayer angle because it opens up the he-didn't-foist-it-on-the-taxpayer defence. Forget about the State-funded takeover of Anglo. Even if Anglo had been liquidated Seán Quinn would still have owed the money, the liquidators would still be chasing it and Seán Quinn would still be refusing to pay his debts, because that's what he does

I agree too much is being made about the Taxpayers. But that's the line being taken by the papers as it sells copies. Anglo are only too happy to have it as a Taxpayer vs Quinn fight. Takes the limelight of them.
Quinn isn't refusing to pay a dept just for the hell of it Deiseach, you do realise that? He believes that the loans aren't legit. And the fact that the state decided to enforce the Loans before ad ressing that issue doesn't change that nor would it inspire justice in the system.

If the boul' Sean had made another few billion off the back of these loans I don't think he would be crying about their legality.

Prob not Tony. But then that's why there's even stricter laws for financial organisations like Anglo to prevent individuals taking those gambles, not to help them along. 
And if we're playing that game I'm sure the Boul' Sean wouldn't have invested so heavily had he known the reality of Anglo's books, but unfortunately that wasn't to be considering the fudging that had taken place.

[orangeman]

What's few hundred million between friends ?

The President of the High Court has been told that the possible €1.65bn call on the Insurance Compensation Fund as a result of losses at Quinn Insurance Limited in the UK may not be the worst-case scenario.


The call on the insurance fund has gone from €738m to a possible €1.65bnPlay Stop  One News: €1.6bn losses at Quinn Insurance may not be the final figure
Domhnall Cullinan, head of insurance supervision at the Central Bank, said there was always the possibility the situation could look worse if further layers of the onion were peeled back.

However, he said he was satisfied the joint administrators of the company had gone through a very robust process in arriving at the figures they had now arrived at.

Mr Justice Nicholas Kearns was hearing evidence from the administrators and information from the Central Bank about how the call on the insurance fund had gone from €738m when the application came before him last October to a possible €1.65bn.

He was told the Minister for Finance had expressed frustration at the fact that the figures continued to rise at very short intervals.

In correspondence with the administrators, the minister said he was at a loss as to how such a large underestimation in the potential call on the ICF could not have been foreseen to a greater extent.

The minister wrote to the administrators in June and said the new figure was a matter of substantial concern particularly when considered in the context of the very difficult financial environment the country was now grappling with.

He said it was "remarkable" that the figure continued to climb by substantial amounts in relatively short periods of time.

In a later letter in July, the minister said he could not understand how the administrators as highly remunerated professional administrators with the support of highly remunerated actuaries and auditors could not have had greater insight into the total increased cost at an earlier stage and he said he was concerned by the manner in which the Government had been misled by incomplete information and estimation.

[thejuice]

Going back to a tread I started on the Easter Rising commemorations and the lack of civic duty or pride. This article by Fintan O'Toole (yeah, I know but lets not shoot the messenger) sums up exactly what I was referring to while also tying it into the Sean Quinn case.

http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/opinion/2012/0807/1224321629744.html?via=mr

The Quinn affair shows significant numbers of Irish people are in literal contempt of the courts, writes FINTAN O'TOOLE

SOMETIMES, YOU forget how tenuous and fragile a thing is the Irish State, how little it means to so many of its citizens. By the State, I don't mean the nation, the flag, pride in being Irish – all that visceral emotion. I mean, rather, two rational things, one tangible, the other abstract.

The State is a set of institutions – the Government, the Oireachtas, the Civil Service, public services, the law, the courts. It is also a broad but crucial sense of mutual dependence – the idea that there's a collective self that goes beyond the narrow realms of family and locality.

To function at all, we have to make the working assumption that those institutions and that idea are part of what we are, that, however vehemently we disagree with each other about however many things, there is this common ground on which we stand. Even when we rail against the institutions (for loyalty is not the same thing as passive obedience), we do so because we identify with them – they are ours to criticise. And even when we are angry at our fellow citizens, we recognise that what affects them affects us too, that there such a thing as a common good.

Everyone knows, of course, that there are subgroups – criminals, subversives – who have no loyalty to the State at all, who have contempt for its institutions and who don't recognise the notion of the common good. But the working assumption is that these groups are small, marginal and outside the mainstream of society. They are, indeed, defined by the very fact that they transgress against what we take to be a norm that enjoys overwhelming acceptance. They don't threaten the basic assumptions about the State – they actually reinforce them.

And then, every so often, there's a moment when those assumptions crumble. The idea that the vast majority of people are loyal to the State is suddenly exposed for what it is: a useful fiction. What happens is that very large numbers of people who would never think of themselves as criminals or subversives reveal the truth that they don't really have much time for key State institutions such as the law and the courts and that they simply don't believe that there is an over-arching common good that means anything when you set it against more potent local loyalties.

This is what we've seen over the last fortnight in the Quinn affair. Very significant numbers of decent, respectable Irish people – not a majority but not a tiny minority either – are in literal contempt of the courts. They really don't give a damn what the courts find – if those findings come into conflict with their own deeper loyalties. They know that two separate High Court judges – Judge Dunne and Judge Kelly, both used to dealing with very bad stuff – have used language of rare vehemence about the actions of the Quinns in stripping €455 million worth of assets from public ownership: "dishonesty and sharp practice", "blatant, dishonest and deceitful", "as far removed from the concept of honour and respectability as it is possible to be". Some idiots among them truly believe that the judges are part of a giant conspiracy against the Quinns. Most know damn well that this is nonsense, but they simply don't care.

Nor do these decent, respectable people believe that there is a common good that operates at the level of the State and that could possibly outweigh an almost feudal loyalty to a local hero. The State, for them, is a vague, hazy and distant thing – too nebulous to command any real fidelity. The idea that encouraging the Quinns to siphon off €455 million of public assets might harm their fellow citizens has no meaning for them because, deep down, they don't actually believe that there are such creatures as fellow citizens. There are good GAA people, good Cavan people, good Fermanagh people – those are the "imagined communities" that command respect and allegiance. A larger citizenship signifies nothing. The people who might be harmed by the Quinns' actions are not Us but Them.

There are reasons for all of this. Many of the most vocal Quinn supporters do not, of course, have the option of belonging to the State – they live and pay their taxes across the Border and they grew up with contempt for the "Free State" as a given. The entire political culture of clientilism encourages people to think about the good of the locality, not of the State as a collective entity. Large parts of the Irish elite have demonstrated, with impunity, their own contempt for the law and the common good by evading and avoiding taxes. And of course the State itself is now a sad and tattered thing, stripped of the sovereignty that gives it life.

Even so, it is shocking to be brought face-to-face with the reality that ours is a State to which many of its decent, respectable inhabitants feel no attachment whatsoever. Here is a reminder, if another were needed, of the stark choice that faces us: watch the State dwindle away or get serious about building a real republic.

http://gaaboard.com/board/index.php?topic=21465.0