Antrim Football Thread

Started by theskull1, November 09, 2006, 11:48:40 PM

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themac_23

Quote from: Hejustkeepsdroppingballs on October 11, 2018, 09:40:24 AM
themac_23 quote:

'Should be aligned with the leagues, the thing being even this year, the best div 2 teams didn't actually play IFC they played SFC in st Bridget's and Aldergrove. Makes a bit of a mockery that you've 2 div 2 teams playing senior yet a mid table div 1 playing intermediate, not all the clubs fault the county should set it out at the start of the year'



St Brigids didn't play intermediate as they won it last year and had to go up even though they asked to be kept in intermediate but rightly so they were told no

Aldergorve did play in it but were beat comfortably in the premlim stage by Gort Na Mona

St Endas worthy favourites but Gort Na Mona will give it a good rattle and might surprise a few.

Apologies, you're correct aldergrove did play IFC. My point is that it shouldn't be down to clubs to chose what level they play at, I don't blame the clubs I blame lack of clarity from the county.

Hectic

Quote from: paddyjohn on October 11, 2018, 09:35:27 AM
Quote from: Dunloy realist on October 11, 2018, 08:50:51 AM
to be fair i was wondering that about Glenravel this year. they won the junior in 2016 and went up for one year and then straight back down again and win it again. whats the point in that? All they did was prove that they are still a strong junior team. Cant see any merit in how that will ever improve a team.

My bro in law lives up there and from what he's told me, they had 5 retirements at the start of the year and 2 in the states. 4 came back to play through the year.

Still a Div 3 team and may be again next year with them, Antrim, Ardoyne and Lisburn all pushing for 2 promotion places. Endas had a very solid season in Div 1 thanks to developing over the years in the SW  ::)

The Gs Man

Quote from: paddyjohn on October 10, 2018, 10:08:17 PM
Quote from: hardstation on October 10, 2018, 08:44:01 PM
He will say St. Enda's aren't a Belfast team....

And you are correct! They could be SW or NA.. don't forget SA couldn't cater for their teams a few years back so they came to the dark side  ;)

Next thing you'll be telling us is Aghagallon are an Armagh team!   ;)
Keep 'er lit

Hectic

Quote from: Peileadoir on October 11, 2018, 10:16:29 AM
St . Enda's  knew that some people would find it strange that they entered the IFC but most people probably dont know that they have never won any adult county football championship at either Junior, Intermediate or Senior grade in their history. They played senior for most of the 90's and noughties before dropping down to intermediate so seem to have set their sights on winning their first title before they consider themselves a proper senior club. If more established clubs like Rossa and the Johnnies can enter and win intermediate grade championships why cant they aspire to that too.
Big favourites for the final but write off Gorts at their peril. In Sean McKenna they have a very astute coach who will have them set up really well.

Yeah look no doubt different clubs will have differing reasons for the choices they make. As an earlier poster has said it is not the clubs fault but rather the county for presenting such options.

Hectic

Quote from: The Gs Man on October 11, 2018, 10:49:33 AM
Quote from: paddyjohn on October 10, 2018, 10:08:17 PM
Quote from: hardstation on October 10, 2018, 08:44:01 PM
He will say St. Enda's aren't a Belfast team....

And you are correct! They could be SW or NA.. don't forget SA couldn't cater for their teams a few years back so they came to the dark side  ;)

Next thing you'll be telling us is Aghagallon are an Armagh team!   ;)

Armagh schooling prob a good help. As is Derry schooling for Creggan.

Na Glinntí Glasa

Quote from: paddyjohn on October 11, 2018, 09:35:27 AM
Quote from: Dunloy realist on October 11, 2018, 08:50:51 AM
to be fair i was wondering that about Glenravel this year. they won the junior in 2016 and went up for one year and then straight back down again and win it again. whats the point in that? All they did was prove that they are still a strong junior team. Cant see any merit in how that will ever improve a team.

My bro in law lives up there and from what he's told me, they had 5 retirements at the start of the year and 2 in the states. 4 came back to play through the year.

to be fair that can impact into a senior team but thats a problem for the internal structures within a club that the minors arent progressing into the adult set up.
hurl like f**k boi!

Belfast GAA man

Quote from: Spike on October 09, 2018, 09:49:12 AM
Quote from: NAG1 on October 09, 2018, 09:42:53 AM
Quote from: belfastsaff on October 09, 2018, 09:36:25 AM
I see that the Derry SFC final is scheduled for the same day - that could affect attendance.

You think the Cargin ones will go to the Derry final instead?  ;)

Both Cargin and Creggan (and both Managers) have the strong backbone of Derry education.  You would probably be surprised at the amount of people disgruntled with the two finals being on the same day
don't be worrying about the managers turning up as they are paid mercenaries - sad to see these big clubs with big memberships and tradition going down the mercenary road

Spike

Quote from: Belfast GAA man on October 11, 2018, 12:35:38 PM
Quote from: Spike on October 09, 2018, 09:49:12 AM
Quote from: NAG1 on October 09, 2018, 09:42:53 AM
Quote from: belfastsaff on October 09, 2018, 09:36:25 AM
I see that the Derry SFC final is scheduled for the same day - that could affect attendance.

You think the Cargin ones will go to the Derry final instead?  ;)

Both Cargin and Creggan (and both Managers) have the strong backbone of Derry education.  You would probably be surprised at the amount of people disgruntled with the two finals being on the same day
don't be worrying about the managers turning up as they are paid mercenaries - sad to see these big clubs with big memberships and tradition going down the mercenary road

Not too many of the 'Big Clubs' in Antrim that have not used mercenaries in the past few years.  Certainly not an ideal situation but its probably a typical situation in most big clubs around Ireland. The odd 'club member' manager scattered around is a relative scarcity.

The big managerial merrygoround will continue onwards. Neither Cargin's nor Creggan's managers will be sitting with their feet up next year regardless of whether Cargin or Creggan release them from service at the end of the season.

The bigger question is how to stop it as it is fairly endemic now

Hectic

Does it need to be stopped? Unfortunately sometimes an outsider is the best way to go. Avoid preconceived ideas about players or indeed from players. Can cut the other way of course where an outsider does not get the same respect but I think this is up to any individual club as to how they wish to play it.

Hectic

Quote from: Dunloy realist on October 11, 2018, 11:51:19 AM
Quote from: paddyjohn on October 11, 2018, 09:35:27 AM
Quote from: Dunloy realist on October 11, 2018, 08:50:51 AM
to be fair i was wondering that about Glenravel this year. they won the junior in 2016 and went up for one year and then straight back down again and win it again. whats the point in that? All they did was prove that they are still a strong junior team. Cant see any merit in how that will ever improve a team.

My bro in law lives up there and from what he's told me, they had 5 retirements at the start of the year and 2 in the states. 4 came back to play through the year.

to be fair that can impact into a senior team but thats a problem for the internal structures within a club that the minors arent progressing into the adult set up.

Looking at the Saffron Gael photos from Sunday the majority of that Glenravel squad looks really fresh faced. DR is correct that it is vital to assimilate youth into senior ranks but I suppose it depends how many you are needing to step up. I always think that if you can get 4 ex minors blooded into senior football any given year you should be in a good place. Very rare though that you would get more than one or two max becoming a mainstay of a team within a year.

Kickham csc

Quote from: Spike on October 11, 2018, 12:48:48 PM
Quote from: Belfast GAA man on October 11, 2018, 12:35:38 PM
Quote from: Spike on October 09, 2018, 09:49:12 AM
Quote from: NAG1 on October 09, 2018, 09:42:53 AM
Quote from: belfastsaff on October 09, 2018, 09:36:25 AM
I see that the Derry SFC final is scheduled for the same day - that could affect attendance.

You think the Cargin ones will go to the Derry final instead?  ;)

Both Cargin and Creggan (and both Managers) have the strong backbone of Derry education.  You would probably be surprised at the amount of people disgruntled with the two finals being on the same day
don't be worrying about the managers turning up as they are paid mercenaries - sad to see these big clubs with big memberships and tradition going down the mercenary road

Not too many of the 'Big Clubs' in Antrim that have not used mercenaries in the past few years.  Certainly not an ideal situation but its probably a typical situation in most big clubs around Ireland. The odd 'club member' manager scattered around is a relative scarcity.

The big managerial merrygoround will continue onwards. Neither Cargin's nor Creggan's managers will be sitting with their feet up next year regardless of whether Cargin or Creggan release them from service at the end of the season.

The bigger question is how to stop it as it is fairly endemic now
From a Creggan point of view
1) We are a small club, a club with membership with massive commitment, but a small club none the less.
2) Managers, the club spent the majority of the 70's, 80, 90's in the lower leagues, and the majority of the playing personnel all had that playing experience. The last three internal managers Creggan had, Sean Maguire (intercounty experience), Peadar Totten (intercounty experience), Gerard Dougan (Div 1 and 2 experience). Outside of these guys, the players with intercounty experience either wanted to focus on underage, or had emigrated to foreign lands.
In the late 90's early 00's the club realized we had really good young potential, but didn't have managers with the experience to take us to the next level at senior level
3) The club focused on ensuring we had really good underage coaching structure (3 per team), and looked external for senior management
4) Players who brought the club up into Div 1 and stayed there, and who rep the county at underage senior, are now coaching underage teams within the club. The natural progression will be these lads coaching the senior team in the next 10+ years

Each club has to make decisions on what is best approach for their club to make sure their potential is maximized. Creggan took an approach that was intended to break a cycle of Div 2 status, and propel the club into senior status. On this point alone, the strategy has worked
 

paddyjohn

Minor and Senior double header in Ahoghill.

Hoof Hearted

Quote from: paddyjohn on October 11, 2018, 03:23:14 PM
Minor and Senior double header in Ahoghill.

with the IFC in Corrigan

Common sense prevails - good stuff
Treble 6 Nations Fantasy Rugby champion 2008, 2011 & 2012

Na Glinntí Glasa

Quote from: Kickham csc on October 11, 2018, 02:41:18 PM
Quote from: Spike on October 11, 2018, 12:48:48 PM
Quote from: Belfast GAA man on October 11, 2018, 12:35:38 PM
Quote from: Spike on October 09, 2018, 09:49:12 AM
Quote from: NAG1 on October 09, 2018, 09:42:53 AM
Quote from: belfastsaff on October 09, 2018, 09:36:25 AM
I see that the Derry SFC final is scheduled for the same day - that could affect attendance.

You think the Cargin ones will go to the Derry final instead?  ;)

Both Cargin and Creggan (and both Managers) have the strong backbone of Derry education.  You would probably be surprised at the amount of people disgruntled with the two finals being on the same day
don't be worrying about the managers turning up as they are paid mercenaries - sad to see these big clubs with big memberships and tradition going down the mercenary road

Not too many of the 'Big Clubs' in Antrim that have not used mercenaries in the past few years.  Certainly not an ideal situation but its probably a typical situation in most big clubs around Ireland. The odd 'club member' manager scattered around is a relative scarcity.

The big managerial merrygoround will continue onwards. Neither Cargin's nor Creggan's managers will be sitting with their feet up next year regardless of whether Cargin or Creggan release them from service at the end of the season.

The bigger question is how to stop it as it is fairly endemic now
From a Creggan point of view
1) We are a small club, a club with membership with massive commitment, but a small club none the less.
2) Managers, the club spent the majority of the 70's, 80, 90's in the lower leagues, and the majority of the playing personnel all had that playing experience. The last three internal managers Creggan had, Sean Maguire (intercounty experience), Peadar Totten (intercounty experience), Gerard Dougan (Div 1 and 2 experience). Outside of these guys, the players with intercounty experience either wanted to focus on underage, or had emigrated to foreign lands.
In the late 90's early 00's the club realized we had really good young potential, but didn't have managers with the experience to take us to the next level at senior level
3) The club focused on ensuring we had really good underage coaching structure (3 per team), and looked external for senior management
4) Players who brought the club up into Div 1 and stayed there, and who rep the county at underage senior, are now coaching underage teams within the club. The natural progression will be these lads coaching the senior team in the next 10+ years

Each club has to make decisions on what is best approach for their club to make sure their potential is maximized. Creggan took an approach that was intended to break a cycle of Div 2 status, and propel the club into senior status. On this point alone, the strategy has worked


It def has and its good to see. Also whats pleasing is the fact that your hurlers have rose to the fore and taken silverware in-between all of this. the foundations of the club are in a good solid state and that all comes from have good coaches and people in charge of every team.
hurl like f**k boi!

Spike

#15284
Quote from: Kickham csc on October 11, 2018, 02:41:18 PM

''The natural progression will be these lads coaching the senior team in the next 10+ years''


Certainly not doubting the success of the strategy, it was the aesthetics of having outside managers that was the opinion.

The above quote is a nice ideal but will be highly surprising if it happens (other than the odd year).  Once a club embarks on outside managers, its rare they revert back to their own.  The 'didn't have managers with the experience to take us to the next level at senior level' excuse doesn't wash either as Paul McIvor and Paul Mellon were hardly seasoned managerial campaigners when they managed Creggan and KM has been around a fair few clubs now. Mickey Moran was the only one with a high profile and track record for success. I'm not sure the others had managerially won anything of note when they joined Creggan (will stand corrected of course), so Id safely say an insider would have at least been worth a punt, even for a season.

The strategy can work, of course it can, but again the point as to roping journeymen into managing GAA clubs is a poor aesthetic.   I'm sure someone on this board can point to a successful team that simply refuses to appoint outside men, but I'm guessing they are the exception to the rule.