China Coronavirus

[Angelo]

I know 13 have died in last 24 for Covid Antrim hospital at 114% in admissions.

To answer your question Every thing is affected, if we can reduce the numbers getting it then all those other areas can be fixed quicker, the hospitals can only take in so much.

Do you feel we should open up more?

I feel covid shouldn't take priority over all other illnesses.  I also know the deaths attributed to covid are skewed.

All deaths? And what about the admissions to hospital? are they skewed as well?

Covid deaths are overstated, that is undeniable.

To what degree we don't know yet, but 80-90%+ of deaths would look to have underlying health conditions. 1910reggie553

What a callous attitude. Many people in their 50s, 60s and 70s have underlying health conditions but they could expect to live for another 10 years minimum with fairly good quality of life. It's not clear at all that Covid deaths are over calculated. Many people died in the first wave from Covid but didn't go to hospital and hence weren't tested. Also many people are dying after 28 days of being tested and hence aren't being counted.

As callous of you, there are plenty of people who would live another 10 years minimum if their cancer diagnoses were detected on time and now run the risk of dying so take your sanctimony elswhere.

It is clear that there have been huge cases and reports all across the world that people's deaths are being classified as Covid when it played no role in the death.

The median age of death is also 82.

Here's an example of Covid deaths being nearly 50% higher than excess deaths in that period of time in the south. How is that logical?

https://www.rte.ie/news/health/2020/0703/1151127-virus-report/

Look at the bigger picture and stop getting consumed by Covid.

That article proves that there were 1200 excess deaths in the first wave, during the most strict social restrictions during any of our lifetimes, which is exactly why it needs to be taken seriously.

I dont know why you are using it to try to back up your point.

My point is that Covid associated death exceeded excess death by 50% in the same time period which would lead us to believe that Covid associated deaths are being overstated in excessive proportions.

A bad flu season could also return big excess death figures as we have seen before, an example below.

https://www.theguardian.com/society/2018/nov/30/excess-winter-deaths-in-england-and-wales-highest-since-1976

[lenny]

I know 13 have died in last 24 for Covid Antrim hospital at 114% in admissions.

To answer your question Every thing is affected, if we can reduce the numbers getting it then all those other areas can be fixed quicker, the hospitals can only take in so much.

Do you feel we should open up more?

I feel covid shouldn't take priority over all other illnesses.  I also know the deaths attributed to covid are skewed.

All deaths? And what about the admissions to hospital? are they skewed as well?

Covid deaths are overstated, that is undeniable.

To what degree we don't know yet, but 80-90%+ of deaths would look to have underlying health conditions. 1910reggie553

What a callous attitude. Many people in their 50s, 60s and 70s have underlying health conditions but they could expect to live for another 10 years minimum with fairly good quality of life. It's not clear at all that Covid deaths are over calculated. Many people died in the first wave from Covid but didn't go to hospital and hence weren't tested. Also many people are dying after 28 days of being tested and hence aren't being counted.

As callous of you, there are plenty of people who would live another 10 years minimum if their cancer diagnoses were detected on time and now run the risk of dying so take your sanctimony elswhere.

It is clear that there have been huge cases and reports all across the world that people's deaths are being classified as Covid when it played no role in the death.

The median age of death is also 82.

Here's an example of Covid deaths being nearly 50% higher than excess deaths in that period of time in the south. How is that logical?

https://www.rte.ie/news/health/2020/0703/1151127-virus-report/

Look at the bigger picture and stop getting consumed by Covid.

Where did I say that people shouldn't go to get themselves checked out for cancer. It's crystal clear that if Covid is allowed to spread unchecked, without lockdowns, then the nhs becomes totally overwhelmed and other patients don't get a chance to get treatment. The whole purpose of lockdown is to give the nhs the capacity to carry on with normal treatments. New Zealand locked down hard, created zero Covid, now they have businesses open, sports open to spectators, health services open. We could have that also.

[johnnycool]

Mid Ulster now has the highest COVID positive rate in the north

Derry City and Strabane and Newry and Mourne are down one third in a week. with Mid Ulster up to a 7 day rate of 536.9.
The improvement in Derry has to offer some hope for other places, if every place could drop one third in a week then the pressure would be eased substantially.

The Derry City and Strabane rates were hardly sustainable though. It was in 1 in 10 of confirmed positive cases per population over a 7/14 day period. If that sustained itself you'd have herd immunity in a couple of months.

Explain this herd immunity thing to me please.

Sometime last week or the week before, Derry-Strabane were getting over 1k cases per 100k population over a 7/14 day period.

If that sustained itself for a 2/3 month period, the whole of Derry/Strabane is infected. That sort of sustainment is not realistic so of course the rise was going to start to taper off.

and this is purely because of "herd immunity" and nothing to do with a change in behaviours?

[Seaney]

I know 13 have died in last 24 for Covid Antrim hospital at 114% in admissions.

To answer your question Every thing is affected, if we can reduce the numbers getting it then all those other areas can be fixed quicker, the hospitals can only take in so much.

Do you feel we should open up more?

I feel covid shouldn't take priority over all other illnesses.  I also know the deaths attributed to covid are skewed.

All deaths? And what about the admissions to hospital? are they skewed as well?

Oh we only do questions.  Where did I say all deaths? Do you think people who need medical care are being abandoned because of the prioritisation of covid? I mentioned before I personally know a doctor who was sent to a covid ward every Thursday and done nothing. Who looked after her appointments that day?  You think a doctor in a pandemic doing nothing whilst at work is a good use of resources?  You think in anyway the public is being failed by the NHS, and yes we know your da is getting treatment and you and your daughter are ok with getting appointments.

[Seaney]

https://www.rte.ie/news/2020/1027/1174285-gardai-domestic-violence/

There has been an 18% increase in calls for help from domestic violence victims to gardaí over the last year as well as a 14% increase in detections for breaches of court orders.

Gardaí have announced a new phase of Operation Faoiseamh, which they say entails a renewed focus on the enforcement of court orders and the prosecution of offenders.

Operation Faoiseamh forms part of the force's community engagement response to Covid-19.

It began on 1 April with the goal of providing enhanced proactive support to victims of domestic abuse.

Divisional Protective Services Units have now been established in every Garda division.

The head of the National Bureau, Detective Chief Superintendent Declan Daly, has stressed that travel restrictions do not apply to victims of domestic violence or anyone helping them escape a risk of harm.

The launch of phase three of Operation Faoiseamh is a further drive to arrest and bring before the courts offenders who have breached domestic violence legislation and in particular court orders, according to gardaí.

Incidents of domestic violence and detections of the crime have increased since the operation was established.

Calls to gardaí are up 18% year on year, detections for breaches of court orders increased by 14% and 107 people are facing prosecution.

Gardaí also said they had made over 15,000 contacts with, or attempts to contact, victims of domestic abuse this year.

Det Chief Supt Daly said the operation is in place to ensure domestic violence victims feel safe and assured them that gardaí will respond "quickly and robustly" to their calls.

Speaking on RTÉ's Morning Ireland, he said this is a "real priority" for gardaí.

"This phase is about ensuring that people who have gone to the trouble of getting a court order - that they're enforced and that people are safe in their homes.

"We've arrested and prosecuted 107 people in relation to Operation Faoiseamh already throughout this pandemic and today we will start another phase of that where we will concentrate our efforts on those who have breached court orders in relation to domestic abuse."

Det Chief Supt Daly said one of the positive results of the operation is the "encouragement and reassurance that people get" from gardaí reaching out to them.

Meanwhile TV and radio adverts for the 'Still Here' campaign against domestic abuse recommence today.

Developed by the Department of Justice in collaboration with a number of frontline services, the adverts are a reminder that for many people in Ireland, their home is not a safe place, particularly at this time.

"For anyone living in an abusive relationship or in fear for their safety, going back to Level 5 must feel frightening and difficult," said Minister for Justice Helen McEntee.

"We know that home is not a safe place for all of us, and domestic violence increased during the initial lockdown we faced in the Covid-19 crisis.

"I want victims of domestic and sexual abuse to know that An Garda Síochána, the Courts Service and other services, including the vital supports provided by our community and voluntary sector, are still here for you as we now face more restrictions."

"If you are in this situation I want you to know we will react when you need us, we will protect you. I also want you to know that the 5km restriction on movement does not apply to you if you are seeking help."

I note the usual suspects ignore this. 

[Seaney]

I know 13 have died in last 24 for Covid Antrim hospital at 114% in admissions.

To answer your question Every thing is affected, if we can reduce the numbers getting it then all those other areas can be fixed quicker, the hospitals can only take in so much.

Do you feel we should open up more?

I feel covid shouldn't take priority over all other illnesses.  I also know the deaths attributed to covid are skewed.

All deaths? And what about the admissions to hospital? are they skewed as well?

Covid deaths are overstated, that is undeniable.

To what degree we don't know yet, but 80-90%+ of deaths would look to have underlying health conditions. 1910reggie553

What a callous attitude. Many people in their 50s, 60s and 70s have underlying health conditions but they could expect to live for another 10 years minimum with fairly good quality of life. It's not clear at all that Covid deaths are over calculated. Many people died in the first wave from Covid but didn't go to hospital and hence weren't tested. Also many people are dying after 28 days of being tested and hence aren't being counted.

Is it as callous as folk missing cancer diagnosis or treatment who now have their life expectance cut?

[GetOverTheBar]

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-54710380

Suppose it's reassuring to know it's not just us.

So hard for the police to tackle this thing when it appears somewhat of a decent minority are not on board whatsoever.

[trueblue1234]

I know 13 have died in last 24 for Covid Antrim hospital at 114% in admissions.

To answer your question Every thing is affected, if we can reduce the numbers getting it then all those other areas can be fixed quicker, the hospitals can only take in so much.

Do you feel we should open up more?

I feel covid shouldn't take priority over all other illnesses.  I also know the deaths attributed to covid are skewed.

But how does that work? I've seen this mentioned before. You're talking about changing the whole triage process. Patients are assessed due to their urgency. If you have someone dying in front of you, they will take precedent over another patient that may die in 2 week's time if action isn't taken. This isn't just Covid, if someone comes in dying from a car accident, they are assessed and if urgent dealt with ahead of others as well. I don't know how you would change this?

[Seaney]

They are cancelling appointments in anticipation of the surge!

[armaghniac]

It is clear that there have been huge cases and reports all across the world that people's deaths are being classified as Covid when it played no role in the death.

Even in the worst areas, no more than 1% of people have Covid at a given time. So you expect no more than 1% of people who die to have Covid, if it plays no part in people's death. So by all means knock 1% off reported figures.

Here's an example of Covid deaths being nearly 50% higher than excess deaths in that period of time in the south. How is that logical?

This may be true to some extent in the south, but not in the North

Look at the bigger picture and stop getting consumed by Covid

You are the one that keeps posting nonsense on this thread.

[Angelo]

I know 13 have died in last 24 for Covid Antrim hospital at 114% in admissions.

To answer your question Every thing is affected, if we can reduce the numbers getting it then all those other areas can be fixed quicker, the hospitals can only take in so much.

Do you feel we should open up more?

I feel covid shouldn't take priority over all other illnesses.  I also know the deaths attributed to covid are skewed.

All deaths? And what about the admissions to hospital? are they skewed as well?

Covid deaths are overstated, that is undeniable.

To what degree we don't know yet, but 80-90%+ of deaths would look to have underlying health conditions. 1910reggie553

What a callous attitude. Many people in their 50s, 60s and 70s have underlying health conditions but they could expect to live for another 10 years minimum with fairly good quality of life. It's not clear at all that Covid deaths are over calculated. Many people died in the first wave from Covid but didn't go to hospital and hence weren't tested. Also many people are dying after 28 days of being tested and hence aren't being counted.

As callous of you, there are plenty of people who would live another 10 years minimum if their cancer diagnoses were detected on time and now run the risk of dying so take your sanctimony elswhere.

It is clear that there have been huge cases and reports all across the world that people's deaths are being classified as Covid when it played no role in the death.

The median age of death is also 82.

Here's an example of Covid deaths being nearly 50% higher than excess deaths in that period of time in the south. How is that logical?

https://www.rte.ie/news/health/2020/0703/1151127-virus-report/

Look at the bigger picture and stop getting consumed by Covid.

Where did I say that people shouldn't go to get themselves checked out for cancer. It's crystal clear that if Covid is allowed to spread unchecked, without lockdowns, then the nhs becomes totally overwhelmed and other patients don't get a chance to get treatment. The whole purpose of lockdown is to give the nhs the capacity to carry on with normal treatments. New Zealand locked down hard, created zero Covid, now they have businesses open, sports open to spectators, health services open. We could have that also.

Shouldn't? They can't.

https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-northern-ireland-53172804

You continue to neglect the ramifications that lockdowns have. Why do you continually dismiss the domestic violence victims, the vulnerable people in society, isolated, having their support services removed or reduced, the increase in mental health concerns, people losing their jobs and livelihoods and the knock on effects of such, the general social and mental wellbeing of society and young people in particular. Why are all these things completely dismissed for Covid. When are people going to open their eyes and see that what we are doing is going to create much bigger and much more long term problems than what we are trying to control.

I know Covid puts people at risk but lockdowns and excessive restrictions carry bigger problems

[Angelo]

Mid Ulster now has the highest COVID positive rate in the north

Derry City and Strabane and Newry and Mourne are down one third in a week. with Mid Ulster up to a 7 day rate of 536.9.
The improvement in Derry has to offer some hope for other places, if every place could drop one third in a week then the pressure would be eased substantially.

The Derry City and Strabane rates were hardly sustainable though. It was in 1 in 10 of confirmed positive cases per population over a 7/14 day period. If that sustained itself you'd have herd immunity in a couple of months.

Explain this herd immunity thing to me please.

Sometime last week or the week before, Derry-Strabane were getting over 1k cases per 100k population over a 7/14 day period.

If that sustained itself for a 2/3 month period, the whole of Derry/Strabane is infected. That sort of sustainment is not realistic so of course the rise was going to start to taper off.

and this is purely because of "herd immunity" and nothing to do with a change in behaviours?

I don't get your point. What is it?

Those kind of daily figures that were happening in Derry/Strabane are simply not sustainable in the long term.

[trueblue1234]

They are cancelling appointments in anticipation of the surge!

The surge is already here. Cancellations are also as a response to staffing levels dropping due to staff isolating. There was 2700 NHS staff members missing a week or two ago due to isolation, I know personally that this is having a huge impact.
They were pulling people from different wards to help cover the gaps. They just don't have the resources to manage the current covid caseload and also do elective surgery.
Did they act too quickly in puling resources from elective surgery? Possibly, I don't know. But it was inevitable that the increases rates of Covid were going to severely impact the rest of the NHS both on demand and staffing availability. 

[Rossfan]

For the Thickos
More cases of Covid =more people needing hospitalisation = more cases in ICU = less hospital/ICU space for people with  other diseases.

[Angelo]

It is clear that there have been huge cases and reports all across the world that people's deaths are being classified as Covid when it played no role in the death.

Even in the worst areas, no more than 1% of people have Covid at a given time. So you expect no more than 1% of people who die to have Covid, if it plays no part in people's death. So by all means knock 1% off reported figures.

Here's an example of Covid deaths being nearly 50% higher than excess deaths in that period of time in the south. How is that logical?

This may be true to some extent in the south, but not in the North

Look at the bigger picture and stop getting consumed by Covid

Even in the worst areas, no more than 1% of people have Covid at a given time. So you expect no more than 1% of people who die to have Covid, if it plays no part in people's death. So by all means knock 1% off reported figures.

Completely speculative. We know that it was slightly over 1% in Derry/Strabane a fortnight ago and that's only what the testing was picking up, it was likely much higher. Knock 1% off reported figures? Eh, that study in the south showed that Covid deaths exceeded excess death by 50%, if we tested every single person that died for flu, how much of a rise do you think we would have with flu deaths every year? There are huge concerns with the classification of Covid deaths, it has been brought up in nearly every European country.

The mean age of Covid deaths also exceeds avg life expectancy in both the UK and Ireland. 80-90% of those who are recorded of dying from Covid have underlying health conditions so we are seeing that people classified as dying from Covid are primarily and to an extensive degree people who are both elderly and with underlying health conditions.

This may be true to some extent in the south, but not in the North

Another assertive claim with absolutely no basis or foundation. How could you possibly know that? This is the problem with people like you propagating fear with misinformation.

You are the one that keeps posting nonsense on this thread.

You're the one making assertive claims without any foundation and only spreading your own biases. I'm the one trying to get people to look at the bigger picture. So spare me your misplaced arrogance.