Graham Linehan on Twitter / Trans debate

[seafoid]

Also, the excuse of how dangerous trans women would be in contact sports, well a peak Serena Williams would be stronger than 99% of trans women, does than mean any women (non-trans) of her strength should be banned as well out of 'safety concerns'?

I brought up last week my own (at the time) 14 year old diminutive self being horsed out of it on the GAA field by lads who were a foot taller and three stone heavier. I'm sure many here have experienced the same.

Get up and get on with it was the option available.

Such a poor argument(yours and blanketattack are equally poor)and in no way is it the same as your  14 year old daughter (if you have one, if not insert sister, niece etc) coming up against a foot taller 3 stone heavier biological male who identifies as a female.

The point is physical disparity is often huge among men and women themselves, yet outside of the likes of boxing, it's never a consideration nor even a concern. A 5'3" man is never going to be a men's tennis champion because he simply lacks the physique, but no one bats an eyelid. Even a 5'3" woman would have a tough time against the Williams sisters in their prime. Yet the odd transwoman competing spells the end of women's sports as we know it and by extension, for some,  necessitates the denial of any legitimate consideration of transexuality.

Transsexuality and trans are 2 different concepts.
People are born transsexual. Trans can be self ID into being.

I don't know what that means.

What is a transsexual by your definition?

Transsexual is the old definition. Someone who  experiences a gender identity that is inconsistent with their assigned sex, and desire to permanently transition to the sex or gender with which they identify. Would have surgery.

Trans is anyone who self IDs . Without self ID you would just have transsexuals. With self ID the population is much bigger and includes some very challenging groups such as AGPs .

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blanchard%27s_transsexualism_typology

Blanchard's transsexualism typology is a proposed psychological typology of gender dysphoria, transsexualism, and fetishistic transvestism, created by sexologist Ray Blanchard through the 1980s and 1990s, building on the work of earlier researchers, including his colleague Kurt Freund. Blanchard categorized trans women into two groups: homosexual transsexuals who are attracted exclusively to men and are feminine in both behavior and appearance; and autogynephilic transsexuals who experience sexual arousal at the idea of having a female body (autogynephilia)(AGP)

[seafoid]

AGPs (autogynophiles) get turned on by presenting as women in female spaces.  But that can't turn anyone into a woman in the reality spectrum. It's some form of narcissism. Plus it's literally bollocks. That's one of the reasons I can't see the trans thing lasting.

[blanketattack]

Also, the excuse of how dangerous trans women would be in contact sports, well a peak Serena Williams would be stronger than 99% of trans women, does than mean any women (non-trans) of her strength should be banned as well out of 'safety concerns'?

I brought up last week my own (at the time) 14 year old diminutive self being horsed out of it on the GAA field by lads who were a foot taller and three stone heavier. I'm sure many here have experienced the same.

Get up and get on with it was the option available.

Such a poor argument(yours and blanketattack are equally poor)and in no way is it the same as your  14 year old daughter (if you have one, if not insert sister, niece etc) coming up against a foot taller 3 stone heavier biological male who identifies as a female.

The point is physical disparity is often huge among men and women themselves, yet outside of the likes of boxing, it's never a consideration nor even a concern. A 5'3" man is never going to be a men's tennis champion because he simply lacks the physique, but no one bats an eyelid. Even a 5'3" woman would have a tough time against the Williams sisters in their prime. Yet the odd transwoman competing spells the end of women's sports as we know it and by extension, for some,  necessitates the denial of any legitimate consideration of transexuality.

Yes, Rugby sees 11 stone players vs 22 stone players.
Basketball has seen 5'3" 9 stone players vs 25 stone 7'1" players.
Did anyone ask for the bigger players to be banned for 'safety concerns'?

People think the Ladies Football scene is going to be flooded with 6'4" 14 stone transwomen. People just looking to invent scenarios just to suit their own transphobia. Transphobes are no different to racists, homophobes and even flat-earthers - no listening to any rational by them, they've their mind made up and no counter argument is going to change their mind.

[general_lee]

What about female to male trans players wanting to play men's sports? Are there safety concerns for them? Purely anecdotal but I've seen a lot more female to male than male to female trans people among the younger population.

[Cavan19]

What about female to male trans players wanting to play men's sports? Are there safety concerns for them? Purely anecdotal but I've seen a lot more female to male than male to female trans people among the younger population.

I don't think any male that wants to be a female would have most interest in playing sport probably more into makeup and love island.

[general_lee]

What about female to male trans players wanting to play men's sports? Are there safety concerns for them? Purely anecdotal but I've seen a lot more female to male than male to female trans people among the younger population.

I don't think any male that wants to be a female would have most interest in playing sport probably more into makeup and love island.

Not ones that identify as cis males.

[imtommygunn]

What about female to male trans players wanting to play men's sports? Are there safety concerns for them? Purely anecdotal but I've seen a lot more female to male than male to female trans people among the younger population.

There should be categories for it.

[RedHand88]

What about female to male trans players wanting to play men's sports? Are there safety concerns for them? Purely anecdotal but I've seen a lot more female to male than male to female trans people among the younger population.

Something tells me it's 4 or 5 to 1 in the opposite direction amongst Gen Z, but I could be wrong.

[seafoid]

Also, the excuse of how dangerous trans women would be in contact sports, well a peak Serena Williams would be stronger than 99% of trans women, does than mean any women (non-trans) of her strength should be banned as well out of 'safety concerns'?

I brought up last week my own (at the time) 14 year old diminutive self being horsed out of it on the GAA field by lads who were a foot taller and three stone heavier. I'm sure many here have experienced the same.

Get up and get on with it was the option available.

Such a poor argument(yours and blanketattack are equally poor)and in no way is it the same as your  14 year old daughter (if you have one, if not insert sister, niece etc) coming up against a foot taller 3 stone heavier biological male who identifies as a female.

The point is physical disparity is often huge among men and women themselves, yet outside of the likes of boxing, it's never a consideration nor even a concern. A 5'3" man is never going to be a men's tennis champion because he simply lacks the physique, but no one bats an eyelid. Even a 5'3" woman would have a tough time against the Williams sisters in their prime. Yet the odd transwoman competing spells the end of women's sports as we know it and by extension, for some,  necessitates the denial of any legitimate consideration of transexuality.

Yes, Rugby sees 11 stone players vs 22 stone players.
Basketball has seen 5'3" 9 stone players vs 25 stone 7'1" players.
Did anyone ask for the bigger players to be banned for 'safety concerns'?

People think the Ladies Football scene is going to be flooded with 6'4" 14 stone transwomen. People just looking to invent scenarios just to suit their own transphobia. Transphobes are no different to racists, homophobes and even flat-earthers - no listening to any rational by them, they've their mind made up and no counter argument is going to change their mind.

Safeguarding rules are about tail risk, not regular stuff.
Most basketball does not have 25 stone players.
11 stone rugby players play in the backs, not the forwards.
Everyone who plays rugby know how it works.
Introducing a trans who weighs twice as much or is 4 times as powerful as the women playing a sport
is a specific risk which has to be legislated for.
The bald Italian who rolled up  at a LGFA match last year was playing against 16 year olds. There are also liability funding issues.
Should general society cover this risk ?

[Milltown Row2]

What about female to male trans players wanting to play men's sports? Are there safety concerns for them? Purely anecdotal but I've seen a lot more female to male than male to female trans people among the younger population.

I don't think any male that wants to be a female would have most interest in playing sport probably more into makeup and love island.

What's wrong with watching love island? Hope Shaq gets rid of Tanya 

[Gabriel_Hurl]

What about female to male trans players wanting to play men's sports? Are there safety concerns for them? Purely anecdotal but I've seen a lot more female to male than male to female trans people among the younger population.

I don't think any male that wants to be a female would have most interest in playing sport probably more into makeup and love island.

a real brainiac here

[johnnycool]

https://bjsm.bmj.com/content/55/11/577

Summary The 15–31% athletic advantage that transwomen displayed over their female counterparts prior to starting gender affirming hormones declined with feminising therapy. However, transwomen still had a 9% faster mean run speed after the 1 year period of testosterone suppression that is recommended by World Athletics for inclusion in women's events.

[gallsman]

Read what Ross Tucker has to say on the science of it. Retained advantage is indisputable.

[blanketattack]

Also, the excuse of how dangerous trans women would be in contact sports, well a peak Serena Williams would be stronger than 99% of trans women, does than mean any women (non-trans) of her strength should be banned as well out of 'safety concerns'?

I brought up last week my own (at the time) 14 year old diminutive self being horsed out of it on the GAA field by lads who were a foot taller and three stone heavier. I'm sure many here have experienced the same.

Get up and get on with it was the option available.

Such a poor argument(yours and blanketattack are equally poor)and in no way is it the same as your  14 year old daughter (if you have one, if not insert sister, niece etc) coming up against a foot taller 3 stone heavier biological male who identifies as a female.

The point is physical disparity is often huge among men and women themselves, yet outside of the likes of boxing, it's never a consideration nor even a concern. A 5'3" man is never going to be a men's tennis champion because he simply lacks the physique, but no one bats an eyelid. Even a 5'3" woman would have a tough time against the Williams sisters in their prime. Yet the odd transwoman competing spells the end of women's sports as we know it and by extension, for some,  necessitates the denial of any legitimate consideration of transexuality.

Yes, Rugby sees 11 stone players vs 22 stone players.
Basketball has seen 5'3" 9 stone players vs 25 stone 7'1" players.
Did anyone ask for the bigger players to be banned for 'safety concerns'?

People think the Ladies Football scene is going to be flooded with 6'4" 14 stone transwomen. People just looking to invent scenarios just to suit their own transphobia. Transphobes are no different to racists, homophobes and even flat-earthers - no listening to any rational by them, they've their mind made up and no counter argument is going to change their mind.

Safeguarding rules are about tail risk, not regular stuff.
Most basketball does not have 25 stone players.
11 stone rugby players play in the backs, not the forwards.
Everyone who plays rugby know how it works.
Introducing a trans who weighs twice as much or is 4 times as powerful as the women playing a sport
is a specific risk which has to be legislated for.
The bald Italian who rolled up  at a LGFA match last year was playing against 16 year olds. There are also liability funding issues.
Should general society cover this risk ?

A transwoman that's 4 times as powerful? No end to the unicorn scenarios.
99.x%: of transwomen will not be these huge giants 4 times as powerful that all the transphobes like to fear monger about . No need to exclude the majority that pose no risk.

[johnnycool]

Read what Ross Tucker has to say on the science of it. Retained advantage is indisputable.

The above article and the excerpt I posted doesn't dispute that.