Superstitions

[ONeill]

And there'll be no time at the end of it too.

[armaghniac]

I knew a guy who was convinced that if he had sex with his wife on some days of the month, rather than others, that she was more likely to get pregnant!

Of course there well may be an afterlife and an infinite number of parallel universes also.

There could even be a parallel universe where Mayo wins All Irelands and St Galls can beat Cross.  Or maybe not, this is just too fanciful.

[Ard-Rí]

I knew a guy who was convinced that if he had sex with his wife on some days of the month, rather than others, that she was more likely to get pregnant!

I think that's called biology.

[Rossfan]

If there was agreement amongst billions worldwide and millions in Ireland that based on stories handed down and huge organised brain washing sessions that we should all worship the Zebra God, other competing ideologies argue we worship the Horse God and the Donkey God. Such ideologies were part of constitutions of Republics and the justification for ruling Monarchs. Would you argue such stupidity deserved respect.

That word negates all that follows.
If today was tomorrow would yesterday be today ? Or would yesterday not be  tomorrow then?

Misdirection and avoidance the classic approach of the theist.

You come out with vile sh1te insulting religion , people take you up on disrespect so you come out with a load of nonsense preceded by an IF.
I point out the absurdity of using IF and you start on about avoidance and misdirection as if you were some sort of Supreme intellect that has everybody stumped.
To me you come across as a hatefilled individual who needs help.

[Lar Naparka]

I can't fully subscribe to the Big Bang theory either.

How do you explain the Cosmic Background Radiation then?

I can't and neither can anyone else. Sure, it lends credibility to the Big Bang theory, which remains just that- a theory.
If I had to choose between creationism and naturalism, I'd opt for the latter but nothing that has been proposed so far answers my fundamental question; where did the matter/energy come from that caused the big bang?

This is a question that's always fascinated me, the idea of what was before the Big Bang. The most accepted theory is that everything, time, space, matter that makes up the universe right now was a super-dense singularity before the Big Bang.

What that means for were the energy comes from is the most debatable facet because there's ideas of the universe repeatedly expanding and collapsing back into a singularity ad infinitum (a 'closed' universe) and it simply expanding forever (an 'open' universe), in which case the reason for what caused that singularity to be there is still needed.

If you want to go down the science route for that answer you'd be looking at cosmogony, the study of those theories. Because the Big Bang itself is only a theory (but an incredibly likely and well-proven one) trying to find theories on top of it to explain an even earlier stage of the universe is speculative. There's plenty of ideas, the most well known involving thing like string theory (do not ask me to explain because I honestly amn't 50% on what that even is myself). It won't be until we can use even more advanced particle colliders than the Large Hadron Collider that something approaching a true scientific answer can be developed.

I think some people attack the Big Bang theory because of its name cache (and likewise ill-informed people on the other side gleefully shout it out as if it's a stake in the heart of God) but all it does is tell us that the universe emerged from a singularity, it doesn't profess to know what the nature or cause of that singularity was.

Just spotted your post now.
The bit I have bolded states my position.
Neither the Big Bang theory nor the divine creation of all matter and energy one can answer that question.
Either one can only be taken as an intermediate step from the finite point where "it" all began to the present day.
If a cataclysmic explosion at some time in the far distant past gave us the universe we live in, what gave rise to that explosion? Where did the matter and energy required come from?
If God created the world, then who made God?

If there really is a God, why won't he let Mayo win a f**king All Ireland?
Will it take another Big Bang to bring this about and, if so, when?
If I can get an answer to the last two, I won't worry about the others.

[Rossfan]

If there really is a God, why won't he let Mayo win a f**king All Ireland?

Because God is a Ros supporter from Ballagh..

[mayogodhelpus@gmail.com]

If there was agreement amongst billions worldwide and millions in Ireland that based on stories handed down and huge organised brain washing sessions that we should all worship the Zebra God, other competing ideologies argue we worship the Horse God and the Donkey God. Such ideologies were part of constitutions of Republics and the justification for ruling Monarchs. Would you argue such stupidity deserved respect.

That word negates all that follows.
If today was tomorrow would yesterday be today ? Or would yesterday not be  tomorrow then?

Misdirection and avoidance the classic approach of the theist.

You come out with vile sh1te insulting religion , people take you up on disrespect so you come out with a load of nonsense preceded by an IF.
I point out the absurdity of using IF and you start on about avoidance and misdirection as if you were some sort of Supreme intellect that has everybody stumped.
To me you come across as a hatefilled individual who needs help.

I don't claim to be a supreme intellect. I do think it is absurd that anyone believe in a deity or higher power. The construct is entirely cultural and serves no purpose. It is lies and that is all it is. Can you hate something that does not exist, I certainly have distaste for the concept of God. How otherwise intelligent people can fail to see this or through fear acknowledge out loud I fail to understand.

[mayogodhelpus@gmail.com]

If there really is a God, why won't he let Mayo win a f**king All Ireland?

Because God is a Ros supporter from Ballagh..

This God must be very young so.

[mayogodhelpus@gmail.com]

One Friday, I was telling a (prod) boy in work that I was heading to Croke Park to watch a match. He said to me, "I don't know how you can watch that shit."

He rarely misses an OWC home game and sits up half the night watching NFL. I don't know how he can watch that shit.

People go to comic conventions dressed as characters.
People go on holiday to the Caribbean.
People go to Bundoran.
People enjoy Chateneuf du Pape.
People enjoy Buckfast.

People don't believe in God.
People do.
They are not vile or stupid.

Big wow.

I did not say this about the believers, I referred to faith/religion. Surely Christians here understsnd the concept of love the sinners not the sin.

[ONeill]

Something Lar said a couple of days ago rang home for me - live and let live.

I will never fathom how someone with basic intelligence believes in 'Jesus' or whatever leader the family/area you were born in happen to follow.

But maybe that's my inability to consider it.

Live and let live is a good maxim.

[thejuice]

Yeah but if we want a better understanding of the world and the universe and if humanity is to progress the big questions have to be asked and some toes will be stood on.

Live and let live sounds fine and dandy but if we live in a world where ideas and beliefs are never challenged then we are on the fast lane to nowhere. Likewise if you never challenge what you think to be true are you really just settling just for what suits you.

[stephenite]

I have to sleep on the side of the bed that is furtherst from the door, no reason why, just have to.

[Eamonnca1]

Theists: "Aha! You can't explain lightning! God must be behind it! Gotcha!"

Science (after a bit of research): "Well actually, we've figured it out. Atmospheric conditions cause a built up of an electrical charge which then jumps the gap between the clouds and the nearest (tallest) conducting object on the ground."

Theists: "Well, what about volcanoes? You can't explain them! God must be behind it! Gotcha!"

Science (after a bit of research): "Well actually, we've figured it out.  The Earth has a molten iron core with liquified rock circulating between the core and the solid crust.  That magma is at a lot of pressure under there, and occasionally that pressure builds up to the point where thin parts of the earth's crust rupture and the magma spews out."

Theists: "Well, what about the movement of the Sun and the Moon around the Earth? You can't explain that!  God must be behind it! Gotcha!"

Science (after a bit of research): "Well actually, we've figured it out.  The Moon goes around the Earth, but the Sun doesn't.  Earth goes around the sun."

Theists: "Well, what about the stars?  You can't explain them! God must be behind them! Gotcha!"

Science (after a bit of research): "Well actually, we've figured it out. each star is a sun, many of them similar to our own.  Because they're so far away, they appear to us as small specks of light.  The process by which they shine is nuclear fusion."

Theists: "Well, what about where the stars and planets came from?  You can't explain that!  God must be behind it! Gotcha!"

Science (after a bit of research): "Well actually, we've figured it out.  A slow process of accretion of interstellar material (usually the result of supernovae) leads the the collection of so much material at the centre that the immense gravity starts the process of nuclear fusion causing the star to shine.  Remaining material orbiting what becomes the star clumps together into smaller bodies, and if they're not massive enough to form stars in their own right then they form planets."

Theists: "Well, what about before that?  Where did all that material come from?  You can't explain that!  God must be behind it! Gotcha!"

Science (after a bit of research): "Well actually, we've figured it out.  We've discovered this Cosmic Background Radiation thing, and the only explanation for it that stands up to any scrutiny is the Big Bang."

Theists: "Well, what about what happened before the Big Bang?  You can't explain that!  God must be behind it! Gotcha!"

Science goes off and does a bit of research...

[Eamonnca1]

...just a theory...

This really grinds my gears.

A "theory" in casual conversation is an idea without necessarily having any supporting evidence.

A hypothesis in science is an idea postulated to explain certain phenomena, but doesn't necessarily have much or any supporting evidence.

A theory in science is a hypothesis with considerable evidence to back it up.  This is very different from a "theory" in casual conversation.  So any time I see Big Bang or evolution by natural selection dismissed as "just" theories it makes me despair for the state of scientific literacy.

Big Bang, like evolution by natural selection, is a highly respected scientific theory with a mountain of evidence to back it up.

The point that people make about "science can't explain this or that" usually falls down in two ways. It either incorrectly claims that science has not proven something when it actually has (Big Bang and evolution by natural selection are actually pretty well understood and the mountains of supporting evidence get bigger by the day).  Or it points beyond the limits of current scientific knowledge and triumphantly claims that "God" can be substituted into the gaps in our current knowledge.  In about 50 years time, the people currently claiming that our current lack of knowledge about what ignited Big Bang is evidence of God will look as silly as the people who once claimed that our lack of knowledge about the cause of lightening was equally valid evidence for the God hypothesis.

One of my problems with many religions is that they are a curiosity killer.  If everyone goes around thinking that all the strange stuff in the universe is explainable by bronze-age myths, where is the incentive for people to go out and investigate the true wonders of the universe?  People who work in certain fields (such as evolutionary biology) have to waste their time and energy fighting a rear-guard action on behalf of their fields against religiously-motivated ignoramuses who attack public scientific literacy by trying to get kids indoctrinated with nonsense in schools.

It wasn't so long ago when we thought that the stars were attached to a glass sphere surrounding the Earth.  We were a long way off modern cosmology.  It'll be a sad day when the last fact is known and the last question is answered.  But we'll never get there because every answer brings with it new questions.  And it's okay to say that we don't have the answer to every question. Science is often accused of "arrogantly claiming to know it all" which is a complete misrepresentation.  If science knew it all then there wouldn't be any such thing as science because there'd be nothing left to investigate.  Only religion claims to have all the answers, and if that isn't hubris then I don't know what is.

[ONeill]

Yeah but if we want a better understanding of the world and the universe and if humanity is to progress the big questions have to be asked and some toes will be stood on.

Live and let live sounds fine and dandy but if we live in a world where ideas and beliefs are never challenged then we are on the fast lane to nowhere. Likewise if you never challenge what you think to be true are you really just settling just for what suits you.

Yes but if someine decides to believe in a deity even after all scientific facts are laid bare in front of them - so be it. No point ramming your point repeatedly down their throat.