DUBLIN V REST OF IRELAND

[Syferus]

Beggan is better than Cluxton.

It's only this year that that isn't an outlandish statement. I'd still take Cluxton's experience over Beggan every time.

[Unlaoised]

Saw in yesterdays programme that Jack Jones Clothing now sponser Dublin. Jesus.

On way out of ground saw Billboard of Ciaran Kilkenny sponsered by Sure and Bernard by King Crisps

Different world

Dublin are what they are .... its going take a freaky day to beat them ...

You have to admire the football they play ..

Yes the money they get is anfair advantage but they do it well very well

[kerryforsam2018]

Beggan is better than Cluxton.

And Con O'Callaghan,Paul Mannion,Ciaran Kilkenny are Dublin forwards that would make the best team in Ireland.

Great good athletes but fairly average footballers

[The PRO]

Beggan is better than Cluxton.

Brody > Beggan > Cluxton

[Lar Naparka]

You could certainly come up with a team, on paper anyway, where every player would be in the view of the majority better or at least as good as his Dublin counterpart.
The odds would still be on the Dubs to win and win well because of their greater teamwork and their unrivalled preparation, physical and psychological, over any knocked together side you'd care to mention.
I mean Michael Murphy and Paul Geaney would make any team in the land but getting them, Ciaran McManus, Lee Keegan and everyone you'd probably consider together for training sessions would be a logistical nightmare.
Y'see, to properly appreciate the effect the present Dublin team has on the GAA as a whole, you'd need to consider what it would take to build another county side that would equal or at least approximate the Dubs in every facet of the game – clone of Dublin.
You would need to begin by merging some counties for starters.
If you started with the least heavily populated Leitrim (31,972 ) and worked your way up to Wicklow, (142,425) merging the populations as you go, you'd get a total almost identical to that of County Dublin. (All courtesy of CSO, 2016 via Wikipedia.)
That's a total of 16 present counties, all rolled into one!
So the equivalent of 15 county boards and 15 senior intercounty panels go by the board, to begin with.
How many players get to play for their counties at senior level in the course of a year? If all types of games are included, I'd say a (very) conservative estimate would be 40 per county.
So if all 16 merged, 40x15 or 600 players would be denied the chance to play intercounty football every year. That would only be the beginning. Where you now have 16 senior clubs championships, you'd only have one. Assloads of senior clubs would have to amalgamate, go out of existence or downgrade.
Imagine the domino effect on clubs of lesser status!
You'd have far bigger, richer and better organised clubs but only a fraction of the number we have at present and given that they'd have to draw their memberships from a wide area so intimate contact with small local communities would be severed.
If if you somehow managed to effect this super merger and all the consequent changes, you'd still face one huge disadvantage- those counties are spread throughout the country while all of Dublin's population and resources, (40% of the republic's total according to Simon Coveney earlier this year) are concentrated in the third smallest county in the country.
So, all in all, any side capable of going toe to toe with Dublin doesn't exist right now

So how come Dublin only won 1 All Ireland in the nearly 30 years between the last one of the Heffo era in '83 & Gilroys in 2011? That is 1 paltry All Ireland in nearly three decades. All your CSO stats about population were as true then, as they are now. Explain that one then..

Thought we had gone through this in detail before but, in any event, here is my take on what the difference is.In short it comes down to money, pure and simple.
Dublin has lots more of it than any other county in the land , even on a pro rata basis.
Of the total development funding dished out be the GAA, Dublin gets by far the greatest percentage.
Again, this has been done to death on a number of threads. On page two of the Money, Dublin and the GAA thread, you ill find an infographic detailing the total amount of money given out by the GAA in the period 2010-2014. The amount shown is what was given per registered player.
Dublin got €247 while Mayo got €22 and Galway got only €15. If you google gaa development funds, you'll get plenty of info on the subject so, like the stats I gave, the figures are in the public domain.All in all, Dublin got 47% of the total handed out and you'll find that
here or
here and in numerous other sources as well.
Given the marketability of the Dublin brand and the size of the potential market for sponsors Dublin has not problem getting a long, long list of sponsors, sorry "partners."
So, the Dublin panel and management are given top of the range Suburu cars every year whereas Roscommon have to make do with a (by now) second hand bus donate by a wealthy supporter some years ago.
As it takes serious money to pay for the services of nutritionists, physiotherapists, physiotherapists and the likes not to mention renting centres of excellence and the likes, Dublin are way out in front of the rest.
Added to all that, Dublin has a number of very competent, hard-working individuals on the county board and down the line and are backed up by dozens od ex-players and other dedicated volunteers so there is a supremely well-organised development structure there that no other country can hope to match.
Around 2010, after the senior team got hockeyed by Meath in a Leinster semi ( think it was 5-9 to 0-13 points) the CB decided enough was enough and had a comprehensive plan of action drawn up and submitted it to CC, looking for funding. This was the Blue Wave initiative nd if you haven't heard of it, google for it.
This was the prime reason for Dublin getting the lion's shared of the games development kitty.
Finally, because of their new development structures they happen to have a lot of very talented young footballers putting pressure all the time on the already established players so the competition will always be keen for places on the team so don't expect  the Dubs to slacken off any time so and decide that enough is enough.
They will always be there ot thereabouts until the social and economic structure of the country undergoes massive change. Don't hold your breath waiting for this to happen.

And that, yer honour, is my best shot and I don't intend returning to this subject any time soon.

[DUBSFORSAM1]

You could certainly come up with a team, on paper anyway, where every player would be in the view of the majority better or at least as good as his Dublin counterpart.
The odds would still be on the Dubs to win and win well because of their greater teamwork and their unrivalled preparation, physical and psychological, over any knocked together side you'd care to mention.
I mean Michael Murphy and Paul Geaney would make any team in the land but getting them, Ciaran McManus, Lee Keegan and everyone you'd probably consider together for training sessions would be a logistical nightmare.
Y'see, to properly appreciate the effect the present Dublin team has on the GAA as a whole, you'd need to consider what it would take to build another county side that would equal or at least approximate the Dubs in every facet of the game – clone of Dublin.
You would need to begin by merging some counties for starters.
If you started with the least heavily populated Leitrim (31,972 ) and worked your way up to Wicklow, (142,425) merging the populations as you go, you'd get a total almost identical to that of County Dublin. (All courtesy of CSO, 2016 via Wikipedia.)
That's a total of 16 present counties, all rolled into one!
So the equivalent of 15 county boards and 15 senior intercounty panels go by the board, to begin with.
How many players get to play for their counties at senior level in the course of a year? If all types of games are included, I'd say a (very) conservative estimate would be 40 per county.
So if all 16 merged, 40x15 or 600 players would be denied the chance to play intercounty football every year. That would only be the beginning. Where you now have 16 senior clubs championships, you'd only have one. Assloads of senior clubs would have to amalgamate, go out of existence or downgrade.
Imagine the domino effect on clubs of lesser status!
You'd have far bigger, richer and better organised clubs but only a fraction of the number we have at present and given that they'd have to draw their memberships from a wide area so intimate contact with small local communities would be severed.
If if you somehow managed to effect this super merger and all the consequent changes, you'd still face one huge disadvantage- those counties are spread throughout the country while all of Dublin's population and resources, (40% of the republic's total according to Simon Coveney earlier this year) are concentrated in the third smallest county in the country.
So, all in all, any side capable of going toe to toe with Dublin doesn't exist right now

So how come Dublin only won 1 All Ireland in the nearly 30 years between the last one of the Heffo era in '83 & Gilroys in 2011? That is 1 paltry All Ireland in nearly three decades. All your CSO stats about population were as true then, as they are now. Explain that one then..

Thought we had gone through this in detail before but, in any event, here is my take on what the difference is.In short it comes down to money, pure and simple.
Dublin has lots more of it than any other county in the land , even on a pro rata basis.
Of the total development funding dished out be the GAA, Dublin gets by far the greatest percentage.
Again, this has been done to death on a number of threads. On page two of the Money, Dublin and the GAA thread, you ill find an infographic detailing the total amount of money given out by the GAA in the period 2010-2014. The amount shown is what was given per registered player.
Dublin got €247 while Mayo got €22 and Galway got only €15. If you google gaa development funds, you'll get plenty of info on the subject so, like the stats I gave, the figures are in the public domain.All in all, Dublin got 47% of the total handed out and you'll find that
here or
here and in numerous other sources as well.
Given the marketability of the Dublin brand and the size of the potential market for sponsors Dublin has not problem getting a long, long list of sponsors, sorry "partners."
So, the Dublin panel and management are given top of the range Suburu cars every year whereas Roscommon have to make do with a (by now) second hand bus donate by a wealthy supporter some years ago.
As it takes serious money to pay for the services of nutritionists, physiotherapists, physiotherapists and the likes not to mention renting centres of excellence and the likes, Dublin are way out in front of the rest.
Added to all that, Dublin has a number of very competent, hard-working individuals on the county board and down the line and are backed up by dozens od ex-players and other dedicated volunteers so there is a supremely well-organised development structure there that no other country can hope to match.
Around 2010, after the senior team got hockeyed by Meath in a Leinster semi ( think it was 5-9 to 0-13 points) the CB decided enough was enough and had a comprehensive plan of action drawn up and submitted it to CC, looking for funding. This was the Blue Wave initiative nd if you haven't heard of it, google for it.
This was the prime reason for Dublin getting the lion's shared of the games development kitty.
Finally, because of their new development structures they happen to have a lot of very talented young footballers putting pressure all the time on the already established players so the competition will always be keen for places on the team so don't expect  the Dubs to slacken off any time so and decide that enough is enough.
They will always be there ot thereabouts until the social and economic structure of the country undergoes massive change. Don't hold your breath waiting for this to happen.

And that, yer honour, is my best shot and I don't intend returning to this subject any time soon.

So doesn't the same logic apply to other counties - Like why are Monaghan better than Cork/Kildare/Meath etc?

[Gael85]

You could certainly come up with a team, on paper anyway, where every player would be in the view of the majority better or at least as good as his Dublin counterpart.
The odds would still be on the Dubs to win and win well because of their greater teamwork and their unrivalled preparation, physical and psychological, over any knocked together side you'd care to mention.
I mean Michael Murphy and Paul Geaney would make any team in the land but getting them, Ciaran McManus, Lee Keegan and everyone you'd probably consider together for training sessions would be a logistical nightmare.
Y'see, to properly appreciate the effect the present Dublin team has on the GAA as a whole, you'd need to consider what it would take to build another county side that would equal or at least approximate the Dubs in every facet of the game – clone of Dublin.
You would need to begin by merging some counties for starters.
If you started with the least heavily populated Leitrim (31,972 ) and worked your way up to Wicklow, (142,425) merging the populations as you go, you'd get a total almost identical to that of County Dublin. (All courtesy of CSO, 2016 via Wikipedia.)
That's a total of 16 present counties, all rolled into one!
So the equivalent of 15 county boards and 15 senior intercounty panels go by the board, to begin with.
How many players get to play for their counties at senior level in the course of a year? If all types of games are included, I'd say a (very) conservative estimate would be 40 per county.
So if all 16 merged, 40x15 or 600 players would be denied the chance to play intercounty football every year. That would only be the beginning. Where you now have 16 senior clubs championships, you'd only have one. Assloads of senior clubs would have to amalgamate, go out of existence or downgrade.
Imagine the domino effect on clubs of lesser status!
You'd have far bigger, richer and better organised clubs but only a fraction of the number we have at present and given that they'd have to draw their memberships from a wide area so intimate contact with small local communities would be severed.
If if you somehow managed to effect this super merger and all the consequent changes, you'd still face one huge disadvantage- those counties are spread throughout the country while all of Dublin's population and resources, (40% of the republic's total according to Simon Coveney earlier this year) are concentrated in the third smallest county in the country.
So, all in all, any side capable of going toe to toe with Dublin doesn't exist right now

So how come Dublin only won 1 All Ireland in the nearly 30 years between the last one of the Heffo era in '83 & Gilroys in 2011? That is 1 paltry All Ireland in nearly three decades. All your CSO stats about population were as true then, as they are now. Explain that one then..

Thought we had gone through this in detail before but, in any event, here is my take on what the difference is.In short it comes down to money, pure and simple.
Dublin has lots more of it than any other county in the land , even on a pro rata basis.
Of the total development funding dished out be the GAA, Dublin gets by far the greatest percentage.
Again, this has been done to death on a number of threads. On page two of the Money, Dublin and the GAA thread, you ill find an infographic detailing the total amount of money given out by the GAA in the period 2010-2014. The amount shown is what was given per registered player.
Dublin got €247 while Mayo got €22 and Galway got only €15. If you google gaa development funds, you'll get plenty of info on the subject so, like the stats I gave, the figures are in the public domain.All in all, Dublin got 47% of the total handed out and you'll find that
here or
here and in numerous other sources as well.
Given the marketability of the Dublin brand and the size of the potential market for sponsors Dublin has not problem getting a long, long list of sponsors, sorry "partners."
So, the Dublin panel and management are given top of the range Suburu cars every year whereas Roscommon have to make do with a (by now) second hand bus donate by a wealthy supporter some years ago.
As it takes serious money to pay for the services of nutritionists, physiotherapists, physiotherapists and the likes not to mention renting centres of excellence and the likes, Dublin are way out in front of the rest.
Added to all that, Dublin has a number of very competent, hard-working individuals on the county board and down the line and are backed up by dozens od ex-players and other dedicated volunteers so there is a supremely well-organised development structure there that no other country can hope to match.
Around 2010, after the senior team got hockeyed by Meath in a Leinster semi ( think it was 5-9 to 0-13 points) the CB decided enough was enough and had a comprehensive plan of action drawn up and submitted it to CC, looking for funding. This was the Blue Wave initiative nd if you haven't heard of it, google for it.
This was the prime reason for Dublin getting the lion's shared of the games development kitty.
Finally, because of their new development structures they happen to have a lot of very talented young footballers putting pressure all the time on the already established players so the competition will always be keen for places on the team so don't expect  the Dubs to slacken off any time so and decide that enough is enough.
They will always be there ot thereabouts until the social and economic structure of the country undergoes massive change. Don't hold your breath waiting for this to happen.

And that, yer honour, is my best shot and I don't intend returning to this subject any time soon.

Which young players are you referring to?

[Gael85]

Dublin have so many good forwards that their individual contribution is diluted somewhat, but their ability shouldn't be underestimated.
They are programmed to put the team first so they don't worry about their personal scoring tallies.
Mannion, in particular, is absolutely top class.
Power, pace, kicks well with both feet.
If he was playing in a weaker team where he was the go to man 80% of the time, his quality would probably be even more evident.

Would agree with that and probably reason our forwards rarely get player of year awards. Having said that our decision making on goal chances need to improve.

[Jinxy]

I don't think Dublin go for goal chances the way they did pre-Donegal in 2014, and it seems to be a deliberate policy.
They are content to take the point more often than not.

[BallyhaiseMan]

A "rest of Ireland" team would annihilate Dublin.

[Jayop]

It's kind of a ridiculous argument anyway. Of course a rest of Ireland team could beat Dublin on paper, but Dublin have been playing as a team together for years and that could be the difference. Mayo were only beat by a point last year and probably would have won the game but for an idiotic sending off. Would Mayo have been even stronger had they been able to pick a few players from the 30 other counties? Of course they would have been a few points better. Imagine they had Murphy on the bench, or Colm Cavanagh or a litany of other brilliant players around the country that would have massively improved them in the final 20 minutes.

[Keyboard Warrior]

Beggan is better than Cluxton.

And Con O'Callaghan,Paul Mannion,Ciaran Kilkenny are Dublin forwards that would make the best team in Ireland.

Great good athletes but fairly average footballers

Delete your account.

[Jayop]

Given Tyrone are probably the only team in Ireland close to Dublin in terms of conditioning I wouldn't as a Tyrone person like to start slinging around unfound allegations of doping that could as easily be thrown at us.

[tonto1888]

A "rest of Ireland" team would annihilate Dublin.

Nope

[BallyhaiseMan]

A "rest of Ireland" team would annihilate Dublin.

Nope

Dublin team against Galway

S Cluxton; E Murchan, C O'Sullivan, P McMahon; J Cooper, J Small, J McCaffrey; B Fenton , J McCarthy; N Scully, C Kilkenny , B Howard ; C O'Callaghan , D Rock , P Mannion . Subs: M Fitzsimons , C Costello   K McManamon  M D Macauley , D Daly P Flynn

Rest of Ireland(Only a sample team, i could have named another two teams worth of players)

1. Rory Beggan (Monaghan)
2. Colm Walshe (Monaghan)
3. Neil McGee(Donegal)
4. Eoghan Ban Gallagher(Donegal)
5. Lee Keegan (Mayo)
6. Chrissy McKeague(Derry)
7. Tiernan McCann(Tyrone)
8. Kevin Feely(Kildare)
9. Colm Cavanagh(Tyrone)
10.Mattie Donnelly(Tyrone)
11.Michael Murphy(Donegal)
12. Enda Smith(Roscommon)
13. Conor McManus (Monaghan)
14. Damien Comer(Galway)
15. Paddy McBrearty(Donegal)

Don't get me wrong,This Dublin team are a fantastic outfit,but some people are losing the run of themselves...there's outstanding footballers in most counties.