Brexit.

[armaghniac]

Shinners may have been able to sell return to Dail and that farce up on hill to their voters, but taking oath to queen in London would seriously hit their support and dissidents would be rubbing their hands. Besides, anybody who thinks their votes would make blind bit of difference is deluded. It's not going to happen, no matter how many times that excuse of a politician micheal martin whines on about it.

Are you for real or are you reading from a script?

The Tories + the DUP have a working majority of 1 or 2.  How would the votes of 7 SF MPs make no difference in a vote of no confidence?  There will be an election at some stage this year and the later it is, the greater the opportunity of Johnston (with Cummings) to prepare. 

Look at this and remember what Vote Leave were at during the referendum. 
https://twitter.com/rowlsmanthorpe/status/1154153775541751810

If SF took there seats and voted one way it would automatically drive some MPs to vote the other way just to avoid being on the same side as them.

+1 People calling for SF to go to Westminster have an agenda and it is not defeating Brexit.

Nonsense,
People are genuinely frightened by the economic chaos that could follow.  We have the most jingoistic, xenaphopic, partisan and irresponsible governments in living memory which will impose a form of Brexit that will do more harm to the six counties than to anywhere else, and you are suggesting that anyone calling on SF to take their seats to bring down the government has another agenda.

I am suggesting this because SF going to Westminster will only increase the partisan and xenophobic nature of the place, given the ranting from the Daily Telegraph and Mail and the Hoeys of this world. Consequently, SF going there will clearly not do any good and so people wanting them to go there are more concerned with annoying SF than anything else.

[imtommygunn]

I don't think there's much scope for increasing it - it must be near a maximum

[RedHand88]

Could you imagine the consternation if Sinn Fein issued a press release saying it was in negotiation with Labour, SNP, Lib Dems etc to take their seats and force a no confidence vote.

I know the Oath of Allegiance is a problem for them. However, what did Dev call it in 1927 when FF took their seats............An empty formula I think........when he had to swear loyalty to King George V.

Perhaps it is time for Sinn Fein to see the bigger picture.....

Maybe indeed. Historically I would have sided with SF on this issue but I understand the unorthodox times we live in. I really don't think SF would be treated like any other political party if they were to enter the chamber, plus their vote would collapse overnight. It ain't going to happen.

[trueblue1234]

Could you imagine the consternation if Sinn Fein issued a press release saying it was in negotiation with Labour, SNP, Lib Dems etc to take their seats and force a no confidence vote.

I know the Oath of Allegiance is a problem for them. However, what did Dev call it in 1927 when FF took their seats............An empty formula I think........when he had to swear loyalty to King George V.

Perhaps it is time for Sinn Fein to see the bigger picture.....

I can understand the clamour for them to take their seats to an extent. But you also have to look at it from their perspective. Their bigger picture might not be the same as your bigger picture. If they were to take their seats now the reality is that they would loss a fairly sizable chunk of their own support and alienate them. Regardless of whether you agree with it or not they canvassed under absenteeism and to change that (And it's a fairly big ideological change) would be a FU to the people who actually voted for them. I'd hazard a guess that the people calling for them to take their seats are people who didn't vote for them anyway.
So basically why would they risk harming their own voter share to do something that they don't believe in on the possibility that it might make a difference with regards to Brexit. It's far from a simple equation.

[Shamrock Shore]

Would alienated SF voters simply stop voting or move over to the Republican parties to the left of SF that remain abstentious but are still wedded to the 'struggle'.

Just asking.

[RedHand88]

Would alienated SF voters simply stop voting or move over to the Republican parties to the left of SF that remain abstentious but are still wedded to the 'struggle'.

Just asking.

Pure speculation here but id say the majority of alienated voters would stay home. You'd see a big surge for those independent republican candidates around Dungannon and that.

[screenexile]

Shinners may have been able to sell return to Dail and that farce up on hill to their voters, but taking oath to queen in London would seriously hit their support and dissidents would be rubbing their hands. Besides, anybody who thinks their votes would make blind bit of difference is deluded. It's not going to happen, no matter how many times that excuse of a politician micheal martin whines on about it.

Are you for real or are you reading from a script?

The Tories + the DUP have a working majority of 1 or 2.  How would the votes of 7 SF MPs make no difference in a vote of no confidence?  There will be an election at some stage this year and the later it is, the greater the opportunity of Johnston (with Cummings) to prepare. 

Look at this and remember what Vote Leave were at during the referendum. 
https://twitter.com/rowlsmanthorpe/status/1154153775541751810

If SF took there seats and voted one way it would automatically drive some MPs to vote the other way just to avoid being on the same side as them.

+1 People calling for SF to go to Westminster have an agenda and it is not defeating Brexit.

Oh no you've caught out my ulterior motive of actually wanting my elected representatives to represent me in the house they've been elected to which decides the laws that I am subject to. . . Also defeating Brexit would be nice in the process!!!

[screenexile]

I don't think Sinn Fein would lose as much support as people let on.

This has been said on numerous occasions with them signing up to the Good Friday agreement then going into Government with the DUP, endorsing the PSNI then McGuinness shaking the Queen's hand, becoming pro choice etc. etc.

I'd be amazed if they lost any of the Westminster seats in the next election or even the European seat they may take a small loss in local council or MLA elections but not a big loss and what they lose from staunch Republicans they could pick up from the liberal youth vote.

The tail is wagging the dog though and the Army Council aren't ready to concede this yet as staunch Republicans are very much of the mind that Brexit will deliver a UI in a shorter period of time and f**k everyone's economic situation in the time being!!!

[Eamonnca1]

Could you imagine the consternation if Sinn Fein issued a press release saying it was in negotiation with Labour, SNP, Lib Dems etc to take their seats and force a no confidence vote.

I know the Oath of Allegiance is a problem for them. However, what did Dev call it in 1927 when FF took their seats............An empty formula I think........when he had to swear loyalty to King George V.

Perhaps it is time for Sinn Fein to see the bigger picture.....

I can understand the clamour for them to take their seats to an extent. But you also have to look at it from their perspective. Their bigger picture might not be the same as your bigger picture. If they were to take their seats now the reality is that they would loss a fairly sizable chunk of their own support and alienate them. Regardless of whether you agree with it or not they canvassed under absenteeism and to change that (And it's a fairly big ideological change) would be a FU to the people who actually voted for them. I'd hazard a guess that the people calling for them to take their seats are people who didn't vote for them anyway.
So basically why would they risk harming their own voter share to do something that they don't believe in on the possibility that it might make a difference with regards to Brexit. It's far from a simple equation.

I'll bet people would have feared SF would have lost support in the 1990s if they endorsed an IRA ceasefire. After they did their support went up, not down.

[armaghniac]

I don't think SF will go and overturn Brexit, their contention is that they should not tell the the English what to do, nor they us, and the kickback would be fierce.
If there was a limited vote on something like a backstop referendum in NI then they could take part in that without greatly overturning any previous principle and there wouldn't be much kickback when it is Paddys voting about Paddys.

[APM]

I don't think SF will go and overturn Brexit, their contention is that they should not tell the the English what to do, nor they us, and the kickback would be fierce.
If there was a limited vote on something like a backstop referendum in NI then they could take part in that without greatly overturning any previous principle and there wouldn't be much kickback when it is Paddys voting about Paddys.

That's fine whenever we aren't part of the same jurisdiction - this statement reflects not how the world actually is, but how we would like it to be.  But when English MPs are making choices that will wreck the economy and are expressly contrary to the majority of the north and you have the numbers to stop it, then ........

[Rossfan]

I would imagine SFs view is to let the clowns self destruct as much as possible hopefully leading to Scottish Independence and a majority in the North wanting to get away from nut job England/Wales.

[balladmaker]

I would imagine SFs view is to let the clowns self destruct as much as possible hopefully leading to Scottish Independence and a majority in the North wanting to get away from nut job England/Wales.

+1.  The Tory's and DUP are advancing the demise of the 'precious union' right before our eyes, why interrupt them in doing so.

[Ronnie]

1.  There is ZERO chance of Stormont being restored in pre 2022
2.  Currently SF's only value is their reduced representation in ROI
3.  A border poll is definitely forthcoming
4.  Despite the jobs for the dupConservatives, NI is well down the new PM's priorities
5.  Alliance's pragmatism counts for little in the sectarian head count of a border poll
6.  It looks like NI will become the battleground in deciding regulatory alignment

Disappointing but interesting

[t_mac]

I would imagine SFs view is to let the clowns self destruct as much as possible hopefully leading to Scottish Independence and a majority in the North wanting to get away from nut job England/Wales.

Whilst 100,000+ lose their jobs on the island of ireland - I voted Sinn Fein in every election since the late 90's bar this year and will never vote for them again, they are letting their people down time and time again, shameful.