A United Ireland. Opening up the discussion.

[weareros]

Many of those Loyalists will have it a lot better in a United Ireland (if Republic's welfare system transfers over) than if they moved to GB, where they'd be like ducks out of water and getting less benefits. Someone has clearly done a good job in convincing them and Unionists at large that the UK is superior in that regard. The soundbytes by the Ben Lowrys of being part of the 5th biggest economy in the world need to be better challenged. In North, that translates to very little these days. The investments 26 has made in education from the 60s on while the Unionists were blocking education investment should be hammered home in the UI talks because that's the key to a better future - even if someone opts to emigrate after it. Better to emigrate with some qualifications, be your identity Irish or British.

[Milltown Row2]

Many of those Loyalists will have it a lot better in a United Ireland (if Republic's welfare system transfers over) than if they moved to GB, where they'd be like ducks out of water and getting less benefits. Someone has clearly done a good job in convincing them and Unionists at large that the UK is superior in that regard. The soundbytes by the Ben Lowrys of being part of the 5th biggest economy in the world need to be better challenged. In North, that translates to very little these days. The investments 26 has made in education from the 60s on while the Unionists were blocking education investment should be hammered home in the UI talks because that's the key to a better future - even if someone opts to emigrate after it. Better to emigrate with some qualifications, be your identity Irish or British.

Would you stay 'british' if the education and benefits were better? if the health service was better or job opportunities were better?

[weareros]

Many of those Loyalists will have it a lot better in a United Ireland (if Republic's welfare system transfers over) than if they moved to GB, where they'd be like ducks out of water and getting less benefits. Someone has clearly done a good job in convincing them and Unionists at large that the UK is superior in that regard. The soundbytes by the Ben Lowrys of being part of the 5th biggest economy in the world need to be better challenged. In North, that translates to very little these days. The investments 26 has made in education from the 60s on while the Unionists were blocking education investment should be hammered home in the UI talks because that's the key to a better future - even if someone opts to emigrate after it. Better to emigrate with some qualifications, be your identity Irish or British.

Would you stay 'british' if the education and benefits were better? if the health service was better or job opportunities were better?

Unionists would. But the point is that's an illusion. There is a University for every 400,000 citizens in the South, in North it is 1 per million - basing that on an Irish News analysis. Even Irish government recently announced millions (56 million) in funding for Magee. In the 60s, Republic were building regional technical colleges (now universities). The investments in education were a big part in Ireland's economic transformation while DUP have downed tools because a flower pot gets checked at Larne. It's the education vision they should be getting votes, not the big fuss over port checks.

[seafoid]

Many of those Loyalists will have it a lot better in a United Ireland (if Republic's welfare system transfers over) than if they moved to GB, where they'd be like ducks out of water and getting less benefits. Someone has clearly done a good job in convincing them and Unionists at large that the UK is superior in that regard. The soundbytes by the Ben Lowrys of being part of the 5th biggest economy in the world need to be better challenged. In North, that translates to very little these days. The investments 26 has made in education from the 60s on while the Unionists were blocking education investment should be hammered home in the UI talks because that's the key to a better future - even if someone opts to emigrate after it. Better to emigrate with some qualifications, be your identity Irish or British.

Would you stay 'british' if the education and benefits were better? if the health service was better or job opportunities were better?

Between 1921 and say 2000 the UK was better. Staunch republicans in Crossmaglen advocating for a UI were laughed at in the 50s after the NHS and Social security were introduced in the North while being absent in the South.    It's hard to get Unionists to change their mind on impressions of things like this.

People in the South didn't care about economic issues in 1921. They just wanted to be free.
It would surely be the same amongst the Gaels of the North.
The North is considerable poorer than the South and flags remain inedible.

[Rossfan]

Also remaining is the Unionist mindset  that most Catholics live on benefits which are much lower in the 26.

[Milltown Row2]

Many of those Loyalists will have it a lot better in a United Ireland (if Republic's welfare system transfers over) than if they moved to GB, where they'd be like ducks out of water and getting less benefits. Someone has clearly done a good job in convincing them and Unionists at large that the UK is superior in that regard. The soundbytes by the Ben Lowrys of being part of the 5th biggest economy in the world need to be better challenged. In North, that translates to very little these days. The investments 26 has made in education from the 60s on while the Unionists were blocking education investment should be hammered home in the UI talks because that's the key to a better future - even if someone opts to emigrate after it. Better to emigrate with some qualifications, be your identity Irish or British.

Would you stay 'british' if the education and benefits were better? if the health service was better or job opportunities were better?

Unionists would. But the point is that's an illusion. There is a University for every 400,000 citizens in the South, in North it is 1 per million - basing that on an Irish News analysis. Even Irish government recently announced millions (56 million) in funding for Magee. In the 60s, Republic were building regional technical colleges (now universities). The investments in education were a big part in Ireland's economic transformation while DUP have downed tools because a flower pot gets checked at Larne. It's the education vision they should be getting votes, not the big fuss over port checks.

Loyalists and unionist would live in shit before joining the country.. Educated prods may have a different view on things but if someone is a Loyalist and a unionist (its in the name) they won't give a crap that the DUP and the other groups are pulling the place down

[johnnycool]

Also remaining is the Unionist mindset  that most Catholics live on benefits which are much lower in the 26.

And everyone pays €50 to see a GP in the South all the while you'd do well to see a GP in the North for at least two weeks!

Yeah, the NHS is free at the point of use, but if you can't access the services due to lack of resources, what's the point?

[seafoid]

Many of those Loyalists will have it a lot better in a United Ireland (if Republic's welfare system transfers over) than if they moved to GB, where they'd be like ducks out of water and getting less benefits. Someone has clearly done a good job in convincing them and Unionists at large that the UK is superior in that regard. The soundbytes by the Ben Lowrys of being part of the 5th biggest economy in the world need to be better challenged. In North, that translates to very little these days. The investments 26 has made in education from the 60s on while the Unionists were blocking education investment should be hammered home in the UI talks because that's the key to a better future - even if someone opts to emigrate after it. Better to emigrate with some qualifications, be your identity Irish or British.

Would you stay 'british' if the education and benefits were better? if the health service was better or job opportunities were better?

Unionists would. But the point is that's an illusion. There is a University for every 400,000 citizens in the South, in North it is 1 per million - basing that on an Irish News analysis. Even Irish government recently announced millions (56 million) in funding for Magee. In the 60s, Republic were building regional technical colleges (now universities). The investments in education were a big part in Ireland's economic transformation while DUP have downed tools because a flower pot gets checked at Larne. It's the education vision they should be getting votes, not the big fuss over port checks.

Loyalists and unionist would live in shit before joining the country.. Educated prods may have a different view on things but if someone is a Loyalist and a unionist (its in the name) they won't give a crap that the DUP and the other groups are pulling the place down

The loyalists need a leader who can lead  them into a better future. Willi Brandt led Germany to accept that the land in the East that used to be German was gone. He went to Poland in 1970 to apologise to Poland for the Nazis. That is leadership. The DUP is not.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W7iVNoWDJDY

[weareros]

Many of those Loyalists will have it a lot better in a United Ireland (if Republic's welfare system transfers over) than if they moved to GB, where they'd be like ducks out of water and getting less benefits. Someone has clearly done a good job in convincing them and Unionists at large that the UK is superior in that regard. The soundbytes by the Ben Lowrys of being part of the 5th biggest economy in the world need to be better challenged. In North, that translates to very little these days. The investments 26 has made in education from the 60s on while the Unionists were blocking education investment should be hammered home in the UI talks because that's the key to a better future - even if someone opts to emigrate after it. Better to emigrate with some qualifications, be your identity Irish or British.

Would you stay 'british' if the education and benefits were better? if the health service was better or job opportunities were better?

Unionists would. But the point is that's an illusion. There is a University for every 400,000 citizens in the South, in North it is 1 per million - basing that on an Irish News analysis. Even Irish government recently announced millions (56 million) in funding for Magee. In the 60s, Republic were building regional technical colleges (now universities). The investments in education were a big part in Ireland's economic transformation while DUP have downed tools because a flower pot gets checked at Larne. It's the education vision they should be getting votes, not the big fuss over port checks.

Loyalists and unionist would live in shit before joining the country.. Educated prods may have a different view on things but if someone is a Loyalist and a unionist (its in the name) they won't give a crap that the DUP and the other groups are pulling the place down

When I say would, I meant Unionists would stay British for better or worse and won't support a UI. I agree. But many seem under the illusion that they are in an economically better position in the UK. They even roll out their Unionist economists (Gudgin, Birnie) to paint a narrative of economically better off in UK, and then you have Lowry with his better off in the 5th largest economy in the world, while still having full access to Dublin airport. That was his actual sell on the radio the other day.

[Rossfan]

When the New Ireland comes those who want to  in the  6 County Area can still have Brit Nationality and Citizenship.
Assuming there is still a Great Britain Political entity by then.

[Milltown Row2]

When the New Ireland comes those who want to  in the  6 County Area can still have Brit Nationality and Citizenship.
Assuming there is still a Great Britain Political entity by then.

I'm sure all the brits that live in the south have dual nationality? its not a problem I'd say, but they choose to live there.. No loyalist will choose to become part of the Republic.

It'll just have to be a head count vote and then they can decide to stay or go, I'd say less than .01% would even think about moving though

[Rossfan]

You could frame the Referendum Question to ensure NO meant favouring an All Ireland outcome?

[marty34]

Also remaining is the Unionist mindset  that most Catholics live on benefits which are much lower in the 26.

And everyone pays €50 to see a GP in the South all the while you'd do well to see a GP in the North for at least two weeks!

Yeah, the NHS is free at the point of use, but if you can't access the services due to lack of resources, what's the point?

Valid point JC.

NHS is held up as a beacon of light but it's crumbling badly.

[seafoid]

When the New Ireland comes those who want to  in the  6 County Area can still have Brit Nationality and Citizenship.
Assuming there is still a Great Britain Political entity by then.

I'm sure all the brits that live in the south have dual nationality? its not a problem I'd say, but they choose to live there.. No loyalist will choose to become part of the Republic.

It'll just have to be a head count vote and then they can decide to stay or go, I'd say less than .01% would even think about moving though

If something very bad happens economically that threatens the living standard of Loyalists but not people in the Republic- ie something linked to the UK, say the removal of the subvention you  would be in a new situation. The Union is bad for everyone but Loyalists don't get that ..yet.

[Wildweasel74]

Car insurance cost down south are a disgrace.