A United Ireland. Opening up the discussion.

[Milltown Row2]

Think of it in 'their' shoes, its not difficult, they are British and want to stay British, and you can throw every benefit at it.

Who do you mean by 'their'?
Unionism is a broad family - Loyalists, traditional Unionists, pragmatic Unionists, Catholic Unionists, cultural Unionists, agnostic/de facto Unionists (eg Alliance).

While every one of those need to be welcomed into any new Irish state, it's only those that form part of the middle ground that need persuading.

By the very term unionist they want to remain part of the union, You can at the very least see where they are coming from? You'd never willing want to stay in the union..

The closer it gets to the border question/poll/deliberation/implementation the place will be completely divided..

What are the timeframes for this? 10/20/30 years?

[johnnycool]

Think of it in 'their' shoes, its not difficult, they are British and want to stay British, and you can throw every benefit at it.

Who do you mean by 'their'?
Unionism is a broad family - Loyalists, traditional Unionists, pragmatic Unionists, Catholic Unionists, cultural Unionists, agnostic/de facto Unionists (eg Alliance).

While every one of those need to be welcomed into any new Irish state, it's only those that form part of the middle ground that need persuading.

By the very term unionist they want to remain part of the union, You can at the very least see where they are coming from? You'd never willing want to stay in the union..

The closer it gets to the border question/poll/deliberation/implementation the place will be completely divided..

What are the timeframes for this? 10/20/30 years?

As a percentage of the NI population those who term themselves as Unionist are dwindling, so as much as it would be good to have as many onboard going into a UI, it's not a requirement at the minute and will be even less of a requirement as time goes by.

[clonadmad]

Think of it in 'their' shoes, its not difficult, they are British and want to stay British, and you can throw every benefit at it.

Who do you mean by 'their'?
Unionism is a broad family - Loyalists, traditional Unionists, pragmatic Unionists, Catholic Unionists, cultural Unionists, agnostic/de facto Unionists (eg Alliance).

While every one of those need to be welcomed into any new Irish state, it's only those that form part of the middle ground that need persuading.

By the very term unionist they want to remain part of the union, You can at the very least see where they are coming from? You'd never willing want to stay in the union..

The closer it gets to the border question/poll/deliberation/implementation the place will be completely divided..

What are the timeframes for this? 10/20/30 years?

Best to not upset them and to leave NI as it is then

Let's run the place into the ground so that the south can't afford us but we will be poor, British and happy seem to be their singular strategy

No wonder they are so against the Protocol because it is doing the opposite

[marty34]

Think of it in 'their' shoes, its not difficult, they are British and want to stay British, and you can throw every benefit at it.

Who do you mean by 'their'?
Unionism is a broad family - Loyalists, traditional Unionists, pragmatic Unionists, Catholic Unionists, cultural Unionists, agnostic/de facto Unionists (eg Alliance).

While every one of those need to be welcomed into any new Irish state, it's only those that form part of the middle ground that need persuading.

By the very term unionist they want to remain part of the union, You can at the very least see where they are coming from? You'd never willing want to stay in the union..

The closer it gets to the border question/poll/deliberation/implementation the place will be completely divided..

What are the timeframes for this? 10/20/30 years?

Best to not upset them and to leave NI as it is then

Let's run the place into the ground so that the south can't afford us but we will be poor, British and happy seem to be their singular strategy

No wonder they are so against the Protocol because it is doing the opposite

We were poor but we were happy. 

[Milltown Row2]

"We were poor but we were happy"

I read that like hearing the sash my father wore 

[clonadmad]

Think of it in 'their' shoes, its not difficult, they are British and want to stay British, and you can throw every benefit at it.

Who do you mean by 'their'?
Unionism is a broad family - Loyalists, traditional Unionists, pragmatic Unionists, Catholic Unionists, cultural Unionists, agnostic/de facto Unionists (eg Alliance).

While every one of those need to be welcomed into any new Irish state, it's only those that form part of the middle ground that need persuading.

By the very term unionist they want to remain part of the union, You can at the very least see where they are coming from? You'd never willing want to stay in the union..

The closer it gets to the border question/poll/deliberation/implementation the place will be completely divided..

What are the timeframes for this? 10/20/30 years?

Best to not upset them and to leave NI as it is then

Let's run the place into the ground so that the south can't afford us but we will be poor, British and happy seem to be their singular strategy

No wonder they are so against the Protocol because it is doing the opposite

We were poor but we were happy. 

Poor,Happy and British

[marty34]

"We were poor but we were happy"

I read that like hearing the sash my father wore 

Coming up to the right time of year too MR2. 

[Milltown Row2]

Think of it in 'their' shoes, its not difficult, they are British and want to stay British, and you can throw every benefit at it.

Who do you mean by 'their'?
Unionism is a broad family - Loyalists, traditional Unionists, pragmatic Unionists, Catholic Unionists, cultural Unionists, agnostic/de facto Unionists (eg Alliance).

While every one of those need to be welcomed into any new Irish state, it's only those that form part of the middle ground that need persuading.

By the very term unionist they want to remain part of the union, You can at the very least see where they are coming from? You'd never willing want to stay in the union..

The closer it gets to the border question/poll/deliberation/implementation the place will be completely divided..

What are the timeframes for this? 10/20/30 years?

Best to not upset them and to leave NI as it is then

Let's run the place into the ground so that the south can't afford us but we will be poor, British and happy seem to be their singular strategy

No wonder they are so against the Protocol because it is doing the opposite

We were poor but we were happy. 

Poor,Happy and British

You're saying that like there's no food banks or plenty of affordable housing in the south

[clonadmad]

Think of it in 'their' shoes, its not difficult, they are British and want to stay British, and you can throw every benefit at it.

Who do you mean by 'their'?
Unionism is a broad family - Loyalists, traditional Unionists, pragmatic Unionists, Catholic Unionists, cultural Unionists, agnostic/de facto Unionists (eg Alliance).

While every one of those need to be welcomed into any new Irish state, it's only those that form part of the middle ground that need persuading.

By the very term unionist they want to remain part of the union, You can at the very least see where they are coming from? You'd never willing want to stay in the union..

The closer it gets to the border question/poll/deliberation/implementation the place will be completely divided..

What are the timeframes for this? 10/20/30 years?

Best to not upset them and to leave NI as it is then

Let's run the place into the ground so that the south can't afford us but we will be poor, British and happy seem to be their singular strategy

No wonder they are so against the Protocol because it is doing the opposite

We were poor but we were happy. 

Poor,Happy and British

You're saying that like there's no food banks or plenty of affordable housing in the south

And that's McWilliams point

We in the south should be exploiting Northern Ireland with its cheap housing and cheap labour for the good of an all Ireland economy

" But here is the opportunity. The Republic has too much demand and not enough supply; the North has too much supply and not enough demand. Integrate further and gains accrue to both jurisdictions.

Take commercial rents, which are far lower in the North. Prime rents in Belfast are £23 (€26.73) per sq ft as opposed to €65 in Dublin. Surely this gap can be bridged as companies move? The average monthly rent in the North is £773 (about €900), as opposed to the average rent in the Republic, which stands at €1,750 – almost double that in Northern Ireland. The average cost of a home in Northern Ireland is £197,800 (€229,902); it is €308,497 in the South."

[AustinPowers]

Think of it in 'their' shoes, its not difficult, they are British and want to stay British, and you can throw every benefit at it.

Who do you mean by 'their'?
Unionism is a broad family - Loyalists, traditional Unionists, pragmatic Unionists, Catholic Unionists, cultural Unionists, agnostic/de facto Unionists (eg Alliance).

While every one of those need to be welcomed into any new Irish state, it's only those that form part of the middle ground that need persuading.

By the very term unionist they want to remain part of the union, You can at the very least see where they are coming from? You'd never willing want to stay in the union..

The closer it gets to the border question/poll/deliberation/implementation the place will be completely divided..

What are the timeframes for this? 10/20/30 years?

As a percentage of the NI population those who term themselves as Unionist are dwindling, so as much as it would be good to have as many onboard going into a UI, it's not a requirement at the minute and will be even less of a requirement as time goes by.

Do you mean  those  with a unionist identity or  those who vote for  unionist parties?

[marty34]

Think of it in 'their' shoes, its not difficult, they are British and want to stay British, and you can throw every benefit at it.

Who do you mean by 'their'?
Unionism is a broad family - Loyalists, traditional Unionists, pragmatic Unionists, Catholic Unionists, cultural Unionists, agnostic/de facto Unionists (eg Alliance).

While every one of those need to be welcomed into any new Irish state, it's only those that form part of the middle ground that need persuading.

By the very term unionist they want to remain part of the union, You can at the very least see where they are coming from? You'd never willing want to stay in the union..

The closer it gets to the border question/poll/deliberation/implementation the place will be completely divided..

What are the timeframes for this? 10/20/30 years?

Best to not upset them and to leave NI as it is then

Let's run the place into the ground so that the south can't afford us but we will be poor, British and happy seem to be their singular strategy

No wonder they are so against the Protocol because it is doing the opposite

We were poor but we were happy. 

Poor,Happy and British

You're saying that like there's no food banks or plenty of affordable housing in the south

And that's McWilliams point

We in the south should be exploiting Northern Ireland with its cheap housing and cheap labour for the good of an all Ireland economy

" But here is the opportunity. The Republic has too much demand and not enough supply; the North has too much supply and not enough demand. Integrate further and gains accrue to both jurisdictions.

Take commercial rents, which are far lower in the North. Prime rents in Belfast are £23 (€26.73) per sq ft as opposed to €65 in Dublin. Surely this gap can be bridged as companies move? The average monthly rent in the North is £773 (about €900), as opposed to the average rent in the Republic, which stands at €1,750 – almost double that in Northern Ireland. The average cost of a home in Northern Ireland is £197,800 (€229,902); it is €308,497 in the South."

What's the average wage of each?

[LeoMc]

Think of it in 'their' shoes, its not difficult, they are British and want to stay British, and you can throw every benefit at it.

Who do you mean by 'their'?
Unionism is a broad family - Loyalists, traditional Unionists, pragmatic Unionists, Catholic Unionists, cultural Unionists, agnostic/de facto Unionists (eg Alliance).

While every one of those need to be welcomed into any new Irish state, it's only those that form part of the middle ground that need persuading.

By the very term unionist they want to remain part of the union, You can at the very least see where they are coming from? You'd never willing want to stay in the union..

The closer it gets to the border question/poll/deliberation/implementation the place will be completely divided..

What are the timeframes for this? 10/20/30 years?

Best to not upset them and to leave NI as it is then

Let's run the place into the ground so that the south can't afford us but we will be poor, British and happy seem to be their singular strategy

No wonder they are so against the Protocol because it is doing the opposite

We were poor but we were happy. 

Poor,Happy and British

You're saying that like there's no food banks or plenty of affordable housing in the south

And that's McWilliams point

We in the south should be exploiting Northern Ireland with its cheap housing and cheap labour for the good of an all Ireland economy

" But here is the opportunity. The Republic has too much demand and not enough supply; the North has too much supply and not enough demand. Integrate further and gains accrue to both jurisdictions.

Take commercial rents, which are far lower in the North. Prime rents in Belfast are £23 (€26.73) per sq ft as opposed to €65 in Dublin. Surely this gap can be bridged as companies move? The average monthly rent in the North is £773 (about €900), as opposed to the average rent in the Republic, which stands at €1,750 – almost double that in Northern Ireland. The average cost of a home in Northern Ireland is £197,800 (€229,902); it is €308,497 in the South."

From a personal perspective it is a great case for live in the North, work in the South.
From a business perspective it is a great case for having an office in the North.

[Applesisapples]

Think of it in 'their' shoes, its not difficult, they are British and want to stay British, and you can throw every benefit at it.

Who do you mean by 'their'?
Unionism is a broad family - Loyalists, traditional Unionists, pragmatic Unionists, Catholic Unionists, cultural Unionists, agnostic/de facto Unionists (eg Alliance).

While every one of those need to be welcomed into any new Irish state, it's only those that form part of the middle ground that need persuading.

By the very term unionist they want to remain part of the union, You can at the very least see where they are coming from? You'd never willing want to stay in the union..

The closer it gets to the border question/poll/deliberation/implementation the place will be completely divided..

What are the timeframes for this? 10/20/30 years?

Whatever the timeframe, unity will only happen organically, in my view as my generation dies of and the unionist middle ground see more and more benefits of some form of UI (probably federal to start) it will come into being. It will be helped by the decline of the UK as a global economy and the mindset of English political parties. A referendum is not winnable at the moment. People need something positive to vote for.

[Main Street]

Think of it in 'their' shoes, its not difficult, they are British and want to stay British, and you can throw every benefit at it.

Who do you mean by 'their'?
Unionism is a broad family - Loyalists, traditional Unionists, pragmatic Unionists, Catholic Unionists, cultural Unionists, agnostic/de facto Unionists (eg Alliance).

While every one of those need to be welcomed into any new Irish state, it's only those that form part of the middle ground that need persuading.

By the very term unionist they want to remain part of the union, You can at the very least see where they are coming from? You'd never willing want to stay in the union..

The closer it gets to the border question/poll/deliberation/implementation the place will be completely divided..

What are the timeframes for this? 10/20/30 years?

Best to not upset them and to leave NI as it is then

Let's run the place into the ground so that the south can't afford us but we will be poor, British and happy seem to be their singular strategy

No wonder they are so against the Protocol because it is doing the opposite

We were poor but we were happy. 

Poor,Happy and British

You're saying that like there's no food banks or plenty of affordable housing in the south

And that's McWilliams point

We in the south should be exploiting Northern Ireland with its cheap housing and cheap labour for the good of an all Ireland economy

" But here is the opportunity. The Republic has too much demand and not enough supply; the North has too much supply and not enough demand. Integrate further and gains accrue to both jurisdictions.

Take commercial rents, which are far lower in the North. Prime rents in Belfast are £23 (€26.73) per sq ft as opposed to €65 in Dublin. Surely this gap can be bridged as companies move? The average monthly rent in the North is £773 (about €900), as opposed to the average rent in the Republic, which stands at €1,750 – almost double that in Northern Ireland. The average cost of a home in Northern Ireland is £197,800 (€229,902); it is €308,497 in the South."

I bet you that MR2 has not listened to the podcast

McWilliams' point was the DUP  policy is to keep NI economically deprived,  by being anti protocol, anti democratic over and above relative economic paradise, i.e. being in the UK and at the same time in the EU, just because they claimed such an arrangement would threaten their British identity.  And the DUP did not care one jot how a hard border would affect the social and economic lives of Irish people over and above their fixation with the necessity to have a hard border.
McWilliams' podcast was about how Brexit has actually strengthened Irish economic unity beyond anyone's prediction,  instead of the DUP's wet dream of Brexit driving a wedge between north and south.

MR2, have you anything to comment on the  McWillams podcast? 

[Milltown Row2]

Think of it in 'their' shoes, its not difficult, they are British and want to stay British, and you can throw every benefit at it.

Who do you mean by 'their'?
Unionism is a broad family - Loyalists, traditional Unionists, pragmatic Unionists, Catholic Unionists, cultural Unionists, agnostic/de facto Unionists (eg Alliance).

While every one of those need to be welcomed into any new Irish state, it's only those that form part of the middle ground that need persuading.

By the very term unionist they want to remain part of the union, You can at the very least see where they are coming from? You'd never willing want to stay in the union..

The closer it gets to the border question/poll/deliberation/implementation the place will be completely divided..

What are the timeframes for this? 10/20/30 years?

Best to not upset them and to leave NI as it is then

Let's run the place into the ground so that the south can't afford us but we will be poor, British and happy seem to be their singular strategy

No wonder they are so against the Protocol because it is doing the opposite

We were poor but we were happy. 

Poor,Happy and British

You're saying that like there's no food banks or plenty of affordable housing in the south

And that's McWilliams point

We in the south should be exploiting Northern Ireland with its cheap housing and cheap labour for the good of an all Ireland economy

" But here is the opportunity. The Republic has too much demand and not enough supply; the North has too much supply and not enough demand. Integrate further and gains accrue to both jurisdictions.

Take commercial rents, which are far lower in the North. Prime rents in Belfast are £23 (€26.73) per sq ft as opposed to €65 in Dublin. Surely this gap can be bridged as companies move? The average monthly rent in the North is £773 (about €900), as opposed to the average rent in the Republic, which stands at €1,750 – almost double that in Northern Ireland. The average cost of a home in Northern Ireland is £197,800 (€229,902); it is €308,497 in the South."

I bet you that MR2 has not listened to the podcast

McWilliams' point was the DUP  policy is to keep NI economically deprived,  by being anti protocol, anti democratic over and above relative economic paradise, i.e. being in the UK and at the same time in the EU, just because they claimed such an arrangement would threaten their British identity.  And the DUP did not care one jot how a hard border would affect the social and economic lives of Irish people over and above their fixation with the necessity to have a hard border.
McWilliams' podcast was about how Brexit has actually strengthened Irish economic unity beyond anyone's prediction,  instead of the DUP's wet dream of Brexit driving a wedge between north and south.

MR2, have you anything to comment on the  McWillams podcast?

I don't need to listen to someone talking shite, you do plenty here.

No one is saying that economically that a UI that is part of the EU is not better than being stuck in the shit set up the UK has found itself in after Brexit/pandemic and successive governments that have run the place into the ground, a blind man on a galloping horse can see that.

The potential voters won't listen to a Dublin ex banker telling them that, it needs to be from within that community. But identity over economics will prevail unfortunately. Though the Unionists would like his views on Israel, he's "just somebody who is prepared to see an Israeli point of view"