Tyrone County Football and Hurling

[Keyboard Warrior]

There does seem to be a few more coming through at underage, But it is hard to find someone who is top class at free's and can justify his position for other reasons!

At younger level Coalislands full forward for the u21's hit 2 45+ yards against Carrickmore in the semi final when the game was tight I think his name was Corr? Again going younger Ciaran Daly for Carrickmore minors has ridiculous feet, from inside the 45 in any position it wouldn't be too often he would miss a free! He hit a free from the sideline about 40 yards out in an u21 game against dromore with the last kick of the game to win it so can handle pressure.

Obviously the likes of these players wont be on the team soon but could be worth looking out for in the future!

Two players that will never be near the Tyrone senior panel no harm to you.

And your experience and expertise gives you the right to say the won't.

Sean Corr is nowhere near the Coalisland team, so if he is not good enough to start for them what value would he be to the Tyrone Senior Panel.
Ciaran Daly didnt feature for Tyrone minors, usually players who push onto the senior team come through minor and u21 ranks, some don't so wouldnt completely rule him out but by and large they come through this way.

Coming through a county minor setup is no guarantee of making a senior squad and/or being successful. Just a few examples: Ryan McMenamin played no underage for Tyrone. Conor Gormley and Conor McManus didn't make their respective county minor squads. All became all-stars. 

[Fuzzman]

Il Bomber Destro, are you saying then that you are happy for Tyrone to continue playing this style of football where we  rarely kick the ball forward and we usually run the ball almost rugby style passing it to the man on the shoulder in order to keep possession?
It has been successful to a degree I suppose in that we have won Ulster this year and got the AI 1/4 finals this year and semi finals last year but I can't decide myself is it the way forward.
I think it is really draining the confidence and development of our forwards and that's why I was asking do most clubs in Tyrone now also play this way?

I would worry for the future development of our forwards if this is what is being coached and practised at club games all the time. My point being that Lee Brennan is being talked up as being a very bright hope for our future but why is he not already in the team as we don't exactly have great forwards? Is it because so much emphasis is being put on our defensive style that he doesn't fit into that yet? If that is the case then we really have a problem with our game and how we are treating talented forwards.
A few of ye said above that McAliskey is a great forward and could be hitting most of the frees but the man's being asked to work so hard back in his own defence most of the time. To me it's crazy and's it's all too easy to just say well other teams do the same. Other teams copied us and Donegal who we got obsessed with but I know so many fans now who followed Tyrone for years who won't even go to matches now cos of the rubbish we have to watch.
Winning Ulster was a big relief for the fans and the squad as it showed playing this way does reap rewards sometimes but I for one am worried how this defensive mindset is having a longer term effect on our forwards mindset. Will it drive many talented players away to soccer, Aussie rules and other sports as they think we would I bother busting my ass working so hard when there is no fun any more being a forward for Tyrone.

[Mikhailov]

One reason you don't see McManus ever miss much frees for Monaghan is that he knows his range, he knows when he is comfortable and not forcing them. For instance you rarely see him kick any from more that 35 metres out, he knows they are not in range. He hits some excellent frees from acute angles but knows he will have problems with accuracy from further out. A forward who is missing frees will certainly have his confidence dented so if it's not in range don't hit it. I have seen O'Neill take many frees this year where they were out of his range and knew he was likely not going to score before hitting them.

Did you not see McManus against us in Croker last year or v Donegal in Breffni in the first game this year. He is well capable of hitting 45 metre frees over the bar and indeed his last 2 free kicks against Donegal were both outside the 45'. He can score from acute angles as you say but these are still 30-40 metres out when the angle is taken into consideration and he makes them look really easy. Last year in Croker he hit sublime scores from all distances and angles. The reality is that 45 metres should be a comfortable range for a quality free taker (Sheehan, McManus, Rock, O'Connor) but we don't even have any who are comfortable from 35 metre - that is the stark reality.  We haven't had a nailed on free taker in over 10 years.....one that you can RELY on.....once the free is given then we can take it for granted it is a score.....

[skeog]

met a former gaa stalwart today who has followed tyrone for 50 yrs has not been to a game for 3 yrs no enjoyment in watching 15 defenders play 15 defenders in most cases he said

[Jeremiah O]

I know a former player too Skeog who refuses to go to Tyrone games as he cant watch their style of play.Kids have him tortured looking to go but he refuses to go.He watched the Ulster final at home but decided to take the dog for a walk 10 mins into the 2nd half.

[Club boi]

Il Bomber Destro, are you saying then that you are happy for Tyrone to continue playing this style of football where we  rarely kick the ball forward and we usually run the ball almost rugby style passing it to the man on the shoulder in order to keep possession?
It has been successful to a degree I suppose in that we have won Ulster this year and got the AI 1/4 finals this year and semi finals last year but I can't decide myself is it the way forward.
I think it is really draining the confidence and development of our forwards and that's why I was asking do most clubs in Tyrone now also play this way?

I would worry for the future development of our forwards if this is what is being coached and practised at club games all the time. My point being that Lee Brennan is being talked up as being a very bright hope for our future but why is he not already in the team as we don't exactly have great forwards? Is it because so much emphasis is being put on our defensive style that he doesn't fit into that yet? If that is the case then we really have a problem with our game and how we are treating talented forwards.
A few of ye said above that McAliskey is a great forward and could be hitting most of the frees but the man's being asked to work so hard back in his own defence most of the time. To me it's crazy and's it's all too easy to just say well other teams do the same. Other teams copied us and Donegal who we got obsessed with but I know so many fans now who followed Tyrone for years who won't even go to matches now cos of the rubbish we have to watch.
Winning Ulster was a big relief for the fans and the squad as it showed playing this way does reap rewards sometimes but I for one am worried how this defensive mindset is having a longer term effect on our forwards mindset. Will it drive many talented players away to soccer, Aussie rules and other sports as they think we would I bother busting my ass working so hard when there is no fun any more being a forward for Tyrone.

Have to agree 100% with the Fuzzman, especially - "Will it drive many talented players away to soccer, Aussie rules and other sports as they think we would I bother busting my ass working so hard when there is no fun any more" except I would finish that sentence with IN PLAYING GAA, not just a forward

[Il Bomber Destro]

One reason you don't see McManus ever miss much frees for Monaghan is that he knows his range, he knows when he is comfortable and not forcing them. For instance you rarely see him kick any from more that 35 metres out, he knows they are not in range. He hits some excellent frees from acute angles but knows he will have problems with accuracy from further out. A forward who is missing frees will certainly have his confidence dented so if it's not in range don't hit it. I have seen O'Neill take many frees this year where they were out of his range and knew he was likely not going to score before hitting them.

Did you not see McManus against us in Croker last year or v Donegal in Breffni in the first game this year. He is well capable of hitting 45 metre frees over the bar and indeed his last 2 free kicks against Donegal were both outside the 45'. He can score from acute angles as you say but these are still 30-40 metres out when the angle is taken into consideration and he makes them look really easy. Last year in Croker he hit sublime scores from all distances and angles. The reality is that 45 metres should be a comfortable range for a quality free taker (Sheehan, McManus, Rock, O'Connor) but we don't even have any who are comfortable from 35 metre - that is the stark reality.  We haven't had a nailed on free taker in over 10 years.....one that you can RELY on.....once the free is given then we can take it for granted it is a score.....

If he is then why does he regularly step aside to let Rory Beggan come up and hit them? He knows his range, too often I have see the likes of O'Neill and McCurry hitting frees from distances they are not comfortable with.

[Il Bomber Destro]

Il Bomber Destro, are you saying then that you are happy for Tyrone to continue playing this style of football where we  rarely kick the ball forward and we usually run the ball almost rugby style passing it to the man on the shoulder in order to keep possession?
It has been successful to a degree I suppose in that we have won Ulster this year and got the AI 1/4 finals this year and semi finals last year but I can't decide myself is it the way forward.
I think it is really draining the confidence and development of our forwards and that's why I was asking do most clubs in Tyrone now also play this way?

I would worry for the future development of our forwards if this is what is being coached and practised at club games all the time. My point being that Lee Brennan is being talked up as being a very bright hope for our future but why is he not already in the team as we don't exactly have great forwards? Is it because so much emphasis is being put on our defensive style that he doesn't fit into that yet? If that is the case then we really have a problem with our game and how we are treating talented forwards.
A few of ye said above that McAliskey is a great forward and could be hitting most of the frees but the man's being asked to work so hard back in his own defence most of the time. To me it's crazy and's it's all too easy to just say well other teams do the same. Other teams copied us and Donegal who we got obsessed with but I know so many fans now who followed Tyrone for years who won't even go to matches now cos of the rubbish we have to watch.
Winning Ulster was a big relief for the fans and the squad as it showed playing this way does reap rewards sometimes but I for one am worried how this defensive mindset is having a longer term effect on our forwards mindset. Will it drive many talented players away to soccer, Aussie rules and other sports as they think we would I bother busting my ass working so hard when there is no fun any more being a forward for Tyrone.

Lee Brennan didn't feature this year because he was involved we had a settled team throughout the league and Mickey went with that.

This defensive mindset is the way football is going, players are too powerful, fast and fit these days to play open. If you have a guy breaking at speed in open spaces a defender hasn't a prayer against a guy on the front foot - not a chance.

The main reasons why teams play this way is Dublin, you simply will not beat Dublin if you don't have a solid defensive base. We have that nailed down, now we need to develop of our attacking play, a guy running into traffic, panicking and taking a mental shot on is not on, it is stupid and will cost us. We have to develop our composure and show patience in working openings.

It's about being smart, we can kick the ball in but it would have been ridiculously stupid to do this against the likes of Donegal and Mayo as both sides were set up extremely defensively and you will also realise that neither side kicked the ball in to much against Tyrone either as their tactics mirrored each other. What stood for Mayo was they were much more composed in waiting for the chances to appear rather than forcing them when they weren't there. If we want to kick the ball in we need a natural full forward who can win any sort of ball and we don't have one. People are expecting too much from Lee Brennan. Is he really any better than McCurry for instance, there is nothing to suggest that he is right now.

The game has changed and a defensive structure is a must with the modern athletic player, you have to have loads of players behind the ball or guys will cut through the middle of the defence. I'd much rather watch a game like Tyrone-Donegal or Tyrone-Mayo than the farce that was Tyrone-Cavan in the replay.

If we want to win we need to persist the way we are and develop on it. As for guys who refuse to watch any more, off with them, the game has improved in terms of skill over the years, watching big lumbering donkeys aimlessly smashing the ball up in the air is thankfully on the decline.

[skeog]

If Greencastle had a free taker Carmen would have had a first round exit dont think Carmen be around at the business end.

[The Golden Years]

If Greencastle had a free taker Carmen would have had a first round exit dont think Carmen be around at the business end.

If Martin Sludden wasn't a biased f@*ker Greencastle would have been beaten by more. Should never be allowed to referee thon walking heart attack.

[redzone]

How did cahir mccullagh play. That Daly player carrickmore ones were on about isn't even on the 30 man panel. Is he injured or to young

[TF15]

I would say Cahir's performance could only be described as bipolar. Scored some incredible points but missed two easy frees from close in and kicked some mad wides from ridiculous shooting positions when the game was close late on. Certainly has some great attributes but is really really raw in his decision making.

[Gaffer]

I know a former player too Skeog who refuses to go to Tyrone games as he cant watch their style of play.Kids have him tortured looking to go but he refuses to go.He watched the Ulster final at home but decided to take the dog for a walk 10 mins into the 2nd half.

Doesn't think much of his kids then!!!

[The Golden Years]

How did cahir mccullagh play. That Daly player carrickmore ones were on about isn't even on the 30 man panel. Is he injured or to young

Ciaran Daly picked up a knee injury against Galbally in an u21 game. Only back doing light training at the minute.

[Fuzzman]

What do others think?
Hand on heart did you enjoy the Ulster final this year?
Yes I was delighted that we won and finally beat this Donegal side but if I'm honest it was a horrible game and it's too easy to say that's Donegal's fault.
Teams mirror our set up now of 14 men behind the ball as they see they have to do this to beat us. It's a catch 22 situation and I feel we are now feeling trapped into playing like this.
Back in the 2000s we played much better football without hoofing it aimlessly forward. We got wing forwards to come back to help our defence.
Now we play with fear and don't trust our defenders to do a job.  The blanket defence isn't working either against Dublin or Kerry as they still have better forwards. Something that we are falling behind with every year.