Westminster Election 12th December 2019

[playwiththewind1st]

Why not? Makes it far easier for them to get to & from Ibrox & various LOL marches in Glasgow, where they can spit on priests & celebrate their culture to their heart's content.

[Eamonnca1]

Yeah, would be very interested in knowing when that happened.

I stand corrected. Seems like it was a local thing in North Armagh.

[gallsman]

Yeah, would be very interested in knowing when that happened.

I stand corrected. Seems like it was a local thing in North Armagh.

St. Ronan's? It's still a grammar school.

[seafoid]

https://www.ft.com/content/628bfd48-2029-11ea-b8a1-584213ee7b2b

The negotiations at Stormont, the regional parliament building outside Belfast, follow last week's general election in which the Democratic Unionists and Sinn Féin, the largest pro-British and Irish nationalist parties, respectively, both saw their share of the vote fall. The outcome has raised the stakes for the talks because Julian Smith, secretary of state for Northern Ireland, has threatened to invoke his powers to call new regional elections if there is no deal by January 13, an unappealing prospect for both the DUP and Sinn Féin after losing support.

[smelmoth]

Why not? Makes it far easier for them to get to & from Ibrox & various LOL marches in Glasgow, where they can spit on priests & celebrate their culture to their heart's content.

From an engineering perspective a bridge to Scotland is more likely than a bridge from Ballintoy to Saturn. But only marginally.

[Eamonnca1]

Yeah, would be very interested in knowing when that happened.

I stand corrected. Seems like it was a local thing in North Armagh.

St. Ronan's? It's still a grammar school.

Are you sure?

[gallsman]

Yeah, would be very interested in knowing when that happened.

I stand corrected. Seems like it was a local thing in North Armagh.

St. Ronan's? It's still a grammar school.

Are you sure?

Yes, it's a non-selective grammar.

[dec]

Yeah, would be very interested in knowing when that happened.

I stand corrected. Seems like it was a local thing in North Armagh.

St. Ronan's? It's still a grammar school.

Are you sure?

St Ronan's is an all ability school, it is a merger of a grammar school and 2 secondary schools.

Sinn Fein did not abolish grammar schools, they got rid of the state run 11 plus/transfer test.

The grammar schools then simply created their own transfer test as a replacement. It being Northern Ireland there are now 2 tests.

https://www.thetransfertest.com/schools

AQE mostly Protestant schools
GL mostly Catholic schools

The North Armagh thing you are thinking of is probably the https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dickson_Plan

[RadioGAAGAA]

They actually did this already, and they "launched" it twice in an attempt to give it some publicity. They got independent experts to assess it and they found that reunification would boost GDP through the elimination of duplicated public services. That was before Brexit, mind you.

I know the one you are talking about. Was done by German academics who had studied German reunification.

But they need to be getting new studies along these lines released every 6 months. The releases must be done without Sinn Fein involvement. It has to be seen as independent - at least in presentation of findings.

[tbrick18]

A border poll is far down the list of things that need to happen between now an Irish reunification. Higher on the list is the desegregation of society in the north along religious lines, but I don't see a whole lot of progress being made on that front. SF have had the education portfolio for years and were able to scrap the grammar school system over the objections of recalcitrant people who wanted to retain selection, but don't seem to have the same eagerness for scrapping the unacceptable practice of keeping school kids segregated by religion until they go to the tech or go to Uni.

In fact SF's business model seems to be "complain about how unfairly treated we are by the evil Brits and that should keep the votes coming in." They'll probably spend the next decade banging on about why we need a border poll now and how unreasonable the Brits are for not providing one.

Ahh the magic bullet of integrated education.
Will these schools teach Irish history, Gaelige, do gaelic games?

Yes

No.
Integrated education is a fantastic idea, however, it is not universally implemented in the same way.
In my experience of it, there was no irish history, Irish language or gaelic games. However, there were Ulster Scotts classes, Badminton, soccer and table tennis.
In a school primarily staffed by Catholic Staff, with Protestant management. A primarily catholic intake at that time - and kids not getting places as there were too many catholics. Quite a few Protestant families complaining about the lack of Gaelic/Irish as they wanted there kids to experience something they felt they couldn't get elsewhere and also quite a few protestant families complaining when a teacher wore a gaelic top to a sponsored walk fund raiser.
The quality of education was also not what either the state or catholic schools (primary schools) as hardly anyone sat or had the ability to sit the transfer test.
No-one was happy with the level of integration, or lack thereof, in the integrated school I have experience of.

From what I have seen of it, Integrated education will only work if the management, staff and families who send their kids to these schools live and breath and integrated ethos. Staff, IMO, integrated schools are only there as they couldn't get a job in a school from their respective tradition. In many cases, kids in the schools are the same, though, there is a sizeable number of mixed marriages with kids in integrated schools.

I know I've gone on a bit of a rant there on Integrated Education, but it galls me to hear so much spouted about the virtues of Integrated Education when the realities don't really live up to the expectations.

[smelmoth]

A border poll is far down the list of things that need to happen between now an Irish reunification. Higher on the list is the desegregation of society in the north along religious lines, but I don't see a whole lot of progress being made on that front. SF have had the education portfolio for years and were able to scrap the grammar school system over the objections of recalcitrant people who wanted to retain selection, but don't seem to have the same eagerness for scrapping the unacceptable practice of keeping school kids segregated by religion until they go to the tech or go to Uni.

In fact SF's business model seems to be "complain about how unfairly treated we are by the evil Brits and that should keep the votes coming in." They'll probably spend the next decade banging on about why we need a border poll now and how unreasonable the Brits are for not providing one.

Ahh the magic bullet of integrated education.
Will these schools teach Irish history, Gaelige, do gaelic games?

Yes

No.
Integrated education is a fantastic idea, however, it is not universally implemented in the same way.
In my experience of it, there was no irish history, Irish language or gaelic games. However, there were Ulster Scotts classes, Badminton, soccer and table tennis.
In a school primarily staffed by Catholic Staff, with Protestant management. A primarily catholic intake at that time - and kids not getting places as there were too many catholics. Quite a few Protestant families complaining about the lack of Gaelic/Irish as they wanted there kids to experience something they felt they couldn't get elsewhere and also quite a few protestant families complaining when a teacher wore a gaelic top to a sponsored walk fund raiser.
The quality of education was also not what either the state or catholic schools (primary schools) as hardly anyone sat or had the ability to sit the transfer test.
No-one was happy with the level of integration, or lack thereof, in the integrated school I have experience of.

From what I have seen of it, Integrated education will only work if the management, staff and families who send their kids to these schools live and breath and integrated ethos. Staff, IMO, integrated schools are only there as they couldn't get a job in a school from their respective tradition. In many cases, kids in the schools are the same, though, there is a sizeable number of mixed marriages with kids in integrated schools.

I know I've gone on a bit of a rant there on Integrated Education, but it galls me to hear so much spouted about the virtues of Integrated Education when the realities don't really live up to the expectations.

My experience would be the polar opposite.

What we need to do is remove segregated education and simply have education.

[michaelg]

A border poll is far down the list of things that need to happen between now an Irish reunification. Higher on the list is the desegregation of society in the north along religious lines, but I don't see a whole lot of progress being made on that front. SF have had the education portfolio for years and were able to scrap the grammar school system over the objections of recalcitrant people who wanted to retain selection, but don't seem to have the same eagerness for scrapping the unacceptable practice of keeping school kids segregated by religion until they go to the tech or go to Uni.

In fact SF's business model seems to be "complain about how unfairly treated we are by the evil Brits and that should keep the votes coming in." They'll probably spend the next decade banging on about why we need a border poll now and how unreasonable the Brits are for not providing one.

Ahh the magic bullet of integrated education.
Will these schools teach Irish history, Gaelige, do gaelic games?

Yes

No.
Integrated education is a fantastic idea, however, it is not universally implemented in the same way.
In my experience of it, there was no irish history, Irish language or gaelic games. However, there were Ulster Scotts classes, Badminton, soccer and table tennis.
In a school primarily staffed by Catholic Staff, with Protestant management. A primarily catholic intake at that time - and kids not getting places as there were too many catholics. Quite a few Protestant families complaining about the lack of Gaelic/Irish as they wanted there kids to experience something they felt they couldn't get elsewhere and also quite a few protestant families complaining when a teacher wore a gaelic top to a sponsored walk fund raiser.
The quality of education was also not what either the state or catholic schools (primary schools) as hardly anyone sat or had the ability to sit the transfer test.
No-one was happy with the level of integration, or lack thereof, in the integrated school I have experience of.

From what I have seen of it, Integrated education will only work if the management, staff and families who send their kids to these schools live and breath and integrated ethos. Staff, IMO, integrated schools are only there as they couldn't get a job in a school from their respective tradition. In many cases, kids in the schools are the same, though, there is a sizeable number of mixed marriages with kids in integrated schools.

I know I've gone on a bit of a rant there on Integrated Education, but it galls me to hear so much spouted about the virtues of Integrated Education when the realities don't really live up to the expectations.

Can't believe you could get so irked about a  spot of badmington and table tennis!  Surely the main virtue of integrated is that young people are being educated together from an early age, building life long friendships and realising that the folk from the other "community" don't have two heads.

[trailer]

St Mary's has a lot to answer for regarding the teachers in the current education system. They are unwilling to share or integrate at all. It's has a very conservative Irish ethos.
Integrated Education is a brilliant idea. Unfortunately it's being implemented by people used to segregation and getting their own way, who then see everything as a concession.

[Armagh18]

St Mary's has a lot to answer for regarding the teachers in the current education system. They are unwilling to share or integrate at all. It's has a very conservative Irish ethos.
Integrated Education is a brilliant idea. Unfortunately it's being implemented by people used to segregation and getting their own way, who then see everything as a concession.

So we should now apologise for being too Irish. Ffs

[trailer]

St Mary's has a lot to answer for regarding the teachers in the current education system. They are unwilling to share or integrate at all. It's has a very conservative Irish ethos.
Integrated Education is a brilliant idea. Unfortunately it's being implemented by people used to segregation and getting their own way, who then see everything as a concession.

So we should now apologise for being too Irish. Ffs

I didn't say that.