FAI...New Manager Hunt continues

[Ed Ricketts]

Stephen Kenny's teams punched above their weight everywhere he went.

I think thats green tinted glasses. For every successful job he did like Dundalk and Dery there are terrible ones like Shamrock Rovers and Bohs.

I think he is an underdog manager. Can step into a smaller or struggling club and bounce it. But when he has gone into jobs with expectations there have been problems, especially with established players. He is a great manager, but are his skills transferable to international soccer,

I think that is a bit unfair. The Bohs gig was 20 years ago ffs. When he was a 30 year old novice.

The comment about struggling with expectations is a bit wide of the mark too. He won the double with Dundalk in 2014. Then, on the back of the increased expectations that such a success brings, continued to win things flat out right through to a second double four years later in 2018.

His short spell with the U21s was also very good, coming away with a better record than pretty much any of his predecessors. That augurs very well for his shot with the senior team.

I'm excited to see what he can do. His teams usually play an attractive style of football, with will hopefully be something of an antidote to the growing apathy around the national team. And he'll hopefully be in a position to benefit from the emergence of a handful of very promising young players.

[macdanger2]

Stephen Kenny's teams punched above their weight everywhere he went. Hopefully he can continue this trend with Ireland. Looking forward to seeing how many young bucks he'll introduce.
Fair play to mick, did a decent job but in the circumstances, God knows when the play offs will be played. I think it is the right decision

Should have been let finish what he started imo.
Saying that I'm looking forward to Kenny taking over, has some good younglads coming through.

I héard someone making the point that the playoff position was via the nations league so Mick didn't actually get us there

[macdanger2]

Personally I think Kenny will do a very good job

[dec]

Stephen Kenny's teams punched above their weight everywhere he went.

I think thats green tinted glasses. For every successful job he did like Dundalk and Dery there are terrible ones like Shamrock Rovers and Bohs.

I think he is an underdog manager. Can step into a smaller or struggling club and bounce it. But when he has gone into jobs with expectations there have been problems, especially with established players. He is a great manager, but are his skills transferable to international soccer,

I think that is a bit unfair. The Bohs gig was 20 years ago ffs. When he was a 30 year old novice.

The comment about struggling with expectations is a bit wide of the mark too. He won the double with Dundalk in 2014. Then, on the back of the increased expectations that such a success brings, continued to win things flat out right through to a second double four years later in 2018.

His short spell with the U21s was also very good, coming away with a better record than pretty much any of his predecessors. That augurs very well for his shot with the senior team.

I'm excited to see what he can do. His teams usually play an attractive style of football, with will hopefully be something of an antidote to the growing apathy around the national team. And he'll hopefully be in a position to benefit from the emergence of a handful of very promising young players.

They got 2 points out of 12 in the Nations League.

If they got 0 points out of 12 the would still be in the playoffs because every League B team made the playoffs.

[Main Street]

Stephen Kenny's teams punched above their weight everywhere he went.

I think thats green tinted glasses. For every successful job he did like Dundalk and Dery there are terrible ones like Shamrock Rovers and Bohs.

I think he is an underdog manager. Can step into a smaller or struggling club and bounce it. But when he has gone into jobs with expectations there have been problems, especially with established players. He is a great manager, but are his skills transferable to international soccer,

I think that is a bit unfair. The Bohs gig was 20 years ago ffs. When he was a 30 year old novice.

The comment about struggling with expectations is a bit wide of the mark too. He won the double with Dundalk in 2014. Then, on the back of the increased expectations that such a success brings, continued to win things flat out right through to a second double four years later in 2018.

His short spell with the U21s was also very good, coming away with a better record than pretty much any of his predecessors. That augurs very well for his shot with the senior team.

I'm excited to see what he can do. His teams usually play an attractive style of football, with will hopefully be something of an antidote to the growing apathy around the national team. And he'll hopefully be in a position to benefit from the emergence of a handful of very promising young players.

They got 2 points out of 12 in the Nations League.

If they got 0 points out of 12 the would still be in the playoffs because every League B team made the playoffs.

One could say that Mick's contribution did get Ireland to the play off route,  with his failure to qualify the team via the direct route.
Should SK get Ireland through the play offs, Mick is reckoned to pick up a Eur1m  bonus payment for his own failure.

In the table of crooked deals, the FAI are two places ahead of  Ponzi scheme. 

[Baile Brigín 2]

Stephen Kenny's teams punched above their weight everywhere he went.

I think thats green tinted glasses. For every successful job he did like Dundalk and Dery there are terrible ones like Shamrock Rovers and Bohs.

I think he is an underdog manager. Can step into a smaller or struggling club and bounce it. But when he has gone into jobs with expectations there have been problems, especially with established players. He is a great manager, but are his skills transferable to international soccer,

I think that is a bit unfair. The Bohs gig was 20 years ago ffs. When he was a 30 year old novice.

The comment about struggling with expectations is a bit wide of the mark too. He won the double with Dundalk in 2014. Then, on the back of the increased expectations that such a success brings, continued to win things flat out right through to a second double four years later in 2018.

His short spell with the U21s was also very good, coming away with a better record than pretty much any of his predecessors. That augurs very well for his shot with the senior team.

I'm excited to see what he can do. His teams usually play an attractive style of football, with will hopefully be something of an antidote to the growing apathy around the national team. And he'll hopefully be in a position to benefit from the emergence of a handful of very promising young players.

16 years ago. You cant just ignore failures on his cv like that.

The point I am making is he took over a Dundalk team that stayed up via playoff and signed a completely new squad of a certain type of player. He won numerous titles with the exact same type of player. He won't have that luxury in international football as he will have to deal with the type of ayer he struggled with before.

Robbie Keanes sacking his him prempting the wimp reputation and getting a slap in first

[Main Street]

Stephen Kenny's teams punched above their weight everywhere he went.

I think thats green tinted glasses. For every successful job he did like Dundalk and Dery there are terrible ones like Shamrock Rovers and Bohs.

I think he is an underdog manager. Can step into a smaller or struggling club and bounce it. But when he has gone into jobs with expectations there have been problems, especially with established players. He is a great manager, but are his skills transferable to international soccer,

I think that is a bit unfair. The Bohs gig was 20 years ago ffs. When he was a 30 year old novice.

The comment about struggling with expectations is a bit wide of the mark too. He won the double with Dundalk in 2014. Then, on the back of the increased expectations that such a success brings, continued to win things flat out right through to a second double four years later in 2018.

His short spell with the U21s was also very good, coming away with a better record than pretty much any of his predecessors. That augurs very well for his shot with the senior team.

I'm excited to see what he can do. His teams usually play an attractive style of football, with will hopefully be something of an antidote to the growing apathy around the national team. And he'll hopefully be in a position to benefit from the emergence of a handful of very promising young players.

16 years ago. You cant just ignore failures on his cv like that.

The point I am making is he took over a Dundalk team that stayed up via playoff and signed a completely new squad of a certain type of player. He won numerous titles with the exact same type of player. He won't have that luxury in international football as he will have to deal with the type of ayer he struggled with before.

Robbie Keanes sacking his him prempting the wimp reputation and getting a slap in first

That  sinks below your usual low bar of what passes for analysis 
Stephen Kenny at the age of 30 was appointed manager of Bohs in  mid season and reversed a bad slide of form, he won the LOI title in his  2nd season, finished 2nd in his 3rd season and was sacked in his 4th season with Bohs, by any rational rule of thumb, also considering him being a baby in managerial years, he had 3 out 4 very successful seasons with Bohs.
Shamrock Rovers were foolish and arrogant to sack him  as was proven by Kenny's 5 seasons with Dundalk, a side he built from scratch.
Meanwhile Shamrock Rovers slid into a comfort zone of mediocrity, way off the pace season after season,  which did  not reflect well on the SR's board or the type of board who though they knew more about football than Kenny.  And they were a club who had a solid support base and well placed financially.
Stephen Kenny will have plenty of talented players to choose from in a squad of 40 of Ireland's finest footballers to build a decent competitive side.

[Baile Brigín 2]

I don't think Bohs fans remember him as fondly as you make out. Regardless, it ended in farce.

He was a disaster at Rovers. Him being a sucess in his next job doesn't change that. Crying in front of players and fans, being kicked out of his dressing room, refusing to allow the previous seasons trophies in the team picture, firing the medical and S&C staff (Philly Mc iirc) and not replacing them plus some dire signings would indicate the board were well within their rights. Sometimes it just doesn't work, both parties seem to have moved on amicably.

But the point remains. He has had spectacular success by taking on clubs who were on a downward spiral where he could rebuild. He failed at clubs who were on the up, expected to win and had structures in place. He has well publicised issues dealing with established professionals.

I hope I am wrong, but he simply wont have the influence top to bottom like he did at Dundalk and won't have the type of player he is excellent at managing. That said, none of the current squad are indispensable, he has freedom to axe any of them and nobody will complain. Its a very weak squad, so he can promote kids relatively easily and there are a handful of LoI players who could pad out the squad without losing any quality. And thats the real issue. The hype and clamour to include is around Jack Byrne. Under Charlton it was Brady. Under Trapp Hoolahan. Our technically best player that fans and the press want to see is at Shamrock Rovers. He can only piss with the c**k he has.

[Main Street]

He has had spectacular success by taking on clubs who were on a downward spiral where he could rebuild. He failed at clubs who were on the up, expected to win and had structures in place. He has well publicised issues dealing with established professionals.

Sort of like Brian Clough then, built up 3 teams from nothing and in between fail at established Leeds. Fair enough I'll take that for Kenny

Rovers sacking Kenny mid season was a stupid impulsive move from a feeble ignorent board. At least they could have waited out the season. Rovers were a club on a slide, probably due to an inflated sense of their own importance after managing the great achievement of losing every game in the EL group stage.
That Rover's slide continued unabated after Kenny left. As it turned out, it was the best thing for him to exit that toxic environment and let Rovers wallow in a sewer of their own making. Not even another successful manager Pat Fenlon could  do anything of note there. Meanwhile Kenny built a team that pissed on Shamrock Rovers, ( a club who were on the up, expected to win and had structures in place ) for 6 seasons in a row. His team would also have beaten O'Neill's team out of sight in a title race.

It's the very definition of a good manager to not only build a good team from nothing but then keep it going for 6 seasons in a row.  A good manager whose professional reputation alone could entice the established good players from around the league to down tools with the desire to play under him. And to the average player, transforming  those ordinary players into good players.

What's the expectation at international level?  That he can build a team to compete against teams of a similair ilk -  Slovakia  and Bosnia  and hopefully win through to that Euro Finals group.  At a minimum to not get relegated from the NL.
Re WC 2022,  only 13 teams from UEFA qualify,  10 group winners and 3  from 12 play off teams. That makes it a very difficult task to qualify, the odds are stacked against Ireland there.

[Baile Brigín 2]

What 3 clubs did Clough build up from nothing?  Derby, Forest and? He also failed at Brighton and nobody ever thought him to be a credible English manager.

Your version of Kenny and Rovers oddly omits him crying in the showers, signing terrible players and sacking key coaching staff. Its appaling logic to say that because someone went on to success  that previous failures didn't happen. Henry being Arsenals best ever player doesn't negate that he flopped at Juventus. Kenny openly atates he failed at Rovers, figured out why and did the opposite at Dundalk. Your bias is shining.

Is a pointed strength of Kenny that he very rarely took established LoI pros? Finn is the only one I can think of. He took misfiring players like Horgan, Boyle and Hoban and mixed them with lads who failed in England. So no, players didn't down tools to play for him.

As I said, I hope I am wrong, but there are big question marks. Just because you do the predictable GAA v Rovers schtick doesn't mean they don't exist.

[marty34]

What 3 clubs did Clough build up from nothing?  Derby, Forest and? He also failed at Brighton and nobody ever thought him to be a credible English manager.

Your version of Kenny and Rovers oddly omits him crying in the showers, signing terrible players and sacking key coaching staff. Its appaling logic to say that because someone went on to success  that previous failures didn't happen. Henry being Arsenals best ever player doesn't negate that he flopped at Juventus. Kenny openly atates he failed at Rovers, figured out why and did the opposite at Dundalk. Your bias is shining.

Is a pointed strength of Kenny that he very rarely took established LoI pros? Finn is the only one I can think of. He took misfiring players like Horgan, Boyle and Hoban and mixed them with lads who failed in England. So no, players didn't down tools to play for him.

As I said, I hope I am wrong, but there are big question marks. Just because you do the predictable GAA v Rovers schtick doesn't mean they don't exist.

Regardless of manager, we don't have the players - too many journeymen.  That's the reality. 

When things were good, the majority of players were playing in top teams in the Premier League etc. in England.  That talent is not there now.

[Hound]

What 3 clubs did Clough build up from nothing?  Derby, Forest and? He also failed at Brighton and nobody ever thought him to be a credible English manager.

The FA at the time didn't want him, but to say nobody ever thought Clough to be a credible candidate for England manager is pure garbage!  Utter nonsense.

There were literally media campaigns to try and get the FA to appoint him.
They didn't want him because of his no-nonsense combative personality. He was a regular match pundit and publicly criticized the FA countless times.  He would have been a complete pain in their collective arses.

[Baile Brigín 2]

What 3 clubs did Clough build up from nothing?  Derby, Forest and? He also failed at Brighton and nobody ever thought him to be a credible English manager.

Your version of Kenny and Rovers oddly omits him crying in the showers, signing terrible players and sacking key coaching staff. Its appaling logic to say that because someone went on to success  that previous failures didn't happen. Henry being Arsenals best ever player doesn't negate that he flopped at Juventus. Kenny openly atates he failed at Rovers, figured out why and did the opposite at Dundalk. Your bias is shining.

Is a pointed strength of Kenny that he very rarely took established LoI pros? Finn is the only one I can think of. He took misfiring players like Horgan, Boyle and Hoban and mixed them with lads who failed in England. So no, players didn't down tools to play for him.

As I said, I hope I am wrong, but there are big question marks. Just because you do the predictable GAA v Rovers schtick doesn't mean they don't exist.

Regardless of manager, we don't have the players - too many journeymen.  That's the reality. 

When things were good, the majority of players were playing in top teams in the Premier League etc. in England.  That talent is not there now.

Agreed, but there are green shoots coming through underage. None of the current squad are undroppable. He is in a unique situation that he has carte blanche. So if we are mediocre we can at least have a passionate group of up and coming mediocrity

[marty34]

What 3 clubs did Clough build up from nothing?  Derby, Forest and? He also failed at Brighton and nobody ever thought him to be a credible English manager.

Your version of Kenny and Rovers oddly omits him crying in the showers, signing terrible players and sacking key coaching staff. Its appaling logic to say that because someone went on to success  that previous failures didn't happen. Henry being Arsenals best ever player doesn't negate that he flopped at Juventus. Kenny openly atates he failed at Rovers, figured out why and did the opposite at Dundalk. Your bias is shining.

Is a pointed strength of Kenny that he very rarely took established LoI pros? Finn is the only one I can think of. He took misfiring players like Horgan, Boyle and Hoban and mixed them with lads who failed in England. So no, players didn't down tools to play for him.

As I said, I hope I am wrong, but there are big question marks. Just because you do the predictable GAA v Rovers schtick doesn't mean they don't exist.

Regardless of manager, we don't have the players - too many journeymen.  That's the reality. 

When things were good, the majority of players were playing in top teams in the Premier League etc. in England.  That talent is not there now.

Agreed, but there are green shoots coming through underage. None of the current squad are undroppable. He is in a unique situation that he has carte blanche. So if we are mediocre we can at least have a passionate group of up and coming mediocrity

True - go with youth and a few experienced lads.  Could be a while before we grace the world or european stage again - who knows - but after the FAI mess, we need to focus on underage and develop players. 

Spend more money at the bottom than at the top level is the way to go now.

[BennyCake]

Nothing but good words about him both on and off the pitch with derry city. Dundalk had some unbelievable European results with him. Just hope it works out better than Brian Kerr, the last real LoI manager.

Thing is Kerr did ok with what he had.

The 2004 campaign was brutal to be fair. I remember big Gary Doherty saving the day on a few occasions.