The DUP thread seems to have disappeared, or my search skills have gone to sh:te. I was't enamoured of the title but it was a useful place to gather various examples of prejudice.
I would have posted this. Back in the day the DUP were boycotting Bushmills as they were sponsoring the GAA, presumably Antrim.
https://www.irishexaminer.com/news/arid-41034599.html
Quote from: armaghniac on December 31, 2022, 05:22:31 PM
The DUP thread seems to have disappeared, or my search skills have gone to sh:te. I was't enamoured of the title but it was a useful place to gather various examples of prejudice.
I would have posted this. Back in the day the DUP were boycotting Bushmills as they were sponsoring the GAA, presumably Antrim.
https://www.irishexaminer.com/news/arid-41034599.html
In a United Ireland a DUP thread would be oppressed by the republican hordes.
Maybe not a bad thing.
Quote from: Windmill abu on December 31, 2022, 07:45:55 PM
Quote from: armaghniac on December 31, 2022, 05:22:31 PM
The DUP thread seems to have disappeared, or my search skills have gone to sh:te. I was't enamoured of the title but it was a useful place to gather various examples of prejudice.
I would have posted this. Back in the day the DUP were boycotting Bushmills as they were sponsoring the GAA, presumably Antrim.
https://www.irishexaminer.com/news/arid-41034599.html
In a United Ireland a DUP thread would be oppressed by the republican hordes.
Maybe not a bad thing.
IRA/GAA supporters delete thread containing many references to
bigotry stauch DUP defence of the union.
Quote from: Windmill abu on December 31, 2022, 07:45:55 PM
Quote from: armaghniac on December 31, 2022, 05:22:31 PM
The DUP thread seems to have disappeared, or my search skills have gone to sh:te. I was't enamoured of the title but it was a useful place to gather various examples of prejudice.
I would have posted this. Back in the day the DUP were boycotting Bushmills as they were sponsoring the GAA, presumably Antrim.
https://www.irishexaminer.com/news/arid-41034599.html
In a United Ireland a DUP thread would be oppressed by the republican hordes.
Maybe not a bad thing.
I would hope that loyalists will finally realise it's better to be a big fish in a small pond, than a tiny fish in an ocean. They can embrace their culture and celebrate it peacefully and in a truely shared manner. I cannot manage any suppression except those that want to terrorise.
They would hardly be a big fish though. If the place went to 32 counties I'd expect their racketeering to be clamped down on unlike it is now. Though maybe a blind eye would be turned a wee bit to keep the place peaceful but I couldn't see them get away with what they do now.
The racketeering only benefits a few, it is curse to most people in loyalist areas.
Quote from: armaghniac on January 01, 2023, 07:33:32 PM
The racketeering only benefits a few, it is curse to most people in loyalist areas.
The DUP only benefits a few, it is a curse to most people in loyalist areas.
By most metrics , loyalists are very poorly served by their public representatives.
https://www.irishexaminer.com/news/arid-41051942.html
Does anyone in the 6 Cos care anymore?
Quote from: Rossfan on January 19, 2023, 10:23:38 AM
https://www.irishexaminer.com/news/arid-41051942.html
Does anyone in the 6 Cos care anymore?
No, I don't ... but I would like to see at least a move to Joint Authority as a further step along the road that is only going in one direction.
Has joint authority ever been implemented anywhere? How can you not have a single authority?
I mean, how would it even work? I don't know why people keep bringing this up as if it were a possibility. It's never been proposed by any British or Irish governments in recent times that I'm aware of.
Quote from: Rossfan on January 19, 2023, 10:23:38 AM
https://www.irishexaminer.com/news/arid-41051942.html
Does anyone in the 6 Cos care anymore?
That is a good question. There is so much apathy now. DUP have their head in the sand. Sinn Fein couldn't run a bath. The others won't get a look in because we're all too busy keeping the other lot out. Place is a shambles. I used to follow local politics on the tv & radio - I switch it over now.
Thought the Orange Order and DUP didn't support terrorism ::)
https://m.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/sunday-life/news/dup-councillor-attends-controversial-parade-honouring-slain-uda-member-42304829.html
The DUP thread must have gone missing on the DUP/reality interface.
Proper joint authority would be an absolute mess. Think I would prefer direct rule from Westminster with Some influence from Dublin. If joint authority was a goer it should have been brought in post GFA. All it would do now is permanently block a UI
I have seen it all now ArleneFoster talking about making progress in Northern Ireland with a 'Never Never Never' blouse on.
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FnEpq1XWIAAz4Gr?format=jpg&name=small)
She never grew up, like a great majority of here supporters, living in the past, and if this province is a basket case no problem as long as its a UK one.
Carla Lockhart spreading more lies online about your woman arrested for praying. Failed to mention that she was actually arrested for constantly breaking an exclusion zone outside an abortion clinic due to groups of religious people intimidating women who had chosen to go for an abortion. Good to see they are more worried about issues in Birmingham than in their own country and constituency
Did wee Jeff vote for or against the right to strike? lol
What happened the DUP?
https://www.irishtimes.com/opinion/2023/01/26/positive-movement-on-protocol-a-tough-sell-to-unionists-who-know-desperate-dup-spin-is-coming/
There should be political generosity from Brussels on a protocol deal, but unionism will have to compromise, Bertie Ahern told Westminster's Northern Ireland Affairs Committee on Monday. The former taoiseach said he does not believe the DUP's "seven tests" for a deal can be met.
The greater the gap between political unionism in Northern Ireland and the broader policy interests of UK governments, then the greater the difficulty for unionists in making the case for equality of treatment as UK citizens. Unionism must not allow itself to become the existential threat to its own existence.
A premeditated and long flagged-up knee-jerk response to the protocol deal brings enormous dangers, while a rollover by the DUP would tear unionism and loyalism apart in a way not seen before
I'll get the popcorn in.
Alex Kane has written a pretty good article here.
https://twitter.com/AlexKane221b/status/1620139674844143616?cxt=HHwWgIDR2emc8vssAAAA
Wee Jeff sure is in a pickle. There is sure to be an EU UK agreement soon as regards the protocol. Jeffrey will have to give some sort of response, i assume based on his 7 tests. There is no way any deal can pass those 7 tests, so Jeffrey is going to have to compromise and lundify himself if a deal is to be done.
He's also got to work under a Sinn Fein first minister in any return to Stormount. I was about to say " Im not sure which would be the more bitter pill to swallow ' but serving under MON would hurt worse i'd say.
https://www.irishtimes.com/opinion/2023/01/28/unionism-has-painted-itself-into-a-corner-and-no-longer-has-friends-in-high-places-to-bail-it-out/The biggest threat to unionism is unionism itself
Anti-protocol unionism doesn't seem to have a thought-through alternative if its bluff is called
Alex Kane
Sat Jan 28 2023
It seems much more likely than not that within the next few weeks unionism – and the DUP in particular – will be required to give a response to a protocol deal agreed by the EU and UK. Their response will depend on whether or not the deal goes far enough in persuading them that there is no longer an "existential threat" to the union and to Northern Ireland's position within the UK.
But what is an existential threat to the union? Or, putting it another way, if the protocol remains, even in a watered-down form (which strikes me as the most likely outcome of the EU-UK deal) does it necessarily follow that the constitutional link between Britain and Northern Ireland will be sundered? Surely that could only happen if, in the event of a Border poll, a majority of voters in the North voted to end the constitutional status quo in favour of a united Ireland.
The protocol pushes Northern Ireland into the constitutional equivalent of a granny flat. Not entirely in the EU. Not entirely in the UK. But not in a united Ireland, either. So maybe not an existential threat to the union, either?
Even with the protocol, Northern Ireland would remain within the UK. Sovereign power would remain with the UK parliament. MPs from Northern Ireland would still be returned there. In the event of the Assembly collapsing, it would be the UK parliament, via the Northern Ireland Office, that would govern. There would be input from the Irish Government and a continuing recognition of the "Irish dimension" (as has been the case since October 1972), but it would still be the United Kingdom of Britain and Northern Ireland.
Yet treating Northern Ireland entirely differently from the rest of the UK, which is what the existing protocol does, and the renegotiated version is likely to do, too, does weaken unionism's hand in Northern Ireland. While it has always been true that Northern Ireland has been "a place apart" since 1921 (when it became the only part of the UK with a devolved government and a parliament entitled to make "locals-only" legislation), it has been a place apart within the UK. The protocol adds to that sense of apartness by placing it within EU parameters as well.
[ Positive movement on protocol a tough sell to unionists who know desperate DUP spin is coming ]
Those who made the case that a new and hard land border in Ireland would change the political and constitutional dynamic with potentially destabilising consequences for the Belfast Agreement were right. Yet they seem blind and deaf to the argument that the Northern Ireland protocol would have a similar impact from a unionist perspective. The polling and electoral evidence does suggest that the overwhelming majority of those who vote for unionist parties have concerns now about the threat to their status and identity.
So what happens if the pending deal doesn't rip up the protocol? What does unionism do then? There is a section of unionism and loyalism that would insist on the end of powersharing.
The mantra "it's the protocol or powersharing ... you can't have both" has become part of their campaigning currency lately. But it is the same section of unionism and loyalism that has resolutely opposed the Belfast Agreement since 1998. It is content to use the protocol as a way of bringing down the institutions established in 1988. Even the most benign deal will be dismissed by this lobby: a lobby that has huge influence across unionism right now.
But collapsing the Assembly brings considerable consequences: no significant unionist political or legislative presence at a local level; the UK-EU deal implemented anyway; a form of direct rule that will include input from the Irish Government; and what would be interpreted as a very clear signal that political unionism no longer prioritises devolution.
More importantly, it would create an enormous gap between unionism and the political centre at Westminster. All of this could also be construed to be an existential threat to the union and local unionism.
The other problem – which also contains existential elements – is that anti-protocol unionism doesn't seem to have a thought-through alternative if its bluff is called on the protocol.
It didn't have that thought-through alternative when Faulkner's cabinet resigned in March 1972; or when the UUUC (United Ulster Unionist Council) strike collapsed the assembly in May 1974; or when the constitutional convention imploded in 1975; or when the anti-Anglo Irish Agreement protests fizzled out in 1986; or when the UK and Irish governments agreed the 1993 Downing Street Declaration (complete with the "no selfish strategic or economic interest" in Northern Ireland doctrine); or when prime ministers Theresa May, Boris Johnson, Liz Truss and now Rishi Sunak let it down. Let's face it, unionism doesn't appear to do thought-through strategies, preferring instead to turn in on itself and then nurture break-away factions.
There is an argument that the protocol in and of itself does not represent an existential threat. Ironically, though, it could be the unionist response that becomes the greatest long-term threat. The greater the gap between political unionism in Northern Ireland and the broader policy interests of UK governments, then the greater the difficulty for unionists in making the case for equality of treatment as UK citizens. Unionism must not allow itself to become the existential threat to its own existence.
A premeditated and long flagged-up knee-jerk response to the protocol deal brings enormous dangers, while a rollover by the DUP would tear unionism and loyalism apart in a way not seen before. A deal that embraces the protocol in some form would be a signal that the UK government was prepared to face down unionism. The next few months will be critical for unionism. It has not been in this position for more than a century. The difference this time is that it is not the electoral majority and nor does it have reliable friends on the government or opposition benches.
https://m.facebook.com/story.php?story_fbid=pfbid0sGtsLimZQyvUYzRX1ooYbRnLQiezXHtCtGCpLbXTy3vdNjKRpShGHPSuMxV23Ua2l&id=526712010807134
The lack of self awareness is unreal. Man is wearing a poppy ffs 🤣
Shooting themselves in the foot there as plenty of their own attend plenty of commemorations - more recently or maybe just more public recently. Idiots.
Be a few orange marches have to be banned.
Quote from: imtommygunn on February 02, 2023, 01:12:13 PM
Shooting themselves in the foot there as plenty of their own attend plenty of commemorations - more recently or maybe just more public recently. Idiots.
Be a few orange marches have to be banned.
and all their uvf flegs
Quote from: imtommygunn on February 02, 2023, 01:12:13 PM
Shooting themselves in the foot there as plenty of their own attend plenty of commemorations - more recently or maybe just more public recently. Idiots.
Be a few orange marches have to be banned.
Ah, but that's different. How you may ask, but in their wee minds it just is.
https://www.irishexaminer.com/news/arid-41066591.html
The UK Supreme Court has ruled that the wee Protocol is legal.
The Tories don't care about the DUP.
Quote from: seafoid on February 08, 2023, 11:00:38 AM
The UK Supreme Court has ruled that the wee Protocol is legal.
The Tories don't care about the DUP.
Serial losers. The DUP couldn't pick last week's winning lotto numbers.
So where do they go from here.
Quote from: seafoid on February 08, 2023, 11:15:52 AM
Quote from: Armagh18 on February 08, 2023, 11:11:04 AM
So where do they go from here.
Drumcree ?
Nothing has actually changed though so they'll continue to say no, hold the place to ransom and order a new election and get the no brigade out in force!
This will not matter one jot to their argument.
Basic fact is they wont share power, every excuse has been dismantled and they just keep adding more and more demands as their arguments fall. It's end of days stuff and the only way to check where they stand is to have an election.
We will only see then how their support is holding up. Sad thing is we probably have a fair idea how that will play out and even post election we are back to the same place.
Now they have a new issue with the ECHR is it? I saw Brolly on about it on twitter. They'll find a new bogeyman. Blatantly no desire to go back to stormont.
Yeah if only they would get crushed by the electorate but unfortunately that is a highly unlikely scenario :(
https://www.itv.com/news/utv/2023-02-08/former-councillor-banned-over-britain-first-stunt-fake-fine
are they threatening violence yet
isnt their beloved king the head of the supreme court.
Quote from: Rossfan on February 08, 2023, 07:42:27 PM
https://www.itv.com/news/utv/2023-02-08/former-councillor-banned-over-britain-first-stunt-fake-fine
That's hilarious tbh. She had Britain first over at flag protests regularly until they realised what she was. They deserve each other. She's a nasty piece of work her - still at it though with the drag acts reading kid's stories etc. Creating a bit of a story there too.
Tbh doesn't matter your views on any of this - she is just a shit stirrer with nothing useful to add to society.
northern ireland politics is cure for insomnia just bunch of the same faces boring people every day yawnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnn is what they are,
(https://i.ibb.co/x3k0dXV/IMG-20230209-WA0006.jpg)
Kicking the can down the road for another year I see https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-64574751
What an absolute shower.....
Its a fact now that power sharing is finished here in the north.
This latest chapter proves beyond doubt that Unionists will not and never will be seen to take orders from nationalists in there own wee state.
I know people will say its only the DUP, but if the UUP were in power the very same thing would be happening.
I don't know where we go from here but one thing is for sure the longer there is a stalemate the more time for there is for certain mouthpieces have to stir tensions up.
Quote from: Hereiam on February 09, 2023, 12:29:37 PM
Its a fact now that power sharing is finished here in the north.
This latest chapter proves beyond doubt that Unionists will not and never will be seen to take orders from nationalists in there own wee state.
I know people will say its only the DUP, but if the UUP were in power the very same thing would be happening.
I don't know where we go from here but one thing is for sure the longer there is a stalemate the more time for there is for certain mouthpieces have to stir tensions up.
I'd go even further in saying they still wouldn't share power with an SDLP first minister, let alone SF...
Completely agree with everything said.
They are talking about all kinds of cuts to services now. The very first thing that should be cut is MLA salaries in their entirety. There should be no debate around it or hesitancy in doing it. How can the regular Joe on the street be expected to stomach cuts to health etc while MLAs continue to receive a salary? It has gone far, far beyond a joke at this stage.
Quote from: 93-DY-SAM on February 09, 2023, 01:35:04 PM
They are talking about all kinds of cuts to services now. The very first thing that should be cut is MLA salaries in their entirety. There should be no debate around it or hesitancy in doing it. How can the regular Joe on the street be expected to stomach cuts to health etc while MLAs continue to receive a salary? It has gone far, far beyond a joke at this stage.
They use the excuse of having to be able to attract talent to the roles, the talent isn't there and there isn't a hope of stormont getting ip and running so why keep throwing good money at it
Quote from: 93-DY-SAM on February 09, 2023, 01:35:04 PM
They are talking about all kinds of cuts to services now. The very first thing that should be cut is MLA salaries in their entirety. There should be no debate around it or hesitancy in doing it. How can the regular Joe on the street be expected to stomach cuts to health etc while MLAs continue to receive a salary? It has gone far, far beyond a joke at this stage.
The DUP put the n in cuts
tories are a joke too for cutting wages 100 percent should give them a deadline to next month or its over.
Quote from: Eire90 on February 09, 2023, 04:36:17 PM
tories are a joke too for not cutting wages 100 percent should give them a deadline to next month or its over.
think ill ignore ni politics now its so boring i felt tired reading brysons tweets yesterday and now tired again
Quote from: Eire90 on February 09, 2023, 04:37:34 PM
think ill ignore ni politics now its so boring i felt tired reading brysons tweets yesterday and now tired again
How about ignoring GAABoard?
what are these morons like
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-64625483
The dup just posh loyalists paramilitary spokespeople in suits (posh in northern ireland terms tories probably still see them as peasants)
Dishy Rishy flew into the Black North last night with the expectation of talking to the leaders of the various political parties (except Mary Lou) and other organisations and "stake holders"...
Looks like he's greasing up the DUP for the NIP Protocol agreement with the EU.
Nothing will be enough for them and Angry Jim.
Speculation is Monday it'll be announced. I noticed from twitter Beattie wasn't invited. I do wonder were Eastwood or Long either.
I wonder does it mean their 7 red lines though they've even added another one since. I highly doubt it.
I could see them spin it but really can't see Stormont coming back.
Mary lou just walked into the culloden 5mins ago JC
But as you say, nothing will be good enough for Jim and Jeff. Hard to know what is going to happen. Think the power-sharing agreement was necessary to get NI moving forward, but it may have run its course
Eastwood, Long and Beattie were there this morning too
It looks like the end of the road for the DUP's strategy
The strategy is to say no to everything. They'll still get plenty of votes.
Quote from: imtommygunn on February 17, 2023, 10:05:02 AM
The strategy is to say no to everything. They'll still get plenty of votes.
Yup, council elections in May, NO,NO,NO!
General Election next year, NO, NO, NO!
Perhaps after that they may start to behave like adults but highly unlikely
Quote from: imtommygunn on February 17, 2023, 10:05:02 AM
The strategy is to say no to everything. They'll still get plenty of votes.
They are going to get bitchslappped by a combo of the UK Government and the EU.
Their strategy is in bits.
I don't think they can smile their way out of this.
Quote from: keep her low this half on February 17, 2023, 10:37:48 AM
Quote from: imtommygunn on February 17, 2023, 10:05:02 AM
The strategy is to say no to everything. They'll still get plenty of votes.
Yup, council elections in May, NO,NO,NO!
General Election next year, NO, NO, NO!
Perhaps after that they may start to behave like adults but highly unlikely
When the negotiations started originally with the EU they were being lauded as great negotiators. Then the penny dropped that they just said no to everything and no more was ever said about their great negotiation strategy.
SF they always come up smelling of roses. Unfortunately that's how it works. All the neanderthal bigots will get their place in the house of lords and rake the money in.
You can guarantee wee Jeff has his seat in the lords secured now and an ample donation to the DUP coffers has been arranged, They don't give one fcuk about the ordinary man & women, its always about themselves.
They are just tories really. (who are more or less UKIP these days). All the same. Not one shite could they give - spew up some hate to get votes then shit on the people who vote for them.
Quote from: Hereiam on February 17, 2023, 10:51:44 AM
You can guarantee wee Jeff has his seat in the lords secured now and an ample donation to the DUP coffers has been arranged, They don't give one fcuk about the ordinary man & women, its always about themselves.
He's resigned to the fact that the NIP is here to stay. There's a softening in his language, but no doubt he'll speak to the LLC/Orange Order and come back with a harder stance....
If he doesn't except it strip him off his knighthood, the slimey shit will force it through
You are assuming he has a choice. Highly unlikely.
Unionism is just one big No.
what will the loyalists do block roads they probably moaned about climate protestors blocking roads
I see Daithi's law is being put through Westminster. Good to see.
Quote from: Armagh18 on February 20, 2023, 10:39:30 AM
I see Daithi's law is being put through Westminster. Good to see.
It is good to see and I wonder if a backroom deal has been done.
Scenario 1. Westminster agrees to Daithis law, taking heat off the DUP, the DUP announce that the new Protocol deal meets their seven tests and everyone back to Stormont ( very very unlikely)
Scenario 2. Westminster does a deal with Brussels, DUP object, no Stormont, direct rule from Westminster for the next two years minimum. This was Westminster addressing devolved matters which they said last week they would not do. First of many?
Between the DUP, the ERG and
Between the DUP, the ERG and Bryson only one thing is sure. Nobody gives a f**k about ordinary Loyalist gobshites.
https://mobile.twitter.com/JamieBrysonCPNI/status/1626662477239910400
Unionism/Loyalism stands united.
@J_Donaldson_MP
has remained resolute & kept his word to the unionist community. I am absolutely convinced he will continue to do so. But it's important unionism collectively provides support & encouragement. #StandFirm
NI will burn: UVF's chilling warning over new NI Protocol 'betrayal'
Senior UVF figures have warned loyalists will "wreck the place" and "the streets will be in flames" if any Brexit deal between the UK and EU does not scrap the Irish Sea border.
Quote from: Eire90 on February 25, 2023, 11:43:09 PM
NI will burn: UVF's chilling warning over new NI Protocol 'betrayal'
Senior UVF figures have warned loyalists will "wreck the place" and "the streets will be in flames" if any Brexit deal between the UK and EU does not scrap the Irish Sea border.
Meh. Are they gonna block the roads with bins again? We'll just find another way home from work like we did in 2012.
Quote from: RedHand88 on February 25, 2023, 11:45:31 PM
Quote from: Eire90 on February 25, 2023, 11:43:09 PM
NI will burn: UVF's chilling warning over new NI Protocol 'betrayal'
Senior UVF figures have warned loyalists will "wreck the place" and "the streets will be in flames" if any Brexit deal between the UK and EU does not scrap the Irish Sea border.
Meh. Are they gonna block the roads with bins again? We'll just find another way home from work like we did in 2012.
Is this another Belfast live exclusive? From a top source?
Shit like this always makes me wonder what exactly it is that they are "loyal" to. Clearly not the rule of law as set down by Westminster, so, what, exactly?
Quote from: Jell 0 Biafra on February 26, 2023, 12:53:33 AM
Shit like this always makes me wonder what exactly it is that they are "loyal" to. Clearly not the rule of law as set down by Westminster, so, what, exactly?
Their fleg, marching and hating taigs.
And for a lot of them, selling drugs.
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on February 25, 2023, 11:53:34 PM
Quote from: RedHand88 on February 25, 2023, 11:45:31 PM
Quote from: Eire90 on February 25, 2023, 11:43:09 PM
NI will burn: UVF's chilling warning over new NI Protocol 'betrayal'
Senior UVF figures have warned loyalists will "wreck the place" and "the streets will be in flames" if any Brexit deal between the UK and EU does not scrap the Irish Sea border.
Meh. Are they gonna block the roads with bins again? We'll just find another way home from work like we did in 2012.
Is this another Belfast live exclusive? From a top source?
belfast telegraph
https://m.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/sunday-life/news/ni-will-burn-uvfs-chilling-warning-over-new-ni-protocol-betrayal/1714828166.html
Sunak has now given the DUP a hospital pass
Dup will probably reject it.
wowwwwwwww dup excepted to accept it reported in irish news i still wouldn't whole my breath.
wait until they meet the lcc though
Quote from: imtommygunn on February 27, 2023, 01:21:04 PM
wait until they meet the lcc though
I would think if the DUP are happy the LCC will be happy
Donaldson painted himself into a corner from day one and now has no way out. Tactically give himself no room for manoeuvre. If he tentatively backs the deal then he will lose out to Allister electorally. If he doesn't back the deal and refuses to return to Stormont then it will proceed anyway and the outcome of that will be far worse for Unionism as Westminster will make decisions under a soon to be Labour government.
It's hard to believe how incompetent Donaldson is. I thought he was half intelligent but he has even made Arlene Foster look good and that is saying something.
Quote from: Saffrongael on February 27, 2023, 01:32:41 PM
Quote from: imtommygunn on February 27, 2023, 01:21:04 PM
wait until they meet the lcc though
I would think if the DUP are happy the LCC will be happy
You've a short memory! Remember 2018? The DUP and SF's negotiators came to an agreement on re-establishing the assembly/Irish language legislation only for the DUP to walk away and deny any agreement was ever reached (SF later published the agreement's text) after they took it away to consult with the Orange Order and representatives of loyalist paramilitaries.
No Stormont. No pay for lots of MLA's DUP or otherwise and some are hardly going to pick up similar salaries in the private sector..
What now?
Quote from: johnnycool on February 27, 2023, 02:38:02 PM
No Stormont. No pay for lots of MLA's DUP or otherwise and some are hardly going to pick up similar salaries in the private sector..
What now?
the dole?
Arlene not happy. That's a good sign ;D
I don't know where unionism go from here.
Quote from: imtommygunn on February 27, 2023, 02:44:53 PM
Arlene not happy. That's a good sign ;D
I don't know where unionism go from here.
Hard unionism has already created another couple of bogeymen in King Charles and the Irish News and the day isn't yet over! The lack of self awareness that Arlene Foster displays is bizarre. She's got her big titles but was the main instigator in leading Unionism down this path yet instead of staying in the background she has continued to put herself at the front and centre of any political debate. Definitely more loyal to the half crown than the crown that one, together with the other Westminster MP cronies.
She's an idiot.
Quote from: yellowcard on February 27, 2023, 02:52:35 PM
Quote from: imtommygunn on February 27, 2023, 02:44:53 PM
Arlene not happy. That's a good sign ;D
I don't know where unionism go from here.
Hard unionism has already created another couple of bogeymen in King Charles and the Irish News and the day isn't yet over! The lack of self awareness that Arlene Foster displays is bizarre. She's got her big titles but was the main instigator in leading Unionism down this path yet instead of staying in the background she has continued to put herself at the front and centre of any political debate. Definitely more loyal to the half crown than the crown that one, together with the other Westminster MP cronies.
To my eternal shame I first read that as something else :-[
Quote from: Shamrock Shore on February 27, 2023, 03:06:02 PM
Quote from: yellowcard on February 27, 2023, 02:52:35 PM
Quote from: imtommygunn on February 27, 2023, 02:44:53 PM
Arlene not happy. That's a good sign ;D
I don't know where unionism go from here.
Hard unionism has already created another couple of bogeymen in King Charles and the Irish News and the day isn't yet over! The lack of self awareness that Arlene Foster displays is bizarre. She's got her big titles but was the main instigator in leading Unionism down this path yet instead of staying in the background she has continued to put herself at the front and centre of any political debate. Definitely more loyal to the half crown than the crown that one, together with the other Westminster MP cronies.
To my eternal shame I first read that as something else :-[
As did I - was going to say I never noticed them before :-[
Quote from: Shamrock Shore on February 27, 2023, 03:06:02 PM
Quote from: yellowcard on February 27, 2023, 02:52:35 PM
Quote from: imtommygunn on February 27, 2023, 02:44:53 PM
Arlene not happy. That's a good sign ;D
I don't know where unionism go from here.
Hard unionism has already created another couple of bogeymen in King Charles and the Irish News and the day isn't yet over! The lack of self awareness that Arlene Foster displays is bizarre. She's got her big titles but was the main instigator in leading Unionism down this path yet instead of staying in the background she has continued to put herself at the front and centre of any political debate. Definitely more loyal to the half crown than the crown that one, together with the other Westminster MP cronies.
To my eternal shame I first read that as something else :-[
🤣🤣
Jesus :o
They are going to call this new Protocol the Windsor agreement or something like that. How could any unionist oppose that?
Sunak by announcing this must think it meets the DUPs tests and that it's the best he can do. Interesting few hours and days ahead to see if the DUP do accept it and if they will return to Stormont. If the answers to those questions is No, I honestly don't know where we go from here.
She's a real Brexit muppet, same as most of the ERG heads. They were chosen because they wouldn't object to anything.
She's the intellectual equivalent of Mark Francois.
This brake will lead to a shit show, unionist veto.
It's a huge opportunity for Jim Allister to make his party the voice of Unionism. Donaldson has looked like a lame duck leader from day one and this fork in the road was coming. From a tactical perspective Allister has played him like a kipper. Its a given that Allister will reject the deal and subsequently LCC/OO/loyalist alliance so then its over to Jeffrey whose head must be spinning at the minute. I can't see him backing it and if he does he's probably toast.
Quote from: yellowcard on February 27, 2023, 04:05:24 PM
It's a huge opportunity for Jim Allister to make his party the voice of Unionism. Donaldson has looked like a lame duck leader from day one and this fork in the road was coming. From a tactical perspective Allister has played him like a kipper. Its a given that Allister will reject the deal and subsequently LCC/OO/loyalist alliance so then its over to Jeffrey whose head must be spinning at the minute. I can't see him backing it and if he does he's probably toast.
But if he does it is another opportunity for the non-unionist parties. If they split they hardline vote between DUP and TUV again they will do nothing but gut themselves, weakening their position further.
Quote from: Applesisapples on February 27, 2023, 03:58:39 PM
This brake will lead to a shit show, unionist veto.
It's not, the POC has to be "applied" with London/Westminster & then has to be externally assessed if the POC numbers are met
Quote from: NAG1 on February 27, 2023, 04:08:38 PM
Quote from: yellowcard on February 27, 2023, 04:05:24 PM
It's a huge opportunity for Jim Allister to make his party the voice of Unionism. Donaldson has looked like a lame duck leader from day one and this fork in the road was coming. From a tactical perspective Allister has played him like a kipper. Its a given that Allister will reject the deal and subsequently LCC/OO/loyalist alliance so then its over to Jeffrey whose head must be spinning at the minute. I can't see him backing it and if he does he's probably toast.
But if he does it is another opportunity for the non-unionist parties. If they split they hardline vote between DUP and TUV again they will do nothing but gut themselves, weakening their position further.
It could well do. At the minute TUV is effectively a one man band but if Donaldson can't keep his party together then Allister will profit most and will make capital off the back of that. Whatever you think about Allister (and he is horrific) he is more of a leader and strategist than Jeffrey Donaldson will ever be.
Quote from: Saffrongael on February 27, 2023, 04:08:58 PM
Quote from: Applesisapples on February 27, 2023, 03:58:39 PM
This brake will lead to a shit show, unionist veto.
It's not, the POC has to be "applied" with London/Westminster & then has to be externally assessed if the POC numbers are met
The POC has been invoked more by the DUP than any other party and Allister and enough UUP will pitch in.
Probably a stupid question.....is it possible for Uk Government and Irish Government together to change items of the GFA? Namely the ability for a single party to pull the institutions down.
If the DUP don't accept this deal, by their own admission they will not return to government so we are at a permanent stalemate.
In that scenario, the only parties remaining are UK and Irish governement so I'm just wondering if there is anything they can do to enable the Assembly to return with the DUP.
Quote from: Applesisapples on February 27, 2023, 04:15:58 PM
Quote from: Saffrongael on February 27, 2023, 04:08:58 PM
Quote from: Applesisapples on February 27, 2023, 03:58:39 PM
This brake will lead to a shit show, unionist veto.
It's not, the POC has to be "applied" with London/Westminster & then has to be externally assessed if the POC numbers are met
The POC has been invoked more by the DUP than any other party and Allister and enough UUP will pitch in.
You need to read my post again, it can't happen with just Stormont parties alone applying it. London has to agree & we will also soon have a Labour government
Quote from: tbrick18 on February 27, 2023, 04:17:15 PM
Probably a stupid question.....is it possible for Uk Government and Irish Government together to change items of the GFA? Namely the ability for a single party to pull the institutions down.
If the DUP don't accept this deal, by their own admission they will not return to government so we are at a permanent stalemate.
In that scenario, the only parties remaining are UK and Irish governement so I'm just wondering if there is anything they can do to enable the Assembly to return with the DUP.
You'd imagine it's something that would be possible but would the 2 governments want to start tinkering with the GFA? Might been seen by some as an excuse to threaten more violence. Ideally stormont would be up and running tomorrow without the dinosaurs.
Quote from: Saffrongael on February 27, 2023, 04:19:28 PM
Quote from: Applesisapples on February 27, 2023, 04:15:58 PM
Quote from: Saffrongael on February 27, 2023, 04:08:58 PM
Quote from: Applesisapples on February 27, 2023, 03:58:39 PM
This brake will lead to a shit show, unionist veto.
It's not, the POC has to be "applied" with London/Westminster & then has to be externally assessed if the POC numbers are met
The POC has been invoked more by the DUP than any other party and Allister and enough UUP will pitch in.
You need to read my post again, it can't happen with just Stormont parties alone applying it. London has to agree & we will also soon have a Labour government
The UK government is to be bound to take notice of this brake and the DUP will push for it to be given a legislative basis. I am basing my opinion on what has been said by the UK/EU and not on your statement. It will lead to more instability and be used for mischief.
Quote from: Saffrongael on February 27, 2023, 04:19:28 PM
Quote from: Applesisapples on February 27, 2023, 04:15:58 PM
Quote from: Saffrongael on February 27, 2023, 04:08:58 PM
Quote from: Applesisapples on February 27, 2023, 03:58:39 PM
This brake will lead to a shit show, unionist veto.
It's not, the POC has to be "applied" with London/Westminster & then has to be externally assessed if the POC numbers are met
The POC has been invoked more by the DUP than any other party and Allister and enough UUP will pitch in.
You need to read my post again, it can't happen with just Stormont parties alone applying it. London has to agree & we will also soon have a Labour government
Maybe not. Only 3 Labour leaders have won an election since 1945. They all had over 60 seats in Scotland. Now Labour has 2. They all had a lot of left wing votes. Starmer has purged the left. And they all had loads of female votes. A lot of women are pissed off about Labour's position on trans.
I would be surprised if Labour would win England given all of that.
Quote from: seafoid on February 27, 2023, 05:29:00 PM
Quote from: Saffrongael on February 27, 2023, 04:19:28 PM
Quote from: Applesisapples on February 27, 2023, 04:15:58 PM
Quote from: Saffrongael on February 27, 2023, 04:08:58 PM
Quote from: Applesisapples on February 27, 2023, 03:58:39 PM
This brake will lead to a shit show, unionist veto.
It's not, the POC has to be "applied" with London/Westminster & then has to be externally assessed if the POC numbers are met
The POC has been invoked more by the DUP than any other party and Allister and enough UUP will pitch in.
You need to read my post again, it can't happen with just Stormont parties alone applying it. London has to agree & we will also soon have a Labour government
Maybe not. Only 3 Labour leaders have won an election since 1945. They all had over 60 seats in Scotland. Now Labour has 2. They all had a lot of left wing votes. Starmer has purged the left. And they all had loads of female votes. A lot of women are pissed off about Labour's position on trans.
I would be surprised if Labour would win England given all of that.
How have Labour pissed off women with the trans issue? Curious because if anything they've pissed off trans activists and don't see how you can say that women are annoyed with them? It's the Looney left and commys that are annoyed with Labour... Sturgeon is gone so SNP are on the wobble and Labour been working hard in Scotland could see them doing well there
It looks like a lot of work went into the deal
https://www.irishtimes.com/politics/2023/02/27/northern-ireland-protocol-deal-eu-uk-brexit/
Sunak says there will be a parliamentary vote on the new Windsor framework 'and it will be respected'
The deal, which will be subject to a vote in Westminster at the "appropriate time", includes green and red lanes for imports into the North. It returns to Westminster the power to set all VAT rates.
It contains safeguards to ensure that all supermarket goods and medicines available in Britain will automatically be available in the North.
Leading Irish American congressman Brendan Boyle, who is also co-chair of the congressional EU caucus, strongly backed the new Northern Ireland protocol deal.
.
The Northern Ireland Business Brexit Working Group, an umbrella group representing 14 industry bodies, said it commended the "considerable efforts made by the EU and the UK government to find joint solutions on the Northern Ireland protocol.
Sunak hails 'decisive breakthrough' on post-Brexit rules for Northern Ireland
UK prime minister Rishi Sunak has said his "decisive breakthrough" on post-Brexit rules for Northern Ireland will remove trade barriers in the Irish Sea as he seeks the backing of unionists and Tory Eurosceptics.
/Mr Sunak said the agreement "safeguards sovereignty" for Northern Ireland.
He said the deal introduces a new Stormont brake, allowing the assembly not only to have a say over EU laws but also to block them from applying in Northern Ireland.
Chairman of the European Research Group of hardline Conservative MPs Mark Francois told Sky News that they wanted "a situation where EU law is expunged from Northern Ireland so it is treated on the same basis as England, Scotland and Wales."
"We're not stupid," he told the broadcaster.
Ms Long added: "All of us would like to see the relationship with the EU in a better place, I think the UK as a whole needs that, but I think it would also be good for north/south and east/west relationships because they've been damaged by Brexit."
________________________________________
Quote from: yellowcard on February 27, 2023, 02:52:35 PM
Quote from: imtommygunn on February 27, 2023, 02:44:53 PM
Arlene not happy. That's a good sign ;D
I don't know where unionism go from here.
Hard unionism has already created another couple of bogeymen in King Charles and the Irish News and the day isn't yet over! The lack of self awareness that Arlene Foster displays is bizarre. She's got her big titles but was the main instigator in leading Unionism down this path yet instead of staying in the background she has continued to put herself at the front and centre of any political debate. Definitely more loyal to the half crown than the crown that one, together with the other Westminster MP cronies.
I actually thought that said "she's got her big titties..." and I thought what the hell have they got to do with the protocol? ;D
Edit: turns out I wasn't the only one!
Given that the deal is called the Windsor Framework, Northern Ireland's national mar dhea stadium should from on on be called Protocol Park
Quote from: yellowcard on February 27, 2023, 04:13:58 PM
Quote from: NAG1 on February 27, 2023, 04:08:38 PM
Quote from: yellowcard on February 27, 2023, 04:05:24 PM
It's a huge opportunity for Jim Allister to make his party the voice of Unionism. Donaldson has looked like a lame duck leader from day one and this fork in the road was coming. From a tactical perspective Allister has played him like a kipper. Its a given that Allister will reject the deal and subsequently LCC/OO/loyalist alliance so then its over to Jeffrey whose head must be spinning at the minute. I can't see him backing it and if he does he's probably toast.
But if he does it is another opportunity for the non-unionist parties. If they split they hardline vote between DUP and TUV again they will do nothing but gut themselves, weakening their position further.
It could well do. At the minute TUV is effectively a one man band but if Donaldson can't keep his party together then Allister will profit most and will make capital off the back of that. Whatever you think about Allister (and he is horrific) he is more of a leader and strategist than Jeffrey Donaldson will ever be.
Don't think so.
He just says no to everything.
Quote from: marty34 on February 27, 2023, 10:32:09 PM
Quote from: yellowcard on February 27, 2023, 04:13:58 PM
Quote from: NAG1 on February 27, 2023, 04:08:38 PM
Quote from: yellowcard on February 27, 2023, 04:05:24 PM
It's a huge opportunity for Jim Allister to make his party the voice of Unionism. Donaldson has looked like a lame duck leader from day one and this fork in the road was coming. From a tactical perspective Allister has played him like a kipper. Its a given that Allister will reject the deal and subsequently LCC/OO/loyalist alliance so then its over to Jeffrey whose head must be spinning at the minute. I can't see him backing it and if he does he's probably toast.
But if he does it is another opportunity for the non-unionist parties. If they split they hardline vote between DUP and TUV again they will do nothing but gut themselves, weakening their position further.
It could well do. At the minute TUV is effectively a one man band but if Donaldson can't keep his party together then Allister will profit most and will make capital off the back of that. Whatever you think about Allister (and he is horrific) he is more of a leader and strategist than Jeffrey Donaldson will ever be.
Don't think so.
He just says no to everything.
That appeals to the sort of yokes he wants voting for him
At the start of the EU negotiations god knows how long ago they thought the DUP were playing a blinder playing hardball and saying no in negotiations. People then realised that was actually all they'd got and they said no to everything. No is all they've got.
Quote from: yellowcard on February 27, 2023, 04:05:24 PM
It's a huge opportunity for Jim Allister to make his party the voice of Unionism. Donaldson has looked like a lame duck leader from day one and this fork in the road was coming. From a tactical perspective Allister has played him like a kipper. Its a given that Allister will reject the deal and subsequently LCC/OO/loyalist alliance so then its over to Jeffrey whose head must be spinning at the minute. I can't see him backing it and if he does he's probably toast.
The great minds of the LCC must have completed their assessment as Ian Og says the deal 'doesn't cut the mustard'
Let's say the 17th Century says NO! to the "Windsor protocol"......
I highly doubt the EU and the Brits are going to tear it up and start all over again?
Quote from: Rossfan on February 28, 2023, 09:10:28 AM
Let's say the 17th Century says NO! to the "Windsor protocol"......
I highly doubt the EU and the Brits are going to tear it up and start all over again?
Nope this is it. They either get on and make it work for their community or they get left behind
Quote from: Rossfan on February 28, 2023, 09:10:28 AM
Let's say the 17th Century says NO! to the "Windsor protocol"......
I highly doubt the EU and the Brits are going to tear it up and start all over again?
Yeah surely no more renegotiating now. As someone else as said, Rishi has played a blinder getting Charlie to look like he's backing it without openly backing it.
Quote from: Armagh18 on February 28, 2023, 09:23:40 AM
Quote from: Rossfan on February 28, 2023, 09:10:28 AM
Let's say the 17th Century says NO! to the "Windsor protocol"......
I highly doubt the EU and the Brits are going to tear it up and start all over again?
Yeah surely no more renegotiating now. As someone else as said, Rishi has played a blinder getting Charlie to look like he's backing it without openly backing it.
Charlie and Jeffrey's relationship is hardly the warmest either going by the reception in Hillsborough the time of his Ma's death.
It will be interesting how the DUP spin this as TBH their intransigence has earned some big compromises from the EU and a normal party would spin that as a serious win, but not Sammy fingers and Ian Óg, oh no, they're boxing Donaldson into a corner as this deal doesn't cut the mustard and looking to overplay their hand.
Sunak has binned their Protocol Bill, so this is the only show in town.
It is hard to know where they go from here if they say no.
If they say no they are basically saying northern ireland can't work because we won't let it.
Some speculate a border poll if they say no however I doubt it.
Quote from: JoG2 on February 28, 2023, 07:15:19 AM
Quote from: yellowcard on February 27, 2023, 04:05:24 PM
It's a huge opportunity for Jim Allister to make his party the voice of Unionism. Donaldson has looked like a lame duck leader from day one and this fork in the road was coming. From a tactical perspective Allister has played him like a kipper. Its a given that Allister will reject the deal and subsequently LCC/OO/loyalist alliance so then its over to Jeffrey whose head must be spinning at the minute. I can't see him backing it and if he does he's probably toast.
The great minds of the LCC must have completed their assessment as Ian Og says the deal 'doesn't cut the mustard'
IanOg doesn't speak for the LCC, he and Sammy will take the same line as Farage, Banks and their Russian owners.
Jeffrey knows it is a good deal but he needs to see what way the wind is blowing.
Must be pressure from inside the party to say yes. It's ok for the MP's to waltz back and fourth to London on those wages and expenses while everyone else (MLA's) could be going back to their day jobs ?
Quote from: imtommygunn on February 28, 2023, 09:36:01 AM
It is hard to know where they go from here if they say no.
If they say no they are basically saying northern ireland can't work because we won't let it.
Some speculate a border poll if they say no however I doubt it.
Labour have said they will back the deal. England and to an extent the ERG want to "get Brexit done". The DUP are being offered a way out, a chance to trumpet a big win. However, for an image of the Stormont brake, imagine a toy steering wheel being handed to a child in the back seat so they can "drive the car, just like Daddy".
Regardless of whether the protocol is approved or not , the DUP's ego is huge (to them anyway), as they made the EU and British government effectively dance to their tune
They think they're more important than they really are. Will they want to give all this power up, slink back into the shadows , never to be seen or heard from again? I doubt it.
I don't think they will approve this deal. So sooner or later , their bluff has to be called . Be that, a border poll, joint rule and/or closing Stormont , and the big wages that goes with it
They're going to have to accept it. There has been give and take between the UK and EU and that's the way these things work. It's going ahead regardless so they will be left out in the cold if they come back with more demands. Countries like Switzerland and Norway don't have an issue with aligning with EU regulations. It's what needs done if you want to trade fairly seamlessly with Europe. Not doing so would turn this place into a bigger economic wasteland that it already is. The dumb wits in the DUP either can't seem to grasp that, or they think it's a price worth paying for their idea of sovereignty. It's ironic given their mantra over the years of nationalists not wanting this place to work.
Quote from: johnnycool on February 28, 2023, 09:31:39 AM
Quote from: Armagh18 on February 28, 2023, 09:23:40 AM
Quote from: Rossfan on February 28, 2023, 09:10:28 AM
Let's say the 17th Century says NO! to the "Windsor protocol"......
I highly doubt the EU and the Brits are going to tear it up and start all over again?
Yeah surely no more renegotiating now. As someone else as said, Rishi has played a blinder getting Charlie to look like he's backing it without openly backing it.
Charlie and Jeffrey's relationship is hardly the warmest either going by the reception in Hillsborough the time of his Ma's death.
It will be interesting how the DUP spin this as TBH their intransigence has earned some big compromises from the EU and a normal party would spin that as a serious win, but not Sammy fingers and Ian Óg, oh no, they're boxing Donaldson into a corner as this deal doesn't cut the mustard and looking to overplay their hand.
Sunak has binned their Protocol Bill, so this is the only show in town.
Yeah not sure where the Sammy and Ian Og want Jeffrey to go from here. You could let Allister write the deal himself and he'd still say no, it's just in them to. I suppose at the end of the day it all boils down to the fact they will never go into Stormont under Sinn Fein.
Quote from: Armagh18 on February 28, 2023, 09:53:51 AM
Quote from: johnnycool on February 28, 2023, 09:31:39 AM
Quote from: Armagh18 on February 28, 2023, 09:23:40 AM
Quote from: Rossfan on February 28, 2023, 09:10:28 AM
Let's say the 17th Century says NO! to the "Windsor protocol"......
I highly doubt the EU and the Brits are going to tear it up and start all over again?
Yeah surely no more renegotiating now. As someone else as said, Rishi has played a blinder getting Charlie to look like he's backing it without openly backing it.
Charlie and Jeffrey's relationship is hardly the warmest either going by the reception in Hillsborough the time of his Ma's death.
It will be interesting how the DUP spin this as TBH their intransigence has earned some big compromises from the EU and a normal party would spin that as a serious win, but not Sammy fingers and Ian Óg, oh no, they're boxing Donaldson into a corner as this deal doesn't cut the mustard and looking to overplay their hand.
Sunak has binned their Protocol Bill, so this is the only show in town.
Yeah not sure where the Sammy and Ian Og want Jeffrey to go from here. You could let Allister write the deal himself and he'd still say no, it's just in them to. I suppose at the end of the day it all boils down to the fact they will never go into Stormont under Sinn Fein.
Jim said this yesterday. The deal was irrelevant, he said they still shouldn't allow a Sinn Fein 1st minister.
The only thing that gives me any confidence that this is the game, is down to the fact that the Little- Englander ERG types appear to have run out of patience with the DUP and just want this done to move on.
So they may find themselves slightly under P to get signed up too it from their once allies.
so Jim Allister is blatantly denying democracy hes not even being veiled about it.
Quote from: RedHand88 on February 28, 2023, 09:57:26 AM
Quote from: Armagh18 on February 28, 2023, 09:53:51 AM
Quote from: johnnycool on February 28, 2023, 09:31:39 AM
Quote from: Armagh18 on February 28, 2023, 09:23:40 AM
Quote from: Rossfan on February 28, 2023, 09:10:28 AM
Let's say the 17th Century says NO! to the "Windsor protocol"......
I highly doubt the EU and the Brits are going to tear it up and start all over again?
Yeah surely no more renegotiating now. As someone else as said, Rishi has played a blinder getting Charlie to look like he's backing it without openly backing it.
Charlie and Jeffrey's relationship is hardly the warmest either going by the reception in Hillsborough the time of his Ma's death.
It will be interesting how the DUP spin this as TBH their intransigence has earned some big compromises from the EU and a normal party would spin that as a serious win, but not Sammy fingers and Ian Óg, oh no, they're boxing Donaldson into a corner as this deal doesn't cut the mustard and looking to overplay their hand.
Sunak has binned their Protocol Bill, so this is the only show in town.
Yeah not sure where the Sammy and Ian Og want Jeffrey to go from here. You could let Allister write the deal himself and he'd still say no, it's just in them to. I suppose at the end of the day it all boils down to the fact they will never go into Stormont under Sinn Fein.
Jim said this yesterday. The deal was irrelevant, he said they still shouldn't allow a Sinn Fein 1st minister.
How the feck does he get away with it. Was he challenged at all on that? Have you link to that interview?
Quote from: Armagh18 on February 28, 2023, 11:23:48 AM
Quote from: RedHand88 on February 28, 2023, 09:57:26 AM
Quote from: Armagh18 on February 28, 2023, 09:53:51 AM
Quote from: johnnycool on February 28, 2023, 09:31:39 AM
Quote from: Armagh18 on February 28, 2023, 09:23:40 AM
Quote from: Rossfan on February 28, 2023, 09:10:28 AM
Let's say the 17th Century says NO! to the "Windsor protocol"......
I highly doubt the EU and the Brits are going to tear it up and start all over again?
Yeah surely no more renegotiating now. As someone else as said, Rishi has played a blinder getting Charlie to look like he's backing it without openly backing it.
Charlie and Jeffrey's relationship is hardly the warmest either going by the reception in Hillsborough the time of his Ma's death.
It will be interesting how the DUP spin this as TBH their intransigence has earned some big compromises from the EU and a normal party would spin that as a serious win, but not Sammy fingers and Ian Óg, oh no, they're boxing Donaldson into a corner as this deal doesn't cut the mustard and looking to overplay their hand.
Sunak has binned their Protocol Bill, so this is the only show in town.
Yeah not sure where the Sammy and Ian Og want Jeffrey to go from here. You could let Allister write the deal himself and he'd still say no, it's just in them to. I suppose at the end of the day it all boils down to the fact they will never go into Stormont under Sinn Fein.
Jim said this yesterday. The deal was irrelevant, he said they still shouldn't allow a Sinn Fein 1st minister.
How the feck does he get away with it. Was he challenged at all on that? Have you link to that interview?
https://www.newsletter.co.uk/business/watch-for-yourself-interview-with-jim-allister-dup-seven-tests-leave-them-with-wriggle-room-but-even-if-they-accept-the-deal-there-should-be-no-return-to-a-sinn-fein-led-stormont-4043736 (https://www.newsletter.co.uk/business/watch-for-yourself-interview-with-jim-allister-dup-seven-tests-leave-them-with-wriggle-room-but-even-if-they-accept-the-deal-there-should-be-no-return-to-a-sinn-fein-led-stormont-4043736)
"As to whether the DUP should be going into Stormont at all, even if its Seven Tests are met, Mr Allister pointed to Sinn Fein's ongoing apologetics for the IRA, with the would-be First Minister Michelle O'Neill having declared recently that there was "no alternative" to republican paramilitary violence during the Troubles."
Penny is dropping with Steve Baker and his ERG mates that the DUP, Alistair et al will only ever be happy with one thing and that is "There are unionists who would dig a moat between the North and the South, those unionists will never be happy.".
Quote from: 93-DY-SAM on February 28, 2023, 12:15:41 PM
Penny is dropping with Steve Baker and his ERG mates that the DUP, Alistair et al will only ever be happy with one thing and that is "There are unionists who would dig a moat between the North and the South, those unionists will never be happy.".
They would still moan that the moat isnt wide enough or deep enough, probably need too main taigs to dig it ffs
The big question today is why is Rishi Sunak claiming that we now have such a uniquely privileged position here in economic terms. After all his main audience is an English one so that raises massive questions as to the so called benefits of Brexit itself to begin with. It seems like it is the beginning of a change in policy from UK government when you hear this and the likes of Steve 'Brexit hard man' Baker having a road to Damascus moment. Sunak knows that he has seen off the threat of Johnson and he is now emboldened to pursue a closer relationship with Europe.
I've no doubt that Sunak convinced the EU that he days of the UK acting the bollix are over. So the EU is less worried about stuff coming into NI because the UK is not going to greatly change standards etc.
Quote from: armaghniac on February 28, 2023, 02:16:23 PM
I've no doubt that Sunak convinced the EU that he days of the UK acting the bollix are over. So the EU is less worried about stuff coming into NI because the UK is not going to greatly change standards etc.
The Protocol was holding up other deals in the Pacific and the US. The Brits had no choice.
Quote from: armaghniac on February 28, 2023, 02:16:23 PM
I've no doubt that Sunak convinced the EU that he days of the UK acting the bollix are over. So the EU is less worried about stuff coming into NI because the UK is not going to greatly change standards etc.
And no doubt the Brits realise that it's not a great idea shutting your eyes and pretending 400,000,000 pretty well off people on you doorstep don't exist.
Steve Baker slabbering on about his mental health. This guy. Christ on a bike. An Absolute moron who cared not one jot for the people of NI leaving us with no government, huge NHS waiting lists, political instability and double digit inflation. f**k his mental health. w**ker.
Quote from: trailer on February 28, 2023, 05:04:44 PM
Steve Baker slabbering on about his mental health. This guy. Christ on a bike. An Absolute moron who cared not one jot for the people of NI leaving us with no government, huge NHS waiting lists, political instability and double digit inflation. f**k his mental health. w**ker.
But what do you really think of Steve Baker? He was a self styled Brexit hard man but was he any worse than Mogg, Johnson, Frost, Francois, Banks, Braverman, Dorris, etc. And that's before you move onto the DUPers who flirted and hitched their wagon to them from the outset. History will not be kind to those politicians. At least Baker belatedly appears to have seen the light even if he probably has his own self serving reasons for doing so.
The outworkings of this Brexit deal for this place economically will be interesting to watch unfold. If it thrives within the next 10/15 years then you could find that middle England will be looking at another EU referendum within a generation. Sunak is already facing a bit of a shit storm among remainers and pro Indy Scots over his comments from earlier today when heralding the unique position we face with the dual access.
The UK has to play by the rules now. There is no Brexit Shangri-la . There is no there there.
Quote from: yellowcard on February 28, 2023, 05:15:58 PM
Quote from: trailer on February 28, 2023, 05:04:44 PM
Steve Baker slabbering on about his mental health. This guy. Christ on a bike. An Absolute moron who cared not one jot for the people of NI leaving us with no government, huge NHS waiting lists, political instability and double digit inflation. f**k his mental health. w**ker.
But what do you really think of Steve Baker? He was a self styled Brexit hard man but was he any worse than Mogg, Johnson, Frost, Francois, Banks, Braverman, Dorris, etc. And that's before you move onto the DUPers who flirted and hitched their wagon to them from the outset. History will not be kind to those politicians. At least Baker belatedly appears to have seen the light even if he probably has his own self serving reasons for doing so.
The outworkings of this Brexit deal for this place economically will be interesting to watch unfold. If it thrives within the next 10/15 years then you could find that middle England will be looking at another EU referendum within a generation. Sunak is already facing a bit of a shit storm among remainers and pro Indy Scots over his comments from earlier today when heralding the unique position we face with the dual access.
Baker definitely changed. He apologised to Ireland for his stance. He was tough on DUP. He trolled Bryson. Was seeing enjoying pints in Dublin. He was nowhere on the same level as those hateful hardline Tories you cite.
Quote from: weareros on February 28, 2023, 08:16:43 PM
Quote from: yellowcard on February 28, 2023, 05:15:58 PM
Quote from: trailer on February 28, 2023, 05:04:44 PM
Steve Baker slabbering on about his mental health. This guy. Christ on a bike. An Absolute moron who cared not one jot for the people of NI leaving us with no government, huge NHS waiting lists, political instability and double digit inflation. f**k his mental health. w**ker.
But what do you really think of Steve Baker? He was a self styled Brexit hard man but was he any worse than Mogg, Johnson, Frost, Francois, Banks, Braverman, Dorris, etc. And that's before you move onto the DUPers who flirted and hitched their wagon to them from the outset. History will not be kind to those politicians. At least Baker belatedly appears to have seen the light even if he probably has his own self serving reasons for doing so.
The outworkings of this Brexit deal for this place economically will be interesting to watch unfold. If it thrives within the next 10/15 years then you could find that middle England will be looking at another EU referendum within a generation. Sunak is already facing a bit of a shit storm among remainers and pro Indy Scots over his comments from earlier today when heralding the unique position we face with the dual access.
Baker definitely changed. He apologised to Ireland for his stance. He was tough on DUP. He trolled Bryson. Was seeing enjoying pints in Dublin. He was nowhere on the same level as those hateful hardline Tories you cite.
Beware! A leopard never changes it's spots. He's a w**ker. f**k him.
Quote from: weareros on February 28, 2023, 08:16:43 PM
Quote from: yellowcard on February 28, 2023, 05:15:58 PM
Quote from: trailer on February 28, 2023, 05:04:44 PM
Steve Baker slabbering on about his mental health. This guy. Christ on a bike. An Absolute moron who cared not one jot for the people of NI leaving us with no government, huge NHS waiting lists, political instability and double digit inflation. f**k his mental health. w**ker.
But what do you really think of Steve Baker? He was a self styled Brexit hard man but was he any worse than Mogg, Johnson, Frost, Francois, Banks, Braverman, Dorris, etc. And that's before you move onto the DUPers who flirted and hitched their wagon to them from the outset. History will not be kind to those politicians. At least Baker belatedly appears to have seen the light even if he probably has his own self serving reasons for doing so.
The outworkings of this Brexit deal for this place economically will be interesting to watch unfold. If it thrives within the next 10/15 years then you could find that middle England will be looking at another EU referendum within a generation. Sunak is already facing a bit of a shit storm among remainers and pro Indy Scots over his comments from earlier today when heralding the unique position we face with the dual access.
Baker definitely changed. He apologised to Ireland for his stance. He was tough on DUP. He trolled Bryson. Was seeing enjoying pints in Dublin. He was nowhere on the same level as those hateful hardline Tories you cite.
He very much was a hateful hardline Tory cúnt, heavily involved in the lies being spun during the Brexit referendum, lets not forget.
He's very much had a road to Damascus moment, whether his conscience got the better of him, who knows, but there's still a lot of the same cúnts pulling the strings in this Tory Government.
There's none of them can be trusted.
Quote from: johnnycool on March 01, 2023, 08:04:06 AM
Quote from: weareros on February 28, 2023, 08:16:43 PM
Quote from: yellowcard on February 28, 2023, 05:15:58 PM
Quote from: trailer on February 28, 2023, 05:04:44 PM
Steve Baker slabbering on about his mental health. This guy. Christ on a bike. An Absolute moron who cared not one jot for the people of NI leaving us with no government, huge NHS waiting lists, political instability and double digit inflation. f**k his mental health. w**ker.
But what do you really think of Steve Baker? He was a self styled Brexit hard man but was he any worse than Mogg, Johnson, Frost, Francois, Banks, Braverman, Dorris, etc. And that's before you move onto the DUPers who flirted and hitched their wagon to them from the outset. History will not be kind to those politicians. At least Baker belatedly appears to have seen the light even if he probably has his own self serving reasons for doing so.
The outworkings of this Brexit deal for this place economically will be interesting to watch unfold. If it thrives within the next 10/15 years then you could find that middle England will be looking at another EU referendum within a generation. Sunak is already facing a bit of a shit storm among remainers and pro Indy Scots over his comments from earlier today when heralding the unique position we face with the dual access.
Baker definitely changed. He apologised to Ireland for his stance. He was tough on DUP. He trolled Bryson. Was seeing enjoying pints in Dublin. He was nowhere on the same level as those hateful hardline Tories you cite.
He very much was a hateful hardline Tory cúnt, heavily involved in the lies being spun during the Brexit referendum, lets not forget.
He's very much had a road to Damascus moment, whether his conscience got the better of him, who knows, but there's still a lot of the same cúnts pulling the strings in this Tory Government.
Has he f**k. He's out for himself. And what really pisses me off more than anything is he's clearly playing the mental health card but you can't say anything because "Mental Health" There'd be f**k all wrong with his mental health if he wasn't such a ****.
And on a more broader point there is some amount of young people running about saying they're having mental health issues... some (not all) but some just using it as an excuse to not go to work, school etc. It's the new "My Granny has died" excuse. Baker and others who play this card are feeding it. Here's an idea, lay of the white lines at 5am in some lads kitchen and you'll be grand.
and what if your not taking white lines at 5am.
Possibly a bit extreme ;D
He's a tory. They are bad c**ts the lot of them and not one word that comes out of any of their mouths should be trusted.
How do you know when they're telling lies? When their lips move.
And this morning Frost is out criticising the deal. This guy... he negotiated the last deal which Unionists hated and led to the collapse of Stormont. Do these people have no self awareness? He actually campaigned to stay in EU when the Whiskey trade was paying him! What credible journalist is giving him oxygen? He is nothing more than cheap whiskey lobbyist. And Whiskey, lets face it, is pure pish.
Quote from: trailer on March 01, 2023, 09:01:09 AM
Quote from: johnnycool on March 01, 2023, 08:04:06 AM
Quote from: weareros on February 28, 2023, 08:16:43 PM
Quote from: yellowcard on February 28, 2023, 05:15:58 PM
Quote from: trailer on February 28, 2023, 05:04:44 PM
Steve Baker slabbering on about his mental health. This guy. Christ on a bike. An Absolute moron who cared not one jot for the people of NI leaving us with no government, huge NHS waiting lists, political instability and double digit inflation. f**k his mental health. w**ker.
But what do you really think of Steve Baker? He was a self styled Brexit hard man but was he any worse than Mogg, Johnson, Frost, Francois, Banks, Braverman, Dorris, etc. And that's before you move onto the DUPers who flirted and hitched their wagon to them from the outset. History will not be kind to those politicians. At least Baker belatedly appears to have seen the light even if he probably has his own self serving reasons for doing so.
The outworkings of this Brexit deal for this place economically will be interesting to watch unfold. If it thrives within the next 10/15 years then you could find that middle England will be looking at another EU referendum within a generation. Sunak is already facing a bit of a shit storm among remainers and pro Indy Scots over his comments from earlier today when heralding the unique position we face with the dual access.
Baker definitely changed. He apologised to Ireland for his stance. He was tough on DUP. He trolled Bryson. Was seeing enjoying pints in Dublin. He was nowhere on the same level as those hateful hardline Tories you cite.
He very much was a hateful hardline Tory cúnt, heavily involved in the lies being spun during the Brexit referendum, lets not forget.
He's very much had a road to Damascus moment, whether his conscience got the better of him, who knows, but there's still a lot of the same cúnts pulling the strings in this Tory Government.
Has he f**k. He's out for himself. And what really pisses me off more than anything is he's clearly playing the mental health card but you can't say anything because "Mental Health" There'd be f**k all wrong with his mental health if he wasn't such a ****.
And on a more broader point there is some amount of young people running about saying they're having mental health issues... some (not all) but some just using it as an excuse to not go to work, school etc. It's the new "My Granny has died" excuse. Baker and others who play this card are feeding it. Here's an idea, lay of the white lines at 5am in some lads kitchen and you'll be grand.
Agreed. Baker is Tory at the end of the day- they can never ever be trusted. Only thing you can sure of is they'll do what suits them and their buddies pocket!
Second paragraph is bang on.
Dup politicians are personally rich so they dont care.
Quote from: trailer on March 01, 2023, 09:16:46 AM
And this morning Frost is out criticising the deal. This guy... he negotiated the last deal which Unionists hated and led to the collapse of Stormont. Do these people have no self awareness? He actually campaigned to stay in EU when the Whiskey trade was paying him! What credible journalist is giving him oxygen? He is nothing more than cheap whiskey lobbyist. And Whiskey, lets face it, is pure pish.
They don't care. Not one bit. They'll spin and lie whatever way they think it suits them.
It is clear he's an idiot.
Quote from: Eire90 on March 01, 2023, 09:28:33 AM
Dup politicians are personally rich so they dont care.
Some possibly are, the MP's barring Shannon and maybe the girl from Portydown direction aren't personally rich I'd have thought, plus a load of the MLA's aren't so I'd say they're missing their wee salary or will be very soon if the DUP don't accept the deal and get back into Stormont.
Quote from: trailer on March 01, 2023, 09:16:46 AM
And this morning Frost is out criticising the deal. This guy... he negotiated the last deal which Unionists hated and led to the collapse of Stormont. Do these people have no self awareness? He actually campaigned to stay in EU when the Whiskey trade was paying him! What credible journalist is giving him oxygen? He is nothing more than cheap whiskey lobbyist. And Whiskey, lets face it, is pure pish.
Whoa, whoa, whoa. It's 'whisky'.
Vive la difference.
Quote from: mouview on March 01, 2023, 11:34:37 AM
Quote from: trailer on March 01, 2023, 09:16:46 AM
And this morning Frost is out criticising the deal. This guy... he negotiated the last deal which Unionists hated and led to the collapse of Stormont. Do these people have no self awareness? He actually campaigned to stay in EU when the Whiskey trade was paying him! What credible journalist is giving him oxygen? He is nothing more than cheap whiskey lobbyist. And Whiskey, lets face it, is pure pish.
Whoa, whoa, whoa. It's 'whisky'. Vive la difference.
Not in Ireland it's not.
Quote from: Snapchap on March 01, 2023, 12:16:52 PM
Quote from: mouview on March 01, 2023, 11:34:37 AM
Quote from: trailer on March 01, 2023, 09:16:46 AM
And this morning Frost is out criticising the deal. This guy... he negotiated the last deal which Unionists hated and led to the collapse of Stormont. Do these people have no self awareness? He actually campaigned to stay in EU when the Whiskey trade was paying him! What credible journalist is giving him oxygen? He is nothing more than cheap whiskey lobbyist. And Whiskey, lets face it, is pure pish.
Whoa, whoa, whoa. It's 'whisky'. Vive la difference.
Not in Ireland it's not.
Yes, but Frost was selling the Scottish product, not the Irish one.
Quote from: johnnycool on March 01, 2023, 11:07:18 AM
Quote from: Eire90 on March 01, 2023, 09:28:33 AM
Dup politicians are personally rich so they dont care.
Some possibly are, the MP's barring Shannon and maybe the girl from Portydown direction aren't personally rich I'd have thought, plus a load of the MLA's aren't so I'd say they're missing their wee salary or will be very soon if the DUP don't accept the deal and get back into Stormont.
I'd say one MP isn't as rich as many think and that's why he is constantly seeking money for favours, must have a serious addiction of sorts thats losing him money
While the DUPUDA "consider" (delay) things will the European and British Parliaments go ahead and approve the deal or does it all stop till the 17th Century says No?
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on March 01, 2023, 02:15:17 PM
Quote from: johnnycool on March 01, 2023, 11:07:18 AM
Quote from: Eire90 on March 01, 2023, 09:28:33 AM
Dup politicians are personally rich so they dont care.
Some possibly are, the MP's barring Shannon and maybe the girl from Portydown direction aren't personally rich I'd have thought, plus a load of the MLA's aren't so I'd say they're missing their wee salary or will be very soon if the DUP don't accept the deal and get back into Stormont.
I'd say one MP isn't as rich as many think and that's why he is constantly seeking money for favours, must have a serious addiction of sorts thats losing him money
There's no pockets in his Da's shroud....
It must have went somewhere!
Quote from: johnnycool on March 01, 2023, 02:27:53 PM
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on March 01, 2023, 02:15:17 PM
Quote from: johnnycool on March 01, 2023, 11:07:18 AM
Quote from: Eire90 on March 01, 2023, 09:28:33 AM
Dup politicians are personally rich so they dont care.
Some possibly are, the MP's barring Shannon and maybe the girl from Portydown direction aren't personally rich I'd have thought, plus a load of the MLA's aren't so I'd say they're missing their wee salary or will be very soon if the DUP don't accept the deal and get back into Stormont.
I'd say one MP isn't as rich as many think and that's why he is constantly seeking money for favours, must have a serious addiction of sorts thats losing him money
There's no pockets in his Da's shroud....
It must have went somewhere!
Digs and food paid for while away in London, flights also. Free bar upstairs and then whatever else they can milk off the system before they take their salary!!
So guessing some sort of addiction
The likes of Arlene Foster and Nigel Dodds are very wealthy individuals totally out of touch with what ordinary people have to face. It makes no difference to some of those people whether the health service is on its knees or if people are struggling in a cost of living crisis. Hence why they took some of the catastrophic decisions they did during Brexit negotiations that were economically self harming. It was almost solely about proving themselves as superbrits to the ERG and aiming to harden the border. For those 2 to continually resurface as commentators during ongoing negotiations just shows an incredible lack of self awareness. Far worse than Jeffrey Donaldson who was handed a poisoned chalice.
Its a disgrace that MLA's are still getting any salary whilst Stormont is down but I'd say there is an internal battle going on within the DUP between the local MLA's and the bigwigs in Westminster.
The DUP are basically tories. There are still major questions over who funded their brexit campaign and what they got out of it.
Same as tories - what is in it for them? As someone here said - loyal to the half crown and not the crown.
SNP are now arguing that Scotland should get the same EU deal that the DUP are possibly going to reject 😂
What the North got is what it had pre Brexit. Aka Remain
Quote from: imtommygunn on March 01, 2023, 04:23:11 PM
The DUP are basically tories. There are still major questions over who funded their brexit campaign and what they got out of it.
Same as tories - what is in it for them? As someone here said - loyal to the half crown and not the crown.
Worse than Tories.
Iniitially the DUP were pro Protocol. Now that almost all of the complaints have been addressed they probably won't get much mileage out of being contrary.
https://www.irishtimes.com/opinion/alex-kane-unsettled-unionists-caught-in-perfect-storm-1.4491016
Arlene Foster and other leading members had even begun a strategy of welcoming the "new opportunities" afforded by Brexit: a strategy which crashed and burned as soon as people began contacting newspapers and radio phone-ins with an ever-lengthening list of the inconveniences and non-deliveries they were experiencing
Quote from: Dougal Maguire on March 01, 2023, 04:51:39 PM
SNP are now arguing that Scotland should get the same EU deal that the DUP are possibly going to reject 😂
SNP made some fool of Sunak today- he made some own goal trying to tel the north how good they have it now with all the benefits of being in the EU. Which Sunak is denying the Scots...
Quote from: Armagh18 on March 01, 2023, 08:04:51 PM
Quote from: Dougal Maguire on March 01, 2023, 04:51:39 PM
SNP are now arguing that Scotland should get the same EU deal that the DUP are possibly going to reject 😂
SNP made some fool of Sunak today- he made some own goal trying to tel the north how good they have it now with all the benefits of being in the EU. Which Sunak is denying the Scots...
Another point scored for Scottish independence then?
BREAKING DUP John larkin says the new deal is not compatible with the act of union
The DUP in a nut shell
https://youtu.be/xHash5takWU
Paisley has gone on a solo run on Nolan ... DUP about to destroy themselves again here!!
Quote from: screenexile on March 01, 2023, 11:07:29 PM
Paisley has gone on a solo run on Nolan ... DUP about to destroy themselves again here!!
Jeffrey really has no control over his party's MPs. They seem to be on a solo run yet again.
looks like boris is about to open his mouth about it if boris says no i bet the dup will see that as a endorsement
Sorcha Eastwood is not good at this!
Quote from: screenexile on March 01, 2023, 11:34:04 PM
Sorcha Eastwood is not good at this!
Sorcha has Jim on strings. If hes not careful he'll blow a gasket
I thought she was useless and the one seat jibe was petty.
If winding Jim up is a measure of politician performance we've set a very low bar as it looks very easy!
She said absolutely nothing of substance bar repeating herself a number of times saying she wanted back into Stormont.
Quote from: screenexile on March 01, 2023, 11:40:11 PM
I thought she was useless and the one seat jibe was petty.
If winding Jim up is a measure of politician performance we've set a very low bar as it looks very easy!
She said absolutely nothing of substance bar repeating herself a number of times saying she wanted back into Stormont.
Agreed. Plenty of soundbites but not a lot else. Allister still rattled but then hes perma angry
Quote from: screenexile on March 01, 2023, 11:40:11 PM
I thought she was useless and the one seat jibe was petty.
If winding Jim up is a measure of politician performance we've set a very low bar as it looks very easy!
She said absolutely nothing of substance bar repeating herself a number of times saying she wanted back into Stormont.
Whats she meant to say when Jims busy talking over everyone swearing his allegiance to the union?
She could have said NI is in the Union until a referendum says otherwise... Jim took a gamble on Brexit pulling NI away from the South and he lost so it turned out the opposite.
Real world examples of why they wanted rigorous implementation of the protocol and real world examples of how this will help NI now... the medicines part of the new deal is massive and I've heard nobody mention it yet!!
Quote from: screenexile on March 01, 2023, 11:49:39 PM
She could have said NI is in the Union until a referendum says otherwise... Jim took a gamble on Brexit pulling NI away from the South and he lost so it turned out the opposite.
Real world examples of why they wanted rigorous implementation of the protocol and real world examples of how this will help NI now... the medicines part of the new deal is massive and I've heard nobody mention it yet!!
Why would she have to say NI is in the union. Everyone knows it is. That's a fact. Jim's the one yapping at it saying he's being subjugated and feels less british
Sinn Fein and the SDLP given up on Noaln all together? Very 1 sided approach the night.
Quote from: Wildweasel74 on March 02, 2023, 01:00:42 AM
Sinn Fein and the SDLP given up on Noaln all together? Very 1 sided approach the night.
Lads,
Turn that shíte off, it's a light entertainment show, not to be taken seriously just like Jerry Springer or your man Kilroy Silk.
Quote from: johnnycool on March 02, 2023, 08:00:17 AM
Quote from: Wildweasel74 on March 02, 2023, 01:00:42 AM
Sinn Fein and the SDLP given up on Noaln all together? Very 1 sided approach the night.
Lads,
Turn that shíte off, it's a light entertainment show, not to be taken seriously just like Jerry Springer or your man Kilroy Silk.
Agree.
How does Angry Jim get so much time on that show?
Compare him to Carroll of PBP who gets no time on it.
Quote from: marty34 on March 02, 2023, 08:14:06 AM
Quote from: johnnycool on March 02, 2023, 08:00:17 AM
Quote from: Wildweasel74 on March 02, 2023, 01:00:42 AM
Sinn Fein and the SDLP given up on Noaln all together? Very 1 sided approach the night.
Lads,
Turn that shíte off, it's a light entertainment show, not to be taken seriously just like Jerry Springer or your man Kilroy Silk.
Agree.
How does Angry Jim get so much time on that show?
Compare him to Carroll of PBP who gets no time on it.
When I said it was a light entertainment show I wasn't joking. It doesn't have to meet any rules on impartiality on the BBC like the News or a current affairs program.
Quote from: Wildweasel74 on March 02, 2023, 01:00:42 AM
Sinn Fein and the SDLP given up on Noaln all together? Very 1 sided approach the night.
If someone had landed from Mars 6 years ago they would think that the triumvirate of DUP/TUV/LCC ran this place and that everybody else was in the minority. The Nolan show has over indulged this protocol wrangling from within loyalism for far too long, its like the mouthpiece for the Newsletter. They are totally out of touch with the reality on the ground and some day the penny might drop if there isn't a backlash before then. As was often stated if he had been around in the days of the GFA I don't think there would have been any deal there either. The relationship between Nolan, Allister, Bryson, Paisley etc is a very curious one.
The phrase 'silent majority' springs to mind. All of the attention is on a smaller hard core section of the population. People who vote SF, SDLP, Alliance and even Ulster Unionist aren't being heard.
The wackos are box office. They boost ratings. That's all they are about in reality. If it was Gerry Carroll or Claire Hanna on last night none of you would be talking about it today.
I had the misfortune to hear the intro to the Nolan show on the radio this morning, it sounded like a party political broadcast for the anti protocol party. How on earth does he get away with this shite, and all on the licence payers dime.
Quote from: Keyser soze on March 02, 2023, 10:10:21 AM
I had the misfortune to hear the intro to the Nolan show on the radio this morning, it sounded like a party political broadcast for the anti protocol party. How on earth does he get away with this shite, and all on the licence payers dime.
It's light entertainment just like the two Johnnies or Hugo Duncan..
Turn off.
Quote from: johnnycool on March 02, 2023, 10:19:48 AM
Quote from: Keyser soze on March 02, 2023, 10:10:21 AM
I had the misfortune to hear the intro to the Nolan show on the radio this morning, it sounded like a party political broadcast for the anti protocol party. How on earth does he get away with this shite, and all on the licence payers dime.
It's light entertainment just like the two Johnnies or Hugo Duncan..
Turn off.
I dont listen to him, he comes on to do a promo before the 9 o'clock news.
Quote from: johnnycool on March 02, 2023, 10:19:48 AM
Quote from: Keyser soze on March 02, 2023, 10:10:21 AM
I had the misfortune to hear the intro to the Nolan show on the radio this morning, it sounded like a party political broadcast for the anti protocol party. How on earth does he get away with this shite, and all on the licence payers dime.
It's light entertainment just like the two Johnnies or Hugo Duncan..
Turn off.
The problem is he rabble rousing and sensationalising which only creates more anxiety and negativity among unionists? Compare him to a William Crawley who can let people have their say without whipping up hysteria.
Quote from: johnnycool on March 02, 2023, 10:19:48 AM
Quote from: Keyser soze on March 02, 2023, 10:10:21 AM
I had the misfortune to hear the intro to the Nolan show on the radio this morning, it sounded like a party political broadcast for the anti protocol party. How on earth does he get away with this shite, and all on the licence payers dime.
It's light entertainment just like the two Johnnies or Hugo Duncan..
Turn off.
Oh Christ, as bad as Hugo is , I'd prefer him over those two
So now that we have Ian og/ Sammy, Bin Boy and the LCC all rejecting the deal.
How does wee Jeff manoeuvre out of this never ending cul de sac?
The hardliners and the West Minister yob running the show, while it seems the rank and file DUP would actually go for the deal just to move past this mess of their own making.
Hard to see any way for wee Jeff now to sell this as the victory they thought they were going to get.
What's the story if they do reject? Will Rishi not just go ahead with a vote anyway, and it'll get enough support especially with labour suppirting. Can they not implement it without DUP/ NI assembly? Will just mean the "brake" will be out of action removing all power from theDUP to challenge Europe.
Struggling with this sovereignty thing.
"we" left the EU to have the parliament in London and the crown as the only sovereign rule maker.
But if that sovereign Government in London and signed into law by HM the Queen of the realm passes a bill such as the NI Protocol where certain EU regulations are to be honoured in a certain part of the UK, is that not within it's rights?
Quote from: trueblue1234 on March 02, 2023, 03:20:28 PM
What's the story if they do reject? Will Rishi not just go ahead with a vote anyway, and it'll get enough support especially with labour suppirting. Can they not implement it without DUP/ NI assembly? Will just mean the "brake" will be out of action removing all power from theDUP to challenge Europe.
It will go through the UK parliament irrespective of the DUP as no amount of ERG'ers will get the numbers up to stop it especially if Labour row in behind Rishi.
What the DUP need to ask themselves is what happens if Stormont is down for another year, what replaces it and how does that pan out long term?
Quote from: johnnycool on March 02, 2023, 03:30:26 PM
Quote from: trueblue1234 on March 02, 2023, 03:20:28 PM
What's the story if they do reject? Will Rishi not just go ahead with a vote anyway, and it'll get enough support especially with labour suppirting. Can they not implement it without DUP/ NI assembly? Will just mean the "brake" will be out of action removing all power from theDUP to challenge Europe.
It will go through the UK parliament irrespective of the DUP as no amount of ERG'ers will get the numbers up to stop it especially if Labour row in behind Rishi.
What the DUP need to ask themselves is what happens if Stormont is down for another year, what replaces it and how does that pan out long term?
Long term everyone knows what is coming just a question of when.
Aside from that though the DUP don't have the intelligence or foresight to plan ahead. All they know is saying no to everything!
Quote from: Armagh18 on March 02, 2023, 03:39:30 PM
Quote from: johnnycool on March 02, 2023, 03:30:26 PM
Quote from: trueblue1234 on March 02, 2023, 03:20:28 PM
What's the story if they do reject? Will Rishi not just go ahead with a vote anyway, and it'll get enough support especially with labour suppirting. Can they not implement it without DUP/ NI assembly? Will just mean the "brake" will be out of action removing all power from theDUP to challenge Europe.
It will go through the UK parliament irrespective of the DUP as no amount of ERG'ers will get the numbers up to stop it especially if Labour row in behind Rishi.
What the DUP need to ask themselves is what happens if Stormont is down for another year, what replaces it and how does that pan out long term?
Long term everyone knows what is coming just a question of when.
Aside from that though the DUP don't have the intelligence or foresight to plan ahead. All they know is saying no to everything!
And that will work for a while with an ever diminishing level of support as they circle the plug hole...
Quote from: johnnycool on March 02, 2023, 04:01:15 PM
Quote from: Armagh18 on March 02, 2023, 03:39:30 PM
Quote from: johnnycool on March 02, 2023, 03:30:26 PM
Quote from: trueblue1234 on March 02, 2023, 03:20:28 PM
What's the story if they do reject? Will Rishi not just go ahead with a vote anyway, and it'll get enough support especially with labour suppirting. Can they not implement it without DUP/ NI assembly? Will just mean the "brake" will be out of action removing all power from theDUP to challenge Europe.
It will go through the UK parliament irrespective of the DUP as no amount of ERG'ers will get the numbers up to stop it especially if Labour row in behind Rishi.
What the DUP need to ask themselves is what happens if Stormont is down for another year, what replaces it and how does that pan out long term?
Long term everyone knows what is coming just a question of when.
Aside from that though the DUP don't have the intelligence or foresight to plan ahead. All they know is saying no to everything!
And that will work for a while with an ever diminishing level of support as they circle the plug hole...
They day they get washed down it can't come soon enough for the rest of us.
Quote from: johnnycool on March 02, 2023, 03:30:26 PM
Quote from: trueblue1234 on March 02, 2023, 03:20:28 PM
What's the story if they do reject? Will Rishi not just go ahead with a vote anyway, and it'll get enough support especially with labour suppirting. Can they not implement it without DUP/ NI assembly? Will just mean the "brake" will be out of action removing all power from theDUP to challenge Europe.
It will go through the UK parliament irrespective of the DUP as no amount of ERG'ers will get the numbers up to stop it especially if Labour row in behind Rishi.
What the DUP need to ask themselves is what happens if Stormont is down for another year, what replaces it and how does that pan out long term?
64 million dollar question right there.
If the deal is dead Stormont is dead.
If Stormont is dead the GFA is dead.
If the GFA is dead no way will nationalists/ republicans accept direct rule from London.
Either the change has to be made to allow a "coalition of the willing " to take power in Stormont with the rest in opposition or Rishi has to grow a set and move straight to joint authority.
Quote from: trueblue1234 on March 02, 2023, 03:20:28 PM
What's the story if they do reject? Will Rishi not just go ahead with a vote anyway, and it'll get enough support especially with labour suppirting. Can they not implement it without DUP/ NI assembly? Will just mean the "brake" will be out of action removing all power from theDUP to challenge Europe.
I would assume it will go ahead as long as parliament votes for it. The brake is a mechanism that can't be used though if no Stormont. So they would be worse off.
Quote from: Armaghtothebone on March 02, 2023, 04:20:20 PM
Quote from: johnnycool on March 02, 2023, 03:30:26 PM
Quote from: trueblue1234 on March 02, 2023, 03:20:28 PM
What's the story if they do reject? Will Rishi not just go ahead with a vote anyway, and it'll get enough support especially with labour suppirting. Can they not implement it without DUP/ NI assembly? Will just mean the "brake" will be out of action removing all power from theDUP to challenge Europe.
It will go through the UK parliament irrespective of the DUP as no amount of ERG'ers will get the numbers up to stop it especially if Labour row in behind Rishi.
What the DUP need to ask themselves is what happens if Stormont is down for another year, what replaces it and how does that pan out long term?
64 million dollar question right there.
If the deal is dead Stormont is dead.
If Stormont is dead the GFA is dead.
If the GFA is dead no way will nationalists/ republicans accept direct rule from London.
Either the change has to be made to allow a "coalition of the willing " to take power in Stormont with the rest in opposition or Rishi has to grow a set and move straight to joint authority.
Can't see the EU wanting any more negotiations. Bigger fish to fry now. If DUP stay out of Stormont it does like very much like the current model is finished. Either direct rule or a coalition of those who do want to work together. I'd bet on the DUP seeking 'clarification' on a number of aspects to save a bit of face before returning. I think they will return - there's no where else to go.
What does Stormont actually do though?
Any laws passed in recent times has been passed by Westminster. As well as fuel payments, covid grants etc. So what is the point of Stormont?
Unionism has an image problem over on the mother ship. Most English people don't care .
Then you have stuff like this
https://www.irishtimes.com/opinion/2023/03/02/unionism-really-needs-to-ask-why-london-wont-take-its-side/
Jim Allister, leader of the TUV, noted on Tuesday morning: "So, all in all, for anyone whose compass is set by sovereignty considerations and whose goal is the strengthening, not weakening, of the union with GB, this is a deal which falls far short.
As for it being enough to cause unionism to give up its Stormont leverage and settle for this deal, which comes with the added packaging of a Sinn Féin First Minister, then, no thanks!"
As Alex Kane says in the same article
"But not one of the unionist critics of the Framework – or of any other "deal" – will ask, or has asked the only question that matters for UK governments: why do you do it?
It's a question that needs to be asked and answered, not least because unionism needs to know what it must do (or stop doing) in order to win over a more sympathetic audience in Westminster, the national media and its fellow citizens across the entire United Kingdom."
Quote from: AustinPowers on March 02, 2023, 05:47:30 PM
What does Stormont actually do though?
Any laws passed in recent times has been passed by Westminster. As well as fuel payments, covid grants etc. So what is the point of Stormont?
Devolved government.
Quote from: AustinPowers on March 02, 2023, 05:47:30 PM
What does Stormont actually do though?
Any laws passed in recent times has been passed by Westminster. As well as fuel payments, covid grants etc. So what is the point of Stormont?
In theory it brings some decision making closer to the people on things like health and education where policies are devolved. But of course it's plagued by the fact its almost completely reliant on the block grant from Treasury, the civil service is too bureaucratic, and the politicians are a bunch of amateurs who save up all the tough decisions for when they pull the house down so someone else can decide. They haven't the balls to restructure hospitals, introduce water charges etc.
But in theory it's a good thing lol. But it's a fair question to ask what significant difference would it make if it returned. I think best positive answer to that is that the people who do the real work here and go out and win business contracts and attract investment and jobs aren't undermined by political uncertainty.
they will probably reject it as boris says its bad
did paisley say he was speaking on behalf of bryson
Quote from: Eire90 on March 02, 2023, 06:39:18 PM
did paisley say he was speaking on behalf of bryson
Bryson is a member of the ' think - tank' ! You have to laugh, a shit show all round !
Quote from: Sportacus on March 02, 2023, 06:27:12 PM
Quote from: AustinPowers on March 02, 2023, 05:47:30 PM
What does Stormont actually do though?
Any laws passed in recent times has been passed by Westminster. As well as fuel payments, covid grants etc. So what is the point of Stormont?
In theory it brings some decision making closer to the people on things like health and education where policies are devolved. But of course it's plagued by the fact its almost completely reliant on the block grant from Treasury, the civil service is too bureaucratic, and the politicians are a bunch of amateurs who save up all the tough decisions for when they pull the house down so someone else can decide. They haven't the balls to restructure hospitals, introduce water charges etc.
But in theory it's a good thing lol. But it's a fair question to ask what significant difference would it make if it returned. I think best positive answer to that is that the people who do the real work here and go out and win business contracts and attract investment and jobs aren't undermined by political uncertainty.
So, no point then? ;)
So, good riddance Stormont.
Anyone listen to talkback hear William tearing this 'independent think tank' to shreds over its credibility in using the term independant. When asked who has worked with them, the 21 year old founder listed people all of the same political ideology as a 'wide range of people from other backgrounds'. He's also been to NI a few times when he was young kid on holiday
Well for a start it can give departments (like health and education) multi year budgets so they can plan and implement. As opposed to leaving decisions to senior civil servants
Dont see why English should care france is closer to England than northern ireland
Quote from: Eire90 on March 02, 2023, 07:41:05 PM
Dont see why English should care france is closer to England than northern ireland
Cumbria isn't
I can't see the Tories tolerating an ongoing shutdown of Stormont just because the DUP don't want to share power with Michelle O'Neill.
Stormont is about real life and real people.
Quote from: seafoid on March 02, 2023, 09:13:46 PM
I can't see the Tories tolerating an ongoing shutdown of Stormont just because the DUP don't want to share power with Michelle O'Neill.
Stormont is about real life and real people.
They've let it go this long. Do you really think they give a flying f**k about us?
PM needs to drop the joint authority option into a discussion with Jeffrey and co., see how they want to play it then. It's time for Westminster to move onto other things, DUP have run their course on this one, if they've any sense they'll jump at the deal and try to stabilise their position for another few years. It's like watching the march of the dodo's to their eventual destiny, not going to be pretty in the latter stages.
Apologies if this has been brought up previously......
If a deal is agreed that leaves the north in an unique situation, with access to UK/EU markets, then big companies might be drawn to that unique trading position.
Let's say big tech companies, manufacturing, medical companies set up home in the north. And the north becomes an economic boomtown, and things are good economy-wise. Plenty of jobs, better wages, people have more expendable income etc etc..... then a United ireland would sail off down the river. I mean , even if you were a hardened republican, you'd be mad to look for a United ireland when you're living in an economic utopia, and never had it so good.
Unionists just have to tuck that penalty kick in the net , and that would become a reality. Bye bye United ireland. The union would be more secure than it ever has been . If only they would have the foresight to see that far
Quote from: balladmaker on March 02, 2023, 10:01:16 PM
PM needs to drop the joint authority option into a discussion with Jeffrey and co., see how they want to play it then. It's time for Westminster to move onto other things, DUP have run their course on this one, if they've any sense they'll jump at the deal and try to stabilise their position for another few years. It's like watching the march of the dodo's to their eventual destiny, not going to be pretty in the latter stages.
I thought it was very apt that in his first 2 questions to be asked after announcing the framework he first asked the BBC and 2nd asked RTE. He's already dropping the hint that the Republic will play a part in the future of Northern Ireland
Quote from: AustinPowers on March 02, 2023, 10:02:09 PM
Apologies if this has been brought up previously......
If a deal is agreed that leaves the north in an unique situation, with access to UK/EU markets, then big companies might be drawn to that unique trading position.
Let's say big tech companies, manufacturing, medical companies set up home in the north. And the north becomes an economic boomtown, and things are good economy-wise. Plenty of jobs, better wages, people have more expendable income etc etc..... then a United ireland would sail off down the river. I mean , even if you were a hardened republican, you'd be mad to look for a United ireland when you're living in an economic utopia, and never had it so good.
Unionists just have to tuck that penalty kick in the net , and that would become a reality. Bye bye United ireland. The union would be more secure than it ever has been . If only they would have the foresight to see that far
They are that thick and bitter it'll never happen. Seriously short sighted.
Quote from: Duine Inteacht Eile on March 02, 2023, 10:19:58 PM
Quote from: AustinPowers on March 02, 2023, 10:02:09 PM
Apologies if this has been brought up previously......
If a deal is agreed that leaves the north in an unique situation, with access to UK/EU markets, then big companies might be drawn to that unique trading position.
Let's say big tech companies, manufacturing, medical companies set up home in the north. And the north becomes an economic boomtown, and things are good economy-wise. Plenty of jobs, better wages, people have more expendable income etc etc..... then a United ireland would sail off down the river. I mean , even if you were a hardened republican, you'd be mad to look for a United ireland when you're living in an economic utopia, and never had it so good.
Unionists just have to tuck that penalty kick in the net , and that would become a reality. Bye bye United ireland. The union would be more secure than it ever has been . If only they would have the foresight to see that far
I'm not sure exactly what a "hardened Republican" is in 2023 but you are expecting them to be (economic) Unionists overnight. That's a jump maybe?
Well ok, the wrong term maybe, but you know the point I'm making.
Would it be wrong to say the dup/lcc agenda is to have a hard border in ireland between north and south that they want to exhaust all options so they say the only solution is border.
So the spokesman for loyalists paramilitaries is giving airtime on bbc
Quote from: Eire90 on March 02, 2023, 10:52:32 PM
Would it be wrong to say the dup/lcc agenda is to have a hard border in ireland between north and south that they want to exhaust all options so they say the only solution is border.
Are they that stupid? As soon as a hard border goes up the calls for a unity ref get too loud to ignore. (They probably are that stupid actually)
Shape of that David Campbell on the view. Just about intelligent enough not to eat himself!
Quote from: AustinPowers on March 02, 2023, 10:02:09 PM
Apologies if this has been brought up previously......
If a deal is agreed that leaves the north in an unique situation, with access to UK/EU markets, then big companies might be drawn to that unique trading position.
Let's say big tech companies, manufacturing, medical companies set up home in the north. And the north becomes an economic boomtown, and things are good economy-wise. Plenty of jobs, better wages, people have more expendable income etc etc..... then a United ireland would sail off down the river. I mean , even if you were a hardened republican, you'd be mad to look for a United ireland when you're living in an economic utopia, and never had it so good.
Unionists just have to tuck that penalty kick in the net , and that would become a reality. Bye bye United ireland. The union would be more secure than it ever has been . If only they would have the foresight to see that far
Some businessman on with Mark Carruthers made this point last night, common sense to most but not the DUP who are being led by the nose by a taxi caller from Donaghadee who's making the most of his 15 minutes of fame.
The DUP have a choice
1. Turn NI into an economic powerhouse and make the place such a success it secures the middle ground and the Union
2. Force a hard border like the good old days and push the middle ground into a UI.
However they see it as
1. Become a Lundy and serve under SF
2. Do what Banks / Wigmore / Farage and their Russian handlers want, to prove how British they are.
I can't see the EU or London doing any more dealing with this framework now. That's it I believe.
It's a deal of an original deal so it's either, for the DUP/lcc, take it or leave it. Too much time exhausted on a small grouping.
Does the the south not have the same advantages as a member of the Single Market/Customs Union and given the Common Trade area with GB?
The North's economy is a basket case but the DUP don't care.
Quote from: marty34 on March 03, 2023, 08:39:10 AM
I can't see the EU or London doing any more dealing with this framework now. That's it I believe.
It's a deal of an original deal so it's either, for the DUP/lcc, take it or leave it. Too much time exhausted on a small grouping.
The issue was the Protocol. This was dealt with.
If the DUP can't handle a SF first minister that is not the EU's problem.
Quote from: seafoid on March 03, 2023, 08:40:34 AM
Quote from: marty34 on March 03, 2023, 08:39:10 AM
I can't see the EU or London doing any more dealing with this framework now. That's it I believe.
It's a deal of an original deal so it's either, for the DUP/lcc, take it or leave it. Too much time exhausted on a small grouping.
The issue was the Protocol. This was dealt with.
If the DUP can't handle a SF first minister that is not the EU's problem.
And neither can the EU do anything about Article VI of the act of union written 100's of years ago, currently now suspended and is driving Jim Allister nuts.
Suck it up Jim, that's what the sovereign Gov in London agreed and implemented.
We are loyal to the king they say.
Umm the king endorsed this deal.
Stop politicising this deal.
;D
Quote from: johnnycool on March 03, 2023, 08:18:08 AM
Quote from: AustinPowers on March 02, 2023, 10:02:09 PM
Apologies if this has been brought up previously......
If a deal is agreed that leaves the north in an unique situation, with access to UK/EU markets, then big companies might be drawn to that unique trading position.
Let's say big tech companies, manufacturing, medical companies set up home in the north. And the north becomes an economic boomtown, and things are good economy-wise. Plenty of jobs, better wages, people have more expendable income etc etc..... then a United ireland would sail off down the river. I mean , even if you were a hardened republican, you'd be mad to look for a United ireland when you're living in an economic utopia, and never had it so good.
Unionists just have to tuck that penalty kick in the net , and that would become a reality. Bye bye United ireland. The union would be more secure than it ever has been . If only they would have the foresight to see that far
Some businessman on with Mark Carruthers made this point last night, common sense to most but not the DUP who are being led by the nose by a taxi caller from Donaghadee who's making the most of his 15 minutes of fame.
Problem moving forward is 25% corporation tax in the north with 12.5% in the 26 counties. Would this not be a big problem to large companies setting up?
Nolan cutting the line off on Matthew O'Toole this morning, and loyalist paramilitary representatives on tv last night for as long as they like. BBC need to catch a grip.
The problem for the DUP is that people in England won't understand why they don't want to go back in. And they need people in England to understand them. Jim Allister doesn't understand this. The north is not physically attached to GB.
Quote from: Sportacus on March 03, 2023, 09:39:48 AM
Nolan cutting the line off on Matthew O'Toole this morning, and loyalist paramilitary representatives on tv last night for as long as they like. BBC need to catch a grip.
In fairness Carruthers did get stuck into Campbell.
Quote from: Walter Cronc on March 03, 2023, 07:43:40 AM
Shape of that David Campbell on the view. Just about intelligent enough not to eat himself!
Cringeworthy stuff. Who's paying him a salary?!
dont they see the king as woke
Quote from: mackers on March 03, 2023, 09:48:30 AM
Quote from: Sportacus on March 03, 2023, 09:39:48 AM
Nolan cutting the line off on Matthew O'Toole this morning, and loyalist paramilitary representatives on tv last night for as long as they like. BBC need to catch a grip.
In fairness Carruthers did get stuck into Campbell.
What i dont get is him going on about the para's having a big say in the GFA and then saying they need represented in this deal as well. Majority have moved on in the 25 years and see paras as no longer relevant in a political discussion. Rishi would have some laugh if he shows up at his door looking adjustments to the framework on behalf of UDA/UVF/RHC
Quote from: seafoid on March 03, 2023, 08:39:33 AM
Does the the south not have the same advantages as a member of the Single Market/Customs Union and given the Common Trade area with GB?
The North's economy is a basket case but the DUP don't care.
Common travel area, not common trade area.
Quote from: GJL on March 03, 2023, 09:22:49 AM
Quote from: johnnycool on March 03, 2023, 08:18:08 AM
Quote from: AustinPowers on March 02, 2023, 10:02:09 PM
Apologies if this has been brought up previously......
If a deal is agreed that leaves the north in an unique situation, with access to UK/EU markets, then big companies might be drawn to that unique trading position.
Let's say big tech companies, manufacturing, medical companies set up home in the north. And the north becomes an economic boomtown, and things are good economy-wise. Plenty of jobs, better wages, people have more expendable income etc etc..... then a United ireland would sail off down the river. I mean , even if you were a hardened republican, you'd be mad to look for a United ireland when you're living in an economic utopia, and never had it so good.
Unionists just have to tuck that penalty kick in the net , and that would become a reality. Bye bye United ireland. The union would be more secure than it ever has been . If only they would have the foresight to see that far
Some businessman on with Mark Carruthers made this point last night, common sense to most but not the DUP who are being led by the nose by a taxi caller from Donaghadee who's making the most of his 15 minutes of fame.
Problem moving forward is 25% corporation tax in the north with 12.5% in the 26 counties. Would this not be a big problem to large companies setting up?
Does the new agreement not have some allowance for setting Corp tax?
Quote from: Sportacus on March 03, 2023, 09:39:48 AM
Nolan cutting the line off on Matthew O'Toole this morning, and loyalist paramilitary representatives on tv last night for as long as they like. BBC need to catch a grip.
Ridiculous. A lot of complaints headed into the BBC off the back of it. Nolan should be hauled in front of the Editorial bosses to explain himself.
Quote from: trailer on March 03, 2023, 02:27:42 PM
Quote from: Sportacus on March 03, 2023, 09:39:48 AM
Nolan cutting the line off on Matthew O'Toole this morning, and loyalist paramilitary representatives on tv last night for as long as they like. BBC need to catch a grip.
Ridiculous. A lot of complaints headed into the BBC off the back of it. Nolan should be hauled in front of the Editorial bosses to explain himself.
What happened??
https://www.irishtimes.com/news/ireland/irish-news/dup-s-brexit-ads-who-bankrolled-the-secretive-435-000-campaign-1.4320055
Longford-born journalist Peter Geoghegan was sitting in a train carriage in Newcastle just before the Brexit referendum in 2016 when a quest began to unravel a mystery about the Democratic Unionist Party's role in winning it.
Flicking through a "well-thumbed copy" of the Metro newspaper, Geoghegan, who works now in Glasgow and London, saw the free newspaper's front page "wraparound" advertisement.
In it, British voters were urged to "Take back control", the slogan of the official Vote Leave campaign," Geoghegan recalls in his new book, Democracy for Sale, which is published by Head of Zeus on Thursday.
"I turned the paper over. An imprint on the back said that the advert had been 'paid for by the Democratic Unionist Party'," says Geoghegan, a journalist with opendemocracy.net.
"This was very curious. Since its foundation in 1971, the Democratic Unionist Party had never run a single candidate outside Northern Ireland, " he writes.
It was a little epiphany that ultimately led him down a number of other tracks and has resulted in the book.
It is filled with the likes Steve Bannon, Donald Trump, Dominic Cummings, Boris Johnson, Nigel Farage and a former head of Saudi Arabian intelligence, Prince Nawwaf bin Abdul Aziz al Saud.
Right there, too, is the DUP, which spent £435,000 "on a massive ad campaign promoting Brexit in England. I knew that election spending in the UK is tightly capped."
"I also knew, having worked as a reporter in Belfast, that political donations to Northern Irish parties were kept secret under anachronistic local laws. Perhaps this was a way around campaign limits?"
So, would he solve the mystery?
In his sleuthing Geoghegan examines how the DUP was "bankrolled by the biggest [political] donation in Northern Irish history" to support the campaign to take the UK out of the European Union.
Geoghegan contends in Democracy for Sale that the money was channelled to the DUP through the official Vote Leave campaign because Vote Leave had almost used up its permitted spending of £7 million.
Vote Leave and the DUP have denied the claim.
Geoghegan contends that the money was channelled to the DUP through the official Vote Leave campaign
Uncommunicative group
Other organisations on both sides of the campaign were allowed additional spending of up to £700,000. The author recounts how he discovered that an uncommunicative organisation called the Constitutional Research Council (CRC) donated £435,000 to the DUP to support the Leave crusade.
•
To prop up his Vote Leave-DUP connection conviction, Geoghegan writes, "Two months before the referendum, Matthew Elliott, Vote Leave's chief executive, wrote in an email to senior staff: 'The DUP also have a £700k spending limit, which can be spent nationwide!' "
"At that stage the DUP had yet to register as a referendum participant," Geoghegan writes. "It only did so in late May. When the CRC started giving money to the DUP, Vote Leave had almost completely exhausted its spending allowance."
https://ft.com/content/abc098e2-6529-44e8-9365-ef0a1ba70194
And, beneath it all, is the Unionists' conviction that they are losing every battle. The Brexit they backed to loosen links to the Irish Republic has instead weakened ties with the UK.
Quote from: seafoid on March 03, 2023, 07:36:50 PM
https://ft.com/content/abc098e2-6529-44e8-9365-ef0a1ba70194
And, beneath it all, is the Unionists' conviction that they are losing every battle. The Brexit they backed to loosen links to the Irish Republic has instead weakened ties with the UK.
Perhaps you should change your username to Paywall?
Just how many members here do you think have a FT subscription?
Quote from: Main Street on March 03, 2023, 09:58:18 PM
Quote from: seafoid on March 03, 2023, 07:36:50 PM
https://ft.com/content/abc098e2-6529-44e8-9365-ef0a1ba70194
And, beneath it all, is the Unionists' conviction that they are losing every battle. The Brexit they backed to loosen links to the Irish Republic has instead weakened ties with the UK.
Perhaps you should change your username to Paywall?
Just how many members here do you think have a FT subscription?
If someone erects a 10ft wall just use a 12ft ladder https://12ft.io/proxy?q=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.ft.com%2Fcontent%2Fabc098e2-6529-44e8-9365-ef0a1ba70194
Quote from: Main Street on March 03, 2023, 09:58:18 PM
Quote from: seafoid on March 03, 2023, 07:36:50 PM
https://ft.com/content/abc098e2-6529-44e8-9365-ef0a1ba70194
And, beneath it all, is the Unionists' conviction that they are losing every battle. The Brexit they backed to loosen links to the Irish Republic has instead weakened ties with the UK.
Perhaps you should change your username to Paywall?
Just how many members here do you think have a FT subscription?
FT is £55 a month online sub
Quote from: dec on March 03, 2023, 10:31:33 PM
Quote from: Main Street on March 03, 2023, 09:58:18 PM
Quote from: seafoid on March 03, 2023, 07:36:50 PM
https://ft.com/content/abc098e2-6529-44e8-9365-ef0a1ba70194
And, beneath it all, is the Unionists' conviction that they are losing every battle. The Brexit they backed to loosen links to the Irish Republic has instead weakened ties with the UK.
Perhaps you should change your username to Paywall?
Just how many members here do you think have a FT subscription?
If someone erects a 10ft wall just use a 12ft ladder https://12ft.io/proxy?q=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.ft.com%2Fcontent%2Fabc098e2-6529-44e8-9365-ef0a1ba70194
You don't even need to, with the FT if you enter the link into Google Search then you generally are able to read the article or if you open an account you get a few free articles.
Also if you clicked every link SF put on here you'd not have very much time left in your life so ignoring might be a better policy ;D
Quote from: imtommygunn on March 04, 2023, 08:41:40 AM
Also if you clicked every link SF put on here you'd not have very much time left in your life so ignoring might be a better policy ;D
+1,000,000
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on March 04, 2023, 08:43:14 AM
Quote from: imtommygunn on March 04, 2023, 08:41:40 AM
Also if you clicked every link SF put on here you'd not have very much time left in your life so ignoring might be a better policy ;D
+1,000,000
Ah lads yous are a bit harsh ;D. I appreciate the articles to the relevant subject matters. Definitely a lot of good ones that I wouldn't have came across otherwise. Keep sticking them up Seaf!
Quote from: RedHand88 on March 03, 2023, 02:38:26 PM
Quote from: trailer on March 03, 2023, 02:27:42 PM
Quote from: Sportacus on March 03, 2023, 09:39:48 AM
Nolan cutting the line off on Matthew O'Toole this morning, and loyalist paramilitary representatives on tv last night for as long as they like. BBC need to catch a grip.
Ridiculous. A lot of complaints headed into the BBC off the back of it. Nolan should be hauled in front of the Editorial bosses to explain himself.
What happened??
Along these lines: MO'T says big David Campbell's appearance on The View was sinister. Nolan says don't be casting aspersions on Campbell. MO'T says well ok, but I think we all know the craic. And Nolan cuts him off quick as a flash. Couldn't wait to get showing him who is boss.
Not right in my opinion. O'Toole has a mandate and it's valid for him to be on the airwaves. Campbell shouldn't be anywhere near a studio, and if he was theres only one question - when are the drug dealers leaving.
Quote from: Sportacus on March 04, 2023, 10:04:31 AM
Quote from: RedHand88 on March 03, 2023, 02:38:26 PM
Quote from: trailer on March 03, 2023, 02:27:42 PM
Quote from: Sportacus on March 03, 2023, 09:39:48 AM
Nolan cutting the line off on Matthew O'Toole this morning, and loyalist paramilitary representatives on tv last night for as long as they like. BBC need to catch a grip.
Ridiculous. A lot of complaints headed into the BBC off the back of it. Nolan should be hauled in front of the Editorial bosses to explain himself.
What happened??
Along these lines: MO'T says big David Campbell's appearance on The View was sinister. Nolan says don't be casting aspersions on Campbell. MO'T says well ok, but I think we all know the craic. And Nolan cuts him off quick as a flash. Couldn't wait to get showing him who is boss.
Not right in my opinion. O'Toole has a mandate and it's valid for him to be on the airwaves. Campbell shouldn't be anywhere near a studio, and if he was theres only one question - when are the drug dealers leaving.
SDLP should boycott Nolan now. Simple as.
Quote from: marty34 on March 04, 2023, 10:38:04 AM
Quote from: Sportacus on March 04, 2023, 10:04:31 AM
Quote from: RedHand88 on March 03, 2023, 02:38:26 PM
Quote from: trailer on March 03, 2023, 02:27:42 PM
Quote from: Sportacus on March 03, 2023, 09:39:48 AM
Nolan cutting the line off on Matthew O'Toole this morning, and loyalist paramilitary representatives on tv last night for as long as they like. BBC need to catch a grip.
Ridiculous. A lot of complaints headed into the BBC off the back of it. Nolan should be hauled in front of the Editorial bosses to explain himself.
What happened??
Along these lines: MO'T says big David Campbell's appearance on The View was sinister. Nolan says don't be casting aspersions on Campbell. MO'T says well ok, but I think we all know the craic. And Nolan cuts him off quick as a flash. Couldn't wait to get showing him who is boss.
Not right in my opinion. O'Toole has a mandate and it's valid for him to be on the airwaves. Campbell shouldn't be anywhere near a studio, and if he was theres only one question - when are the drug dealers leaving.
SDLP should boycott Nolan now. Simple as.
Everyone should boycott him.
Quote from: Square Ball on March 04, 2023, 11:27:29 AM
Quote from: marty34 on March 04, 2023, 10:38:04 AM
Quote from: Sportacus on March 04, 2023, 10:04:31 AM
Quote from: RedHand88 on March 03, 2023, 02:38:26 PM
Quote from: trailer on March 03, 2023, 02:27:42 PM
Quote from: Sportacus on March 03, 2023, 09:39:48 AM
Nolan cutting the line off on Matthew O'Toole this morning, and loyalist paramilitary representatives on tv last night for as long as they like. BBC need to catch a grip.
Ridiculous. A lot of complaints headed into the BBC off the back of it. Nolan should be hauled in front of the Editorial bosses to explain himself.
What happened??
Along these lines: MO'T says big David Campbell's appearance on The View was sinister. Nolan says don't be casting aspersions on Campbell. MO'T says well ok, but I think we all know the craic. And Nolan cuts him off quick as a flash. Couldn't wait to get showing him who is boss.
Not right in my opinion. O'Toole has a mandate and it's valid for him to be on the airwaves. Campbell shouldn't be anywhere near a studio, and if he was theres only one question - when are the drug dealers leaving.
SDLP should boycott Nolan now. Simple as.
Everyone should boycott him.
Nolan pushes an agenda which is not constructive
People should not give him a profile
If it wasn't for him the likes of Bryson wouldn't have a profile. I wouldn't go near the nolan show but it's influential and is not in any way constructive for this place at all. It gives voices to people who if they were in a bar you wouldn't entertain. Tbh it's dangerous.
Why isn't he asking questions of the likes of your man Campbell who is a sinister being.
Everyone has an agenda, Nolan is no different. The problem is the platform he has and whether he likes it or not, he is destructive. Needs taken off the air given the lack of editorial balance and his apparent agenda to only further a unionist/loyalist cause. All nationalists should boycott him, I think his handling of Mathew O'Toole yesterday will be a watershed moment for Nolan.
Quote from: Square Ball on March 04, 2023, 11:27:29 AM
Quote from: marty34 on March 04, 2023, 10:38:04 AM
Quote from: Sportacus on March 04, 2023, 10:04:31 AM
Quote from: RedHand88 on March 03, 2023, 02:38:26 PM
Quote from: trailer on March 03, 2023, 02:27:42 PM
Quote from: Sportacus on March 03, 2023, 09:39:48 AM
Nolan cutting the line off on Matthew O'Toole this morning, and loyalist paramilitary representatives on tv last night for as long as they like. BBC need to catch a grip.
Ridiculous. A lot of complaints headed into the BBC off the back of it. Nolan should be hauled in front of the Editorial bosses to explain himself.
What happened??
Along these lines: MO'T says big David Campbell's appearance on The View was sinister. Nolan says don't be casting aspersions on Campbell. MO'T says well ok, but I think we all know the craic. And Nolan cuts him off quick as a flash. Couldn't wait to get showing him who is boss.
Not right in my opinion. O'Toole has a mandate and it's valid for him to be on the airwaves. Campbell shouldn't be anywhere near a studio, and if he was theres only one question - when are the drug dealers leaving.
SDLP should boycott Nolan now. Simple as.
Everyone should boycott him.
No, nationalists should.
He has Bryson and Angry Jim on regularly.
SDLP need to cut their links with him.
Allister wants Jim Crow in the North. No uppity Taigs becoming First Minister. He is insane
Sf allister is just saying what some of the rest of them are thinking. At least he says it.
Quote from: balladmaker on March 04, 2023, 01:20:34 PM
Everyone has an agenda, Nolan is no different. The problem is the platform he has and whether he likes it or not, he is destructive. Needs taken off the air given the lack of editorial balance and his apparent agenda to only further a unionist/loyalist cause. All nationalists should boycott him, I think his handling of Mathew O'Toole yesterday will be a watershed moment for Nolan.
Does Nolan set the agenda/topic/discussion on his shows? Or is there a team above him who dictate the topics?
Quote from: dec on March 03, 2023, 10:31:33 PM
Quote from: Main Street on March 03, 2023, 09:58:18 PM
Quote from: seafoid on March 03, 2023, 07:36:50 PM
https://ft.com/content/abc098e2-6529-44e8-9365-ef0a1ba70194
And, beneath it all, is the Unionists' conviction that they are losing every battle. The Brexit they backed to loosen links to the Irish Republic has instead weakened ties with the UK.
Perhaps you should change your username to Paywall?
Just how many members here do you think have a FT subscription?
If someone erects a 10ft wall just use a 12ft ladder https://12ft.io/proxy?q=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.ft.com%2Fcontent%2Fabc098e2-6529-44e8-9365-ef0a1ba70194
Thanks.
Though that's strange, I had tried the ladder link bypass but it didn't work, message -
Request timed out try again later .
Your working ladder link contains 2Fwww.ft.com
my ladder link has 2Fft.com
Quote from: imtommygunn on March 04, 2023, 01:48:42 PM
Sf allister is just saying what some of the rest of them are thinking. At least he says it.
Yip, Poots was holding his nose when in office with SF, Arlene and her crocodiles statement..
some hide it better than others, but it's there nonetheless
8 reasons the DUP are in this hole
There is no political advantage in grasping reality if your voters don't (Jim Allister is also at it)
After correcting for birth, power goes to the people most committed to getting it. •
An inability to admit past error
If your genuine beliefs contradict reality, deny reality
Denying reality proves your fanaticism to other fanatics.
Laziness
Stupidity
Ignorance
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j-fWDrZSiZs
Quote from: AustinPowers on March 04, 2023, 01:58:42 PM
Quote from: balladmaker on March 04, 2023, 01:20:34 PM
Everyone has an agenda, Nolan is no different. The problem is the platform he has and whether he likes it or not, he is destructive. Needs taken off the air given the lack of editorial balance and his apparent agenda to only further a unionist/loyalist cause. All nationalists should boycott him, I think his handling of Mathew O'Toole yesterday will be a watershed moment for Nolan.
Does Nolan set the agenda/topic/discussion on his shows? Or is there a team above him who dictate the topics?
I'm sure they have production meetings where they agree on topics to cover ... the problem is Nolan is live at the mic, how he handles issues is on him, and his bias is obvious for all to see. I understand when he has to tow the legal line in the BBC and move discussions away from possible litigation, however he does let a very pro-unionist/loyalist view point come through in his questioning time and again.
I have just listened to the earlier discussed March 3rd Nolan show where Matthew O'Toole was cancelled by Nolan in midstream saying that stuff about Campbell, ironic considering Nolan had just made mention of the freedom of speech which allows loyalists groups to mouth off their threats of violence.
It's a blatant obvious ploy straight from the handbook of the parliamentary unionist party of the day , 'we're not violent, we don't support violence, but if our 7 demands are not met there are these mad loyalist thugs who will create mayhem this summer'.
Implication is, support our demands or else. That is the text book definition of a politician being sinister.
Quote from: Main Street on March 07, 2023, 08:27:35 PM
I have just listened to the earlier discussed March 3rd Nolan show where Matthew O'Toole was cancelled by Nolan in midstream saying that stuff about Campbell, ironic considering Nolan had just made mention of the freedom of speech which allows loyalists groups to mouth off their threats of violence.
It's a blatant obvious ploy straight from the handbook of the parliamentary unionist party of the day , 'we're not violent, we don't support violence, but if our 7 demands are not met there are these mad loyalist thugs who will create mayhem this summer'.
Implication is, support our demands or else. That is the text book definition of a politician being sinister.
Anybody know has tthe SDLP went back on Nolan since that?
Quote from: marty34 on March 07, 2023, 08:34:57 PM
Quote from: Main Street on March 07, 2023, 08:27:35 PM
I have just listened to the earlier discussed March 3rd Nolan show where Matthew O'Toole was cancelled by Nolan in midstream saying that stuff about Campbell, ironic considering Nolan had just made mention of the freedom of speech which allows loyalists groups to mouth off their threats of violence.
It's a blatant obvious ploy straight from the handbook of the parliamentary unionist party of the day , 'we're not violent, we don't support violence, but if our 7 demands are not met there are these mad loyalist thugs who will create mayhem this summer'.
Implication is, support our demands or else. That is the text book definition of a politician being sinister.
Anybody know has tthe SDLP went back on Nolan since that?
They put out a statement criticising BBC and asking them to clarify their editorial position.
Poor Jim, his old friend RDE has forsaken him and endorsed the new agreement. Will she now be a target along with King Charles.
Roof deadly the lundy! Who'd have thought.
I do wonder how long the DUP will take to give their thoughts on the Framework.
Or indeed, how long they will be allowed to take by the UK govt.
Surely there isn't any logical reason why, more than a week later, they still haven't given their opinion on whether they can support it or not.
Quote from: Smokin Joe on March 09, 2023, 10:53:40 AM
I do wonder how long the DUP will take to give their thoughts on the Framework.
Or indeed, how long they will be allowed to take by the UK govt.
Surely there isn't any logical reason why, more than a week later, they still haven't given their opinion on whether they can support it or not.
They said by the end of the month, must be to piss people off but sure they'll still say no? Or must be gauging what's in it for them first from behind closed doors, all sorts of peerages being promised as sweeteners
They're putting together a panel to assess it.
https://www.newsletter.co.uk/news/politics/windsor-framework-and-northern-ireland-protocol-who-is-who-on-dup-leader-sir-jeffrey-donaldsons-consultative-group-to-assess-eu-uk-agreement-and-what-have-they-said-about-the-protocol-4054064
I firmly believe they'll accept it (& have already come to that conclusion) this is all showboating for the bonehead elements. Also timed to run into Council election campaign.
Jim Alister feels his britishness is being eroded away bit by bit. Can we help him with a full list of that erosion?
1793 Penal Laws Removed (despite loyalist outrage)
1829 Catholic Emancipation (despite loyalist outrage)
1922 Ireland breaks free (despite loyalist outrage)
1973 Sunningdale Agreement (despite loyalist outrage)
1985 Anglo-Irish Agreement (despite loyalist outrage)
1998 Good Friday Agreement (loyalist outrage)
2016 Brexit Vote (loyalist jubilation)
2019 NI Protocol (loyalist outrage)
2023 Windsor Framework (loyalist outrage)
Irish Church Act 1869 removed Protestantism as state religion in Ireland.
Don't forget about removing the fleg from Belfast City Hall ;)
Have to watch the Tories that to appease them they don't write something into NI Act that makes a border poll harder to achieve. That ultimately is what the DUP want out of this, a rewriting of the GFA to lock North into UK. They wouldn't care if every sausage was blocked at Larne and sent back to Cumberland if they achieved that.
Quote from: weareros on March 09, 2023, 01:32:59 PM
Have to watch the Tories that to appease them they don't write something into NI Act that makes a border poll harder to achieve. That ultimately is what the DUP want out of this, a rewriting of the GFA to lock North into UK. They wouldn't care if every sausage was blocked at Larne and sent back to Cumberland if they achieved that.
Yeah, I said that a while back, saying they're trying to re-write the GFA to say something similar.
Quote from: marty34 on March 09, 2023, 02:33:59 PM
Quote from: weareros on March 09, 2023, 01:32:59 PM
Have to watch the Tories that to appease them they don't write something into NI Act that makes a border poll harder to achieve. That ultimately is what the DUP want out of this, a rewriting of the GFA to lock North into UK. They wouldn't care if every sausage was blocked at Larne and sent back to Cumberland if they achieved that.
Yeah, I said that a while back, saying they're trying to re-write the GFA to say something similar.
Surely even this duplicitous shower of Tory scum couldn't try and do that in an international agreement OR could they?
The mood music coming from the US was that this would be unacceptable and not tolerated.
Quote from: johnnycool on March 09, 2023, 02:38:54 PM
Quote from: marty34 on March 09, 2023, 02:33:59 PM
Quote from: weareros on March 09, 2023, 01:32:59 PM
Have to watch the Tories that to appease them they don't write something into NI Act that makes a border poll harder to achieve. That ultimately is what the DUP want out of this, a rewriting of the GFA to lock North into UK. They wouldn't care if every sausage was blocked at Larne and sent back to Cumberland if they achieved that.
Yeah, I said that a while back, saying they're trying to re-write the GFA to say something similar.
Surely even this duplicitous shower of Tory scum couldn't try and do that in an international agreement OR could they?
Why couldn't they? They could put in some wishy washy new act to get this protocol framework over the line. Wouldn't surprise me.
The Torys don't care. It'll be a fudge, like the Windsor Framework - all smoke and mirrors.
Quote from: marty34 on March 09, 2023, 02:42:04 PM
Quote from: johnnycool on March 09, 2023, 02:38:54 PM
Quote from: marty34 on March 09, 2023, 02:33:59 PM
Quote from: weareros on March 09, 2023, 01:32:59 PM
Have to watch the Tories that to appease them they don't write something into NI Act that makes a border poll harder to achieve. That ultimately is what the DUP want out of this, a rewriting of the GFA to lock North into UK. They wouldn't care if every sausage was blocked at Larne and sent back to Cumberland if they achieved that.
Yeah, I said that a while back, saying they're trying to re-write the GFA to say something similar.
Surely even this duplicitous shower of Tory scum couldn't try and do that in an international agreement OR could they?
Why couldn't they? They could put in some wishy washy new act to get this protocol framework over the line. Wouldn't surprise me.
The Torys don't care. It'll be a fudge, like the Windsor Framework - all smoke and mirrors.
No chance. UK Government would just be swopping DUP outrage for Nationalist outrage
Quote from: bennydorano on March 09, 2023, 03:00:07 PM
Quote from: marty34 on March 09, 2023, 02:42:04 PM
Quote from: johnnycool on March 09, 2023, 02:38:54 PM
Quote from: marty34 on March 09, 2023, 02:33:59 PM
Quote from: weareros on March 09, 2023, 01:32:59 PM
Have to watch the Tories that to appease them they don't write something into NI Act that makes a border poll harder to achieve. That ultimately is what the DUP want out of this, a rewriting of the GFA to lock North into UK. They wouldn't care if every sausage was blocked at Larne and sent back to Cumberland if they achieved that.
Yeah, I said that a while back, saying they're trying to re-write the GFA to say something similar.
Surely even this duplicitous shower of Tory scum couldn't try and do that in an international agreement OR could they?
Why couldn't they? They could put in some wishy washy new act to get this protocol framework over the line. Wouldn't surprise me.
The Torys don't care. It'll be a fudge, like the Windsor Framework - all smoke and mirrors.
No chance. UK Government would just be swopping DUP outrage for Nationalist outrage
Uncle Joe, oh Uncle Joe, those Brits are at it again!!!
Quote from: bennydorano on March 09, 2023, 03:00:07 PM
Quote from: marty34 on March 09, 2023, 02:42:04 PM
Quote from: johnnycool on March 09, 2023, 02:38:54 PM
Quote from: marty34 on March 09, 2023, 02:33:59 PM
Quote from: weareros on March 09, 2023, 01:32:59 PM
Have to watch the Tories that to appease them they don't write something into NI Act that makes a border poll harder to achieve. That ultimately is what the DUP want out of this, a rewriting of the GFA to lock North into UK. They wouldn't care if every sausage was blocked at Larne and sent back to Cumberland if they achieved that.
Yeah, I said that a while back, saying they're trying to re-write the GFA to say something similar.
Surely even this duplicitous shower of Tory scum couldn't try and do that in an international agreement OR could they?
Why couldn't they? They could put in some wishy washy new act to get this protocol framework over the line. Wouldn't surprise me.
The Torys don't care. It'll be a fudge, like the Windsor Framework - all smoke and mirrors.
No chance. UK Government would just be swopping DUP outrage for Nationalist outrage
Probably not but what would nationalists do?
Can't see them out protesting alà Bryson and the loyalists.
Even if the DUP got their way via the Windsor Framework a few weeks ago, what would nationalists do?
Quote from: marty34 on March 09, 2023, 03:08:35 PM
Quote from: bennydorano on March 09, 2023, 03:00:07 PM
Quote from: marty34 on March 09, 2023, 02:42:04 PM
Quote from: johnnycool on March 09, 2023, 02:38:54 PM
Quote from: marty34 on March 09, 2023, 02:33:59 PM
Quote from: weareros on March 09, 2023, 01:32:59 PM
Have to watch the Tories that to appease them they don't write something into NI Act that makes a border poll harder to achieve. That ultimately is what the DUP want out of this, a rewriting of the GFA to lock North into UK. They wouldn't care if every sausage was blocked at Larne and sent back to Cumberland if they achieved that.
Yeah, I said that a while back, saying they're trying to re-write the GFA to say something similar.
Surely even this duplicitous shower of Tory scum couldn't try and do that in an international agreement OR could they?
Why couldn't they? They could put in some wishy washy new act to get this protocol framework over the line. Wouldn't surprise me.
The Torys don't care. It'll be a fudge, like the Windsor Framework - all smoke and mirrors.
No chance. UK Government would just be swopping DUP outrage for Nationalist outrage
Probably not but what would nationalists do?
Can't see them out protesting alà Bryson and the loyalists.
Even if the DUP got their way via the Windsor Framework a few weeks ago, what would nationalists do?
Their way? As in a border? There'd be serious protests. Probably ends up in violence at some point.
I think Rishi isn't stupid, he wants to move on from Brexit and keep close enough ties with the eu trade wise.
Quote from: Armagh18 on March 09, 2023, 03:11:55 PM
Quote from: marty34 on March 09, 2023, 03:08:35 PM
Quote from: bennydorano on March 09, 2023, 03:00:07 PM
Quote from: marty34 on March 09, 2023, 02:42:04 PM
Quote from: johnnycool on March 09, 2023, 02:38:54 PM
Quote from: marty34 on March 09, 2023, 02:33:59 PM
Quote from: weareros on March 09, 2023, 01:32:59 PM
Have to watch the Tories that to appease them they don't write something into NI Act that makes a border poll harder to achieve. That ultimately is what the DUP want out of this, a rewriting of the GFA to lock North into UK. They wouldn't care if every sausage was blocked at Larne and sent back to Cumberland if they achieved that.
Yeah, I said that a while back, saying they're trying to re-write the GFA to say something similar.
Surely even this duplicitous shower of Tory scum couldn't try and do that in an international agreement OR could they?
Why couldn't they? They could put in some wishy washy new act to get this protocol framework over the line. Wouldn't surprise me.
The Torys don't care. It'll be a fudge, like the Windsor Framework - all smoke and mirrors.
No chance. UK Government would just be swopping DUP outrage for Nationalist outrage
Probably not but what would nationalists do?
Can't see them out protesting alà Bryson and the loyalists.
Even if the DUP got their way via the Windsor Framework a few weeks ago, what would nationalists do?
Their way? As in a border? There'd be serious protests. Probably ends up in violence at some point.
I think Rishi isn't stupid, he wants to move on from Brexit and keep close enough ties with the eu trade wise.
Especially with the US and EU now in discussions about a free/ closer trade agreement.
Hard border I don't think US would be impressed by either and that is probably a factor.
There will never be a hard border. It would not last in South Armagh for starters.
Rishi wants economic growth. The hard Brexit was minus 5% .
Hopefully SF pull out of Stormont if the DUP agree to a change ;D ;D ;D
Was rinse repeat
Nothing to do with a hard border. It's all about getting the super majority bill for all future referendums though Westminster. Second reading is later this month. That removes 50%+1 in a border poll.
If they try stunts with the GFA they will be great lads among the knuckle draggers around Larne, but will drive numbers of soft u and Alliance voters towards vote yes. Great strategy lads.
Id love to see Eastwood turn Jeffrey over in Lisburn next GE. Like Dodd's career here ending in embarrassment. In fact if they keep this poor me attitude up SF and SDLP should stand aside in Lisburn.
Quote from: weareros on March 09, 2023, 04:29:04 PM
Nothing to do with a hard border. It's all about getting the super majority bill for all future referendums though Westminster. Second reading is later this month. That removes 50%+1 in a border poll.
So the GFA is fucked then?
They're shouting it's f**ked while f**king it at the same time. Clever when you think about it...
I don't think that super majority is going to be a thing. It was Ian Og taking the piss as he usually does.
Quote from: imtommygunn on March 09, 2023, 05:03:35 PM
They're shouting it's f**ked while f**king it at the same time. Clever when you think about it...
I don't think that super majority is going to be a thing. It was Ian Og taking the piss as he usually does.
While it's Paisley taking the piss, the Tories had already been discussing changing rules for a Scottish Indy referendum to a super majority. He will get support for this. The DUP and TUV have no interest in protecting the GFA. They never supported it. They have been angling for awhile to change what consent means. It means a simple majority for constitutional change and Dublin/Nationalist parties need to stay awake.
Gregory must be feeling a bit left out seeing all his colleagues being anointed with knighthoods, damehoods, baronesses and Lords. Trying a bit too hard to defend his Tory/ERG colleagues in a monologue about Lineker today was classic Gregory. He's definitely given himself a chance but is probably still behind Sammy and Ian Og in the queue.
We have all been laughing at the DUP over the last couple of months/years as they seemed to dig themselves further into problems of their own creation. The more that this goes on the more I fear they will win their battle and win it handsomely. Mad to think that a Party that holds just over 20% of the vote in Northern Ireland should hold so much power. I mean nearly 80% didn't vote for them if you look at it from the other perspective. Crazy!
Quote from: weareros on March 09, 2023, 06:10:43 PM
Quote from: imtommygunn on March 09, 2023, 05:03:35 PM
They're shouting it's f**ked while f**king it at the same time. Clever when you think about it...
I don't think that super majority is going to be a thing. It was Ian Og taking the piss as he usually does.
While it's Paisley taking the piss, the Tories had already been discussing changing rules for a Scottish Indy referendum to a super majority. He will get support for this. The DUP and TUV have no interest in protecting the GFA. They never supported it. They have been angling for awhile to change what consent means. It means a simple majority for constitutional change and Dublin/Nationalist parties need to stay awake.
Dublin parties would be quite happy to move away from 50%+1. In fact they regularly voice such support. Micheal Martin has spoken of his desire for a wholly undemocratic and anti-GFA "parallel consent" mechanism while Varadkar has repeatedly stated the view that 50%+1 would not be a success.
Both FF and FG are vocal advocates of what essentially is a unionist veto of a pro unity vote.
Quote from: marty34 on March 09, 2023, 03:08:35 PM
Quote from: bennydorano on March 09, 2023, 03:00:07 PM
Quote from: marty34 on March 09, 2023, 02:42:04 PM
Quote from: johnnycool on March 09, 2023, 02:38:54 PM
Quote from: marty34 on March 09, 2023, 02:33:59 PM
Quote from: weareros on March 09, 2023, 01:32:59 PM
Have to watch the Tories that to appease them they don't write something into NI Act that makes a border poll harder to achieve. That ultimately is what the DUP want out of this, a rewriting of the GFA to lock North into UK. They wouldn't care if every sausage was blocked at Larne and sent back to Cumberland if they achieved that.
Yeah, I said that a while back, saying they're trying to re-write the GFA to say something similar.
Surely even this duplicitous shower of Tory scum couldn't try and do that in an international agreement OR could they?
Why couldn't they? They could put in some wishy washy new act to get this protocol framework over the line. Wouldn't surprise me.
The Torys don't care. It'll be a fudge, like the Windsor Framework - all smoke and mirrors.
No chance. UK Government would just be swopping DUP outrage for Nationalist outrage
Probably not but what would nationalists do?
Can't see them out protesting alà Bryson and the loyalists.
Even if the DUP got their way via the Windsor Framework a few weeks ago, what would nationalists do?
https://www.ft.com/content/fcf6e9f2-82fd-4a03-8945-a3679c6bc640
Even the most brilliant political strategies must ultimately be measured against their outcomes.
The DUP are going to end up going back with the GFA in place. They have no powerful allies in London or the US
What always bugs me is the hypocrisy of unionism, its as if all the evil since partition was down to the "minority" without whom this "wee country" would be paradise. It bugs me even more that no-one ever calls this out, not the media, not the SDLP, not Alliance and SF only in very limited circumstances and then very quietly. Nationalists have be tip toeing around unionism for a century, it is no longer the "minority" a term UU politicians of old used in the most perforative fashion. Equality can no longer be a one way street.
Quote from: Snapchap on March 10, 2023, 07:50:12 AM
Quote from: weareros on March 09, 2023, 06:10:43 PM
Quote from: imtommygunn on March 09, 2023, 05:03:35 PM
They're shouting it's f**ked while f**king it at the same time. Clever when you think about it...
I don't think that super majority is going to be a thing. It was Ian Og taking the piss as he usually does.
While it's Paisley taking the piss, the Tories had already been discussing changing rules for a Scottish Indy referendum to a super majority. He will get support for this. The DUP and TUV have no interest in protecting the GFA. They never supported it. They have been angling for awhile to change what consent means. It means a simple majority for constitutional change and Dublin/Nationalist parties need to stay awake.
Dublin parties would be quite happy to move away from 50%+1. In fact they regularly voice such support. Micheal Martin has spoken of his desire for a wholly undemocratic and anti-GFA "parallel consent" mechanism while Varadkar has repeatedly stated the view that 50%+1 would not be a success.
Both FF and FG are vocal advocates of what essentially is a unionist veto of a pro unity vote.
It's funny because you always hear the line about Britain don't want the north and would get rid if they could. Same with the south though , they clearly don't want the north . The people maybe, but not the establishment.
Quote from: AustinPowers on March 10, 2023, 12:34:35 PM
Quote from: Snapchap on March 10, 2023, 07:50:12 AM
Quote from: weareros on March 09, 2023, 06:10:43 PM
Quote from: imtommygunn on March 09, 2023, 05:03:35 PM
They're shouting it's f**ked while f**king it at the same time. Clever when you think about it...
I don't think that super majority is going to be a thing. It was Ian Og taking the piss as he usually does.
While it's Paisley taking the piss, the Tories had already been discussing changing rules for a Scottish Indy referendum to a super majority. He will get support for this. The DUP and TUV have no interest in protecting the GFA. They never supported it. They have been angling for awhile to change what consent means. It means a simple majority for constitutional change and Dublin/Nationalist parties need to stay awake.
Dublin parties would be quite happy to move away from 50%+1. In fact they regularly voice such support. Micheal Martin has spoken of his desire for a wholly undemocratic and anti-GFA "parallel consent" mechanism while Varadkar has repeatedly stated the view that 50%+1 would not be a success.
Both FF and FG are vocal advocates of what essentially is a unionist veto of a pro unity vote.
It's funny because you always hear the line about Britain don't want the north and would get rid if they could. Same with the south though , they clearly don't want the north . The people maybe, but not the establishment.
Next election should sort that out hopefully.
Quote from: Applesisapples on March 10, 2023, 11:01:05 AM
What always bugs me is the hypocrisy of unionism, its as if all the evil since partition was down to the "minority" without whom this "wee country" would be paradise. It bugs me even more that no-one ever calls this out, not the media, not the SDLP, not Alliance and SF only in very limited circumstances and then very quietly. Nationalists have be tip toeing around unionism for a century, it is no longer the "minority" a term UU politicians of old used in the most perforative fashion. Equality can no longer be a one way street.
The other thing that gets me is Protestant emigration and why nothing is ever done about it. They don't actually care. It doesn't make sense
Growing up It was common to hear the Catholic community referred to as the minority community, Usually by some arsehole Secretary of State. It is a very colonial phrase.
It is no longer in use for obvious reasons. There no longer is a majority community and every other reason for the existence of Northern Ireland is defunct.
The Time For Unity is Now.
Quote from: seafoid on March 10, 2023, 01:34:40 PM
Quote from: Applesisapples on March 10, 2023, 11:01:05 AM
What always bugs me is the hypocrisy of unionism, its as if all the evil since partition was down to the "minority" without whom this "wee country" would be paradise. It bugs me even more that no-one ever calls this out, not the media, not the SDLP, not Alliance and SF only in very limited circumstances and then very quietly. Nationalists have be tip toeing around unionism for a century, it is no longer the "minority" a term UU politicians of old used in the most perforative fashion. Equality can no longer be a one way street.
The other thing that gets me is Protestant emigration and why nothing is ever done about it. They don't actually care. It doesn't make sense
I'm doing a course at UU and there is 120 at a lecture on a Monday, from going through the class register and the amount of GAA tops in it each week I conservatively put it at 100/20 wee Fenians.
Quote from: pbat on March 10, 2023, 02:13:54 PM
Quote from: seafoid on March 10, 2023, 01:34:40 PM
Quote from: Applesisapples on March 10, 2023, 11:01:05 AM
What always bugs me is the hypocrisy of unionism, its as if all the evil since partition was down to the "minority" without whom this "wee country" would be paradise. It bugs me even more that no-one ever calls this out, not the media, not the SDLP, not Alliance and SF only in very limited circumstances and then very quietly. Nationalists have be tip toeing around unionism for a century, it is no longer the "minority" a term UU politicians of old used in the most perforative fashion. Equality can no longer be a one way street.
The other thing that gets me is Protestant emigration and why nothing is ever done about it. They don't actually care. It doesn't make sense
I'm doing a course at UU and there is 120 at a lecture on a Monday, from going through the class register and the amount of GAA tops in it each week I conservatively put it at 100/20 wee Fenians.
And no doubt Jim Allister will be along again soon to describe the universities in the north as "cold houses for unionism" or similar, when what he's really pissed off about is them uppity taigs daring to go and get themselves an education.
Quote from: balladmaker on March 10, 2023, 01:03:40 PM
Quote from: AustinPowers on March 10, 2023, 12:34:35 PM
Quote from: Snapchap on March 10, 2023, 07:50:12 AM
Quote from: weareros on March 09, 2023, 06:10:43 PM
Quote from: imtommygunn on March 09, 2023, 05:03:35 PM
They're shouting it's f**ked while f**king it at the same time. Clever when you think about it...
I don't think that super majority is going to be a thing. It was Ian Og taking the piss as he usually does.
While it's Paisley taking the piss, the Tories had already been discussing changing rules for a Scottish Indy referendum to a super majority. He will get support for this. The DUP and TUV have no interest in protecting the GFA. They never supported it. They have been angling for awhile to change what consent means. It means a simple majority for constitutional change and Dublin/Nationalist parties need to stay awake.
Dublin parties would be quite happy to move away from 50%+1. In fact they regularly voice such support. Micheal Martin has spoken of his desire for a wholly undemocratic and anti-GFA "parallel consent" mechanism while Varadkar has repeatedly stated the view that 50%+1 would not be a success.
Both FF and FG are vocal advocates of what essentially is a unionist veto of a pro unity vote.
It's funny because you always hear the line about Britain don't want the north and would get rid if they could. Same with the south though , they clearly don't want the north . The people maybe, but not the establishment.
Next election should sort that out hopefully.
What do you think is going to happen? :o
Quote from: gallsman on March 10, 2023, 04:18:45 PM
Quote from: pbat on March 10, 2023, 02:13:54 PM
Quote from: seafoid on March 10, 2023, 01:34:40 PM
Quote from: Applesisapples on March 10, 2023, 11:01:05 AM
What always bugs me is the hypocrisy of unionism, its as if all the evil since partition was down to the "minority" without whom this "wee country" would be paradise. It bugs me even more that no-one ever calls this out, not the media, not the SDLP, not Alliance and SF only in very limited circumstances and then very quietly. Nationalists have be tip toeing around unionism for a century, it is no longer the "minority" a term UU politicians of old used in the most perforative fashion. Equality can no longer be a one way street.
The other thing that gets me is Protestant emigration and why nothing is ever done about it. They don't actually care. It doesn't make sense
I'm doing a course at UU and there is 120 at a lecture on a Monday, from going through the class register and the amount of GAA tops in it each week I conservatively put it at 100/20 wee Fenians.
And no doubt Jim Allister will be along again soon to describe the universities in the north as "cold houses for unionism" or similar, when what he's really pissed off about is them uppity taigs daring to go and get themselves an education.
Nationalists shouldn't be pandering to unioniats now.
Get the national flag up in every nationalist controlled council now I say.
Quote from: marty34 on March 10, 2023, 05:20:47 PM
Quote from: gallsman on March 10, 2023, 04:18:45 PM
Quote from: pbat on March 10, 2023, 02:13:54 PM
Quote from: seafoid on March 10, 2023, 01:34:40 PM
Quote from: Applesisapples on March 10, 2023, 11:01:05 AM
What always bugs me is the hypocrisy of unionism, its as if all the evil since partition was down to the "minority" without whom this "wee country" would be paradise. It bugs me even more that no-one ever calls this out, not the media, not the SDLP, not Alliance and SF only in very limited circumstances and then very quietly. Nationalists have be tip toeing around unionism for a century, it is no longer the "minority" a term UU politicians of old used in the most perforative fashion. Equality can no longer be a one way street.
The other thing that gets me is Protestant emigration and why nothing is ever done about it. They don't actually care. It doesn't make sense
I'm doing a course at UU and there is 120 at a lecture on a Monday, from going through the class register and the amount of GAA tops in it each week I conservatively put it at 100/20 wee Fenians.
And no doubt Jim Allister will be along again soon to describe the universities in the north as "cold houses for unionism" or similar, when what he's really pissed off about is them uppity taigs daring to go and get themselves an education.
Nationalists shouldn't be pandering to unioniats now.
Get the national flag up in every nationalist controlled council now I say.
Then those of use who are unfortunate enough to live in a Unionist controlled district have to suffer the consequences >:(
Quote from: Brendan on March 10, 2023, 07:13:01 PM
Quote from: marty34 on March 10, 2023, 05:20:47 PM
Quote from: gallsman on March 10, 2023, 04:18:45 PM
Quote from: pbat on March 10, 2023, 02:13:54 PM
Quote from: seafoid on March 10, 2023, 01:34:40 PM
Quote from: Applesisapples on March 10, 2023, 11:01:05 AM
What always bugs me is the hypocrisy of unionism, its as if all the evil since partition was down to the "minority" without whom this "wee country" would be paradise. It bugs me even more that no-one ever calls this out, not the media, not the SDLP, not Alliance and SF only in very limited circumstances and then very quietly. Nationalists have be tip toeing around unionism for a century, it is no longer the "minority" a term UU politicians of old used in the most perforative fashion. Equality can no longer be a one way street.
The other thing that gets me is Protestant emigration and why nothing is ever done about it. They don't actually care. It doesn't make sense
I'm doing a course at UU and there is 120 at a lecture on a Monday, from going through the class register and the amount of GAA tops in it each week I conservatively put it at 100/20 wee Fenians.
And no doubt Jim Allister will be along again soon to describe the universities in the north as "cold houses for unionism" or similar, when what he's really pissed off about is them uppity taigs daring to go and get themselves an education.
Nationalists shouldn't be pandering to unioniats now.
Get the national flag up in every nationalist controlled council now I say.
Then those of use who are unfortunate enough to live in a Unionist controlled district have to suffer the consequences >:(
Marty, you're not exactly out thinking them with that.
Quote from: gallsman on March 10, 2023, 04:18:45 PM
Quote from: pbat on March 10, 2023, 02:13:54 PM
Quote from: seafoid on March 10, 2023, 01:34:40 PM
Quote from: Applesisapples on March 10, 2023, 11:01:05 AM
What always bugs me is the hypocrisy of unionism, its as if all the evil since partition was down to the "minority" without whom this "wee country" would be paradise. It bugs me even more that no-one ever calls this out, not the media, not the SDLP, not Alliance and SF only in very limited circumstances and then very quietly. Nationalists have be tip toeing around unionism for a century, it is no longer the "minority" a term UU politicians of old used in the most perforative fashion. Equality can no longer be a one way street.
The other thing that gets me is Protestant emigration and why nothing is ever done about it. They don't actually care. It doesn't make sense
I'm doing a course at UU and there is 120 at a lecture on a Monday, from going through the class register and the amount of GAA tops in it each week I conservatively put it at 100/20 wee Fenians.
And no doubt Jim Allister will be along again soon to describe the universities in the north as "cold houses for unionism" or similar, when what he's really pissed off about is them uppity taigs daring to go and get themselves an education.
A hell of a lot of students from a Protestant background go to college across the water. Not sure of the figures though
Quote from: Sportacus on March 10, 2023, 08:42:09 PM
Quote from: Brendan on March 10, 2023, 07:13:01 PM
Quote from: marty34 on March 10, 2023, 05:20:47 PM
Quote from: gallsman on March 10, 2023, 04:18:45 PM
Quote from: pbat on March 10, 2023, 02:13:54 PM
Quote from: seafoid on March 10, 2023, 01:34:40 PM
Quote from: Applesisapples on March 10, 2023, 11:01:05 AM
What always bugs me is the hypocrisy of unionism, its as if all the evil since partition was down to the "minority" without whom this "wee country" would be paradise. It bugs me even more that no-one ever calls this out, not the media, not the SDLP, not Alliance and SF only in very limited circumstances and then very quietly. Nationalists have be tip toeing around unionism for a century, it is no longer the "minority" a term UU politicians of old used in the most perforative fashion. Equality can no longer be a one way street.
The other thing that gets me is Protestant emigration and why nothing is ever done about it. They don't actually care. It doesn't make sense
I'm doing a course at UU and there is 120 at a lecture on a Monday, from going through the class register and the amount of GAA tops in it each week I conservatively put it at 100/20 wee Fenians.
And no doubt Jim Allister will be along again soon to describe the universities in the north as "cold houses for unionism" or similar, when what he's really pissed off about is them uppity taigs daring to go and get themselves an education.
Nationalists shouldn't be pandering to unioniats now.
Get the national flag up in every nationalist controlled council now I say.
Then those of use who are unfortunate enough to live in a Unionist controlled district have to suffer the consequences >:(
Marty, you're not exactly out thinking them with that.
And?
Quote from: marty34 on March 10, 2023, 09:53:57 PM
Quote from: Sportacus on March 10, 2023, 08:42:09 PM
Quote from: Brendan on March 10, 2023, 07:13:01 PM
Quote from: marty34 on March 10, 2023, 05:20:47 PM
Quote from: gallsman on March 10, 2023, 04:18:45 PM
Quote from: pbat on March 10, 2023, 02:13:54 PM
Quote from: seafoid on March 10, 2023, 01:34:40 PM
Quote from: Applesisapples on March 10, 2023, 11:01:05 AM
What always bugs me is the hypocrisy of unionism, its as if all the evil since partition was down to the "minority" without whom this "wee country" would be paradise. It bugs me even more that no-one ever calls this out, not the media, not the SDLP, not Alliance and SF only in very limited circumstances and then very quietly. Nationalists have be tip toeing around unionism for a century, it is no longer the "minority" a term UU politicians of old used in the most perforative fashion. Equality can no longer be a one way street.
The other thing that gets me is Protestant emigration and why nothing is ever done about it. They don't actually care. It doesn't make sense
I'm doing a course at UU and there is 120 at a lecture on a Monday, from going through the class register and the amount of GAA tops in it each week I conservatively put it at 100/20 wee Fenians.
And no doubt Jim Allister will be along again soon to describe the universities in the north as "cold houses for unionism" or similar, when what he's really pissed off about is them uppity taigs daring to go and get themselves an education.
Nationalists shouldn't be pandering to unioniats now.
Get the national flag up in every nationalist controlled council now I say.
Then those of use who are unfortunate enough to live in a Unionist controlled district have to suffer the consequences >:(
Marty, you're not exactly out thinking them with that.
And?
Wouldn't you like to offer something better than matching up their efforts to plaster the place with flags?
I'd like to think as a community we would approach these matters in a more mature and responsible manner than the dup & Tuv have, and unionism in general to be fair.
I think its important that we learn from the mistakes unionism has made and that we are more tolerant and inclusive when we have a majority. And I honestly think we will be. I can never see a Jim Allister/Sammy Wilson/Gregory Campbell type character dominating republican or nationalist politics.
Quote from: Sportacus on March 10, 2023, 10:14:25 PM
Quote from: marty34 on March 10, 2023, 09:53:57 PM
Quote from: Sportacus on March 10, 2023, 08:42:09 PM
Quote from: Brendan on March 10, 2023, 07:13:01 PM
Quote from: marty34 on March 10, 2023, 05:20:47 PM
Quote from: gallsman on March 10, 2023, 04:18:45 PM
Quote from: pbat on March 10, 2023, 02:13:54 PM
Quote from: seafoid on March 10, 2023, 01:34:40 PM
Quote from: Applesisapples on March 10, 2023, 11:01:05 AM
What always bugs me is the hypocrisy of unionism, its as if all the evil since partition was down to the "minority" without whom this "wee country" would be paradise. It bugs me even more that no-one ever calls this out, not the media, not the SDLP, not Alliance and SF only in very limited circumstances and then very quietly. Nationalists have be tip toeing around unionism for a century, it is no longer the "minority" a term UU politicians of old used in the most perforative fashion. Equality can no longer be a one way street.
The other thing that gets me is Protestant emigration and why nothing is ever done about it. They don't actually care. It doesn't make sense
I'm doing a course at UU and there is 120 at a lecture on a Monday, from going through the class register and the amount of GAA tops in it each week I conservatively put it at 100/20 wee Fenians.
And no doubt Jim Allister will be along again soon to describe the universities in the north as "cold houses for unionism" or similar, when what he's really pissed off about is them uppity taigs daring to go and get themselves an education.
Nationalists shouldn't be pandering to unioniats now.
Get the national flag up in every nationalist controlled council now I say.
Then those of use who are unfortunate enough to live in a Unionist controlled district have to suffer the consequences >:(
Marty, you're not exactly out thinking them with that.
And?
Wouldn't you like to offer something better than matching up their efforts to plaster the place with flags?
Sorry, I meant in the district offices only.
A hell of a lot of students from a Protestant background go to college across the water. Not sure of the figures though
[/quote]
The 2021 census confirmed that there are significantly more Catholics than Protestants in NI. The detailed in depth figures have not been released yet, but they will show that only about 33% of 18 year olds are Protestant and that well over 50% of 18 year old are Catholic. In addition Protestant schools tend to have lower educational attainment and therefore a lower percentage of Protestant kids actually go to Uni. Of those that do go to Uni they are significantly more likely to choose Scotland and England in comparison with their Catholic peers. When you add this all together the proportion of Protestant kids entering University in the North is a tiny percentage. So much so that the 'Protestant' teacher training college in Stranmillis has as many Catholic students as Protestants due to St Mary's being over subscribed. This has been going on for years but the disparity is increasing each year.
So kids that go to Inst BRA Methody Ballymena Academy Bangor Grammar and the other dozen or more Protestant schools don't go to uni?
Both my daughters went to a non catholic school but went to uni as did any of the kids that finished upper 6th as most passed their A levels. So I'm only using their years and results from that school
No, I didn't say that. Of course kids from those schools and many others go to Uni. A previous poster estimated that a lecture had a possible 100/20 split in favour of Catholic students and I'm just elaborating on how that is an entirely credible scenario.
Quote from: Feckitt on March 10, 2023, 11:26:33 PM
No, I didn't say that. Of course kids from those schools and many others go to Uni. A previous poster estimated that a lecture had a possible 100/20 split in favour of Catholic students and I'm just elaborating on how that is an entirely credible scenario.
No, but there is a perception that Protestants are thick :D
But the reality is slightly different. I went to a secondary school were no one went to college, no one. If they did it was later in life
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on March 10, 2023, 11:19:15 PM
So kids that go to Inst BRA Methody Ballymena Academy Bangor Grammar and the other dozen or more Protestant schools don't go to uni?
Of course they went to uni, the really good ones to Oxford or Cambridge, the rest to Edinburgh or St Andrews.
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on March 10, 2023, 11:31:01 PM
No, but there is a perception that Protestants are thick :D
I'm not sure that there is, not in Ireland generally. However, the Ulster variety are obstinate and unimaginative in many cases.
2/3 of kids from here who go to Uni in GB settle there. I don't care what background they are from, that's a sad situation. Partly because of a lack of funding for our universities. The grades for the likes of St Mary's are through the roof.
Quote from: Sportacus on March 11, 2023, 09:18:38 AM
2/3 of kids from here who go to Uni in GB settle there. I don't care what background they are from, that's a sad situation. Partly because of a lack of funding for our universities. The grades for the likes of St Mary's are through the roof.
It's sad but the reality is they have more career opportunities
Quote from: Sportacus on March 11, 2023, 09:18:38 AM
2/3 of kids from here who go to Uni in GB settle there. I don't care what background they are from, that's a sad situation. Partly because of a lack of funding for our universities. The grades for the likes of St Mary's are through the roof.
Would it be worth considering that a hefty percentage of those who go to uni in England, have already formed a desire to leave NI for good, and studying in England provides a suitable window of opportunities?
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on March 10, 2023, 11:19:15 PM
So kids that go to Inst BRA Methody Ballymena Academy Bangor Grammar and the other dozen or more Protestant schools don't go to uni?
Both my daughters went to a non catholic school but went to uni as did any of the kids that finished upper 6th as most passed their A levels. So I'm only using their years and results from that school
I worked in a place several years ago, time of the 11 plus, where a lot of my colleagues had kids looking to go to schools such as those highlighted. They were all paying for private tuition at the time as well to help with the test. I remember saying to a colleague one day that if their kid failed the 11 plus it was the not the end of the world as they could always go to the local high school. This was not an option for them as to all intents and purposes if their darling kids ended up going to the local high school they were f@#ked for life as they would end up mixing with the local riff raff. That is one thing I have always found with Protestants, awful snobbery within.
Quote from: thewobbler on March 11, 2023, 12:18:01 PM
Quote from: Sportacus on March 11, 2023, 09:18:38 AM
2/3 of kids from here who go to Uni in GB settle there. I don't care what background they are from, that's a sad situation. Partly because of a lack of funding for our universities. The grades for the likes of St Mary's are through the roof.
Would it be worth considering that a hefty percentage of those who go to uni in England, have already formed a desire to leave NI for good, and studying in England provides a suitable window of opportunities?
Yeah that's fair. I don't know what the split is between those who want to leave and those who are forced to leave.
Quote from: Sportacus on March 11, 2023, 12:58:38 PM
Quote from: thewobbler on March 11, 2023, 12:18:01 PM
Quote from: Sportacus on March 11, 2023, 09:18:38 AM
2/3 of kids from here who go to Uni in GB settle there. I don't care what background they are from, that's a sad situation. Partly because of a lack of funding for our universities. The grades for the likes of St Mary's are through the roof.
Would it be worth considering that a hefty percentage of those who go to uni in England, have already formed a desire to leave NI for good, and studying in England provides a suitable window of opportunities?
Yeah that's fair. I don't know what the split is between those who want to leave and those who are forced to leave.
My daughters year only one from her class stayed, they are all partying sorry studying across the water. Not forced either. Eldest daughter stayed went to queens but is a home bird though lives in Belfast, all but one of her friends went across the water also
Quote from: Sportacus on March 11, 2023, 09:18:38 AM
2/3 of kids from here who go to Uni in GB settle there. I don't care what background they are from, that's a sad situation. Partly because of a lack of funding for our universities. The grades for the likes of St Mary's are through the roof.
It is shocking that there is little interest in having enough places in NI universities proportionate to the population. Even in the 2009 recession the Dublin government actually increased the number of places, now they did that by underfunding the institutions, but they had the right idea.
Studies have shown that Protestants who go to Britain, or even Dublin, are less likely to go back than Catholics. In addition, some Catholics who study in Britain come to the 26 counties to work if there is a lack of opportunity in NI.
Jeffrey will have to get off the fence. The latest poll shows DUP voters against the Framework, but non unionists in favour
https://twitter.com/BelTel/status/1634460289620951040
- 67% of people - Yes
73% of DUP voters - No
56% UUP voters - Yes
38% of unionists - Yes
98% of Alliance/Green voters, 97% of nationalists
There was an article in Irish News recently detailing the difference between university places in North and the 26. There's a university for every 400,000 citizens in the South, in North it is 1 per million. While the "South" in the 60s - led by Patrick Hillary - were building regional technical colleges (which have now merged to become 5 technological universities), Unionists were blocking education investment East of the Bann. Too bad young Unionist supporters don't see what a terrible legacy they left when running the place.
Quote from: weareros on March 11, 2023, 04:23:57 PM
There was an article in Irish News recently detailing the difference between university places in North and the 26. There's a university for every 400,000 citizens in the South, in North it is 1 per million. While the "South" in the 60s - led by Patrick Hillary - were building regional technical colleges (which have now merged to become 5 technological universities), Unionists were blocking education investment East of the Bann. Too bad young Unionist supporters don't see what a terrible legacy they left when running the place.
But if Protestant students from those schools I mentioned had to go to college at home they would, they probably choose to go away as the places is a shambles, and they can afford it too possibly
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on March 11, 2023, 04:27:47 PM
But if Protestant students from those schools I mentioned had to go to college at home they would, they probably choose to go away as the places is a shambles, and they can afford it too possibly
We know it is a shambles. The question is why do people not aim that it not be?
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on March 11, 2023, 04:27:47 PM
Quote from: weareros on March 11, 2023, 04:23:57 PM
There was an article in Irish News recently detailing the difference between university places in North and the 26. There's a university for every 400,000 citizens in the South, in North it is 1 per million. While the "South" in the 60s - led by Patrick Hillary - were building regional technical colleges (which have now merged to become 5 technological universities), Unionists were blocking education investment East of the Bann. Too bad young Unionist supporters don't see what a terrible legacy they left when running the place.
But if Protestant students from those schools I mentioned had to go to college at home they would, they probably choose to go away as the places is a shambles, and they can afford it too possibly
Alot of students who live in Greater Belfast / North Down/South Antrim Area are not keen on going to Uni in Belfast. Part of Student Life is getting away from your locality and spreading your wings.
Quote from: armaghniac on March 11, 2023, 04:15:35 PM
Jeffrey will have to get off the fence. The latest poll shows DUP voters against the Framework, but non unionists in favour
https://twitter.com/BelTel/status/1634460289620951040
- 67% of people - Yes
73% of DUP voters - No
56% UUP voters - Yes
38% of unionists - Yes
98% of Alliance/Green voters, 97% of nationalists
Give it 15 years and half of that 73% of voters will be dead
Quote from: Mourne Red on March 11, 2023, 06:24:08 PM
Give it 15 years and half of that 73% of voters will be dead
More than three-quarters of 18 to 34-year-olds (77%) back the framework compared to 65% of 35 to 54-year-olds and 61% of those over 55.Sadly, there is bigotry among the young also, if not quite in the same proportion.
Quote from: Sportacus on March 11, 2023, 12:58:38 PM
Quote from: thewobbler on March 11, 2023, 12:18:01 PM
Quote from: Sportacus on March 11, 2023, 09:18:38 AM
2/3 of kids from here who go to Uni in GB settle there. I don't care what background they are from, that's a sad situation. Partly because of a lack of funding for our universities. The grades for the likes of St Mary's are through the roof.
Would it be worth considering that a hefty percentage of those who go to uni in England, have already formed a desire to leave NI for good, and studying in England provides a suitable window of opportunities?
Yeah that's fair. I don't know what the split is between those who want to leave and those who are forced to leave.
Can't speak to the six counties experience, but when I first moved to the US, on a grad student visa, I had no intention of staying. I was just in it for the education and the experience of somewhere else. But then life happens. 4-6 years living in a place, from when you're late teen/early 20s is formative. You make friends, fall in love, get job opportunities. Even if you originally intended to go home, that can change in a hurry.
Quote from: armaghniac on March 11, 2023, 06:35:34 PM
Quote from: Mourne Red on March 11, 2023, 06:24:08 PM
Give it 15 years and half of that 73% of voters will be dead
More than three-quarters of 18 to 34-year-olds (77%) back the framework compared to 65% of 35 to 54-year-olds and 61% of those over 55.
Sadly, there is bigotry among the young also, if not quite in the same proportion.
Going by these latest polls and the Brexit vote statistics, really starting to look like a scheme of withdrawing the vote after a certain age would be a good idea ;D ;D ;D
UK Gov telling the DUP that the WF is the only deal in town.
https://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/politics/downing-street-warns-dup-that-windsor-framework-is-best-deal-available-to-ni/1638827166.html (https://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/politics/downing-street-warns-dup-that-windsor-framework-is-best-deal-available-to-ni/1638827166.html)
Wee Jeffrey should be looking for a win in this situation but looking over his shoulder at the LCC/Bryson/Allister is never going to be a long term strategy but he hasn't the toy dolls to face them down.
Always the lowest common denominator with Unionism.
A very good summation of the quandary the DUP find itself in.
https://unherd.com/2023/03/larkins-lesson-for-northern-ireland/ (https://unherd.com/2023/03/larkins-lesson-for-northern-ireland/)
Quote from: johnnycool on March 15, 2023, 12:45:29 PM
UK Gov telling the DUP that the WF is the only deal in town.
https://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/politics/downing-street-warns-dup-that-windsor-framework-is-best-deal-available-to-ni/1638827166.html (https://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/politics/downing-street-warns-dup-that-windsor-framework-is-best-deal-available-to-ni/1638827166.html)
Wee Jeffrey should be looking for a win in this situation but looking over his shoulder at the LCC/Bryson/Allister is never going to be a long term strategy but he hasn't the toy dolls to face them down.
Basically, Sunak rang the EU and said "we both know Boris is a bollix, you revise the deal and give any flexibility you can and I'll implement it without coming back for more". That is what happened, and nobody has any interest in what the DUP think, an honest effort was made and everyone has moved on.
Quote from: armaghniac on March 15, 2023, 02:43:45 PM
Quote from: johnnycool on March 15, 2023, 12:45:29 PM
UK Gov telling the DUP that the WF is the only deal in town.
https://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/politics/downing-street-warns-dup-that-windsor-framework-is-best-deal-available-to-ni/1638827166.html (https://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/politics/downing-street-warns-dup-that-windsor-framework-is-best-deal-available-to-ni/1638827166.html)
Wee Jeffrey should be looking for a win in this situation but looking over his shoulder at the LCC/Bryson/Allister is never going to be a long term strategy but he hasn't the toy dolls to face them down.
Basically, Sunak rang the EU and said "we both know Boris is a bollix, you revise the deal and give any flexibility you can and I'll implement it without coming back for more". That is what happened, and nobody has any interest in what the DUP think, an honest effort was made and everyone has moved on.
Yeah, they had their chance. Time to move on.
A very small minority wagging the dog.
What will their ploy be now? Bluff it out to after the May elections?
Then what?
https://www.ft.com/content/67db49bd-c4e4-4c48-a6a1-206feb0b0139
The British Social Attitudes survey reported that 77 per cent of Britons wanted less immigration; over half stated they wanted it reduced by "a lot".
The DUP and the Tories rode this wave from 2016 on.
But now things are different. Inflation is out of control
Inflation is out of control? Currently falling and forecast to be 2.9% by year-end (in UK). Inflation today in Argentina is over 100%, now that is out of control.
Quote from: bennydorano on March 15, 2023, 03:54:04 PM
Inflation is out of control? Currently falling and forecast to be 2.9% by year-end (in UK). Inflation today in Argentina is over 100%, now that is out of control.
It's currently very high in the UK and in the US it is sticky and not expected to fall to the Central Bank's target .
So the Fed may have to manufacture a recession. This would be quite serious.
Quote from: marty34 on March 15, 2023, 02:49:20 PM
Quote from: armaghniac on March 15, 2023, 02:43:45 PM
Quote from: johnnycool on March 15, 2023, 12:45:29 PM
UK Gov telling the DUP that the WF is the only deal in town.
https://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/politics/downing-street-warns-dup-that-windsor-framework-is-best-deal-available-to-ni/1638827166.html (https://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/politics/downing-street-warns-dup-that-windsor-framework-is-best-deal-available-to-ni/1638827166.html)
Wee Jeffrey should be looking for a win in this situation but looking over his shoulder at the LCC/Bryson/Allister is never going to be a long term strategy but he hasn't the toy dolls to face them down.
Basically, Sunak rang the EU and said "we both know Boris is a bollix, you revise the deal and give any flexibility you can and I'll implement it without coming back for more". That is what happened, and nobody has any interest in what the DUP think, an honest effort was made and everyone has moved on.
Yeah, they had their chance. Time to move on.
A very small minority wagging the dog.
What will their ploy be now? Bluff it out to after the May elections?
Then what?
Well you can't give in now and have Biden blowing about the GFA with Michelle at his side.
Then you have the elections.
Then you have the marching season....
Quote from: bennydorano on March 15, 2023, 03:54:04 PM
Inflation is out of control? Currently falling and forecast to be 2.9% by year-end (in UK). Inflation today in Argentina is over 100%, now that is out of control.
It won't be 2.9%.
https://www.irishtimes.com/business/economy/2023/03/16/inflation-in-irish-economy-unexpectedly-rises-to-85-in-february/
They're not going back to serve under a Fenian First Minister. Northern Ireland is finished, but the only way out is democratically and quickly.
https://www.gov.uk/register-to-vote
Make sure your friends, family, neighbours and work colleagues are registered to vote. Has your daughter moved to Uni, your cousin moved house Maybe your Polish work colleague never bothered to vote? Make sure they are all registered!
https://www.gov.uk/register-to-vote
Getting Polish to vote should be a big push, quite a no here now, any where I live don't bother to vote.
When the Unity referendum comes the sizeable population originally from Central and Eastern Europe will have the opportunity to get back in the EU and therefore have closer links to their home country.
Quote from: Feckitt on March 19, 2023, 04:45:05 PM
When the Unity referendum comes the sizeable population originally from Central and Eastern Europe will have the opportunity to get back in the EU and therefore have closer links to their home country.
If they are allowed vote.
It's decision time now for Donaldson and the DUP. I can't see the leadership of the party publicly supporting the WF which could then leave them in an even more perilous position. At every juncture they have managed to make things even worse for themselves as they are petrified of being lundified. I think Peter Robinson is one of the few in the party who has a strategic brain and will recognise the opportunity that the WF offers to unionists. But he is only one of 8 people and the threat of the TUV/LCC/OO axis looms large over any decision to be made.
Quote from: yellowcard on March 19, 2023, 10:08:19 PM
It's decision time now for Donaldson and the DUP. I can't see the leadership of the party publicly supporting the WF which could then leave them in an even more perilous position. At every juncture they have managed to make things even worse for themselves as they are petrified of being lundified. I think Peter Robinson is one of the few in the party who has a strategic brain and will recognise the opportunity that the WF offers to unionists. But he is only one of 8 people and the threat of the TUV/LCC/OO axis looms large over any decision to be made.
Decision time would suggest that Donaldson has options.
If he has 3 options then he has 3.
If he has 2 options then he has 2.
If he has 1 option then he has no option.
He will reject the WF, and say that he is passing the problem back to Rishi. He will then tell his electorate that Rishi has messed up and Rishi has to find a solution.
Looking like no Stormont for 2 or 3 years.
Quote from: Orior on March 19, 2023, 10:31:21 PM
Quote from: yellowcard on March 19, 2023, 10:08:19 PM
It's decision time now for Donaldson and the DUP. I can't see the leadership of the party publicly supporting the WF which could then leave them in an even more perilous position. At every juncture they have managed to make things even worse for themselves as they are petrified of being lundified. I think Peter Robinson is one of the few in the party who has a strategic brain and will recognise the opportunity that the WF offers to unionists. But he is only one of 8 people and the threat of the TUV/LCC/OO axis looms large over any decision to be made.
Decision time would suggest that Donaldson has options.
If he has 3 options then he has 3.
If he has 2 options then he has 2.
If he has 1 option then he has no option.
He will reject the WF, and say that he is passing the problem back to Rishi. He will then tell his electorate that Rishi has messed up and Rishi has to find a solution.
Looking like no Stormont for 2 or 3 years.
Conservative Party is the most successful party in World Politics for a reason.. They will string this out and then next year when they're out of gov it will be a Labour problem. This is when Labour will probably f**k up and do something that'll threaten the union and there the conservatives slogan will be run on in the 2028 election to save the Union and our Country vote Tory. They've already started with going after refugees, they know they lost 2024 so it's all about getting back asap
Quote from: Orior on March 19, 2023, 10:31:21 PM
Quote from: yellowcard on March 19, 2023, 10:08:19 PM
It's decision time now for Donaldson and the DUP. I can't see the leadership of the party publicly supporting the WF which could then leave them in an even more perilous position. At every juncture they have managed to make things even worse for themselves as they are petrified of being lundified. I think Peter Robinson is one of the few in the party who has a strategic brain and will recognise the opportunity that the WF offers to unionists. But he is only one of 8 people and the threat of the TUV/LCC/OO axis looms large over any decision to be made.
Decision time would suggest that Donaldson has options.
If he has 3 options then he has 3.
If he has 2 options then he has 2.
If he has 1 option then he has no option.
He will reject the WF, and say that he is passing the problem back to Rishi. He will then tell his electorate that Rishi has messed up and Rishi has to find a solution.
Looking like no Stormont for 2 or 3 years.
He could well reject it but he has set up a committee to avoid him personally taking the blame for whatever the outcome. How can he square the circle of pulling MLAs out of Stormont (which affects the lives of the people living here) in protest at the protocol yet still have MPs parading around Westminster which is where any objections should be aimed. It's all a smokescreen.
Also Sunak doesn't have to find any solution, it will comfortably get through a vote this week so what do the DUP do then. The likelihood is that they will be facing direct rule with decision making being taken out of their hands with a soon to be Labour government in the UK and a probable SF government in the south. Strategically it is in unionisms best interests to get Stormont back up running again.
Quote from: yellowcard on March 19, 2023, 11:13:49 PM
Quote from: Orior on March 19, 2023, 10:31:21 PM
Quote from: yellowcard on March 19, 2023, 10:08:19 PM
It's decision time now for Donaldson and the DUP. I can't see the leadership of the party publicly supporting the WF which could then leave them in an even more perilous position. At every juncture they have managed to make things even worse for themselves as they are petrified of being lundified. I think Peter Robinson is one of the few in the party who has a strategic brain and will recognise the opportunity that the WF offers to unionists. But he is only one of 8 people and the threat of the TUV/LCC/OO axis looms large over any decision to be made.
Decision time would suggest that Donaldson has options.
If he has 3 options then he has 3.
If he has 2 options then he has 2.
If he has 1 option then he has no option.
He will reject the WF, and say that he is passing the problem back to Rishi. He will then tell his electorate that Rishi has messed up and Rishi has to find a solution.
Looking like no Stormont for 2 or 3 years.
He could well reject it but he has set up a committee to avoid him personally taking the blame for whatever the outcome. How can he square the circle of pulling MLAs out of Stormont (which affects the lives of the people living here) in protest at the protocol yet still have MPs parading around Westminster which is where any objections should be aimed. It's all a smokescreen.
Also Sunak doesn't have to find any solution, it will comfortably get through a vote this week so what do the DUP do then. The likelihood is that they will be facing direct rule with decision making being taken out of their hands with a soon to be Labour government in the UK and a probable SF government in the south. Strategically it is in unionisms best interests to get Stormont back up running again.
Always looking over their shoulder at wee Jimbob so they'll probably not commit on the framework. Drag it out a bit until the election.
The TUV could pick up a good few council seats at the expense of the DUP.
Quote from: Mourne Red on March 19, 2023, 11:12:01 PM
Quote from: Orior on March 19, 2023, 10:31:21 PM
Quote from: yellowcard on March 19, 2023, 10:08:19 PM
It's decision time now for Donaldson and the DUP. I can't see the leadership of the party publicly supporting the WF which could then leave them in an even more perilous position. At every juncture they have managed to make things even worse for themselves as they are petrified of being lundified. I think Peter Robinson is one of the few in the party who has a strategic brain and will recognise the opportunity that the WF offers to unionists. But he is only one of 8 people and the threat of the TUV/LCC/OO axis looms large over any decision to be made.
Decision time would suggest that Donaldson has options.
If he has 3 options then he has 3.
If he has 2 options then he has 2.
If he has 1 option then he has no option.
He will reject the WF, and say that he is passing the problem back to Rishi. He will then tell his electorate that Rishi has messed up and Rishi has to find a solution.
Looking like no Stormont for 2 or 3 years.
Conservative Party is the most successful party in World Politics for a reason.. They will string this out and then next year when they're out of gov it will be a Labour problem. This is when Labour will probably f**k up and do something that'll threaten the union and there the conservatives slogan will be run on in the 2028 election to save the Union and our Country vote Tory. They've already started with going after refugees, they know they lost 2024 so it's all about getting back asap
Yup sounds about right
But surely the Brits will say to themselves , never vote those Tory b*******s again!!! I mean , not everyone was around during the thatcher years and the shit that she did.. but by Christ they should remember these Tory years!
Quote from: yellowcard on March 19, 2023, 10:08:19 PM
It's decision time now for Donaldson and the DUP. I can't see the leadership of the party publicly supporting the WF which could then leave them in an even more perilous position. At every juncture they have managed to make things even worse for themselves as they are petrified of being lundified. I think Peter Robinson is one of the few in the party who has a strategic brain and will recognise the opportunity that the WF offers to unionists. But he is only one of 8 people and the threat of the TUV/LCC/OO axis looms large over any decision to be made.
That's it in a nutshell. The hot potato that is the unionist leadership . Say no to everything. Replace, and repeat
Quote from: AustinPowers on March 19, 2023, 11:50:00 PM
Quote from: yellowcard on March 19, 2023, 10:08:19 PM
It's decision time now for Donaldson and the DUP. I can't see the leadership of the party publicly supporting the WF which could then leave them in an even more perilous position. At every juncture they have managed to make things even worse for themselves as they are petrified of being lundified. I think Peter Robinson is one of the few in the party who has a strategic brain and will recognise the opportunity that the WF offers to unionists. But he is only one of 8 people and the threat of the TUV/LCC/OO axis looms large over any decision to be made.
That's it in a nutshell. The hot potato that is the unionist leadership . Say no to everything. Replace, and repeat
The DUP isn't unionism
Quote from: seafoid on March 20, 2023, 08:16:43 AM
Quote from: AustinPowers on March 19, 2023, 11:50:00 PM
Quote from: yellowcard on March 19, 2023, 10:08:19 PM
It's decision time now for Donaldson and the DUP. I can't see the leadership of the party publicly supporting the WF which could then leave them in an even more perilous position. At every juncture they have managed to make things even worse for themselves as they are petrified of being lundified. I think Peter Robinson is one of the few in the party who has a strategic brain and will recognise the opportunity that the WF offers to unionists. But he is only one of 8 people and the threat of the TUV/LCC/OO axis looms large over any decision to be made.
That's it in a nutshell. The hot potato that is the unionist leadership . Say no to everything. Replace, and repeat
The DUP isn't unionism
Unionism always lurches to the right. There's always a bogey man going to make a lundy of anyone who deviates from the norm.
Look at it 25 years ago, same thing. Now it's wee Jim screaming from the sidelines.
It's the way unionism works.
i actually think the tories will be back in again around 2029 and they might still pull of the upset and win next election labour will be attack by the right wing media every day and the dm and express readers will probably vote tory again.
There will be a massive smear campaign against labour and starmer which will crank up in the not that distant future. They are far from gone yet.
Quote from: Mourne Red on March 19, 2023, 11:12:01 PM
Quote from: Orior on March 19, 2023, 10:31:21 PM
Quote from: yellowcard on March 19, 2023, 10:08:19 PM
It's decision time now for Donaldson and the DUP. I can't see the leadership of the party publicly supporting the WF which could then leave them in an even more perilous position. At every juncture they have managed to make things even worse for themselves as they are petrified of being lundified. I think Peter Robinson is one of the few in the party who has a strategic brain and will recognise the opportunity that the WF offers to unionists. But he is only one of 8 people and the threat of the TUV/LCC/OO axis looms large over any decision to be made.
Decision time would suggest that Donaldson has options.
If he has 3 options then he has 3.
If he has 2 options then he has 2.
If he has 1 option then he has no option.
He will reject the WF, and say that he is passing the problem back to Rishi. He will then tell his electorate that Rishi has messed up and Rishi has to find a solution.
Looking like no Stormont for 2 or 3 years.
Conservative Party is the most successful party in World Politics for a reason.. They will string this out and then next year when they're out of gov it will be a Labour problem. This is when Labour will probably f**k up and do something that'll threaten the union and there the conservatives slogan will be run on in the 2028 election to save the Union and our Country vote Tory. They've already started with going after refugees, they know they lost 2024 so it's all about getting back asap
Two reasons for that and neither has much to do with their political acumen. The voting system itself and a right wing media press interconnected to the Tory political class who control and manipulate public opinion.
They're rejecting it
https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2023/mar/20/dup-ian-paisley-vote-against-northern-ireland-post-brexit-deal?CMP=Share_AndroidApp_Other (https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2023/mar/20/dup-ian-paisley-vote-against-northern-ireland-post-brexit-deal?CMP=Share_AndroidApp_Other)
Will have to be joint authority now surely as an election won't change anything and there won't be any more negotiations with the EU.
Another own goal, genuinely must take a serious effort to be on the wrong side of everything constantly.
No more negotiations to be had, the Gov't going to force it through regardless.
Quote from: NAG1 on March 20, 2023, 01:54:37 PM
Another own goal, genuinely must take a serious effort to be on the wrong side of everything constantly.
No more negotiations to be had, the Gov't going to force it through regardless.
Touch of arrogance from Mr Donaldson, expecting Sunak and the EU to re-open the talks just to appease him and his ever decreasing cabal.
What now for the Assembly, Is it Joint authority with major inputs from the Irish Tánaiste?
Quote from: tyrone08 on March 20, 2023, 01:46:36 PM
Will have to be joint authority now surely as an election won't change anything and there won't be any more negotiations with the EU.
This 100%.
Joint authority, otherwise the last 55 years has been a waste of time.
Quote from: johnnycool on March 20, 2023, 02:00:13 PM
Quote from: NAG1 on March 20, 2023, 01:54:37 PM
Another own goal, genuinely must take a serious effort to be on the wrong side of everything constantly.
No more negotiations to be had, the Gov't going to force it through regardless.
Touch of arrogance from Mr Donaldson, expecting Sunak and the EU to re-open the talks just to appease him and his ever decreasing cabal.
What now for the Assembly, Is it Joint authority with major inputs from the Irish Tánaiste?
Well , I'm in need of some rubble for a laneway so I'm hoping they knock down Stormont
Only thing is , I could no longer complain about Stormont never having done anything for me
Quote from: AustinPowers on March 20, 2023, 02:11:07 PM
Quote from: johnnycool on March 20, 2023, 02:00:13 PM
Quote from: NAG1 on March 20, 2023, 01:54:37 PM
Another own goal, genuinely must take a serious effort to be on the wrong side of everything constantly.
No more negotiations to be had, the Gov't going to force it through regardless.
Touch of arrogance from Mr Donaldson, expecting Sunak and the EU to re-open the talks just to appease him and his ever decreasing cabal.
What now for the Assembly, Is it Joint authority with major inputs from the Irish Tánaiste?
Well , I'm in need of some rubble for a laneway so I'm hoping they knock down Stormont
Only thing is , I could no longer complain about Stormont never having done anything for me
I've heard some of the road crews sell off the old tarmac they've lifted up. You can buy it, get it levelled and roll the shíte out of it in the hot weather and it's meant to be the dogs danglies for a laneway.
Knocking down the home of the famed Dublin hurler is a bit much for your lane all the same.
Quote from: johnnycool on March 20, 2023, 02:00:13 PM
Quote from: NAG1 on March 20, 2023, 01:54:37 PM
Another own goal, genuinely must take a serious effort to be on the wrong side of everything constantly.
No more negotiations to be had, the Gov't going to force it through regardless.
Touch of arrogance from Mr Donaldson, expecting Sunak and the EU to re-open the talks just to appease him and his ever decreasing cabal.
What now for the Assembly, Is it Joint authority with major inputs from the Irish Tánaiste?
Abolish all MLAs salary immediately. If they fail to go back into government then Stormont is effectively finished. After that politicians here will have no control over our own affairs. It will be some form of joint authority although it mightn't be worded as such.
I still think Donaldson is too fearful of the consequences of not going back into Stormont and that they will find some form of workaround. It does show the folly of painting himself into a corner in pulling down Stormont to begin with though.
Quote from: yellowcard on March 20, 2023, 02:17:02 PM
Quote from: johnnycool on March 20, 2023, 02:00:13 PM
Quote from: NAG1 on March 20, 2023, 01:54:37 PM
Another own goal, genuinely must take a serious effort to be on the wrong side of everything constantly.
No more negotiations to be had, the Gov't going to force it through regardless.
Touch of arrogance from Mr Donaldson, expecting Sunak and the EU to re-open the talks just to appease him and his ever decreasing cabal.
What now for the Assembly, Is it Joint authority with major inputs from the Irish Tánaiste?
Abolish all MLAs salary immediately. If they fail to go back into government then Stormont is effectively finished. After that politicians here will have no control over our own affairs. It will be some form of joint authority although it mightn't be worded as such.
I still think Donaldson is too fearful of the consequences of not going back into Stormont and that they will find some form of workaround. It does show the folly of painting himself into a corner in pulling down Stormont to begin with though.
Yes, I'd pull the MLA's salaries as a starting point and then set a date for late summer for re-elections.
Is there no way they can just pull the DUP MLA salaries?
To your point about Donaldson and arrogance Donaldson is arrogance personified. Even the look of him is arrogant.
As many would say if the UK government ploughs on then what have they achieved here. They have basically proved or made here unworkable.
Quote from: johnnycool on March 20, 2023, 02:00:13 PM
Quote from: NAG1 on March 20, 2023, 01:54:37 PM
Another own goal, genuinely must take a serious effort to be on the wrong side of everything constantly.
No more negotiations to be had, the Gov't going to force it through regardless.
Touch of arrogance from Mr Donaldson, expecting Sunak and the EU to re-open the talks just to appease him and his ever decreasing cabal.
What now for the Assembly, Is it Joint authority with major inputs from the Irish Tánaiste?
Can't see the uk government going back to the eu or the eu even encountering any change either.
Last chance saloon.
would joint authority not mean a loyalist return to war.
Quote from: Eire90 on March 20, 2023, 04:21:16 PM
would joint authority not mean a loyalist return to war.
They'll go clean mad but they've only themselves to blame!
there's no way the EU and the british government would agree to exactly what the DUP want. In fact tbh they don't even know what they want or they know what they want can't be articulated in public without them looking like a very backward bunch of bigots.
If they agree to what the DUP want, aka a hard border, then that would mean a republican return to war too you would imagine.
This all boils down to one thing and one thing only - a nationalist first minister. That's the long and short or it.
The Protocol was about for a good while before the unionists decided to tackle it head on.
I wonder why?
So other than the DUP and a few cranks in the Tory party, will anyone else vote against it? It's going to be ridiculously one sided and Jeff et al will look like clowns yet again.
It is just a token. They can show they voted against the perfidious WA but the Tories stabbed them in the back so they need to go into Stormont to stop RishIRA Sunak and his ToIRA party from doing it again.
Quote from: screenexile on March 20, 2023, 04:22:05 PM
Quote from: Eire90 on March 20, 2023, 04:21:16 PM
would joint authority not mean a loyalist return to war.
They'll go clean mad but they've only themselves to blame!
We keep hearing about this loyalist return to violence. Who are they going to be waging this war against? Just an excuse for them to start murdering innocent Catholics.
Quote from: marty34 on March 20, 2023, 04:35:00 PM
This all boils down to one thing and one thing only - a nationalist first minister. That's the long and short or it.
The Protocol was about for a good while before the unionists decided to tackle it head on.
I wonder why?
I agree totally. The WF has 3% exposure to EU law. Whining about it does not make sense except as a way of avoiding going into government under SF.
Quote from: 93-DY-SAM on March 20, 2023, 04:46:42 PM
Quote from: screenexile on March 20, 2023, 04:22:05 PM
Quote from: Eire90 on March 20, 2023, 04:21:16 PM
would joint authority not mean a loyalist return to war.
They'll go clean mad but they've only themselves to blame!
We keep hearing about this loyalist return to violence. Who are they going to be waging this war against? Just an excuse for them to start murdering innocent Catholics.
The threat of loyalist violence does get overstated somewhat. It's like the lad in school that keeps on telling you he is going to hit you but never actually does anything about it. Its largely used for political leverage as was the case with the flag protests, the riots and the protocol protests. If they start up again it would only bring a lot more heat on them and shine a light on their other more nefarious activities which are more important to those at the top of those organisations. Those groups like to create intimidation and fear and are more concerned with controlling communities and making money from extortion, racketeering and the sale of narcotics.
Quote from: yellowcard on March 20, 2023, 05:28:28 PM
Quote from: 93-DY-SAM on March 20, 2023, 04:46:42 PM
Quote from: screenexile on March 20, 2023, 04:22:05 PM
Quote from: Eire90 on March 20, 2023, 04:21:16 PM
would joint authority not mean a loyalist return to war.
They'll go clean mad but they've only themselves to blame!
We keep hearing about this loyalist return to violence. Who are they going to be waging this war against? Just an excuse for them to start murdering innocent Catholics.
The threat of loyalist violence does get overstated somewhat. It's like the lad in school that keeps on telling you he is going to hit you but never actually does anything about it. Its largely used for political leverage as was the case with the flag protests, the riots and the protocol protests. If they start up again it would only bring a lot more heat on them and shine a light on their other more nefarious activities which are more important to those at the top of those organisations. Those groups like to create intimidation and fear and are more concerned with controlling communities and making money from extortion, racketeering and the sale of narcotics.
They're going to march on their Sovereign Gov in Westminster who exercised it's new found sovereign powers annexing part of the UK into the clutches of the EU and the dirty Taigs in Dublin.
Since day one it has been an over amplified minority wrt loyalists and violence.
I would expect some of them might get uppety but the vocal minority are pawns for Habib and all those other clowns who blatantly stand to make money from Brexit.
Quote from: AustinPowers on March 20, 2023, 02:11:07 PM
Well , I'm in need of some rubble for a laneway so I'm hoping they knock down Stormont
I wouldn't recommend it.
First bit of pressure and ye just know it'd collapse on ye.
Then you'd have to do it all over again.
https://www.irishtimes.com/opinion/2023/03/18/boardrooms-of-corporate-america-gearing-up-to-support-peace-again/
The message that the North can look forward to a "decade of investment" if political stability returns is being made publicly and – rather more forcefully, one imagines – privately. The boardrooms of corporate America are gearing up again. The three governments – once again in lockstep, at least on this issue – are pressing the point home. If the institutions are revived and function effectively and sensibly, then there will be tangible economic benefits for Northern Ireland and its people. But to unlock this, the DUP needs to accept the Windsor Framework .
The DUP won't go back to Stormont so as to pressure the British government to fix the Windsor Agreement.
But they're happy with direct rule by the same British government that agreed the Windsor Agreement with the EU.
Nice one Jeff.
Does anyone know what loyalists are actually loyal to? They aren't loyal to the UK government because they don't listen to what they say to them and don't agree with any laws they make for NI e.g. abortion laws. They aren't loyal to the crown as they are going against this Windsor framework that has King Charles blessing.
Quote from: Nanderson on March 20, 2023, 08:46:36 PM
Does anyone know what loyalists are actually loyal to? They aren't loyal to the UK government because they don't listen to what they say to them and don't agree with any laws they make for NI e.g. abortion laws. They aren't loyal to the crown as they are going against this Windsor framework that has King Charles blessing.
For Drugs and Ulster
What a carry on. Honestly don't care much about politics but this crowd are something else. Don't give one shit about any one of us or helping a soul other than themselves. Really sad and with young kids now pisses me of even more so.
Quote from: Brendan on March 20, 2023, 08:54:26 PM
Quote from: Nanderson on March 20, 2023, 08:46:36 PM
Does anyone know what loyalists are actually loyal to? They aren't loyal to the UK government because they don't listen to what they say to them and don't agree with any laws they make for NI e.g. abortion laws. They aren't loyal to the crown as they are going against this Windsor framework that has King Charles blessing.
For Drugs and Ulster
6/9ths of Ulster
Stormont Brake vote today in Westminster, DUP not supporting along with the intellectual heavyweights in the ERG led by Mark Francois.. Labour will see this over the line as much as its being seen as an indicative vote on the full Windsor Framework, but too many rebels will mean Sunaks time is limited.
Quote from: johnnycool on March 22, 2023, 12:15:11 PM
Stormont Brake vote today in Westminster, DUP not supporting along with the intellectual heavyweights in the ERG led by Mark Francois.. Labour will see this over the line as much as its being seen as an indicative vote on the full Windsor Framework, but too many rebels will mean Sunaks time is limited.
Johnson not voting for an agreement that builds on his own "oven ready" agreement says all you need to know about these self serving c***ts.
Soft as shite Sunak should enforce a 3 line whip and any "rebels" fucked out of the party.
Quote from: trailer on March 22, 2023, 12:20:09 PM
Quote from: johnnycool on March 22, 2023, 12:15:11 PM
Stormont Brake vote today in Westminster, DUP not supporting along with the intellectual heavyweights in the ERG led by Mark Francois.. Labour will see this over the line as much as its being seen as an indicative vote on the full Windsor Framework, but too many rebels will mean Sunaks time is limited.
Johnson not voting for an agreement that builds on his own "oven ready" agreement says all you need to know about these self serving c***ts.
At this point I think Johnson is a Labour plant.. No way does he think the public will go for him as a PM again, just ruining the Tories - Great too see all the same
Quote from: johnnycool on March 22, 2023, 12:15:11 PM
Stormont Brake vote today in Westminster, DUP not supporting along with the intellectual heavyweights in the ERG led by Mark Francois.. Labour will see this over the line as much as its being seen as an indicative vote on the full Windsor Framework, but too many rebels will mean Sunaks time is limited.
The Tories have moved on
Only 29 votes against the deal, take the 8 dupers out that only leaves 21 Tory rebels. Shows over, deal done.
The show is well and truly over for wee Jeff and the lads.
He either toes the line or its direct rule.
The last kick of a dying party will want to cause carnage here
At least Jim Shannon is using his influence at Westminster for good things. Putting a motion in to honour Dolly Parton on the 50th anniversary for one of her songs ::)
Only 29 against, that is a laughable figure. Honestly thought there would be a sizeable minority that could give some, albeit minor, credence to the DUP position but it's over for them
What's next though, I just don't know. Think the GFA is done, we need to move to a coalition of the willing
Yeah I was a bit worried too. That's them put in their box, though probably briefly, but there'll be plenty of noise from them yet.
I expected well over 100 rebels from the talk all week. We could probably name the 29 as there seemed to be that many publicly saying they would go against it!
Total embarrassment for the DUP and ERG (how many members do they actually have in reality?!)
Quote from: square_ball on March 22, 2023, 02:51:55 PM
At least Jim Shannon is using his influence at Westminster for good things. Putting a motion in to honour Dolly Parton on the 50th anniversary for one of her songs ::)
This should be in the WTF category.......what an absolute clown, sums up the calibre of politician in this country. This is like something you would expect the Healy Reas to come out with.
WTF is the only response to that
What are these guys actually smoking
Quote from: RedHand88 on March 22, 2023, 03:14:53 PM
I expected well over 100 rebels from the talk all week. We could probably name the 29 as there seemed to be that many publicly saying they would go against it!
Total embarrassment for the DUP and ERG (how many members do they actually have in reality?!)
8 DUP, Johnson, Truss, JRM and Patel, all stated they were voting against.
On GMU this morning, they'd a fella from the ERG on saying that they had "dozens of members", and they wouldn't recommend voting for the Framework, however all members had a free choice on what way to vote.
So it looks like most of those members decided to vote for the framework.
I called it a couple if days ago. It was always going to be humiliating. How can they keep at this shit when they get hammered in the UK parliament and on top of that a poll in NI claims only 16% of the population are against the new protocol. Surely to fook the game is up, enough of the wankers
This framework is all bullshit anyway. The real problem is as obvious as the nose on your face. THEY WON'T SHARE POWER WITH A FENIAN FIRST MINISTER
Quote from: smort on March 22, 2023, 03:03:45 PM
Only 29 against, that is a laughable figure. Honestly thought there would be a sizeable minority that could give some, albeit minor, credence to the DUP position but it's over for them
What's next though, I just don't know. Think the GFA is done, we need to move to a coalition of the willing
Yup, should have happened 20 years ago. If Stormont is to function in any way , that is what needs to happen . Otherwise , knock it down (I still need that rubble)
Ian Og also using his time wisely at Westminster by getting stickers made up. These cnuts need chased. Unfortunately they are are going to be around for the foreseeable.
https://twitter.com/naomi_long/status/1638543409693483008?s=20
Quote from: square_ball on March 22, 2023, 02:51:55 PM
At least Jim Shannon is using his influence at Westminster for good things. Putting a motion in to honour Dolly Parton on the 50th anniversary for one of her songs ::)
Jim is my MP and he really is
SPECIAL. ;)
Only 22 Conservative MPs voted against the Stormont Brake. The Tories have moved on, just a cabal of Johnston, Truss, Rees Mogg, Francois and a few other headers left. DUP are in no man's land.
Quote from: Feckitt on March 22, 2023, 03:38:25 PM
This framework is all bullshit anyway. The real problem is as obvious as the nose on your face. THEY WON'T SHARE POWER WITH A FENIAN FIRST MINISTER
Of course, it is. If you go back through this thread (and the old DUP thread which BTW did we ever figure out what happened it?) you'll see people say this time and time again. The DUP are supremacists with a supremacist history and mindset. That will never change so long as they exist. I don't know why they are not being called out on this by journalists instead of being facilitated by the likes of Nolan etc. They want a wall around the border which could never be high enough or wide enough armed with Brit soldiers to keep pesky Fenians in their place. They thought Brexit would deliver this. A shower of more hateful c***ts you will be hard-pressed to find anywhere else.
Quote from: Sportacus on March 22, 2023, 04:05:35 PM
Only 22 Conservative MPs voted against the Stormont Brake. The Tories have moved on, just a cabal of Johnston, Truss, Rees Mogg, Francois and a few other headers left. DUP are in no man's land.
The lunatic fringe. They will become increasingly isolated. It's all games anyway with the DUP. They'll string it out for a while and eventually come back.
Quote from: Armamike on March 22, 2023, 04:11:16 PM
Quote from: Sportacus on March 22, 2023, 04:05:35 PM
Only 22 Conservative MPs voted against the Stormont Brake. The Tories have moved on, just a cabal of Johnston, Truss, Rees Mogg, Francois and a few other headers left. DUP are in no man's land.
The lunatic fringe. They will become increasingly isolated. It's all games anyway with the DUP. They'll string it out for a while and eventually come back.
I agree. The only thing on the mind of the average Tory MP is saving their skin in next years election and wasting time on the DUP isn't in the equation. Jeffrey still on a hook, all they are doing is hanging onto their hard core support but it's all tactics and no strategy.
JC they are talking about this Shannon motion on Evening Extra! It's ludicrous!
Quote from: smort on March 22, 2023, 04:31:27 PM
JC they are talking about this Shannon motion on Evening Extra! It's ludicrous!
The man hasn't got the brains to tie his own shoe laces... A stooge if ever there was one but they needed someone quick after Iris was playing offside.
Not that big a stooge looking at his expenses :( Bigger expenses than Ian Og IIRC.
Quote from: imtommygunn on March 22, 2023, 04:43:44 PM
Not that big a stooge looking at his expenses :( Bigger expenses than Ian Og IIRC.
Aye, he knows how to line his pockets, always did.
I'd always had him down as a farm labourer but then noticed his dodgyness and this came back to me;
"Shannon was educated at Ballywalter Primary School and Coleraine Academical Institution. He was a soldier in the Ulster Defence Regiment in 1973–1975 and 1976–1977 and was awarded the General Service Medal. He served in the Royal Artillery TA from 1977 to 1988. He was expelled from the Territorial Army along with two of his colleagues after the theft of a replica Blowpipe missile by loyalists associated with the Ulster Resistance paramilitary group. The group intented to give the missile system to Apartheid South Africa in exchange for weapons.[3] He is a member of the Orange Order and Apprentice Boys of Derry."
Quote from: square_ball on March 22, 2023, 02:51:55 PM
At least Jim Shannon is using his influence at Westminster for good things. Putting a motion in to honour Dolly Parton on the 50th anniversary for one of her songs ::)
Deliberately done to try and deflect from the resounding defeat of the WF vote. Taking the people for fools.
Quote from: yellowcard on March 22, 2023, 05:29:19 PM
Quote from: square_ball on March 22, 2023, 02:51:55 PM
At least Jim Shannon is using his influence at Westminster for good things. Putting a motion in to honour Dolly Parton on the 50th anniversary for one of her songs ::)
Deliberately done to try and deflect from the resounding defeat of the WF vote. Taking the people for fools.
You're giving Jim too much credit, trust me.
Quote from: johnnycool on March 22, 2023, 05:51:22 PM
Quote from: yellowcard on March 22, 2023, 05:29:19 PM
Quote from: square_ball on March 22, 2023, 02:51:55 PM
At least Jim Shannon is using his influence at Westminster for good things. Putting a motion in to honour Dolly Parton on the 50th anniversary for one of her songs ::)
Deliberately done to try and deflect from the resounding defeat of the WF vote. Taking the people for fools.
You're giving Jim too much credit, trust me.
Maybe so, he does come across as a bit of a simpleton alright. Lacking in self awareness and utterly shameless are traits most associated with Wilson, Paisley, Poots and Foster so perhaps Shannon needs to be added to the list as well.
Quote from: yellowcard on March 22, 2023, 05:29:19 PM
Quote from: square_ball on March 22, 2023, 02:51:55 PM
At least Jim Shannon is using his influence at Westminster for good things. Putting a motion in to honour Dolly Parton on the 50th anniversary for one of her songs ::)
Deliberately done to try and deflect from the resounding defeat of the WF vote. Taking the people for fools.
Rather than deflect, somehow it reminds me they made tits of themselves.
Taxpayers are the fools not Jim Shannon.
It's his voters not tax payers. These pricks know how to milk things unfortunately.
What happens next?
More theatrics.
DUP could safely vote against the WF Bill today in the knowledge it would safely pass, they can now tell the electorate how hardcore they are. Hard to see Stormont up and running again anytime soon as the DUP will likely be looking some secondary legislation passed in the HOC in regards to safeguarding NI's place within the UK, as the withdrawal agreement superceded the Act of Union. They'll be pushing to legally nail down what the Stormont brake will look like in practice too I'd imagine.
Varadkar was quoted in today's Irish Times saying that Stormont can probably be reopened without the DUP.
Quote from: seafoid on March 22, 2023, 09:12:01 PM
Varadkar was quoted in today's Irish Times saying that Stormont can probably be reopened without the DUP.
Oh flip. That'll get the hackles up of the low-brow knuckle-dragging king-loving irish-hating loyalists.
Quote from: Orior on March 22, 2023, 09:26:31 PM
Quote from: seafoid on March 22, 2023, 09:12:01 PM
Varadkar was quoted in today's Irish Times saying that Stormont can probably be reopened without the DUP.
Oh flip. That'll get the hackles up of the low-brow knuckle-dragging king-loving irish-hating loyalists.
The DUP tore the arse out of it
The DUP has bigger fish to fry. Jim Shannon is busy going round Westminster trying to get support for his Early Day Motion to mark the 50th anniversary of Dolly Parton's song 'I Will Always Love You'. You couldn't make it up.
Quote from: Dougal Maguire on March 22, 2023, 10:05:56 PM
The DUP has bigger fish to fry. Jim Shannon is busy going round Westminster trying to get support for his Early Day Motion to mark the 50th anniversary of Dolly Parton's song 'I Will Always Love You'. You couldn't make it up.
The DUP love their country.
Bryson talking about war if stormont returns
Quote from: Eire90 on March 23, 2023, 06:15:42 AM
Bryson talking about war if stormont returns
Wouldn't listen to a thing that wee scrote says
Quote from: armaghniac on March 22, 2023, 10:43:50 PM
Quote from: Dougal Maguire on March 22, 2023, 10:05:56 PM
The DUP has bigger fish to fry. Jim Shannon is busy going round Westminster trying to get support for his Early Day Motion to mark the 50th anniversary of Dolly Parton's song 'I Will Always Love You'. You couldn't make it up.
The DUP love their country.
Very underrated response that. ;D
Time to replace the Wolfe Tones with Dolly after championship win TikTok videos.
Quote from: armaghniac on March 22, 2023, 10:43:50 PM
Quote from: Dougal Maguire on March 22, 2023, 10:05:56 PM
The DUP has bigger fish to fry. Jim Shannon is busy going round Westminster trying to get support for his Early Day Motion to mark the 50th anniversary of Dolly Parton's song 'I Will Always Love You'. You couldn't make it up.
The DUP love their country.
very good
Jeffrey, Arlene, Sammy, Gregory, Nigel, Emma, Ian Og, Edwin, Givan, Carla, Angry Jim, Bryson, Moore, Kate, Ben Habib. Ben Lowry, Nolan
What a line up? No friends anywhere in the world, no strategy......Lowry wants to go back to 1972 to 1998........they would all love that.
At last the world sees them for the clowns that they are........but how can we all move on despite them wanting to hold this place back to a time 30 years ago?
Quote from: The Trap on March 23, 2023, 11:52:06 AM
Jeffrey, Arlene, Sammy, Gregory, Nigel, Emma, Ian Og, Edwin, Givan, Carla, Angry Jim, Bryson, Moore, Kate, Ben Habib. Ben Lowry, Nolan
What a line up? No friends anywhere in the world, no strategy......Lowry wants to go back to 1972 to 1998........they would all love that.
At last the world sees them for the clowns that they are........but how can we all move on despite them wanting to hold this place back to a time 30 years ago?
If the voters could gradually abandon them. Allister is deluded
https://twitter.com/JimAllister/status/1638858161464516612
TalkBack doing a segment on Shannon's Dolly Parton love
WTF
Quote from: seafoid on March 23, 2023, 12:16:30 PM
Quote from: The Trap on March 23, 2023, 11:52:06 AM
Jeffrey, Arlene, Sammy, Gregory, Nigel, Emma, Ian Og, Edwin, Givan, Carla, Angry Jim, Bryson, Moore, Kate, Ben Habib. Ben Lowry, Nolan
What a line up? No friends anywhere in the world, no strategy......Lowry wants to go back to 1972 to 1998........they would all love that.
At last the world sees them for the clowns that they are........but how can we all move on despite them wanting to hold this place back to a time 30 years ago?
If the voters could gradually abandon them. Allister is deluded
https://twitter.com/JimAllister/status/1638858161464516612
I enjoyed that very much so.
Quote from: The Trap on March 23, 2023, 11:52:06 AM
Jeffrey, Arlene, Sammy, Gregory, Nigel, Emma, Ian Og, Edwin, Givan, Carla, Angry Jim, Bryson, Moore, Kate, Ben Habib. Ben Lowry, Nolan
What a line up? No friends anywhere in the world, no strategy......Lowry wants to go back to 1972 to 1998........they would all love that.
At last the world sees them for the clowns that they are........but how can we all move on despite them wanting to hold this place back to a time 30 years ago?
Ben Lowry did actually say that direct rule worked well in the 1970's. Quite unbelievable.
One problem with Unionists is that they don't know who they are. This makes them easy to manipulate.
We all need to step back a bit and revaluate what has happened since the GFA came into being.
From the beginning the DUP did not want this agreement because I'm sure Paisley knew it was the start of the end for majority rule by one side of the community.
Jump forward to present day and the DUP couldn't have been given a better excuse to wreck the GFA once and for all especially now that SF hold the balance of power.
I do believe that this is the end of the line for the GFA if the DUP do not take their seats (which I dont think they will do) as no nationalist party could go into power with them again.
I do believe that if the UUP were in the DUP's position it would be no differnt as the stakeholders will always call the shots.
In a democracy , democratic parties accept the results of elections. The DUP and Allister are living in la la land.
Quote from: Hereiam on March 23, 2023, 02:17:28 PM
We all need to step back a bit and revaluate what has happened since the GFA came into being.
From the beginning the DUP did not want this agreement because I'm sure Paisley knew it was the start of the end for majority rule by one side of the community.
Jump forward to present day and the DUP couldn't have been given a better excuse to wreck the GFA once and for all especially now that SF hold the balance of power.
I do believe that this is the end of the line for the GFA if the DUP do not take their seats (which I dont think they will do) as no nationalist party could go into power with them again.
I do believe that if the UUP were in the DUP's position it would be no differnt as the stakeholders will always call the shots.
You forgot to add that while doing that they have constantly said that it's other people who are in breach of the GFA.
They thrive on division and tbh it's all they've got. What problems that causes from now on I guess time will tell but I don't think they'd be particularly unhappy if the troubles came back(which is not something I could remotely see happening tbh).
It's not advisable for Allister to attack the UK Gov or to imply that the Union is over. Because it's behaviour such as his which will end in it being over.
They are Supremacists. It is as pure and simple as that.
Quote from: The Trap on March 23, 2023, 11:52:06 AM
Jeffrey, Arlene, Sammy, Gregory, Nigel, Emma, Ian Og, Edwin, Givan, Carla, Angry Jim, Bryson, Moore, Kate, Ben Habib. Ben Lowry, Nolan
What a line up? No friends anywhere in the world, no strategy......Lowry wants to go back to 1972 to 1998........they would all love that.
At last the world sees them for the clowns that they are........but how can we all move on despite them wanting to hold this place back to a time 30 years ago?
Don't you mean 300 years ago?
The British people have moved on . Only unionists in the north.( and those bigots in Lewes ) behave like they still live in the 1600's.
I presume the Irish Government, Brit Govt and the White House are still pinning hope on DUPUDA going back to Stormont.
Have they a plan B at all?
Quote from: seafoid on March 23, 2023, 03:13:08 PM
It's not advisable for Allister to attack the UK Gov or to imply that the Union is over. Because it's behaviour such as his which will end in it being over.
Shhhh don't be telling him that!
Quote from: Rossfan on March 23, 2023, 04:39:10 PM
I presume the Irish Government, Brit Govt and the White House are still pinning hope on DUPUDA going back to Stormont.
Have they a plan B at all?
If it were up to me, there'd be a ruling body comprising representatives from Westminster and the Dail - with potential non-voting representation from Stormont (to basically act as a conduit to the locals) and the US congress (which might up investment).
Chris Donnelly is a tool too......why is he on so much
It wasn't his best evening. Yer man Shirlow from Liverpool Uni waffling as well. John Campbell cutting through to the facts as always .
Quote from: The Trap on March 23, 2023, 11:28:52 PM
Chris Donnelly is a tool too......why is he on so much
Very harsh. I think He's articulate, intelligent and well able to handle himself whether in radio, tv or writing in the papers. Unashamedly a Republican and there's nothing wrong with that either.
Quote from: Orior on March 23, 2023, 01:50:29 PM
Quote from: The Trap on March 23, 2023, 11:52:06 AM
Jeffrey, Arlene, Sammy, Gregory, Nigel, Emma, Ian Og, Edwin, Givan, Carla, Angry Jim, Bryson, Moore, Kate, Ben Habib. Ben Lowry, Nolan
What a line up? No friends anywhere in the world, no strategy......Lowry wants to go back to 1972 to 1998........they would all love that.
At last the world sees them for the clowns that they are........but how can we all move on despite them wanting to hold this place back to a time 30 years ago?
Ben Lowry did actually say that direct rule worked well in the 1970's. Quite unbelievable.
I recorded the program and watched it last night. I had to pause it because I thought , nah he didn't just say that. I rewind , and sure enough, he had just said it. Unbelievable. But This is what you're dealing with
Quote from: Sportacus on March 23, 2023, 11:40:45 PM
It wasn't his best evening. Yer man Shirlow from Liverpool Uni waffling as well. John Campbell cutting through to the facts as always .
Has anyone ever seen John Campbell smile?
I'd like to hear him crack a joke about numbers e.g. 2+2=5 (for big values of 2)
Quote from: Orior on March 24, 2023, 10:23:33 AM
Quote from: Sportacus on March 23, 2023, 11:40:45 PM
It wasn't his best evening. Yer man Shirlow from Liverpool Uni waffling as well. John Campbell cutting through to the facts as always .
Has anyone ever seen John Campbell smile?
I'd like to hear him crack a joke about numbers e.g. 2+2=5 (for big values of 2)
Is he an Antrim man?
Ballymena.
Has Caruthers ever got a bigger role than interviewing parish pump type politicians in North. He is quite a polished presenter, better than anyone on RTE. Nolan on the other hand is an embarrassment. The other night when he told the caller with a disability to put his face up close to the TV and then proceeds to yell at the top of his lungs: "Michele O'Neill was the Minister of Health." Have the BBC no shame allowing this lug on the air?
Shock jock. And shite at it. In other words, hes a gobshite
He's not that shite at it the money he's getting >:( He just plays to the lowest common denominator and it works for him.
Quote from: johnnycool on March 24, 2023, 10:31:35 AM
Quote from: Orior on March 24, 2023, 10:23:33 AM
Quote from: Sportacus on March 23, 2023, 11:40:45 PM
It wasn't his best evening. Yer man Shirlow from Liverpool Uni waffling as well. John Campbell cutting through to the facts as always .
Has anyone ever seen John Campbell smile?
I'd like to hear him crack a joke about numbers e.g. 2+2=5 (for big values of 2)
Is he an Antrim man?
Went to Garron Tower/St Killians
Quote from: Sportacus on March 23, 2023, 11:40:45 PM
It wasn't his best evening. Yer man Shirlow from Liverpool Uni waffling as well. John Campbell cutting through to the facts as always .
Shirlow was good. Called out Donnelly the SF plant anyway.
Quote from: trailer on March 24, 2023, 12:38:50 PM
Quote from: Sportacus on March 23, 2023, 11:40:45 PM
It wasn't his best evening. Yer man Shirlow from Liverpool Uni waffling as well. John Campbell cutting through to the facts as always .
Shirlow was good. Called out Donnelly the SF plant anyway.
??
I thought Donnelly as usual spoke well. It's a shame most of our politicians can't string a sentence together. Shirliow also spoke well but I see as usual no-one questions the dodgy methodology of the Liverpool university surveys and polls.
https://www.irishtimes.com/politics/2023/03/23/dup-secretly-warned-against-its-own-trade-deal-demand-letter-reveals/
The Democratic Unionist Party (DUP) privately warned the UK government that a "dual regulation" environment in Northern Ireland would not work for crucial industry groups, despite the idea now being one of its demands to restore the region's devolved government.The big issue which the Ulster Farmers' Union (UFU) have raised is the area of dual regulation," Wilson wrote in a letter to the agriculture department, Defra, seen by the Financial Times, adding that the idea "does raise some concerns for us".He explained that farmers in Northern Ireland would always opt to follow EU rules for commercial reasons because that gave them equal access to both the UK and EU markets.The idea of a "dual regulation" framework for Northern Ireland was proposed in former prime minister Boris Johnson's controversial Northern Ireland protocol Bill that was replaced by Mr Sunak's Windsor Framework.But at Westminster on Wednesday, he insisted: "What I do not accept is a situation where every business in my constituency must comply with EU rules even if they do not sell a single widget to the EU. That is wrong, because it harms our place in the internal market of the UK."However, UK officials say the DUP has yet to come up with concrete examples of where the requirement to follow EU rules has impeded Northern Ireland companies from trading with the UK.But London has said there will be none. "There is nothing more to get out of ... negotiation. It is done," Chris Heaton-Harris, the UK's Northern Ireland secretary, said on Thursday.
Quote from: seafoid on March 24, 2023, 01:22:43 PM
https://www.irishtimes.com/politics/2023/03/23/dup-secretly-warned-against-its-own-trade-deal-demand-letter-reveals/
The Democratic Unionist Party (DUP) privately warned the UK government that a "dual regulation" environment in Northern Ireland would not work for crucial industry groups, despite the idea now being one of its demands to restore the region's devolved government.The big issue which the Ulster Farmers' Union (UFU) have raised is the area of dual regulation," Wilson wrote in a letter to the agriculture department, Defra, seen by the Financial Times, adding that the idea "does raise some concerns for us".He explained that farmers in Northern Ireland would always opt to follow EU rules for commercial reasons because that gave them equal access to both the UK and EU markets.The idea of a "dual regulation" framework for Northern Ireland was proposed in former prime minister Boris Johnson's controversial Northern Ireland protocol Bill that was replaced by Mr Sunak's Windsor Framework.But at Westminster on Wednesday, he insisted: "What I do not accept is a situation where every business in my constituency must comply with EU rules even if they do not sell a single widget to the EU. That is wrong, because it harms our place in the internal market of the UK."However, UK officials say the DUP has yet to come up with concrete examples of where the requirement to follow EU rules has impeded Northern Ireland companies from trading with the UK.But London has said there will be none. "There is nothing more to get out of ... negotiation. It is done," Chris Heaton-Harris, the UK's Northern Ireland secretary, said on Thursday.
Wee Sammy caught telling porkies and undermining the UFU and lord knows who else..
Quote from: Silver hill on March 24, 2023, 08:02:22 AM
Quote from: The Trap on March 23, 2023, 11:28:52 PM
Chris Donnelly is a tool too......why is he on so much
Very harsh. I think He's articulate, intelligent and well able to handle himself whether in radio, tv or writing in the papers. Unashamedly a Republican and there's nothing wrong with that either.
Yeah, he speaks grand. Has good political understanding.
Problem is Nolan is running out of lads to come on, so it's a small pool of people he's working with.
II'd say ithey don't go on to his show, then Nolan's show will soon disappear with lack of viewers.
Quote from: Orior on March 23, 2023, 01:50:29 PM
Quote from: The Trap on March 23, 2023, 11:52:06 AM
Jeffrey, Arlene, Sammy, Gregory, Nigel, Emma, Ian Og, Edwin, Givan, Carla, Angry Jim, Bryson, Moore, Kate, Ben Habib. Ben Lowry, Nolan
What a line up? No friends anywhere in the world, no strategy......Lowry wants to go back to 1972 to 1998........they would all love that.
At last the world sees them for the clowns that they are........but how can we all move on despite them wanting to hold this place back to a time 30 years ago?
Ben Lowry did actually say that direct rule worked well in the 1970's. Quite unbelievable.
Not really, if you knew him, or ever had any dealings with him. An utter bigot, and complete tube to boot.
Quote from: red hander on March 24, 2023, 06:01:18 PM
Quote from: Orior on March 23, 2023, 01:50:29 PM
Quote from: The Trap on March 23, 2023, 11:52:06 AM
Jeffrey, Arlene, Sammy, Gregory, Nigel, Emma, Ian Og, Edwin, Givan, Carla, Angry Jim, Bryson, Moore, Kate, Ben Habib. Ben Lowry, Nolan
What a line up? No friends anywhere in the world, no strategy......Lowry wants to go back to 1972 to 1998........they would all love that.
At last the world sees them for the clowns that they are........but how can we all move on despite them wanting to hold this place back to a time 30 years ago?
Ben Lowry did actually say that direct rule worked well in the 1970's. Quite unbelievable.
Not really, if you knew him, or ever had any dealings with him. An utter bigot, and complete tube to boot.
Yeah, at times he gets so worked up about the olden days, you'd think he's about to cry.
(http://www.whytes.ie/images/archive/20130126/243.jpg)
Lowry has a write up today in the Newsletter from a director of a logistics company claiming the Windsor arrangement is worse than the protocol. He fails to mention the same director is also on the board of directors of Mc Burney Transport who was recently sold to a Danish company for 140 million thanks to the duel access.
Quote from: red hander on March 24, 2023, 06:01:18 PM
Quote from: Orior on March 23, 2023, 01:50:29 PM
Quote from: The Trap on March 23, 2023, 11:52:06 AM
Jeffrey, Arlene, Sammy, Gregory, Nigel, Emma, Ian Og, Edwin, Givan, Carla, Angry Jim, Bryson, Moore, Kate, Ben Habib. Ben Lowry, Nolan
What a line up? No friends anywhere in the world, no strategy......Lowry wants to go back to 1972 to 1998........they would all love that.
At last the world sees them for the clowns that they are........but how can we all move on despite them wanting to hold this place back to a time 30 years ago?
Ben Lowry did actually say that direct rule worked well in the 1970's. Quite unbelievable.
Not really, if you knew him, or ever had any dealings with him. An utter bigot, and complete tube to boot.
Can't listen to him. Very blinkered. The plummy accent grinds a bit too.
https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-northern-ireland-65075772 (https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-northern-ireland-65075772)
Jim says no to Stormont at the TUV Ard fheis
Quote from: RedHand88 on March 25, 2023, 06:25:12 PM
https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-northern-ireland-65075772 (https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-northern-ireland-65075772)
Jim says no to Stormont at the TUV Ard fheis
Kate Hoey there too.
https://www.spectator.co.uk/article/the-decline-and-fall-of-the-dup/
There's an excellent read, when the Spectator is on there back its not a great sign.
Quote from: RedHand88 on March 25, 2023, 06:25:12 PM
https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-northern-ireland-65075772 (https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-northern-ireland-65075772)
Jim says no to Stormont at the TUV Ard fheis
Yet they have no issue calling their annual conference their Ard fheis?
Bizzare ;)
Quote from: AustinPowers on March 25, 2023, 07:45:52 PM
Quote from: RedHand88 on March 25, 2023, 06:25:12 PM
https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-northern-ireland-65075772 (https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-northern-ireland-65075772)
Jim says no to Stormont at the TUV Ard fheis
Yet they have no issue calling their annual conference their Ard fheis?
Bizzare ;)
They even have an Ard Comhairle, only Jim is on it
Quote from: Brendan on March 25, 2023, 08:49:23 PM
Quote from: AustinPowers on March 25, 2023, 07:45:52 PM
Quote from: RedHand88 on March 25, 2023, 06:25:12 PM
https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-northern-ireland-65075772 (https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-northern-ireland-65075772)
Jim says no to Stormont at the TUV Ard fheis
Yet they have no issue calling their annual conference their Ard fheis?
Bizzare ;)
They even have an Ard Comhairle, only Jim is on it
Guth traidisiúnta aontachtach
Though I'm not that aufait with unionist politics, but haven't the DUP just shot themselves in both feet by rejecting the Windsor Framework? They could've claimed full credit for the positive changes in the WF but instead come across as political nihilists. Should the next development be calling for new elections isn't there a good chance that there will be a serious swing away from the nihilists?
Unfortunately it's not guaranteed that they would lose votes :( You would have to hope that at some point in this bonkers place people eventually stop voting for the dup but I wouldn't guarantee it. The ticket we're not sf seems to be enough.
In a sane world it would be political suicide yes.
There's no hope the DUP will go back to Stormont the way things are.
It looks like there will be no change to the WF , and according to Mark carruthers the other night , neither British or Irish governments are keen to reform power sharing ( or sf/dup losing their veto)
If there's going to be no change to the WF or power sharing reform , then what are we waiting for ? People can't sit forever waiting and hoping there will be some sort of resolution to get Stormont going again. It's not going to happen
It's either Westminster rule, or joint rule. Whether people want either of those or not , it has to happen. And it needs to happen very quickly.
So here we are. The DUP are never going to go into Government with a SF First Minister. You'd hope that those who could never vote SF would at least choose Alliance. One thing for sure there are a Plethora of elected members getting a big wad of money for doing nothing.
I have a rule if you don't attend 60% attendance at stormont/ govt you don't get paid. Hard to bring in as MPs in England attendance for their Westminster wouldn't be great
In summary, what's the DUPs issue with this latest agreement?
Quote from: nrico2006 on March 26, 2023, 08:06:31 AM
In summary, what's the DUPs issue with this latest agreement?
If you look really closely at the text, you will see that it involves a Nationalist as First Minister.
Quote from: nrico2006 on March 26, 2023, 08:06:31 AM
In summary, what's the DUPs issue with this latest agreement?
1 - as Red Hand says
2 - 470,000,000 didn't do what 200,000 demanded!!
3 - TUVUDAUVFOO says NO.
Quote from: From the Bunker on March 26, 2023, 12:00:40 AM
So here we are. The DUP are never going to go into Government with a SF First Minister. You'd hope that those who could never vote SF would at least choose Alliance. One thing for sure there are a Plethora of elected members getting a big wad of money for doing nothing.
The DUP don't have to be in Government if they don't respect the democratic result. They can be excluded
Quote from: nrico2006 on March 26, 2023, 08:06:31 AM
In summary, what's the DUPs issue with this latest agreement?
Equality - don't want to see a nationalist First Minister. All about the optics.
Protocol is a red herring.
Quote from: nrico2006 on March 26, 2023, 08:06:31 AM
In summary, what's the DUPs issue with this latest agreement?
irishtimes.com/politics/2023/03/23/dup-secretly-warned-against-its-own-trade-deal-demand-letter-reveals/...
"At Westminster Donaldson insisted: "What I don't accept is a situation where every business in my constituency must comply with EU rules even if they do not sell a single widget to the EU. That is wrong, because it harms our place in the UK internal market"
However, UK officials say the DUP has yet to come up with concrete examples of where the requirement to follow EU rules has impeded Northern Ireland companies from trading with the UK. "
Just fancy that!
https://www.irishtimes.com/opinion/2023/03/23/improved-uk-eu-relationship-will-facilitate-all-important-fudges-of-windsor-framework/
Stalling until after May's council elections, which appears to be the DUP's plan, has doomed it to several months of nit-picking and mischief-making, none of it conducive to welcoming a new spirit of partnership.
Quote from: marty34 on March 26, 2023, 10:53:50 AM
Quote from: nrico2006 on March 26, 2023, 08:06:31 AM
In summary, what's the DUPs issue with this latest agreement?
Equality - don't want to see a nationalist First Minister. All about the optics.
Protocol is a red herring.
As someone said- you could let Jim Allister write the framework himself and he would still object to it
Pipe bombs, petrol bombs and masked vigilante groups hanging on street corners "protecting" peoples homes, just another tidy weekend in Newtownards...
Cops watch on.
DUP response, NADA....
Quote from: johnnycool on March 27, 2023, 04:08:35 PM
Pipe bombs, petrol bombs and masked vigilante groups hanging on street corners "protecting" peoples homes, just another tidy weekend in Newtownards...
Cops watch on.
DUP response, NADA....
DUP should be made stand on steps of Stormont and denounce their fellow travellers.
Quote from: marty34 on March 27, 2023, 05:27:36 PM
Quote from: johnnycool on March 27, 2023, 04:08:35 PM
Pipe bombs, petrol bombs and masked vigilante groups hanging on street corners "protecting" peoples homes, just another tidy weekend in Newtownards...
Cops watch on.
DUP response, NADA....
DUP should be made stand on steps of Stormont and denounce their fellow travellers.
DUP strangely quiet on this and the only murmurings from the usual Loyalist bloggers is almost welcoming this "purge" when it's really a power struggle for control of the drugs, not some cleansing of Loyalism...
Helicopters over Ards last night, very little on BBC NI, but I bet the biggest show in the country will be all over it as he can probably hear the helicopters from his house.
Quote from: johnnycool on March 28, 2023, 09:26:07 AM
Quote from: marty34 on March 27, 2023, 05:27:36 PM
Quote from: johnnycool on March 27, 2023, 04:08:35 PM
Pipe bombs, petrol bombs and masked vigilante groups hanging on street corners "protecting" peoples homes, just another tidy weekend in Newtownards...
Cops watch on.
DUP response, NADA....
DUP should be made stand on steps of Stormont and denounce their fellow travellers.
DUP strangely quiet on this and the only murmurings from the usual Loyalist bloggers is almost welcoming this "purge" when it's really a power struggle for control of the drugs, not some cleansing of Loyalism...
Helicopters over Ards last night, very little on BBC NI, but I bet the biggest show in the country will be all over it as he can probably hear the helicopters from his house.
Emma Pengelly was interviewed on GMU this morning about it. I am no DUP supporter but they haven't been quiet.
FWIW I thought Pengelly was giving some political cover to the LCC and by extension these groups.
Quote from: trailer on March 28, 2023, 09:52:12 AM
Quote from: johnnycool on March 28, 2023, 09:26:07 AM
Quote from: marty34 on March 27, 2023, 05:27:36 PM
Quote from: johnnycool on March 27, 2023, 04:08:35 PM
Pipe bombs, petrol bombs and masked vigilante groups hanging on street corners "protecting" peoples homes, just another tidy weekend in Newtownards...
Cops watch on.
DUP response, NADA....
DUP should be made stand on steps of Stormont and denounce their fellow travellers.
DUP strangely quiet on this and the only murmurings from the usual Loyalist bloggers is almost welcoming this "purge" when it's really a power struggle for control of the drugs, not some cleansing of Loyalism...
Helicopters over Ards last night, very little on BBC NI, but I bet the biggest show in the country will be all over it as he can probably hear the helicopters from his house.
Emma Pengelly was interviewed on GMU this morning about it. I am no DUP supporter but they haven't been quiet.
FWIW I thought Pengelly was giving some political cover to the LCC and by extension these groups.
What did she say?
Quote from: johnnycool on March 28, 2023, 09:53:09 AM
Quote from: trailer on March 28, 2023, 09:52:12 AM
Quote from: johnnycool on March 28, 2023, 09:26:07 AM
Quote from: marty34 on March 27, 2023, 05:27:36 PM
Quote from: johnnycool on March 27, 2023, 04:08:35 PM
Pipe bombs, petrol bombs and masked vigilante groups hanging on street corners "protecting" peoples homes, just another tidy weekend in Newtownards...
Cops watch on.
DUP response, NADA....
DUP should be made stand on steps of Stormont and denounce their fellow travellers.
DUP strangely quiet on this and the only murmurings from the usual Loyalist bloggers is almost welcoming this "purge" when it's really a power struggle for control of the drugs, not some cleansing of Loyalism...
Helicopters over Ards last night, very little on BBC NI, but I bet the biggest show in the country will be all over it as he can probably hear the helicopters from his house.
Emma Pengelly was interviewed on GMU this morning about it. I am no DUP supporter but they haven't been quiet.
FWIW I thought Pengelly was giving some political cover to the LCC and by extension these groups.
What did she say?
They condemn violence and that they will engage with all groups. LCC is to facilitate a move away from violence. They're helping these groups, UDA, UVF etc to move away from criminality. Felt she got an easy enough ride.
I don't know how the LCC is facilitating a move away from violence when they are continually using thinly veiled threats of violence wrt the protocol. They are in fact doing the opposite.
If they move away from criminality then they don't exist (unless government funding makes them stop that).
She's horrendous.
Quote from: imtommygunn on March 28, 2023, 10:18:32 AM
I don't know how the LCC is facilitating a move away from violence when they are continually using thinly veiled threats of violence wrt the protocol. They are in fact doing the opposite.
If they move away from criminality then they don't exist (unless government funding makes them stop that).
She's horrendous.
The actual existence of the UVF/UDA doesn't ever seem to be questioned and this LCC crap and the DUP in discussions with stakeholders reinforces this crap that somehow these organisations are legitimate and no one bats an eyelid..
It's ludicrous (I was going to say unbelievable but not so much) there hasn't been significant scrutiny on this and in particular the background of the likes of the guy Campbell etc.
When was the last time a loyalist or anyone for that matter been convicted with being a member of the UDA/UVF ect.
Tells you all you need to know about the state of the law and order in the north.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-65091660
All thanks to the DUP
What an utter cesspit of a society we live in. If anything its getting worse
Quote from: Hereiam on March 28, 2023, 11:47:54 AM
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-65091660
All thanks to the DUP
FFS.
50 yrs in schools??? I'm not 50 and I never had this in either primary or secondary school
Quote from: snoopdog on March 28, 2023, 01:45:34 PM
50 yrs in schools??? I'm not 50 and I never had this in either primary or secondary school
We'd it in Primary school, early 80's.
Quote from: snoopdog on March 28, 2023, 01:45:34 PM
50 yrs in schools??? I'm not 50 and I never had this in either primary or secondary school
You would have needed to be able to cycle a bicycle to get on it. :P
Quote from: snoopdog on March 28, 2023, 01:45:34 PM
50 yrs in schools??? I'm not 50 and I never had this in either primary or secondary school
Are all transport related issues not segregated by religion up there ?
Quote from: johnnycool on March 28, 2023, 01:47:37 PM
Quote from: snoopdog on March 28, 2023, 01:45:34 PM
50 yrs in schools??? I'm not 50 and I never had this in either primary or secondary school
We'd it in Primary school, early 80's 70's
Fixed that
Quote from: seafoid on March 28, 2023, 03:37:13 PM
Quote from: snoopdog on March 28, 2023, 01:45:34 PM
50 yrs in schools??? I'm not 50 and I never had this in either primary or secondary school
Are all transport related issues not segregated by religion up there ?
No-one mentioned tandem bikes did they?
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on March 28, 2023, 06:51:40 PM
Quote from: johnnycool on March 28, 2023, 01:47:37 PM
Quote from: snoopdog on March 28, 2023, 01:45:34 PM
50 yrs in schools??? I'm not 50 and I never had this in either primary or secondary school
We'd it in Primary school, early 80's 70's
Fixed that
I was in P7, so 79 or so.. Thanks for the correction ;)
Quote from: johnnycool on March 29, 2023, 08:53:29 AM
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on March 28, 2023, 06:51:40 PM
Quote from: johnnycool on March 28, 2023, 01:47:37 PM
Quote from: snoopdog on March 28, 2023, 01:45:34 PM
50 yrs in schools??? I'm not 50 and I never had this in either primary or secondary school
We'd it in Primary school, early 80's 70's
Fixed that
I was in P7, so 79 or so.. Thanks for the correction ;)
I'm a bit younger so 80's for me ;) though cycling to school and avoiding the burnt out buses and coming home during the riots was more like an assault course
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on March 29, 2023, 09:00:22 AM
Quote from: johnnycool on March 29, 2023, 08:53:29 AM
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on March 28, 2023, 06:51:40 PM
Quote from: johnnycool on March 28, 2023, 01:47:37 PM
Quote from: snoopdog on March 28, 2023, 01:45:34 PM
50 yrs in schools??? I'm not 50 and I never had this in either primary or secondary school
We'd it in Primary school, early 80's 70's
Fixed that
I was in P7, so 79 or so.. Thanks for the correction ;)
I'm a bit younger so 80's for me ;) though cycling to school and avoiding the burnt out buses and coming home during the riots was more like an assault course
The kids in Newtownards will be experiencing that this morning ;D
Ah, the good ole days, I was just trying to avoid the cow shíte on the roads.
Quote from: trailer on March 28, 2023, 09:55:19 AM
Quote from: johnnycool on March 28, 2023, 09:53:09 AM
Quote from: trailer on March 28, 2023, 09:52:12 AM
Quote from: johnnycool on March 28, 2023, 09:26:07 AM
Quote from: marty34 on March 27, 2023, 05:27:36 PM
Quote from: johnnycool on March 27, 2023, 04:08:35 PM
Pipe bombs, petrol bombs and masked vigilante groups hanging on street corners "protecting" peoples homes, just another tidy weekend in Newtownards...
Cops watch on.
DUP response, NADA....
DUP should be made stand on steps of Stormont and denounce their fellow travellers.
DUP strangely quiet on this and the only murmurings from the usual Loyalist bloggers is almost welcoming this "purge" when it's really a power struggle for control of the drugs, not some cleansing of Loyalism...
Helicopters over Ards last night, very little on BBC NI, but I bet the biggest show in the country will be all over it as he can probably hear the helicopters from his house.
Emma Pengelly was interviewed on GMU this morning about it. I am no DUP supporter but they haven't been quiet.
FWIW I thought Pengelly was giving some political cover to the LCC and by extension these groups.
What did she say?
They condemn violence and that they will engage with all groups. LCC is to facilitate a move away from violence. They're helping these groups, UDA, UVF etc to move away from criminality. Felt she got an easy enough ride.
Car set alight in Ballywalter, almost at Jim Shannon's back door, but NADA...
You can't expect DUPUDA to criticise their masters!
Chopper in the air tonight again, place is turning into Vietnam ;D
Enjoyed the show on The Prime Minister of Northern Ireland.. bunch of public school rich orange feckers
https://www.irishtimes.com/sport/gaelic-games/2023/03/30/ciaran-murphy-its-not-hard-to-do-away-with-superfluous-finals-and-increase-drama/
There is an event at Croke Park this Saturday, April 1st, part of the Thinking Futures: Building Recognition initiative for the Institute of Irish Studies, University of Liverpool and the GAA. Each forum will feature a chaired panel discussion with two pro-union and two GAA panel members with 10 minutes each to explain their identity and attitude to the constitutional question. The aim is to start a conversation and build reconciliation.
Tickets are available on eventbrite.
https://www.eventbrite.co.uk/e/thinking-futures-building-recognition-dublin-tickets-580651964657
While the exploitation of people at these 'international' car wash places needs to be investigated and those that are being used by criminal gangs need to be need to be brought to hand, the recent events in Newtownards is being ignored by Nolan lol!!
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on March 30, 2023, 09:41:13 AM
While the exploitation of people at these 'international' car wash places needs to be investigated and those that are being used by criminal gangs need to be need to be brought to hand, the recent events in Newtownards is being ignored by Nolan lol!!
Nolan needs sent to work in a carwash for a week or two, some real work might do him good!
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on March 30, 2023, 09:41:13 AM
While the exploitation of people at these 'international' car wash places needs to be investigated and those that are being used by criminal gangs need to be need to be brought to hand, the recent events in Newtownards is being ignored by Nolan lol!!
When you're able to get a valet and wash for 15quid, there's something not right.
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on March 30, 2023, 09:41:13 AM
While the exploitation of people at these 'international' car wash places needs to be investigated and those that are being used by criminal gangs need to be need to be brought to hand, the recent events in Newtownards is being ignored by Nolan lol!!
The same loyalist paramilitary groups are a very useful tool for extreme unionism to be used as and when required. So it shouldn't be surprising that institutionalised media do not want to highlight or report these sinister criminals feuding. When it gets to the stage where the SDLP are boycotting that show you know it is merely nothing more than an entertainment show that places sectariansim as its main selling point, mostly as a talking shop for loyalism.
The SDLP one was more than entertainment though. It was the LCC getting their usual free ride. It's actually quite sinister.
Quote from: RedHand88 on March 30, 2023, 10:14:17 AM
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on March 30, 2023, 09:41:13 AM
While the exploitation of people at these 'international' car wash places needs to be investigated and those that are being used by criminal gangs need to be need to be brought to hand, the recent events in Newtownards is being ignored by Nolan lol!!
When you're able to get a valet and wash for 15quid, there's something not right.
It is estimated that its a 1.7billion business industry in the UK, be that legal or the other, Wife still uses them, I tell her not too but what's new lol.. there is a way of looking at it, first the police or councils that allow the sites to run, need to step in, check that H&S is being adhered to at the very least and that those employed are doing so of their own free will.
The owners should be checked that they are paying properly (minimum wage) and its not bringing illegals or migrant workers as slaves. Also that the business is not polluting water systems
If we use them (illegal ones) then you are encouraging it. I've stopped using them a long time ago, but knowing fine well that none of it was legit at the time.
Are they linked to paramilitary groups? If not probably paying protection money.
If they were all shut down, where would they be put to work? Drug dealing prostitution and so on?
groups of masked men appear in newtownards town centre in broad daylight
Quote from: Eire90 on March 30, 2023, 03:15:01 PM
groups of masked men appear in newtownards town centre in broad daylight
Covid must be rife there
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on March 30, 2023, 03:15:58 PM
Quote from: Eire90 on March 30, 2023, 03:15:01 PM
groups of masked men appear in newtownards town centre in broad daylight
Covid must be rife there
The worst thing is those right wing criminal extremists wouldn't wear a mask when they were supposed to.
WTF are those useless PSNI wankers doing about these scum? Heard on the radio they were 'negotiating' to bring an end to feud. Proof, if proof was needed, of what a failed shithole statelet this is. Do you think the response would be same if this was happening in a nationalist area, or in any place in Britain?
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on March 30, 2023, 03:15:58 PM
Quote from: Eire90 on March 30, 2023, 03:15:01 PM
groups of masked men appear in newtownards town centre in broad daylight
Covid must be rife there
the peelers treating them like sheep...
(https://focus.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/thumbor/SSoq9AcC7MtQnF6aAUlctS0IMsM=/0x0:3394x2059/fit-in/960x640/prod-mh-ireland/55ccce13-1673-4def-a5f8-ebfab9dcaa87/bc1e9ce8-97b4-4e7a-b6d1-0d8b2ae1f6cf/55ccce13-1673-4def-a5f8-ebfab9dcaa87.jpg)
Quote from: red hander on March 30, 2023, 04:12:03 PM
WTF are those useless PSNI wankers doing about these scum? Heard on the radio they were 'negotiating' to bring an end to feud. Proof, if proof was needed, of what a failed shithole statelet this is. Do you think the response would be same if this was happening in a nationalist area, or in any place in Britain?
In any normal functioning society the sight of masked men openly walking around town streets would be front page news. But it is normalised here as working class protestant people are told by politicians exactly where to look for their enemies. Loyalism is a cloak for their primary purpose which is coercion, racketeering, drug dealing and extortion. It's all about controlling communities by fear and if people are kept in poverty then they can't see a way out.
Just remember these illegal groups are the people who the DUP run to for approval on major political decisions. The LCC and David Campbell have placed themselves at the forefront of political discussions around the protocol and the BBC have sought their opinion at various stages throughout this process. Where is David Campbell now?
Loyalism is a name of convenience for these groups. They are organised criminals from a loyalist background. The language is changing but the policing is not. There should be a full frontal on them and there should be widespread condemnation of the lack of condemnation from the DUP....but this won't happen. It's all part of the game that is our politics and our day to day life. Biden is coming over next week. Will be a big financial package out in place to make this cursed place work for the next number of years....£5bn I hear. A portion of this will go to the 'community groups' who have lost a load of European funding this week. This is the pension for the Dee Stitts et al.
These scumbags shouldn't get a penny when hard working people can barely get by. Why on earth is the UDA even mentioned by the press when they are no longer members. The language used is vital yet the cretins here in the media don't seem to understand this. Hopefully they kill other!!!
Let's face it most of the funding in these community groups, on both sides of the house, go on salaries & a bit left over for whatever project they are working on
Absolute scumbags the whole lot of them with not a single brain cell between them. In an ideal world where there is a united ireland I would love to see a few van loads of guards being sent in to put manners on these f@#kers.
shooting in west belfast last night
Quote from: LC on March 30, 2023, 08:10:46 PM
Absolute scumbags the whole lot of them with not a single brain cell between them. In an ideal world where there is a united ireland I would love to see a few van loads of guards being sent in to put manners on these f@#kers.
that would start the troubles again
Group calling themselves the real UFF is this the original real UFF or the new real UFF
Quote from: Eire90 on March 31, 2023, 12:09:37 PM
shooting in west belfast last night
Was teaching up the Shankill during one of the feuds, god must be over 20 years ago. Families all had top move out of the areas they lived in for fear of being shot or house petrol bombed while they were in it. They don't mess about, most just guilty by association rather than being involved
Quote from: LC on March 30, 2023, 08:10:46 PM
Absolute scumbags the whole lot of them with not a single brain cell between them. In an ideal world where there is a united ireland I would love to see a few van loads of guards being sent in to put manners on these f@#kers.
Christ on a bike you think the ERU is resourced enough to take on all these lads?! Or maybe your everyday run off the mill Garda with the big thick head on him should be sent in to help as well?
apparantly there has been an assault at a shopping centre in newtownards
Wouldnt be suprise if we see violence tonight with them all on the weekend coke
Imagine the scenes if this shit was going on in Cross or somewhere!
Quote from: Armagh18 on March 31, 2023, 07:26:48 PM
Imagine the scenes if this shit was going on in Cross or somewhere!
The thing is it wouldn't be happening to this level, maybe back in the day but those days are gone. There is no control over those involved anymore. Too much money involved in this turf war
When the last time there was a major republican fued.
Quote from: brokencrossbar1 on March 31, 2023, 07:32:43 PM
Quote from: Armagh18 on March 31, 2023, 07:26:48 PM
Imagine the scenes if this shit was going on in Cross or somewhere!
The thing is it wouldn't be happening to this level, maybe back in the day but those days are gone. There is no control over those involved anymore. Too much money involved in this turf war
This is not really political at all, it is more like the Hutch-Kinahan feud or other gang wars in Limerick or Drogheda.
Quote from: Eire90 on March 31, 2023, 06:30:15 PM
Wouldnt be suprise if we see violence tonight with them all on the weekend coke
We can only hope!
Quote from: armaghniac on March 31, 2023, 08:53:30 PM
Quote from: brokencrossbar1 on March 31, 2023, 07:32:43 PM
Quote from: Armagh18 on March 31, 2023, 07:26:48 PM
Imagine the scenes if this shit was going on in Cross or somewhere!
The thing is it wouldn't be happening to this level, maybe back in the day but those days are gone. There is no control over those involved anymore. Too much money involved in this turf war
This is not really political at all, it is more like the Hutch-Kinahan feud or other gang wars in Limerick or Drogheda.
Which side are the DUP on?
Quote from: Eire90 on March 31, 2023, 08:43:54 PM
When the last time there was a major republican fued.
When Peadar Toibín left to set up Aontú
Was there not a boy shot in short strand a few years ago in some kind of feud? That may have been drug related but more or less the same... Actually that may have been someone from dublin came up.
https://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/sunday-life/news/dup-seeks-meeting-with-ni-secretary-to-resolve-drumcree-dispute/1802280697.html
Not hard to know July is far away, time to stir the pot. How niaive on her part to think SoS give two hoots about this.
Lockhart...
A vile bigot ::)
They need some votes in council elections so need to stir things up a bit for the lowest common denominator.
Quote from: LC on April 02, 2023, 06:43:47 PM
https://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/sunday-life/news/dup-seeks-meeting-with-ni-secretary-to-resolve-drumcree-dispute/1802280697.html
Not hard to know July is far away, time to stir the pot. How niaive on her part to think SoS give two hoots about this.
Wasn't it resolved 25 years ago when the cnuts were told ye can't parade down Garvaghy Road?
Quote from: LC on April 02, 2023, 06:43:47 PM
https://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/sunday-life/news/dup-seeks-meeting-with-ni-secretary-to-resolve-drumcree-dispute/1802280697.html
Not hard to know July is far away, time to stir the pot. How niaive on her part to think SoS give two hoots about this.
April Fool?
I have no doubt this would have part of the deals done between the DUP and the Tories for their votes.
dup basically threatening eu not to show up to good friday agreement events but i bet they wouldnt dare threaten the tories even tho they signed the agreement also do not see them threatening joe biden
What or where is this? I see no mention of it.
sammy wilson and arlene foster warn eu delegates to stay away
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2023/04/03/unionists-eu-northern-ireland-peace-deal-anniversary/
The EU has a lot more reason to attend Good Friday events than the anti GF agreement DUP.
Quote from: Eire90 on April 04, 2023, 05:05:50 PM
sammy wilson and arlene foster warn eu delegates to stay away
No one likes us we don't care say the DUP! It would appear that Arlene Foster has retired in name only with the amount of publicity she has received since being ousted but self awareness was never her strong point after leading unionism down a Brexit cul de sac which has continued to this day.
They are still doing the bidding of the ERG and Arlene in particular has a debt to repay to them after getting her Baroness and Dame titles off the back of propping up the Brexit wing of the Tory party. I think they live in a bubble where they think that a fringe regional political party are at the centre of the universe.
Quote from: yellowcard on April 04, 2023, 05:30:37 PM
Quote from: Eire90 on April 04, 2023, 05:05:50 PM
sammy wilson and arlene foster warn eu delegates to stay away
No one likes us we don't care say the DUP! It would appear that Arlene Foster has retired in name only with the amount of publicity she has received since being ousted but self awareness was never her strong point after leading unionism down a Brexit cul de sac which has continued to this day.
They are still doing the bidding of the ERG and Arlene in particular has a debt to repay to them after getting her Baroness and Dame titles off the back of propping up the Brexit wing of the Tory party. I think they live in a bubble where they think that a fringe regional political party are at the centre of the universe.
+1
Quote from: LC on April 04, 2023, 05:50:28 PM
Quote from: yellowcard on April 04, 2023, 05:30:37 PM
Quote from: Eire90 on April 04, 2023, 05:05:50 PM
sammy wilson and arlene foster warn eu delegates to stay away
No one likes us we don't care say the DUP! It would appear that Arlene Foster has retired in name only with the amount of publicity she has received since being ousted but self awareness was never her strong point after leading unionism down a Brexit cul de sac which has continued to this day.
They are still doing the bidding of the ERG and Arlene in particular has a debt to repay to them after getting her Baroness and Dame titles off the back of propping up the Brexit wing of the Tory party. I think they live in a bubble where they think that a fringe regional political party are at the centre of the universe.
+1
But that universe is only 5000 years old ;D ;)
Talkbalk has Unionists on gurning about Biden coming here.
"He says he's Irish, hes not Northern Irish"
I see the DUP have launched another charm offensive against the US administration as he embarks on his tour of Ireland. They just can't help themselves, before inviting someone else into their house for a cup of tea they would first need to prove their Britishness, anyone else is simply persona non grata.
Foster has completely lost the plot. Tbh I suspect she is at this point just looking for attention. She keeps getting peerages and awards but that doesn't hide the fact she is a complete failure and has done almost irreparable damage to the DUP. (Well hope that is the case anyway!).
Quote from: imtommygunn on April 12, 2023, 03:45:32 PM
Foster has completely lost the plot. Tbh I suspect she is at this point just looking for attention. She keeps getting peerages and awards but that doesn't hide the fact she is a complete failure and has done almost irreparable damage to the DUP. (Well hope that is the case anyway!).
Dan Wooten loves her.
Kate Hoey loves her.
Sammy Wilson loves her.
Nigel Farage loves her.
Unfortunately none of the above post on GAA Board so we are unable to explore the cause of such adoration.
Quote from: Orior on April 12, 2023, 03:53:18 PM
Quote from: imtommygunn on April 12, 2023, 03:45:32 PM
Foster has completely lost the plot. Tbh I suspect she is at this point just looking for attention. She keeps getting peerages and awards but that doesn't hide the fact she is a complete failure and has done almost irreparable damage to the DUP. (Well hope that is the case anyway!).
Dan Wooten loves her.
Kate Hoey loves her.
Sammy Wilson loves her.
Nigel Farage loves her.
Unfortunately none of the above post on GAA Board so we are unable to explore the cause of such adoration.
What a lovely bunch of "friends".
Quote from: yellowcard on April 12, 2023, 03:33:07 PM
I see the DUP have launched another charm offensive against the US administration as he embarks on his tour of Ireland. They just can't help themselves, before inviting someone else into their house for a cup of tea they would first need to prove their Britishness, anyone else is simply persona non grata.
Arlene has highlighted their train of thought though. If you are Irish or consider yourself Irish, you must hate the British, there is no other middle ground.
Sad really
On the outside, looking it, yet again.
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FthFvisXoAQ3Wuh?format=jpg&name=small)
Quote from: johnnycool on April 12, 2023, 04:11:34 PM
Quote from: yellowcard on April 12, 2023, 03:33:07 PM
I see the DUP have launched another charm offensive against the US administration as he embarks on his tour of Ireland. They just can't help themselves, before inviting someone else into their house for a cup of tea they would first need to prove their Britishness, anyone else is simply persona non grata.
Arlene has highlighted their train of thought though. If you are Irish or consider yourself Irish, you must hate the British, there is no other middle ground.
Sad really
It's only because she hates anything Irish. That has nothing to do with non DUP Brits.
Quote from: johnnycool on April 12, 2023, 04:19:59 PM
On the outside, looking it, yet again.
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FthFvisXoAQ3Wuh?format=jpg&name=small)
That image is like something you'd see in a horror film
And what's Les Ferdinand doing on tv talking about a presidential visit?
Don't like EU, don't like Ireland, Don't like America, Don't like Labour, who do the DUP like? Buddy buddy with the Israelis who killed more British soldiers than the IRA bck before Palestine troubles broke out after WW2. Their only love in left is, Russia.
I've never been able to decide if it's bigotry or stupidity/incompetence that defines Arlene. She certainly has demonstrated incompetence in each of her political roles culminating in RHI. I've come to the conclusion it's a bit of both.
Anyone with a pea for a brain would understand the importance and value of a US President visiting here in terms of potential for foreign investment. Made the mistake of listening to Nolan this morning for 10 minutes. A cesspit of negativity. Not many of his callers got the bigger picture around his visit.
https://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/northern-ireland/state-papers-dup-mp-william-mccrea-wanted-air-strikes-launched-on-the-republic-in-the-1980s/30867020.html (https://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/northern-ireland/state-papers-dup-mp-william-mccrea-wanted-air-strikes-launched-on-the-republic-in-the-1980s/30867020.html)
Quote from: GJL on April 12, 2023, 09:01:01 PM
https://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/northern-ireland/state-papers-dup-mp-william-mccrea-wanted-air-strikes-launched-on-the-republic-in-the-1980s/30867020.html (https://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/northern-ireland/state-papers-dup-mp-william-mccrea-wanted-air-strikes-launched-on-the-republic-in-the-1980s/30867020.html)
The singing bigot
Quote from: GJL on April 12, 2023, 09:01:01 PM
https://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/northern-ireland/state-papers-dup-mp-william-mccrea-wanted-air-strikes-launched-on-the-republic-in-the-1980s/30867020.html (https://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/northern-ireland/state-papers-dup-mp-william-mccrea-wanted-air-strikes-launched-on-the-republic-in-the-1980s/30867020.html)
Willie has wanted (and frequently obtained) many, many things his God wouldn't approve of in his time.
Quote from: gallsman on April 12, 2023, 09:11:03 PM
Quote from: GJL on April 12, 2023, 09:01:01 PM
https://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/northern-ireland/state-papers-dup-mp-william-mccrea-wanted-air-strikes-launched-on-the-republic-in-the-1980s/30867020.html (https://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/northern-ireland/state-papers-dup-mp-william-mccrea-wanted-air-strikes-launched-on-the-republic-in-the-1980s/30867020.html)
Willie has wanted (and frequently obtained) many, many things his God wouldn't approve of in his time.
Willie has been very much sidelined the past number of years. Maybe the superinjunction rumours were true.
If there's a free junket to the US on St. Patrick's Day, the DUP will not turn it down.
Had the misfortune of being on the same flight as McCrea to Heathrow a couple of months ago ... laughable how he tried to shield his face from everyone boarding the plane. The image of him on the platform with Billy 'King Rat' Wright won't be forgotten, hopefully his pal has the fires well stoked awaiting the arrival of the Baron of Magherafelt & Cookstown.
Quote from: LeoMc on April 12, 2023, 09:43:22 PM
Quote from: gallsman on April 12, 2023, 09:11:03 PM
Quote from: GJL on April 12, 2023, 09:01:01 PM
https://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/northern-ireland/state-papers-dup-mp-william-mccrea-wanted-air-strikes-launched-on-the-republic-in-the-1980s/30867020.html (https://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/northern-ireland/state-papers-dup-mp-william-mccrea-wanted-air-strikes-launched-on-the-republic-in-the-1980s/30867020.html)
Willie has wanted (and frequently obtained) many, many things his God wouldn't approve of in his time.
Willie has been very much sidelined the past number of years. Maybe the superinjunction rumours were true.
Aw now come on you can't leave us hanging like that. Spill??
Quote from: gallsman on April 12, 2023, 09:11:03 PM
Quote from: GJL on April 12, 2023, 09:01:01 PM
https://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/northern-ireland/state-papers-dup-mp-william-mccrea-wanted-air-strikes-launched-on-the-republic-in-the-1980s/30867020.html (https://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/northern-ireland/state-papers-dup-mp-william-mccrea-wanted-air-strikes-launched-on-the-republic-in-the-1980s/30867020.html)
Willie has wanted (and frequently obtained) many, many things his God wouldn't approve of in his time.
A bad one and no amount of praying can hide that.
Good living for a living.
After telling her audience that Biden hated the UK, Snarlene Foster has taken offence at the president not flying the union fleg on his presendential car.
At lunchtime today, Ben Lowry let slip that the DUP/Unionists are not good at diplomacy. Who knew!
Now Sammy has weighed in with his 2 cents worth and called Joe Biden a bigot like his mother.
Quote from: Orior on April 13, 2023, 09:30:16 PM
After telling her audience that Biden hated the UK, Snarlene Foster has taken offence at the president not flying the union fleg on his presendential car.
At lunchtime today, Ben Lowry let slip that the DUP/Unionists are not good at diplomacy. Who knew!
They really are going out of their way to be offended .
No amount of talking , pandering, gestures etc will ever be enough for them or will ever please them. It is time to reform Stormont , and move on without them. For all Stormont 's ills , at least reforming it will be a big statement , ie . that we've all had enough of your sh1t.
Quote from: Orior on April 13, 2023, 09:30:16 PM
After telling her audience that Biden hated the UK, Snarlene Foster has taken offence at the president not flying the union fleg on his presendential car.
At lunchtime today, Ben Lowry let slip that the DUP/Unionists are not good at diplomacy. Who knew!
When Ben's giving out, you're in a bad place.
Quote from: AustinPowers on April 13, 2023, 10:23:46 PM
Quote from: Orior on April 13, 2023, 09:30:16 PM
After telling her audience that Biden hated the UK, Snarlene Foster has taken offence at the president not flying the union fleg on his presendential car.
At lunchtime today, Ben Lowry let slip that the DUP/Unionists are not good at diplomacy. Who knew!
They really are going out of their way to be offended .
No amount of talking , pandering, gestures etc will ever be enough for them or will ever please them. It is time to reform Stormont , and move on without them. For all Stormont 's ills , at least reforming it will be a big statement , ie . that we've all had enough of your sh1t.
Sleepy Joe offending the Brits again with his speech in Dublin saying the UK Gov should be doing more with the Irish Gov to resolve the issues in NI, he's very right as since May (Theresa that is ) no UK Prime minister has given two flying fúcks for this place and yet the DUP lick their balls like the subservient slaves that they are..
I wonder will the TUV take many seats off the DUP in the local elections in May?
DUP still playing the 'hardline' card for this election, so it mightn't affect them that much.
Unionism is all over the place and Jeffrey Donaldson has had little or no control of the DUP since taking over. In the last few days you had Wilson, Foster, Wells and Paisley all queuing up from the sidelines to have a pop at the US presidents visit and then you have that ultra antagonist Bryson meeting with him regularly for god knows what. It all sits well with their base but the optics look terrible from the outside world looking in. But none of those DUP politicians have any money concerns so they can afford to whip up the masses for their own political and financial benefits.
Add to that their use of propaganda outlets such as the Newsletter, GB News and the Nolan Show which are used as a political tool and which are all designed to whip up fear & division and Unionism is in a sorry state. No long term strategy whatsoever except for hurdling through the next election with the same old tired, negative voices.
When these people stick 2 fingers up at the most powerful man in the world you really understand that there is no dealing, negotiating or finding common ground with them. They'd let the world burn so long as there was a union jack flying on a pole somewhere. The only question is when will protestants/unionists see that there is no future for them if they continue to vote in these dinosaurs
Hardline unionists have enough support for the next 10-15 years. By that stage majority of the hardcore elders who cling to the trouble era will be dead, then we should see a softer unionists stance the younger generation come through who care more about jobs and wages rather than flags and Britain.
Quote from: yellowcard on April 14, 2023, 09:58:34 AM
Unionism is all over the place and Jeffrey Donaldson has had little or no control of the DUP since taking over. In the last few days you had Wilson, Foster, Wells and Paisley all queuing up from the sidelines to have a pop at the US presidents visit and then you have that ultra antagonist Bryson meeting with him regularly for god knows what. It all sits well with their base but the optics look terrible from the outside world looking in. But none of those DUP politicians have any money concerns so they can afford to whip up the masses for their own political and financial benefits.
Add to that their use of propaganda outlets such as the Newsletter, GB News and the Nolan Show which are used as a political tool and which are all designed to whip up fear & division and Unionism is in a sorry state. No long term strategy whatsoever except for hurdling through the next election with the same old tired, negative voices.
It is a very fragmented party but for some reason it still works. I still think they basically hang on the ticket of "we're not SF".
I would say you're right tyrone08. I don't think they are going anywhere soon but they will eventually.
Also I wish their lies would be called out significantly more. They did not tell their voters they would bring down stormont prior to doing so and you see Pengelly swanning round there having earned nothing.
At least in one regard the world has now seen we have known all along - that they're bonkers and just can't be reasoned with at all.
Quote from: marty34 on April 14, 2023, 09:11:05 AM
I wonder will the TUV take many seats off the DUP in the local elections in May?
DUP still playing the 'hardline' card for this election, so it mightn't affect them that much.
Even if the DUP moved to a more moderate position, the TUV wouldn't take much off them. Always found this curious as to why the DUP feel they need to protect their right flank.
TUV have been on the go for 15 years now. I put their occasional popularity in the polls to the unionist electorates opinion of Jim Allister. Unfortunately for them, he can only stand in one constituency. Even the most prominent of their other candidates wouldn't be the most, shall we kindly say, impressive of individuals. When Jim goes, the party will go (bar an odd councilor).
Quote from: imtommygunn on April 14, 2023, 10:39:04 AM
Quote from: yellowcard on April 14, 2023, 09:58:34 AM
Unionism is all over the place and Jeffrey Donaldson has had little or no control of the DUP since taking over. In the last few days you had Wilson, Foster, Wells and Paisley all queuing up from the sidelines to have a pop at the US presidents visit and then you have that ultra antagonist Bryson meeting with him regularly for god knows what. It all sits well with their base but the optics look terrible from the outside world looking in. But none of those DUP politicians have any money concerns so they can afford to whip up the masses for their own political and financial benefits.
Add to that their use of propaganda outlets such as the Newsletter, GB News and the Nolan Show which are used as a political tool and which are all designed to whip up fear & division and Unionism is in a sorry state. No long term strategy whatsoever except for hurdling through the next election with the same old tired, negative voices.
It is a very fragmented party but for some reason it still works. I still think they basically hang on the ticket of "we're not SF".
I would say you're right tyrone08. I don't think they are going anywhere soon but they will eventually.
Also I wish their lies would be called out significantly more. They did not tell their voters they would bring down stormont prior to doing so and you see Pengelly swanning round there having earned nothing.
At least in one regard the world has now seen we have known all along - that they're bonkers and just can't be reasoned with at all.
This in a nutshell.
The days of saying each side is as bad as each other needs to be questioned as it was never the case and now anyone having to deal with the DUP are seeing what they are like and that includes Sunak who evidently bowed to their pressure and downgraded Bidens visit as per their wishes and made him and the UK look pathetic to the US.
https://www.irishecho.com/2023/4/cold-house-for-biden-no-love-lost-between-americans-and-british-during-visit#.ZDfEVTqtVSx.twitter (https://www.irishecho.com/2023/4/cold-house-for-biden-no-love-lost-between-americans-and-british-during-visit#.ZDfEVTqtVSx.twitter)
I think a lot will change in the next 10 years.
Now is like the old science experiment when it took ages for the water to change colour, then with one drop, the colour changes dramatically.
This is what is happening now with the demographics and the next few years, things will change dramatically.
Demographics is the big shaker now.
Quote from: marty34 on April 14, 2023, 11:20:18 AM
I think a lot will change in the next 10 years.
Now is like the old science experiment when it took ages for the water to change colour, then with one drop, the colour changes dramatically.
This is what is happening now with the demographics and the next few years, things will change dramatically.
Demographics is the big shaker now.
If you think demographics and demographics alone will deliver a united Ireland you are deluded.
Quote from: trailer on April 14, 2023, 12:06:43 PM
Quote from: marty34 on April 14, 2023, 11:20:18 AM
I think a lot will change in the next 10 years.
Now is like the old science experiment when it took ages for the water to change colour, then with one drop, the colour changes dramatically.
This is what is happening now with the demographics and the next few years, things will change dramatically.
Demographics is the big shaker now.
If you think demographics and demographics alone will deliver a united Ireland you are deluded.
Demographics alone won't work because too many nationalists leaning people don't vote or spunk their vote on the alliance party who talk a good game but literally have zero interest in a UI
Quote from: johnnycool on April 14, 2023, 11:12:47 AM
Quote from: imtommygunn on April 14, 2023, 10:39:04 AM
Quote from: yellowcard on April 14, 2023, 09:58:34 AM
Unionism is all over the place and Jeffrey Donaldson has had little or no control of the DUP since taking over. In the last few days you had Wilson, Foster, Wells and Paisley all queuing up from the sidelines to have a pop at the US presidents visit and then you have that ultra antagonist Bryson meeting with him regularly for god knows what. It all sits well with their base but the optics look terrible from the outside world looking in. But none of those DUP politicians have any money concerns so they can afford to whip up the masses for their own political and financial benefits.
Add to that their use of propaganda outlets such as the Newsletter, GB News and the Nolan Show which are used as a political tool and which are all designed to whip up fear & division and Unionism is in a sorry state. No long term strategy whatsoever except for hurdling through the next election with the same old tired, negative voices.
It is a very fragmented party but for some reason it still works. I still think they basically hang on the ticket of "we're not SF".
I would say you're right tyrone08. I don't think they are going anywhere soon but they will eventually.
Also I wish their lies would be called out significantly more. They did not tell their voters they would bring down stormont prior to doing so and you see Pengelly swanning round there having earned nothing.
At least in one regard the world has now seen we have known all along - that they're bonkers and just can't be reasoned with at all.
This in a nutshell.
The days of saying each side is as bad as each other needs to be questioned as it was never the case and now anyone having to deal with the DUP are seeing what they are like and that includes Sunak who evidently bowed to their pressure and downgraded Bidens visit as per their wishes and made him and the UK look pathetic to the US.
https://www.irishecho.com/2023/4/cold-house-for-biden-no-love-lost-between-americans-and-british-during-visit#.ZDfEVTqtVSx.twitter (https://www.irishecho.com/2023/4/cold-house-for-biden-no-love-lost-between-americans-and-british-during-visit#.ZDfEVTqtVSx.twitter)
You can see Biden has very very little regard for Sunak. The Brits are becoming an international embarassment tbh. Johnson's tenure and Brexit have really hammered that home.
Quote from: JPGJOHNNYG on April 14, 2023, 12:29:27 PM
Quote from: trailer on April 14, 2023, 12:06:43 PM
Quote from: marty34 on April 14, 2023, 11:20:18 AM
I think a lot will change in the next 10 years.
Now is like the old science experiment when it took ages for the water to change colour, then with one drop, the colour changes dramatically.
This is what is happening now with the demographics and the next few years, things will change dramatically.
Demographics is the big shaker now.
If you think demographics and demographics alone will deliver a united Ireland you are deluded.
Demographics alone won't work because too many nationalists leaning people don't vote or spunk their vote on the alliance party who talk a good game but literally have zero interest in a UI
You are right, demographics alone won't work but when the UK slides further into economic turmoil after Brexit, guess which part of it will bare the brunt? That and demographics will be the death of the union and the unionists know this but they just can't process it.
Quote from: Itchy on April 14, 2023, 01:10:03 PM
Quote from: JPGJOHNNYG on April 14, 2023, 12:29:27 PM
Quote from: trailer on April 14, 2023, 12:06:43 PM
Quote from: marty34 on April 14, 2023, 11:20:18 AM
I think a lot will change in the next 10 years.
Now is like the old science experiment when it took ages for the water to change colour, then with one drop, the colour changes dramatically.
This is what is happening now with the demographics and the next few years, things will change dramatically.
Demographics is the big shaker now.
If you think demographics and demographics alone will deliver a united Ireland you are deluded.
Demographics alone won't work because too many nationalists leaning people don't vote or spunk their vote on the alliance party who talk a good game but literally have zero interest in a UI
You are right, demographics alone won't work but when the UK slides further into economic turmoil after Brexit, guess which part of it will bare the brunt? That and demographics will be the death of the union and the unionists know this but they just can't process it.
You can't vote Alliance in a UI referendum.
The sitting on the fence will be over.
You have the choice of not voting!
Quote from: Rossfan on April 14, 2023, 01:29:49 PM
You have the choice of not voting!
You certainly do, but that won't prevent a majority from voting Tá
Quote from: Itchy on April 14, 2023, 01:10:03 PM
Quote from: JPGJOHNNYG on April 14, 2023, 12:29:27 PM
Quote from: trailer on April 14, 2023, 12:06:43 PM
Quote from: marty34 on April 14, 2023, 11:20:18 AM
I think a lot will change in the next 10 years.
Now is like the old science experiment when it took ages for the water to change colour, then with one drop, the colour changes dramatically.
This is what is happening now with the demographics and the next few years, things will change dramatically.
Demographics is the big shaker now.
If you think demographics and demographics alone will deliver a united Ireland you are deluded.
Demographics alone won't work because too many nationalists leaning people don't vote or spunk their vote on the alliance party who talk a good game but literally have zero interest in a UI
You are right, demographics alone won't work but when the UK slides further into economic turmoil after Brexit, guess which part of it will bare the brunt? That and demographics will be the death of the union and the unionists know this but they just can't process it.
If people on here think that unionism will change overnight, you's are deluded.
In 2023, the anti-Irish manifesto is still alive and well. Actually worse since the 1920's.
And then people think that unionism can be talked to etc.
How's that going?
Quote from: imtommygunn on April 14, 2023, 12:35:47 PM
Quote from: johnnycool on April 14, 2023, 11:12:47 AM
Quote from: imtommygunn on April 14, 2023, 10:39:04 AM
Quote from: yellowcard on April 14, 2023, 09:58:34 AM
Unionism is all over the place and Jeffrey Donaldson has had little or no control of the DUP since taking over. In the last few days you had Wilson, Foster, Wells and Paisley all queuing up from the sidelines to have a pop at the US presidents visit and then you have that ultra antagonist Bryson meeting with him regularly for god knows what. It all sits well with their base but the optics look terrible from the outside world looking in. But none of those DUP politicians have any money concerns so they can afford to whip up the masses for their own political and financial benefits.
Add to that their use of propaganda outlets such as the Newsletter, GB News and the Nolan Show which are used as a political tool and which are all designed to whip up fear & division and Unionism is in a sorry state. No long term strategy whatsoever except for hurdling through the next election with the same old tired, negative voices.
It is a very fragmented party but for some reason it still works. I still think they basically hang on the ticket of "we're not SF".
I would say you're right tyrone08. I don't think they are going anywhere soon but they will eventually.
Also I wish their lies would be called out significantly more. They did not tell their voters they would bring down stormont prior to doing so and you see Pengelly swanning round there having earned nothing.
At least in one regard the world has now seen we have known all along - that they're bonkers and just can't be reasoned with at all.
This in a nutshell.
The days of saying each side is as bad as each other needs to be questioned as it was never the case and now anyone having to deal with the DUP are seeing what they are like and that includes Sunak who evidently bowed to their pressure and downgraded Bidens visit as per their wishes and made him and the UK look pathetic to the US.
https://www.irishecho.com/2023/4/cold-house-for-biden-no-love-lost-between-americans-and-british-during-visit#.ZDfEVTqtVSx.twitter (https://www.irishecho.com/2023/4/cold-house-for-biden-no-love-lost-between-americans-and-british-during-visit#.ZDfEVTqtVSx.twitter)
You can see Biden has very very little regard for Sunak. The Brits are becoming an international embarassment tbh. Johnson's tenure and Brexit have really hammered that home.
Sunak won't be in post for long, he is a bit of a lame duck prime minister. He knows pragmatically that he has to forge closer relationship with the EU for the overall future economic health of the UK. But he is also hamstrung by the ERG Tories within his own party who will ditch and turn on him as soon as they get the chance. So he finds himself constantly creating culture wars around immigration and the likes.
Ireland has an opportunity now to forge ahead of the UK, being the primary English speaking EU country with a well educated workforce and low corporate tax rate. The north could benefit somewhat from this also with still being in the EU for goods, but looking at the difference in attitude in the last few weeks when the DUP went out of their way to insult the Americans, you would wonder will this investment be as forthcoming as it could potentially be.
https://www.gov.uk/register-to-vote
Make sure all your friends and family are updated and registered to vote at the correct address.
Quote from: marty34 on April 14, 2023, 02:00:05 PM
Quote from: Itchy on April 14, 2023, 01:10:03 PM
Quote from: JPGJOHNNYG on April 14, 2023, 12:29:27 PM
Quote from: trailer on April 14, 2023, 12:06:43 PM
Quote from: marty34 on April 14, 2023, 11:20:18 AM
I think a lot will change in the next 10 years.
Now is like the old science experiment when it took ages for the water to change colour, then with one drop, the colour changes dramatically.
This is what is happening now with the demographics and the next few years, things will change dramatically.
Demographics is the big shaker now.
If you think demographics and demographics alone will deliver a united Ireland you are deluded.
Demographics alone won't work because too many nationalists leaning people don't vote or spunk their vote on the alliance party who talk a good game but literally have zero interest in a UI
You are right, demographics alone won't work but when the UK slides further into economic turmoil after Brexit, guess which part of it will bare the brunt? That and demographics will be the death of the union and the unionists know this but they just can't process it.
If people on here think that unionism will change overnight, you's are deluded.
In 2023, the anti-Irish manifesto is still alive and well. Actually worse since the 1920's.
And then people think that unionism can be talked to etc.
How's that going?
Unionism is an election or two from slipping below 40% of the vote. The biggest question is why UI trails staying in UK in most opinion polls when the statelet is some shitshow. The economic performance of the 26 is light years ahead of the 6. Education prospects are better. Life span is longer and despite criticism of health service in 26, the standards are clearly higher. The xenophobia of the DUP is an embarrassment. There's extremists in 26 too but they command less than a percentage or two of electorate. Then the NI supporters coming out against Casement, unable to see that they have not a stadium for purpose in their mighty UK. You would think at this stage that UI in opinion polls would pull ahead. Why does clinging to the Brexit UK/Unionism still win the day - when a better alternative is now clearly visible.
Quote from: marty34 on April 14, 2023, 02:00:05 PM
Quote from: Itchy on April 14, 2023, 01:10:03 PM
Quote from: JPGJOHNNYG on April 14, 2023, 12:29:27 PM
Quote from: trailer on April 14, 2023, 12:06:43 PM
Quote from: marty34 on April 14, 2023, 11:20:18 AM
I think a lot will change in the next 10 years.
Now is like the old science experiment when it took ages for the water to change colour, then with one drop, the colour changes dramatically.
This is what is happening now with the demographics and the next few years, things will change dramatically.
Demographics is the big shaker now.
If you think demographics and demographics alone will deliver a united Ireland you are deluded.
Demographics alone won't work because too many nationalists leaning people don't vote or spunk their vote on the alliance party who talk a good game but literally have zero interest in a UI
You are right, demographics alone won't work but when the UK slides further into economic turmoil after Brexit, guess which part of it will bare the brunt? That and demographics will be the death of the union and the unionists know this but they just can't process it.
If people on here think that unionism will change overnight, you's are deluded.
In 2023, the anti-Irish manifesto is still alive and well. Actually worse since the 1920's.
And then people think that unionism can be talked to etc.
How's that going?
Hard-line unionists definitely not. The Union is above everything, health, prosperity, everything. Nothing trumps "Our Precious Union".
I think we need to convince some on what would be deemed "our side" who get lumped in with Nationalists and probably some even vote SF. We could start convincing them. And once we've done that we could move on to trickier targets like Alliance voters.
https://www.theguardian.com/stage/2018/sep/30/stephen-rea-british-identity-is-dwindling-brexit-samuel-beckett-cyprus-avenue#:~:text=The%20Belfast%20I%20grew%20up,flag%2C%20all%20that%20stuff.%E2%80%9D
The Belfast I grew up in was a pre-Troubles city, so not progressive in any meaningful way. Put simply, they would not do anything the Free State [Ireland] did. They got rid of the Irish language, they banned the Irish flag, all that stuff."
Unionists were, and still are, cut off not just from Catholics and from Ireland, but from the world. It's pure isolation. And it is so drummed into the young that they cannot let go of these views."
Quote from: weareros on April 14, 2023, 02:39:28 PM
Quote from: marty34 on April 14, 2023, 02:00:05 PM
Quote from: Itchy on April 14, 2023, 01:10:03 PM
Quote from: JPGJOHNNYG on April 14, 2023, 12:29:27 PM
Quote from: trailer on April 14, 2023, 12:06:43 PM
Quote from: marty34 on April 14, 2023, 11:20:18 AM
I think a lot will change in the next 10 years.
Now is like the old science experiment when it took ages for the water to change colour, then with one drop, the colour changes dramatically.
This is what is happening now with the demographics and the next few years, things will change dramatically.
Demographics is the big shaker now.
If you think demographics and demographics alone will deliver a united Ireland you are deluded.
Demographics alone won't work because too many nationalists leaning people don't vote or spunk their vote on the alliance party who talk a good game but literally have zero interest in a UI
You are right, demographics alone won't work but when the UK slides further into economic turmoil after Brexit, guess which part of it will bare the brunt? That and demographics will be the death of the union and the unionists know this but they just can't process it.
If people on here think that unionism will change overnight, you's are deluded.
In 2023, the anti-Irish manifesto is still alive and well. Actually worse since the 1920's.
And then people think that unionism can be talked to etc.
How's that going?
Unionism is an election or two from slipping below 40% of the vote. The biggest question is why UI trails staying in UK in most opinion polls when the statelet is some shitshow. The economic performance of the 26 is light years ahead of the 6. Education prospects are better. Life span is longer and despite criticism of health service in 26, the standards are clearly higher. The xenophobia of the DUP is an embarrassment. There's extremists in 26 too but they command less than a percentage or two of electorate. Then the NI supporters coming out against Casement, unable to see that they have not a stadium for purpose in their mighty UK. You would think at this stage that UI in opinion polls would pull ahead. Why does clinging to the Brexit UK/Unionism still win the day - when a better alternative is now clearly visible.
The reality is people fear change and until the benefits of a UI are clearly defined and risk free people will stay with the status quo. There is a lot of work to be donee on this. The current Irish Government is Luke warm at best on a UI and that doesn't help.
Quote from: Applesisapples on April 14, 2023, 03:02:20 PM
Quote from: weareros on April 14, 2023, 02:39:28 PM
Quote from: marty34 on April 14, 2023, 02:00:05 PM
Quote from: Itchy on April 14, 2023, 01:10:03 PM
Quote from: JPGJOHNNYG on April 14, 2023, 12:29:27 PM
Quote from: trailer on April 14, 2023, 12:06:43 PM
Quote from: marty34 on April 14, 2023, 11:20:18 AM
I think a lot will change in the next 10 years.
Now is like the old science experiment when it took ages for the water to change colour, then with one drop, the colour changes dramatically.
This is what is happening now with the demographics and the next few years, things will change dramatically.
Demographics is the big shaker now.
If you think demographics and demographics alone will deliver a united Ireland you are deluded.
Demographics alone won't work because too many nationalists leaning people don't vote or spunk their vote on the alliance party who talk a good game but literally have zero interest in a UI
You are right, demographics alone won't work but when the UK slides further into economic turmoil after Brexit, guess which part of it will bare the brunt? That and demographics will be the death of the union and the unionists know this but they just can't process it.
If people on here think that unionism will change overnight, you's are deluded.
In 2023, the anti-Irish manifesto is still alive and well. Actually worse since the 1920's.
And then people think that unionism can be talked to etc.
How's that going?
Unionism is an election or two from slipping below 40% of the vote. The biggest question is why UI trails staying in UK in most opinion polls when the statelet is some shitshow. The economic performance of the 26 is light years ahead of the 6. Education prospects are better. Life span is longer and despite criticism of health service in 26, the standards are clearly higher. The xenophobia of the DUP is an embarrassment. There's extremists in 26 too but they command less than a percentage or two of electorate. Then the NI supporters coming out against Casement, unable to see that they have not a stadium for purpose in their mighty UK. You would think at this stage that UI in opinion polls would pull ahead. Why does clinging to the Brexit UK/Unionism still win the day - when a better alternative is now clearly visible.
The reality is people fear change and until the benefits of a UI are clearly defined and risk free people will stay with the status quo. There is a lot of work to be donee on this. The current Irish Government is Luke warm at best on a UI and that doesn't help.
No surpise, NI is an economic basket case that has been insolvent for years. By taking on NI the RoI GDP would be taking a serious hit.
The reform needed in the health service would be huge. The hit with civil service jobs and pensions would be huge. Funding peace initiatives would be huge. Big undertaking for the south. Though please do it ;D
I think any referendum would need to be projected say 15 years or so in the event of a yes to unification.
There would need to be time to get things aligned, but you would imagine significant EU support and funding would be made available. If Brexit means Brexit for the long term, then it would be in the EU's interest to ensure that a United Ireland would be a comparative success.
Identity politics would be so complex. It's hard to visualise Sammy Wilson or Jim Allister in Dáil Éireann, and when the likes of Nigel or Arlene won't have the prospect of a House of Lords as a fallback, it might be more difficult to convince the politicians rather than the electorate.
Quote from: LC on April 14, 2023, 03:48:18 PM
Quote from: Applesisapples on April 14, 2023, 03:02:20 PM
Quote from: weareros on April 14, 2023, 02:39:28 PM
Quote from: marty34 on April 14, 2023, 02:00:05 PM
Quote from: Itchy on April 14, 2023, 01:10:03 PM
Quote from: JPGJOHNNYG on April 14, 2023, 12:29:27 PM
Quote from: trailer on April 14, 2023, 12:06:43 PM
Quote from: marty34 on April 14, 2023, 11:20:18 AM
I think a lot will change in the next 10 years.
Now is like the old science experiment when it took ages for the water to change colour, then with one drop, the colour changes dramatically.
This is what is happening now with the demographics and the next few years, things will change dramatically.
Demographics is the big shaker now.
If you think demographics and demographics alone will deliver a united Ireland you are deluded.
Demographics alone won't work because too many nationalists leaning people don't vote or spunk their vote on the alliance party who talk a good game but literally have zero interest in a UI
You are right, demographics alone won't work but when the UK slides further into economic turmoil after Brexit, guess which part of it will bare the brunt? That and demographics will be the death of the union and the unionists know this but they just can't process it.
If people on here think that unionism will change overnight, you's are deluded.
In 2023, the anti-Irish manifesto is still alive and well. Actually worse since the 1920's.
And then people think that unionism can be talked to etc.
How's that going?
Unionism is an election or two from slipping below 40% of the vote. The biggest question is why UI trails staying in UK in most opinion polls when the statelet is some shitshow. The economic performance of the 26 is light years ahead of the 6. Education prospects are better. Life span is longer and despite criticism of health service in 26, the standards are clearly higher. The xenophobia of the DUP is an embarrassment. There's extremists in 26 too but they command less than a percentage or two of electorate. Then the NI supporters coming out against Casement, unable to see that they have not a stadium for purpose in their mighty UK. You would think at this stage that UI in opinion polls would pull ahead. Why does clinging to the Brexit UK/Unionism still win the day - when a better alternative is now clearly visible.
The reality is people fear change and until the benefits of a UI are clearly defined and risk free people will stay with the status quo. There is a lot of work to be donee on this. The current Irish Government is Luke warm at best on a UI and that doesn't help.
No surpise, NI is an economic basket case that has been insolvent for years. By taking on NI the RoI GDP would be taking a serious hit.
The current Irish Government is on borrowed time and FG especially will be gone after next election
Quote from: seafoid on April 14, 2023, 03:00:50 PM
https://www.theguardian.com/stage/2018/sep/30/stephen-rea-british-identity-is-dwindling-brexit-samuel-beckett-cyprus-avenue#:~:text=The%20Belfast%20I%20grew%20up,flag%2C%20all%20that%20stuff.%E2%80%9D
The Belfast I grew up in was a pre-Troubles city, so not progressive in any meaningful way. Put simply, they would not do anything the Free State [Ireland] did. They got rid of the Irish language, they banned the Irish flag, all that stuff."
Unionists were, and still are, cut off not just from Catholics and from Ireland, but from the world. It's pure isolation. And it is so drummed into the young that they cannot let go of these views."
Seafoid
Fabulous article and genuinely first time I read the poem
Thanks
Stormont budget cuts look to be very deep and severe. CHH is out to punish the DUP (and the rest of us by extension) for their treatment of May when they were in a confidence and supply agreement and for their unwillingness to go into Stormont.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-65378104
The likes of this article today is telling, usually when the private sector gets it a bit tight the construction industry still has public sector works to fall back on however if the housing markets continues to slow down you are looking at a perfect storm.
I would not be surprised if the budget comes out on Friday, always a good day to try and out put out bad news, especially on a bank holiday weekend.
Is he punishing DUP or are these hard choices the Assembly parties would rather London make. Could not see SF or DUP wanting to be associated with water charges, higher university fees, prescription charges, over 60s travel, cuts in civil service workforce. But if Assembly was up and running, how would the £600m financial hole be raised?
The DUP are expected to go back to Stormont next month after the local elections.
Quote from: seafoid on April 25, 2023, 07:59:27 PM
The DUP are expected to go back to Stormont next month after the local elections.
Do you think so?
I'd say they'll not go in until after the marching season...plus with a sweetner from they Tory Party to sell to their faithful as a win.
Quote from: marty34 on April 25, 2023, 08:01:52 PM
Quote from: seafoid on April 25, 2023, 07:59:27 PM
The DUP are expected to go back to Stormont next month after the local elections.
Do you think so?
I'd say they'll not go in until after the marching season...plus with a sweetner from they Tory Party to sell to their faithful as a win.
That's what Newton Emerson expects
It was always about holding out to after the LE, go as hard line as the TUV so as not to lose too many seats. After that then to see about getting some way back into Stormont.
It's a pity their voter base is simply that bigoted that they don't care about public services or schools or hospitals to see through this sh*t show.
I remain to be convinced they'll go back into government tbh. I think they are shooting themselves in the foot if they do and will lose votes going in with a SF first minister.
On the flip side the north is unworkable with no government so they are also shooting themselves in the foot by not going in as it will expedite talk of a united ireland further than they have already done.
I'm sceptical as well as to whether they'll go back. But huge cuts are coming and huge choices. Public works are paused for the foreseeable and other publicly funded groups are shutting their doors it is a terrible look for all our parties but especially the DUP.
CHH is out to punish the DUP. Two reasons. One because they won't form a Government and two just to show those uppity Ulster upstarts that they don't rule WM.
If the DUP go in to stormont in the morning, are things likely to change? Would the wee 6 have access to any more finances? Genuinely interested to hear?
Quote from: trailer on April 26, 2023, 09:17:00 AM
I'm sceptical as well as to whether they'll go back. But huge cuts are coming and huge choices. Public works are paused for the foreseeable and other publicly funded groups are shutting their doors it is a terrible look for all our parties but especially the DUP.
CHH is out to punish the DUP. Two reasons. One because they won't form a Government and two just to show those uppity Ulster upstarts that they don't rule WM.
I don't think the torys have forgot the "milk and no sugar" statement from Ian Og, there is a bit more knife twisting and revenge in store yet.
Quote from: trueblue1234 on April 26, 2023, 10:37:56 AM
If the DUP go in to stormont in the morning, are things likely to change? Would the wee 6 have access to any more finances? Genuinely interested to hear?
Some have suggested the harsh cuts are to force DUP back in and then they - ie DUP - will get a reward. Brian Feeney is sceptical of that in todays Irish News as Britain is broke and there's no Tory votes in North.
Arlene was right!
The IRA will offer hundreds of billions of dollars in grants, loans, tax incentives and subsidies to support the production of goods such as electric vehicles and green energy - the catch being that recipients must manufacture on US soil.
Quote from: trueblue1234 on April 26, 2023, 10:37:56 AM
If the DUP go in to stormont in the morning, are things likely to change? Would the wee 6 have access to any more finances? Genuinely interested to hear?
25 years post the GFA the British Government are long past the point of bank rolling the wee 6, time for us this country to enter the real world of operating within your means. British Government do not give 2 hoots about this place and DUP have absolutely no leverage. All politicians will at no doubt return to Stormont in the next few months but will probably be motivated by getting their wages and those and all their cronies back up to were it was. By that stage all the tough calls will have been made (which none of them would ever have the balls to do) so easy for them to just point the figure at Westminster.
Quote from: weareros on April 26, 2023, 10:55:31 AM
Quote from: trueblue1234 on April 26, 2023, 10:37:56 AM
If the DUP go in to stormont in the morning, are things likely to change? Would the wee 6 have access to any more finances? Genuinely interested to hear?
Some have suggested the harsh cuts are to force DUP back in and then they - ie DUP - will get a reward. Brian Feeney is sceptical of that in todays Irish News as Britain is broke and there's no Tory votes in North.
I am too. I think there are monies owed etc and basically the chickens have come home to roost from overspending and stuff like that.
Quote from: imtommygunn on April 26, 2023, 11:15:50 AM
Quote from: weareros on April 26, 2023, 10:55:31 AM
Quote from: trueblue1234 on April 26, 2023, 10:37:56 AM
If the DUP go in to stormont in the morning, are things likely to change? Would the wee 6 have access to any more finances? Genuinely interested to hear?
Some have suggested the harsh cuts are to force DUP back in and then they - ie DUP - will get a reward. Brian Feeney is sceptical of that in todays Irish News as Britain is broke and there's no Tory votes in North.
I am too. I think there are monies owed etc and basically the chickens have come home to roost from overspending and stuff like that.
Must be serious money wasted on ridiculous things because where is all this overspending happening? The roads are a joke, probably less craters on the moon. The health service is on it's knees, staff are overworked and underpaid and teachers/nurses/doctors if they've any sense are heading to the middle east or down under if they have any sense. Education not much better, schools are unbelievably underfunded.
There is talk of EU money owed too. I read a bit on it but no expert tbh.
The health service here is absolutely crippled. I don't know how it gets out of it's current situation at all. The rest of it as you say isn't great either.
Quote from: imtommygunn on April 26, 2023, 12:13:33 PM
There is talk of EU money owed too. I read a bit on it but no expert tbh.
The health service here is absolutely crippled. I don't know how it gets out of it's current situation at all. The rest of it as you say isn't great either.
The European Social Fund was worth £40m per year to charities in North. DUP mantra was this was UK's money just coming back from EU and Brexit funds would match and exceed. When the ESF recently stopped, it was replaced by UK fund of £57m... then the fine print, £57m over two years.
Meanwhile Nationalism and its leader being all grown up
https://m.independent.ie/irish-news/politics/sinn-feins-michelle-oneill-to-attend-the-coronation-of-king-charles/a826316762.html
Quote from: Rossfan on April 26, 2023, 01:45:00 PM
Meanwhile Nationalism and its leader being all grown up
https://m.independent.ie/irish-news/politics/sinn-feins-michelle-oneill-to-attend-the-coronation-of-king-charles/a826316762.html
Watch wee Jim's head completely explode now!
Quote from: trueblue1234 on April 26, 2023, 10:37:56 AM
If the DUP go in to stormont in the morning, are things likely to change? Would the wee 6 have access to any more finances? Genuinely interested to hear?
Open to correction on any of this, but, as I understood it, last year Stormont took an advance from Westminster of a few hundred million to cover costs. Things like covid and inflation were blamed for this need. They then wanted to pay the few hundred million back over ~5 years, so that any cuts necessary to square things up would be more manageable.
Westminster, maybe because the Brits are broke, or because they don't give a shite about the north, or because they want to stick it to the DUP, said nah, you're paying it all back this year. Add in inflation and the hole in the budget jumps another few hundred million.
Health accounts for a massive proportion of all spending and it's already fucked, so can't be cut at all. Education is the other big ticket item and you can't cut too much there either, because kids have to go to school. So the ~£600 million hole gets plugged with deeper cuts in all the other Departments - and with a lot of things just getting axed altogether.
Completely dysfunctional way to run things, but dysfunction is our specialty up here. Even if funding is restored next year, it will take years to work back from the damages of the 2023 cuts. Some previously funded areas will just have died off altogether, never to return. These are the things that leave us behind our neighbours in the south or elsewhere in western Europe on most important metrics.
There is only one blindingly obvious solution to this.
Wee Jeff been outsmarted by Michelle who is playing a blinder imo.
Watch this space . I'm Not convinced that the DUP aren't the ones who are playing smart and end up getting what they want.
Getting people out to vote is a challenge,but if you play an extreme card , then it can motivate to vote . The danger of softer politics is that it doesn't motivate .
If your position is intransigent, others end up moving to accommodate you , and you can claim victory in your intransigence. This seige mentality can work to your advantage. As we have seen in many occasions .
The final sweetener from the tories to get DUP on board , may be a big payout to boost the NI budget, for which the DUP can also claim victory , just in time for the polls.
The Tories aren't stupid. There's a real chance that Labour will not secure a majority and the Tories could once again be dependent on DUP votes , and in any event they won't want to anger the ERG section of the party by hanging the DUP out to dry.
Meantime a SF soft approach might get a few more SDLP votes on board but is unlikely to result in a surge.
There are craftier people than us making the decisions , and history has shown that whatever happens , Tories won't want to kick the DUP in the teeth .
It ain't over 'til it's over
Quote from: 6th sam on April 26, 2023, 07:16:43 PM
Watch this space . I'm Not convinced that the DUP aren't the ones who are playing smart and end up getting what they want.
Getting people out to vote is a challenge,but if you play an extreme card , then it can motivate to vote . The danger of softer politics is that it doesn't motivate .
If your position is intransigent, others end up moving to accommodate you , and you can claim victory in your intransigence. This seige mentality can work to your advantage. As we have seen in many occasions .
The final sweetener from the tories to get DUP on board , may be a big payout to boost the NI budget, for which the DUP can also claim victory , just in time for the polls.
The Tories aren't stupid. There's a real chance that Labour will not secure a majority and the Tories could once again be dependent on DUP votes , and in any event they won't want to anger the ERG section of the party by hanging the DUP out to dry.
Meantime a SF soft approach might get a few more SDLP votes on board but is unlikely to result in a surge.
There are craftier people than us making the decisions , and history has shown that whatever happens , Tories won't want to kick the DUP in the teeth .
It ain't over 'til it's over
The Tories don't mind shafting the DUP.
Quote from: seafoid on April 26, 2023, 08:04:15 PM
Quote from: 6th sam on April 26, 2023, 07:16:43 PM
Watch this space . I'm Not convinced that the DUP aren't the ones who are playing smart and end up getting what they want.
Getting people out to vote is a challenge,but if you play an extreme card , then it can motivate to vote . The danger of softer politics is that it doesn't motivate .
If your position is intransigent, others end up moving to accommodate you , and you can claim victory in your intransigence. This seige mentality can work to your advantage. As we have seen in many occasions .
The final sweetener from the tories to get DUP on board , may be a big payout to boost the NI budget, for which the DUP can also claim victory , just in time for the polls.
The Tories aren't stupid. There's a real chance that Labour will not secure a majority and the Tories could once again be dependent on DUP votes , and in any event they won't want to anger the ERG section of the party by hanging the DUP out to dry.
Meantime a SF soft approach might get a few more SDLP votes on board but is unlikely to result in a surge.
There are craftier people than us making the decisions , and history has shown that whatever happens , Tories won't want to kick the DUP in the teeth .
It ain't over 'til it's over
The Tories don't mind shafting the DUP.
They've supported the DUP shafting the rest of us for years, what makes u think they'll find a conscience all of a sudden ?
Quote from: 6th sam on April 26, 2023, 09:22:01 PM
Quote from: seafoid on April 26, 2023, 08:04:15 PM
Quote from: 6th sam on April 26, 2023, 07:16:43 PM
Watch this space . I'm Not convinced that the DUP aren't the ones who are playing smart and end up getting what they want.
Getting people out to vote is a challenge,but if you play an extreme card , then it can motivate to vote . The danger of softer politics is that it doesn't motivate .
If your position is intransigent, others end up moving to accommodate you , and you can claim victory in your intransigence. This seige mentality can work to your advantage. As we have seen in many occasions .
The final sweetener from the tories to get DUP on board , may be a big payout to boost the NI budget, for which the DUP can also claim victory , just in time for the polls.
The Tories aren't stupid. There's a real chance that Labour will not secure a majority and the Tories could once again be dependent on DUP votes , and in any event they won't want to anger the ERG section of the party by hanging the DUP out to dry.
Meantime a SF soft approach might get a few more SDLP votes on board but is unlikely to result in a surge.
There are craftier people than us making the decisions , and history has shown that whatever happens , Tories won't want to kick the DUP in the teeth .
It ain't over 'til it's over
The Tories don't mind shafting the DUP.
They've supported the DUP shafting the rest of us for years, what makes u think they'll find a conscience all of a sudden ?
The DUP shafted Theresa May. So they had to pay
Quote from: seafoid on April 26, 2023, 09:26:01 PM
Quote from: 6th sam on April 26, 2023, 09:22:01 PM
Quote from: seafoid on April 26, 2023, 08:04:15 PM
Quote from: 6th sam on April 26, 2023, 07:16:43 PM
Watch this space . I'm Not convinced that the DUP aren't the ones who are playing smart and end up getting what they want.
Getting people out to vote is a challenge,but if you play an extreme card , then it can motivate to vote . The danger of softer politics is that it doesn't motivate .
If your position is intransigent, others end up moving to accommodate you , and you can claim victory in your intransigence. This seige mentality can work to your advantage. As we have seen in many occasions .
The final sweetener from the tories to get DUP on board , may be a big payout to boost the NI budget, for which the DUP can also claim victory , just in time for the polls.
The Tories aren't stupid. There's a real chance that Labour will not secure a majority and the Tories could once again be dependent on DUP votes , and in any event they won't want to anger the ERG section of the party by hanging the DUP out to dry.
Meantime a SF soft approach might get a few more SDLP votes on board but is unlikely to result in a surge.
There are craftier people than us making the decisions , and history has shown that whatever happens , Tories won't want to kick the DUP in the teeth .
It ain't over 'til it's over
The Tories don't mind shafting the DUP.
They've supported the DUP shafting the rest of us for years, what makes u think they'll find a conscience all of a sudden ?
The DUP shafted Theresa May. So they had to pay
We'll see . Would love to be proved wrong but think the DUP will get all the help they need when it comes down to it
The torys know they can hang the dup out to dry, and they also know when they need the dup all they have to do is click their fingers and they will come running in a pathetic attempt to prove their Britishness ( probably to themselves)
Quote from: ardtole on April 26, 2023, 09:59:08 PM
The torys know they can hang the dup out to dry, and they also know when they need the dup all they have to do is click their fingers and they will come running in a pathetic attempt to prove their Britishness ( probably to themselves)
Yup 100% agree
If anyone treated you like that though , you'd tell them where to go. But the DUP clearly have no dignity or backbone. Then again , they can't very well tell the Brits to get stuffed , otherwise who do they be loyal to? They're trapped in a loveless marriage
Carrot and stick.
Whilst the Torys shaft the DUP and by extension all of us....
https://www.breakingnews.ie/ireland/varadkar-mcdonald-and-martin-call-for-northern-ireland-executive-to-be-restored-1467954.html
Varadkar said if an Executive is formed, Ireland is ready to use its Shared Island Fund to assist Northern Ireland with issues like housing, the health service, enterprise, the cost of living and budget deficit.
Hmmmm the first 2 items.....
But it's nice to help the poor relations....
Quote from: 6th sam on April 26, 2023, 07:16:43 PM
Watch this space . I'm Not convinced that the DUP aren't the ones who are playing smart and end up getting what they want.
Getting people out to vote is a challenge,but if you play an extreme card , then it can motivate to vote . The danger of softer politics is that it doesn't motivate .
If your position is intransigent, others end up moving to accommodate you , and you can claim victory in your intransigence. This seige mentality can work to your advantage. As we have seen in many occasions .
The final sweetener from the tories to get DUP on board , may be a big payout to boost the NI budget, for which the DUP can also claim victory , just in time for the polls.
The Tories aren't stupid. There's a real chance that Labour will not secure a majority and the Tories could once again be dependent on DUP votes , and in any event they won't want to anger the ERG section of the party by hanging the DUP out to dry.
Meantime a SF soft approach might get a few more SDLP votes on board but is unlikely to result in a surge.
There are craftier people than us making the decisions , and history has shown that whatever happens , Tories won't want to kick the DUP in the teeth .
It ain't over 'til it's over
I've always that doubt in my mind as well, the DUP always seem to come up smelling of roses even when it's their own doing they're neck deep in shíte.
Quote from: Rossfan on April 27, 2023, 12:08:39 PM
Hmmmm the first 2 items.....
But it's nice to help the poor relations....
Roscommon ain't exactly a rich cousin.
Didn't know where put this one, got a video there (Am sure it's doing the rounds) with some lad Adrian Douglas - AD Window cleaning) trying to kick in a single Catholic girl door in, in Lurgan. Wonder will the complaintants of the flag removal at the fball match be quick to reply to this.
Quote from: Wildweasel74 on May 02, 2023, 09:31:01 AM
Didn't know where put this one, got a video there (Am sure it's doing the rounds) with some lad Adrian Douglas - AD Window cleaning) trying to kick in a single Catholic girl door in, in Lurgan. Wonder will the complaintants of the flaf removal at the fball match be quick to reply to this.
AD is also a Facebook friend of Carla Loveheart.
Quote from: Wildweasel74 on May 02, 2023, 09:31:01 AM
Didn't know where put this one, got a video there (Am sure it's doing the rounds) with some lad Adrian Douglas - AD Window cleaning) trying to kick in a single Catholic girl door in, in Lurgan. Wonder will the complaintants of the flaf removal at the fball match be quick to reply to this.
I'd presume given that both brothers are well known Glenavon fans that the local DUP will be asking the IFA to investigate and sanction them.
Quote from: Orior on May 02, 2023, 09:39:44 AM
Quote from: Wildweasel74 on May 02, 2023, 09:31:01 AM
Didn't know where put this one, got a video there (Am sure it's doing the rounds) with some lad Adrian Douglas - AD Window cleaning) trying to kick in a single Catholic girl door in, in Lurgan. Wonder will the complaintants of the flaf removal at the fball match be quick to reply to this.
AD is also a Facebook friend of Carla Loveheart.
She has called it verbal abuse rather than anything secterian. He has taken down his business facebook page.
21 year old single mother at that.
Lockhart is up there with the worst of them tbh and that is saying something. How is someone that young who likely barely lived through troubles so bitter and twisted.
Update - he's been arrested.
Battering her door is "verbal abuse"? Pull the other one, Carla.
Sure he only wanted to talk to her. Them Fenians trying to deflect from the real issues, them Derry wans stealing flegs and them Armagh ones singing.
Quote from: RedHand88 on May 02, 2023, 10:09:58 AM
Update - he's been arrested.
And let go, no hate crime charge either...
Quote from: johnnycool on May 02, 2023, 10:58:29 AM
Quote from: RedHand88 on May 02, 2023, 10:09:58 AM
Update - he's been arrested.
And let go, no hate crime charge either...
I could be wrong, but I thought there was no such thing as a "hate crime" here when charging someone. It was under review and about to be upgraded before the Stormont shutdown.
Can anyone legally minded confirm?
Police not call the flagpole removal a hate crime.
After the flagpole nonsense and a few days of pretty equal whataboutery tallies from both sides, the loyalist bully boy has handed team Nationalism a serious advantage on Twitter.
And by f**k are our lot playing the violins.
I've muted and unfollowed a hefty number of political threads and people the past week, in a hope of never seeing six county shit again, but my timeline is still overflowing with outrage and angst.
Everyone, on both sides, just needs to take a breath and say nothing .
Quote from: Wildweasel74 on May 02, 2023, 12:50:14 PM
Police not call the flagpole removal a hate crime.
It can be described as a hate crime, but it can't be charged as a hate crime (I think).
One man's hate crime is another man's burning effigies on bonfires. Culture.
Quote from: thewobbler on May 02, 2023, 01:06:21 PM
After the flagpole nonsense and a few days of pretty equal whataboutery tallies from both sides, the loyalist bully boy has handed team Nationalism a serious advantage on Twitter.
And by f**k are our lot playing the violins.
I've muted and unfollowed a hefty number of political threads and people the past week, in a hope of never seeing six county shit again, but my timeline is still overflowing with outrage and angst.
Everyone, on both sides, just needs to take a breath and say nothing .
Aye, ignore it, that will make it go away.
Only a couple of weeks ago a few teenagers were battered in Belfast city by a couple of bigots (including an ex squaddie) for the audacity of wearing a GAA jersey. I'm sure if it was one of your Ballyholland minors you'd have a different outlook. God knows what those rats would have done on Sunday had that girl answered her door.
He probably done her windows, noticed when looking through them she had some catholic paraphernalia about!
Like copies of the RTE guide and so on and so forth?
He's only 34 ffs :o
Quote from: Aristo 60 on May 02, 2023, 09:27:27 PM
Like copies of the RTE guide and so on and so forth?
Who da f**k buys a tv mag ;D
Probably a Copy of the Wolfe Tones greatest hits
Quote from: Aristo 60 on May 02, 2023, 09:27:27 PM
Like copies of the RTE guide and so on and so forth?
Ireland's own
Jam in the press
Padre Pio on the wall
Wouldn't need go in my dad's house with the Maze altar they used to do, some hunger strike calendar, plus a few hunger strike items. Beginning to wonder should I mention to him it's 40years ago.
Quote from: RedHand88 on May 02, 2023, 09:51:16 PM
Quote from: Aristo 60 on May 02, 2023, 09:27:27 PM
Like copies of the RTE guide and so on and so forth?
Ireland's own
Jam in the press
Padre Pio on the wall
Sacred heart picture
JFK picture
Jack Charlton and Maurice Setters picture
Ludo trophy
I think I need to take a break from watching Father Ted
Quote from: general_lee on May 02, 2023, 09:10:57 PM
Quote from: thewobbler on May 02, 2023, 01:06:21 PM
After the flagpole nonsense and a few days of pretty equal whataboutery tallies from both sides, the loyalist bully boy has handed team Nationalism a serious advantage on Twitter.
And by f**k are our lot playing the violins.
I've muted and unfollowed a hefty number of political threads and people the past week, in a hope of never seeing six county shit again, but my timeline is still overflowing with outrage and angst.
Everyone, on both sides, just needs to take a breath and say nothing .
Aye, ignore it, that will make it go away.
Only a couple of weeks ago a few teenagers were battered in Belfast city by a couple of bigots (including an ex squaddie) for the audacity of wearing a GAA jersey. I'm sure if it was one of your Ballyholland minors you'd have a different outlook. God knows what those rats would have done on Sunday had that girl answered her door.
Point is.
Every town, village and city across the world this past weekend would have been witness to vile and repugnant acts of bullying and brutality. It's just, unfortunately, how humans are prone to treating each other.
The two sides of the six county spectrum jumping on every incident, no matter how trivial (and I'm not describing this particular one as trivial by the way) with over the top horror and disgust, mixed together with a king sized dollop of whataboutery, is helping nobody. It's just pumping more and more unnecessary air into sectarian ways of living.
f**k that. We don't need it. Just accept that there's c***ts of humans in every town, village and city. The colours they're wearing is a disguise, not a uniform.
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on May 02, 2023, 09:44:22 PM
Quote from: Aristo 60 on May 02, 2023, 09:27:27 PM
Like copies of the RTE guide and so on and so forth?
Who da f**k buys a tv mag ;D
Probably a Copy of the Wolfe Tones greatest hits
Obviously someone must be buying them if they keep printing them
Quote from: thewobbler on May 02, 2023, 10:39:14 PM
Quote from: general_lee on May 02, 2023, 09:10:57 PM
Quote from: thewobbler on May 02, 2023, 01:06:21 PM
After the flagpole nonsense and a few days of pretty equal whataboutery tallies from both sides, the loyalist bully boy has handed team Nationalism a serious advantage on Twitter.
And by f**k are our lot playing the violins.
I've muted and unfollowed a hefty number of political threads and people the past week, in a hope of never seeing six county shit again, but my timeline is still overflowing with outrage and angst.
Everyone, on both sides, just needs to take a breath and say nothing .
Aye, ignore it, that will make it go away.
Only a couple of weeks ago a few teenagers were battered in Belfast city by a couple of bigots (including an ex squaddie) for the audacity of wearing a GAA jersey. I'm sure if it was one of your Ballyholland minors you'd have a different outlook. God knows what those rats would have done on Sunday had that girl answered her door.
Point is.
Every town, village and city across the world this past weekend would have been witness to vile and repugnant acts of bullying and brutality. It's just, unfortunately, how humans are prone to treating each other.
The two sides of the six county spectrum jumping on every incident, no matter how trivial (and I'm not describing this particular one as trivial by the way) with over the top horror and disgust, mixed together with a king sized dollop of whataboutery, is helping nobody. It's just pumping more and more unnecessary air into sectarian ways of living.
f**k that. We don't need it. Just accept that there's c***ts of humans in every town, village and city. The colours they're wearing is a disguise, not a uniform.
Breathtaking ignorance, naiveté or stupidity. Take your pick. You didn't mean to trivialise the incident yet fluked it anyway.
Bothsidesing is every bit as bad as whataboutery.
Quote from: Dougal Maguire on May 02, 2023, 10:52:49 PM
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on May 02, 2023, 09:44:22 PM
Quote from: Aristo 60 on May 02, 2023, 09:27:27 PM
Like copies of the RTE guide and so on and so forth?
Who da f**k buys a tv mag ;D
Probably a Copy of the Wolfe Tones greatest hits
Obviously someone must be buying them if they keep printing them
I suppose the older generation buy it but huge drop recently with things online
43,000 from last period of being recorded. No figures since 2018
Drop from 260,000 in 2002
Will Snarlene do an exclusive for GB News on the Ulster Final which features two British teams from Northern Ireland, Londonderry and Armagh?
Geez, I nearly punched myself for typing that 😐
Anyone hiring Bryson can't be the brightest ....
https://www.rte.ie/news/ireland/2023/0627/1391371-ni-video/
Doesn't deserve any airtime RF. If people would stop talking about him he would fade back into anonymity where he should be... (Not a dig at you)
Bryson is not only an egomaniac and a charlatan, he's a deranged hypocrite.
He is morbidly obsessed with Irish Republicanism - although I have him muted on twitter it's hard not to escape his daily rants about SF and the IRA.
Today, he defended some nonsense bigotry at a bonfire in east Belfast, dismissing a swastika and paramilitary paraphernalia as the work of "over exuberant" kids.
Not sure about that. He's the main driver in unionism nowadays.
He's the link between the DUP, OO and their loyalist armies etc.
He has too put input but ironic thing is that everything he touches fails big time
Quote from: marty34 on June 27, 2023, 04:14:14 PM
Not sure about that. He's the main driver in unionism nowadays.
He's the link between the DUP, OO and their loyalist armies etc.
He has too put input but ironic thing is that everything he touches fails big time
Who's funding him though?
Jamie reckoned she shouldn't have been sacked as there was a shortage of healthcare workers
Some shortage of brains anyway whatever about healthcare staff.
Sorta need try find that Bryson pic on holiday yrs ago in front of the tricolour, and plaster it everywhere on twitter.
https://twitter.com/50SavesOfDeGea/status/297042332556083200?t=kJMkFYIU9Fcaorg1T7jssw&s=19 (https://twitter.com/50SavesOfDeGea/status/297042332556083200?t=kJMkFYIU9Fcaorg1T7jssw&s=19)
https://twitter.com/FcsadakoMartin/status/746096134230257664?t=rCN0MDtRBfVN2cbUSRqCjg&s=19 (https://twitter.com/FcsadakoMartin/status/746096134230257664?t=rCN0MDtRBfVN2cbUSRqCjg&s=19)
Quote from: johnnycool on June 27, 2023, 04:47:00 PM
Quote from: marty34 on June 27, 2023, 04:14:14 PM
Not sure about that. He's the main driver in unionism nowadays.
He's the link between the DUP, OO and their loyalist armies etc.
He has too put input but ironic thing is that everything he touches fails big time
Who's funding him though?
Good question. I think he's some Director of the Union or something...and I use that term loosely.
I asked before - somebody must be helping him. How could he tweet so much (rubbish) every 5 mins from 7 am to 11pm. Madness.
If the DUP show any sign of weakness, he'll be all over them. He seems to be in the No Surrender camp but has the ear of Allister and Donaldson also.
Watched the case of Lisa Dorrian last night on tv, absolutely horrible story and how it's been closed off for so long and reason I've brought it here is that the likes of Bryson's crew in that north Down area all know who done it!
Hopefully they get some justice
Think the police know who did it, proving it another matter.
Quote from: Wildweasel74 on June 30, 2023, 12:03:05 AM
Think the police know who did it, proving it another matter.
There aren't many murders here throughout the troubles that the police/ authorities don't know who carried them out. As has been said actually proving it in a court of law is a different story.
Quote from: NAG1 on June 30, 2023, 08:55:48 AM
Quote from: Wildweasel74 on June 30, 2023, 12:03:05 AM
Think the police know who did it, proving it another matter.
There aren't many murders here throughout the troubles that the police/ authorities don't know who carried them out. As has been said actually proving it in a court of law is a different story.
But christ sake, in this case someone let the family know where they disposed of her and let them have a bitta closure in that regard, the mother died purely down to the murder of her child, this person has murdered one and brought far too early the death of another.
They really tried to get at the partner of the person they suspect of the killing I felt near the end of the show, but they are probably up to their neck in shit that they don't care.
Some heartless cnuts out there
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on June 27, 2023, 10:08:22 PM
Watched the case of Lisa Dorrian last night on tv, absolutely horrible story and how it's been closed off for so long and reason I've brought it here is that the likes of Bryson's crew in that north Down area all know who done it!
Hopefully they get some justice
Horrendous. I don't think I could watch a show on it. The poor family.
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on June 30, 2023, 09:22:53 AM
Quote from: NAG1 on June 30, 2023, 08:55:48 AM
Quote from: Wildweasel74 on June 30, 2023, 12:03:05 AM
Think the police know who did it, proving it another matter.
There aren't many murders here throughout the troubles that the police/ authorities don't know who carried them out. As has been said actually proving it in a court of law is a different story.
But christ sake, in this case someone let the family know where they disposed of her and let them have a bitta closure in that regard, the mother died purely down to the murder of her child, this person has murdered one and brought far too early the death of another.
They really tried to get at the partner of the person they suspect of the killing I felt near the end of the show, but they are probably up to their neck in shit that they don't care.
Some heartless cnuts out there
I haven't seen the show, but I've often thought this too.
How easy would an anonymous tip be? It would give the family some level of comfort to be able to have a funeral and get some kind of closure.
It's un-imaginable the pain of something like that.
I see the OO, via pressure from their various stakeholders, are trying to raise the Dumcree parade again...25 years later.
Trying to force the issue again.
They tried this in Ardoyne/Crumlin Rd a few weeks ago also but got rejected. The locals had come a an agreement a good few years ago but OO tried to renage on it until the Parades Commission rejected it.
Trying to up the ante once again. Very sad.
Quote from: marty34 on June 30, 2023, 10:36:05 AM
I see the OO, via pressure from their various stakeholders, are trying to raise the Dumcree parade again...25 years later.
Trying to force the issue again.
They tried this in Ardoyne/Crumlin Rd a few weeks ago also but got rejected. The locals had come a an agreement a good few years ago but OO tried to renage on it until the Parades Commission rejected it.
Trying to up the ante once again. Very sad.
They're feeling isolated and let down by their leaders here and their betters in London, there's no love for them so they need to express themselves and their culture of exceptionalism the only way they know how, by triumphantly marching through Nationalist areas to get their fix.
It's going to take a while to wane them off that particular fix.
Quote from: marty34 on June 30, 2023, 10:36:05 AM
I see the OO, via pressure from their various stakeholders, are trying to raise the Dumcree parade again...25 years later.
Trying to force the issue again.
They tried this in Ardoyne/Crumlin Rd a few weeks ago also but got rejected. The locals had come a an agreement a good few years ago but OO tried to renage on it until the Parades Commission rejected it.
Trying to up the ante once again. Very sad.
Seems a big effort this year - even with that Larne bonfire.
You'd think people would have learned when someone died there but appears not.
Quote from: imtommygunn on June 30, 2023, 10:59:39 AM
Quote from: marty34 on June 30, 2023, 10:36:05 AM
I see the OO, via pressure from their various stakeholders, are trying to raise the Dumcree parade again...25 years later.
Trying to force the issue again.
They tried this in Ardoyne/Crumlin Rd a few weeks ago also but got rejected. The locals had come a an agreement a good few years ago but OO tried to renage on it until the Parades Commission rejected it.
Trying to up the ante once again. Very sad.
Seems a big effort this year - even with that Larne bonfire.
You'd think people would have learned when someone died there but appears not.
If you saw some of the social media from them at the start of the Larne build, they dont give one f%*k about the lad who died last year. It seemed to give them some sort of sick amusement.
MEA council completely bricking it I'd say, hoping that it goes off without major injury or death.
But yeah there is a serious effort from them at the moment to paint this victim ideology, everyone is against them no one cares etc
The fact that these grievances are mainly self inflicted seems to escape them.
Nationalists outnumber Unionists
Catholics outnumber Protestants
How are we going to keep NI in the UK?? I know!, we'll try and get Orange marches back down the Garvaghy Road, and through Ardoyne. And we'll build the biggest f**king obscene monstrosity of a bonfire and fill it with everything belonging to Kafflicks and set it on fire.
In addition we'll encourage the DUP/Newsletter/Bel Tel to keep attacking the GAA and the Irish Language.
That should keep the Union secure for another 100 years! A foolproof plan.
And, I almost forgot, we will not share power as a junior partner to a Fenian first minister. Northern Ireland. Stronger Together.
No point being a sick organisation without acting like a sick organisation ::)
Quote from: tbrick18 on June 30, 2023, 10:05:49 AM
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on June 30, 2023, 09:22:53 AM
Quote from: NAG1 on June 30, 2023, 08:55:48 AM
Quote from: Wildweasel74 on June 30, 2023, 12:03:05 AM
Think the police know who did it, proving it another matter.
There aren't many murders here throughout the troubles that the police/ authorities don't know who carried them out. As has been said actually proving it in a court of law is a different story.
But christ sake, in this case someone let the family know where they disposed of her and let them have a bitta closure in that regard, the mother died purely down to the murder of her child, this person has murdered one and brought far too early the death of another.
They really tried to get at the partner of the person they suspect of the killing I felt near the end of the show, but they are probably up to their neck in shit that they don't care.
Some heartless cnuts out there
I haven't seen the show, but I've often thought this too.
How easy would an anonymous tip be? It would give the family some level of comfort to be able to have a funeral and get some kind of closure.
It's un-imaginable the pain of something like that.
The only thing I can think of is that there would be some sort of DNA or other evidence even after all these years that would mean no anonymous tips
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-66102199 (https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-66102199)
Orange order/Pan nationalist front putting restrictions on their own parade. Lundys!
Belfast is an absolute disaster for their parades between drunkenness, anti-social behaviour etc.
I don't think it's as bad as that with parades elsewhere.
Quote from: RedHand88 on July 06, 2023, 10:06:29 AM
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-66102199 (https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-66102199)
Orange order/Pan nationalist front putting restrictions on their own parade. Lundys!
They whip up the absolute dregs of society into a sectarian frenzy and then can't understand why these scum act the way they do. Bizarre
Quote from: imtommygunn on July 06, 2023, 10:18:46 AM
Belfast is an absolute disaster for their parades between drunkenness, anti-social behaviour etc.
I don't think it's as bad as that with parades elsewhere.
Belfast is just the worst. And if you go do Donegal you get the inverse of these people in Bundoran and the likes. Anyone who can disappears on the 12th week.
I wonder who leaked the report/review.
Hopefully it's a sign that these sectarian hatefests are getting less popular.
Quote from: Rossfan on July 07, 2023, 11:51:50 AM
Hopefully it's a sign that these sectarian hatefests are getting less popular.
This will lead to a bumper turn out this year and the fall away again next year. No one wants to walk 10 miles and listen to hymns anymore when you can stand, drink and piss in the street for the day!
It's basically turned into to a rave in Sandy row now. Which is the issue for the elders.
Quote from: Jeepers Creepers on July 07, 2023, 01:50:57 PM
Quote from: Rossfan on July 07, 2023, 11:51:50 AM
Hopefully it's a sign that these sectarian hatefests are getting less popular.
This will lead to a bumper turn out this year and the fall away again next year. No one wants to walk 10 miles and listen to hymns anymore when you can stand, drink and piss in the street for the day!
It's basically turned into to a rave in Sandy row now. Which is the issue for the elders.
It's a day on the beer on sandy row
Similar to saint patricks day in the holy lands
Not much temperance and religious fervour
Do Alliance members/voters engage in the Order Order parades and stuff anymore? Or Ulster Rugby type followers. Much of it seems more loyalist and working class in nature?
(https://media.tenor.com/iu8rcC0LpRAAAAAd/no-surrender-loyalist.gif)
Quote from: full moon on July 07, 2023, 02:26:31 PM
Do Alliance members/voters engage in the Order Order parades and stuff anymore? Or Ulster Rugby type followers. Much of it seems more loyalist and working class in nature?
Some of the rugby farmer types still love it. More and more people from a Unionist background are seeing it for the anachronistic shite that it is.
Quote from: full moon on July 07, 2023, 02:26:31 PM
Do Alliance members/voters engage in the Order Order parades and stuff anymore? Or Ulster Rugby type followers. Much of it seems more loyalist and working class in nature?
The OO is different in character in country parts and in Belfast. In many country parts a few oul fellows get together a few times a year and in most cases do not cause any great trouble to anyone, not least because they have to live there all year round. in Belfast it lets the sectarian slums take over the main streets, but the educated classes have less and less to do with it.
Quote from: Duine Inteacht Eile on July 07, 2023, 03:37:40 PM
Quote from: armaghniac on July 07, 2023, 03:24:08 PM
Quote from: full moon on July 07, 2023, 02:26:31 PM
Do Alliance members/voters engage in the Order Order parades and stuff anymore? Or Ulster Rugby type followers. Much of it seems more loyalist and working class in nature?
The OO is different in character in country parts and in Belfast. In many country parts a few oul fellows get together a few times a year and in most cases do not cause any great trouble to anyone, not least because they have to live there all year round. in Belfast it lets the sectarian slums take over the main streets, but the educated classes have less and less to do with it.
Don't be fooled. Let's remember that those singing about Michaela McAreavey in that band hall were not from Belfast's slums but indeed from God fearing South Derry.
Yeah some places in Armagh are ferociously anti-Irish/Catholic. The area stretching from Portadown-Armagh-Markethill-Tandragee is fairly staunch.
Quote from: general_lee on July 07, 2023, 04:39:51 PM
Quote from: Duine Inteacht Eile on July 07, 2023, 03:37:40 PM
Quote from: armaghniac on July 07, 2023, 03:24:08 PM
Quote from: full moon on July 07, 2023, 02:26:31 PM
Do Alliance members/voters engage in the Order Order parades and stuff anymore? Or Ulster Rugby type followers. Much of it seems more loyalist and working class in nature?
The OO is different in character in country parts and in Belfast. In many country parts a few oul fellows get together a few times a year and in most cases do not cause any great trouble to anyone, not least because they have to live there all year round. in Belfast it lets the sectarian slums take over the main streets, but the educated classes have less and less to do with it.
Don't be fooled. Let's remember that those singing about Michaela McAreavey in that band hall were not from Belfast's slums but indeed from God fearing South Derry.
Yeah some places in Armagh are ferociously anti-Irish/Catholic. The area stretching from Portadown-Armagh-Markethill-Tandragee is fairly staunch.
I have no direct experience of this, in Cross' we did not ever have an Orange lodge unlike places like Birr or Roscrea. But in the 6 counties things are not homogenous, community relations might be decent in Poyntzpass but not in Tandragee, and local Orange lodge might fit into that.
The Gaa social episode with Brian canavan was very interesting. He talked a lot about this and the cross community relationships in his community. What you say is like what he says. It varies greatly from place to place. I imagine all it takes is a few eejits on either side to sour these relations.
Quote from: imtommygunn on July 07, 2023, 05:26:00 PM
The Gaa social episode with Brian canavan was very interesting. He talked a lot about this and the cross community relationships in his community. What you say is like what he says. It varies greatly from place to place. I imagine all it takes is a few eejits on either side to sour these relations.
I was thinking of that in my example, and previous comment by Tony Fearon, Presumably if there was a non confrontational approach in the local lodge then that is reflected in their leadership over time, a son takes over from his father on the committee or whatever. You'd have some places in Fermanagh with civil relations and while the likes of Kilkeel is not good, there could be other places in South Down where this was not the case.
Poyntzpass is the benchmark for good relations. Can always remember when Armagh were going well late 90s/early 00s, the red, white & blue bunting came down straight after the 12th and the orange/white Armagh bunting went up, sometimes with a bit of cross over.
Quote from: armaghniac on July 07, 2023, 07:13:21 PM
Quote from: imtommygunn on July 07, 2023, 05:26:00 PM
The Gaa social episode with Brian canavan was very interesting. He talked a lot about this and the cross community relationships in his community. What you say is like what he says. It varies greatly from place to place. I imagine all it takes is a few eejits on either side to sour these relations.
I was thinking of that in my example, and previous comment by Tony Fearon, Presumably if there was a non confrontational approach in the local lodge then that is reflected in their leadership over time, a son takes over from his father on the committee or whatever. You'd have some places in Fermanagh with civil relations and while the likes of Kilkeel is not good, there could be other places in South Down where this was not the case.
You'll find relationships are good when in areas were they're in a minority and generally in them areas the nationalists let them get on with it. I drove into a small parade last Sunday in South Armagh about two miles from my house. I didn't even know it was on, two cops held me for 10 mins till it walked passed, they stopped at a memorial said a few prayers played about 3 tunes and back into there cars and away.
In areas where they can still lord it over the pesky fenians you find the tensions.
Quote from: general_lee on July 07, 2023, 07:30:40 PM
Poyntzpass is the benchmark for good relations. Can always remember when Armagh were going well late 90s/early 00s, the red, white & blue bunting came down straight after the 12th and the orange/white Armagh bunting went up, sometimes with a bit of cross over.
Now they would have to do it the other way around!
Quote from: pbat on July 07, 2023, 07:46:49 PM
You'll find relationships are good when in areas were they're in a minority and generally in them areas the nationalists let them get on with it. I drove into a small parade last Sunday in South Armagh about two miles from my house. I didn't even know it was on, two cops held me for 10 mins till it walked passed, they stopped at a memorial said a few prayers played about 3 tunes and back into there cars and away.
In areas where they can still lord it over the pesky fenians you find the tensions.
Exactly.
Quote from: general_lee on July 07, 2023, 04:39:51 PM
Quote from: Duine Inteacht Eile on July 07, 2023, 03:37:40 PM
Quote from: armaghniac on July 07, 2023, 03:24:08 PM
Quote from: full moon on July 07, 2023, 02:26:31 PM
Do Alliance members/voters engage in the Order Order parades and stuff anymore? Or Ulster Rugby type followers. Much of it seems more loyalist and working class in nature?
The OO is different in character in country parts and in Belfast. In many country parts a few oul fellows get together a few times a year and in most cases do not cause any great trouble to anyone, not least because they have to live there all year round. in Belfast it lets the sectarian slums take over the main streets, but the educated classes have less and less to do with it.
Don't be fooled. Let's remember that those singing about Michaela McAreavey in that band hall were not from Belfast's slums but indeed from God fearing South Derry.
Yeah some places in Armagh are ferociously anti-Irish/Catholic. The area stretching from Portadown-Armagh-Markethill-Tandragee is fairly staunch.
There is a village called Richhill it's a stop on the Belfast-Cavan/Monaghan bus route. It's in that area I think?
It seemed like a staunch loyalist enclave, there was UVF flags on main Street I think and Soldier F. Not a place that seemed like stopping for a pint in lol
Quote from: general_lee on July 07, 2023, 03:06:14 PM
Quote from: full moon on July 07, 2023, 02:26:31 PM
Do Alliance members/voters engage in the Order Order parades and stuff anymore? Or Ulster Rugby type followers. Much of it seems more loyalist and working class in nature?
Some of the rugby farmer types still love it. More and more people from a Unionist background are seeing it for the anachronistic shite that it is.
It's just sad and pathetic at this point, it just creates more hatred and the cycle continues.
It does seem like some more "educated" or upper class unionists/prods probably find it embarrassing.
Quote from: full moon on July 07, 2023, 09:24:03 PM
Quote from: general_lee on July 07, 2023, 04:39:51 PM
Quote from: Duine Inteacht Eile on July 07, 2023, 03:37:40 PM
Quote from: armaghniac on July 07, 2023, 03:24:08 PM
Quote from: full moon on July 07, 2023, 02:26:31 PM
Do Alliance members/voters engage in the Order Order parades and stuff anymore? Or Ulster Rugby type followers. Much of it seems more loyalist and working class in nature?
The OO is different in character in country parts and in Belfast. In many country parts a few oul fellows get together a few times a year and in most cases do not cause any great trouble to anyone, not least because they have to live there all year round. in Belfast it lets the sectarian slums take over the main streets, but the educated classes have less and less to do with it.
Don't be fooled. Let's remember that those singing about Michaela McAreavey in that band hall were not from Belfast's slums but indeed from God fearing South Derry.
Yeah some places in Armagh are ferociously anti-Irish/Catholic. The area stretching from Portadown-Armagh-Markethill-Tandragee is fairly staunch.
There is a village called Richhill it's a stop on the Belfast-Cavan/Monaghan bus route. It's in that area I think?
It seemed like a staunch loyalist enclave, there was UVF flags on main Street I think and Soldier F. Not a place that seemed like stopping for a pint in lol
And Richhill would be quite an affluent village, a lot of police officers and solicitors/barristers live in it.
Quote from: pbat on July 07, 2023, 09:45:05 PM
Quote from: full moon on July 07, 2023, 09:24:03 PM
Quote from: general_lee on July 07, 2023, 04:39:51 PM
Quote from: Duine Inteacht Eile on July 07, 2023, 03:37:40 PM
Quote from: armaghniac on July 07, 2023, 03:24:08 PM
Quote from: full moon on July 07, 2023, 02:26:31 PM
Do Alliance members/voters engage in the Order Order parades and stuff anymore? Or Ulster Rugby type followers. Much of it seems more loyalist and working class in nature?
The OO is different in character in country parts and in Belfast. In many country parts a few oul fellows get together a few times a year and in most cases do not cause any great trouble to anyone, not least because they have to live there all year round. in Belfast it lets the sectarian slums take over the main streets, but the educated classes have less and less to do with it.
Don't be fooled. Let's remember that those singing about Michaela McAreavey in that band hall were not from Belfast's slums but indeed from God fearing South Derry.
Yeah some places in Armagh are ferociously anti-Irish/Catholic. The area stretching from Portadown-Armagh-Markethill-Tandragee is fairly staunch.
There is a village called Richhill it's a stop on the Belfast-Cavan/Monaghan bus route. It's in that area I think?
It seemed like a staunch loyalist enclave, there was UVF flags on main Street I think and Soldier F. Not a place that seemed like stopping for a pint in lol
And Richhill would be quite an affluent village, a lot of police officers and solicitors/barristers live in it.
It seems like in even the most sectarian areas there are PSNI living there.
Quote from: naka on July 07, 2023, 02:21:01 PM
Quote from: Jeepers Creepers on July 07, 2023, 01:50:57 PM
Quote from: Rossfan on July 07, 2023, 11:51:50 AM
Hopefully it's a sign that these sectarian hatefests are getting less popular.
This will lead to a bumper turn out this year and the fall away again next year. No one wants to walk 10 miles and listen to hymns anymore when you can stand, drink and piss in the street for the day!
It's basically turned into to a rave in Sandy row now. Which is the issue for the elders.
It's a day on the beer on sandy row
Similar to saint patricks day in the holy lands
Not much temperance and religious fervour
Had the pleasure of spending a 12th of July on the 10th floor of the city hospital tower block with the Mrs one year, Birds Eye view of Sandy Row. Pure piss session then at about 5 o'clock a crowd of lads (50 odd) came from Shaftesbury Square direction and an unreal riot started between them and the Sandy Row crowd, kicked absolute shite out of each other, bottles, sticks and everything. Went on for about 10 minutes before the cops intervened, at least 20 taken to hospital, started firing stuff at the ambulances too and one ambulance man got assaulted. It was class viewing, funny enough though not one mention of it on the news that evening
Plenty like thst on both sides. The GAA gets them too when a county starts to go on a run. The part timers come out for the bus trip and drink and abuse the regulars and start fights. We are no saints either.
I thought Clones this year for the Down v Armagh game was very messy.
Quote from: full moon on July 07, 2023, 09:24:03 PM
Quote from: general_lee on July 07, 2023, 04:39:51 PM
Quote from: Duine Inteacht Eile on July 07, 2023, 03:37:40 PM
Quote from: armaghniac on July 07, 2023, 03:24:08 PM
Quote from: full moon on July 07, 2023, 02:26:31 PM
Do Alliance members/voters engage in the Order Order parades and stuff anymore? Or Ulster Rugby type followers. Much of it seems more loyalist and working class in nature?
The OO is different in character in country parts and in Belfast. In many country parts a few oul fellows get together a few times a year and in most cases do not cause any great trouble to anyone, not least because they have to live there all year round. in Belfast it lets the sectarian slums take over the main streets, but the educated classes have less and less to do with it.
Don't be fooled. Let's remember that those singing about Michaela McAreavey in that band hall were not from Belfast's slums but indeed from God fearing South Derry.
Yeah some places in Armagh are ferociously anti-Irish/Catholic. The area stretching from Portadown-Armagh-Markethill-Tandragee is fairly staunch.
There is a village called Richhill it's a stop on the Belfast-Cavan/Monaghan bus route. It's in that area I think?
It seemed like a staunch loyalist enclave, there was UVF flags on main Street I think and Soldier F. Not a place that seemed like stopping for a pint in lol
Not far from Markethill. Fairly staunch and bitter for the most part yeah!
Quote from: Armagh18 on July 08, 2023, 12:50:29 PM
Quote from: full moon on July 07, 2023, 09:24:03 PM
Quote from: general_lee on July 07, 2023, 04:39:51 PM
Quote from: Duine Inteacht Eile on July 07, 2023, 03:37:40 PM
Quote from: armaghniac on July 07, 2023, 03:24:08 PM
Quote from: full moon on July 07, 2023, 02:26:31 PM
Do Alliance members/voters engage in the Order Order parades and stuff anymore? Or Ulster Rugby type followers. Much of it seems more loyalist and working class in nature?
The OO is different in character in country parts and in Belfast. In many country parts a few oul fellows get together a few times a year and in most cases do not cause any great trouble to anyone, not least because they have to live there all year round. in Belfast it lets the sectarian slums take over the main streets, but the educated classes have less and less to do with it.
Don't be fooled. Let's remember that those singing about Michaela McAreavey in that band hall were not from Belfast's slums but indeed from God fearing South Derry.
Yeah some places in Armagh are ferociously anti-Irish/Catholic. The area stretching from Portadown-Armagh-Markethill-Tandragee is fairly staunch.
There is a village called Richhill it's a stop on the Belfast-Cavan/Monaghan bus route. It's in that area I think?
It seemed like a staunch loyalist enclave, there was UVF flags on main Street I think and Soldier F. Not a place that seemed like stopping for a pint in lol
Not far from Markethill. Fairly staunch and bitter for the most part yeah!
Not the famous Rian O'Neill, but Moneymore seems one place where people can tolerate each other.
https://twitter.com/RyanONeill07/status/1678106522503528449
Know that lad.
I worked there for about 5 years. Last year travelling to work I saw Derry flags and Union Jacks flying together on the same lamp post. I didn't know if it was a (hopefully)more tolerant way of getting along. Or did neither side have a Tyrone flag to burn 😛
There were also some Catholics at the Moygashel bonfire. They were Catholics from an integrated school but still claimed as a win by loyalists.
Quote from: Orior on July 10, 2023, 12:54:45 AM
There were also some Catholics at the Moygashel bonfire. They were Catholics from an integrated school but still claimed as a win by loyalists.
This always baffles me when they claim that Catholics/ Nationalists attend these bonfires etc.
No educated self respecting non-loyalist would put themselves in that position, to be at an event that is directly aimed hating on on that section of the community.
Pure unadulterated hate fests.
Quote from: NAG1 on July 10, 2023, 09:31:15 AM
Quote from: Orior on July 10, 2023, 12:54:45 AM
There were also some Catholics at the Moygashel bonfire. They were Catholics from an integrated school but still claimed as a win by loyalists.
This always baffles me when they claim that Catholics/ Nationalists attend these bonfires etc.
No educated self respecting non-loyalist would put themselves in that position, to be at an event that is directly aimed hating on on that section of the community.
Pure unadulterated hate fests.
#
Just like the Westie's Feile, and usually the Wolfe Tones?
Quote from: 5times5times on July 10, 2023, 10:15:08 AM
Quote from: NAG1 on July 10, 2023, 09:31:15 AM
Quote from: Orior on July 10, 2023, 12:54:45 AM
There were also some Catholics at the Moygashel bonfire. They were Catholics from an integrated school but still claimed as a win by loyalists.
This always baffles me when they claim that Catholics/ Nationalists attend these bonfires etc.
No educated self respecting non-loyalist would put themselves in that position, to be at an event that is directly aimed hating on on that section of the community.
Pure unadulterated hate fests.
#
Just like the Westie's Feile, and usually the Wolfe Tones?
While not a massive fan of the WT and definitely think it was time for the Feile to move on from this a few years ago, I don't see any comparison.
One is a sectarian hate fest aimed at the destruction of one side of the community, the other is one act at a week long music festival.
Quote from: Orior on July 10, 2023, 12:54:45 AM
There were also some Catholics at the Moygashel bonfire. They were Catholics from an integrated school but still claimed as a win by loyalists.
Don't let them impress you with those "facts".
Moygashel is one of the least tolerant areas in the north. Regularly have had signs up in the area about "foreigners" not being allowed. UVF, Para and Soldier F flags. The election centre used to be in a primary school at the periphery of moygashel and the locals used to stand at the gates with flags in hand intimidating one side of the community, until the electoral commission changed the location to the leisure centre. Subsequently we had the poor us being persecuted cries.
IF there were catholics for an integrated school at the bonfire (and that's a big IF), then I would suspect they are from those mixed marriages where the leaning is still towards the loyalist/unionist side. Knowing something about the ilk of some (not all) families in the integrated schools in that area, many are only there because its the closest school. The secondary doesnt require transfer tests for entry and the primary has plenty of families who are anything but integrated. It's one of my main issues with integrated education here actually, in my experience they are not particularly integrated in practice. I've heard kids being called fenian scum in an integrated ps for example and primarily all staff are from a loyalist/unionist background.
Everyone needs a tribe. I work with a lot of "PUL" people, some love the whole "carry on", others are embarrassed by it. The enthusiasts are not bad people but they enjoy the opportunity for a get- together and a bit of craic. Not saying for a minute there aren't bad actors involved but the same can also be said of our side. Humans are savages, thats how we got to be the apex predators.
Choose not to be paranoid/offended and the headers will lose their grip.
Quote from: 5times5times on July 10, 2023, 10:15:08 AM
Quote from: NAG1 on July 10, 2023, 09:31:15 AM
Quote from: Orior on July 10, 2023, 12:54:45 AM
There were also some Catholics at the Moygashel bonfire. They were Catholics from an integrated school but still claimed as a win by loyalists.
This always baffles me when they claim that Catholics/ Nationalists attend these bonfires etc.
No educated self respecting non-loyalist would put themselves in that position, to be at an event that is directly aimed hating on on that section of the community.
Pure unadulterated hate fests.
#
Just like the Westie's Feile, and usually the Wolfe Tones?
What a weird/silly post.
Quote from: 5times5times on July 10, 2023, 10:15:08 AM
Quote from: NAG1 on July 10, 2023, 09:31:15 AM
Quote from: Orior on July 10, 2023, 12:54:45 AM
There were also some Catholics at the Moygashel bonfire. They were Catholics from an integrated school but still claimed as a win by loyalists.
This always baffles me when they claim that Catholics/ Nationalists attend these bonfires etc.
No educated self respecting non-loyalist would put themselves in that position, to be at an event that is directly aimed hating on on that section of the community.
Pure unadulterated hate fests.
#
Just like the Westie's Feile, and usually the Wolfe Tones?
Not sure what you're comparing here.
The Féile has been a brilliant addition to West Belfast. It started for all the right reasons and cutting down on the anti-social behaviour etc. A great initiative.
They have loads of debates, sport, talks and concerts etc. for everyone.
I don't think they burn union jacks or unionist election posters etc. at the Wolfe Tones concerts.
Quote from: marty34 on July 10, 2023, 11:17:19 AM
Quote from: 5times5times on July 10, 2023, 10:15:08 AM
Quote from: NAG1 on July 10, 2023, 09:31:15 AM
Quote from: Orior on July 10, 2023, 12:54:45 AM
There were also some Catholics at the Moygashel bonfire. They were Catholics from an integrated school but still claimed as a win by loyalists.
This always baffles me when they claim that Catholics/ Nationalists attend these bonfires etc.
No educated self respecting non-loyalist would put themselves in that position, to be at an event that is directly aimed hating on on that section of the community.
Pure unadulterated hate fests.
#
Just like the Westie's Feile, and usually the Wolfe Tones?
Not sure what you're comparing here.
The Féile has been a brilliant addition to West Belfast. It started for all the right reasons and cutting down on the anti-social behaviour etc. A great initiative.
They have loads of debates, sport, talks and concerts etc. for everyone.
I don't think they burn union jacks or unionist election posters etc. at the Wolfe Tones concerts.
Definitely improved from the Springhill days ;D
I was at one when I was 11, we stayed with a mixed family at Ballykeel. I remember when going out to play with the children they said don't tell them u surname or religion. Otherwise I be top spot on that Bonfire. Same family ended up getting fire bombed out of Ballykeel years later.
Was up around the north coast at the weekend.....must a be a fair few neanderthals around Portrush as the place was full of flegs. I can only presume that the people around Portstewart have a bit more cop on as thankfully it was not plastered in the same way.
Quote from: LC on July 11, 2023, 08:25:12 AM
Was up around the north coast at the weekend.....must a be a fair few neanderthals around Portrush as the place was full of flegs. I can only presume that the people around Portstewart have a bit more cop on as thankfully it was not plastered in the same way.
The caravaners love it ;D
It is a kip of a place especially over the summer months, shame really when it could be such a tourist attraction.
Quote from: NAG1 on July 11, 2023, 08:44:02 AM
Quote from: LC on July 11, 2023, 08:25:12 AM
Was up around the north coast at the weekend.....must a be a fair few neanderthals around Portrush as the place was full of flegs. I can only presume that the people around Portstewart have a bit more cop on as thankfully it was not plastered in the same way.
The caravaners love it ;D
It is a kip of a place especially over the summer months, shame really when it could be such a tourist attraction.
You are 100% correct you can only imagine what bus loads of foreign tourists think of the likes of Bushmills when they drive through it around this time of year on their way to the Giants Causeway and it absolutely plastered with flags , red white and blue kerbs etc.
Quote from: LC on July 11, 2023, 09:47:28 AM
Quote from: NAG1 on July 11, 2023, 08:44:02 AM
Quote from: LC on July 11, 2023, 08:25:12 AM
Was up around the north coast at the weekend.....must a be a fair few neanderthals around Portrush as the place was full of flegs. I can only presume that the people around Portstewart have a bit more cop on as thankfully it was not plastered in the same way.
The caravaners love it ;D
It is a kip of a place especially over the summer months, shame really when it could be such a tourist attraction.
You are 100% correct you can only imagine what bus loads of foreign tourists think of the likes of Bushmills when they drive through it around this time of year on their way to the Giants Causeway and it absolutely plastered with flags , red white and blue kerbs etc.
They probably think it's a festival of some sort. They wouldn't know any difference.
Portstewart is nice but a lot of the places up round the neck of woods are "fleggy" and I don't think would be voting yes in the united ireland vote... Same when you drive round the coast road from waterfoot to carrickfergus - lovely in so many places then you hit the flags everywhere. There's one wee place I think there are more union jacks than there are buildings in the village.
In mainly nationalist villages all over the north, there's always a few flags up at the 12 th (for 2/3 weeks) and, as an outsider, you'd think it's a majority unionist village/town whereas in fact, it could be up to 70% or 80% nationalist.
All about perception and I firmly believe, as a result of this, unionists can't see the demographics changing so quickly in certain villages and towns.
Quote from: LC on July 11, 2023, 09:47:28 AM
Quote from: NAG1 on July 11, 2023, 08:44:02 AM
Quote from: LC on July 11, 2023, 08:25:12 AM
Was up around the north coast at the weekend.....must a be a fair few neanderthals around Portrush as the place was full of flegs. I can only presume that the people around Portstewart have a bit more cop on as thankfully it was not plastered in the same way.
The caravaners love it ;D
It is a kip of a place especially over the summer months, shame really when it could be such a tourist attraction.
You are 100% correct you can only imagine what bus loads of foreign tourists think of the likes of Bushmills when they drive through it around this time of year on their way to the Giants Causeway and it absolutely plastered with flags , red white and blue kerbs etc.
I'd say the Scottish ones love it! I suppose if it's done "tastefully" (I use that term sparingly) it can't really do much harm. Different if they've been hanging rotten for the previous 6 months.
Quote from: imtommygunn on July 11, 2023, 09:57:29 AM
Portstewart is nice but a lot of the places up round the neck of woods are "fleggy" and I don't think would be voting yes in the united ireland vote... Same when you drive round the coast road from waterfoot to carrickfergus - lovely in so many places then you hit the flags everywhere. There's one wee place I think there are more union jacks than there are buildings in the village.
I think it's fair to say that Portstewart would have a more Catholic population than Portrush.
But even Portrush has mellowed out over the years. My mother had some relatives who lived in Portrush, all dead and gone now, but they never had any issues as far as I know. We've been to a couple of caravan sites in Portrush too, big on on a hill up behind the Lidl and it was full of kids in gaelic jersey's playing football with kids in rangers tops. They all just got on.
As much as a don't like the fleggers or marchers, there's plenty of middle of the road normal protestants in both Portrush and Portstewart who would not be involved in any of that, but as with most places here, the minority knuckle dragger element get their way.
I have to say I love the north coast and we're going up there for a week in August with the kids. Plenty of beaches, plenty of eating houses and is laid back enough.
Quote from: general_lee on July 11, 2023, 10:02:51 AM
Quote from: LC on July 11, 2023, 09:47:28 AM
Quote from: NAG1 on July 11, 2023, 08:44:02 AM
Quote from: LC on July 11, 2023, 08:25:12 AM
Was up around the north coast at the weekend.....must a be a fair few neanderthals around Portrush as the place was full of flegs. I can only presume that the people around Portstewart have a bit more cop on as thankfully it was not plastered in the same way.
The caravaners love it ;D
It is a kip of a place especially over the summer months, shame really when it could be such a tourist attraction.
You are 100% correct you can only imagine what bus loads of foreign tourists think of the likes of Bushmills when they drive through it around this time of year on their way to the Giants Causeway and it absolutely plastered with flags , red white and blue kerbs etc.
I'd say the Scottish ones love it! I suppose if it's done "tastefully" (I use that term sparingly) it can't really do much harm. Different if they've been hanging rotten for the previous 6 months.
Many years ago I worked in Ayr for a while.....yes definitely no surprise Johnny Adair relocated to here.......an absolute sh#t hole.
some guy on Slugger did the sums on the Craighyhill bonfire
I looked at the Craigiehill from an aerial photo and the outer ring of the lower half of the bonfire is made up of 6 rings of pallets the first ring being 24 pallets the last ring being four and the bonfire diameter reduces as it reaches its enormous height.
The height of the bonfire is 202 feet in old money, which is 61,650mm. A euro pallet is 144mm high so the bonfire has 423 rings of pallets.
So assuming rings of 24, 20, 16, 12, 8 and 4 pallets and following the ring profile reducing as the bonfire gets taller, this equates to approximately 27,000 pallets.
A euro pallet is 24kg, so this equates to a total tonnage of wood of 648 tonnes.
The amount of carbon emitted from burning 1 kilogram (kg) of wood can vary depending on the type of wood and the combustion conditions. However, on average, the carbon content of dry wood is roughly 50% by weight. This means that approximately 0.5 kg (or 500 grams) of carbon is released when 1 kg of wood is burned.
It's important to note that when wood is burned, not all of the carbon is released as carbon dioxide (CO2). Some of the carbon is converted into other compounds, such as carbon monoxide (CO) and particulate matter (soot). The efficiency of the combustion process, including factors like temperature and oxygen supply, also affects the emissions.
To estimate the amount of carbon dioxide specifically emitted from burning 1 kg of wood, we need to consider the stoichiometry of the combustion reaction. When wood burns completely, the reaction can be simplified as follows:
C6H12O6 + 6O2 → 6CO2 + 6H2O
This equation shows that for every 6 moles of oxygen (O2) consumed, 6 moles of carbon dioxide (CO2) are produced. Since the molar mass of carbon is 12 grams per mole and the molar mass of carbon dioxide is 44 grams per mole, we can calculate the amount of CO2 produced from the carbon in 1 kg of wood:
(0.5 kg carbon) × (44 g CO2 / 12 g carbon) = 1.83 kg CO2
The Craigiehill bonfire will emit approximately 1,185 tonnes of CO2 emissions during its short life.
Most of the pallets are painted, and the viewers of the bonfire and the local community can look forward to being exposed to the following pollutants:-
Nitrogen oxides (NOx): Nitrogen present in the air combines with oxygen during combustion to form nitrogen oxides. NOx emissions contribute to the formation of smog
Volatile Organic Compounds (VOCs): Paints often contain VOCs, which are released as gases during combustion. VOCs can contribute to air pollution, smog formation, and have adverse health effects.
Hazardous Air Pollutants (HAPs): Some paints may contain hazardous substances such as lead, mercury, chromium, or other heavy metals. Burning painted wood can release these HAPs into the air, which pose health risks and environmental concerns.
Particulate Matter (PM): Burning painted wood can generate fine particulate matter, including soot and ash. These particles can contribute to air pollution and have adverse effects on respiratory health.
Toxic Gases: The combustion of painted wood can release toxic gases such as carbon monoxide (CO) and nitrogen oxides (NOx). sulphur dioxide (SO2). These gases are harmful to human health and contribute to air pollution.
A standard used Euro pallet costs £8.00 to £10.00 second hand, and all coloured pallets remain property of CHEP and therefore are stolen, so we are watching pallets with a conservative value of £250,000 being burned.
Wouldn't be hard to raise a quarter of a Mill by raffling off a few bottles of Vodka don't you worry
Quote from: armaghniac on July 11, 2023, 09:26:45 PM
some guy on Slugger did the sums on the Craighyhill bonfire
I looked at the Craigiehill from an aerial photo and the outer ring of the lower half of the bonfire is made up of 6 rings of pallets the first ring being 24 pallets the last ring being four and the bonfire diameter reduces as it reaches its enormous height.
The height of the bonfire is 202 feet in old money, which is 61,650mm. A euro pallet is 144mm high so the bonfire has 423 rings of pallets.
So assuming rings of 24, 20, 16, 12, 8 and 4 pallets and following the ring profile reducing as the bonfire gets taller, this equates to approximately 27,000 pallets.
A euro pallet is 24kg, so this equates to a total tonnage of wood of 648 tonnes.
The amount of carbon emitted from burning 1 kilogram (kg) of wood can vary depending on the type of wood and the combustion conditions. However, on average, the carbon content of dry wood is roughly 50% by weight. This means that approximately 0.5 kg (or 500 grams) of carbon is released when 1 kg of wood is burned.
It's important to note that when wood is burned, not all of the carbon is released as carbon dioxide (CO2). Some of the carbon is converted into other compounds, such as carbon monoxide (CO) and particulate matter (soot). The efficiency of the combustion process, including factors like temperature and oxygen supply, also affects the emissions.
To estimate the amount of carbon dioxide specifically emitted from burning 1 kg of wood, we need to consider the stoichiometry of the combustion reaction. When wood burns completely, the reaction can be simplified as follows:
C6H12O6 + 6O2 → 6CO2 + 6H2O
This equation shows that for every 6 moles of oxygen (O2) consumed, 6 moles of carbon dioxide (CO2) are produced. Since the molar mass of carbon is 12 grams per mole and the molar mass of carbon dioxide is 44 grams per mole, we can calculate the amount of CO2 produced from the carbon in 1 kg of wood:
(0.5 kg carbon) × (44 g CO2 / 12 g carbon) = 1.83 kg CO2
The Craigiehill bonfire will emit approximately 1,185 tonnes of CO2 emissions during its short life.
Most of the pallets are painted, and the viewers of the bonfire and the local community can look forward to being exposed to the following pollutants:-
Nitrogen oxides (NOx): Nitrogen present in the air combines with oxygen during combustion to form nitrogen oxides. NOx emissions contribute to the formation of smog
Volatile Organic Compounds (VOCs): Paints often contain VOCs, which are released as gases during combustion. VOCs can contribute to air pollution, smog formation, and have adverse health effects.
Hazardous Air Pollutants (HAPs): Some paints may contain hazardous substances such as lead, mercury, chromium, or other heavy metals. Burning painted wood can release these HAPs into the air, which pose health risks and environmental concerns.
Particulate Matter (PM): Burning painted wood can generate fine particulate matter, including soot and ash. These particles can contribute to air pollution and have adverse effects on respiratory health.
Toxic Gases: The combustion of painted wood can release toxic gases such as carbon monoxide (CO) and nitrogen oxides (NOx). sulphur dioxide (SO2). These gases are harmful to human health and contribute to air pollution.
A standard used Euro pallet costs £8.00 to £10.00 second hand, and all coloured pallets remain property of CHEP and therefore are stolen, so we are watching pallets with a conservative value of £250,000 being burned.
Those toxic gases and that amount of money being burned should not be sniffed at.
Year after year I await news of a bonfire going wrong. And let's face it , regardless of which direction the wind is blowing , even if its blowing towards a petrol station or a cigarette factory , the fire will be lit tonight. It's only a matter of time .
Sammy Wilson was commending the builders of Larne bonfire earlier , saying they should be proud of themselves, and he was to mention it in the London parliament that the Larne lads will have broken a world record height for a boney. Sweet Jesus
It's going to take a tragedy for the authorities to cop themselves on. It's only a matter of time before someone, or some family, loses their home, or their lives. Maybe then they will clamp down on this crap. But I wouldn't hold my breath... which is what a lot of people should be doing tonight judging by armaghniac's post
Derry lads CV: Won an All-Ireland minor medal with a team of people. We learnt skills, discipline, tactics, respect and teamwork etc
Larne lads CV: We built a big bonfire.
Quote from: AustinPowers on July 11, 2023, 10:22:27 PM
Year after year I await news of a bonfire going wrong. And let's face it , regardless of which direction the wind is blowing , even if its blowing towards a petrol station or a cigarette factory , the fire will be lit tonight. It's only a matter of time .
Sammy Wilson was commending the builders of Larne bonfire earlier , saying they should be proud of themselves, and he was to mention it in the London parliament that the Larne lads will have broken a world record height for a boney. Sweet Jesus
It's going to take a tragedy for the authorities to cop themselves on. It's only a matter of time before someone, or some family, loses their home, or their lives. Maybe then they will clamp down on this crap. But I wouldn't hold my breath... which is what a lot of people should be doing tonight judging by armaghniac's post
Sure after your man fell off the bonfire last year they lit it as a tribute as its "what he would have wanted "
Quote from: markl121 on July 11, 2023, 10:42:40 PM
Quote from: AustinPowers on July 11, 2023, 10:22:27 PM
Year after year I await news of a bonfire going wrong. And let's face it , regardless of which direction the wind is blowing , even if its blowing towards a petrol station or a cigarette factory , the fire will be lit tonight. It's only a matter of time .
Sammy Wilson was commending the builders of Larne bonfire earlier , saying they should be proud of themselves, and he was to mention it in the London parliament that the Larne lads will have broken a world record height for a boney. Sweet Jesus
It's going to take a tragedy for the authorities to cop themselves on. It's only a matter of time before someone, or some family, loses their home, or their lives. Maybe then they will clamp down on this crap. But I wouldn't hold my breath... which is what a lot of people should be doing tonight judging by armaghniac's post
Sure after your man fell off the bonfire last year they lit it as a tribute as its "what he would have wanted "
It won't matter a thing...
Was watching stuff the other day, old photos of NI, in all the photos I've seen, flegs, were maybe in one or two photos was there an image of a flag, the more we are accelerating towards a UI the more flegs are produced
Quote from: Brendan on July 11, 2023, 09:48:33 PM
Wouldn't be hard to raise a quarter of a Mill by raffling off a few bottles of Vodka don't you worry
Yes the head honcho in Larne power washes gutters for a living and also drives a supercar...
"Master bonfire builder" was it not 😉😃
If nothing else this thread has shown me that Armaghniac is a clever basturt. Could be absolutely wrong but im fcuked if ill ever find out. See above post
I see some lad fell down a right distance of one yesterday after lighting it, I would say he has a fair chance of being at his next bonfire paralysed in a wheelchair
Quote from: quit yo jibbajabba on July 12, 2023, 09:28:00 AM
If nothing else this thread has shown me that Armaghniac is a clever basturt. Could be absolutely wrong but im fcuked if ill ever find out. See above post
Armaghniac never did learn how to do do this....
QuoteAnd I quote
https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-northern-ireland-66167757
#culture
Quote from: Itchy on July 12, 2023, 09:42:09 AM
I see some lad fell down a right distance of one yesterday after lighting it, I would say he has a fair chance of being at his next bonfire paralysed in a wheelchair
Natural selection. Time they were banned.
Quote from: quit yo jibbajabba on July 12, 2023, 09:28:00 AM
If nothing else this thread has shown me that Armaghniac is a clever basturt. Could be absolutely wrong but im fcuked if ill ever find out. See above post
You obviously have not been in Gaaboard long or you would already know this.
However, I cannot take credit for those calculations as someone on Slugger did them.
Quote from: armaghniac on July 12, 2023, 10:21:45 AM
Quote from: quit yo jibbajabba on July 12, 2023, 09:28:00 AM
If nothing else this thread has shown me that Armaghniac is a clever basturt. Could be absolutely wrong but im fcuked if ill ever find out. See above post
You obviously have not been in Gaaboard long or you would already know this.
However, I cannot take credit for those calculations as someone on Slugger did them.
I am now conflicted 😃
Quote from: general_lee on July 12, 2023, 10:15:12 AM
Quote from: Itchy on July 12, 2023, 09:42:09 AM
I see some lad fell down a right distance of one yesterday after lighting it, I would say he has a fair chance of being at his next bonfire paralysed in a wheelchair
Natural selection. Time they were banned.
One of MutantArds finest it seems fell quite a height too, he'll be lucky to walk again by the looks of it.
But sure the local RUFF/EB UVF or whoever oversees that particular bonfire in EA ground (it used to be a primary school) will see to it that he and his family are well looked after.
What I have noticed is this Flaggelation is a class thing, very few flags up in the "developments" in Newtownards or Holywood when I went through it the other day, it's just the sink estates like the Westwinds and the Bowtown Road (pronounced boot-on) where the fleggers seems to be their strongest.
Quote from: johnnycool on July 12, 2023, 10:51:29 AM
Quote from: general_lee on July 12, 2023, 10:15:12 AM
Quote from: Itchy on July 12, 2023, 09:42:09 AM
I see some lad fell down a right distance of one yesterday after lighting it, I would say he has a fair chance of being at his next bonfire paralysed in a wheelchair
Natural selection. Time they were banned.
One of MutantArds finest it seems fell quite a height too, he'll be lucky to walk again by the looks of it.
But sure the local RUFF/EB UVF or whoever oversees that particular bonfire in EA ground (it used to be a primary school) will see to it that he and his family are well looked after.
What I have noticed is this Flaggelation is a class thing, very few flags up in the "developments" in Newtownards or Holywood when I went through it the other day, it's just the sink estates like the Westwinds and the Bowtown Road (pronounced boot-on) where the fleggers seems to be their strongest.
Who fell off the Ards bonfire? Was it the one in Bowtown? I thought it had moved from a bonfire to a beacon some years ago. Send me a PM if you don't want to go public
https://m.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/northern-ireland/sammy-wilson-hails-craigyhill-bonfire-as-best-of-northern-ireland-in-parliamentary-motion/a1209824782.html
(https://m.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/northern-ireland/sammy-wilson-hails-craigyhill-bonfire-as-best-of-northern-ireland-in-parliamentary-motion/a1209824782.html)
I think the bit that stood for me out was....
Mr Wilson said: "The efforts of the people in Craigyhill are an example of what is best in Northern Ireland.
Good soaking today for a change
Quote from: Dougal Maguire on July 12, 2023, 11:18:32 AM
Quote from: johnnycool on July 12, 2023, 10:51:29 AM
Quote from: general_lee on July 12, 2023, 10:15:12 AM
Quote from: Itchy on July 12, 2023, 09:42:09 AM
I see some lad fell down a right distance of one yesterday after lighting it, I would say he has a fair chance of being at his next bonfire paralysed in a wheelchair
Natural selection. Time they were banned.
One of MutantArds finest it seems fell quite a height too, he'll be lucky to walk again by the looks of it.
But sure the local RUFF/EB UVF or whoever oversees that particular bonfire in EA ground (it used to be a primary school) will see to it that he and his family are well looked after.
What I have noticed is this Flaggelation is a class thing, very few flags up in the "developments" in Newtownards or Holywood when I went through it the other day, it's just the sink estates like the Westwinds and the Bowtown Road (pronounced boot-on) where the fleggers seems to be their strongest.
Who fell off the Ards bonfire? Was it the one in Bowtown? I thought it had moved from a bonfire to a beacon some years ago. Send me a PM if you don't want to go public
The bonfire in question is the one in front of the firestation, used to be a Primary school so bonfires on that particular site are probably only 10 to 15 years into their tradition.
I'd say the knuckle draggers who attended this one are from the Movilla Road, Greenwell Street area, frequenters of the pub called "The Pub" in their glory.
Only a matter of time before the lad that fell from the bonfire has a personal injury claim in against the council. The only good thing is he'll probably be represented by Donaghadee's finest QC so he hasn't a hope of winning.
Tbh it seems like a miracle that more people aren't seriously hurt or killed at these things. Man dies in Larne so what do they do - build bigger. Ludicrous.
Once your man Steele's case come up and the family take a fortune of MEA council and the lad from last night sues Belfast council then you might see council's taking a stand on allowing there property been used.
MEA were to have an urgent behind closed doors meeting in May about bonfire's on their properties but it was adjourned to the autumn.
Would cooperate manslaughter laws apply against the council in the Steele's case?
what would be the basis of any lawsuits against local councils? Are they supposed to prevent this sort of thing?
Quote from: imtommygunn on July 12, 2023, 06:06:58 PM
Tbh it seems like a miracle that more people aren't seriously hurt or killed at these things. Man dies in Larne so what do they do - build bigger. Ludicrous.
Yeah , it's madness . Then you get big Sammy bringing it up in parliament , which just ratchets the thing up a peg or ten
Seen that video with the fella falling last night. I'm sure it's a broken leg (or two) at best. Feck knows what injuries he has , or how he'll be left after this . Would be interesting to get his views on bonfires when he recovers , and if it was all worth it
Quote from: AustinPowers on July 12, 2023, 10:13:14 PM
Quote from: imtommygunn on July 12, 2023, 06:06:58 PM
Tbh it seems like a miracle that more people aren't seriously hurt or killed at these things. Man dies in Larne so what do they do - build bigger. Ludicrous.
Yeah , it's madness . Then you get big Sammy bringing it up in parliament , which just ratchets the thing up a peg or ten
Seen that video with the fella falling last night. I'm sure it's a broken leg (or two) at best. Feck knows what injuries he has , or how he'll be left after this . Would be interesting to get his views on bonfires when he recovers , and if it was all worth it
Broken ribs, hip etc nothing life threatening.
How exactly are councils liable?
Quote from: general_lee on July 12, 2023, 10:30:00 PM
Quote from: AustinPowers on July 12, 2023, 10:13:14 PM
Quote from: imtommygunn on July 12, 2023, 06:06:58 PM
Tbh it seems like a miracle that more people aren't seriously hurt or killed at these things. Man dies in Larne so what do they do - build bigger. Ludicrous.
Yeah , it's madness . Then you get big Sammy bringing it up in parliament , which just ratchets the thing up a peg or ten
Seen that video with the fella falling last night. I'm sure it's a broken leg (or two) at best. Feck knows what injuries he has , or how he'll be left after this . Would be interesting to get his views on bonfires when he recovers , and if it was all worth it
Broken ribs, hip etc nothing life threatening.
How exactly are councils liable?
They wouldn't be. But that wouldn't stop some from trying.
If it happens on council land are they not supposed to have the property in a safe condition to prevent injury?
It probably was pretty safe until nutters started to build giant bonfires.
Quote from: screenexile on July 12, 2023, 11:26:56 PM
If it happens on council land are they not supposed to have the property in a safe condition to prevent injury?
How do you make ground safe so someone falling 30 odd foot, or whatever it was, onto it doesn't hurt themselves?
The problem here is there would be significant "anti-social" things which would happen if councils prevented these scales of bonfires happening. The council(s) are damned if they do and damned if they don't.
If PSNI did their job on this and all that flags crap there wouldn't be a problem, but they're a useless shower of shite.
Quote from: imtommygunn on July 13, 2023, 07:46:28 AM
Quote from: screenexile on July 12, 2023, 11:26:56 PM
If it happens on council land are they not supposed to have the property in a safe condition to prevent injury?
How do you make ground safe so someone falling 30 odd foot, or whatever it was, onto it doesn't hurt themselves?
The problem here is there would be significant "anti-social" things which would happen if councils prevented these scales of bonfires happening. The council(s) are damned if they do and damned if they don't.
Requires political leadership. None exists. Carla Lockheart wants to get orange men back down the Garvaghy rd. so this is where this shit is at.
Quote from: trailer on July 13, 2023, 11:03:59 AM
Quote from: imtommygunn on July 13, 2023, 07:46:28 AM
Quote from: screenexile on July 12, 2023, 11:26:56 PM
If it happens on council land are they not supposed to have the property in a safe condition to prevent injury?
How do you make ground safe so someone falling 30 odd foot, or whatever it was, onto it doesn't hurt themselves?
The problem here is there would be significant "anti-social" things which would happen if councils prevented these scales of bonfires happening. The council(s) are damned if they do and damned if they don't.
Requires political leadership. None exists. Carla Lockheart wants to get orange men back down the Garvaghy rd. so this is where this shit is at.
Hopefully there's an election pact there next time out and she gets the boot.
No self-awareness at all.
Quote from: marty34 on July 13, 2023, 11:15:04 AM
Quote from: trailer on July 13, 2023, 11:03:59 AM
Quote from: imtommygunn on July 13, 2023, 07:46:28 AM
Quote from: screenexile on July 12, 2023, 11:26:56 PM
If it happens on council land are they not supposed to have the property in a safe condition to prevent injury?
How do you make ground safe so someone falling 30 odd foot, or whatever it was, onto it doesn't hurt themselves?
The problem here is there would be significant "anti-social" things which would happen if councils prevented these scales of bonfires happening. The council(s) are damned if they do and damned if they don't.
Requires political leadership. None exists. Carla Lockheart wants to get orange men back down the Garvaghy rd. so this is where this shit is at.
Hopefully there's an election pact there next time out and she gets the boot.
No self-awareness at all.
She could do with eating a good Sunday roast
She'd probably be better keeping her mouth shut. Every time it opens something vile comes out then she plays a sympathy card on getting slagged about what she looks like. Her opinions are vile - what she looks like doesn't matter.
Quote from: red hander on July 13, 2023, 11:03:09 AM
If PSNI did their job on this and all that flags crap there wouldn't be a problem, but they're a useless shower of shite.
I read a few tweets from a lad who used to work for CHEP (the blue pallet crowd) and they don't sell them, He said they'd contacted the PSNI about their pallets being on a bonfire and that they wanted them back, the PSNI called them back and said that it would be more hassle than it's worth and weren't going to do anything about it...
It wouldn't take a rocket scientist to know where these pallets come from, stolen or "donated" would be the most of them!
Quote from: imtommygunn on July 13, 2023, 11:33:45 AM
She'd probably be better keeping her mouth shut. Every time it opens something vile comes out then she plays a sympathy card on getting slagged about what she looks like. Her opinions are vile - what she looks like doesn't matter.
But they'll keep voting for her.
It's very clearly orchestrated and done for votes >:(
Quote from: johnnycool on July 13, 2023, 11:40:04 AM
Quote from: red hander on July 13, 2023, 11:03:09 AM
If PSNI did their job on this and all that flags crap there wouldn't be a problem, but they're a useless shower of shite.
I read a few tweets from a lad who used to work for CHEP (the blue pallet crowd) and they don't sell them, He said they'd contacted the PSNI about their pallets being on a bonfire and that they wanted them back, the PSNI called them back and said that it would be more hassle than it's worth and weren't going to do anything about it...
It wouldn't take a rocket scientist to know where these pallets come from, stolen or "donated" would be the most of them!
Them pallets on those huge bonfires are bought. UDA/ UVF drug money.
Quote from: trailer on July 13, 2023, 12:23:54 PM
Quote from: johnnycool on July 13, 2023, 11:40:04 AM
Quote from: red hander on July 13, 2023, 11:03:09 AM
If PSNI did their job on this and all that flags crap there wouldn't be a problem, but they're a useless shower of shite.
I read a few tweets from a lad who used to work for CHEP (the blue pallet crowd) and they don't sell them, He said they'd contacted the PSNI about their pallets being on a bonfire and that they wanted them back, the PSNI called them back and said that it would be more hassle than it's worth and weren't going to do anything about it...
It wouldn't take a rocket scientist to know where these pallets come from, stolen or "donated" would be the most of them!
Them pallets on those huge bonfires are bought. UDA/ UVF drug money.
Must be very large cash transactions well!
Should be easy for the PSNI to trace otherwise.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-66181670
Not content with attacking firefighters now it's paramedics as well, can't even claim it was an isolated incident
Quote from: imtommygunn on July 13, 2023, 11:58:20 AM
It's very clearly orchestrated and done for votes >:(
That's exactly it
Same as Sammy Wilson praising the boys in Larne for their world record bonfire height. Wasn't this the same bonfire where that man died from last year? Like , friggin hell. It's all to appeal to the Neanderthals thinking , so they'll keep votinh for him. These politicians care not a jot about community relations, or the bigger things in society. Better to keep stirring the pot , because that keeps us relevant and in a big wage
Lockhart went on about shared space the other night . Funny that , because the last time I heard , there was a banner supporting soldier F in portadown town centre (and other areas), and by all accounts, the town is decorated with the butchers apron every summer . Shared space , how are ye!
They're only in it for themselves.
half of them marching are coke out of it literal marching powder
Quote from: Eire90 on July 15, 2023, 03:02:04 AM
half of them marching are coke out of it literal marching powder
Yeah, saw that. Crazy stuff.
Person on camera should have shouted at them and they'd have looked up. Just to see their expression would have been class.
Hopefully it'll go viral.
The Bonfires as well as being Dangerous to construct and dangerous when burning.
They leave an unmerciful mess afterwards
(https://ichef.bbci.co.uk/news/976/cpsprodpb/072D/production/_130373810_55da0d6a-c0a6-4d25-9fec-a011387e0c21.jpg.webp)
Quote from: From the Bunker on July 15, 2023, 12:29:21 PM
The Bonfires as well as being Dangerous to construct and dangerous when burning.
They leave an unmerciful mess afterwards
(https://ichef.bbci.co.uk/news/976/cpsprodpb/072D/production/_130373810_55da0d6a-c0a6-4d25-9fec-a011387e0c21.jpg.webp)
As do the crowds
https://twitter.com/IrishMa88348067/status/1679243860545814528?t=kleb7-8AbVEL9uZhAfeq2A&s=19
Who cleans that crap all up? The council?
Quote from: From the Bunker on July 15, 2023, 12:29:21 PM
The Bonfires as well as being Dangerous to construct and dangerous when burning.
They leave an unmerciful mess afterwards
(https://ichef.bbci.co.uk/news/976/cpsprodpb/072D/production/_130373810_55da0d6a-c0a6-4d25-9fec-a011387e0c21.jpg.webp)
Looks like a scene from Ukraine.
I can throw up pics of paddy's day in Holylands, concerts, Street festivals and so on that are exactly the same.
Dont mind many large scale bonnies in the Holylands from my day but in fairness i was drunk a lot of the time
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on July 16, 2023, 12:31:41 AM
I can throw up pics of paddy's day in Holylands, concerts, Street festivals and so on that are exactly the same.
That scene is pretty common after any big event. Where are the bins. Yes they should bring their rubbish home. But the council could prevent a lot of that by putting temp bins in place. The streets around Clones wouldn't be too tidy after a big game either. Bonfires a diff story obviously.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-66235152
Another 2 fingers from the British Government to the DUP.
Howards Hastings et al will be on the phone to wee Jeffrey telling them to wind their necks in.
Quote from: LC on July 18, 2023, 05:18:16 PM
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-66235152
Another 2 fingers from the British Government to the DUP.
Howards Hastings et al will be on the phone to wee Jeffrey telling them to wind their necks in.
"Unacceptable gap in UK border security"
I wonder is Mr Jenrick talking about enforcing these checks along the Irish sea.....
https://www.derrynow.com/news/home/1252229/county-derry-estate-redevelopment-project-halted-as-it-sits-on-bonfire-site.html?utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=facebook&fbclid=IwAR0X1CYXKr4jLeVrrk34oJRg5lRgQj66k6ZYdJ5Os0jO6LQvyfVMwjYfkQI
Quote from: Brendan on July 19, 2023, 07:17:11 PM
https://www.derrynow.com/news/home/1252229/county-derry-estate-redevelopment-project-halted-as-it-sits-on-bonfire-site.html?utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=facebook&fbclid=IwAR0X1CYXKr4jLeVrrk34oJRg5lRgQj66k6ZYdJ5Os0jO6LQvyfVMwjYfkQI
Madness, just like the picture above. That mess should be left as it is and they should have to clean it up themselves. Let them look at that for 365 days of the year.
Former Northern Ireland First Minister Arlene Foster has said she "feels so sorry" for holidaymakers trapped in Greece, as wildfires continue to grip Rhodes.
She described initially being "oblivious" to the fires on the island – until a restaurant where she visited was burnt to the ground.
Thousands of holidaymakers are currently on the Greek island, which has been ravaged by flames, and holiday firms are scrambling to get them home.
Speaking to GB News, Ms Foster recounted her experience.
"The thing is I had a wonderful holiday and was quite oblivious to what was going on on other parts of the island until Saturday when I was due to leave (that evening)," she said.
"We had been to such beautiful places in Rhodes, including a gorgeous little restaurant by the beach – and on Saturday evening I found out it was completely burnt to the ground.
"The place where I had been all day on Thursday...and on Saturday evening, my daughter looked at Twitter and it was burnt to the ground.
"When we were taking off on early Sunday morning, we could look back and see the fires raging on the ground. I had been walking around the town that day, no one was concerned but when I got to the airport that's when I got concerned."
Ms Foster said she was "very fortunate" that they had managed to escape the chaos after multiple holiday providers subsequently cancelled flights in and out of the island.
Some 19,000 people have been evacuated from Rhodes after many holidaymakers had to resort to escaping to the beach to escape the extreme weather conditions.
The Greek island of Corfu has also experienced serious fires across the island, with 2,500 people evacuated from the island.
"The lovely people of Rhodes who work and live there, who were telling us they don't make much money during the winter, are now devastated," Ms Foster continued.
"I'm told they have fires most summers but this is certainly the worst they've had in many years."
Upon returning to Northern Ireland, the politician turned broadcaster tweeted and said she is watching the news reports of the fires across the island.
She Tweeted: "Watching the terrible story of the fires in the Greek island. I came home from Rhodes on Sunday and feel so sorry for all those wonderful people in Rhodes who have lost their homes and livelihoods and wish safe passage to all those trying to get home to the UK."
Despite the chaos she escaped, Ms Foster said she wouldn't let the emergency situation put her off Rhodes for a future holiday.
"I would go back, particularly because the tourist season is their biggest industry. They were so lovely and wonderful people. This is devastation for them," she said.
Well as long as her dinner was lovely and she was oblivious to the raging fires destroying the areas where she went for a lovely walk!
That sums up the DUP. Oblivious to the place burning down round them.
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on July 24, 2023, 04:00:19 PM
Well as long as her dinner was lovely and she was oblivious to the raging fires destroying the areas where she went for a lovely walk!
Ah sure it's all just a bit of weather, according to her right wing friends in GB News and Talk Radio.
Campbell from lcc, the dup bedfellows, suing Matthew o'toole of sdlp over comments on the Nolan show. The outcome will be interesting. Hope it exposes that lcc.
Is Brolly representing Campbell, lol, lol.
At some point voters will wake up to who is in bed with the DUP. Maybe when house prices collapse. The party seems to have a similar relationship to money as the GOP. It's total Scooby Doo
Quote from: bannside on August 26, 2023, 10:20:21 AM
Is Brolly representing Campbell, lol, lol.
:D
Some of the derry posters would combust lol.
It's little coincidence that he has waited until the allegations over Stephen Nolan last week.
It's also quite telling the number of so called prominent journalists who failed to comment on the Nolan story since it broke. So much for impartiality and independence, all on the gravy train and a firm part of the 'NI' media establishment.
Quote from: yellowcard on August 26, 2023, 12:50:49 PM
It's little coincidence that he has waited until the allegations over Stephen Nolan last week.
It's also quite telling the number of so called prominent journalists who failed to comment on the Nolan story since it broke. So much for impartiality and independence, all on the gravy train and a firm part of the 'NI' media establishment.
Allison Morris has been on Nolan more than anyone from January - June, and Patricia Devlin has asked if any of them are on monthly retainers via Nolan's production company. Has Morris commented on the Nolan stuff?, i don't follow her as she is a dose & hilariously refers to herself as a "security expert"
Quote from: Kidder81 on August 26, 2023, 01:01:47 PM
Quote from: yellowcard on August 26, 2023, 12:50:49 PM
It's little coincidence that he has waited until the allegations over Stephen Nolan last week.
It's also quite telling the number of so called prominent journalists who failed to comment on the Nolan story since it broke. So much for impartiality and independence, all on the gravy train and a firm part of the 'NI' media establishment.
Allison Morris has been on Nolan more than anyone from January - June, and Patricia Devlin has asked if any of them are on monthly retainers via Nolan's production company. Has Morris commented on the Nolan stuff?, i don't follow her as she is a dose & hilariously refers to herself as a "security expert"
She's a big part of that Nolan golden circle so she won't be saying anything.
Devlin has said plenty. Morris has said a bit but maybe not as much
Sam thingy from newsletter is the main to have said nothing.
Quote from: imtommygunn on August 26, 2023, 03:34:33 PM
Devlin has said plenty. Morris has said a bit but maybe not as much
Sam thingy from newsletter is the main to have said nothing.
There is previous between Morris and Devlin. Morris very much portrays herself as a bastion of women's rights, but was called out for her silence at the time Patricia Devlin was receiving threats from loyalists and others.
Devlin mustn't fall into their golden circle
Quote from: JohnDenver on August 26, 2023, 09:33:11 PM
Quote from: imtommygunn on August 26, 2023, 03:34:33 PM
Devlin has said plenty. Morris has said a bit but maybe not as much
Sam thingy from newsletter is the main to have said nothing.
There is previous between Morris and Devlin. Morris very much portrays herself as a bastion of women's rights, but was called out for her silence at the time Patricia Devlin was receiving threats from loyalists and others.
Devlin mustn't fall into their golden circle
Devlin and Morris definitely don't get on, Morris has basically made a career out of talking about mysogny etc but never said a word, as you say, when Devlin was getting all sorts of harassment. It spoke volumes about her.
Wondered why the DUP were pushing for the head PSNI guy to go then that absolute muppet Lockhart puts out a tweet blaming him for two tier policing (also said some judge said there was now two tier policing) talking about orange march policing and the Bobby Storey funeral.
You couldn't make it up (well she probably did)
Quote from: imtommygunn on August 31, 2023, 09:19:29 AM
Wondered why the DUP were pushing for the head PSNI guy to go then that absolute muppet Lockhart puts out a tweet blaming him for two tier policing (also said some judge said there was now two tier policing) talking about orange march policing and the Bobby Storey funeral.
You couldn't make it up (well she probably did)
He should go though. After all his incompetence to remain in such a high profile job is beyond belief. Remember the Crossmaglen assault rifles picture on Christmas Day? The force is as sectarian as ever if we belief Sam McBride, it lurches from crisis to crisis. His handling of the Covid regulations during the pandemic was farcical. Remeber the BLM march in Derry? He's in over his head and he should go.
He should - but not because of "two tier policing".
Quote from: imtommygunn on August 31, 2023, 09:38:45 AM
He should - but not because of "two tier policing".
Agree
Two tier policing:
https://www.thedetail.tv/articles/almost-twice-the-number-of-catholics-than-protestants-arrested-and-charged-by-psni (https://www.thedetail.tv/articles/almost-twice-the-number-of-catholics-than-protestants-arrested-and-charged-by-psni)
https://www.thedetail.tv/articles/nearly-twice-as-many-security-stop-and-searches-on-catholics-as-protestants (https://www.thedetail.tv/articles/nearly-twice-as-many-security-stop-and-searches-on-catholics-as-protestants)
https://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/opinion/columnists/sam-mcbride/anti-catholic-sentiment-in-the-psni-is-driving-brave-officers-away/a498017723.html (https://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/opinion/columnists/sam-mcbride/anti-catholic-sentiment-in-the-psni-is-driving-brave-officers-away/a498017723.html)
Exactly.
I no longer am sure whether they believe what they say or are just shit stirring. Tbh I used to just think the latter but now I think the former especially with this imbecile.
Bin Lowry in tears on Nolan this morning.
Quote from: Orior on August 31, 2023, 10:31:36 AM
Bin Lowry in tears on Nolan this morning.
What was his problem today?
Quote from: Kidder81 on August 26, 2023, 09:48:40 PM
Quote from: JohnDenver on August 26, 2023, 09:33:11 PM
Quote from: imtommygunn on August 26, 2023, 03:34:33 PM
Devlin has said plenty. Morris has said a bit but maybe not as much
Sam thingy from newsletter is the main to have said nothing.
There is previous between Morris and Devlin. Morris very much portrays herself as a bastion of women's rights, but was called out for her silence at the time Patricia Devlin was receiving threats from loyalists and others.
Devlin mustn't fall into their golden circle
Devlin and Morris definitely don't get on, Morris has basically made a career out of talking about mysogny etc but never said a word, as you say, when Devlin was getting all sorts of harassment. It spoke volumes about her.
Check out The Pensive Quill website/blog and search for 'Mean Girl Allison Morris'. Tells you all you need to know about that one.
Quote from: red hander on August 31, 2023, 11:51:48 AM
Quote from: Kidder81 on August 26, 2023, 09:48:40 PM
Quote from: JohnDenver on August 26, 2023, 09:33:11 PM
Quote from: imtommygunn on August 26, 2023, 03:34:33 PM
Devlin has said plenty. Morris has said a bit but maybe not as much
Sam thingy from newsletter is the main to have said nothing.
There is previous between Morris and Devlin. Morris very much portrays herself as a bastion of women's rights, but was called out for her silence at the time Patricia Devlin was receiving threats from loyalists and others.
Devlin mustn't fall into their golden circle
Devlin and Morris definitely don't get on, Morris has basically made a career out of talking about mysogny etc but never said a word, as you say, when Devlin was getting all sorts of harassment. It spoke volumes about her.
Check out The Pensive Quill website/blog and search for 'Mean Girl Allison Morris'. Tells you all you need to know about that one.
Not great reading though not surprising reading either tbh.
We all say we hate Nolan but come on is there anything more entertaining than Lowry or Bryson in full meltdown?
Everything the DUP touch is disputed. They should change their name to the Unionist Friction Party
Cheers. Ah I thought there was more than that I didn't know about.
Quote from: HiMucker on August 31, 2023, 02:53:22 PM
Quote from: Taylor on August 31, 2023, 02:42:59 PM
Quote from: Orior on August 31, 2023, 12:13:27 PM
Quote from: Taylor on August 31, 2023, 10:35:25 AM
Quote from: Orior on August 31, 2023, 10:31:36 AM
Bin Lowry in tears on Nolan this morning.
What was his problem today?
PSNIRA
Is there anyone that isnt in the RA at this stage?
Gerry Adams
Beat me to it! ;D
It's all gotten a bit murky for those cops at the Sean Grahams anniversary as they initially said they didn't know what the gathering was for or anything about the Sean Grahams massacre but the radio recordings suggest different as they were told exactly what was going on.
It won't be the first time a member of the PSNI/RUC told a few porkies in a court of law so little wonder these young recruits ably assisted by the Police Federation didn't think it was an issue to continue to do so!
They blatantly knew about that.
It didn't sit right at the time and now we are starting find out why.
It is just shambles after shambles, it would actually be quite entertaining were it not so sinister.
I would be amazed if new recruits are not being given a bit of a history lesson about the place. Out of all that has come out in the last few days and all that the media are spouting, the one reason I would be sacking the chief constable would be on that, that new recruits claim not to have a clue about major incidents that happened during the troubles and that are still raw for many in the community. Is that not the biggest scandal here? Is that not a rather fundamental flaw to policing in NI?
The PSNI story is another dead cat.
This relentless distraction must be a feature of post conflict societies in Bosnia etc.
Quote from: NAG1 on September 01, 2023, 09:45:19 AM
It didn't sit right at the time and now we are starting find out why.
It is just shambles after shambles, it would actually be quite entertaining were it not so sinister.
Definitely that ormeau road one did not sit right at all.
Then they come out with two tier policing ::)
Quote from: seafoid on September 01, 2023, 09:53:51 AM
The PSNI story is another dead cat.
This relentless distraction must be a feature of post conflict societies in Bosnia etc.
The PSNI are limping from one disaster to the next, removing Simon Byrne as head won't change the nature of that organisation as we see how they walk alongside vigilante groups in Newtownards and much more....
Quote from: JPGJOHNNYG on September 01, 2023, 09:51:49 AM
I would be amazed if new recruits are not being given a bit of a history lesson about the place. Out of all that has come out in the last few days and all that the media are spouting, the one reason I would be sacking the chief constable would be on that, that new recruits claim not to have a clue about major incidents that happened during the troubles and that are still raw for many in the community. Is that not the biggest scandal here? Is that not a rather fundamental flaw to policing in NI?
As referenced by another poster above, and contrary to the statements provided by the two cops in question, court documents show that they actually were told over the radio what the gathering was. So they KNEW what it was. They KNEW it was a commemoration. The could no doubt clearly that see those in attendance were socially distanced and masked, and they still made the decision to go in and throw their weight around and make a few arrests.
The Police Ombusdmans investigation into the Sean Grahams massacre confirmed that the RUC colluded with the UDA in the attack. 29 years later, we see the psni turn up to intimidate and arrest the families at an anniversary commemoration. One of those arrested at the commemoration was Mark Sykes, a man who was shot five times during the massacre, and who's brother-in-law was killed. As if that weren't bad enough, it was set against the optics of a few days previous, where masked UDA men walked through a council estate as the psni stood aside and watched.
(https://www.irishnews.com/picturesarchive/irishnews/irishnews/2022/04/13/162224617-888a0a6d-feb9-4d46-a042-6012b08750fc.jpg)
Quote from: johnnycool on September 01, 2023, 10:30:45 AM
Quote from: seafoid on September 01, 2023, 09:53:51 AM
The PSNI story is another dead cat.
This relentless distraction must be a feature of post conflict societies in Bosnia etc.
The PSNI are limping from one disaster to the next, removing Simon Byrne as head won't change the nature of that organisation as we see how they walk alongside vigilante groups in Newtownards and much more....
It's that interacting with the DUP's problems. There is no sign of Stormont being restored, meanwhile. It's no wonder the South gets all the investment.
Quote from: Snapchap on September 01, 2023, 10:34:48 AM
Quote from: JPGJOHNNYG on September 01, 2023, 09:51:49 AM
I would be amazed if new recruits are not being given a bit of a history lesson about the place. Out of all that has come out in the last few days and all that the media are spouting, the one reason I would be sacking the chief constable would be on that, that new recruits claim not to have a clue about major incidents that happened during the troubles and that are still raw for many in the community. Is that not the biggest scandal here? Is that not a rather fundamental flaw to policing in NI?
As referenced by another poster above, and contrary to the statements provided by the two cops in question, court documents show that they actually were told over the radio what the gathering was. So they KNEW what it was. They KNEW it was a commemoration. The could no doubt clearly that see those in attendance were socially distanced and masked, and they still made the decision to go in and throw their weight around and make a few arrests.
The Police Ombusdmans investigation into the Sean Grahams massacre confirmed that the RUC colluded with the UDA in the attack. 29 years later, we see the psni turn up to intimidate and arrest the families at an anniversary commemoration. One of those arrested at the commemoration was Mark Sykes, a man who was shot five times during the massacre, and who's brother-in-law was killed. As if that weren't bad enough, it was set against the optics of a few days previous, where masked UDA men walked through a council estate as the psni stood aside and watched.
(https://www.irishnews.com/picturesarchive/irishnews/irishnews/2022/04/13/162224617-888a0a6d-feb9-4d46-a042-6012b08750fc.jpg)
Playing devil's advocate, the fella Nolan had on the last couple of days argued that the footage clearly showed that they were asked to come over by a member of the crowd whilst in their car. Both things can't be true.
Quote from: gallsman on September 01, 2023, 11:53:03 AM
Quote from: Snapchap on September 01, 2023, 10:34:48 AM
Quote from: JPGJOHNNYG on September 01, 2023, 09:51:49 AM
I would be amazed if new recruits are not being given a bit of a history lesson about the place. Out of all that has come out in the last few days and all that the media are spouting, the one reason I would be sacking the chief constable would be on that, that new recruits claim not to have a clue about major incidents that happened during the troubles and that are still raw for many in the community. Is that not the biggest scandal here? Is that not a rather fundamental flaw to policing in NI?
As referenced by another poster above, and contrary to the statements provided by the two cops in question, court documents show that they actually were told over the radio what the gathering was. So they KNEW what it was. They KNEW it was a commemoration. The could no doubt clearly that see those in attendance were socially distanced and masked, and they still made the decision to go in and throw their weight around and make a few arrests.
The Police Ombusdmans investigation into the Sean Grahams massacre confirmed that the RUC colluded with the UDA in the attack. 29 years later, we see the psni turn up to intimidate and arrest the families at an anniversary commemoration. One of those arrested at the commemoration was Mark Sykes, a man who was shot five times during the massacre, and who's brother-in-law was killed. As if that weren't bad enough, it was set against the optics of a few days previous, where masked UDA men walked through a council estate as the psni stood aside and watched.
(https://www.irishnews.com/picturesarchive/irishnews/irishnews/2022/04/13/162224617-888a0a6d-feb9-4d46-a042-6012b08750fc.jpg)
Playing devil's advocate, the fella Nolan had on the last couple of days argued that the footage clearly showed that they were asked to come over by a member of the crowd whilst in their car. Both things can't be true.
Who's "the fella on Nolan"? Is he suggesting the people, mid-commemoration, took the time to ask the cops to come over and arrest a few of them?
Mark Sykes, who as I say was shot 5 times during the massacre, and who lost his brother-in-law, was arrested and left handcuffed in a police car for two and a half hours for attending the commemoration. He remains, to this day, the only person that the police have ever arrested in relation to a massacre that the police themselves colluded in.
These things paralyse the North every so often. It is not surprising . The hurt and the pain of the Troubles was never really addressed properly and so many people suffered.
Some institution led by a independent credible outsider accepted by both sides with a role to address this and positioned above politics might help. The current system does not work.
If the PSNI had interrupted a memorial to the Shankill bomb would the DUP have waited until now to call for the Chief Constable's head?
Can a new Chief Constable be appointed while the DUP have closed Stormont?
Quote from: Orior on September 01, 2023, 01:27:57 PM
If the PSNI had interrupted a memorial to the Shankill bomb would the DUP have waited until now to call for the Chief Constable's head?
Can a new Chief Constable be appointed while the DUP have closed Stormont?
At the minute no, needs stormont to rubber stamp a new CC
Quote from: Snapchap on September 01, 2023, 12:45:00 PM
Who's "the fella on Nolan"? Is he suggesting the people, mid-commemoration, took the time to ask the cops to come over and arrest a few of them?
Mark Sykes, who as I say was shot 5 times during the massacre, and who lost his brother-in-law, was arrested and left handcuffed in a police car for two and a half hours for attending the commemoration. He remains, to this day, the only person that the police have ever arrested in relation to a massacre that the police themselves colluded in.
John Burrows, a former PSNI officer "with a background in professional ethics" who testified during the case.
The suggestion, as I understand it from judge's view of the bodycam evidence, is that the memorial had concluded. The speakers had finished, people had left and equipment was being dissasmbled. There are clearly semantics at play here but if the video evidence is as such, it's easy for them to argue the claim they arrested Sykes "during the memorial" is inaccurate. Their presence, obviously, was known during the memorial itself.
Quote from: johnnycool on September 01, 2023, 08:56:56 AM
It's all gotten a bit murky for those cops at the Sean Grahams anniversary as they initially said they didn't know what the gathering was for or anything about the Sean Grahams massacre but the radio recordings suggest different as they were told exactly what was going on.
It won't be the first time a member of the PSNI/RUC told a few porkies in a court of law so little wonder these young recruits ably assisted by the Police Federation didn't think it was an issue to continue to do so!
Are the audio/video clips themselves to corroborate this point of view available? The judgment, if you've read it, makes reference to an officer on the radio having mentioned Sean Grahams and another referring to the "30 year anniversary of the bookie shooting there". I don't find the suggestion that the two beat cops (7 and 10 months on the job, and one of them a Catholic from the South) hadn't the slightest clue about either the massacre itself or the memorial in any way implausible. A few bits of chatter on the radio during the moment itself making reference to events they neither know of the existence or significance of wasn't going to give them a history lesson.
Quote from: JPGJOHNNYG on September 01, 2023, 01:32:13 PM
Quote from: Orior on September 01, 2023, 01:27:57 PM
If the PSNI had interrupted a memorial to the Shankill bomb would the DUP have waited until now to call for the Chief Constable's head?
Can a new Chief Constable be appointed while the DUP have closed Stormont?
At the minute no, needs stormont to rubber stamp a new CC
Could this be a plan by the DUP to engineer a reason for them to get stormont up and running again? Ie whip up a frenzy "ah sure we had to get back at it in order to get rid of the IRA supporting cheif constable"?
Quote from: HiMucker on September 01, 2023, 03:37:57 PM
Quote from: JPGJOHNNYG on September 01, 2023, 01:32:13 PM
Quote from: Orior on September 01, 2023, 01:27:57 PM
If the PSNI had interrupted a memorial to the Shankill bomb would the DUP have waited until now to call for the Chief Constable's head?
Can a new Chief Constable be appointed while the DUP have closed Stormont?
At the minute no, needs stormont to rubber stamp a new CC
Could this be a plan by the DUP to engineer a reason for them to get stormont up and running again? Ie whip up a frenzy "ah sure we had to get back at it in order to get rid of the IRA supporting cheif constable"?
Either way it is a dead cat because the narrative is shifted away from the DUP and their boycott of Stormont and the knock-on effects with the local services and the economy.
Gets them off the hook for a bit any way.
A shadowy vigilante group has declared war on Ulster's drug dealers.
The Sunday World can reveal that a group of ex-loyalist paramilitaries have set up an organisation with the sole aim of targeting drug peddlers.
Dealers from the bottom of the food chain to the top are in the sights of the group members who say they will strike without warning and claim they are prepared to take lives.
It is understood the group has been holding meetings over a long period of time and has been building an 'intelligence file' on the country's major and minor dealers – no one is exempt.
The group is made up of veteran loyalist paramilitaries, mostly from the UVF and the dormant Ulster Resistance.
The anti-drug purge is the brainchild of a farmer/landowner from mid Ulster, and the organisation has bypassed the current paramilitary leadership. UVF Chief of Staff John Bunter Graham and UDA godfather Jackie McDonald have been vocal in their opposition to the drugs trade but have failed to curb the spread of drug abuse and have turned a blind eye as paramilitaries make money from the illicit trade.
Our source said low-level dealers will be kneecapped but their main focus is on suppliers who they say will be shot dead.
"Their main intention is the protection of loyalist communities – they will target anyone whether they are dissidents or foreign gangs. If they're dealing in loyalist communities they are fair game."
The source said they had access to a significant cache of weaponry.
It is known the secretive Ulster Resistance retains an arsenal of weapons hidden in arms dumps across Northern Ireland
Quote from: Eire90 on September 02, 2023, 12:07:11 AM
A shadowy vigilante group has declared war on Ulster's drug dealers.
The Sunday World can reveal that a group of ex-loyalist paramilitaries have set up an organisation with the sole aim of targeting drug peddlers.
Dealers from the bottom of the food chain to the top are in the sights of the group members who say they will strike without warning and claim they are prepared to take lives.
It is understood the group has been holding meetings over a long period of time and has been building an 'intelligence file' on the country's major and minor dealers – no one is exempt.
The group is made up of veteran loyalist paramilitaries, mostly from the UVF and the dormant Ulster Resistance.
The anti-drug purge is the brainchild of a farmer/landowner from mid Ulster, and the organisation has bypassed the current paramilitary leadership. UVF Chief of Staff John Bunter Graham and UDA godfather Jackie McDonald have been vocal in their opposition to the drugs trade but have failed to curb the spread of drug abuse and have turned a blind eye as paramilitaries make money from the illicit trade.
They don't want to stop drugs that's the problem. They just want to limit all the supply of it so that only the paramilitaries can make money from it
Quote from: HiMucker on August 31, 2023, 02:53:22 PM
Quote from: Taylor on August 31, 2023, 02:42:59 PM
Quote from: Orior on August 31, 2023, 12:13:27 PM
Quote from: Taylor on August 31, 2023, 10:35:25 AM
Quote from: Orior on August 31, 2023, 10:31:36 AM
Bin Lowry in tears on Nolan this morning.
What was his problem today?
PSNIRA
Is there anyone that isnt in the RA at this stage?
Gerry Adams
brilliant
NI budget clusterfuck
https://www.irishtimes.com/politics/2023/09/03/london-will-not-throw-money-at-northern-ireland-chris-heaton-harris/
In a speech at the British Irish Association's annual conference in Oxford at the weekend, Chris Heaton-Harris said that in the past the "so-called solution" to a Northern Ireland problem had been to "throw money at it and hope it will go away" and this pattern could not be repeated.
"The problems facing Northern Ireland cannot be fixed with a sticking-plaster funding settlement, which would not do anything to address the structural problems that have been building for years," he said
Another day, another Lundy outed. This time, one of the founders of the DUP...
https://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/politics/new-ireland-is-now-inevitable-says-dup-founding-member/a1243025765.html
Quote from: Orior on September 04, 2023, 11:51:49 AM
Another day, another Lundy outed. This time, one of the founders of the DUP...
https://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/politics/new-ireland-is-now-inevitable-says-dup-founding-member/a1243025765.html
I think that reality has been obvious now for years, it's the persistent policy of trying to wreck the place before they lose their grip is a reflection of the vindictiveness and bile. But their electorate seems happy with the chaos.
Good living for a living;
https://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/business/agri/farmer-who-criticised-police-for-not-catching-those-behind-huge-cannabis-factory-is-charged-himself/a760397715.html (https://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/business/agri/farmer-who-criticised-police-for-not-catching-those-behind-huge-cannabis-factory-is-charged-himself/a760397715.html)
Quote from: NAG1 on September 01, 2023, 03:45:07 PM
Quote from: HiMucker on September 01, 2023, 03:37:57 PM
Quote from: JPGJOHNNYG on September 01, 2023, 01:32:13 PM
Quote from: Orior on September 01, 2023, 01:27:57 PM
If the PSNI had interrupted a memorial to the Shankill bomb would the DUP have waited until now to call for the Chief Constable's head?
Can a new Chief Constable be appointed while the DUP have closed Stormont?
At the minute no, needs stormont to rubber stamp a new CC
Could this be a plan by the DUP to engineer a reason for them to get stormont up and running again? Ie whip up a frenzy "ah sure we had to get back at it in order to get rid of the IRA supporting cheif constable"?
Either way it is a dead cat because the narrative is shifted away from the DUP and their boycott of Stormont and the knock-on effects with the local services and the economy.
Gets them off the hook for a bit any way.
They are holding the North back. Even the Tories say there is no justification for the boycott. It's so depressing.
Fingers in ears, eyes closed, head buried under sand....
https://m.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/politics/i-didnt-want-to-see-that-front-page-in-tesco-jim-wells-says-wallace-thompson-shouldve-kept-new-ireland-views-to-himself/a1289071126.html
Wasn't much need for Sinn Fein boycott, got them nothing, so their position in trying get DUP bck starting from a bad base, as their boycott, the stick used to beat them.
Quote from: Wildweasel74 on September 06, 2023, 01:30:36 AM
Wasn't much need for Sinn Fein boycott, got them nothing, so their position in trying get DUP bck starting from a bad base, as their boycott, the stick used to beat them.
Rights or wrongs behind SF pulling out at that time was at least a principled one regarding RHI.
DUP boycott is completely sectarian, they can gurn about the WF or Protocol all they want (they aren't stupid enough at this point to think they can actually change it) but at the end of the day, they simply cannot countenance going in to Stormont under a SF FM and a woman at that. All the rest is them dancing on the head of a pin because they know they have been sold out and know they have no where to turn.
The longer they stay away the more influence Dublin can assert and we have already seen this with some low key joint investment projects.
I am not a SF supporter but it had reached the point where it was completely taking the piss and something needed done.. Any DUP MLA, or DUP member it would seem, could do whatever they wanted and they could get away with it. They were taking the piss out of everyone - they were pretty much doing what Johnson did before he did it. Do whatever you want with zero accountability. (I am not sure it is much different now mind you).
I still don't believe that the DUP informed their voters etc they were bailing out of this. There has to come a point where this has to stop. You would think it's long past mind you.
They think they hold the key to everything and everything revolves round them. Get Dublin involved and then see what they do then.
Quote from: Wildweasel74 on September 06, 2023, 01:30:36 AM
Wasn't much need for Sinn Fein boycott, got them nothing, so their position in trying get DUP bck starting from a bad base, as their boycott, the stick used to beat them.
Big difference was that quite quickly SF did a deal with Poots on behalf of the DUP to go back in, only for loyalist groupings to put pressure on the DUP who then reneged on the deal. The point is you cannot rely on the DUP or the UUP to keep their word, they are beholden to the Bryson's of this world.
Yep, we have to out extreme the extremists.
The GFA has to be rewritten so that no party can boycott Stormont. The DUP boycott is a disaster for the people.
Quote from: seafoid on September 06, 2023, 10:46:48 AM
The GFA has to be rewritten so that no party can boycott Stormont. The DUP boycott is a disaster for the people.
Or that they can boycott it if they want, but the rest can go ahead without them.
Quote from: dec on September 06, 2023, 02:09:04 PM
Quote from: seafoid on September 06, 2023, 10:46:48 AM
The GFA has to be rewritten so that no party can boycott Stormont. The DUP boycott is a disaster for the people.
Or that they can boycott it if they want, but the rest can go ahead without them.
Yes.
I think too, parties like Alliance should be able to take first/deputy first minister role. So far as I know (and I could be wrong) they can't hold either position as they don't designate as Nationalist/Unionist.
I assume the same is true for independents.
I think, or hope, we have moved on enough as a society that we can do this.
I'd also be in favour of at least reviewing the Petition of concern and how it can be used. It has certainly been abused, particularly by unionists.
How do we get to the stage where it's agreed that no one party can collapse the executive?
Does all parties have to actually be sitting in the assembly , and take a vote to agree the reform?
Can the British/Irish governments go over the executive 's heads and just announce that we are doing this?
Or do all parties and both governments have to actually sit down again and basically thrash out a new GFA?
Quote from: AustinPowers on September 06, 2023, 03:26:23 PM
How do we get to the stage where it's agreed that no one party can collapse the executive?
Does all parties have to actually be sitting in the assembly , and take a vote to agree the reform?
Can the British/Irish governments go over the executive 's heads and just announce that we are doing this?
Or do all parties and both governments have to actually sit down again and basically thrash out a new GFA?
You need a new GFA. They didn't think about everything.
Someone needs to tell the DUP to GFY.
Quote from: seafoid on September 06, 2023, 04:04:37 PM
Quote from: AustinPowers on September 06, 2023, 03:26:23 PM
How do we get to the stage where it's agreed that no one party can collapse the executive?
Does all parties have to actually be sitting in the assembly , and take a vote to agree the reform?
Can the British/Irish governments go over the executive 's heads and just announce that we are doing this?
Or do all parties and both governments have to actually sit down again and basically thrash out a new GFA?
You need a new GFA. They didn't think about everything.
Someone needs to tell the DUP to GFY.
25 years ago no one would have thought that you didn't want to help govern the place. SF used the loophole first and monkey see, monkey do.
People will suffer ultimately, health, education, infrastructure as we can see is unravelling before our eyes.
What is the DUPs endgame? Nothing seems to change for them in relation to the protocol, and the longer they stay away the more difficult it becomes for them to go back.
But we have to remember this is what people want and have voted for. SF's vote went up with their boycott and the DUPs vote is holding up and the policy is popular with its voters. Nobody really cares that Stormont isn't sitting and see no discernible difference in their lives, even though we are being left behind in the UK and Europe.
Sammy Wilson nearly talked himself into a border poll trying to debate with Steve Baker Monday night in the commons. I'd say it's minimum viable running of North until enough see it's a failed state and a poll can be called. He threw gauntlet down to DUP to make it work or face a different future. They've talked themselves into a corner.
Quote from: weareros on September 06, 2023, 04:29:36 PM
Sammy Wilson nearly talked himself into a border poll trying to debate with Steve Baker Monday night in the commons. I'd say it's minimum viable running of North until enough see it's a failed state and a poll can be called. He threw gauntlet down to DUP to make it work or face a different future. They've talked themselves into a corner.
The short-sightedness of the DUP has caught them out time and time again. From Brexit, to backing Boris, to this Boycott. They will have no one to blame but themselves. It's a roadmap in how not to do politics.
Quote from: weareros on September 06, 2023, 04:29:36 PM
Sammy Wilson nearly talked himself into a border poll trying to debate with Steve Baker Monday night in the commons. I'd say it's minimum viable running of North until enough see it's a failed state and a poll can be called. He threw gauntlet down to DUP to make it work or face a different future. They've talked themselves into a corner.
They will only change course if they have no other choice. As long as gobshites continue to vote for them there will be no change.
https://twitter.com/duncan_morrow/status/1699229432979116072
Quote from: trailer on September 06, 2023, 04:18:14 PM
Quote from: seafoid on September 06, 2023, 04:04:37 PM
Quote from: AustinPowers on September 06, 2023, 03:26:23 PM
How do we get to the stage where it's agreed that no one party can collapse the executive?
Does all parties have to actually be sitting in the assembly , and take a vote to agree the reform?
Can the British/Irish governments go over the executive 's heads and just announce that we are doing this?
Or do all parties and both governments have to actually sit down again and basically thrash out a new GFA?
You need a new GFA. They didn't think about everything.
Someone needs to tell the DUP to GFY.
25 years ago no one would have thought that you didn't want to help govern the place. SF used the loophole first and monkey see, monkey do.
People will suffer ultimately, health, education, infrastructure as we can see is unravelling before our eyes.
What is the DUPs endgame? Nothing seems to change for them in relation to the protocol, and the longer they stay away the more difficult it becomes for them to go back.
But we have to remember this is what people want and have voted for. SF's vote went up with their boycott and the DUPs vote is holding up and the policy is popular with its voters. Nobody really cares that Stormont isn't sitting and see no discernible difference in their lives, even though we are being left behind in the UK and Europe.
This is not SF"s fault. Don't forget the SF boycott started over RHI and both Alliance and the SDLP were supportive of SF's position regarding the need for Forster to stand aside given her involvement in the decision making. The nationalist community weighed in behind the Irish Speaking community on the need for respect and an ILA. Poots did a deal with them within a short period only for the DUP to renege on the deal, showing their ongoing disrespect for the Irish/nationalist community. So it is not correct or fair and just lazy analysis to blame SF on the past boycott. This time is different the DUP are boycotting Stormont over issues that are between the UK government and the EU. So the two can not be compared.
Quote from: Applesisapples on September 07, 2023, 09:23:04 AM
Quote from: trailer on September 06, 2023, 04:18:14 PM
Quote from: seafoid on September 06, 2023, 04:04:37 PM
Quote from: AustinPowers on September 06, 2023, 03:26:23 PM
How do we get to the stage where it's agreed that no one party can collapse the executive?
Does all parties have to actually be sitting in the assembly , and take a vote to agree the reform?
Can the British/Irish governments go over the executive 's heads and just announce that we are doing this?
Or do all parties and both governments have to actually sit down again and basically thrash out a new GFA?
You need a new GFA. They didn't think about everything.
Someone needs to tell the DUP to GFY.
25 years ago no one would have thought that you didn't want to help govern the place. SF used the loophole first and monkey see, monkey do.
People will suffer ultimately, health, education, infrastructure as we can see is unravelling before our eyes.
What is the DUPs endgame? Nothing seems to change for them in relation to the protocol, and the longer they stay away the more difficult it becomes for them to go back.
But we have to remember this is what people want and have voted for. SF's vote went up with their boycott and the DUPs vote is holding up and the policy is popular with its voters. Nobody really cares that Stormont isn't sitting and see no discernible difference in their lives, even though we are being left behind in the UK and Europe.
This is not SF"s fault. Don't forget the SF boycott started over RHI and both Alliance and the SDLP were supportive of SF's position regarding the need for Forster to stand aside given her involvement in the decision making. The nationalist community weighed in behind the Irish Speaking community on the need for respect and an ILA. Poots did a deal with them within a short period only for the DUP to renege on the deal, showing their ongoing disrespect for the Irish/nationalist community. So it is not correct or fair and just lazy analysis to blame SF on the past boycott. This time is different the DUP are boycotting Stormont over issues that are between the UK government and the EU. So the two can not be compared.
The reasons are different. But they are using the exact same mechanism that SF used. Surely you can see that?
Quote from: trailer on September 07, 2023, 09:25:25 AM
Quote from: Applesisapples on September 07, 2023, 09:23:04 AM
Quote from: trailer on September 06, 2023, 04:18:14 PM
Quote from: seafoid on September 06, 2023, 04:04:37 PM
Quote from: AustinPowers on September 06, 2023, 03:26:23 PM
How do we get to the stage where it's agreed that no one party can collapse the executive?
Does all parties have to actually be sitting in the assembly , and take a vote to agree the reform?
Can the British/Irish governments go over the executive 's heads and just announce that we are doing this?
Or do all parties and both governments have to actually sit down again and basically thrash out a new GFA?
You need a new GFA. They didn't think about everything.
Someone needs to tell the DUP to GFY.
25 years ago no one would have thought that you didn't want to help govern the place. SF used the loophole first and monkey see, monkey do.
People will suffer ultimately, health, education, infrastructure as we can see is unravelling before our eyes.
What is the DUPs endgame? Nothing seems to change for them in relation to the protocol, and the longer they stay away the more difficult it becomes for them to go back.
But we have to remember this is what people want and have voted for. SF's vote went up with their boycott and the DUPs vote is holding up and the policy is popular with its voters. Nobody really cares that Stormont isn't sitting and see no discernible difference in their lives, even though we are being left behind in the UK and Europe.
This is not SF"s fault. Don't forget the SF boycott started over RHI and both Alliance and the SDLP were supportive of SF's position regarding the need for Forster to stand aside given her involvement in the decision making. The nationalist community weighed in behind the Irish Speaking community on the need for respect and an ILA. Poots did a deal with them within a short period only for the DUP to renege on the deal, showing their ongoing disrespect for the Irish/nationalist community. So it is not correct or fair and just lazy analysis to blame SF on the past boycott. This time is different the DUP are boycotting Stormont over issues that are between the UK government and the EU. So the two can not be compared.
The reasons are different. But they are using the exact same mechanism that SF used. Surely you can see that?
I'm not sure how it's relevant that they used the same mechanism? Are you pointing out the flaws in the system? Genuine question.
For me, SF collapsed the assembly as the DUP were governing for themselves and themselves alone. There were many issues around the use of the POC, the Irish langauge act which had already been agreed to be implemented by all parties and the DUP reneged on, the RHI scandal and blatant one sided governance.
SF had my support in collapsing the assembly at that time in protest to DUP blocking everything that didnt suit them.
In this current instance, DUP have collapsed it as the WF doesnt suit them.
So the same mechanism and the same underlying reason.
The difference this time is that the DUP have no support from anyone apart from a portion of their own electorate, which includes the paramilitaries (the real leadership of the DUP). I know many traditional DUP voters who don't agree with the stance, or at least that's what they say. I'd guess they'd still vote DUP.
Trailer do you think that if SF hadn't done what they did the DUP wouldn't have worked out themselves that they could do this?
Quote from: tbrick18 on September 07, 2023, 09:49:30 AM
Quote from: trailer on September 07, 2023, 09:25:25 AM
Quote from: Applesisapples on September 07, 2023, 09:23:04 AM
Quote from: trailer on September 06, 2023, 04:18:14 PM
Quote from: seafoid on September 06, 2023, 04:04:37 PM
Quote from: AustinPowers on September 06, 2023, 03:26:23 PM
How do we get to the stage where it's agreed that no one party can collapse the executive?
Does all parties have to actually be sitting in the assembly , and take a vote to agree the reform?
Can the British/Irish governments go over the executive 's heads and just announce that we are doing this?
Or do all parties and both governments have to actually sit down again and basically thrash out a new GFA?
You need a new GFA. They didn't think about everything.
Someone needs to tell the DUP to GFY.
25 years ago no one would have thought that you didn't want to help govern the place. SF used the loophole first and monkey see, monkey do.
People will suffer ultimately, health, education, infrastructure as we can see is unravelling before our eyes.
What is the DUPs endgame? Nothing seems to change for them in relation to the protocol, and the longer they stay away the more difficult it becomes for them to go back.
But we have to remember this is what people want and have voted for. SF's vote went up with their boycott and the DUPs vote is holding up and the policy is popular with its voters. Nobody really cares that Stormont isn't sitting and see no discernible difference in their lives, even though we are being left behind in the UK and Europe.
This is not SF"s fault. Don't forget the SF boycott started over RHI and both Alliance and the SDLP were supportive of SF's position regarding the need for Forster to stand aside given her involvement in the decision making. The nationalist community weighed in behind the Irish Speaking community on the need for respect and an ILA. Poots did a deal with them within a short period only for the DUP to renege on the deal, showing their ongoing disrespect for the Irish/nationalist community. So it is not correct or fair and just lazy analysis to blame SF on the past boycott. This time is different the DUP are boycotting Stormont over issues that are between the UK government and the EU. So the two can not be compared.
The reasons are different. But they are using the exact same mechanism that SF used. Surely you can see that?
I'm not sure how it's relevant that they used the same mechanism? Are you pointing out the flaws in the system? Genuine question.
For me, SF collapsed the assembly as the DUP were governing for themselves and themselves alone. There were many issues around the use of the POC, the Irish langauge act which had already been agreed to be implemented by all parties and the DUP reneged on, the RHI scandal and blatant one sided governance.
SF had my support in collapsing the assembly at that time in protest to DUP blocking everything that didnt suit them.
In this current instance, DUP have collapsed it as the WF doesnt suit them.
So the same mechanism and the same underlying reason.
The difference this time is that the DUP have no support from anyone apart from a portion of their own electorate, which includes the paramilitaries (the real leadership of the DUP). I know many traditional DUP voters who don't agree with the stance, or at least that's what they say. I'd guess they'd still vote DUP.
I don't think if SF had did what they did, the DUP would've have done the same. Leaving aside why SF collapsed the assembly, it gives the DUP cover for their current actions by simply pointing out that SF did the exact same thing. Maybe I am wrong. Who knows. The DUP are useless c***ts for sure.
When MMcG collapsed the Assembly the tagline was no return to the status quo. Fair enough. But then they went back into exactly that. No ILA, Foster FM, and I can't even remember what the 3rd thing was. It was just a waste of time were services suffered. That pissed me off.
Quote from: imtommygunn on September 07, 2023, 10:03:22 AM
Trailer do you think that if SF hadn't done what they did the DUP wouldn't have worked out themselves that they could do this?
They would've known to do it, but it was the nuclear option and they might not have gone through with it. SF's previous gives them cover. It plays great with their base.
"Sticking it to SF. If they can do it so can we. An eye for an eye. Them Republicans won't tell us what to do." blah, blah, blah.
I don't think so tbh. They wouldn't care about going nuclear with or without the cover of that. They always have their default fallback of but what about the ra.
They're slippery enough they'd have found some "reason".
Quote from: trailer on September 07, 2023, 09:25:25 AM
Quote from: Applesisapples on September 07, 2023, 09:23:04 AM
Quote from: trailer on September 06, 2023, 04:18:14 PM
Quote from: seafoid on September 06, 2023, 04:04:37 PM
Quote from: AustinPowers on September 06, 2023, 03:26:23 PM
How do we get to the stage where it's agreed that no one party can collapse the executive?
Does all parties have to actually be sitting in the assembly , and take a vote to agree the reform?
Can the British/Irish governments go over the executive 's heads and just announce that we are doing this?
Or do all parties and both governments have to actually sit down again and basically thrash out a new GFA?
You need a new GFA. They didn't think about everything.
Someone needs to tell the DUP to GFY.
25 years ago no one would have thought that you didn't want to help govern the place. SF used the loophole first and monkey see, monkey do.
People will suffer ultimately, health, education, infrastructure as we can see is unravelling before our eyes.
What is the DUPs endgame? Nothing seems to change for them in relation to the protocol, and the longer they stay away the more difficult it becomes for them to go back.
But we have to remember this is what people want and have voted for. SF's vote went up with their boycott and the DUPs vote is holding up and the policy is popular with its voters. Nobody really cares that Stormont isn't sitting and see no discernible difference in their lives, even though we are being left behind in the UK and Europe.
This is not SF"s fault. Don't forget the SF boycott started over RHI and both Alliance and the SDLP were supportive of SF's position regarding the need for Forster to stand aside given her involvement in the decision making. The nationalist community weighed in behind the Irish Speaking community on the need for respect and an ILA. Poots did a deal with them within a short period only for the DUP to renege on the deal, showing their ongoing disrespect for the Irish/nationalist community. So it is not correct or fair and just lazy analysis to blame SF on the past boycott. This time is different the DUP are boycotting Stormont over issues that are between the UK government and the EU. So the two can not be compared.
The reasons are different. But they are using the exact same mechanism that SF used. Surely you can see that?
The point I am making is that SF had agreed to go back very quickly under a deal which the DUP reneged on at the behest of loyalist paramilitaries and their fellow travellers, their boycott also was about matters over which Stormont had control. So they are not the same and cannot be conflated and it is lazy analysis to do so.
Quote from: imtommygunn on September 07, 2023, 10:08:50 AM
I don't think so tbh. They wouldn't care about going nuclear with or without the cover of that. They always have their default fallback of but what about the ra.
They're slippery enough they'd have found some "reason".
One thing I learned back in the '80's during Drumcree, is you should never underestimate the willingness of hardcore DUP voters and loyalists to cut off every appendage to spite their face. Even if it causes them to lose everything they own.
Quote from: Applesisapples on September 07, 2023, 10:29:54 AM
Quote from: imtommygunn on September 07, 2023, 10:08:50 AM
I don't think so tbh. They wouldn't care about going nuclear with or without the cover of that. They always have their default fallback of but what about the ra.
They're slippery enough they'd have found some "reason".
One thing I learned back in the '80's during Drumcree, is you should never underestimate the willingness of hardcore DUP voters and loyalists to cut off every appendage to spite their face. Even if it causes them to lose everything they own.
Oh so true.
The DUP, Donaldson to be precise is still wrangling for a win of sorts to allow them to save some face and get Stormont up and running as they know it will hurt them long term with the electorate, but he's being undermined by the more vocal in his party but the absurdity of creating these 7 tests and the likes which they're bound to have known the UK government would never meet ranks of stupidity and arrogance of the highest level.
Sitting beside Michelle O'Neill as first minister also doesn't help, but that will be for ELP and not wee Jeffrey if he's still around in the next few months.
They really are badly led ever since Robinson exited the stage for them.
DUP really have backed themselves into a corner.
They have gambled that the tories will give them what they want if they collapse Stormont.
It doesnt seem to be working as the tories have just kind of said, leave them to it.
The Tories and the GB public in general couldn't give a toss about this place or the sensitivities of the unionist hard liners.
They will see a financial cost....that's it. Would they be happy cutting that cost off?
I don't see a way back for the DUP without losing face and probably leadership again. By changing leadership they could go back in and put all the blame on wee jeff. They'd need to do it quickly though to allow a settling in period before the next round of elections.
The days of unionist dominance over all are over and they still have not been able to accept that, and I dont know why.
What's the worst that could happen for them? They country is run by a governement sitting in Dublin, but they can still be British, sing to the queen/king, march around bonfires, etc. They might get a better set of public services under a dublin government too.
Perhaps the spectre of SF running the country is what terrifies them most.
Quote from: tbrick18 on September 07, 2023, 11:07:17 AM
DUP really have backed themselves into a corner.
They have gambled that the tories will give them what they want if they collapse Stormont.
It doesnt seem to be working as the tories have just kind of said, leave them to it.
The Tories and the GB public in general couldn't give a toss about this place or the sensitivities of the unionist hard liners.
They will see a financial cost....that's it. Would they be happy cutting that cost off?
I don't see a way back for the DUP without losing face and probably leadership again. By changing leadership they could go back in and put all the blame on wee jeff. They'd need to do it quickly though to allow a settling in period before the next round of elections.
The days of unionist dominance over all are over and they still have not been able to accept that, and I dont know why.
What's the worst that could happen for them? They country is run by a governement sitting in Dublin, but they can still be British, sing to the queen/king, march around bonfires, etc. They might get a better set of public services under a dublin government too.
Perhaps the spectre of SF running the country is what terrifies them most.
The DUP are paranoid. They are terrified of losing control. It would probably indicate to them that the future of the North was very uncertain.
SF are as neoliberal as they are. They are far more teddy bear than the Tories.
Quote from: johnnycool on September 07, 2023, 10:39:25 AM
Quote from: Applesisapples on September 07, 2023, 10:29:54 AM
Quote from: imtommygunn on September 07, 2023, 10:08:50 AM
I don't think so tbh. They wouldn't care about going nuclear with or without the cover of that. They always have their default fallback of but what about the ra.
They're slippery enough they'd have found some "reason".
One thing I learned back in the '80's during Drumcree, is you should never underestimate the willingness of hardcore DUP voters and loyalists to cut off every appendage to spite their face. Even if it causes them to lose everything they own.
Oh so true.
The DUP, Donaldson to be precise is still wrangling for a win of sorts to allow them to save some face and get Stormont up and running as they know it will hurt them long term with the electorate, but he's being undermined by the more vocal in his party but the absurdity of creating these 7 tests and the likes which they're bound to have known the UK government would never meet ranks of stupidity and arrogance of the highest level.
Sitting beside Michelle O'Neill as first minister also doesn't help, but that will be for ELP and not wee Jeffrey if he's still around in the next few months.
They really are badly led ever since Robinson exited the stage for them.
The 7 that started as 5 and will probably grow yet.
There has to be an end line somewhere but their bitterness knows no bounds and really I think that is the main reason they are not in government.
Donaldson is nearly worse than Foster and that is saying something.
The DUP were all set to accept the protocol until they got spooked by Bryson, Allister and LCC. While they are bigots on social issues, Irish culture, they know well the economic benefits of having access to EU for trade. Even Paisley made sure to note the cows were Irish during Foot and Mouth. Sure Poots was writing letters behind the scenes to make sure farmers were still getting EU benefits and was giving out stink about having to compete with cheap Aussie and NZ beef and lamb from Brexit trade deals. He was even having his department build the customs posts which Allister dubbed Poots Posts. He also objected to protection status for Irish Grass Fed Beef in EU because it did not include the 6 counties. He won and now it's 32. They tried to be too clever for their own good instead of being honest with the Unionist electorate that having access to EU trade means some necessary compromises.
Don't rule out the possibility that the DUP will use the current stalemate to force new negotiations in relation to the governance of the North, which they will use as an opportunity to attempt renegotiation of the GFA. They are running out of moves and are desperate to move the goalposts on a border poll.
Quote from: Caesar on September 07, 2023, 12:08:43 PM
Don't rule out the possibility that the DUP will use the current stalemate to force new negotiations in relation to the governance of the North, which they will use as an opportunity to attempt renegotiation of the GFA. They are running out of moves and are desperate to move the goalposts on a border poll.
It shouldn't matter now. They're not in a position of power anymore. They don't hold the majority vote backed up by a sympathetic UK Gov anymore. They squandered their opportunity to try and make an alternative NI a possibility in the long term. Any negotiations they go into now is at a weakened state. They will have to be dragged kicking and screaming into any shared future because as was pointed out to them in the Commons this week, the option they want to return to, isn't there anymore. It's no longer an option. So you have to pick from the available options. And if they don't, it will be forced onto them just like the WF.
They're trying to shift the majority that's required for a UI.
It's all a far cry from milk and two sugars.
Quote from: imtommygunn on September 07, 2023, 12:37:34 PM
They're trying to shift the majority that's required for a UI.
But they won't be able to. It would never be accepted by nationalists. And they swing as much power as Unionists now and their majority will only grow. It's too late to try and force that now. They're in too weak a position.
The other big motivation for the DUP maintaining the stalemate is to avoid a Sinn Fein First Minister. For years the DUP have used this as a scare tactic to garner votes. "The DUP are the only party capable of stopping Sinn Fein...".
Don't underestimate this. Not even unionists vote DUP based on what they deliver for the electorate. It's all scare tactics. Once Sinn Fein hold the First Minister position and the DUP lose this leverage it could be make a big impact!
I find it strange that the FM / Deputy FM roles were named as they were in the GFA. In reality, They are equal roles but the wording of the FM title is important. UNionists could always think they held the power while they held the FM role. Even though the deputy was an equal position, symbolically it was as if they still lorded it over those pesky fenians.
Makes you wonder why nationalist parties agreed to the titles of these roles in 1998. I mean , was it not called "power sharing"? Surely that should mean JOINT first ministers?
And did unionists never actually envision a time when a politician from a nationalist party might be FM?
The DUP have painted themselves into a corner. It would take a heart of stone not to laugh.
Of course there wouldn't be a nationalist FM this time either except for the St Andrews agreement imposed by the DUP. That would only have delayed things for one or two elections though.
Quote from: Caesar on September 07, 2023, 02:07:57 PM
The other big motivation for the DUP maintaining the stalemate is to avoid a Sinn Fein First Minister. For years the DUP have used this as a scare tactic to garner votes. "The DUP are the only party capable of stopping Sinn Fein...".
Don't underestimate this. Not even unionists vote DUP based on what they deliver for the electorate. It's all scare tactics. Once Sinn Fein hold the First Minister position and the DUP lose this leverage it could be make a big impact!
Don't kid yourself into thinking there is any other motivation than that. Said it a million times here. Everything else is a smokescreen around the fact they don't want a Sinn Fein First Minister. Especially one that is a woman.
Times they are a changing fast and change can't come quick enough.
DUP also no longer have enough seats for petition of concern. They made great use of that when they had the power and most of the social progress they blocked has now come in via Westminster.
Quote from: AustinPowers on September 07, 2023, 02:29:14 PM
I find it strange that the FM / Deputy FM roles were named as they were in the GFA. In reality, They are equal roles but the wording of the FM title is important. UNionists could always think they held the power while they held the FM role. Even though the deputy was an equal position, symbolically it was as if they still lorded it over those pesky fenians.
Makes you wonder why nationalist parties agreed to the titles of these roles in 1998. I mean , was it not called "power sharing"? Surely that should mean JOINT first ministers?
And did unionists never actually envision a time when a politician from a nationalist party might be FM?
Therein lies the biggest problem for political unionism. They cannot see past the next election cycle never mind look at what the medium term future might hold. Practically every political decision they ever make is solely with the next election in mind, and now that they don't have the majority, the chickens are coming home to roost. But they won't change, that much is clear at this stage. The smallest of what they deem to be a concession will always be pounced upon by the hardliners for political gain.
Quote from: johnnycool on September 07, 2023, 10:39:25 AM
Quote from: Applesisapples on September 07, 2023, 10:29:54 AM
Quote from: imtommygunn on September 07, 2023, 10:08:50 AM
I don't think so tbh. They wouldn't care about going nuclear with or without the cover of that. They always have their default fallback of but what about the ra.
They're slippery enough they'd have found some "reason".
One thing I learned back in the '80's during Drumcree, is you should never underestimate the willingness of hardcore DUP voters and loyalists to cut off every appendage to spite their face. Even if it causes them to lose everything they own.
Oh so true.
The DUP, Donaldson to be precise is still wrangling for a win of sorts to allow them to save some face and get Stormont up and running as they know it will hurt them long term with the electorate, but he's being undermined by the more vocal in his party but the absurdity of creating these 7 tests and the likes which they're bound to have known the UK government would never meet ranks of stupidity and arrogance of the highest level.
Sitting beside Michelle O'Neill as first minister also doesn't help, but that will be for ELP and not wee Jeffrey if he's still around in the next few months.
They really are badly led ever since Robinson exited the stage for them.
Will it hurt them with their electorate? I'm not too sure.
There seems to be a hardening of attitudes....as in..we'll dig ourselves into a bigger whole. We don't care.
Education, in a bad way at the minute, alot of capital works stopped to redivert existing funding just to keep schools open from maint issues ans school meals issues. A number of schools having issues with provision of school meals, plus massive Special Needs overscription. And not 1 politican gives a shit! How these people keep getting paid for not doing the job they supposed to, is amazing.
Driving tests and MOT's going up in price.
Tories punishing us all, via the DUP.
What'll be next? Water charges? Perscription charges?
The English are hardly going to keep paying to give ye things for free that they have to pay for.
Quote from: Rossfan on September 08, 2023, 08:01:32 AM
The English are hardly going to keep paying to give ye things for free that they have to pay for.
Exactly Rossfan, they'd be far wiser to pay the republic to take us off their hands
Quote from: marty34 on September 07, 2023, 08:01:39 PM
Quote from: johnnycool on September 07, 2023, 10:39:25 AM
Quote from: Applesisapples on September 07, 2023, 10:29:54 AM
Quote from: imtommygunn on September 07, 2023, 10:08:50 AM
I don't think so tbh. They wouldn't care about going nuclear with or without the cover of that. They always have their default fallback of but what about the ra.
They're slippery enough they'd have found some "reason".
One thing I learned back in the '80's during Drumcree, is you should never underestimate the willingness of hardcore DUP voters and loyalists to cut off every appendage to spite their face. Even if it causes them to lose everything they own.
Oh so true.
The DUP, Donaldson to be precise is still wrangling for a win of sorts to allow them to save some face and get Stormont up and running as they know it will hurt them long term with the electorate, but he's being undermined by the more vocal in his party but the absurdity of creating these 7 tests and the likes which they're bound to have known the UK government would never meet ranks of stupidity and arrogance of the highest level.
Sitting beside Michelle O'Neill as first minister also doesn't help, but that will be for ELP and not wee Jeffrey if he's still around in the next few months.
They really are badly led ever since Robinson exited the stage for them.
Will it hurt them with their electorate? I'm not too sure.
There seems to be a hardening of attitudes....as in..we'll dig ourselves into a bigger whole. We don't care.
It won't hurt them with
their electorate, no, but their electoral pool is dwindling, they've maxed out the hardline vote and they're still play second fiddle to SF.
They've fended off the TUV to their right, but Alliance are still making gains to the middle on what is perceived to be small u unionists. The likes of East Belfast could well fall to Alliance at the next GE.
In a recent poll it is thought Doug Beattie is cutting through to young unionists, how that plays out in the polls in the next election we'll see.
Quote from: johnnycool on September 08, 2023, 08:24:49 AM
Quote from: marty34 on September 07, 2023, 08:01:39 PM
Quote from: johnnycool on September 07, 2023, 10:39:25 AM
Quote from: Applesisapples on September 07, 2023, 10:29:54 AM
Quote from: imtommygunn on September 07, 2023, 10:08:50 AM
I don't think so tbh. They wouldn't care about going nuclear with or without the cover of that. They always have their default fallback of but what about the ra.
They're slippery enough they'd have found some "reason".
One thing I learned back in the '80's during Drumcree, is you should never underestimate the willingness of hardcore DUP voters and loyalists to cut off every appendage to spite their face. Even if it causes them to lose everything they own.
Oh so true.
The DUP, Donaldson to be precise is still wrangling for a win of sorts to allow them to save some face and get Stormont up and running as they know it will hurt them long term with the electorate, but he's being undermined by the more vocal in his party but the absurdity of creating these 7 tests and the likes which they're bound to have known the UK government would never meet ranks of stupidity and arrogance of the highest level.
Sitting beside Michelle O'Neill as first minister also doesn't help, but that will be for ELP and not wee Jeffrey if he's still around in the next few months.
They really are badly led ever since Robinson exited the stage for them.
Will it hurt them with their electorate? I'm not too sure.
There seems to be a hardening of attitudes....as in..we'll dig ourselves into a bigger whole. We don't care.
It won't hurt them with their electorate, no, but their electoral pool is dwindling, they've maxed out the hardline vote and they're still play second fiddle to SF.
They've fended off the TUV to their right, but Alliance are still making gains to the middle on what is perceived to be small u unionists. The likes of East Belfast could well fall to Alliance at the next GE.
In a recent poll it is thought Doug Beattie is cutting through to young unionists, how that plays out in the polls in the next election we'll see.
At some stage the UUP will take over again As the DUP did in the noughties.
"The crisis takes a much longer time coming than you think, and then it happens much faster than you would have thought." Rüdiger Dornbusch
'young' unionists may well think that Beattie makes more sense than the DUP loons, but will they go out and vote.?
Not convinced Beattie is cutting it tbh. Party not in a great place and if they can't pick up unionist votes now when can they.
jamie bryson making threats against brexit hardman steve bakar.
Quote from: Eire90 on September 13, 2023, 09:44:51 AM
jamie bryson making threats against brexit hardman steve bakar.
And actually proving Bakers point!
Snarlene was on GB News this morning and they were discussing legislation introduced by MPs in England.
In their usual right wing pompous fashion the english commentators were slagging MPs for not knowing the legislation that they had voted in, and said they expected the MPs to read the detail.
Snarlene went very quiet at that point, lol.
Quote from: Orior on September 13, 2023, 12:45:43 PM
Snarlene was on GB News this morning and they were discussing legislation introduced by MPs in England.
In their usual right wing pompous fashion the english commentators were slagging MPs for not knowing the legislation that they had voted in, and said they expected the MPs to read the detail.
Snarlene went very quiet at that point, lol.
You can't expect the MP's to be over ever jot and tittle...
xl bully ban does not apply blood on mla to northern hands if anyone gets attack and dies will northern ireland now become a dumping ground for xl bullys.
Actually was gonna pet one of those dogs outsude a shop the other day, stopped as I wasn't sure what it was, Head massive on it. Not a Inch on the Russian sheepdog, now they are real monsters.
https://www.rte.ie/news/leinster/2023/0929/1408002-meath-dowth-park/ (https://www.rte.ie/news/leinster/2023/0929/1408002-meath-dowth-park/)
New visitor attraction for the unionists?
Quote from: Aristo 60 on September 29, 2023, 03:25:33 PMhttps://www.rte.ie/news/leinster/2023/0929/1408002-meath-dowth-park/ (https://www.rte.ie/news/leinster/2023/0929/1408002-meath-dowth-park/)
New visitor attraction for the unionists?
They'll probably lament the fact it's no longer owned by whatever wealthy Anglo-Irish gimp used to call it home.
Quote from: Aristo 60 on September 29, 2023, 03:25:33 PMhttps://www.rte.ie/news/leinster/2023/0929/1408002-meath-dowth-park/ (https://www.rte.ie/news/leinster/2023/0929/1408002-meath-dowth-park/)
New visitor attraction for the unionists?
Irish government already pumped 15 million into the Boyne site after the GFA. I had a look once when I was taking family to Newgrange and it's a very nice visitor location. Not that any of them even appreciate these acts.
Some Unionists probably don't believe
1 that there were people in Ireland before 1609
2 that the Earth existed 5,000 years ago
Quote from: Rossfan on September 29, 2023, 04:20:04 PMSome Unionists probably don't believe
1 that there were people in Ireland before 1609
2 that the Earth existed 5,000 years ago
You are too cynical. After all who built Carrickfergus castle and the earth founded almost 6026 years ago, as every unionist knows.
Looks like the path has opened up for the DUP to go back into the executive. The wheelie bin brigade already issuing threats from grassroots unionism to incite mass protests riots and threatening to destroy their electorate vote if they do decide to go back into the assembley
hopefully whatever happens it'l be the end of him. absolute waste of space
Quote from: Nanderson on October 03, 2023, 02:18:24 PMLooks like the path has opened up for the DUP to go back into the executive. The wheelie bin brigade already issuing threats from grassroots unionism to incite mass protests riots and threatening to destroy their electorate vote if they do decide to go back into the assembley
There's a terrace-style chant in there somewhere ....
Quote from: AustinPowers on October 03, 2023, 06:22:26 PMQuote from: Nanderson on October 03, 2023, 02:18:24 PMLooks like the path has opened up for the DUP to go back into the executive. The wheelie bin brigade already issuing threats from grassroots unionism to incite mass protests riots and threatening to destroy their electorate vote if they do decide to go back into the assembley YA CNUTS?
There's a terrace-style chant in there somewhere ....
And the bigotry continues....
https://m.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/politics/irish-street-sign-survey-to-proceed-after-dup-fails-in-bid-to-block-move/a911265799.html
Israel-Gaza violence: Prime Minister Rishi Sunak calls Palestinian protest in Belfast school 'malicious'
Makedy uppity news from Wee Sammy, Arlene and the Newsletter. What a lowly piece of crap that paper is. Sad losers.
Quote from: grounded on October 17, 2023, 11:59:38 AMIsrael-Gaza violence: Prime Minister Rishi Sunak calls Palestinian protest in Belfast school 'malicious'
Makedy uppity news from Wee Sammy, Arlene and the Newsletter. What a lowly piece of crap that paper is. Sad losers.
Id love to know in what way it was malicious
There seems to be no ability to distinguish between supporting the plight of the palestinian people and supporting hamas. Even a prime minister can't do it though I would say it is more won't than can't.
He's a horrible wee man tbh.
https://www.irishtimes.com/ireland/2023/10/17/loyalists-must-get-educated-and-get-professional-jobs-argues-loyalist-activist/
Loyalists finally realising what the nationalist population figured out 50 years ago.......
If he's the best loyalism have to offer then he's right. I don't think any number of schools could help that boy though.
He was at some committee yesterday and had his arse handed to him on a plate as usual. He kept using the word subjugate and the boy had to more or less explain to him what it meant...
Imbecile.
Loyalist paramilitaries and the DUP are doing nothing to help the above. They are the biggest enemies of loyalism tbh.
Quote from: imtommygunn on October 18, 2023, 03:26:09 PMIf he's the best loyalism have to offer then he's right. I don't think any number of schools could help that boy though.
He was at some committee yesterday and had his arse handed to him on a plate as usual. He kept using the word subjugate and the boy had to more or less explain to him what it meant...
Imbecile.
Loyalist paramilitaries and the DUP are doing nothing to help the above. They are the biggest enemies of loyalism tbh.
All very true - and yet it is one side that follow him on social media, engage with him on social media and give him the oxygen he craves.
Whoever follows or engages with him are part of the problem.
If he tweeted to an echo chamber he would soon disappear
Yes exactly. The joke's over. It's not funny any more.
Nolan keeps this bollacks relevant, there is a photo floating around years ago of him in a Irish Pub in Spain with the Tricolour /(Not photoshopped) love to find that again,
https://www.reddit.com/r/northernireland/comments/sjvw2q/jamie_claiming_a_nationalist_coup_as_stormont/
I have forgotten how to add photos ;D
Quote from: LC on October 18, 2023, 03:20:33 PMhttps://www.irishtimes.com/ireland/2023/10/17/loyalists-must-get-educated-and-get-professional-jobs-argues-loyalist-activist/
Loyalists finally realising what the nationalist population figured out 50 years ago.......
Some illegal immigrant from Tipp or Timbuktu is keeping wee billy boy out of a job as a brain surgeon.
Quote from: Wildweasel74 on October 18, 2023, 10:12:40 PMNolan keeps this bollacks relevant, there is a photo floating around years ago of him in a Irish Pub in Spain with the Tricolour /(Not photoshopped) love to find that again,
Bwyson on Nolan again
He's on there nearly as often aS Vogue Williams on the late late show
What's way u make a official complaint about Nolan, gotta be the most biased f**ker on TV cause no Catholic would entertain him, that f**ker Bryson couldnt get 70 votes.DUP regret the day they sucked up to that tosser.
Quote from: AustinPowers on October 18, 2023, 11:32:13 PMQuote from: Wildweasel74 on October 18, 2023, 10:12:40 PMNolan keeps this bollacks relevant, there is a photo floating around years ago of him in a Irish Pub in Spain with the Tricolour /(Not photoshopped) love to find that again,
Bwyson on Nolan again
He's on there nearly as often aS Vogue Williams on the late late show
Vogue Williams is a qualified quantity surveyor and has won the best podcast in Britain. What is binlid's excuse.
Quote from: armaghniac on October 19, 2023, 12:06:02 AMQuote from: AustinPowers on October 18, 2023, 11:32:13 PMQuote from: Wildweasel74 on October 18, 2023, 10:12:40 PMNolan keeps this bollacks relevant, there is a photo floating around years ago of him in a Irish Pub in Spain with the Tricolour /(Not photoshopped) love to find that again,
Bwyson on Nolan again
He's on there nearly as often aS Vogue Williams on the late late show
Vogue Williams is a qualified quantity surveyor and has won the best podcast in Britain. What is binlid's excuse.
He's a useful idiot to those behind him and pulling his strings, Allister certainly, Donaldson seems to be trying to distance himself from Jamie a bit, but then you've the other DUP Pro Brexit hardliners using him, ably assisted by the uber Loyalist trying to portray himself as Mr Middle of the road Stevie Nolan.
Quote from: Wildweasel74 on October 18, 2023, 11:38:32 PMWhat's way u make a official complaint about Nolan, gotta be the most biased f**ker on TV cause no Catholic would entertain him, that f**ker Bryson couldnt get 70 votes.DUP regret the day they sucked up to that tosser.
I'll have you know he got 167 votes so he did.
Nearly as popular as the Fascists in the 26.
Wonder if those people whose homes have been devastated by storm Babet, will be consoled by money being pumped into the six counties because a small percentage feel a little bit less british?
Would a right minded unionist not wonder about a nation on its doorstep building a sovereign wealth fund whilst their particular political representatives are telling them we better off with those lads across the qater that keep stabbing us in the back and all we have to do is go back to London and tell them you just need to keep handing us more charity money and it will be OK.
Quote from: WT4E on October 23, 2023, 10:36:43 PMWould a right minded unionist not wonder about a nation on its doorstep building a sovereign wealth fund whilst their particular political representatives are telling them we better off with those lads across the qater that keep stabbing us in the back and all we have to do is go back to London and tell them you just need to keep handing us more charity money and it will be OK.
I've highlighted everything you need to know
Quote from: WT4E on October 23, 2023, 10:36:43 PMWould a right minded unionist not wonder about a nation on its doorstep building a sovereign wealth fund whilst their particular political representatives are telling them we better off with those lads across the qater that keep stabbing us in the back and all we have to do is go back to London and tell them you just need to keep handing us more charity money and it will be OK.
An oxymoron if ever there was one
Quote from: blasmere on October 24, 2023, 08:59:49 AMQuote from: WT4E on October 23, 2023, 10:36:43 PMWould a right minded unionist not wonder about a nation on its doorstep building a sovereign wealth fund whilst their particular political representatives are telling them we better off with those lads across the qater that keep stabbing us in the back and all we have to do is go back to London and tell them you just need to keep handing us more charity money and it will be OK.
An oxymoron if ever there was one
Moron is well deserved here. I should have said protestant - moderate unionist?
Quote from: WT4E on October 24, 2023, 02:09:08 PMQuote from: blasmere on October 24, 2023, 08:59:49 AMQuote from: WT4E on October 23, 2023, 10:36:43 PMWould a right minded unionist not wonder about a nation on its doorstep building a sovereign wealth fund whilst their particular political representatives are telling them we better off with those lads across the qater that keep stabbing us in the back and all we have to do is go back to London and tell them you just need to keep handing us more charity money and it will be OK.
An oxymoron if ever there was one
Moron is well deserved here. I should have said protestant - moderate unionist?
Just a prod will do, by definition of Unionist, and if he's labels him/herself as a unionist then they'll take some changing to buy into an united Ireland
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on October 24, 2023, 10:43:40 PMQuote from: WT4E on October 24, 2023, 02:09:08 PMQuote from: blasmere on October 24, 2023, 08:59:49 AMQuote from: WT4E on October 23, 2023, 10:36:43 PMWould a right minded unionist not wonder about a nation on its doorstep building a sovereign wealth fund whilst their particular political representatives are telling them we better off with those lads across the qater that keep stabbing us in the back and all we have to do is go back to London and tell them you just need to keep handing us more charity money and it will be OK.
An oxymoron if ever there was one
Moron is well deserved here. I should have said protestant - moderate unionist?
Just a prod will do, by definition of Unionist, and if he's labels him/herself as a unionist then they'll take some changing to buy into an united Ireland
Fair point. Anyway surely a united Ireland vote be won by any right minded person.
Quote from: WT4E on October 24, 2023, 11:33:06 PMQuote from: Milltown Row2 on October 24, 2023, 10:43:40 PMQuote from: WT4E on October 24, 2023, 02:09:08 PMQuote from: blasmere on October 24, 2023, 08:59:49 AMQuote from: WT4E on October 23, 2023, 10:36:43 PMWould a right minded unionist not wonder about a nation on its doorstep building a sovereign wealth fund whilst their particular political representatives are telling them we better off with those lads across the qater that keep stabbing us in the back and all we have to do is go back to London and tell them you just need to keep handing us more charity money and it will be OK.
An oxymoron if ever there was one
Moron is well deserved here. I should have said protestant - moderate unionist?
Just a prod will do, by definition of Unionist, and if he's labels him/herself as a unionist then they'll take some changing to buy into an united Ireland
Fair point. Anyway surely a united Ireland vote be won by any right minded person.
If you logically think it through it's a no brainier, but when did logic ever enter the equation?!
Sammy a slow learner...
https://m.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/politics/ni-thrown-under-the-bus-says-dups-sammy-wilson-after-sacked-braverman-accuses-pm-of-dishonesty-over-protocol/a936361049.html
Quote from: Rossfan on November 15, 2023, 11:00:20 AMSammy a slow learner...
https://m.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/politics/ni-thrown-under-the-bus-says-dups-sammy-wilson-after-sacked-braverman-accuses-pm-of-dishonesty-over-protocol/a936361049.html
They always seem shocked when PM after PM shows they don't give a fcuk about them.
They are comeplete simps for the tories.
Quote from: Tony Baloney on November 15, 2023, 06:03:07 PMQuote from: Rossfan on November 15, 2023, 11:00:20 AMSammy a slow learner...
https://m.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/politics/ni-thrown-under-the-bus-says-dups-sammy-wilson-after-sacked-braverman-accuses-pm-of-dishonesty-over-protocol/a936361049.html
They always seem shocked when PM after PM shows they don't give a fcuk about them.
They are as thick as mince.
Wasn't sure where to post this, but as they're close advisors for the DUP....
Newton Emerson make a great comment on Saturday that the East Belfast UDA had lost the UDA franchise, lol.
So their racqueteering, drug selling, community "services" will no longer be under the name of the UDA.
Ah bless.
Quote from: Orior on November 20, 2023, 03:11:18 PMWasn't sure where to post this, but as they're close advisors for the DUP....
Newton Emerson make a great comment on Saturday that the East Belfast UDA had lost the UDA franchise, lol.
So their racqueteering, drug selling, community "services" will no longer be under the name of the UDA.
Ah bless.
It will cost them a fortune getting new headed notepaper and business cards done
Ulster says dough
Some pressure on them, and the optics of healthcare staff telling them to get back to work is awful.
Jeffrey wants to get back but the other Westminster MPs aren't so keen.
Not one f**k could they give though.
Quote from: Orior on December 12, 2023, 09:04:35 AMUlster says dough
Quote from: imtommygunn on December 12, 2023, 09:23:22 AMNot one f**k could they give though.
Both statements 100% true.
Part of me wishes the British Government would tell the whole the lot of them to go f@+k themselves and if they were not sitting in Stormont on Monday morning them and their office staff (family members and other hanger ons) would have their salaries reduced to £0.
Quote from: LC on December 12, 2023, 06:22:57 PMQuote from: Orior on December 12, 2023, 09:04:35 AMUlster says dough
Quote from: imtommygunn on December 12, 2023, 09:23:22 AMNot one f**k could they give though.
Both statements 100% true.
Part of me wishes the British Government would tell the whole the lot of them to go f@+k themselves and if they were not sitting in Stormont on Monday morning them and their office staff (family members and other hanger ons) would have their salaries reduced to £0.
In a normal society that would have been done a week after the c***ts wouldnt go back in after the election.
I see Arlene and Michelle have been publicly found to have something in common ie a willingness to destroy any records that might show how inept they were in power.
They're a pair of c***ts, on the same level as Boris.
The truth is very few of them have the ability to run a country.
Quote from: thewobbler on December 12, 2023, 09:41:46 PMI see Arlene and Michelle have been publicly found to have something in common ie a willingness to destroy any records that might show how inept they were in power.
They're a pair of c***ts, on the same level as Boris.
Is it not the case that their phones are wiped once they hand them back?
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on December 13, 2023, 08:55:22 AMQuote from: thewobbler on December 12, 2023, 09:41:46 PMI see Arlene and Michelle have been publicly found to have something in common ie a willingness to destroy any records that might show how inept they were in power.
They're a pair of c***ts, on the same level as Boris.
Is it not the case that their phones are wiped once they hand them back?
Yes, this would happen in most companies if you hand back a mobile phone, computer or laptop.
Quote from: johnnycool on December 13, 2023, 09:53:28 AMQuote from: Milltown Row2 on December 13, 2023, 08:55:22 AMQuote from: thewobbler on December 12, 2023, 09:41:46 PMI see Arlene and Michelle have been publicly found to have something in common ie a willingness to destroy any records that might show how inept they were in power.
They're a pair of c***ts, on the same level as Boris.
Is it not the case that their phones are wiped once they hand them back?
Yes, this would happen in most companies if you hand back a mobile phone, computer or laptop.
And so it should, You do not want a record of government to be sitting in a storeroom or whatever. However, things like Whatsapps or text messages can be backed up before the phone is wiped and should be archived in some way if they are used for official business.
Quote from: armaghniac on December 13, 2023, 09:58:47 AMQuote from: johnnycool on December 13, 2023, 09:53:28 AMQuote from: Milltown Row2 on December 13, 2023, 08:55:22 AMQuote from: thewobbler on December 12, 2023, 09:41:46 PMI see Arlene and Michelle have been publicly found to have something in common ie a willingness to destroy any records that might show how inept they were in power.
They're a pair of c***ts, on the same level as Boris.
Is it not the case that their phones are wiped once they hand them back?
Yes, this would happen in most companies if you hand back a mobile phone, computer or laptop.
And so it should, You do not want a record of government to be sitting in a storeroom or whatever. However, things like Whatsapps or text messages can be backed up before the phone is wiped and should be archived in some way if they are used for official business.
Who backs it up? The Government or ministers? What safe environment would the ministers back it up to? Twitter lol!
I'm sure that stuff could be retrieved, and nothing like digging up shit to make news
Quote from: johnnycool on December 13, 2023, 09:53:28 AMQuote from: Milltown Row2 on December 13, 2023, 08:55:22 AMQuote from: thewobbler on December 12, 2023, 09:41:46 PMI see Arlene and Michelle have been publicly found to have something in common ie a willingness to destroy any records that might show how inept they were in power.
They're a pair of c***ts, on the same level as Boris.
Is it not the case that their phones are wiped once they hand them back?
Yes, this would happen in most companies if you hand back a mobile phone, computer or laptop.
Except when the civil servants had been told not to do that. That they would be required or the enquiry. Another blunder from a civil service full of shitheads who are completely unemployable in the real world.
Quote from: thewobbler on December 12, 2023, 09:41:46 PMI see Arlene and Michelle have been publicly found to have something in common ie a willingness to destroy any records that might show how inept they were in power.
They're a pair of c***ts, on the same level as Boris.
My understanding is that the ministers didn't wipe anything. They handed back the phones when they were no longer service as ministers.
Civil servants then reset them to factory settings.
I can see why they'd do this, but I also beleive that if there was official communications done via Whatsapp or other means then those records should have been retained.
Sounds like a break down in process again.
Quote from: tbrick18 on December 13, 2023, 10:41:17 AMQuote from: thewobbler on December 12, 2023, 09:41:46 PMI see Arlene and Michelle have been publicly found to have something in common ie a willingness to destroy any records that might show how inept they were in power.
They're a pair of c***ts, on the same level as Boris.
My understanding is that the ministers didn't wipe anything. They handed back the phones when they were no longer service as ministers.
Civil servants then reset them to factory settings.
I can see why they'd do this, but I also beleive that if there was official communications done via Whatsapp or other means then those records should have been retained.
Sounds like a break down in process again.
Yeah, heard Naomi Long on about it this morning and that seems to be the case. Don't think this sits at the door of Arlene or Michelle. Civil service are responsible for this.
Isn't stopping Jim Allister from having a pop about Michelle over it and even wheeling out the Bobby Storey funeral again.
Quote from: RedHand88 on December 13, 2023, 11:36:36 AMIsn't stopping Jim Allister from having a pop about Michelle over it and even wheeling out the Bobby Storey funeral again.
General rule of thumb, if you're annoying that clown you're doing something right lol.
Quote from: brokencrossbar1 on December 13, 2023, 11:18:57 AMQuote from: tbrick18 on December 13, 2023, 10:41:17 AMQuote from: thewobbler on December 12, 2023, 09:41:46 PMI see Arlene and Michelle have been publicly found to have something in common ie a willingness to destroy any records that might show how inept they were in power.
They're a pair of c***ts, on the same level as Boris.
My understanding is that the ministers didn't wipe anything. They handed back the phones when they were no longer service as ministers.
Civil servants then reset them to factory settings.
I can see why they'd do this, but I also beleive that if there was official communications done via Whatsapp or other means then those records should have been retained.
Sounds like a break down in process again.
Yeah, heard Naomi Long on about it this morning and that seems to be the case. Don't think this sits at the door of Arlene or Michelle. Civil service are responsible for this.
Not their fault but the facts never get in the way of a good headline. Bad press that phones where wiped and that's probably all most people will hear.
Quote from: Armagh18 on December 13, 2023, 12:32:19 PMQuote from: brokencrossbar1 on December 13, 2023, 11:18:57 AMQuote from: tbrick18 on December 13, 2023, 10:41:17 AMQuote from: thewobbler on December 12, 2023, 09:41:46 PMI see Arlene and Michelle have been publicly found to have something in common ie a willingness to destroy any records that might show how inept they were in power.
They're a pair of c***ts, on the same level as Boris.
My understanding is that the ministers didn't wipe anything. They handed back the phones when they were no longer service as ministers.
Civil servants then reset them to factory settings.
I can see why they'd do this, but I also beleive that if there was official communications done via Whatsapp or other means then those records should have been retained.
Sounds like a break down in process again.
Yeah, heard Naomi Long on about it this morning and that seems to be the case. Don't think this sits at the door of Arlene or Michelle. Civil service are responsible for this.
Not their fault but the facts never get in the way of a good headline. Bad press that phones where wiped and that's probably all most people will hear.
Would we really want to read Snarlene's (alledged) flirty texts with her chauffeur?
Quote from: Orior on December 13, 2023, 01:07:25 PMQuote from: Armagh18 on December 13, 2023, 12:32:19 PMQuote from: brokencrossbar1 on December 13, 2023, 11:18:57 AMQuote from: tbrick18 on December 13, 2023, 10:41:17 AMQuote from: thewobbler on December 12, 2023, 09:41:46 PMI see Arlene and Michelle have been publicly found to have something in common ie a willingness to destroy any records that might show how inept they were in power.
They're a pair of c***ts, on the same level as Boris.
My understanding is that the ministers didn't wipe anything. They handed back the phones when they were no longer service as ministers.
Civil servants then reset them to factory settings.
I can see why they'd do this, but I also beleive that if there was official communications done via Whatsapp or other means then those records should have been retained.
Sounds like a break down in process again.
Yeah, heard Naomi Long on about it this morning and that seems to be the case. Don't think this sits at the door of Arlene or Michelle. Civil service are responsible for this.
Not their fault but the facts never get in the way of a good headline. Bad press that phones where wiped and that's probably all most people will hear.
Would we really want to read Snarlene's (alledged) flirty texts with her chauffeur?
'Oh baby I can't wait for you to drive your big limo up my traditional route!'
Or see pics of snarlenes growler!
Cheers lads. Saved me buying lunch today I've lost my appetite!
Quote from: Orior on December 13, 2023, 01:07:25 PMQuote from: Armagh18 on December 13, 2023, 12:32:19 PMQuote from: brokencrossbar1 on December 13, 2023, 11:18:57 AMQuote from: tbrick18 on December 13, 2023, 10:41:17 AMQuote from: thewobbler on December 12, 2023, 09:41:46 PMI see Arlene and Michelle have been publicly found to have something in common ie a willingness to destroy any records that might show how inept they were in power.
They're a pair of c***ts, on the same level as Boris.
My understanding is that the ministers didn't wipe anything. They handed back the phones when they were no longer service as ministers.
Civil servants then reset them to factory settings.
I can see why they'd do this, but I also beleive that if there was official communications done via Whatsapp or other means then those records should have been retained.
Sounds like a break down in process again.
Yeah, heard Naomi Long on about it this morning and that seems to be the case. Don't think this sits at the door of Arlene or Michelle. Civil service are responsible for this.
Not their fault but the facts never get in the way of a good headline. Bad press that phones where wiped and that's probably all most people will hear.
Would we really want to read Snarlene's (alledged) flirty texts with her chauffeur?
YES! ;D
sinn fein and dup wiping whatsapps messages but aye sinn fein and dup are good people.
Quote from: Eire90 on December 13, 2023, 05:36:58 PMsinn fein and dup wiping whatsapps messages but aye sinn fein and dup are good people.
Anyone wanna explain this "story" to Eire90?
Quote from: Snapchap on December 13, 2023, 05:45:56 PMQuote from: Eire90 on December 13, 2023, 05:36:58 PMsinn fein and dup wiping whatsapps messages but aye sinn fein and dup are good people.
Anyone wanna explain this "story" to Eire90?
Would only give me a sore head
Quote from: Snapchap on December 13, 2023, 05:45:56 PMQuote from: Eire90 on December 13, 2023, 05:36:58 PMsinn fein and dup wiping whatsapps messages but aye sinn fein and dup are good people.
Anyone wanna explain this "story" to Eire90?
During Covid, politicians relied heavily on WhatsApp for communications and policy agreements.
Covid as we know now, was a very difficult time for politicians. There was no correct way to handle how it unfolded.
But one of the legacies of it all seems to be that politicians were able to dream up and unfurl measures to make unusual profits for friends and influencers.
And as a result, enquiries are being held to work out just how much of this was by accident and how much of it was on purpose.
As the paper trail for the conversations that allowed this all to happen was heavily undertaken on WhatsApp, politicians across the world are scrambling to erase all messages from that period.
This is of course immoral behaviour.
In NI the big two, who never agree on anything, have decided to throw the civil service under the bus for doing this without their knowledge. Which is of course horse shit and the real reason is has happened is because the civil servants in question were bullied and likely bribed into taking it on the chin.
This approach allows the blinkered supporters of each party to believe that the behaviour of their leaders is different to that of the crooked Boris Johnson. And they will lap it up.
Where'd you pull that out of wobbler?
Bullied and bribed lol.. plenty of facts in most of your post, but stretching here..
Can phone information be recalled via the 'cloud' or some other technique?
Quote from: thewobbler on December 13, 2023, 07:04:03 PMQuote from: Snapchap on December 13, 2023, 05:45:56 PMQuote from: Eire90 on December 13, 2023, 05:36:58 PMsinn fein and dup wiping whatsapps messages but aye sinn fein and dup are good people.
Anyone wanna explain this "story" to Eire90?
During Covid, politicians relied heavily on WhatsApp for communications and policy agreements.
Covid as we know now, was a very difficult time for politicians. There was no correct way to handle how it unfolded.
But one of the legacies of it all seems to be that politicians were able to dream up and unfurl measures to make unusual profits for friends and influencers.
And as a result, enquiries are being held to work out just how much of this was by accident and how much of it was on purpose.
As the paper trail for the conversations that allowed this all to happen was heavily undertaken on WhatsApp, politicians across the world are scrambling to erase all messages from that period.
This is of course immoral behaviour.
In NI the big two, who never agree on anything, have decided to throw the civil service under the bus for doing this without their knowledge. Which is of course horse shit and the real reason is has happened is because the civil servants in question were bullied and likely bribed into taking it on the chin.
This approach allows the blinkered supporters of each party to believe that the behaviour of their leaders is different to that of the crooked Boris Johnson. And they will lap it up.
Nailed it.
I know theres lots of links to Hancock and Boris letting their mates get contracts for PPE etc but unless I'm forgetting something there wasn't anything like that happening here as far as I remember anyway.
Quote from: Armagh18 on December 13, 2023, 08:03:47 PMI know theres lots of links to Hancock and Boris letting their mates get contracts for PPE etc but unless I'm forgetting something there wasn't anything like that happening here as far as I remember anyway.
Funeral gate is the only thing they are actually interested in.
There was something down south with private health and beds (which was possibly more panic) but the scale of what the tories have been at is on another level to most countries.
Your woman who does the undewear shop lines, not get a ton of contracts, then the stuff didn't meet the standard!
Quote from: thewobbler on December 13, 2023, 07:04:03 PMQuote from: Snapchap on December 13, 2023, 05:45:56 PMQuote from: Eire90 on December 13, 2023, 05:36:58 PMsinn fein and dup wiping whatsapps messages but aye sinn fein and dup are good people.
Anyone wanna explain this "story" to Eire90?
During Covid, politicians relied heavily on WhatsApp for communications and policy agreements.
Covid as we know now, was a very difficult time for politicians. There was no correct way to handle how it unfolded.
But one of the legacies of it all seems to be that politicians were able to dream up and unfurl measures to make unusual profits for friends and influencers.
And as a result, enquiries are being held to work out just how much of this was by accident and how much of it was on purpose.
As the paper trail for the conversations that allowed this all to happen was heavily undertaken on WhatsApp, politicians across the world are scrambling to erase all messages from that period.
This is of course immoral behaviour.
In NI the big two, who never agree on anything, have decided to throw the civil service under the bus for doing this without their knowledge. Which is of course horse shit and the real reason is has happened is because the civil servants in question were bullied and likely bribed into taking it on the chin.
This approach allows the blinkered supporters of each party to believe that the behaviour of their leaders is different to that of the crooked Boris Johnson. And they will lap it up.
Is this based on anything? Serious question by the way? I'm assuming it's based on something?
Naomi's phone was also wiped when hers was returned - something she has described as standard practice. Where does that fit into your claim that it's all a SF/DUP "big two" conspiracy, Wobbler?
Quote from: thewobbler on December 13, 2023, 07:04:03 PMIn NI the big two, who never agree on anything, have decided to throw the civil service under the bus for doing this without their knowledge. Which is of course horse shit and the real reason is has happened is because the civil servants in question were bullied and likely bribed into taking it on the chin.
This approach allows the blinkered supporters of each party to believe that the behaviour of their leaders is different to that of the crooked Boris Johnson. And they will lap it up.
I don't particularly want to defend either SF or DUP - both are two sides of the same turd in my view - but....
If the civil servants had either a semblance of balls or brains, they'd have backed the stuff up. Its not as if the politicians could touch them.
But they have neither. You'd have to travel a long way to find a more gormless bunch of fuckwits.
Quote from: RadioGAAGAA on December 13, 2023, 10:47:53 PMQuote from: thewobbler on December 13, 2023, 07:04:03 PMIn NI the big two, who never agree on anything, have decided to throw the civil service under the bus for doing this without their knowledge. Which is of course horse shit and the real reason is has happened is because the civil servants in question were bullied and likely bribed into taking it on the chin.
This approach allows the blinkered supporters of each party to believe that the behaviour of their leaders is different to that of the crooked Boris Johnson. And they will lap it up.
I don't particularly want to defend either SF or DUP - both are two sides of the same turd in my view - but....
If the civil servants had either a semblance of balls or brains, they'd have backed the stuff up. Its not as if the politicians could touch them.
But they have neither. You'd have to travel a long way to find a more gormless bunch of fuckwits.
That's a lazy analysis. SF have plenty of faults but they aren't on the same level as that other shower
I do enjoy a lively discourse.
Is there any fact in what I posted above? No. It's all supposition. Every last word.
But to answer questions.
Was bullying or bribery involved? Perhaps not. My understanding of how people reach the upper echelons of the Civil Service is that they are intuitively diplomatic. They walk in the direction the wind is blowing, and only pick fights to help the wind blow in the same direction.
Covid though is a very emotive subject, which makes their intuition of "toe the line" more difficult.
And I'll put it like this. If I tell an employee "do this or else", that's bullying. And if I tell an employee "say nothing and you will be promoted", that's bribery.
I can't possibly say that this has happened in Stormont. All I know is that whistleblowers in the high ranks of NiCS are traditionally few and far between. And they witness awful politics as par for the course.
——
In terms of the scope of our local politicians for fraud, philandering, whatever. It's genuinely negligible compared to their colleagues in Westminster. But it should then also be measured in relative terms. So if they're capable of giving a nod, that nod should be measured the same as Westminster, in relative terms.
——
If I was given the opportunity to restart my original soliloquy I would now mention that Arlene and Michelle might actually be in the same boat as NiCS. They may have received simple instructions from Westminster that their financial and political wellbeing would only be enhanced by wiping any semblance of WhatsApp during Covid times.
Why? Because they would have been involved in WhatsApp groups with Boris and/or his cabinet and aides that contained messages, that are now damning of the Conservative government. Boris and co likely had them on mute ffs but messages would have been passed... and answered.
Naomi Long wouldn't have been involved in those discussions. But she would provide tangible links to them through forwarded messages and other WhatsApp groups where they were discussed. Getting her phone wiped is important, but not so much as those the rank above.
——
And being honest I don't blame anyone for following such a protocol. A WhatsApp deletion scandal might last a week. The messages within - should they happen to be rolling the wrong direction either then or now - could destroy careers.
We all say things we don't mean on WhatsApp.
But very few of us are running the country.
——
My honest reason for the post above was to engage other posters.
As far as I'm concerned, Boris Johnson is a ****. An absolute ****. Not because of how the Tories handled Covid (difficult situation, no right answer). But for his outright disrespect for the needs and wants of the average person, before, during and after. We are all but pawns in a big money game to that ****.
That his entire WhatsApp history for that period of history is now "gone" is neither surprising nor important. It's expected.
But for any person to simultaneously admonish him directly for what is happening to enquiries in Westminster, while declaring what happened in Stormont as a Civil Servant issue, well it just drives me mad. This is adults who might wonder how children can believe in Santa Claus, but will believe anything they're told as long as it matches their political beliefs.
These politicians are all hiding something, all these WhatsApp deleters. Some more than others, no doubt. But they're all hiding something.
They're all c***ts.
There's not one politician in government that would have come out of covid without doing something, on reflection, they'll have regret, making a mistake or bad decision would have been expected to be fair.
Considering the extent of the pandemic and what it involved there's not a nation that came away without looking back and thinking there could have been a better approach.
The WhatsApps could provide some insight to what best/worst practices could be used or not used should this if come to light again.
The inquiry should have (I hope) a blueprint to how governments should react in the future, attacking them is futile, we know most of them are incompetent and the skill set they bring for such events is minimal.
It's whether or not they would be able to allow the actual science to guide them rather than their own needs.
Protocols on such things will need to be looked at, and the practice of wiping phones during times in office should have a time period of a few years, just in case, would be difficult to do or control.
And yes, I agree with your last line ;D
DUP party officers meeting today/tonight to discuss the current negotiations.
Are they about to go back into Stormont?
Quote from: tbrick18 on December 15, 2023, 11:23:02 AMDUP party officers meeting today/tonight to discuss the current negotiations.
Are they about to go back into Stormont?
Bryson in full flow, time they ignored that bollox but the loyalist "stakeholders" and the OO will also have their say, yet they still get on their high horse over "SF/IRA"!!!
Dodds and Sammy will be trying to scupper this as well.
Donaldson could sell this as a win, but he lacks backbone and will need to read the room as patience is running out on the DUP with the NHS in freefall and the education sector looking at a swathe of redundancies if more budget isn't secured for 2024.
Quote from: johnnycool on December 15, 2023, 12:21:09 PMQuote from: tbrick18 on December 15, 2023, 11:23:02 AMDUP party officers meeting today/tonight to discuss the current negotiations.
Are they about to go back into Stormont?
Bryson in full flow, time they ignored that bollox but the loyalist "stakeholders" and the OO will also have their say, yet they still get on their high horse over "SF/IRA"!!!
Dodds and Sammy will be trying to scupper this as well.
Donaldson could sell this as a win, but he lacks backbone and will need to read the room as patience is running out on the DUP with the NHS in freefall and the education sector looking at a swathe of redundancies if more budget isn't secured for 2024.
I assume the Nolan show?
Bryson is a mouthpiece who needs something to shout about to stay relevant with his UVF friends. Shouldn't be given the time of day.
Likewise with the OO. Are the a religious organisation or a political one?
They should be given as much say as the Catholic church in the running of a state.
Quote from: johnnycool on December 15, 2023, 12:21:09 PMQuote from: tbrick18 on December 15, 2023, 11:23:02 AMDUP party officers meeting today/tonight to discuss the current negotiations.
Are they about to go back into Stormont?
Bryson in full flow, time they ignored that bollox but the loyalist "stakeholders" and the OO will also have their say, yet they still get on their high horse over "SF/IRA"!!!
Dodds and Sammy will be trying to scupper this as well.
Donaldson could sell this as a win, but he lacks backbone and will need to read the room as patience is running out on the DUP with the NHS in freefall and the education sector looking at a swathe of redundancies if more budget isn't secured for 2024.
If DUP / Shinners et all walked back into Stormont in the morning they would not have and never will have the competency (brains) to fix things. There is £2.5 billion carrot being dangled so why do the British Government not just give the money to the Civil Service, who are currently running the country, and let them get on with things. When it comes to fiscal management our elected representatives are to often blinded by their political alleigances when it comes to the allocation of public money whether it be Irish Language, bonfires, housing and the slush fund of all slush funds the 'community' groups. Putting money towards Irish Language / bonfires scores brownie points with their core vote and they would far rather do this than put their heads together to see what needs to be done to have for example prevent Causeway Hospital maternity being relocated to Antrim or ensuring Daisy Hill and SWAH are able to offer a better service than they currently are. If they cant wrap a tricolour or union jack around it they don't give a f@@k.
Quote from: tbrick18 on December 15, 2023, 01:30:53 PMQuote from: johnnycool on December 15, 2023, 12:21:09 PMQuote from: tbrick18 on December 15, 2023, 11:23:02 AMDUP party officers meeting today/tonight to discuss the current negotiations.
Are they about to go back into Stormont?
Bryson in full flow, time they ignored that bollox but the loyalist "stakeholders" and the OO will also have their say, yet they still get on their high horse over "SF/IRA"!!!
Dodds and Sammy will be trying to scupper this as well.
Donaldson could sell this as a win, but he lacks backbone and will need to read the room as patience is running out on the DUP with the NHS in freefall and the education sector looking at a swathe of redundancies if more budget isn't secured for 2024.
I assume the Nolan show?
Bryson is a mouthpiece who needs something to shout about to stay relevant with his UVF friends. Shouldn't be given the time of day.
Likewise with the OO. Are the a religious organisation or a political one?
They should be given as much say as the Catholic church in the running of a state.
Exactly this - but anyone who follows him on social media is to blame for giving him a platform.
Even worse are those who reply to him - this simply gives him ammo for future tweets.
Its amazing these people dont realise that they are part of the problem
Lads getting on as if they don't know how WhatsApp backups work in 2023 ffs. Wise up.
He should be blocked on social media and Nolan shouldn't be near your radio or tv.
Here I think JB is a great fella, someone of this calibre setting the agenda for unionism can only be good for nationalism imo, and needs to be encouraged. Everything he touches turns to shit.
Though in fairness the elected face of unionism as repped by Sammy, Gregory, Shannon and Lockhart are hardly intellectual heavyweights either.
Quote from: johnnycool on December 15, 2023, 12:21:09 PMQuote from: tbrick18 on December 15, 2023, 11:23:02 AMDUP party officers meeting today/tonight to discuss the current negotiations.
Are they about to go back into Stormont?
Bryson in full flow, time they ignored that bollox but the loyalist "stakeholders" and the OO will also have their say, yet they still get on their high horse over "SF/IRA"!!!
Dodds and Sammy will be trying to scupper this as well.
Donaldson could sell this as a win, but he lacks backbone and will need to read the room as patience is running out on the DUP with the NHS in freefall and the education sector looking at a swathe of redundancies if more budget isn't secured for 2024.
Their MPs are probably against it. Out of sight and out of mind type of thing. They don't care. They have it handy hob nobing in London and won't get the anger the MLAs get.
Quote from: LC on December 15, 2023, 02:06:51 PMQuote from: johnnycool on December 15, 2023, 12:21:09 PMQuote from: tbrick18 on December 15, 2023, 11:23:02 AMDUP party officers meeting today/tonight to discuss the current negotiations.
Are they about to go back into Stormont?
Bryson in full flow, time they ignored that bollox but the loyalist "stakeholders" and the OO will also have their say, yet they still get on their high horse over "SF/IRA"!!!
Dodds and Sammy will be trying to scupper this as well.
Donaldson could sell this as a win, but he lacks backbone and will need to read the room as patience is running out on the DUP with the NHS in freefall and the education sector looking at a swathe of redundancies if more budget isn't secured for 2024.
If DUP / Shinners et all walked back into Stormont in the morning they would not have and never will have the competency (brains) to fix things. There is £2.5 billion carrot being dangled so why do the British Government not just give the money to the Civil Service, who are currently running the country, and let them get on with things. When it comes to fiscal management our elected representatives are to often blinded by their political alleigances when it comes to the allocation of public money whether it be Irish Language, bonfires, housing and the slush fund of all slush funds the 'community' groups. Putting money towards Irish Language / bonfires scores brownie points with their core vote and they would far rather do this than put their heads together to see what needs to be done to have for example prevent Causeway Hospital maternity being relocated to Antrim or ensuring Daisy Hill and SWAH are able to offer a better service than they currently are. If they cant wrap a tricolour or union jack around it they don't give a f@@k.
What's the Irish language got to do with anything?
too many stakeholder types in irish politics on both sides of border
Listen, they signed off a structure in EA and DE which left 2 more layers of management than previous. I say to ones in at work, if this was a private company I sack 25% of the staff, and reduce all the extra layers of paperwork and actually maybe get stuff done. The amount of staff hired past 4yrs is something else.
The EA is a complete shambles. They are understaffed, people leaving in droves, the admin of SEN is a disgrace. The amalgamation into one provincial body was poorly planned , ( saved very little money!) and has no leadership!
Quote from: marty34 on December 15, 2023, 09:28:28 PMQuote from: LC on December 15, 2023, 02:06:51 PMQuote from: johnnycool on December 15, 2023, 12:21:09 PMQuote from: tbrick18 on December 15, 2023, 11:23:02 AMDUP party officers meeting today/tonight to discuss the current negotiations.
Are they about to go back into Stormont?
Bryson in full flow, time they ignored that bollox but the loyalist "stakeholders" and the OO will also have their say, yet they still get on their high horse over "SF/IRA"!!!
Dodds and Sammy will be trying to scupper this as well.
Donaldson could sell this as a win, but he lacks backbone and will need to read the room as patience is running out on the DUP with the NHS in freefall and the education sector looking at a swathe of redundancies if more budget isn't secured for 2024.
If DUP / Shinners et all walked back into Stormont in the morning they would not have and never will have the competency (brains) to fix things. There is £2.5 billion carrot being dangled so why do the British Government not just give the money to the Civil Service, who are currently running the country, and let them get on with things. When it comes to fiscal management our elected representatives are to often blinded by their political alleigances when it comes to the allocation of public money whether it be Irish Language, bonfires, housing and the slush fund of all slush funds the 'community' groups. Putting money towards Irish Language / bonfires scores brownie points with their core vote and they would far rather do this than put their heads together to see what needs to be done to have for example prevent Causeway Hospital maternity being relocated to Antrim or ensuring Daisy Hill and SWAH are able to offer a better service than they currently are. If they cant wrap a tricolour or union jack around it they don't give a f@@k.
What's the Irish language got to do with anything?
I think his point is that it's not one bit important in the grand scheme of things, has been a major issue that's been heavily focused on but whether it was implemented or not really doesn't positively impact the country as a whole in real terms.
Quote from: nrico2006 on December 17, 2023, 09:22:14 AMQuote from: marty34 on December 15, 2023, 09:28:28 PMQuote from: LC on December 15, 2023, 02:06:51 PMQuote from: johnnycool on December 15, 2023, 12:21:09 PMQuote from: tbrick18 on December 15, 2023, 11:23:02 AMDUP party officers meeting today/tonight to discuss the current negotiations.
Are they about to go back into Stormont?
Bryson in full flow, time they ignored that bollox but the loyalist "stakeholders" and the OO will also have their say, yet they still get on their high horse over "SF/IRA"!!!
Dodds and Sammy will be trying to scupper this as well.
Donaldson could sell this as a win, but he lacks backbone and will need to read the room as patience is running out on the DUP with the NHS in freefall and the education sector looking at a swathe of redundancies if more budget isn't secured for 2024.
If DUP / Shinners et all walked back into Stormont in the morning they would not have and never will have the competency (brains) to fix things. There is £2.5 billion carrot being dangled so why do the British Government not just give the money to the Civil Service, who are currently running the country, and let them get on with things. When it comes to fiscal management our elected representatives are to often blinded by their political alleigances when it comes to the allocation of public money whether it be Irish Language, bonfires, housing and the slush fund of all slush funds the 'community' groups. Putting money towards Irish Language / bonfires scores brownie points with their core vote and they would far rather do this than put their heads together to see what needs to be done to have for example prevent Causeway Hospital maternity being relocated to Antrim or ensuring Daisy Hill and SWAH are able to offer a better service than they currently are. If they cant wrap a tricolour or union jack around it they don't give a f@@k.
What's the Irish language got to do with anything?
I think his point is that it's not one bit important in the grand scheme of things, has been a major issue that's been heavily focused on but whether it was implemented or not really doesn't positively impact the country as a whole in real terms.
Could not have put it better myself nrico.
Nothing against the Irish Language but access to a decent healthcare service will always be a greater benefit, and I would like to think more important for the majority of people, than if the local road signs are in Irish or not.
Quote from: LC on December 17, 2023, 11:08:15 AMNothing against the Irish Language but access to a decent healthcare service will always be a greater benefit, and I would like to think more important for the majority of people, than if the local road signs are in Irish or not.
The two things are not in conflict at all, we should have both.
Quote from: armaghniac on December 17, 2023, 11:18:48 AMQuote from: LC on December 17, 2023, 11:08:15 AMNothing against the Irish Language but access to a decent healthcare service will always be a greater benefit, and I would like to think more important for the majority of people, than if the local road signs are in Irish or not.
The two things are not in conflict at all, we should have both.
In the current economic climate of course they are in conflict. I know from my side, if it was a choice between ten more nurses in the NHS in the province or every sign in Irish it's a no brainer as far as I'm concerned.
Quote from: TabClear on December 17, 2023, 11:54:00 AMQuote from: armaghniac on December 17, 2023, 11:18:48 AMQuote from: LC on December 17, 2023, 11:08:15 AMNothing against the Irish Language but access to a decent healthcare service will always be a greater benefit, and I would like to think more important for the majority of people, than if the local road signs are in Irish or not.
The two things are not in conflict at all, we should have both.
In the current economic climate of course they are in conflict. I know from my side, if it was a choice between ten more nurses in the NHS in the province or every sign in Irish it's a no brainer as far as I'm concerned.
This is a false dichotomy, nobody is proposing wholesale erection of signs in Irish, only that they might be replaced in due course as they need to. The only waste of money in relation to Irish is these "consultations" that allow anti Irish sentiments to determine public policy.
If you examined all public expenditure in NI with a view to diverting more funds to the NHS then there are plenty of areas to look at.
'Stop the DUP sellout' signs starting to appear overnight in DUP strongholds. The stakeholders know whats coming this week and they want to threaten the DUP into 'standing firm'
Quote from: LC on December 17, 2023, 11:08:15 AMQuote from: nrico2006 on December 17, 2023, 09:22:14 AMQuote from: marty34 on December 15, 2023, 09:28:28 PMQuote from: LC on December 15, 2023, 02:06:51 PMQuote from: johnnycool on December 15, 2023, 12:21:09 PMQuote from: tbrick18 on December 15, 2023, 11:23:02 AMDUP party officers meeting today/tonight to discuss the current negotiations.
Are they about to go back into Stormont?
Bryson in full flow, time they ignored that bollox but the loyalist "stakeholders" and the OO will also have their say, yet they still get on their high horse over "SF/IRA"!!!
Dodds and Sammy will be trying to scupper this as well.
Donaldson could sell this as a win, but he lacks backbone and will need to read the room as patience is running out on the DUP with the NHS in freefall and the education sector looking at a swathe of redundancies if more budget isn't secured for 2024.
If DUP / Shinners et all walked back into Stormont in the morning they would not have and never will have the competency (brains) to fix things. There is £2.5 billion carrot being dangled so why do the British Government not just give the money to the Civil Service, who are currently running the country, and let them get on with things. When it comes to fiscal management our elected representatives are to often blinded by their political alleigances when it comes to the allocation of public money whether it be Irish Language, bonfires, housing and the slush fund of all slush funds the 'community' groups. Putting money towards Irish Language / bonfires scores brownie points with their core vote and they would far rather do this than put their heads together to see what needs to be done to have for example prevent Causeway Hospital maternity being relocated to Antrim or ensuring Daisy Hill and SWAH are able to offer a better service than they currently are. If they cant wrap a tricolour or union jack around it they don't give a f@@k.
What's the Irish language got to do with anything?
I think his point is that it's not one bit important in the grand scheme of things, has been a major issue that's been heavily focused on but whether it was implemented or not really doesn't positively impact the country as a whole in real terms.
Could not have put it better myself nrico.
Nothing against the Irish Language but access to a decent healthcare service will always be a greater benefit, and I would like to think more important for the majority of people, than if the local road signs are in Irish or not.
Nothing against the Irish language BUT.....
You can't pick and choose things. Health is the most important thing imo also but it doesn't work like that.
Where do you stop?
Don't fund cricket because it not that popular.
Don't fill potholes in Fermanagh because that's where the least people in the north live.
Where do you stop and who decides?
Funny you pick out the Irish language when you could pick out a 100 other things.
The Irish language has been discriminated against for hundreds of years. More recently by the unionist regime in the north.
Quote from: marty34 on December 17, 2023, 01:29:55 PMQuote from: LC on December 17, 2023, 11:08:15 AMQuote from: nrico2006 on December 17, 2023, 09:22:14 AMQuote from: marty34 on December 15, 2023, 09:28:28 PMQuote from: LC on December 15, 2023, 02:06:51 PMQuote from: johnnycool on December 15, 2023, 12:21:09 PMQuote from: tbrick18 on December 15, 2023, 11:23:02 AMDUP party officers meeting today/tonight to discuss the current negotiations.
Are they about to go back into Stormont?
Bryson in full flow, time they ignored that bollox but the loyalist "stakeholders" and the OO will also have their say, yet they still get on their high horse over "SF/IRA"!!!
Dodds and Sammy will be trying to scupper this as well.
Donaldson could sell this as a win, but he lacks backbone and will need to read the room as patience is running out on the DUP with the NHS in freefall and the education sector looking at a swathe of redundancies if more budget isn't secured for 2024.
If DUP / Shinners et all walked back into Stormont in the morning they would not have and never will have the competency (brains) to fix things. There is £2.5 billion carrot being dangled so why do the British Government not just give the money to the Civil Service, who are currently running the country, and let them get on with things. When it comes to fiscal management our elected representatives are to often blinded by their political alleigances when it comes to the allocation of public money whether it be Irish Language, bonfires, housing and the slush fund of all slush funds the 'community' groups. Putting money towards Irish Language / bonfires scores brownie points with their core vote and they would far rather do this than put their heads together to see what needs to be done to have for example prevent Causeway Hospital maternity being relocated to Antrim or ensuring Daisy Hill and SWAH are able to offer a better service than they currently are. If they cant wrap a tricolour or union jack around it they don't give a f@@k.
What's the Irish language got to do with anything?
I think his point is that it's not one bit important in the grand scheme of things, has been a major issue that's been heavily focused on but whether it was implemented or not really doesn't positively impact the country as a whole in real terms.
Could not have put it better myself nrico.
Nothing against the Irish Language but access to a decent healthcare service will always be a greater benefit, and I would like to think more important for the majority of people, than if the local road signs are in Irish or not.
Nothing against the Irish language BUT.....
You can't pick and choose things. Health is the most important thing imo also but it doesn't work like that.
Where do you stop?
Don't fund cricket because it not that popular.
Don't fill potholes in Fermanagh because that's where the least people in the north live.
Where do you stop and who decides?
Funny you pick out the Irish language when you could pick out a 100 other things.
The Irish language has been discriminated against for hundreds of years. More recently by the unionist regime in the north.
The Shinners have hijacked the Irish Language and have used it as a stick to ram down the throats of unionists at every opportunity. The IL Act was a real red line for SF a while back and M O'N was very vocal about it.......in English of course, dont recall her being interviewed on TG4 much.
Quote from: LC on December 17, 2023, 03:56:24 PMThe Shinners have hijacked the Irish Language and have used it as a stick to ram down the throats of unionists at every opportunity. The IL Act was a real red line for SF a while back and M O'N was very vocal about it.......in English of course, dont recall her being interviewed on TG4 much.
All the unionists had to do was agree and there was no longer an issue.
Quote from: armaghniac on December 17, 2023, 04:22:54 PMQuote from: LC on December 17, 2023, 03:56:24 PMThe Shinners have hijacked the Irish Language and have used it as a stick to ram down the throats of unionists at every opportunity. The IL Act was a real red line for SF a while back and M O'N was very vocal about it.......in English of course, dont recall her being interviewed on TG4 much.
All the unionists had to do was agree and there was no longer an issue.
SF knew fine rightly the DUP would not agree to it however it help feeds the narrative it is all their fault and not ours as to why things don't get sorted. The Shinners are a lot of things but they are not stupid.
Quote from: LC on December 17, 2023, 04:33:04 PMQuote from: armaghniac on December 17, 2023, 04:22:54 PMQuote from: LC on December 17, 2023, 03:56:24 PMThe Shinners have hijacked the Irish Language and have used it as a stick to ram down the throats of unionists at every opportunity. The IL Act was a real red line for SF a while back and M O'N was very vocal about it.......in English of course, dont recall her being interviewed on TG4 much.
All the unionists had to do was agree and there was no longer an issue.
SF knew fine rightly the DUP would not agree to it however it help feeds the narrative it is all their fault and not ours as to why things don't get sorted. The Shinners are a lot of things but they are not stupid.
There are things that should be done and they should be done whatever shit the DUP want to stir. It is 25 years after the GFA, this should all have been done 20 years ago and it has nothing to do with current shortfalls in the health service.
TUV admit to being behind intimidation posters outside DUP members office's. Unionism has never been more divided
Usually a dup stunt. Hard not to laugh.
Quote from: LC on December 17, 2023, 03:56:24 PMQuote from: marty34 on December 17, 2023, 01:29:55 PMQuote from: LC on December 17, 2023, 11:08:15 AMQuote from: nrico2006 on December 17, 2023, 09:22:14 AMQuote from: marty34 on December 15, 2023, 09:28:28 PMQuote from: LC on December 15, 2023, 02:06:51 PMQuote from: johnnycool on December 15, 2023, 12:21:09 PMQuote from: tbrick18 on December 15, 2023, 11:23:02 AMDUP party officers meeting today/tonight to discuss the current negotiations.
Are they about to go back into Stormont?
Bryson in full flow, time they ignored that bollox but the loyalist "stakeholders" and the OO will also have their say, yet they still get on their high horse over "SF/IRA"!!!
Dodds and Sammy will be trying to scupper this as well.
Donaldson could sell this as a win, but he lacks backbone and will need to read the room as patience is running out on the DUP with the NHS in freefall and the education sector looking at a swathe of redundancies if more budget isn't secured for 2024.
If DUP / Shinners et all walked back into Stormont in the morning they would not have and never will have the competency (brains) to fix things. There is £2.5 billion carrot being dangled so why do the British Government not just give the money to the Civil Service, who are currently running the country, and let them get on with things. When it comes to fiscal management our elected representatives are to often blinded by their political alleigances when it comes to the allocation of public money whether it be Irish Language, bonfires, housing and the slush fund of all slush funds the 'community' groups. Putting money towards Irish Language / bonfires scores brownie points with their core vote and they would far rather do this than put their heads together to see what needs to be done to have for example prevent Causeway Hospital maternity being relocated to Antrim or ensuring Daisy Hill and SWAH are able to offer a better service than they currently are. If they cant wrap a tricolour or union jack around it they don't give a f@@k.
What's the Irish language got to do with anything?
I think his point is that it's not one bit important in the grand scheme of things, has been a major issue that's been heavily focused on but whether it was implemented or not really doesn't positively impact the country as a whole in real terms.
Could not have put it better myself nrico.
Nothing against the Irish Language but access to a decent healthcare service will always be a greater benefit, and I would like to think more important for the majority of people, than if the local road signs are in Irish or not.
Nothing against the Irish language BUT.....
You can't pick and choose things. Health is the most important thing imo also but it doesn't work like that.
Where do you stop?
Don't fund cricket because it not that popular.
Don't fill potholes in Fermanagh because that's where the least people in the north live.
Where do you stop and who decides?
Funny you pick out the Irish language when you could pick out a 100 other things.
The Irish language has been discriminated against for hundreds of years. More recently by the unionist regime in the north.
The Shinners have hijacked the Irish Language and have used it as a stick to ram down the throats of unionists at every opportunity. The IL Act was a real red line for SF a while back and M O'N was very vocal about it.......in English of course, dont recall her being interviewed on TG4 much.
Are you sure you're not Jim Allister of the TUV?
For some reason you're doubling down on the Irish language (again) when I raised the point that you could bring up 100 more areas where money could be 'diverted' to the health service.
Quote from: Nanderson on December 17, 2023, 07:44:21 PMTUV admit to being behind intimidation posters outside DUP members office's. Unionism has never been more divided
I think the other 'loyalist stakeholders' now realise that the DUP are looking for a way to get back in again with their list of 7 unfulfilled and are turning up the heat on them.
Quote from: LC on December 17, 2023, 03:56:24 PMThe Shinners have hijacked the Irish Language and have used it as a stick to ram down the throats of unionists at every opportunity. The IL Act was a real red line for SF a while back and M O'N was very vocal about it.......in English of course, dont recall her being interviewed on TG4 much.
Is there a single argument re the Language Act that you haven't blindly taken from the TUV?? In response to the above and your previous posts on the topic:
1. A Language Act is a financial drop in the ocean. It never has been about a choice between funding the heath service and funding a Language Act. I'm going to give you the benefit of the doubt and suggest that you are just indulging in a bit of political point scoring and that you aren't really so stupid as to actually believe it's a choice of being able to fund one or the other.
2. How have SF "hijacked" the Irish Language and "rammed it down unionists throats"? By using it?? Is it your view that the sectarian intolerance of the indigenous Language of the place where we actually live should be not only tolerated but a actively facilitated?
3. A majority of parties and a majority of MLAs were in favour of an Irish Language Act, it was not just a SF policy.
4. An Irish Language Act does not involve road signs all being translated to Irish.
5. Does Michelle O'Neill her to be a fluent Irish speaker to believe that the language needs legislative protection in the area to which it is indigenous? By that logic, should only gay people have been allowed to lobby for marriage equality?
Quote from: marty34 on December 17, 2023, 08:49:04 PMQuote from: Nanderson on December 17, 2023, 07:44:21 PMTUV admit to being behind intimidation posters outside DUP members office's. Unionism has never been more divided
I think the other 'loyalist stakeholders' now realise that the DUP are looking for a way to get back in again with their list of 7 unfulfilled and are turning up the heat on them.
Get the popcorn
Quote from: marty34 on December 17, 2023, 08:45:27 PMQuote from: LC on December 17, 2023, 03:56:24 PMQuote from: marty34 on December 17, 2023, 01:29:55 PMQuote from: LC on December 17, 2023, 11:08:15 AMQuote from: nrico2006 on December 17, 2023, 09:22:14 AMQuote from: marty34 on December 15, 2023, 09:28:28 PMQuote from: LC on December 15, 2023, 02:06:51 PMQuote from: johnnycool on December 15, 2023, 12:21:09 PMQuote from: tbrick18 on December 15, 2023, 11:23:02 AMDUP party officers meeting today/tonight to discuss the current negotiations.
Are they about to go back into Stormont?
Bryson in full flow, time they ignored that bollox but the loyalist "stakeholders" and the OO will also have their say, yet they still get on their high horse over "SF/IRA"!!!
Dodds and Sammy will be trying to scupper this as well.
Donaldson could sell this as a win, but he lacks backbone and will need to read the room as patience is running out on the DUP with the NHS in freefall and the education sector looking at a swathe of redundancies if more budget isn't secured for 2024.
If DUP / Shinners et all walked back into Stormont in the morning they would not have and never will have the competency (brains) to fix things. There is £2.5 billion carrot being dangled so why do the British Government not just give the money to the Civil Service, who are currently running the country, and let them get on with things. When it comes to fiscal management our elected representatives are to often blinded by their political alleigances when it comes to the allocation of public money whether it be Irish Language, bonfires, housing and the slush fund of all slush funds the 'community' groups. Putting money towards Irish Language / bonfires scores brownie points with their core vote and they would far rather do this than put their heads together to see what needs to be done to have for example prevent Causeway Hospital maternity being relocated to Antrim or ensuring Daisy Hill and SWAH are able to offer a better service than they currently are. If they cant wrap a tricolour or union jack around it they don't give a f@@k.
What's the Irish language got to do with anything?
I think his point is that it's not one bit important in the grand scheme of things, has been a major issue that's been heavily focused on but whether it was implemented or not really doesn't positively impact the country as a whole in real terms.
Could not have put it better myself nrico.
Nothing against the Irish Language but access to a decent healthcare service will always be a greater benefit, and I would like to think more important for the majority of people, than if the local road signs are in Irish or not.
Nothing against the Irish language BUT.....
You can't pick and choose things. Health is the most important thing imo also but it doesn't work like that.
Where do you stop?
Don't fund cricket because it not that popular.
Don't fill potholes in Fermanagh because that's where the least people in the north live.
Where do you stop and who decides?
Funny you pick out the Irish language when you could pick out a 100 other things.
The Irish language has been discriminated against for hundreds of years. More recently by the unionist regime in the north.
The Shinners have hijacked the Irish Language and have used it as a stick to ram down the throats of unionists at every opportunity. The IL Act was a real red line for SF a while back and M O'N was very vocal about it.......in English of course, dont recall her being interviewed on TG4 much.
Are you sure you're not Jim Allister of the TUV?
For some reason you're doubling down on the Irish language (again) when I raised the point that you could bring up 100 more areas where money could be 'diverted' to the health service.
SF greatest achievement was forcing nurses to strike for the first time ever in Northern Ireland. Shamed them back in. The same scenes outside Hillsborough last week should do the same for the DUP.
Quote from: Snapchap on December 13, 2023, 05:45:56 PMQuote from: Eire90 on December 13, 2023, 05:36:58 PMsinn fein and dup wiping whatsapps messages but aye sinn fein and dup are good people.
Anyone wanna explain this "story" to Eire90?
No point, he will believe what suits.
Irish Language is dead. Complete waste of effort and resources trying to do anything about it.
Quote from: nrico2006 on December 18, 2023, 05:41:10 PMIrish Language is dead. Complete waste of effort and resources trying to do anything about it.
That statement is complete and utter nonsense.
Quote from: nrico2006 on December 18, 2023, 05:41:10 PMIrish Language is dead. Complete waste of effort and resources trying to do anything about it.
Imagine if the Israelis had said that back in 1948
SOS has put the ball firmly in to the DUP court.
Going to be hard to stage manage saying NO to £3.3bn including public sector pay rises, in the middle of a Cost of Living crisis.
Quote from: NAG1 on December 19, 2023, 12:52:36 PMSOS has put the ball firmly in to the DUP court.
Going to be hard to stage manage saying NO to £3.3bn including public sector pay rises, in the middle of a Cost of Living crisis.
They'll do it. And their supporters will lap it up.
Some jump from the 2.5 or whatever it was offered last week.
Quote from: Armagh18 on December 19, 2023, 12:57:38 PMQuote from: NAG1 on December 19, 2023, 12:52:36 PMSOS has put the ball firmly in to the DUP court.
Going to be hard to stage manage saying NO to £3.3bn including public sector pay rises, in the middle of a Cost of Living crisis.
They'll do it. And their supporters will lap it up.
Some jump from the 2.5 or whatever it was offered last week.
I fear they will too, but when you are struggling to pay your bills and you are waiting on that extra income it might be a harder sell. But I suppose a good portion of their voters don't really have to worry about those sorts of things.
Think there are too many middle of the road unionists who work in the public sector that would deflect if pay increases aren't implemented next year. They would definitely be badly hit imo. There will be a % who won't care regardless of how they're hit in the pocket. But there is still a sizeable % (on both sides it should be said) who will vote with the £. If these people are being directly impacted financially by the DUP boycott then many will find it acceptable to vote UUP instead.
Here's hoping we don't get to that and the DUP realise they can't win going against the TUV. They have to accept they have lost that section. But start trying to win votes from the Alliance party and being realistic. And get back into government.
The NO brigade would rather go back to the troubles and have soldiers on the streets, the RUC, UDR etc.....take a few casualties
to keep stoking tensions..... not a forward looking mind between them.
I know people have been saying for years that schools have failed them but it is really showing now!
Hopefully they see the light. But wouldn't be holding my breath. How bitter would you have to be to turn down all that money over not wanting a SF First Minister.
Quote from: The Trap on December 19, 2023, 01:10:09 PMThe NO brigade would rather go back to the troubles and have soldiers on the streets, the RUC, UDR etc.....take a few casualties
to keep stoking tensions..... not a forward looking mind between them.
I know people have been saying for years that schools have failed them but it is really showing now!
100% right.
Quote from: NAG1 on December 19, 2023, 12:52:36 PMSOS has put the ball firmly in to the DUP court.
Going to be hard to stage manage saying NO to £3.3bn including public sector pay rises, in the middle of a Cost of Living crisis.
The whole thing could have been sorted a long time ago. Their £55k basic salary , taken from all DUP members in Feb 2022 for refusing to go into the executive .
Sea borders /frameworks etc , would have been quickly forgotten by Jeffrey and Co when they realise their big wages were suddenly stopped.
Quote from: The Trap on December 19, 2023, 01:10:09 PMThe NO brigade would rather go back to the troubles and have soldiers on the streets, the RUC, UDR etc.....take a few casualties
to keep stoking tensions..... not a forward looking mind between them.
I know people have been saying for years that schools have failed them but it is really showing now!
There was an absolute dose on Talkback earlier who said he didn't want a local government or a peace process because "Republicans get everything and Unionists get naffin".
When you are accustomed to privilege equality feels like oppression.
I'm sceptical if they'll go back in. CHH has dealt every card he has and the DUP are still not satisfied. I don't think they want a Catholic girl to be FM of NI.
I think that is pretty much it. They have backed themselves into a corner here. If they go back they will lose hardcode voters which is their bread and butter. If they don't they will probably lose more moderate voters.
It's a mess all of their own doing and hopefully it is the end of them as a serious party. (They never were a serious party but unfortunately they're a party that has to be taken seriously >:( )
Quote from: imtommygunn on December 19, 2023, 03:48:37 PMI think that is pretty much it. They have backed themselves into a corner here. If they go back they will lose hardcode voters which is their bread and butter. If they don't they will probably lose more moderate voters.
It's a mess all of their own doing and hopefully it is the end of them as a serious party. (They never were a serious party but unfortunately they're a party that has to be taken seriously >:( )
To me, that is one of the most depressing aspects of all this - that there are as many hardcore voters out there who support this nonsense that the likes of the DUP have to pander to. Depressing as f**k.
Quote from: 93-DY-SAM on December 19, 2023, 04:02:28 PMQuote from: imtommygunn on December 19, 2023, 03:48:37 PMI think that is pretty much it. They have backed themselves into a corner here. If they go back they will lose hardcode voters which is their bread and butter. If they don't they will probably lose more moderate voters.
It's a mess all of their own doing and hopefully it is the end of them as a serious party. (They never were a serious party but unfortunately they're a party that has to be taken seriously >:( )
To me, that is one of the most depressing aspects of all this - that there are as many hardcore voters out there who support this nonsense that the likes of the DUP have to pander to. Depressing as f**k.
Problem is this hardcore element will vote for them regardless, are at two different ends of the spectrum socially.
One are the hardcore loyalists in Carrick, Antrim and Ards and the like who will claim their benefits regardless so doesnt affect them. The other are the well off older generation who can have their principles because they can afford them, final salary pensions, houses paid off etc.
It's the group in the middle who are being impacted who should have the say, but will they?!
Quote from: NAG1 on December 19, 2023, 04:07:12 PMQuote from: 93-DY-SAM on December 19, 2023, 04:02:28 PMQuote from: imtommygunn on December 19, 2023, 03:48:37 PMI think that is pretty much it. They have backed themselves into a corner here. If they go back they will lose hardcode voters which is their bread and butter. If they don't they will probably lose more moderate voters.
It's a mess all of their own doing and hopefully it is the end of them as a serious party. (They never were a serious party but unfortunately they're a party that has to be taken seriously >:( )
To me, that is one of the most depressing aspects of all this - that there are as many hardcore voters out there who support this nonsense that the likes of the DUP have to pander to. Depressing as f**k.
Problem is this hardcore element will vote for them regardless, are at two different ends of the spectrum socially.
One are the hardcore loyalists in Carrick, Antrim and Ards and the like who will claim their benefits regardless so doesnt affect them. The other are the well off older generation who can have their principles because they can afford them, final salary pensions, houses paid off etc.
It's the group in the middle who are being impacted who should have the say, but will they?!
18th Jan is a massive day of co-ordinated strike action with the unions. We'll see if it makes a difference but so far the unions are directing their anger at CHH and not the DUP.
Quote from: trailer on December 19, 2023, 04:10:12 PMQuote from: NAG1 on December 19, 2023, 04:07:12 PMQuote from: 93-DY-SAM on December 19, 2023, 04:02:28 PMQuote from: imtommygunn on December 19, 2023, 03:48:37 PMI think that is pretty much it. They have backed themselves into a corner here. If they go back they will lose hardcode voters which is their bread and butter. If they don't they will probably lose more moderate voters.
It's a mess all of their own doing and hopefully it is the end of them as a serious party. (They never were a serious party but unfortunately they're a party that has to be taken seriously >:( )
To me, that is one of the most depressing aspects of all this - that there are as many hardcore voters out there who support this nonsense that the likes of the DUP have to pander to. Depressing as f**k.
Problem is this hardcore element will vote for them regardless, are at two different ends of the spectrum socially.
One are the hardcore loyalists in Carrick, Antrim and Ards and the like who will claim their benefits regardless so doesnt affect them. The other are the well off older generation who can have their principles because they can afford them, final salary pensions, houses paid off etc.
It's the group in the middle who are being impacted who should have the say, but will they?!
18th Jan is a massive day of co-ordinated strike action but the unions. We'll see if it makes a difference but so far the unions are directing their anger at CHH and not the DUP.
Bar telling the DUP to go and jump and letting Michelle in with Naomi Long as her deputy I'm not sure what else he's meant to do in fairness to him.
Madness that it's taken so long to get to this point though.
Presumably it is just a once off. The UK government and bank of England created inflation so it is fair for them to pay. The GFA needs to be revised. It is too easy to hijack, leaving the North without an Assembly.
Jeff saying he needs the deal to "restore NI's place in the UK".
What does that mean ffs. Should a decent interviewer not say to him that no one is threatening it?
Brits should threaten him with a border poll if he doesn't go back in. And one a year every year until Stormont is back or it passes.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-scotland-politics-67759418
The Scots are £1.5b in the red and they have to sort it themselves and make the hard / unpopular calls to fix it, they must look at NI and go wtf.
Re the hard calls the Scottish Government are having to make even if the British Government gave full authority on all fiscal matters to Stormont no minister would have the balls to make decisions like this. Folks on the hill want to have power and control but not make hard calls.
One thing for sure is that our rates are going to take a fair jump. Strap yourselves in
Quote from: Hereiam on December 20, 2023, 12:31:09 AMOne thing for sure is that our rates are going to take a fair jump. Strap yourselves in
I actually wouldn't mind rates going up if services improved. But hiking rates and taxes in general when most roads are full of potholes, waiting lists are years long, school buildings are falling down, almost every union is striking and Lough Neagh resembles a sink someone has been sick in at a bad NYE party is going to be hard to stomach.
Quote from: Hereiam on December 20, 2023, 12:31:09 AMOne thing for sure is that our rates are going to take a fair jump. Strap yourselves in
some transparency on expenditure would be welcome
Quote from: trailer on December 20, 2023, 08:39:00 AMQuote from: Hereiam on December 20, 2023, 12:31:09 AMOne thing for sure is that our rates are going to take a fair jump. Strap yourselves in
I actually wouldn't mind rates going up if services improved. But hiking rates and taxes in general when most roads are full of potholes, waiting lists are years long, school buildings are falling down, almost every union is striking and Lough Neagh resembles a sink someone has been sick in at a bad NYE party is going to be hard to stomach.
It's always ordinary folk who suffer though isn't it? Services won't. get any better when they take more money off people.
Here's a starting place though. A salary of £55,000 x 25 DUP MLA's = £1,375,000. Nearly double that considering it's been 2 years since they sat .
That's a lot of potholes fixed , and nurses wages or classroom assistants.
That Donaldson is a hostage to extreme loyalists both within the DUP and outside. I've said it before and it's worth repeating, I learned a long time ago that you cannot underestimate the amount of self inflicted harm hardline unionists will endure rather than be seen to give even an inch. Time to close Stormont for good and get joint authority on the go.
I will never understand why someone doesn't stop their salaries straight away when these boycotts happen.
Quote from: nrico2006 on December 20, 2023, 11:05:11 AMI will never understand why someone doesn't stop their salaries straight away when these boycotts happen.
They are reduced by 27% at the minute. But if they don't go in this time the whole assembly needs binned. It's clearly not workable.
Quote from: trailer on December 20, 2023, 11:21:58 AMQuote from: nrico2006 on December 20, 2023, 11:05:11 AMI will never understand why someone doesn't stop their salaries straight away when these boycotts happen.
They are reduced by 27% at the minute. But if they don't go in this time the whole assembly needs binned. It's clearly not workable.
Sooner the better. It's a joke shop. Michelle seems the caring type and a decent spud, but the MLAs aren't capable of making the big decisions. They are mostly either incompetent or too twisted to work together.
Quote from: trailer on December 20, 2023, 11:21:58 AMQuote from: nrico2006 on December 20, 2023, 11:05:11 AMI will never understand why someone doesn't stop their salaries straight away when these boycotts happen.
They are reduced by 27% at the minute. But if they don't go in this time the whole assembly needs binned. It's clearly not workable.
Snipping a bit off was never going to make a difference. We need a system where the best/most intelligent people run the country, not the ones who simply do the best in elections.
I don't think anywhere in the world has that...
Quote from: nrico2006 on December 20, 2023, 12:22:58 PMQuote from: trailer on December 20, 2023, 11:21:58 AMQuote from: nrico2006 on December 20, 2023, 11:05:11 AMI will never understand why someone doesn't stop their salaries straight away when these boycotts happen.
They are reduced by 27% at the minute. But if they don't go in this time the whole assembly needs binned. It's clearly not workable.
Snipping a bit off was never going to make a difference. We need a system where the best/most intelligent people run the country, not the ones who simply do the best in elections.
Unfortunately the best and brightest never (or very very rarely) end up in politics and even more unfortunately the corrupt and incompetent more often than not do.
Quote from: LC on December 19, 2023, 06:41:39 PMhttps://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-scotland-politics-67759418
The Scots are £1.5b in the red and they have to sort it themselves and make the hard / unpopular calls to fix it, they must look at NI and go wtf.
Re the hard calls the Scottish Government are having to make even if the British Government gave full authority on all fiscal matters to Stormont no minister would have the balls to make decisions like this. Folks on the hill want to have power and control but not make hard calls.
Has GB News or Talk TV discussed this yet? I wonder what they make of the two different approaches.
Conservatives forcing Jeffrey and the gang further and further into the corner they will struggle to get out of;
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-67950962
I am sure they would hand over the 6 counties in the morning if they could get away with it.
DUP'ers voting on returning to Stormont and is apparently coming down to one or two votes either way..
Quote from: Armagh18 on January 19, 2024, 10:04:50 AMDUP'ers voting on returning to Stormont and is apparently coming down to one or two votes either way..
It'll be a damp squib because they all have their noses in the trough. Jeffrey will get it through if/when he has the guts to do it, and there'll be very few big names break away. That's my prediction.
And if they don't, Michelle was right, they can't bear to see a nationalist First Minister.
Quote from: Sportacus on January 19, 2024, 01:07:47 PMQuote from: Armagh18 on January 19, 2024, 10:04:50 AMDUP'ers voting on returning to Stormont and is apparently coming down to one or two votes either way..
It'll be a damp squib because they all have their noses in the trough. Jeffrey will get it through if/when he has the guts to do it, and there'll be very few big names break away. That's my prediction.
And if they don't, Michelle was right, they can't bear to see a nationalist First Minister.
It's a strange one.
In my opinion, they were never going to get their 7 tests...it was always a gamble but one the DUP took to pacify the Sammy Wilson type persona in the DUP. They probably thought they'd get enough concessions to get them onside at some point, but CHH and the Tory government have basically said FU. Best we'll do is give you a few quid to smooth the return.
Realisation has hit in, the strike has shown them that they are losing the people they were confident they had in election terms. They probably still thought CHH would pay the money out for the public sector workers and the strike would be cancelled and they'd be off the hook, but that hasnt happened and now the panic is on.
Lesser of two evils, try to protect the vote by getting them the money as that's what's more important to people than the windsor framework. Yet, there's still the DUP right wingers who would do anything rather than risk their precious union or sit in Stormount with SF as the First Minister - even if that meant direct rule and no assembly. The bigotry is so rife in them.
If they go back in....it will probably be followed by another split in the DUP or another leadership contest (or maybe both). And if that happens, they could boycott it again in a very short period of time.
If they don't go back in....then we're at a standstill. Westminster don't care as there's no votes for them over here. The anti-windsor agreement element of the dup are happy enough as they are protecting the union. The people here suffer more and more in terms of health, education, public services in general and pay. But the union is protected. A minority party with a declining minority electorate basically holding everyone to ransom for their narrow minded views.
It all shows that the only thing the DUP are interested in is the party, not the people.
If I was CHH, I'd call the border poll. I don't see any future here with a DUP who refuse to accept the democratic views of the majority unless it suits them.
The practical economic benefits of a UI are now far outweighing any romantic views of a UI or British Union, in my opinion.
I can see big Jeffrey leaving the DUP , rather than do a deal or to be seen to be backing down on the WF. So he will be safe from getting his arse thrown on the bonfire every July.
The DUP as a party will then slip back to Stormont , then appoint a leader after so no leader gets the blame for doing the deal.
Workers will get some sort of a pay rise . But the DUP will walk out again within weeks over something stupid, like the milk containers for the tea in Stormont have green lids
Don't get this about if the DUP agreed to go back in then the pay disputes would be sorted. I have no idea what the offer is for me as a schoolmaster to cease industrial action. The negotiations have yet to begin as far as I am concerned so the industrial action may well continue long after if and when Stormont returns.
Quote from: tbrick18 on January 19, 2024, 01:28:05 PMIt's a strange one.
In my opinion, they were never going to get their 7 tests...it was always a gamble but one the DUP took to pacify the Sammy Wilson type persona in the DUP. They probably thought they'd get enough concessions to get them onside at some point, but CHH and the Tory government have basically said FU. Best we'll do is give you a few quid to smooth the return.
Realisation has hit in, the strike has shown them that they are losing the people they were confident they had in election terms. They probably still thought CHH would pay the money out for the public sector workers and the strike would be cancelled and they'd be off the hook, but that hasnt happened and now the panic is on.
In the real world, the Tories did not say FU, there were quite a few practical measures introduced to the Protocol, as much as was possible while NI remained in the Single Market and GB did not. But a bit like Theresa May, who made a genuine effort to give them something, Sunak found that these people have no interest in the real world.
Quote from: Jim Bob on January 19, 2024, 03:49:07 PMDon't get this about if the DUP agreed to go back in then the pay disputes would be sorted. I have no idea what the offer is for me as a schoolmaster to cease industrial action. The negotiations have yet to begin as far as I am concerned so the industrial action may well continue long after if and when Stormont returns.
That's a fair point. I'd assumed there was a figure that the unions are asking for and the financial settlement from Westminster included funds to meet that figure so that there is pay parity across the UK.
Perhaps that's not the case.
Does this money go away if the DUP do not go back in. Carmel Gates made them sound like the heroes of the hour on BBC last night, she wasn't going to criticise them in case they were holding out for more money.
Quote from: weareros on January 19, 2024, 04:33:28 PMDoes this money go away if the DUP do not go back in. Carmel Gates made them sound like the heroes of the hour on BBC last night, she wasn't going to criticise them in case they were holding out for more money.
The reluctance of unions to call out the DUP is yet more evidence that they're pretty useless organisations. Holding out for more dough is a recipe for never going back..."'cause they'll offer us more next week"
Quote from: Pub Bore on January 19, 2024, 05:12:24 PMQuote from: weareros on January 19, 2024, 04:33:28 PMDoes this money go away if the DUP do not go back in. Carmel Gates made them sound like the heroes of the hour on BBC last night, she wasn't going to criticise them in case they were holding out for more money.
The reluctance of unions to call out the DUP is yet more evidence that they're pretty useless organisations. Holding out for more dough is a recipe for never going back..."'cause they'll offer us more next week"
I think it's clear CHH did cough up more dough for pay disputes and it's tied to the DUP going back into Stormont.
If the DUP don't go back then that money goes back to whitehall evidently.
Jeffrey still having splinters on the auld arse by the looks of it.
I think the DUP are spooked by the big strike yesterday. This 'meeting' has come very quick after the lull last week.
There was a vox pox on Evening Extra for the Shankill Road and it was about 3/4 saying to the DUP to get back to work.
On the other side you have the TUV who'll be turning the screw.
Interesting stuff.
On Thursday the DUP get walloped by strikers and a resignation so on Friday they change the narrative to take away the negative headlines.......if they don't go back they should br further vilified for taking publicity away from the strikers. They have no shame!
A f**king TUV Party Political broadcast was on straight after the BBCNI news tonight, WTF was that about? Thought they were only allowed on when elections were imminent. Seemed very odd to me, haven't seen any other party's recently 🤔
Quote from: bennydorano on January 19, 2024, 08:56:47 PMA f**king TUV Party Political broadcast was on straight after the BBCNI news tonight, WTF was that about? Thought they were only allowed on when elections were imminent. Seemed very odd to me, haven't seen any other party's recently 🤔
I'm pretty sure i've seen that one before. TUV have contacts in BBC now so i'd say big Jim dipped into the petty cash to get it pushed on at prime time after the news broke this morning
no decision what a joke i knew it was all pantomine shame on media for giving them publicity
The media should have said aye your having a wee meeting are you ok f off
Quote from: bennydorano on January 19, 2024, 08:56:47 PMA f**king TUV Party Political broadcast was on straight after the BBCNI news tonight, WTF was that about? Thought they were only allowed on when elections were imminent. Seemed very odd to me, haven't seen any other party's recently 🤔
But did you watch it? Christ I laughed. Fantastic photoshop skills with the North turning into a tricolour.
It was like a parody.
It was poor quality stuff. Not very slick.
How do they get a party political broadcast on at this time of year?
Seems wee Jeff hasn't got enough support.
Quote from: marty34 on January 19, 2024, 10:45:18 PMIt was poor quality stuff. Not very slick.
How do they get a party political broadcast on at this time of year?
Seems wee Jeff hasn't got enough support.
Must have been a lot of arm bending over the weekend, from what I have seen and read it is very close within the party. Hilary Benn's contribution in the HoC the other day will have made them sit up and think (if that is possible) new government same position.
Jon Tonge, who is an expert on the DUP has basically said a DUP faction is aligning with the TUV and Bryson followers to stop the DUP going into power sharing. Debunking Sam McBrides contention that the DUP decision is not about a SF First Minister. That is exactly what it is about. Time for Nationalists to give up on Stormont.
Quote from: Applesisapples on January 22, 2024, 11:45:35 AMJon Tonge, who is an expert on the DUP has basically said a DUP faction is aligning with the TUV and Bryson followers to stop the DUP going into power sharing. Debunking Sam McBrides contention that the DUP decision is not about a SF First Minister. That is exactly what it is about. Time for Nationalists to give up on Stormont.
Of course it is about a SF first minister, at least for some within the party. Note their MPs didn't withdraw their services from Westminster.
Getting sick and weary of the column inches and round the clock media coverage given over to the DUP circus, if you came down from Mars you would think that nobody else existed in this place.
Quote from: Applesisapples on January 22, 2024, 11:45:35 AMJon Tonge, who is an expert on the DUP has basically said a DUP faction is aligning with the TUV and Bryson followers to stop the DUP going into power sharing. Debunking Sam McBrides contention that the DUP decision is not about a SF First Minister. That is exactly what it is about. Time for Nationalists to give up on Stormont.
Mc Bride's article was pure waffle.
Saying it was nothing to do with a SF, nationalist republican woman as head of the north.
The DUP could have penned the article. Doing the bidding for the DUP.
Everybody knows that's the reason for it.
A lot of questions asked about how the shock Jock was able to call into his own show with a bit of gossip that probably derailed wee Jeffreys attempt to push through a return to Stormont.
Shock Jock as been replaced by Holly Hamilton the last few weeks allegedly but was well enough to call in with his wee titbit
Quote from: johnnycool on January 22, 2024, 03:22:24 PMA lot of questions asked about how the shock Jock was able to call into his own show with a bit of gossip that probably derailed wee Jeffreys attempt to push through a return to Stormont.
Shock Jock as been replaced by Holly Hamilton the last few weeks allegedly but was well enough to call in with his wee titbit
I think he was on holidays in the States
Quote from: bogball88 on January 22, 2024, 03:40:06 PMQuote from: johnnycool on January 22, 2024, 03:22:24 PMA lot of questions asked about how the shock Jock was able to call into his own show with a bit of gossip that probably derailed wee Jeffreys attempt to push through a return to Stormont.
Shock Jock as been replaced by Holly Hamilton the last few weeks allegedly but was well enough to call in with his wee titbit
I think he was on holidays in the States
Minimum 5 hours behind, so the shock jock got out of his bed at 4 or 5 in the morning to scupper Donaldsons attempt to get Stormont up and running...
Donaldson needs to grow a set all the same, but the amplification of a minority of hardliners by Nolan isn't helping.
Quote from: johnnycool on January 22, 2024, 03:48:49 PMQuote from: bogball88 on January 22, 2024, 03:40:06 PMQuote from: johnnycool on January 22, 2024, 03:22:24 PMA lot of questions asked about how the shock Jock was able to call into his own show with a bit of gossip that probably derailed wee Jeffreys attempt to push through a return to Stormont.
Shock Jock as been replaced by Holly Hamilton the last few weeks allegedly but was well enough to call in with his wee titbit
I think he was on holidays in the States
Minimum 5 hours behind, so the shock jock got out of his bed at 4 or 5 in the morning to scupper Donaldsons attempt to get Stormont up and running...
Donaldson needs to grow a set all the same, but the amplification of a minority of hardliners by Nolan isn't helping.
How he is getting away with this on license fee payers money is unbelievable. It must go right to the top in BBC NI but then when you see who is leading it there would be no surprise there.
Would the Good Friday Agreement have happened with Nolan about?
I don't think so... This stuff further highlights it. Things being even slightly harmonious doesn't suit people like this.
It's Jeffrey versus Dodds.
Quote from: Sportacus on January 22, 2024, 06:18:56 PMIt's Jeffrey versus Dodds.
Looks like Jeffrey finally grew a set of balls today.
Watching the expression of junior sitting behind him today was equally funny yet very telling. He couldn't hide his disdain for Donaldson and I think it's a safe bet that it's him who has been leaking stuff to the media. Pantomime stuff from the DUP.
Jeffrey showing the pressure.
Jesus he is a dose.
Brexit is a culture war and the the DUP is a culture war and then the TUV is a culture war against the DUP. It is all so weird.
So Jeffrey was threatened , by an unnamed person(s). Very convenient ::)
So now he's reduced the heat on himself and Colm Eastwood even coming out in support of him.
He should have turned on the tears as well. That would have put the tin hat on it
Personally Donaldson has wanted to return to Stormont for a long while, but it's not just his call.
The TUV will prosper. UUP -> DUP - > TUV, that's the direction of travel, black, blacker, blackest
Quote from: AustinPowers on January 24, 2024, 06:27:26 PMSo Jeffrey was threatened , by an unnamed person(s). Very convenient ::)
So now he's reduced the heat on himself and Colm Eastwood even coming out in support of him.
He should have turned on the tears as well. That would have put the tin hat on it
Why do you find it so hard to believe dissident loyalists have been threatening him when you can see it on Twitter every day? Put your biased cynicism to one side and look at it objectively.
Quote from: RedHand88 on January 24, 2024, 07:39:48 PMQuote from: AustinPowers on January 24, 2024, 06:27:26 PMSo Jeffrey was threatened , by an unnamed person(s). Very convenient ::)
So now he's reduced the heat on himself and Colm Eastwood even coming out in support of him.
He should have turned on the tears as well. That would have put the tin hat on it
Why do you find it so hard to believe dissident loyalists have been threatening him when you can see it on Twitter every day? Put your biased cynicism to one side and look at it objectively.
Lie down with dogs and you'll get fleas...
Donaldson as much as anyone gave bin man, LCC and the OO too much credence at the start and led them down a blind alley with his 7 tests stuff.
He'll reap what he sowed.
Quote from: RedHand88 on January 24, 2024, 07:39:48 PMQuote from: AustinPowers on January 24, 2024, 06:27:26 PMSo Jeffrey was threatened , by an unnamed person(s). Very convenient ::)
So now he's reduced the heat on himself and Colm Eastwood even coming out in support of him.
He should have turned on the tears as well. That would have put the tin hat on it
Why do you find it so hard to believe dissident loyalists have been threatening him when you can see it on Twitter every day? Put your biased cynicism to one side and look at it objectively.
I'm sure he has been abused and threatened on Twitter/Facebook etc, just like every other politician. It comes with the territory. (That doesn't mean i think it's right btw)
But why bring it up now though?
His party has refused to sit in Stormont for near 2 years , and suddenly he delivers this emotive speech, just as he's under the most pressure he's probably ever been, with tens of thousands of workers on his back.
Seems a bit too convenient to me.
Quote from: AustinPowers on January 24, 2024, 09:48:57 PMQuote from: RedHand88 on January 24, 2024, 07:39:48 PMQuote from: AustinPowers on January 24, 2024, 06:27:26 PMSo Jeffrey was threatened , by an unnamed person(s). Very convenient ::)
So now he's reduced the heat on himself and Colm Eastwood even coming out in support of him.
He should have turned on the tears as well. That would have put the tin hat on it
Why do you find it so hard to believe dissident loyalists have been threatening him when you can see it on Twitter every day? Put your biased cynicism to one side and look at it objectively.
I'm sure he has been abused and threatened on Twitter/Facebook etc, just like every other politician. It comes with the territory. (That doesn't mean i think it's right btw)
But why bring it up now though?
His party has refused to sit in Stormont for near 2 years , and suddenly he delivers this emotive speech, just as he's under the most pressure he's probably ever been, with tens of thousands of workers on his back.
Seems a bit too convenient to me.
Yeah. 0 sympathy for him.
He and his cronies have legitimised some fairly dubious voices. I still would say he was probably threatened. Horrible man but definitely between a rock and a hard place too.
He seems to have been comfort eating too.
Quote from: AustinPowers on January 24, 2024, 06:27:26 PMSo Jeffrey was threatened , by an unnamed person(s). Very convenient ::)
So now he's reduced the heat on himself and Colm Eastwood even coming out in support of him.
He should have turned on the tears as well. That would have put the tin hat on it
Threatened by an unknown person who, when he checked hadn't voted!
How can he check if someone voted? I thought that was anonymous?
Can't be an unknown person if he knows them!
Whole thing is a deflection....ironic give he said he wouldn't be deflected.
No sympathy for him, I don't condone threats, I mean the situation he and the dup are in. Its self made and we are all suffering for their party politics.
Quote from: tbrick18 on January 25, 2024, 08:28:04 AMQuote from: AustinPowers on January 24, 2024, 06:27:26 PMSo Jeffrey was threatened , by an unnamed person(s). Very convenient ::)
So now he's reduced the heat on himself and Colm Eastwood even coming out in support of him.
He should have turned on the tears as well. That would have put the tin hat on it
Threatened by an unknown person who, when he checked hadn't voted!
How can he check if someone voted? I thought that was anonymous?
Can't be an unknown person if he knows them!
Whole thing is a deflection....ironic give he said he wouldn't be deflected.
No sympathy for him, I don't condone threats, I mean the situation he and the dup are in. Its self made and we are all suffering for their party politics.
Think most parties have a list of eligible voters and tick it off on election day when they see the person at voting stations.
Quote from: tbrick18 on January 25, 2024, 08:28:04 AMQuote from: AustinPowers on January 24, 2024, 06:27:26 PMSo Jeffrey was threatened , by an unnamed person(s). Very convenient ::)
So now he's reduced the heat on himself and Colm Eastwood even coming out in support of him.
He should have turned on the tears as well. That would have put the tin hat on it
Threatened by an unknown person who, when he checked hadn't voted!
How can he check if someone voted? I thought that was anonymous?
Can't be an unknown person if he knows them!
Whole thing is a deflection....ironic give he said he wouldn't be deflected.
No sympathy for him, I don't condone threats, I mean the situation he and the dup are in. Its self made and we are all suffering for their party politics.
Jeff did not say they were unknown people, it's possible he could have checked earlier online comments made. Wasn't it Donaldson who threatened Trimble back in the day?
I see he was spoofing about all the alterations to the protocol that he alone was able to negotiate.
I had to laugh at Allison Morris going on this morning how wee Jeff has stood up as a leader now after his pantomime performance in the common's, we now have had 3 DUP Politian's stand in the HOC blubbering like little babies and this is what we are to believe leadership looks like.
Quote from: tbrick18 on January 25, 2024, 08:28:04 AMQuote from: AustinPowers on January 24, 2024, 06:27:26 PMSo Jeffrey was threatened , by an unnamed person(s). Very convenient ::)
So now he's reduced the heat on himself and Colm Eastwood even coming out in support of him.
He should have turned on the tears as well. That would have put the tin hat on it
Threatened by an unknown person who, when he checked hadn't voted!
How can he check if someone voted? I thought that was anonymous?
Can't be an unknown person if he knows them!
Whole thing is a deflection....ironic give he said he wouldn't be deflected.
No sympathy for him, I don't condone threats, I mean the situation he and the dup are in. Its self made and we are all suffering for their party politics.
The person who didn't vote is wee Seamie I suspect. On the day of the election is was gurning as there was a Rangers game on that day and he was not able to vote, according to him, as he was away at the game. The references by wee Jeff and CCH to people on twitter is a clear shot at Bryson.
While I have little sympathy for Donaldson maybe he has grown a pair and publicly now has stood up to the back room bullies. Very pointed sitting in the HoC with all the DUP members in a row expect Junior sitting directly behind wee Jeff in the eye of the camera.
Quote from: Main Street on January 25, 2024, 09:10:07 AMQuote from: tbrick18 on January 25, 2024, 08:28:04 AMQuote from: AustinPowers on January 24, 2024, 06:27:26 PMSo Jeffrey was threatened , by an unnamed person(s). Very convenient ::)
So now he's reduced the heat on himself and Colm Eastwood even coming out in support of him.
He should have turned on the tears as well. That would have put the tin hat on it
Threatened by an unknown person who, when he checked hadn't voted!
How can he check if someone voted? I thought that was anonymous?
Can't be an unknown person if he knows them!
Whole thing is a deflection....ironic give he said he wouldn't be deflected.
No sympathy for him, I don't condone threats, I mean the situation he and the dup are in. Its self made and we are all suffering for their party politics.
Jeff did not say they were unknown people, it's possible he could have checked earlier online comments made. Wasn't it Donaldson who threatened Trimble back in the day?
I see he was spoofing about all the alterations to the protocol that he alone was able to negotiate.
My bad, I misread unnamed as unknown.
I still don't understand how he can check if someone voted.
He's full of it. Don't believe a word he says to be honest and I'm surprised so many have been taken in by the performance.
I was never a huge fan of SDLPs Eastwood, but he seriously went down in my estimations yesterday with how he responded. He's right to condemn threats of course, but good god.
Quote from: tbrick18 on January 25, 2024, 09:38:22 AMQuote from: Main Street on January 25, 2024, 09:10:07 AMQuote from: tbrick18 on January 25, 2024, 08:28:04 AMQuote from: AustinPowers on January 24, 2024, 06:27:26 PMSo Jeffrey was threatened , by an unnamed person(s). Very convenient ::)
So now he's reduced the heat on himself and Colm Eastwood even coming out in support of him.
He should have turned on the tears as well. That would have put the tin hat on it
Threatened by an unknown person who, when he checked hadn't voted!
How can he check if someone voted? I thought that was anonymous?
Can't be an unknown person if he knows them!
Whole thing is a deflection....ironic give he said he wouldn't be deflected.
No sympathy for him, I don't condone threats, I mean the situation he and the dup are in. Its self made and we are all suffering for their party politics.
Jeff did not say they were unknown people, it's possible he could have checked earlier online comments made. Wasn't it Donaldson who threatened Trimble back in the day?
I see he was spoofing about all the alterations to the protocol that he alone was able to negotiate.
My bad, I misread unnamed as unknown.
I still don't understand how he can check if someone voted.
He's full of it. Don't believe a word he says to be honest and I'm surprised so many have been taken in by the performance.
I was never a huge fan of SDLPs Eastwood, but he seriously went down in my estimations yesterday with how he responded. He's right to condemn threats of course, but good god.
You get checked off if you vote. Register can be viewed, just not who you voted for.
1 clown calling out 2 other clowns from the capital of their glorious union, imagining the shade of Jim Allister's face as he watched from home, it was very enjoyable.
Quote from: tbrick18 on January 25, 2024, 08:28:04 AMQuote from: AustinPowers on January 24, 2024, 06:27:26 PMSo Jeffrey was threatened , by an unnamed person(s). Very convenient ::)
So now he's reduced the heat on himself and Colm Eastwood even coming out in support of him.
He should have turned on the tears as well. That would have put the tin hat on it
Threatened by an unknown person who, when he checked hadn't voted!
How can he check if someone voted? I thought that was anonymous?
Can't be an unknown person if he knows them!
Whole thing is a deflection....ironic give he said he wouldn't be deflected.
No sympathy for him, I don't condone threats, I mean the situation he and the dup are in. Its self made and we are all suffering for their party politics.
Not at all, the party operative sitting in the polling station is marking names off as they vote. Nothing illegal about it, its allowed so long as they aren't looking over your shoulder obviously.
Also possible that the person isn't on the register (public information) in which case they would not have voted.
He said the person was not on the register and that is how he knew they did not vote.
Wee Jeff has stood side by side with these clowns for far too long legitimising them. He has to have some responsibility for that. When you lie down with dogs you get up with fleas. Impossible to have any sympathy for him given what he has put the rest of us through these past 18+ months. Using the protocol as a smokescreen for the real agenda - a nationalist FM and worse still a woman!!!
Time to sh1t or get off the pot.
Quote from: 93-DY-SAM on January 25, 2024, 10:04:58 AMWee Jeff has stood side by side with these clowns for far too long legitimising them. He has to have some responsibility for that. When you lie down with dogs you get up with fleas. Impossible to have any sympathy for him given what he has put the rest of us through these past 18+ months. Using the protocol as a smokescreen for the real agenda - a nationalist FM and worse still a woman!!!
Time to sh1t or get off the pot.
Spot on.
Quote from: 93-DY-SAM on January 25, 2024, 10:04:58 AMWee Jeff has stood side by side with these clowns for far too long legitimising them. He has to have some responsibility for that. When you lie down with dogs you get up with fleas. Impossible to have any sympathy for him given what he has put the rest of us through these past 18+ months. Using the protocol as a smokescreen for the real agenda - a nationalist FM and worse still a woman!!!
Time to sh1t or get off the pot.
Nails hit on head there on all fronts.
Instead iof getting on with things after the last Election they went running to the OO, Binlid and the various U criminal gangs.
Their only view on anything is No! unless it's a return to the 1950s or 1690
Hard to see how the DUP can survive in its current iteration. There is clearly a split WM v Stormont. Jeffrey might be trying to choreograph a return but with Jim Alister to the right backed up by unelected eejits he will do well to keep everyone on board.
I think another problem could be if he bounces ELP in as DFM (nearly forgot the D) I think a good chunk of DUP MLA's won't be happy. Maybe he has calculated it and knows the numbers I'm not sure.
He will have support from certain parts of unionism, of that there is no doubt, but will he have enough?
The reality is he's not really in charge of the party at all. Foster probably wasn't too. I am not sure if Robinson was but maybe he was. There are more sinister elements really call the shots and tbh I've thought that for a long while.
Quote from: tbrick18 on January 25, 2024, 09:38:22 AMQuote from: Main Street on January 25, 2024, 09:10:07 AMQuote from: tbrick18 on January 25, 2024, 08:28:04 AMQuote from: AustinPowers on January 24, 2024, 06:27:26 PMSo Jeffrey was threatened , by an unnamed person(s). Very convenient ::)
So now he's reduced the heat on himself and Colm Eastwood even coming out in support of him.
He should have turned on the tears as well. That would have put the tin hat on it
Threatened by an unknown person who, when he checked hadn't voted!
How can he check if someone voted? I thought that was anonymous?
Can't be an unknown person if he knows them!
Whole thing is a deflection....ironic give he said he wouldn't be deflected.
No sympathy for him, I don't condone threats, I mean the situation he and the dup are in. Its self made and we are all suffering for their party politics.
Jeff did not say they were unknown people, it's possible he could have checked earlier online comments made. Wasn't it Donaldson who threatened Trimble back in the day?
I see he was spoofing about all the alterations to the protocol that he alone was able to negotiate.
My bad, I misread unnamed as unknown.
I still don't understand how he can check if someone voted.
He's full of it. Don't believe a word he says to be honest and I'm surprised so many have been taken in by the performance.
I was never a huge fan of SDLPs Eastwood, but he seriously went down in my estimations yesterday with how he responded. He's right to condemn threats of course, but good god.
Whole thing reminded me of Schofield's announcement a few years back. Bunch of gobshites saying how brave he was , when I was saying... what about his wife and family? Lying to them for 20+ years? Ach nah, never mind that, he's so brave. It was so staged , and so was Jeffrey 's performance
I still think Jeffrey
will walk away . He'll say the threats are taking a toll on his menntal health as a get out of jail free card , And walk away without becoming the Lundy for doing a deal.
Quote from: Jeepers Creepers on January 25, 2024, 09:47:24 AMQuote from: tbrick18 on January 25, 2024, 09:38:22 AMQuote from: Main Street on January 25, 2024, 09:10:07 AMQuote from: tbrick18 on January 25, 2024, 08:28:04 AMQuote from: AustinPowers on January 24, 2024, 06:27:26 PMSo Jeffrey was threatened , by an unnamed person(s). Very convenient ::)
So now he's reduced the heat on himself and Colm Eastwood even coming out in support of him.
He should have turned on the tears as well. That would have put the tin hat on it
Threatened by an unknown person who, when he checked hadn't voted!
How can he check if someone voted? I thought that was anonymous?
Can't be an unknown person if he knows them!
Whole thing is a deflection....ironic give he said he wouldn't be deflected.
No sympathy for him, I don't condone threats, I mean the situation he and the dup are in. Its self made and we are all suffering for their party politics.
Jeff did not say they were unknown people, it's possible he could have checked earlier online comments made. Wasn't it Donaldson who threatened Trimble back in the day?
I see he was spoofing about all the alterations to the protocol that he alone was able to negotiate.
My bad, I misread unnamed as unknown.
I still don't understand how he can check if someone voted.
He's full of it. Don't believe a word he says to be honest and I'm surprised so many have been taken in by the performance.
I was never a huge fan of SDLPs Eastwood, but he seriously went down in my estimations yesterday with how he responded. He's right to condemn threats of course, but good god.
You get checked off if you vote. Register can be viewed, just not who you voted for.
Never new it!
Can anyone see it?
Dup and sinn fein do not care about the severe mental health epidemic in northern ireland as long as they got there champagne and steak
The problem with the DUP is that it hasn't been operating on the reality spectrum for a number of years.
It is still very vulnerable to the TUV awhile Protestant voters are crying out for leadership. There is no Conor Glass type figure to read the political game, take a grip on the party and drive it on .
Quote from: tbrick18 on January 25, 2024, 10:32:03 AMQuote from: Jeepers Creepers on January 25, 2024, 09:47:24 AMQuote from: tbrick18 on January 25, 2024, 09:38:22 AMQuote from: Main Street on January 25, 2024, 09:10:07 AMQuote from: tbrick18 on January 25, 2024, 08:28:04 AMQuote from: AustinPowers on January 24, 2024, 06:27:26 PMSo Jeffrey was threatened , by an unnamed person(s). Very convenient ::)
So now he's reduced the heat on himself and Colm Eastwood even coming out in support of him.
He should have turned on the tears as well. That would have put the tin hat on it
Threatened by an unknown person who, when he checked hadn't voted!
How can he check if someone voted? I thought that was anonymous?
Can't be an unknown person if he knows them!
Whole thing is a deflection....ironic give he said he wouldn't be deflected.
No sympathy for him, I don't condone threats, I mean the situation he and the dup are in. Its self made and we are all suffering for their party politics.
Jeff did not say they were unknown people, it's possible he could have checked earlier online comments made. Wasn't it Donaldson who threatened Trimble back in the day?
I see he was spoofing about all the alterations to the protocol that he alone was able to negotiate.
My bad, I misread unnamed as unknown.
I still don't understand how he can check if someone voted.
He's full of it. Don't believe a word he says to be honest and I'm surprised so many have been taken in by the performance.
I was never a huge fan of SDLPs Eastwood, but he seriously went down in my estimations yesterday with how he responded. He's right to condemn threats of course, but good god.
You get checked off if you vote. Register can be viewed, just not who you voted for.
Never new it!
Can anyone see it?
YES!
https://www.eoni.org.uk/Register-To-Vote/Inspecting-the-Electoral-Register
I tried to listened to this, when he said he put on the uniform of the UDR to protect the whole community I switched straight off.
Quote from: north_antrim_hound on January 25, 2024, 11:14:11 AMI tried to listened to this, when he said he put on the uniform of the UDR to protect the whole community I switched straight off.
So that is what he meant.
Quote from: north_antrim_hound on January 25, 2024, 11:14:11 AMI tried to listened to this, when he said he put on the uniform of the UDR to protect the whole community I switched straight off.
Same and then he said he was working night and day
Quote from: brokencrossbar1 on January 25, 2024, 09:29:12 AMQuote from: tbrick18 on January 25, 2024, 08:28:04 AMQuote from: AustinPowers on January 24, 2024, 06:27:26 PMSo Jeffrey was threatened , by an unnamed person(s). Very convenient ::)
So now he's reduced the heat on himself and Colm Eastwood even coming out in support of him.
He should have turned on the tears as well. That would have put the tin hat on it
Threatened by an unknown person who, when he checked hadn't voted!
How can he check if someone voted? I thought that was anonymous?
Can't be an unknown person if he knows them!
Whole thing is a deflection....ironic give he said he wouldn't be deflected.
No sympathy for him, I don't condone threats, I mean the situation he and the dup are in. Its self made and we are all suffering for their party politics.
The person who didn't vote is wee Seamie I suspect. On the day of the election is was gurning as there was a Rangers game on that day and he was not able to vote, according to him, as he was away at the game. The references by wee Jeff and CCH to people on twitter is a clear shot at Bryson.
While I have little sympathy for Donaldson maybe he has grown a pair and publicly now has stood up to the back room bullies. Very pointed sitting in the HoC with all the DUP members in a row expect Junior sitting directly behind wee Jeff in the eye of the camera.
That's it. He's saying the exact thing we've all been saying, Bryson (and the rest) doesn't have a mandate so why are people giving any sort of credence to his incitement. Something he should have called out long ago and called the media out on over the disproportionate amount of coverage afforded to him.
No sympathy, and I suspect whatever happens it's the end of the DUP or any unionist party ever being the biggest party in the North as this will split the unionist/loyalist voting. Cue Stormont up and down while they come to terms with this.
Really doesn't matter how this plays out in terms of the Nationalist population politically.
Worst case scenario they all rally around the DUP and he gains voters - unlikely and doesn't really matter in terms of the demographics just delays things.
Best case scenario completely splinters the loyalist/ unionist vote even further and they are weakened even more.
The real danger is that when loyalists are feeling threatened or are angry with whatever, who do they target and our history shows us that it is usually innocent Catholics.
Quote from: NAG1 on January 25, 2024, 11:45:06 AMReally doesn't matter how this plays out in terms of the Nationalist population politically.
Worst case scenario they all rally around the DUP and he gains voters - unlikely and doesn't really matter in terms of the demographics just delays things.
Best case scenario completely splinters the loyalist/ unionist vote even further and they are weakened even more.
The real danger is that when loyalists are feeling threatened or are angry with whatever, who do they target and our history shows us that it is usually innocent Catholics.
That's the danger here. All while wee Jeff, Allister et al wash their hands off it saying it had nothing to do with us.
It's a fractured party. What really is keeping it together? Is it a gravy train they're on they don't want off or is it just they'll do anything to not have SF the largest party? (Yes they are that anyway but by a landslide I mean)
He does the bidding for the OO and UDA/UVF.
That's the reality.
I couldn't care less for him. They'll never change. There's no De Clerk or their supporters won't allow a De Clerk.
Quote from: tbrick18 on January 25, 2024, 10:32:03 AMQuote from: Jeepers Creepers on January 25, 2024, 09:47:24 AMQuote from: tbrick18 on January 25, 2024, 09:38:22 AMQuote from: Main Street on January 25, 2024, 09:10:07 AMQuote from: tbrick18 on January 25, 2024, 08:28:04 AMQuote from: AustinPowers on January 24, 2024, 06:27:26 PMSo Jeffrey was threatened , by an unnamed person(s). Very convenient ::)
So now he's reduced the heat on himself and Colm Eastwood even coming out in support of him.
He should have turned on the tears as well. That would have put the tin hat on it
Threatened by an unknown person who, when he checked hadn't voted!
How can he check if someone voted? I thought that was anonymous?
Can't be an unknown person if he knows them!
Whole thing is a deflection....ironic give he said he wouldn't be deflected.
No sympathy for him, I don't condone threats, I mean the situation he and the dup are in. Its self made and we are all suffering for their party politics.
Jeff did not say they were unknown people, it's possible he could have checked earlier online comments made. Wasn't it Donaldson who threatened Trimble back in the day?
I see he was spoofing about all the alterations to the protocol that he alone was able to negotiate.
My bad, I misread unnamed as unknown.
I still don't understand how he can check if someone voted.
He's full of it. Don't believe a word he says to be honest and I'm surprised so many have been taken in by the performance.
I was never a huge fan of SDLPs Eastwood, but he seriously went down in my estimations yesterday with how he responded. He's right to condemn threats of course, but good god.
You get checked off if you vote. Register can be viewed, just not who you voted for.
Never new it!
Can anyone see it?
They probably don't even need to do that. In your polling station there's a table set up for Polling Agents and they have a blank copy of the register. When a voter comes in they'll come to the voting desk and give ID etc, the staff then have to shout out that person's number so the polling agent can then mark them as voted on their own register.
I've worked half a dozen elections in the Glens of Antrim so only ever seen Sinn Fein polling agents but I'm sure in DUP strongholds they'll have them working. If there's people who haven't voted they'll contact them and offer them lifts to the polling station etc.
is having lists of who has and who has not voted a very dangerous thing
what happens if it comes to a united ireland vote and someone does not vote could sinn fein order masked men to beat them up. or the dup order loyalists to beast someone up whos not voted in the shankill
Quote from: Eire90 on January 25, 2024, 12:44:29 PMis having lists of who has and who has not voted a very dangerous thing
what happens if it comes to a united ireland vote and someone does not vote could sinn fein order masked men to beat them up. or the dup order loyalists to beast someone up whos not voted in the shankill
Yeah that'll happen.
Thing here is I would say that most people wouldn't have known this at all (I certainly wouldn't) and now this clampit has shone a light on it ::)
Quote from: Eire90 on January 25, 2024, 12:44:29 PMis having lists of who has and who has not voted a very dangerous thing
what happens if it comes to a united ireland vote and someone does not vote could sinn fein order masked men to beat them up. or the dup order loyalists to beast someone up whos not voted in the shankill
There's no lists of who has or hasn't voted. The Electoral Register is a public document that can be viewed at the ER headquarters and lists who is registered to vote at each address. So you can easily check someone's address to see if they are registered. Not registered then clearly didn't vote.
Quote from: TyroneOnlooker on January 25, 2024, 01:42:47 PMQuote from: Eire90 on January 25, 2024, 12:44:29 PMis having lists of who has and who has not voted a very dangerous thing
what happens if it comes to a united ireland vote and someone does not vote could sinn fein order masked men to beat them up. or the dup order loyalists to beast someone up whos not voted in the shankill
There's no lists of who has or hasn't voted. The Electoral Register is a public document that can be viewed at the ER headquarters and lists who is registered to vote at each address. So you can easily check someone's address to see if they are registered. Not registered then clearly didn't vote.
Not strictly true. Parties who have the army of help... they can keep a record as they have people in every polling station. Like what did people think all those randomers are doing sitting at different tables in the polling stations?
Pity Jeffery didn't
Quote from: Armagh18 on January 25, 2024, 12:57:49 PMQuote from: Eire90 on January 25, 2024, 12:44:29 PMis having lists of who has and who has not voted a very dangerous thing
what happens if it comes to a united ireland vote and someone does not vote could sinn fein order masked men to beat them up. or the dup order loyalists to beast someone up whos not voted in the shankill
Yeah that'll happen.
Pity Jeffery didn't acknowledge when looking at voting electoral info that 79% of people that did vote didn't vote for the DUP.
I am pretty sure you cannot sit in the polling station regardless of what political party you come from.
Observers can sit in on the count at the count centre though to verify numbers of votes though the voting process is confidential and a vote can not be linked to an individual.
Quote from: Keyser soze on January 25, 2024, 02:44:16 PMI am pretty sure you cannot sit in the polling station regardless of what political party you come from.
Observers can sit in on the count at the count centre though to verify numbers of votes though the voting process is confidential and a vote can not be linked to an individual.
It's been happening for years - parties know who has & hasn't voted. None of this stuff is new
wasnt there not reports of shinners or duppers outside polling stations last year intimidating people
Quote from: Keyser soze on January 25, 2024, 02:44:16 PMI am pretty sure you cannot sit in the polling station regardless of what political party you come from.
Observers can sit in on the count at the count centre though to verify numbers of votes though the voting process is confidential and a vote can not be linked to an individual.
You can surely. SF have always done this at my local one. I'm sure the DUP do the same in Unionist areas. They will be sitting at a table by themselves and when the clerk calls out your name and address, the party official will score you off on their copy of the register. They take this back to party HQ where it is input into a database so that when they are canvassing next time round, they will know if you are a likely voter/nonvoter before you've even answered the door (though they won't know who you voted for unless you've told them when they canvassed last time round)
For the real staunch areas it's useful on polling day as around 6pm the database is able to produce a list of people who
1) Indicted in canvassing they would vote for your candidate
AND
2) Have not voted that day yet.
From this they can go door to door on the evening of polling day offering lifts, encouraging them to go to vote etc.
Nothing explicitly illegal any of this EXCEPT the fact they are technically storing data on you which you have not consented to. This caused a ruckus a while back with SF. Other parties kept remarkably quiet because they know they all do the exact same thing.
All those lists at each polling station are collated and the marked list (who has and has not voted) is available to anyone for a small fee.
Quote from: RedHand88 on January 25, 2024, 03:20:26 PMQuote from: Keyser soze on January 25, 2024, 02:44:16 PMI am pretty sure you cannot sit in the polling station regardless of what political party you come from.
Observers can sit in on the count at the count centre though to verify numbers of votes though the voting process is confidential and a vote can not be linked to an individual.
You can surely. SF have always done this at my local one. I'm sure the DUP do the same in Unionist areas. They will be sitting at a table by themselves and when the clerk calls out your name and address, the party official will score you off on their copy of the register. They take this back to party HQ where it is input into a database so that when they are canvassing next time round, they will know if you are a likely voter/nonvoter before you've even answered the door (though they won't know who you voted for unless you've told them when they canvassed last time round)
For the real staunch areas it's useful on polling day as around 6pm the database is able to produce a list of people who
1) Indicted in canvassing they would vote for your candidate
AND
2) Have not voted that day yet.
From this they can go door to door on the evening of polling day offering lifts, encouraging them to go to vote etc.
Nothing explicitly illegal any of this EXCEPT the fact they are technically storing data on you which you have not consented to. This caused a ruckus a while back with SF. Other parties kept remarkably quiet because they know they all do the exact same thing.
Never seen anyone other than the Electoral office officials in a poll centre, am sure that this is against the regs.
Found this:
1 http://www.electoralcommission.org.uk/__data/assets/pdf_file/0011/179741/Code-of-conduct-for␂campaigners-2015.pdf
2 Tellers are an established part of the democratic process although they have no standing in law.
Tellers are usually volunteers for candidates, parties or campaigns who are positioned outside a
polling station to ask voters for their elector number to see whether their supporters have turned out..
This activity is not illegal and may help to increase turnout by allowing campaigners to contact
electors who have not voted. However, tellers may be seen as impeding, obstructing or intimidating
electors on their way into the polling station/place. Any decision regarding the location or behaviour of
tellers is a matter for the Presiding Officer and RO, and tellers must comply with their instructions.
3 See Erlam & Ors v Rahman & Anor [2015] EWHC 1215 (QB) paragraphs 163 – 169 and 575 – 624.
Quote from: LeoMc on January 25, 2024, 03:31:28 PMAll those lists at each polling station are collated and the marked list (who has and has not voted) is available to anyone for a small fee.
All the parties and candidates who run I think can get a copy. In short all parties know if you voted or not.
Quote from: Keyser soze on January 25, 2024, 03:44:34 PMQuote from: RedHand88 on January 25, 2024, 03:20:26 PMQuote from: Keyser soze on January 25, 2024, 02:44:16 PMI am pretty sure you cannot sit in the polling station regardless of what political party you come from.
Observers can sit in on the count at the count centre though to verify numbers of votes though the voting process is confidential and a vote can not be linked to an individual.
You can surely. SF have always done this at my local one. I'm sure the DUP do the same in Unionist areas. They will be sitting at a table by themselves and when the clerk calls out your name and address, the party official will score you off on their copy of the register. They take this back to party HQ where it is input into a database so that when they are canvassing next time round, they will know if you are a likely voter/nonvoter before you've even answered the door (though they won't know who you voted for unless you've told them when they canvassed last time round)
For the real staunch areas it's useful on polling day as around 6pm the database is able to produce a list of people who
1) Indicted in canvassing they would vote for your candidate
AND
2) Have not voted that day yet.
From this they can go door to door on the evening of polling day offering lifts, encouraging them to go to vote etc.
Nothing explicitly illegal any of this EXCEPT the fact they are technically storing data on you which you have not consented to. This caused a ruckus a while back with SF. Other parties kept remarkably quiet because they know they all do the exact same thing.
Never seen anyone other than the Electoral office officials in a poll centre, am sure that this is against the regs.
No it isn't. But it should be.
Quote from: Eire90 on January 25, 2024, 03:08:54 PMwasnt there not reports of shinners or duppers outside polling stations last year intimidating people
A few years back in Dungannon. Polling station was a PS on the edge of Moygashel and the knuckle draggers where at the gates of the school waving flags and just gathering in numbers.
The venue was objected to going forward and the electoral commission moved it to the leisure centre instead, which is more central in the town, but cause uproar from the unionists in the area.
Quote from: Keyser soze on January 25, 2024, 03:44:34 PMQuote from: RedHand88 on January 25, 2024, 03:20:26 PMQuote from: Keyser soze on January 25, 2024, 02:44:16 PMI am pretty sure you cannot sit in the polling station regardless of what political party you come from.
Observers can sit in on the count at the count centre though to verify numbers of votes though the voting process is confidential and a vote can not be linked to an individual.
You can surely. SF have always done this at my local one. I'm sure the DUP do the same in Unionist areas. They will be sitting at a table by themselves and when the clerk calls out your name and address, the party official will score you off on their copy of the register. They take this back to party HQ where it is input into a database so that when they are canvassing next time round, they will know if you are a likely voter/nonvoter before you've even answered the door (though they won't know who you voted for unless you've told them when they canvassed last time round)
For the real staunch areas it's useful on polling day as around 6pm the database is able to produce a list of people who
1) Indicted in canvassing they would vote for your candidate
AND
2) Have not voted that day yet.
From this they can go door to door on the evening of polling day offering lifts, encouraging them to go to vote etc.
Nothing explicitly illegal any of this EXCEPT the fact they are technically storing data on you which you have not consented to. This caused a ruckus a while back with SF. Other parties kept remarkably quiet because they know they all do the exact same thing.
Never seen anyone other than the Electoral office officials in a poll centre, am sure that this is against the regs.
Found this:
1 http://www.electoralcommission.org.uk/__data/assets/pdf_file/0011/179741/Code-of-conduct-for␂campaigners-2015.pdf
2 Tellers are an established part of the democratic process although they have no standing in law.
Tellers are usually volunteers for candidates, parties or campaigns who are positioned outside a
polling station to ask voters for their elector number to see whether their supporters have turned out..
This activity is not illegal and may help to increase turnout by allowing campaigners to contact
electors who have not voted. However, tellers may be seen as impeding, obstructing or intimidating
electors on their way into the polling station/place. Any decision regarding the location or behaviour of
tellers is a matter for the Presiding Officer and RO, and tellers must comply with their instructions.
3 See Erlam & Ors v Rahman & Anor [2015] EWHC 1215 (QB) paragraphs 163 – 169 and 575 – 624.
It's 100% allowed and the parties have to give a list in advance of who will be there. They take it in shifts a few hours at a time.
Quote from: SaffronSports on January 25, 2024, 10:17:45 PMQuote from: Keyser soze on January 25, 2024, 03:44:34 PMQuote from: RedHand88 on January 25, 2024, 03:20:26 PMQuote from: Keyser soze on January 25, 2024, 02:44:16 PMI am pretty sure you cannot sit in the polling station regardless of what political party you come from.
Observers can sit in on the count at the count centre though to verify numbers of votes though the voting process is confidential and a vote can not be linked to an individual.
You can surely. SF have always done this at my local one. I'm sure the DUP do the same in Unionist areas. They will be sitting at a table by themselves and when the clerk calls out your name and address, the party official will score you off on their copy of the register. They take this back to party HQ where it is input into a database so that when they are canvassing next time round, they will know if you are a likely voter/nonvoter before you've even answered the door (though they won't know who you voted for unless you've told them when they canvassed last time round)
For the real staunch areas it's useful on polling day as around 6pm the database is able to produce a list of people who
1) Indicted in canvassing they would vote for your candidate
AND
2) Have not voted that day yet.
From this they can go door to door on the evening of polling day offering lifts, encouraging them to go to vote etc.
Nothing explicitly illegal any of this EXCEPT the fact they are technically storing data on you which you have not consented to. This caused a ruckus a while back with SF. Other parties kept remarkably quiet because they know they all do the exact same thing.
Never seen anyone other than the Electoral office officials in a poll centre, am sure that this is against the regs.
Found this:
1 http://www.electoralcommission.org.uk/__data/assets/pdf_file/0011/179741/Code-of-conduct-for␂campaigners-2015.pdf
2 Tellers are an established part of the democratic process although they have no standing in law.
Tellers are usually volunteers for candidates, parties or campaigns who are positioned outside a
polling station to ask voters for their elector number to see whether their supporters have turned out..
This activity is not illegal and may help to increase turnout by allowing campaigners to contact
electors who have not voted. However, tellers may be seen as impeding, obstructing or intimidating
electors on their way into the polling station/place. Any decision regarding the location or behaviour of
tellers is a matter for the Presiding Officer and RO, and tellers must comply with their instructions.
3 See Erlam & Ors v Rahman & Anor [2015] EWHC 1215 (QB) paragraphs 163 – 169 and 575 – 624.
It's 100% allowed and the parties have to give a list in advance of who will be there. They take it in shifts a few hours at a time.
I have just quoted you the electoral commission regulations which states that it is 100% not allowed.
Quote from: Keyser soze on January 26, 2024, 09:47:26 AMQuote from: SaffronSports on January 25, 2024, 10:17:45 PMQuote from: Keyser soze on January 25, 2024, 03:44:34 PMQuote from: RedHand88 on January 25, 2024, 03:20:26 PMQuote from: Keyser soze on January 25, 2024, 02:44:16 PMI am pretty sure you cannot sit in the polling station regardless of what political party you come from.
Observers can sit in on the count at the count centre though to verify numbers of votes though the voting process is confidential and a vote can not be linked to an individual.
You can surely. SF have always done this at my local one. I'm sure the DUP do the same in Unionist areas. They will be sitting at a table by themselves and when the clerk calls out your name and address, the party official will score you off on their copy of the register. They take this back to party HQ where it is input into a database so that when they are canvassing next time round, they will know if you are a likely voter/nonvoter before you've even answered the door (though they won't know who you voted for unless you've told them when they canvassed last time round)
For the real staunch areas it's useful on polling day as around 6pm the database is able to produce a list of people who
1) Indicted in canvassing they would vote for your candidate
AND
2) Have not voted that day yet.
From this they can go door to door on the evening of polling day offering lifts, encouraging them to go to vote etc.
Nothing explicitly illegal any of this EXCEPT the fact they are technically storing data on you which you have not consented to. This caused a ruckus a while back with SF. Other parties kept remarkably quiet because they know they all do the exact same thing.
Never seen anyone other than the Electoral office officials in a poll centre, am sure that this is against the regs.
Found this:
1 http://www.electoralcommission.org.uk/__data/assets/pdf_file/0011/179741/Code-of-conduct-for␂campaigners-2015.pdf
2 Tellers are an established part of the democratic process although they have no standing in law.
Tellers are usually volunteers for candidates, parties or campaigns who are positioned outside a
polling station to ask voters for their elector number to see whether their supporters have turned out..
This activity is not illegal and may help to increase turnout by allowing campaigners to contact
electors who have not voted. However, tellers may be seen as impeding, obstructing or intimidating
electors on their way into the polling station/place. Any decision regarding the location or behaviour of
tellers is a matter for the Presiding Officer and RO, and tellers must comply with their instructions.
3 See Erlam & Ors v Rahman & Anor [2015] EWHC 1215 (QB) paragraphs 163 – 169 and 575 – 624.
It's 100% allowed and the parties have to give a list in advance of who will be there. They take it in shifts a few hours at a time.
I have just quoted you the electoral commission regulations which states that it is 100% not allowed.
Can I not read or does that quote say "this is not illegal"
Quote from: Keyser soze on January 26, 2024, 09:47:26 AMQuote from: SaffronSports on January 25, 2024, 10:17:45 PMQuote from: Keyser soze on January 25, 2024, 03:44:34 PMQuote from: RedHand88 on January 25, 2024, 03:20:26 PMQuote from: Keyser soze on January 25, 2024, 02:44:16 PMI am pretty sure you cannot sit in the polling station regardless of what political party you come from.
Observers can sit in on the count at the count centre though to verify numbers of votes though the voting process is confidential and a vote can not be linked to an individual.
You can surely. SF have always done this at my local one. I'm sure the DUP do the same in Unionist areas. They will be sitting at a table by themselves and when the clerk calls out your name and address, the party official will score you off on their copy of the register. They take this back to party HQ where it is input into a database so that when they are canvassing next time round, they will know if you are a likely voter/nonvoter before you've even answered the door (though they won't know who you voted for unless you've told them when they canvassed last time round)
For the real staunch areas it's useful on polling day as around 6pm the database is able to produce a list of people who
1) Indicted in canvassing they would vote for your candidate
AND
2) Have not voted that day yet.
From this they can go door to door on the evening of polling day offering lifts, encouraging them to go to vote etc.
Nothing explicitly illegal any of this EXCEPT the fact they are technically storing data on you which you have not consented to. This caused a ruckus a while back with SF. Other parties kept remarkably quiet because they know they all do the exact same thing.
Never seen anyone other than the Electoral office officials in a poll centre, am sure that this is against the regs.
Found this:
1 http://www.electoralcommission.org.uk/__data/assets/pdf_file/0011/179741/Code-of-conduct-for␂campaigners-2015.pdf
2 Tellers are an established part of the democratic process although they have no standing in law.
Tellers are usually volunteers for candidates, parties or campaigns who are positioned outside a
polling station to ask voters for their elector number to see whether their supporters have turned out..
This activity is not illegal and may help to increase turnout by allowing campaigners to contact
electors who have not voted. However, tellers may be seen as impeding, obstructing or intimidating
electors on their way into the polling station/place. Any decision regarding the location or behaviour of
tellers is a matter for the Presiding Officer and RO, and tellers must comply with their instructions.
3 See Erlam & Ors v Rahman & Anor [2015] EWHC 1215 (QB) paragraphs 163 – 169 and 575 – 624.
It's 100% allowed and the parties have to give a list in advance of who will be there. They take it in shifts a few hours at a time.
I have just quoted you the electoral commission regulations which states that it is 100% not allowed.
The Tellers are the "volunteers" from the party.
I don't know if it's allowed or not but the parties definitely know who still has to vote on election day. Come 6pm on polling day they are all over the place trying to round up people to get them to the polling station.
Quote from: Keyser soze on January 26, 2024, 09:47:26 AMQuote from: SaffronSports on January 25, 2024, 10:17:45 PMQuote from: Keyser soze on January 25, 2024, 03:44:34 PMQuote from: RedHand88 on January 25, 2024, 03:20:26 PMQuote from: Keyser soze on January 25, 2024, 02:44:16 PMI am pretty sure you cannot sit in the polling station regardless of what political party you come from.
Observers can sit in on the count at the count centre though to verify numbers of votes though the voting process is confidential and a vote can not be linked to an individual.
You can surely. SF have always done this at my local one. I'm sure the DUP do the same in Unionist areas. They will be sitting at a table by themselves and when the clerk calls out your name and address, the party official will score you off on their copy of the register. They take this back to party HQ where it is input into a database so that when they are canvassing next time round, they will know if you are a likely voter/nonvoter before you've even answered the door (though they won't know who you voted for unless you've told them when they canvassed last time round)
For the real staunch areas it's useful on polling day as around 6pm the database is able to produce a list of people who
1) Indicted in canvassing they would vote for your candidate
AND
2) Have not voted that day yet.
From this they can go door to door on the evening of polling day offering lifts, encouraging them to go to vote etc.
Nothing explicitly illegal any of this EXCEPT the fact they are technically storing data on you which you have not consented to. This caused a ruckus a while back with SF. Other parties kept remarkably quiet because they know they all do the exact same thing.
Never seen anyone other than the Electoral office officials in a poll centre, am sure that this is against the regs.
Found this:
1 http://www.electoralcommission.org.uk/__data/assets/pdf_file/0011/179741/Code-of-conduct-for␂campaigners-2015.pdf
2 Tellers are an established part of the democratic process although they have no standing in law.
Tellers are usually volunteers for candidates, parties or campaigns who are positioned outside a
polling station to ask voters for their elector number to see whether their supporters have turned out..
This activity is not illegal and may help to increase turnout by allowing campaigners to contact
electors who have not voted. However, tellers may be seen as impeding, obstructing or intimidating
electors on their way into the polling station/place. Any decision regarding the location or behaviour of
tellers is a matter for the Presiding Officer and RO, and tellers must comply with their instructions.
3 See Erlam & Ors v Rahman & Anor [2015] EWHC 1215 (QB) paragraphs 163 – 169 and 575 – 624.
It's 100% allowed and the parties have to give a list in advance of who will be there. They take it in shifts a few hours at a time.
I have just quoted you the electoral commission regulations which states that it is 100% not allowed.
That's a teller. They'll stand outside the gates and count people going in.
What I'm talking about is a Polling Agent. We literally have to set up a table for them and leave a copy (a different colour to the real one) of the electoral register on that table. They aren't allowed to take it out of the polling station and it gets taken back to the main polling centre after polls closed but they have access to that thing from 7am -10pm. They have to be known in advance and when they arrive they show ID to the Polling Station manager and they have to keep a log throughout the day of who comes and goes be it polling agents, police, electoral staff or any other information like if someone tries to vote that's maybe done a proxy or postal vote etc.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-politics-68105094
Poots publicly stating that the DUP are not traitors. Shows the pressure they are under that they have to explicitly call this out.
Unionism imploding again.
Quote from: SaffronSports on January 26, 2024, 11:35:33 AMQuote from: Keyser soze on January 26, 2024, 09:47:26 AMQuote from: SaffronSports on January 25, 2024, 10:17:45 PMQuote from: Keyser soze on January 25, 2024, 03:44:34 PMQuote from: RedHand88 on January 25, 2024, 03:20:26 PMQuote from: Keyser soze on January 25, 2024, 02:44:16 PMI am pretty sure you cannot sit in the polling station regardless of what political party you come from.
Observers can sit in on the count at the count centre though to verify numbers of votes though the voting process is confidential and a vote can not be linked to an individual.
You can surely. SF have always done this at my local one. I'm sure the DUP do the same in Unionist areas. They will be sitting at a table by themselves and when the clerk calls out your name and address, the party official will score you off on their copy of the register. They take this back to party HQ where it is input into a database so that when they are canvassing next time round, they will know if you are a likely voter/nonvoter before you've even answered the door (though they won't know who you voted for unless you've told them when they canvassed last time round)
For the real staunch areas it's useful on polling day as around 6pm the database is able to produce a list of people who
1) Indicted in canvassing they would vote for your candidate
AND
2) Have not voted that day yet.
From this they can go door to door on the evening of polling day offering lifts, encouraging them to go to vote etc.
Nothing explicitly illegal any of this EXCEPT the fact they are technically storing data on you which you have not consented to. This caused a ruckus a while back with SF. Other parties kept remarkably quiet because they know they all do the exact same thing.
Never seen anyone other than the Electoral office officials in a poll centre, am sure that this is against the regs.
Found this:
1 http://www.electoralcommission.org.uk/__data/assets/pdf_file/0011/179741/Code-of-conduct-for␂campaigners-2015.pdf
2 Tellers are an established part of the democratic process although they have no standing in law.
Tellers are usually volunteers for candidates, parties or campaigns who are positioned outside a
polling station to ask voters for their elector number to see whether their supporters have turned out..
This activity is not illegal and may help to increase turnout by allowing campaigners to contact
electors who have not voted. However, tellers may be seen as impeding, obstructing or intimidating
electors on their way into the polling station/place. Any decision regarding the location or behaviour of
tellers is a matter for the Presiding Officer and RO, and tellers must comply with their instructions.
3 See Erlam & Ors v Rahman & Anor [2015] EWHC 1215 (QB) paragraphs 163 – 169 and 575 – 624.
It's 100% allowed and the parties have to give a list in advance of who will be there. They take it in shifts a few hours at a time.
I have just quoted you the electoral commission regulations which states that it is 100% not allowed.
That's a teller. They'll stand outside the gates and count people going in.
What I'm talking about is a Polling Agent. We literally have to set up a table for them and leave a copy (a different colour to the real one) of the electoral register on that table. They aren't allowed to take it out of the polling station and it gets taken back to the main polling centre after polls closed but they have access to that thing from 7am -10pm. They have to be known in advance and when they arrive they show ID to the Polling Station manager and they have to keep a log throughout the day of who comes and goes be it polling agents, police, electoral staff or any other information like if someone tries to vote that's maybe done a proxy or postal vote etc.
I stand corrected!
I'm aware that saying so goes completely against the whole ethos of the discussion board, if not SM sites in general lol
Quote from: Keyser soze on January 26, 2024, 12:29:23 PMQuote from: SaffronSports on January 26, 2024, 11:35:33 AMQuote from: Keyser soze on January 26, 2024, 09:47:26 AMQuote from: SaffronSports on January 25, 2024, 10:17:45 PMQuote from: Keyser soze on January 25, 2024, 03:44:34 PMQuote from: RedHand88 on January 25, 2024, 03:20:26 PMQuote from: Keyser soze on January 25, 2024, 02:44:16 PMI am pretty sure you cannot sit in the polling station regardless of what political party you come from.
Observers can sit in on the count at the count centre though to verify numbers of votes though the voting process is confidential and a vote can not be linked to an individual.
You can surely. SF have always done this at my local one. I'm sure the DUP do the same in Unionist areas. They will be sitting at a table by themselves and when the clerk calls out your name and address, the party official will score you off on their copy of the register. They take this back to party HQ where it is input into a database so that when they are canvassing next time round, they will know if you are a likely voter/nonvoter before you've even answered the door (though they won't know who you voted for unless you've told them when they canvassed last time round)
For the real staunch areas it's useful on polling day as around 6pm the database is able to produce a list of people who
1) Indicted in canvassing they would vote for your candidate
AND
2) Have not voted that day yet.
From this they can go door to door on the evening of polling day offering lifts, encouraging them to go to vote etc.
Nothing explicitly illegal any of this EXCEPT the fact they are technically storing data on you which you have not consented to. This caused a ruckus a while back with SF. Other parties kept remarkably quiet because they know they all do the exact same thing.
Never seen anyone other than the Electoral office officials in a poll centre, am sure that this is against the regs.
Found this:
1 http://www.electoralcommission.org.uk/__data/assets/pdf_file/0011/179741/Code-of-conduct-for␂campaigners-2015.pdf
2 Tellers are an established part of the democratic process although they have no standing in law.
Tellers are usually volunteers for candidates, parties or campaigns who are positioned outside a
polling station to ask voters for their elector number to see whether their supporters have turned out..
This activity is not illegal and may help to increase turnout by allowing campaigners to contact
electors who have not voted. However, tellers may be seen as impeding, obstructing or intimidating
electors on their way into the polling station/place. Any decision regarding the location or behaviour of
tellers is a matter for the Presiding Officer and RO, and tellers must comply with their instructions.
3 See Erlam & Ors v Rahman & Anor [2015] EWHC 1215 (QB) paragraphs 163 – 169 and 575 – 624.
It's 100% allowed and the parties have to give a list in advance of who will be there. They take it in shifts a few hours at a time.
I have just quoted you the electoral commission regulations which states that it is 100% not allowed.
That's a teller. They'll stand outside the gates and count people going in.
What I'm talking about is a Polling Agent. We literally have to set up a table for them and leave a copy (a different colour to the real one) of the electoral register on that table. They aren't allowed to take it out of the polling station and it gets taken back to the main polling centre after polls closed but they have access to that thing from 7am -10pm. They have to be known in advance and when they arrive they show ID to the Polling Station manager and they have to keep a log throughout the day of who comes and goes be it polling agents, police, electoral staff or any other information like if someone tries to vote that's maybe done a proxy or postal vote etc.
I stand corrected!
I'm aware that saying so goes completely against the whole ethos of the discussion board, if not SM sites in general lol
😂 An inspiration to all my friend.
Seems Donaldson has calculated he finally has enough support to push them back into Stormont. Big meeting on Monday to lay it all out. Maybe even back at work by the end of the week.
Response of the holdouts will be interesting. A bit of grumbling, but ultimately sticking with the DUP gravy train? Or does it become more messy? Unionism is so directionless at the minute - how stable can government be until they figure themselves out?
I'd say the Brits will fudge some language and jargon to melt the ice a bit for Donaldson and get him over the line.
All depends how Bin man and Allister react to see what happens next.
As I say, Donaldson and the DUP are being dragged into this...not willing to be part of it at all.
Quote from: Ed Ricketts on January 27, 2024, 11:44:48 AMSeems Donaldson has calculated he finally has enough support to push them back into Stormont. Big meeting on Monday to lay it all out. Maybe even back at work by the end of the week.
Response of the holdouts will be interesting. A bit of grumbling, but ultimately sticking with the DUP gravy train? Or does it become more messy? Unionism is so directionless at the minute - how stable can government be until they figure themselves out?
They didn't vote during the last meeting as it was leaked. So Bryson leaked about this one hoping for the same result.
Seen a great response to him from Newton Emerson. If you continually tell people they are not Unionist, eventually you will be right.
Quote from: Ed Ricketts on January 27, 2024, 11:44:48 AMSeems Donaldson has calculated he finally has enough support to push them back into Stormont. Big meeting on Monday to lay it all out. Maybe even back at work by the end of the week.
Response of the holdouts will be interesting. A bit of grumbling, but ultimately sticking with the DUP gravy train? Or does it become more messy? Unionism is so directionless at the minute - how stable can government be until they figure themselves out?
Stephen Nolan is back from holidays on Monday so there is still time to ramp up the outrage and scupper a deal.
Quote from: SaffronSports on January 26, 2024, 12:53:44 PMQuote from: Keyser soze on January 26, 2024, 12:29:23 PMQuote from: SaffronSports on January 26, 2024, 11:35:33 AMQuote from: Keyser soze on January 26, 2024, 09:47:26 AMQuote from: SaffronSports on January 25, 2024, 10:17:45 PMQuote from: Keyser soze on January 25, 2024, 03:44:34 PMQuote from: RedHand88 on January 25, 2024, 03:20:26 PMQuote from: Keyser soze on January 25, 2024, 02:44:16 PMI am pretty sure you cannot sit in the polling station regardless of what political party you come from.
Observers can sit in on the count at the count centre though to verify numbers of votes though the voting process is confidential and a vote can not be linked to an individual.
You can surely. SF have always done this at my local one. I'm sure the DUP do the same in Unionist areas. They will be sitting at a table by themselves and when the clerk calls out your name and address, the party official will score you off on their copy of the register. They take this back to party HQ where it is input into a database so that when they are canvassing next time round, they will know if you are a likely voter/nonvoter before you've even answered the door (though they won't know who you voted for unless you've told them when they canvassed last time round)
For the real staunch areas it's useful on polling day as around 6pm the database is able to produce a list of people who
1) Indicted in canvassing they would vote for your candidate
AND
2) Have not voted that day yet.
From this they can go door to door on the evening of polling day offering lifts, encouraging them to go to vote etc.
Nothing explicitly illegal any of this EXCEPT the fact they are technically storing data on you which you have not consented to. This caused a ruckus a while back with SF. Other parties kept remarkably quiet because they know they all do the exact same thing.
Never seen anyone other than the Electoral office officials in a poll centre, am sure that this is against the regs.
Found this:
1 http://www.electoralcommission.org.uk/__data/assets/pdf_file/0011/179741/Code-of-conduct-for␂campaigners-2015.pdf
2 Tellers are an established part of the democratic process although they have no standing in law.
Tellers are usually volunteers for candidates, parties or campaigns who are positioned outside a
polling station to ask voters for their elector number to see whether their supporters have turned out..
This activity is not illegal and may help to increase turnout by allowing campaigners to contact
electors who have not voted. However, tellers may be seen as impeding, obstructing or intimidating
electors on their way into the polling station/place. Any decision regarding the location or behaviour of
tellers is a matter for the Presiding Officer and RO, and tellers must comply with their instructions.
3 See Erlam & Ors v Rahman & Anor [2015] EWHC 1215 (QB) paragraphs 163 – 169 and 575 – 624.
It's 100% allowed and the parties have to give a list in advance of who will be there. They take it in shifts a few hours at a time.
I have just quoted you the electoral commission regulations which states that it is 100% not allowed.
That's a teller. They'll stand outside the gates and count people going in.
What I'm talking about is a Polling Agent. We literally have to set up a table for them and leave a copy (a different colour to the real one) of the electoral register on that table. They aren't allowed to take it out of the polling station and it gets taken back to the main polling centre after polls closed but they have access to that thing from 7am -10pm. They have to be known in advance and when they arrive they show ID to the Polling Station manager and they have to keep a log throughout the day of who comes and goes be it polling agents, police, electoral staff or any other information like if someone tries to vote that's maybe done a proxy or postal vote etc.
I stand corrected!
I'm aware that saying so goes completely against the whole ethos of the discussion board, if not SM sites in general lol
😂 An inspiration to all my friend.
Both Tellers and Polling Agents "are an established part of the democratic process".
It´s just that Tellers have to behave and act within guidelines.
So, as well as giving the occupied six counties £3 billion, Rishi is going to roll back some of the so-called Brexit benefits? I'm sure the racist English will be delighted,
People gathering in communities to write keep your world letters to dup
Quote from: Eire90 on January 27, 2024, 04:51:07 PMPeople gathering in communities to write keep your world letters to dup
says more about those types of community. Haven't seen a signing outside of east belfast, markethill or moygashel
Quote from: yellowcard on January 27, 2024, 01:06:19 PMQuote from: Ed Ricketts on January 27, 2024, 11:44:48 AMSeems Donaldson has calculated he finally has enough support to push them back into Stormont. Big meeting on Monday to lay it all out. Maybe even back at work by the end of the week.
Response of the holdouts will be interesting. A bit of grumbling, but ultimately sticking with the DUP gravy train? Or does it become more messy? Unionism is so directionless at the minute - how stable can government be until they figure themselves out?
Stephen Nolan is back from holidays on Monday so there is still time to ramp up the outrage and scupper a deal.
a ' Lundy Monday ' Special?
Quote from: grounded on January 27, 2024, 10:25:11 PMQuote from: yellowcard on January 27, 2024, 01:06:19 PMQuote from: Ed Ricketts on January 27, 2024, 11:44:48 AMSeems Donaldson has calculated he finally has enough support to push them back into Stormont. Big meeting on Monday to lay it all out. Maybe even back at work by the end of the week.
Response of the holdouts will be interesting. A bit of grumbling, but ultimately sticking with the DUP gravy train? Or does it become more messy? Unionism is so directionless at the minute - how stable can government be until they figure themselves out?
Stephen Nolan is back from holidays on Monday so there is still time to ramp up the outrage and scupper a deal.
a ' Lundy Monday ' Special?
Or he could have cool sensible heads on the show like Doug Beattie, Peter Shirlow or Newton Emerson. But I guess the ratings are more important.
Quote from: Orior on January 28, 2024, 05:23:32 PMQuote from: grounded on January 27, 2024, 10:25:11 PMQuote from: yellowcard on January 27, 2024, 01:06:19 PMQuote from: Ed Ricketts on January 27, 2024, 11:44:48 AMSeems Donaldson has calculated he finally has enough support to push them back into Stormont. Big meeting on Monday to lay it all out. Maybe even back at work by the end of the week.
Response of the holdouts will be interesting. A bit of grumbling, but ultimately sticking with the DUP gravy train? Or does it become more messy? Unionism is so directionless at the minute - how stable can government be until they figure themselves out?
Stephen Nolan is back from holidays on Monday so there is still time to ramp up the outrage and scupper a deal.
a ' Lundy Monday ' Special?
Or he could have cool sensible heads on the show like Doug Beattie, Peter Shirlow or Newton Emerson. But I guess the ratings are more important.
Peter Shirlow "sensible" :o
Have the popcorn in. Can't wait to see the bastards tearing themselves apart ;D
Quote from: red hander on January 28, 2024, 08:36:16 PMHave the popcorn in. Can't wait to see the bastards tearing themselves apart ;D
Are the predictions of a 'bloodbath' too much to hope for? ;D
Deal or NO deal
Quote from: Orior on January 28, 2024, 05:23:32 PMQuote from: grounded on January 27, 2024, 10:25:11 PMQuote from: yellowcard on January 27, 2024, 01:06:19 PMQuote from: Ed Ricketts on January 27, 2024, 11:44:48 AMSeems Donaldson has calculated he finally has enough support to push them back into Stormont. Big meeting on Monday to lay it all out. Maybe even back at work by the end of the week.
Response of the holdouts will be interesting. A bit of grumbling, but ultimately sticking with the DUP gravy train? Or does it become more messy? Unionism is so directionless at the minute - how stable can government be until they figure themselves out?
Stephen Nolan is back from holidays on Monday so there is still time to ramp up the outrage and scupper a deal.
a ' Lundy Monday ' Special?
Or he could have cool sensible heads on the show like Doug Beattie, Peter Shirlow or Newton Emerson. But I guess the ratings are more important.
Nope... looks like ' Traitor Tuesday ' tomorrow! Grim Allister to the fore once again!
The same goons who backed the party's Brexit support are now packed into a hotel room listening to Jeffrey pretend they can have their cake and eat it. Idiots.
And Bryson is live tweeting what's being said. Embarrassing.
This is by far the worst example of party leadership I've ever seen. They can't stop someone in the meeting live tweeting? Surely they'd have had the foresight not to let anyone in with their phone.
If Jim McGuinness could do it before the Dubs game surely JD should have done it tonight!
https://twitter.com/JamieBrysonCPNI/status/1752052609320423646
JD just began speaking:
Says negotiations are over, and DUP aren't going to get anymore.
Says we have reached moment of decision 1/
He says after much deliberation time is now to bring it to wider party. They expected the Gov to now move with publishing legislation 2/
First challenge to JD - asked who was the policy making body within the party. 2/
JD now complaining about leaks; he says every meeting he holds gets in the hands of the media in less than an hour. Says it impacts on way DUP do business and says it undermines trust. He says party therefore operating with constraints. 3/
JD now beginning presentation. Says this is product of negotiations with Gov. Says party always opposed Protocol. 4/
Meeting now halted. Anger that meeting is being live tweeted. 5/
DUP meeting descends into mayhem. JD saying texts being sent to Jamie Bryson who is giving a blow by blow account to the meeting 6/
MAYHEM in party Exec meeting. One DUP delegate accuses PSNI officers of being the leak. 7/
JD defends police officers says "they are not messaging Jamie Bryson" 8/
JD resuming presentation. DUP enforcers now looking around the rooms. 9/
JD says in response to Windsor Framework DUP consulted. Unlike any other party. Name checks Peter Robinson and Arlene Foster 10/
JD now discussing seven tests "designed to be the measure against which DUP would discuss any future arrangements" 11/
JD says tests being misrepresented- now trying to escape from restoring the Acts of Union. Trying to explain away why his deal doesn't restore the Acts of Union. First sign of DUP backing off 12/
JD now saying legislation will affirm sovereignty! What? 13/
JD says two pieces of constitutional legislation, including amending UK internal market act 14/
Says legislation "restores Parliamentary sovereignty" and reaffirms NI place in the Union; says offers NEW protections on Acts of Union - clearly therefore Acts of Union not restored 15/
JD 'constitutional legislation' sounds like utter waffle 16/
Party Chairman orders 'PHONES OFF' 17/
Continuing with presentation 18/
DUP meeting now halted. Fury and mayhem 19/
JD says PSNI brought in to try and block phone signals 20/
JD says effort to block phone signals hasn't stopped the reporting from the meeting. 21/
JD says there will still be checks and declarations on green lane. 22/
JD still discussing legislation. Talking about reduction in checks. 23/
DUP meeting is utter chaos and mayhem 24/
God its all so hilarious. How long can Donaldson go on as leader with no authority
Quote from: screenexile on January 29, 2024, 08:03:24 PMThis is by far the worst example of party leadership I've ever seen. They can't stop someone in the meeting live tweeting? Surely they'd have had the foresight not to let anyone in with their phone.
If Jim McGuinness could do it before the Dubs game surely JD should have done it tonight!
Someone is wearing a wire I'd say.
Seems to be a farce....but pretty enjoyable.
Quote from: Duine Inteacht Eile on January 29, 2024, 08:09:59 PMQuote from: screenexile on January 29, 2024, 08:03:24 PMThis is by far the worst example of party leadership I've ever seen. They can't stop someone in the meeting live tweeting? Surely they'd have had the foresight not to let anyone in with their phone.
If Jim McGuinness could do it before the Dubs game surely JD should have done it tonight!
Someone is wearing a wire I'd say.
Or someone just phoned Bryson before they went in and left their phone on in their pocket. The whole thing is hilarious. Donaldsons reputation in tatters. Karma bites 25 years later for the snake ;D
Cnuts and all that they are they should be allowed to get on with party business without that wee rat reporting their proceedings.
Quote from: Tony Baloney on January 29, 2024, 10:31:20 PMCnuts and all that they are they should be allowed to get on with party business without that wee rat reporting their proceedings.
Mole hunt as we speak.
Flagatha Christie they're calling it.
Ulster says Poirot
I'll get me coat
Mad stuff.
Surely the BBC can't platform Bryson again after that escapade, or even Allister for cheerleading it.
The fall-out of this will be very interesting. A weakened DUP, and a few inevitable defections to TUV. If the primary objection was a Nationalist First Minister, then they not only shot themselves in the foot, they danced on a nail, jumped on a landmine, then amputated the foot and threw it in a barrel of acid.
Quote from: Substandard on January 30, 2024, 12:23:27 AMMad stuff.
Surely the BBC can't platform Bryson again after that escapade, or even Allister for cheerleading it.
The fall-out of this will be very interesting. A weakened DUP, and a few inevitable defections to TUV. If the primary objection was a Nationalist First Minister, then they not only shot themselves in the foot, they danced on a nail, jumped on a landmine, then amputated the foot and threw it in a barrel of acid.
How do they intend to march this year after all that?
I don't think they've thought this through
Quote from: AustinPowers on January 30, 2024, 12:44:46 AMQuote from: Substandard on January 30, 2024, 12:23:27 AMMad stuff.
Surely the BBC can't platform Bryson again after that escapade, or even Allister for cheerleading it.
The fall-out of this will be very interesting. A weakened DUP, and a few inevitable defections to TUV. If the primary objection was a Nationalist First Minister, then they not only shot themselves in the foot, they danced on a nail, jumped on a landmine, then amputated the foot and threw it in a barrel of acid.
How do they intend to march this year after all that?
I don't think they've thought this through
Tis the nature of things- never ones to toe the line, and someone else will foot the bill!!
I'd imagine Jamie is going to be made pay for this, however. It's one thing to be shouting from the sidelines when all it gets is a little limelight, but this will have consequences and repercussions, and there will be a push back.
Don't have to look any further than Paisley.
So their back in pending some legislative changes by UK gov.
Donaldson came across as reasonable and pragmatic during that press conference. Bryson cited Wilson, Dodds and Lockhart as the main opponents. If he manages to face them down and maintain control, it will be impressive, and more than I'd have given him credit for. The hardliners will undoubtedly be spitting fire at this soft-edge DUP, but just going on tonight, Stormont might just be workable.
Jamie's thumbs will be knackered between tonight and the next few days digesting this.
Quote from: Substandard on January 30, 2024, 01:34:48 AMDonaldson came across as reasonable and pragmatic during that press conference. Bryson cited Wilson, Dodds and Lockhart as the main opponents. If he manages to face them down and maintain control, it will be impressive, and more than I'd have given him credit for. The hardliners will undoubtedly be spitting fire at this soft-edge DUP, but just going on tonight, Stormont might just be workable.
Jamie's thumbs will be knackered between tonight and the next few days digesting this.
He's still at it. It's 3am and he's still giving off about the union being betrayed. They aren't wise the half of them.
They look a bunch of amateurs with Bryson seemingly having a live feed of the meeting. But Donaldson legitimised him by standing on platforms with him. Donaldson along with Foster did the exact same to Trimble. So I have little to no sympathy for him.
Yep, they gave bin lid, the OO and various criminal U gangs a virtual veto and danced to their tune for 2 years.
When is the Jamie Bryson joke over?
You feel a bit for Donaldson then you remember what trailer says. What is that song you lie down with dogs you get fleas etc.
We are firmly in 'sold a pup' territory.
Quote from: imtommygunn on January 30, 2024, 08:43:33 AMWhen is the Jamie Bryson joke over?
You feel a bit for Donaldson then you remember what trailer says. What is that song you lie down with dogs you get fleas etc.
To an extent.
Nolan exalted Bryson up the ranks as a voice for Loyalism and Donaldson got suckered into it and went with it as it suited his agenda.
Now he's being foisted on his own petard..
It's hard to have sympathy with Donaldson but we all saw this happening years ago, but he lacked the balls to deal with his own party the way he should have and it's come to this.
How long until they walk out over something else i wonder.
It wouldnt suprise me if its shut down again within six months and the media start the whole cirucs again fawmning over them if it gets shut down again the media should just ignore them and there pay cut to Zero but that wont happen.It wouldnt even suprise me if they pull out again this week.
Yes, there could be twists and turns before the end of the week, they're not back in yet
Quote from: imtommygunn on January 30, 2024, 08:43:33 AMWhen is the Jamie Bryson joke over?
You feel a bit for Donaldson then you remember what trailer says. What is that song you lie down with dogs you get fleas etc.
He's the unionist version of Jedward.
And I'd say even they got more votes than him in the last election
Quote from: Substandard on January 30, 2024, 12:23:27 AMMad stuff.
Surely the BBC can't platform Bryson again after that escapade, or even Allister for cheerleading it.
The fall-out of this will be very interesting. A weakened DUP, and a few inevitable defections to TUV. If the primary objection was a Nationalist First Minister, then they not only shot themselves in the foot, they danced on a nail, jumped on a landmine, then amputated the foot and threw it in a barrel of acid.
There'll be few, if any, defections. Maybe the odd disgruntled MLA or councillor.
They get elected and earn a living based on their status in the DUP, the majority are not going to risk their livelihood for this.
Get back into the executive and by the time the next election comes around they'll still be the biggest Unionist party.
Come the next assembly election don't be surprised to see them and UUP come to some sort of arrangement whereby they run as separate parties, but sit as one in the assembly, giving Unionism the FM position once more.
Isn't it completely ludicrous that there are still a significant percentage of unionists that will get behind a campaign with slogans such as No Surrender, the Slippery Slope to Dublin, No Sellout, For God and Ulster etc people amongst us living in a different millennium to the rest of the planet.
I cannot see there being any major defections to the TUV or others. The DUP has a huge clout in Orange Lodges, Churches and Tea rooms across Ulster. Jumping to the TUV would be political suicide unless they have an ultra super safe seat. Some of these MLA's and MPs are lunatics. Unelectable unless they have the big party behind them. Jonathan Bell a perfect example. While Sammy Wilson and Ian Paisley might not like it they'll suck it up. Dodds and Morrow who have cushy HOL positions can be slightly more vocal but expect Dodds to be bought off with a ministerial position or a baroness title for his wife.
Bryson on the other hand won't be easily handled. Of course he is a muppet but I listened to part of his exchange with Nolan this morning and he is a good media performer. Nolan criticised him for publicising a private DUP meeting on X last night. Bryson pointed out that Nolan did exactly the same a week or so ago dialling in from the USA. Now I didn't have section 7a of whatever legislation he was quoting to hand but he was able to make fairly coherent arguments based on legal text and what he had heard and seen last night about sea borders and acts of union. To me I don't give a f**k if the sea border eats him, but many others in the Unionist community listen to him and that will be an issue for JD.
Someone said it above.... they're not back in yet.
It's hard to know sometimes if it's an amplified minority or there are lots of unionists who think like that. Unfortunately there are way more than you would hope for regardless.
Social media definitely amplifies things as if you look at the protestors there were at that meeting last night there really weren't very many. Just like the flag protests.
Quote from: imtommygunn on January 30, 2024, 11:28:27 AMIt's hard to know sometimes if it's an amplified minority or there are lots of unionists who think like that. Unfortunately there are way more than you would hope for regardless.
Social media definitely amplifies things as if you look at the protestors there were at that meeting last night there really weren't very many. Just like the flag protests.
Hard to know but their stance hasn't harmed their popularity in the polls. As good of indicator that we have. If/when they go back it will be interesting to see if there's any change.
They are a laughing stock. Was barely touched on the BBC and ITV breakfast news this morning which shows you how much of a priority the story is with them. If only they'd report the farcical details of last night to their viewers it would open their eyes a bit more to think that these clowns had their hands anywhere near the levers of power in GB not that long ago aided by a Tory government.
This isn't difficult to understand, Unionist will veto (rightly or wrongly) any attempts to 'break away' from the Union.
They have been sucking on that tit for so long that it might take another 100 years for them to ween off it
All Nationalists should be doing is let them at it, if the border poll shows that a Ref'n is ready then take it, still think its further away than some feel
Wee Jeff trying to polish a turd. EU have said they expect the UK to fulfil its obligations under the Framework. Brexiter headbangers have said GB will continue to be able to diverge. A bit of tinkering at the edges and a lot of cosmetics. If they go back this week, I give the Assembly 12-18 months before some other issue brings it down.
It's all going to be smoke and mirrors but if they go in and they get 3 billion or whatever they get you can be sure the tories won't give this out without conditions. I doubt they would be able to just coup it again quickly.
(Although in an ideal world the tories won't be in that much longer so that is another variable to be thrown in the mix.)
Quote from: Pub Bore on January 30, 2024, 12:11:30 PMWee Jeff trying to polish a turd. EU have said they expect the UK to fulfil its obligations under the Framework. Brexiter headbangers have said GB will continue to be able to diverge. A bit of tinkering at the edges and a lot of cosmetics. If they go back this week, I give the Assembly 12-18 months before some other issue brings it down.
This is it in a nutshell, the hardliners on the Unionist side are right, this deal changes nothing essentially. A couple of cosmetic details on the edges that were easily agreed.
But if JD can get them into the Assembly and up and running again, the local issues will take over and the quick wins of public sector pay increases and budgets actually being in place should get them through the first tricky weeks/ months and the rest hopefully will die down.
Alliance and SDLP are seeking for reform of the assembly to stop one party being able to bring the place down, if there are any right thinking MLAs up there surely this is top priority for the assembly as well.
No sympathy for the DUP and I hope that come the next election that they and TUV have a proper election spat and they eat themselves. Gone are the days of a Unionist majority no matter how much they kick and scream.
Quote from: imtommygunn on January 30, 2024, 12:14:22 PMIt's all going to be smoke and mirrors but if they go in and they get 3 billion or whatever they get you can be sure the tories won't give this out without conditions. I doubt they would be able to just coup it again quickly.
(Although in an ideal world the tories won't be in that much longer so that is another variable to be thrown in the mix.)
Yes. If the DUP return to Stormont , that means the people will suffer as there will be rates hikes, prescription charges, water charges etc.
Now , say what you like about Britain having to pay for those and NI not , the fact is, it's always the ordinary folk who foot the bill. In this case , people will pay for the north being mismanaged and underfunded for decades
Workers will get some sort of a raise. But it will be taken away as quickly
Quote from: NAG1 on January 30, 2024, 12:20:25 PMQuote from: Pub Bore on January 30, 2024, 12:11:30 PMWee Jeff trying to polish a turd. EU have said they expect the UK to fulfil its obligations under the Framework. Brexiter headbangers have said GB will continue to be able to diverge. A bit of tinkering at the edges and a lot of cosmetics. If they go back this week, I give the Assembly 12-18 months before some other issue brings it down.
This is it in a nutshell, the hardliners on the Unionist side are right, this deal changes nothing essentially. A couple of cosmetic details on the edges that were easily agreed.
But if JD can get them into the Assembly and up and running again, the local issues will take over and the quick wins of public sector pay increases and budgets actually being in place should get them through the first tricky weeks/ months and the rest hopefully will die down.
Alliance and SDLP are seeking for reform of the assembly to stop one party being able to bring the place down, if there are any right thinking MLAs up there surely this is top priority for the assembly as well.
I can't see how that can be achieved. The whole point was to implement power sharing so the days of majority rule couldn't be brought back. Such a big change would require a huge re-negotiation including the two governments.
The DUP had a mandate for their position, and will get a mandate for their new position at the next election as well, they've no party capable of challenging them within Unionism.
Quote from: Brendan on January 29, 2024, 08:06:24 PMGod its all so hilarious. How long can Donaldson go on as leader with no authority
This is what Donaldson did to Trimble.
Will Jamie Bryson move to the UUP?
Quote from: seafoid on January 30, 2024, 01:14:10 PMQuote from: Brendan on January 29, 2024, 08:06:24 PMGod its all so hilarious. How long can Donaldson go on as leader with no authority
This is what Donaldson did to Trimble.
Will Jamie Bryson move to the UUP?
Eh, there's no way Doug Beattie would entertain him, Doug is trying to get a few more Army type people like him in to tell the natives how to behave...
Let's see how Tim Collins does against Farry in North Down who both the DUP and UUP have targeted but as yet have failed to unseat.
Quote from: seafoid on January 30, 2024, 01:14:10 PMQuote from: Brendan on January 29, 2024, 08:06:24 PMGod its all so hilarious. How long can Donaldson go on as leader with no authority
This is what Donaldson did to Trimble.
Will Jamie Bryson move to the UUP?
You have about as much chance of joining the UUP. As much chance of Starmer becoming a tory or Martin becoming SF.
At some point the DUP will give way to the UUP. But when?
Quote from: seafoid on January 30, 2024, 02:20:01 PMAt some point the DUP will give way to the UUP. But when?
I still don't see that happening.
There'll be even more hardening of views if SF keep maintaining good voting strength with Alliance picking up the middle ground and squeezing the UUP and to a lesser extent the DUP voters who realise the inevitability of a UI in whoever's lifetime, but the demographics are only going the one way.
Wee Jamie would be better riding all round himself to preserve the union.
Voting has become more and polarised as time goes on. The UUP are somewhere between DUP and Alliance and tbh I don't think fully know their identity so I doubt voters will...
It's a pity as surely there is room for a sensible unionist party. (I still think there is more to Doug Beattie than meets the eye tbh and not necessarily positive - just something about him I am unsure of).
Quote from: imtommygunn on January 30, 2024, 02:33:53 PMVoting has become more and polarised as time goes on. The UUP are somewhere between DUP and Alliance and tbh I don't think fully know their identity so I doubt voters will...
It's a pity as surely there is room for a sensible unionist party. (I still think there is more to Doug Beattie than meets the eye tbh and not necessarily positive - just something about him I am unsure of).
He's like all unionists and deep down he believes that it was those pesky taigs that started all the killing and bombing for no good reason.
They still like to claim the moral high ground, he's no different.
Quote from: johnnycool on January 30, 2024, 02:06:50 PMQuote from: seafoid on January 30, 2024, 01:14:10 PMQuote from: Brendan on January 29, 2024, 08:06:24 PMGod its all so hilarious. How long can Donaldson go on as leader with no authority
This is what Donaldson did to Trimble.
Will Jamie Bryson move to the UUP?
Eh, there's no way Doug Beattie would entertain him, Doug is trying to get a few more Army type people like him in to tell the natives how to behave...
Let's see how Tim Collins does against Farry in North Down who both the DUP and UUP have targeted but as yet have failed to unseat.
I'd say Collins, a softer unionist with 'credentials', is in there to beat Farry.
The DUP will step aside and it'll come down to a head to head between Collins and Farry.
Wee Jeff has been speaking a lot recently about united unionism etc. and this is the start of it. Bryson will be sidelined and the DUP will cosy up with the UUP and gain as many seats as possible.
A one party unionism if you like but make up of 2 parties.
Quote from: marty34 on January 30, 2024, 02:54:00 PMQuote from: johnnycool on January 30, 2024, 02:06:50 PMQuote from: seafoid on January 30, 2024, 01:14:10 PMQuote from: Brendan on January 29, 2024, 08:06:24 PMGod its all so hilarious. How long can Donaldson go on as leader with no authority
This is what Donaldson did to Trimble.
Will Jamie Bryson move to the UUP?
Eh, there's no way Doug Beattie would entertain him, Doug is trying to get a few more Army type people like him in to tell the natives how to behave...
Let's see how Tim Collins does against Farry in North Down who both the DUP and UUP have targeted but as yet have failed to unseat.
I'd say Collins, a softer unionist with 'credentials', is in there to beat Farry.
The DUP will step aside and it'll come down to a head to head between Collins and Farry.
Wee Jeff has been speaking a lot recently about united unionism etc. and this is the start of it. Bryson will be sidelined and the DUP will cosy up with the UUP and gain as many seats as possible.
A one party unionism if you like but make up of 2 parties.
Unionism in a nutshell. They tear each other apart and then line up for the pacts at election time. Even Allister and Bryson will play ball come election time. As much as they would love to run as anti protocol candidates they will only end up risking a unionist loss even in places like Lagan valley strangfird east Antrim they have to be careful in case Alliance sneak through.
Quote from: imtommygunn on January 30, 2024, 08:43:33 AMWhen is the Jamie Bryson joke over?
You feel a bit for Donaldson then you remember what trailer says. What is that song you lie down with dogs you get fleas etc.
🎶 The man behind the wire 🎶
Quote from: imtommygunn on January 30, 2024, 02:16:45 PMQuote from: seafoid on January 30, 2024, 01:14:10 PMQuote from: Brendan on January 29, 2024, 08:06:24 PMGod its all so hilarious. How long can Donaldson go on as leader with no authority
This is what Donaldson did to Trimble.
Will Jamie Bryson move to the UUP?
You have about as much chance of joining the UUP. As much chance of Starmer becoming a tory or Martin becoming SF.
Starmer is even worse than a Tory, tbf
Mad stuff by the rat allowing Bryson to tweet the secret meeting. The rat will now be owned by bin man 167. When I say rat, it might be more accurate to say horse.
Quote from: red hander on January 30, 2024, 03:32:13 PMQuote from: imtommygunn on January 30, 2024, 02:16:45 PMQuote from: seafoid on January 30, 2024, 01:14:10 PMQuote from: Brendan on January 29, 2024, 08:06:24 PMGod its all so hilarious. How long can Donaldson go on as leader with no authority
This is what Donaldson did to Trimble.
Will Jamie Bryson move to the UUP?
You have about as much chance of joining the UUP. As much chance of Starmer becoming a tory or Martin becoming SF.
Starmer is even worse than a Tory, tbf
Was about to say Starmer to the tories isn't that much of a stretch
Quote from: Orior on January 30, 2024, 04:30:04 PMMad stuff by the rat allowing Bryson to tweet the secret meeting. The rat will now be owned by bin man 167. When I say rat, it might be more accurate to say horse.
Carla the tout?
Quote from: Walter Cronc on January 30, 2024, 04:43:53 PMQuote from: Orior on January 30, 2024, 04:30:04 PMMad stuff by the rat allowing Bryson to tweet the secret meeting. The rat will now be owned by bin man 167. When I say rat, it might be more accurate to say horse.
Carla the tout?
A lot of the twitterati are suggesting it's her, whoever it is can only be sure that Bryson will spill the beans at some point in time.
She is not really the sharpest tool in the box her. Whoever did it will inevitably be finished. We can only hope they finish him off too.
Did anything actually change or is Donaldson gaslighting to get back in?
I see they're talking about a meeting of the Assembly on Saturday which could be difficult for double jobbing Justin McNulty
My money still on ole Ian
Quote from: seafoid on January 30, 2024, 05:47:59 PMDid anything actually change or is Donaldson gaslighting to get back in?
He got fcuk all squared and is lying to his base, the majority of which is too thick to realise it.
It's important for Donaldson to get this over the line asap i.e. this week-end.
The longer it takes, I think there'll be more questions.
They basically backed themselves into a corner, shot themselves in the foot and expect the Brits to bail them out with jargon, fudge and bluff saying things have changed and they've got what they wanted.
Pure waffle. The EU seem to be happy with it so there's the problem straight away for the DUP.
They'll say they got closer to what they wanted. They can't say they they got everything (They need to leave a get out clause). It's all about visuals - making it look like holding out for this deal was for the good of Ulster. Most of their constituents haven't a clue what's been bargained anyway. The DUP themselves actually don't know what they want anymore. When its all done and dusted they'll shout a few lines about the Union and stability.
Sunak lied about Customs when he over sold the Windsor Framework, but it's too boring for most people to pay any attention. Jeffrey is at the same game. NI is a backdoor to the EU and there's no way they are turning a blind eye. Watch the Command Paper tomorrow - it will have absolutely no legal standing but it will be full of meat for the DUP men.
Quote from: From the Bunker on January 30, 2024, 07:05:54 PMThey'll say they got closer to what they wanted. They can't say they they got everything (They need to leave a get out clause). It's all about visuals - making it look like holding out for this deal was for the good of Ulster. Most of their constituents haven't a clue what's been bargained anyway. The DUP themselves actually don't know what they want anymore. When its all done and dusted they'll shout a few lines about the Union and stability.
The DUP got into bed with the Brexit vandals. They loved the attention. Brexit like Trump was about destroying multilateral institutions- the EU primarily, but also the UK. The DUP were too blind to see that.
I expect this deal to go tits up, cause there isn't really a deal
The EU have already agreed a few things, which would of course have been agreed anyway had the DUP been in Stormont.
https://twitter.com/EU_Commission/status/1752340346065879267
From listening to big Jeff, I think he's putting the heat back on Westminster , after WM put the heat on the DUP, re: the pay rises/funding
Basically....... We (DUP) will go back to Stormont if you promise to keep your side of the bargain .
Oh, you didn't keep your promises? Ok, we won't go back to Stormont then. NI won't get any funding , and workers still won't get their pay rises.
And it's all your fault, Westminster. Not ours.
And the DUP still won't have to serve under a SF first minister.
Quote from: Dougal Maguire on January 30, 2024, 06:02:22 PMI see they're talking about a meeting of the Assembly on Saturday which could be difficult for double jobbing Justin McNulty
Probably wasn't expecting Stormont to return anytime soon like the rest of us when he took that job
Quote from: johnnycool on January 30, 2024, 04:45:40 PMQuote from: Walter Cronc on January 30, 2024, 04:43:53 PMQuote from: Orior on January 30, 2024, 04:30:04 PMMad stuff by the rat allowing Bryson to tweet the secret meeting. The rat will now be owned by bin man 167. When I say rat, it might be more accurate to say horse.
Carla the tout?
A lot of the twitterati are suggesting it's her, whoever it is can only be sure that Bryson will spill the beans at some point in time.
Would she have the tech skills? Her attempt to use a filter on live TV went spectacularly wrong? She'd probably set the speakers screeching with feedback every time she went near one.
ELP as DFM? Dunno if I have the stomach for this to be honest.
She's a horrendous woman. Sectarian to the core and then cries when she gets voted out like she was some kind of martyr who didn't bow to the UVF in south belfast at every turn.
Married to a sketchy sectarian f**k as well.
Quote from: gallsman on January 31, 2024, 09:00:44 AMMarried to a sketchy sectarian f**k as well.
Chances are that in the next election she wouldn't even make it back to the assembly going by her record. But looks like we are going to have to endure her for the forseeable.
That's if they can get the assembly back up before the, emperor's clothes style of JD's deal are exposed.
I still want to know who is coaching Jamie. Is it Allister just giving him it all written down before his interviews or is it even someone like Dodds. It's certainly not him on his own because the difference between his crap on twitter and then his radio interviews is huge. Didn't daithi McKay prep a lot of his nama stuff (still unsure why he did that).
Quote from: JPGJOHNNYG on January 31, 2024, 10:06:48 AMI still want to know who is coaching Jamie. Is it Allister just giving him it all written down before his interviews or is it even someone like Dodds. It's certainly not him on his own because the difference between his crap on twitter and then his radio interviews is huge. Didn't daithi McKay prep a lot of his nama stuff (still unsure why he did that).
Would you be shocked if he was maybe given the questions to be asked ahead of his appearances on the Radio show.
He is a complete moron and has scuppered any chance of ever being taken seriously (not that there was much chance of that regardless) but no serious politician will ever trust him again. Only a matter of time before he discloses who the moles are, that's if they don't take the initiative and jump before being pushed.
There is a split on the way it is just a matter of how many decide to head over to angry Jim.
Quote from: NAG1 on January 31, 2024, 10:27:30 AMQuote from: JPGJOHNNYG on January 31, 2024, 10:06:48 AMI still want to know who is coaching Jamie. Is it Allister just giving him it all written down before his interviews or is it even someone like Dodds. It's certainly not him on his own because the difference between his crap on twitter and then his radio interviews is huge. Didn't daithi McKay prep a lot of his nama stuff (still unsure why he did that).
Would you be shocked if he was maybe given the questions to be asked ahead of his appearances on the Radio show.
He is a complete moron and has scuppered any chance of ever being taken seriously (not that there was much chance of that regardless) but no serious politician will ever trust him again. Only a matter of time before he discloses who the moles are, that's if they don't take the initiative and jump before being pushed.
There is a split on the way it is just a matter of how many decide to head over to angry Jim.
Can't see there being any split worth talking about. Maybe one or two mental councillors, a token MLA perhaps.
The vast majority of their MLA's will realise they're elected off the back of a party machine rather than any personal vote they might receive. Just look at the TUV and their struggle to get anybody other than Jim Allister elected.
Leaving the party would potentially leave them unemployed after the next election.
Quote from: ranch on January 31, 2024, 12:10:20 PMQuote from: NAG1 on January 31, 2024, 10:27:30 AMQuote from: JPGJOHNNYG on January 31, 2024, 10:06:48 AMI still want to know who is coaching Jamie. Is it Allister just giving him it all written down before his interviews or is it even someone like Dodds. It's certainly not him on his own because the difference between his crap on twitter and then his radio interviews is huge. Didn't daithi McKay prep a lot of his nama stuff (still unsure why he did that).
Would you be shocked if he was maybe given the questions to be asked ahead of his appearances on the Radio show.
He is a complete moron and has scuppered any chance of ever being taken seriously (not that there was much chance of that regardless) but no serious politician will ever trust him again. Only a matter of time before he discloses who the moles are, that's if they don't take the initiative and jump before being pushed.
There is a split on the way it is just a matter of how many decide to head over to angry Jim.
Can't see there being any split worth talking about. Maybe one or two mental councillors, a token MLA perhaps.
The vast majority of their MLA's will realise they're elected off the back of a party machine rather than any personal vote they might receive. Just look at the TUV and their struggle to get anybody other than Jim Allister elected.
Leaving the party would potentially leave them unemployed after the next election.
The impending UK General Election this year will fairly tell a tale as to the impact this will have on Unionism.
Hard to see Ian O'g go to TUV, but may strike out as an independent, possibly Sammy and Lockhart doing the same, Shannon is a moron and will know what side his bread is buttered and stick with the DUP.
Flegory will sit tight I'd say as will the other less vocal MP's.
Bryson after bugging and reporting publicly on a DUP meeting the other night now wants Donaldson to debate him on the contents of the deal. You couldn't make it up.
Quote from: yellowcard on January 31, 2024, 12:45:46 PMBryson after bugging and reporting publicly on a DUP meeting the other night now wants Donaldson to debate him on the contents of the deal. You couldn't make it up.
Can't understand how he hasn't been slapped down for that stunt.
Quote from: Substandard on January 31, 2024, 12:52:37 PMQuote from: yellowcard on January 31, 2024, 12:45:46 PMBryson after bugging and reporting publicly on a DUP meeting the other night now wants Donaldson to debate him on the contents of the deal. You couldn't make it up.
Can't understand how he hasn't been slapped down for that stunt.
I'd imagine it is coming, he has got about 48hrs to wreck the deal JD has in place. So it will ramp up the whole way to Friday.
Quote from: NAG1 on January 31, 2024, 12:59:08 PMQuote from: Substandard on January 31, 2024, 12:52:37 PMQuote from: yellowcard on January 31, 2024, 12:45:46 PMBryson after bugging and reporting publicly on a DUP meeting the other night now wants Donaldson to debate him on the contents of the deal. You couldn't make it up.
Can't understand how he hasn't been slapped down for that stunt.
I'd imagine it is coming, he has got about 48hrs to wreck the deal JD has in place. So it will ramp up the whole way to Friday.
I hope whoever the mole is gets found out, it will wreck their career both in and out of politics
The DUP has to get this over quickly. The essence of the deal is a promise from the UK Government. Hardline Prods want Brexit and a stronger Union. This is impossible. Brexit weaknens the Union.
So we are back to where started in that NI has access (unfettered) to GB and the EU and GB has (unfettered) access to NI.
So answer me this... what has Brexit achieved for Unionists? The people of the North? Am I missing something?
Quote from: trailer on January 31, 2024, 01:29:09 PMSo we are back to where started in that NI has access (unfettered) to GB and the EU and GB has (unfettered) access to NI.
So answer me this... what has Brexit achieved for Unionists? The people of the North? Am I missing something?
You answered your own question
Quote from: johnnycool on January 31, 2024, 12:28:00 PMQuote from: ranch on January 31, 2024, 12:10:20 PMQuote from: NAG1 on January 31, 2024, 10:27:30 AMQuote from: JPGJOHNNYG on January 31, 2024, 10:06:48 AMI still want to know who is coaching Jamie. Is it Allister just giving him it all written down before his interviews or is it even someone like Dodds. It's certainly not him on his own because the difference between his crap on twitter and then his radio interviews is huge. Didn't daithi McKay prep a lot of his nama stuff (still unsure why he did that).
Would you be shocked if he was maybe given the questions to be asked ahead of his appearances on the Radio show.
He is a complete moron and has scuppered any chance of ever being taken seriously (not that there was much chance of that regardless) but no serious politician will ever trust him again. Only a matter of time before he discloses who the moles are, that's if they don't take the initiative and jump before being pushed.
There is a split on the way it is just a matter of how many decide to head over to angry Jim.
Can't see there being any split worth talking about. Maybe one or two mental councillors, a token MLA perhaps.
The vast majority of their MLA's will realise they're elected off the back of a party machine rather than any personal vote they might receive. Just look at the TUV and their struggle to get anybody other than Jim Allister elected.
Leaving the party would potentially leave them unemployed after the next election.
The impending UK General Election this year will fairly tell a tale as to the impact this will have on Unionism.
Hard to see Ian O'g go to TUV, but may strike out as an independent, possibly Sammy and Lockhart doing the same, Shannon is a moron and will know what side his bread is buttered and stick with the DUP.
Flegory will sit tight I'd say as will the other less vocal MP's.
Lockhart has a safe seat, she'll not quit the party. Ian Paisley likewise.
They'll hold their own at the next GE. No real threats within Unionism to take a seat off them. If anything they could improve their vote with an agreement with the UUP to give one another a free run in certain areas (DUP step aside for the UUP in FST and vice versa in North Belfast). The TUV will only ever be a party of protest within Unionism with Jim as a MLA and a loony councillor here and there.
Why would the UUP partner up with the DUP considering they fecking hate each other?
Would it not be a case that the UUP may make a little gain if the DUP and the TUV got at each other again? Add in maybe someone going independent it may change
Nobody has broke cover from within the DUP yet.... Says a lot.
Jeffrey on talkback spoke quote well. Really put his opponents within Unionism in their place without naming names.
Quote from: trailer on January 31, 2024, 01:58:35 PMNobody has broke cover from within the DUP yet.... Says a lot.
That there's more than one spineless cúnt in that party?
Remarkable how the Command Paper is written. All about doing a deal with the DUP, strengthening NI's place in the Union etc, As one sided as you'll ever see, no surprise I suppose. You'd never guess there's a nationalist First Minister incoming.
SF must be willing to tolerate it all because they want the First Minister prize. I can understand that.
See tweets circulating about road blocking by the Loyalists on Friday. The 'TOs are working hard behind the scenes.
As I said before, it's all smoke, mirrors and fudge words to get it over the line.
In reality, nothing has changed.
Unionism is in crisis. That is the big picture. One of the reasons the DUP stayed out of Stormont is that the momentum is with the Shinners.
Quote from: bennydorano on January 31, 2024, 05:46:46 PMSee tweets circulating about road blocking by the Loyalists on Friday. The 'TOs are working hard behind the scenes.
You'd think they'd be delighted their drug shipments will come through without checks.
Quote from: marty34 on January 31, 2024, 05:47:31 PMAs I said before, it's all smoke, mirrors and fudge words to get it over the line.
In reality, nothing has changed.
100%
The reason why the DUP "moved" now , is to hang onto their seats and big salaries. This is all in their own interests, nobody else's.
The lack of any criticism from Nationalists would suggest "we" have no particular real issues about the thing.
Does the "Stormont brake" mean Unionists can block any EU Laws being implemented in the 6?
Quote from: Rossfan on January 31, 2024, 06:58:55 PMThe lack of any criticism from Nationalists would suggest "we" have no particular real issues about the thing.
Does the "Stormont brake" mean Unionists can block any EU Laws being implemented in the 6?
It means they can cry to Westminster about it but they can chose to ignore them
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on January 31, 2024, 01:49:40 PMWhy would the UUP partner up with the DUP considering they fecking hate each other?
Would it not be a case that the UUP may make a little gain if the DUP and the TUV got at each other again? Add in maybe someone going independent it may change
They do hate one another, that hasn't stopped them stepping aside in certain seats in the past. The UUP have a choice if the DUP suggest an election pact - accept it and potentially win a seat, reject it and lose anyway.
Quote from: bennydorano on January 31, 2024, 05:46:46 PMSee tweets circulating about road blocking by the Loyalists on Friday. The 'TOs are working hard behind the scenes.
Last sting of a dying wasp. Their Union is fucked. And the irony is they are responsible because of their stupidity and outright bigotry in backing Brexit.
Quote from: red hander on January 31, 2024, 07:24:41 PMQuote from: bennydorano on January 31, 2024, 05:46:46 PMSee tweets circulating about road blocking by the Loyalists on Friday. The 'TOs are working hard behind the scenes.
Last sting of a dying wasp. Their Union is fucked. And the irony is they are responsible because of their stupidity and outright bigotry in backing Brexit.
Hoping I'm on a road they are trying to block
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on January 31, 2024, 08:07:59 PMQuote from: red hander on January 31, 2024, 07:24:41 PMQuote from: bennydorano on January 31, 2024, 05:46:46 PMSee tweets circulating about road blocking by the Loyalists on Friday. The 'TOs are working hard behind the scenes.
Last sting of a dying wasp. Their Union is fucked. And the irony is they are responsible because of their stupidity and outright bigotry in backing Brexit.
Hoping I'm on a road they are trying to block
Don't give the wee scrotes any excuse to get a claim off you. No doubt they'll all have their phones out.
Water cannon heading up the road this evening.
Quote from: RedHand88 on January 31, 2024, 08:47:39 PMQuote from: Milltown Row2 on January 31, 2024, 08:07:59 PMQuote from: red hander on January 31, 2024, 07:24:41 PMQuote from: bennydorano on January 31, 2024, 05:46:46 PMSee tweets circulating about road blocking by the Loyalists on Friday. The 'TOs are working hard behind the scenes.
Last sting of a dying wasp. Their Union is fucked. And the irony is they are responsible because of their stupidity and outright bigotry in backing Brexit.
Hoping I'm on a road they are trying to block
Don't give the wee scrotes any excuse to get a claim off you. No doubt they'll all have their phones out.
I'll be having my phone out!
Quote from: Rossfan on January 31, 2024, 06:58:55 PMThe lack of any criticism from Nationalists would suggest "we" have no particular real issues about the thing.
Does the "Stormont brake" mean Unionists can block any EU Laws being implemented in the 6?
It's farmers in 26 who should be more worried. All it will take is one dodgy lorry of livestock to come in from Britain that could jeopardise Irish trade deals. EU and Dublin forced Britain into a deal that was in Ireland's interest, now Tories are saying no checks on internal Uk trade. Britain has had zero controls on goods coming into Britain. Even Brits are worried about their own biosecurity. That's a haulier away from Ireland. I don't think Sinn Féin or SDLP are on the ball with this at all. Nor is Martin. Leo is bored off it now. Coveney was a big loss in that roll.
Quote from: weareros on January 31, 2024, 10:39:52 PMQuote from: Rossfan on January 31, 2024, 06:58:55 PMThe lack of any criticism from Nationalists would suggest "we" have no particular real issues about the thing.
Does the "Stormont brake" mean Unionists can block any EU Laws being implemented in the 6?
It's farmers in 26 who should be more worried. All it will take is one dodgy lorry of livestock to come in from Britain that could jeopardise Irish trade deals. EU and Dublin forced Britain into a deal that was in Ireland's interest, now Tories are saying no checks on internal Uk trade. Britain has had zero controls on goods coming into Britain. Even Brits are worried about their own biosecurity. That's a haulier away from Ireland. I don't think Sinn Féin or SDLP are on the ball with this at all. Nor is Martin. Leo is bored off it now. Coveney was a big loss in that roll.
Would there not be that sorta trading going on under the counter anyways over the years?
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on January 31, 2024, 10:43:56 PMQuote from: weareros on January 31, 2024, 10:39:52 PMQuote from: Rossfan on January 31, 2024, 06:58:55 PMThe lack of any criticism from Nationalists would suggest "we" have no particular real issues about the thing.
Does the "Stormont brake" mean Unionists can block any EU Laws being implemented in the 6?
It's farmers in 26 who should be more worried. All it will take is one dodgy lorry of livestock to come in from Britain that could jeopardise Irish trade deals. EU and Dublin forced Britain into a deal that was in Ireland's interest, now Tories are saying no checks on internal Uk trade. Britain has had zero controls on goods coming into Britain. Even Brits are worried about their own biosecurity. That's a haulier away from Ireland. I don't think Sinn Féin or SDLP are on the ball with this at all. Nor is Martin. Leo is bored off it now. Coveney was a big loss in that roll.
Would there not be that sorta trading going on under the counter anyways over the years?
GB was aligned to EU standards so there was no widespread risk. Now they have pesticides banned in EU, substandard beef coming in from other countries, more liberal rules on GMO foodstuffs. Once that gets into Irish food chain, it will destroy reputation of Irish agriculture. The likes of China won't hesitate to ban Irish beef again. Some of the North's farming practices are very questionable to begin with (livestock and chickens in close proximity). This opens the door to making it worse. And you will probably have a DUPer on agriculture to make it worse like the measly fines Poots implemented for polluting lakes and rivers. That lot don't care about the land so long as they can put a flag up on it.
Not really, Ireland will bring in something to highlight different of beef from the North. China ban Irush Beef, ha, they hardly a guiding light in food practices, Man best friend vouch for that.
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on January 31, 2024, 08:07:59 PMQuote from: red hander on January 31, 2024, 07:24:41 PMQuote from: bennydorano on January 31, 2024, 05:46:46 PMSee tweets circulating about road blocking by the Loyalists on Friday. The 'TOs are working hard behind the scenes.
Last sting of a dying wasp. Their Union is fucked. And the irony is they are responsible because of their stupidity and outright bigotry in backing Brexit.
Hoping I'm on a road they are trying to block
Why ?
Quote from: Jim Bob on February 01, 2024, 07:30:47 AMQuote from: Milltown Row2 on January 31, 2024, 08:07:59 PMQuote from: red hander on January 31, 2024, 07:24:41 PMQuote from: bennydorano on January 31, 2024, 05:46:46 PMSee tweets circulating about road blocking by the Loyalists on Friday. The 'TOs are working hard behind the scenes.
Last sting of a dying wasp. Their Union is fucked. And the irony is they are responsible because of their stupidity and outright bigotry in backing Brexit.
Hoping I'm on a road they are trying to block
Why ?
As I'll be going through the road block, I'll be asking the question when I get to the front, why are they blocking the road. The answers should be entertaining.
I'd say most haven't read the new framework
Most have never voted
Many will not understand the benefits of being part of both the EU and UK
None of the issues surrounding the red and green lanes would have had made a difference to their lives.
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on February 01, 2024, 07:37:33 AMQuote from: Jim Bob on February 01, 2024, 07:30:47 AMQuote from: Milltown Row2 on January 31, 2024, 08:07:59 PMQuote from: red hander on January 31, 2024, 07:24:41 PMQuote from: bennydorano on January 31, 2024, 05:46:46 PMSee tweets circulating about road blocking by the Loyalists on Friday. The 'TOs are working hard behind the scenes.
Last sting of a dying wasp. Their Union is fucked. And the irony is they are responsible because of their stupidity and outright bigotry in backing Brexit.
Hoping I'm on a road they are trying to block
Why ?
As I'll be going through the road block, I'll be asking the question when I get to the front, why are they blocking the road. The answers should be entertaining.
I'd say most haven't read the new framework
Most have never voted
Many will not understand the benefits of being part of both the EU and UK
None of the issues surrounding the red and green lanes would have had made a difference to their lives.
Would it be worth winning an argument but having your car burned out?
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on February 01, 2024, 07:37:33 AMQuote from: Jim Bob on February 01, 2024, 07:30:47 AMQuote from: Milltown Row2 on January 31, 2024, 08:07:59 PMQuote from: red hander on January 31, 2024, 07:24:41 PMQuote from: bennydorano on January 31, 2024, 05:46:46 PMSee tweets circulating about road blocking by the Loyalists on Friday. The 'TOs are working hard behind the scenes.
Last sting of a dying wasp. Their Union is fucked. And the irony is they are responsible because of their stupidity and outright bigotry in backing Brexit.
Hoping I'm on a road they are trying to block
Why ?
As I'll be going through the road block, I'll be asking the question when I get to the front, why are they blocking the road. The answers should be entertaining.
I'd say most haven't read the new framework
Most have never voted
Many will not understand the benefits of being part of both the EU and UK
None of the issues surrounding the red and green lanes would have had made a difference to their lives.
The agreement and the protocol make incredibly boring reading (agreement is 80 pages of legal text). It's quite dense and long winded, as laws tend to be.
There isn't a hope in hell any of them will have read a paragraph of it.
Quote from: maddog on February 01, 2024, 08:00:39 AMQuote from: Milltown Row2 on February 01, 2024, 07:37:33 AMQuote from: Jim Bob on February 01, 2024, 07:30:47 AMQuote from: Milltown Row2 on January 31, 2024, 08:07:59 PMQuote from: red hander on January 31, 2024, 07:24:41 PMQuote from: bennydorano on January 31, 2024, 05:46:46 PMSee tweets circulating about road blocking by the Loyalists on Friday. The 'TOs are working hard behind the scenes.
Last sting of a dying wasp. Their Union is fucked. And the irony is they are responsible because of their stupidity and outright bigotry in backing Brexit.
Hoping I'm on a road they are trying to block
Why ?
As I'll be going through the road block, I'll be asking the question when I get to the front, why are they blocking the road. The answers should be entertaining.
I'd say most haven't read the new framework
Most have never voted
Many will not understand the benefits of being part of both the EU and UK
None of the issues surrounding the red and green lanes would have had made a difference to their lives.
Would it be worth winning an argument but having your car burned out?
The man wants a new car leave him alone
Trust me there will be no burning of cars, this mob will do nothing, they stand in their own areas and make their own locals days a misery
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on February 01, 2024, 08:38:11 AMTrust me there will be no burning of cars, this mob will do nothing, they stand in their own areas and make their own locals days a misery
I see they blaming Nationalists/ Republicans for circulating this list of roads to be blocked.
Will be interesting to see if anything materialises.
Quote from: weareros on January 31, 2024, 10:39:52 PMQuote from: Rossfan on January 31, 2024, 06:58:55 PMThe lack of any criticism from Nationalists would suggest "we" have no particular real issues about the thing.
Does the "Stormont brake" mean Unionists can block any EU Laws being implemented in the 6?
It's farmers in 26 who should be more worried. All it will take is one dodgy lorry of livestock to come in from Britain that could jeopardise Irish trade deals. EU and Dublin forced Britain into a deal that was in Ireland's interest, now Tories are saying no checks on internal Uk trade. Britain has had zero controls on goods coming into Britain. Even Brits are worried about their own biosecurity. That's a haulier away from Ireland. I don't think Sinn Féin or SDLP are on the ball with this at all. Nor is Martin. Leo is bored off it now. Coveney was a big loss in that roll.
Always been checks on Livestock from GB to NI and vice versa. Can't imagine that will ever change.
Quote from: Rossfan on January 31, 2024, 06:58:55 PMThe lack of any criticism from Nationalists would suggest "we" have no particular real issues about the thing.
Does the "Stormont brake" mean Unionists can block any EU Laws being implemented in the 6?
With the exception of the party leaders no other politician is really saying much.
From what I understand the agreement is a 76 page document and no doubt probably a bit too much to process for the calibre of politicians we have so no doubt if they exposed themselves to be interviewed on it they could be found wanting.
Main thing from their perspective is they are back up to full wages. I wonder if any will be brave enough to come out and say until nurses, bus drivers etc get sorted as a sign of solidarity they will return to work on their current reduced salary, some chance.
Hard to believe it took two years to come up with that "agreement". Some checks will be reduced but the rest is very much smoothing out a few rough edges of the Framework. Luckily for the DUP the vast majority of Unionism doesn't care and wants the Assembly up and running again. The next big issue is unmasking the DUP's Stakeknife (or knives)
At what point does SF/SDLP pull the plug until a border poll is called 8)
Quote from: Hereiam on February 01, 2024, 10:01:59 AMAt what point does SF/SDLP pull the plug until a border poll is called 8)
Yes, some of the stuff that CHH and other politicians came out with yesterday flew under the radar and was eye watering in its lack of understanding of the GFA.
Quote from: Pub Bore on February 01, 2024, 10:14:09 AMQuote from: Hereiam on February 01, 2024, 10:01:59 AMAt what point does SF/SDLP pull the plug until a border poll is called 8)
Yes, some of the stuff that CHH and other politicians came out with yesterday flew under the radar and was eye watering in its lack of understanding of the GFA.
At this stage I think they will say anything to get the assembly back up and running and SF are not going to pull them on it until it is.
Yet to see anything that devastating, that would prevent JD marching them back up the hill. Everyone and their dog knew it was the MPs holding out this, all on really cushy numbers with no impact on their income or lifestyle from the assembly being down. So they could come across as hard line as they want to play to the galleries.
One thing that maybe has flown under the radar is the possible reduction in Corporation tax here. Looking forward to that for sure. Would be a massive boost to business and the local economy if they can pull it off. Be interesting to see if we have the political ability to get that done.
But but but....that would make "Northern Ireland different to the rest of the UK".....
Quote from: trailer on February 01, 2024, 10:37:23 AMOne thing that maybe has flown under the radar is the possible reduction in Corporation tax here. Looking forward to that for sure. Would be a massive boost to business and the local economy if they can pull it off. Be interesting to see if we have the political ability to get that done.
I read that too.
I also read that as a reduction in corporation tax would mean a reduction in money paid to the British Exchequer from NI, the block grant would then also be reduced accordingly.
So it could be a case of giving on one hand and taking on the other with no net gain....and possibly even a net loss to NI Ltd.
Quote from: tbrick18 on February 01, 2024, 11:32:12 AMQuote from: trailer on February 01, 2024, 10:37:23 AMOne thing that maybe has flown under the radar is the possible reduction in Corporation tax here. Looking forward to that for sure. Would be a massive boost to business and the local economy if they can pull it off. Be interesting to see if we have the political ability to get that done.
I read that too.
I also read that as a reduction in corporation tax would mean a reduction in money paid to the British Exchequer from NI, the block grant would then also be reduced accordingly.
So it could be a case of giving on one hand and taking on the other with no net gain....and possibly even a net loss to NI Ltd.
Is this the beginning of the weaning process?
Quote from: NAG1 on February 01, 2024, 11:44:04 AMQuote from: tbrick18 on February 01, 2024, 11:32:12 AMQuote from: trailer on February 01, 2024, 10:37:23 AMOne thing that maybe has flown under the radar is the possible reduction in Corporation tax here. Looking forward to that for sure. Would be a massive boost to business and the local economy if they can pull it off. Be interesting to see if we have the political ability to get that done.
I read that too.
I also read that as a reduction in corporation tax would mean a reduction in money paid to the British Exchequer from NI, the block grant would then also be reduced accordingly.
So it could be a case of giving on one hand and taking on the other with no net gain....and possibly even a net loss to NI Ltd.
Is this the beginning of the weaning process?
Just create another 'issue' leave the Assembly and get some favours to get back in, rinse and repeat when necessary
Quote from: tbrick18 on February 01, 2024, 11:32:12 AMQuote from: trailer on February 01, 2024, 10:37:23 AMOne thing that maybe has flown under the radar is the possible reduction in Corporation tax here. Looking forward to that for sure. Would be a massive boost to business and the local economy if they can pull it off. Be interesting to see if we have the political ability to get that done.
I read that too.
I also read that as a reduction in corporation tax would mean a reduction in money paid to the British Exchequer from NI, the block grant would then also be reduced accordingly.
So it could be a case of giving on one hand and taking on the other with no net gain....and possibly even a net loss to NI Ltd.
And absolutely the right approach. It means our politicians will actually have to do what they are paid to do, i.e. do a cost benefit analysis and determine if the reduction in tax rate will have a net positive outcome, whether through increased employment or higher taxable profits as more companies relocate. Unfortunately an approach like that needs a stable political base and competent ministers, something I think we are sadly lacking. It should not be a case of "cut tax for the sake of it and sure Whitehall will bail us out to make sure we are no worse off." This begging bowl approach has to stop.
I think this episode over the last few years has woken up a lot of Tories as to what a pain in the arse NI is to UK. And all thanks to the DUP. ;D ;D
Quote from: Pub Bore on February 01, 2024, 10:14:09 AMQuote from: Hereiam on February 01, 2024, 10:01:59 AMAt what point does SF/SDLP pull the plug until a border poll is called 8)
Yes, some of the stuff that CHH and other politicians came out with yesterday flew under the radar and was eye watering in its lack of understanding of the GFA.
Buttering up the DUP, but we'd need to be careful they don't slip some shít under the radar impacting the calling of a border poll
The was a Labour MP interviewed yesterday and she obviously wasn't aware of the UK Governments supposed position in the event of a border poll either.
The Corporation Tax case was made before Brexit, and it did make economic sense back then. Many of my colleagues were involved in the investigative groundwork, and certainly the community of chartered accountants (of which I'm a member) was majority in favour of tax powers devolving here. Not sure how much things will have changed by now.
Quote from: johnnycool on February 01, 2024, 12:06:22 PMQuote from: Pub Bore on February 01, 2024, 10:14:09 AMQuote from: Hereiam on February 01, 2024, 10:01:59 AMAt what point does SF/SDLP pull the plug until a border poll is called 8)
Yes, some of the stuff that CHH and other politicians came out with yesterday flew under the radar and was eye watering in its lack of understanding of the GFA.
Buttering up the DUP, but we'd need to be careful they don't slip some shít under the radar impacting the calling of a border poll
The was a Labour MP interviewed yesterday and she obviously wasn't aware of the UK Governments supposed position in the event of a border poll either.
Saw that on Sky. She's obviously as thick as pigshit, which is all that charlatan Starmer wants in his party, but that odious cow Burley had no idea about what she was on about either and completely lacking in research in her questions. She has a history of ill-researched shit stirring.
Quote from: johnnycool on February 01, 2024, 12:06:22 PMQuote from: Pub Bore on February 01, 2024, 10:14:09 AMQuote from: Hereiam on February 01, 2024, 10:01:59 AMAt what point does SF/SDLP pull the plug until a border poll is called 8)
Yes, some of the stuff that CHH and other politicians came out with yesterday flew under the radar and was eye watering in its lack of understanding of the GFA.
Buttering up the DUP, but we'd need to be careful they don't slip some shít under the radar impacting the calling of a border poll
The was a Labour MP interviewed yesterday and she obviously wasn't aware of the UK Governments supposed position in the event of a border poll either.
That was Tulip Siddiq. She represents Kilburn! ::)
Quote from: johnnycool on February 01, 2024, 12:06:22 PMQuote from: Pub Bore on February 01, 2024, 10:14:09 AMQuote from: Hereiam on February 01, 2024, 10:01:59 AMAt what point does SF/SDLP pull the plug until a border poll is called 8)
Yes, some of the stuff that CHH and other politicians came out with yesterday flew under the radar and was eye watering in its lack of understanding of the GFA.
Buttering up the DUP, but we'd need to be careful they don't slip some shít under the radar impacting the calling of a border poll
The was a Labour MP interviewed yesterday and she obviously wasn't aware of the UK Governments supposed position in the event of a border poll either.
Well Keir Starmer doesn't know either as he has already said he will be campaigning pro-union during any campaign instead of the supposed neutrality
Quote from: Rois on February 01, 2024, 12:12:46 PMThe Corporation Tax case was made before Brexit, and it did make economic sense back then. Many of my colleagues were involved in the investigative groundwork, and certainly the community of chartered accountants (of which I'm a member) was majority in favour of tax powers devolving here. Not sure how much things will have changed by now.
I'd be careful in which powers to devolve. Our politicians are largely incompetent. We already pay 2 million a year for a non existent flight to NYC. We all remember RHI.
I think a cut in corporation tax to make it attractive to companies to invest would be fine, but to allow them to make decisions with income tax, inheritance tax, stamp duty definitely No.
Quote from: red hander on February 01, 2024, 12:14:13 PMQuote from: johnnycool on February 01, 2024, 12:06:22 PMQuote from: Pub Bore on February 01, 2024, 10:14:09 AMQuote from: Hereiam on February 01, 2024, 10:01:59 AMAt what point does SF/SDLP pull the plug until a border poll is called 8)
Yes, some of the stuff that CHH and other politicians came out with yesterday flew under the radar and was eye watering in its lack of understanding of the GFA.
Buttering up the DUP, but we'd need to be careful they don't slip some shít under the radar impacting the calling of a border poll
The was a Labour MP interviewed yesterday and she obviously wasn't aware of the UK Governments supposed position in the event of a border poll either.
Saw that on Sky. She's obviously as thick as pigshit, which is all that charlatan Starmer wants in his party, but that odious cow Burley had no idea about what she was on about either and completely lacking in research in her questions. She has a history of ill-researched shit stirring.
Saw it too and what I took from it was like 99% of MPs in the UK she a) didn't have the first clue about anything to do with politics in the North and b) didn't give a shit about it either.
When is she going to get the pay rise? Hearing teachers may get 8.5% any chance that will be back dated? ;)
Apparently, oul whiskey nose himself is backing the 'Betrayal Deal'. Bin Boy will be going even more apeshit. Need to restock the popcorn supplies.
Hearing the MLAs voices on the radio every day now is only bringing back bad memories for me. I couldn't think of half a dozen who I'd rate as serious operators.
It was funny watching aul Willie Irvine stopping the car outside the gates of the hotel the other night to speak to the protestors. Like most local politicians he's been stealing a living for years spoofing away and chairing the agriculture committee at one stage I think. He couldn't get the window up quick enough when the heat came on.
The quick win will be a public sector pay rise, and there'll be plenty of photo shoots if they want it portraying stability, which is no bad thing if it brings in some jobs.
But not a ward nor small school will they have the balls to shut, so don't be expecting big change.
https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2024/feb/01/post-brexit-food-labelling-rules-to-appease-dup-will-lead-to-higher-prices-says-industry
Wee Jeff and the boys making food more expensive for everyone in the UK!
Big Gavin Robinson denying the existence of an All Island economy...
Someone better not tell him or those big Protestant farmers where those Lakeland Dairies lorries loaded with their milk every morning goes!
They must live in total denial.
Do him better to deny the existence of pies
Quote from: johnnycool on February 01, 2024, 04:32:41 PMBig Gavin Robinson denying the existence of an All Island economy...
Someone better not tell him or those big Protestant farmers where those Lakeland Dairies lorries loaded with their milk every morning goes!
They must live in total denial.
He doesn't. But the muppets that give him his vote does so he plays that game as well. Do you think many DUP voters in East Belfast know anything about anything related to farming never mind understanding of milk chains?
Quote from: NAG1 on February 01, 2024, 08:49:27 AMQuote from: Milltown Row2 on February 01, 2024, 08:38:11 AMTrust me there will be no burning of cars, this mob will do nothing, they stand in their own areas and make their own locals days a misery
I see they blaming Nationalists/ Republicans for circulating this list of roads to be blocked.
Will be interesting to see if anything materialises.
Where's this list at?
Quote from: TabClear on February 01, 2024, 11:55:03 AMQuote from: tbrick18 on February 01, 2024, 11:32:12 AMQuote from: trailer on February 01, 2024, 10:37:23 AMOne thing that maybe has flown under the radar is the possible reduction in Corporation tax here. Looking forward to that for sure. Would be a massive boost to business and the local economy if they can pull it off. Be interesting to see if we have the political ability to get that done.
I read that too.
I also read that as a reduction in corporation tax would mean a reduction in money paid to the British Exchequer from NI, the block grant would then also be reduced accordingly.
So it could be a case of giving on one hand and taking on the other with no net gain....and possibly even a net loss to NI Ltd.
And absolutely the right approach. It means our politicians will actually have to do what they are paid to do, i.e. do a cost benefit analysis and determine if the reduction in tax rate will have a net positive outcome, whether through increased employment or higher taxable profits as more companies relocate. Unfortunately an approach like that needs a stable political base and competent ministers, something I think we are sadly lacking. It should not be a case of "cut tax for the sake of it and sure Whitehall will bail us out to make sure we are no worse off." This begging bowl approach has to stop.
I think this episode over the last few years has woken up a lot of Tories as to what a pain in the arse NI is to UK. And all thanks to the DUP. ;D ;D
The issue will be we'll have to pay for water and perscription charges etc.
There'll be some uproar over that.
All well and good saying politicians have to make mature decisions but when they have to make these type of decisions, there'll be some whinging and complaining.
Donaldson seems to have weathered the storm and has done a reasonable job getting his deal out there. The extreme hardliners will never get a deal that satisfies them so things will move on now but I have my doubts over how well Stormont will ultimately work. There have been a lot of damaged relationships between the parties since Brexit began as the loyalist moon howlers attempt to obstruct any semblance of progression.
Its been a whirlwind week for Unionist politics overall but I still can't get my head around the fact that a DUP member wore a wire into a meeting connected to a UVF linked agitator who then put it into the public domain. Espionage without any shame. It's a story that Nolan would normally salivate over if you replaced the characters involved in it. A sure fire way to stoke up the outrage and boast about ratings but yet he has barely mentioned it all week on loyalist radio.
Quote from: marty34 on February 01, 2024, 06:13:59 PMQuote from: TabClear on February 01, 2024, 11:55:03 AMQuote from: tbrick18 on February 01, 2024, 11:32:12 AMQuote from: trailer on February 01, 2024, 10:37:23 AMOne thing that maybe has flown under the radar is the possible reduction in Corporation tax here. Looking forward to that for sure. Would be a massive boost to business and the local economy if they can pull it off. Be interesting to see if we have the political ability to get that done.
I read that too.
I also read that as a reduction in corporation tax would mean a reduction in money paid to the British Exchequer from NI, the block grant would then also be reduced accordingly.
So it could be a case of giving on one hand and taking on the other with no net gain....and possibly even a net loss to NI Ltd.
And absolutely the right approach. It means our politicians will actually have to do what they are paid to do, i.e. do a cost benefit analysis and determine if the reduction in tax rate will have a net positive outcome, whether through increased employment or higher taxable profits as more companies relocate. Unfortunately an approach like that needs a stable political base and competent ministers, something I think we are sadly lacking. It should not be a case of "cut tax for the sake of it and sure Whitehall will bail us out to make sure we are no worse off." This begging bowl approach has to stop.
I think this episode over the last few years has woken up a lot of Tories as to what a pain in the arse NI is to UK. And all thanks to the DUP. ;D ;D
The issue will be we'll have to pay for water and perscription charges etc.
There'll be some uproar over that.
All well and good saying politicians have to make mature decisions but when they have to make these type of decisions, there'll be some whinging and complaining.
As there should be.
Bin boy giving a speech to the mutants in the Village of the Damned tonight. Moygashel needs a new idiot after the old one died from toxic shock syndrome when he had a wash. Agent 167 is perfectly qualified.
Quote from: red hander on February 01, 2024, 06:33:03 PMBin boy giving a speech to the mutants in the Village of the Damned tonight. Moygashel needs a new idiot after the old one died from toxic shock syndrome when he had a wash. Agent 167 is perfectly qualified.
It'd be funny if someone tweeted out from the meeting.
The rugby is on Friday and the Assembly sits on Saturday . trina cheile.
Who is likely to get the ministerial jobs?
Sinn Fein - Economy, Education, Communities
DUP - Finance, Health
Alliance - Justice, Agriculture
Not sure who is left for Infrastructure
Quote from: Duine Inteacht Eile on February 01, 2024, 08:42:14 PMSinn Fein - Economy, Education, Communities
DUP - Finance, Health
Alliance - Justice, Agriculture
Not sure who is left for Infrastructure
UUP are due a post but haven't decided if they'll take one or remain in opposition.
Quote from: lurganblue on February 02, 2024, 08:45:45 AMQuote from: Duine Inteacht Eile on February 01, 2024, 08:42:14 PMSinn Fein - Economy, Education, Communities
DUP - Finance, Health
Alliance - Justice, Agriculture
Not sure who is left for Infrastructure
UUP are due a post but haven't decided if they'll take one or remain in opposition.
Doug wants to take opposition, just needs to persuade his party. O'Toole would be gutted.
Still can't get over how one sided that Command Paper is. It openly boasts that this is a Government/DUP deal, actively seeks to de-legitimise the All Island economy, and sets up a load of structures to keep the focus on NI-GB. Parity of esteem?
SDLP have called it out.
SF strategy seems to be don't rock the boat, let's get Michelle in, and we'll take it from there.
Good to see Mark Carruthers picking up on the DUP's double standards last night when Paul Girvan said it was "unhelpful" for Mary Lou talking about the prospect of a UI, yet it's OK for the DUP and associated Tory ministers talking up strengthening the union.
There's no concern for nationalist sensitivities when it comes to this evidently.
How many thousand turned up at the Binlid/Angry Jim shindig?
Shinners obviously want to get the feet under the Executive table so are keeping mum.
Quote from: Rossfan on February 02, 2024, 10:34:31 AMHow many thousand turned up at the Binlid/Angry Jim shindig?
Shinners obviously want to get the feet under the Executive table so are keeping mum.
50 odd in in Moygashel...
It seems Moygashel and Markethill are their go to places, not Donaghadee, not East Belfast, not Larne.
I find that quite strange.
As for SF, each and every representative interviewed from now on should make it abundantly clear they striving for a UI and fúck Unionist sensitivities.
is the road blocks all talk
Quote from: johnnycool on February 02, 2024, 11:04:38 AMQuote from: Rossfan on February 02, 2024, 10:34:31 AMHow many thousand turned up at the Binlid/Angry Jim shindig?
Shinners obviously want to get the feet under the Executive table so are keeping mum.
50 odd in in Moygashel...
It seems Moygashel and Markethill are their go to places, not Donaghadee, not East Belfast, not Larne.
I find that quite strange.
As for SF, each and every representative interviewed from now on should make it abundantly clear they striving for a UI and fúck Unionist sensitivities.
Having first hand experience of Moygashel, it's right up the Bryson/Allister street.
Bigots and racists. If you're non-loyalist, if you're non-white, if you're a foreign national....you'll get burned out of moygashel.
In terms of SF - I don't think they need to draw attention to the one sidedness of the agreement between dup and WM. I think now, when they are in the ascendancy with the electorate, the demographics are going in one direction they need to make some good progress for all people in NI before the next election. Then, when election mode is on and from that point on they have the referenceability of governing for all and so the UI can be called for to benefit all.
What ever people think of SF, they have been running rings around the unionist parties for well over a decade in terms of politics.
Quote from: tbrick18 on February 02, 2024, 11:12:52 AMQuote from: johnnycool on February 02, 2024, 11:04:38 AMQuote from: Rossfan on February 02, 2024, 10:34:31 AMHow many thousand turned up at the Binlid/Angry Jim shindig?
Shinners obviously want to get the feet under the Executive table so are keeping mum.
50 odd in in Moygashel...
It seems Moygashel and Markethill are their go to places, not Donaghadee, not East Belfast, not Larne.
I find that quite strange.
As for SF, each and every representative interviewed from now on should make it abundantly clear they striving for a UI and fúck Unionist sensitivities.
Having first hand experience of Moygashel, it's right up the Bryson/Allister street.
Bigots and racists. If you're non-loyalist, if you're non-white, if you're a foreign national....you'll get burned out of moygashel.
In terms of SF - I don't think they need to draw attention to the one sidedness of the agreement between dup and WM. I think now, when they are in the ascendancy with the electorate, the demographics are going in one direction they need to make some good progress for all people in NI before the next election. Then, when election mode is on and from that point on they have the referenceability of governing for all and so the UI can be called for to benefit all.
What ever people think of SF, they have been running rings around the unionist parties for well over a decade in terms of politics.
"Non-white", saw pictures of some Asian lad stood next to big Jim at the meeting he must have gotten lost ;D .Reminds me of that famous Muslim rangers lad who then joined the EDL you couldn't make it up
Quote from: tbrick18 on February 02, 2024, 11:12:52 AMQuote from: johnnycool on February 02, 2024, 11:04:38 AMQuote from: Rossfan on February 02, 2024, 10:34:31 AMHow many thousand turned up at the Binlid/Angry Jim shindig?
Shinners obviously want to get the feet under the Executive table so are keeping mum.
50 odd in in Moygashel...
It seems Moygashel and Markethill are their go to places, not Donaghadee, not East Belfast, not Larne.
I find that quite strange.
As for SF, each and every representative interviewed from now on should make it abundantly clear they striving for a UI and fúck Unionist sensitivities.
Having first hand experience of Moygashel, it's right up the Bryson/Allister street.
Bigots and racists. If you're non-loyalist, if you're non-white, if you're a foreign national....you'll get burned out of moygashel.
In terms of SF - I don't think they need to draw attention to the one sidedness of the agreement between dup and WM. I think now, when they are in the ascendancy with the electorate, the demographics are going in one direction they need to make some good progress for all people in NI before the next election. Then, when election mode is on and from that point on they have the referenceability of governing for all and so the UI can be called for to benefit all.
What ever people think of SF, they have been running rings around the unionist parties for well over a decade in terms of politics.
Markethill wouldn't be much better. Remember their disgusting soldier F banners a few years back and plenty of UVF signs in it now plus their Israeli flags.
Quote from: johnnycool on February 02, 2024, 11:04:38 AMQuote from: Rossfan on February 02, 2024, 10:34:31 AMHow many thousand turned up at the Binlid/Angry Jim shindig?
Shinners obviously want to get the feet under the Executive table so are keeping mum.
It seems Moygashel and Markethill are their go to places, not Donaghadee, not East Belfast, not Larne.
I find that quite strange.
Its the pitchfork brigade. East Belfast wouldn't know what a pitchfork was for.
Our Mississippi.
Quote from: maddog on February 02, 2024, 11:23:14 AMQuote from: johnnycool on February 02, 2024, 11:04:38 AMQuote from: Rossfan on February 02, 2024, 10:34:31 AMHow many thousand turned up at the Binlid/Angry Jim shindig?
Shinners obviously want to get the feet under the Executive table so are keeping mum.
It seems Moygashel and Markethill are their go to places, not Donaghadee, not East Belfast, not Larne.
I find that quite strange.
Its the pitchfork brigade. East Belfast wouldn't know what a pitchfork was for.
A Machete or a bull hook, well that's a different story. ;D
I don't know if this is a new thing or not, I certainly don't recall hearing it before but BBC news earlier was talking about the pro-British Democratic Unionist Party. Anyone else notice this.
Quote from: Harold Disgracey on February 02, 2024, 12:15:32 PMI don't know if this is a new thing or not, I certainly don't recall hearing it before but BBC news earlier was talking about the pro-British Democratic Unionist Party. Anyone else notice this.
Is there an anti British one?
Quote from: Duine Inteacht Eile on February 01, 2024, 08:42:14 PMSinn Fein - Economy, Education, Communities
DUP - Finance, Health
Alliance - Justice, Agriculture
Not sure who is left for Infrastructure
GRMA
a call has been put put to set up road blocks to block the mlas going into stormont tommorow
Quote from: johnnycool on February 02, 2024, 11:04:38 AMQuote from: Rossfan on February 02, 2024, 10:34:31 AMHow many thousand turned up at the Binlid/Angry Jim shindig?
Shinners obviously want to get the feet under the Executive table so are keeping mum.
50 odd in in Moygashel...
It seems Moygashel and Markethill are their go to places, not Donaghadee, not East Belfast, not Larne.
I find that quite strange.
As for SF, each and every representative interviewed from now on should make it abundantly clear they striving for a UI and fúck Unionist sensitivities.
Insecure unionist areas , as they feel they're under siege being near all those pesky taigs in south Armagh and east Tyrone , so they have to be more bitter and twisted.
Quote from: JPGJOHNNYG on February 02, 2024, 11:19:19 AMQuote from: tbrick18 on February 02, 2024, 11:12:52 AMQuote from: johnnycool on February 02, 2024, 11:04:38 AMQuote from: Rossfan on February 02, 2024, 10:34:31 AMHow many thousand turned up at the Binlid/Angry Jim shindig?
Shinners obviously want to get the feet under the Executive table so are keeping mum.
50 odd in in Moygashel...
It seems Moygashel and Markethill are their go to places, not Donaghadee, not East Belfast, not Larne.
I find that quite strange.
As for SF, each and every representative interviewed from now on should make it abundantly clear they striving for a UI and fúck Unionist sensitivities.
Having first hand experience of Moygashel, it's right up the Bryson/Allister street.
Bigots and racists. If you're non-loyalist, if you're non-white, if you're a foreign national....you'll get burned out of moygashel.
In terms of SF - I don't think they need to draw attention to the one sidedness of the agreement between dup and WM. I think now, when they are in the ascendancy with the electorate, the demographics are going in one direction they need to make some good progress for all people in NI before the next election. Then, when election mode is on and from that point on they have the referenceability of governing for all and so the UI can be called for to benefit all.
What ever people think of SF, they have been running rings around the unionist parties for well over a decade in terms of politics.
"Non-white", saw pictures of some Asian lad stood next to big Jim at the meeting he must have gotten lost ;D .Reminds me of that famous Muslim rangers lad who then joined the EDL you couldn't make it up
Maybe he was waiting on someone paying him for delivering a Chinese takeaway to the meeting?
UUP confirm they're going into the Executive. They'll get the 5th choice of ministry. SDLP will be in opposition.
Quote from: Pub Bore on February 02, 2024, 04:54:56 PMUUP confirm they're going into the Executive. They'll get the 5th choice of ministry. SDLP will be in opposition.
Couldn't begrudge Swann a run at the health ministry. I genuinely thought he gave it a good go during covid.
Donaldson well fit for Nolan this morning, not often you see a local politician sitting an a show like that for an hour.
Why won't one of the big two take Health ?
Quote from: Kidder81 on February 02, 2024, 06:12:10 PMDonaldson well fit for Nolan this morning, not often you see a local politician sitting an a show like that for an hour.
Why won't one of the big two take Health ?
Because the changes needed to make it sustainable (Bengoa) are not politically ideal. Everyone wants a hospital in their doorstep, which just isn't feasible and closing hospitals or centralising healthcare isn't exactly a vote winner.
Agree on Donaldson, he was excellent and corrected Nolan several times. Also enjoyed his takedown of Brysons commissioned "legal opinion". Its basically comprised of carefully crafted questions to give the impression it backs up their point of view.
Quote from: Kidder81 on February 02, 2024, 06:12:10 PMDonaldson well fit for Nolan this morning, not often you see a local politician sitting an a show like that for an hour.
Why won't one of the big two take Health ?
You simply can't win with Health due to the structural problems. It is probably at the stage where it can't be fixed.
Quote from: Tony Baloney on February 02, 2024, 08:34:01 PMQuote from: Kidder81 on February 02, 2024, 06:12:10 PMDonaldson well fit for Nolan this morning, not often you see a local politician sitting an a show like that for an hour.
Why won't one of the big two take Health ?
You simply can't win with Health due to the structural problems. It is probably at the stage where it can't be fixed.
The 26 county regime have thrown lots of money at health, and still the likes of Limerick hospital is a danger to health. Whoever is in Stormont will have to fix it without much money to add and if anyone can do that then they will raise my opinion of NI politicians.
Jeffrey has got away with it so far, but there is no question the Irish Sea border remains.
Everyone's a winner I suppose.
Excuse my understanding here but how does Bryson get so much access. Like he strolls around political events flanked by people who were actually voted in.
Like how can a blogger get into Stormont, etc?
I think Jamie gets a bad press. He is smarter than a lot of politicians and we talk about his tweets more than anyone else. He's also good looking and can handle himself in the ring.
Like him or loathe him, and I prefer the latter, you have to give wee Jeff some level of credit for his performance over the last week. He has played a blinder one way or another. I really can't believe he has managed to move the masses so quickly with seemingly a very minimal level of fuss.
Also, has Ian Og not been remarkably quiet?
Quote from: Olly on February 02, 2024, 11:37:22 PMI think Jamie gets a bad press. He is smarter than a lot of politicians and we talk about his tweets more than anyone else. He's also good looking and can handle himself in the ring.
You may be taking the piss but sadly there are politicians there he is smarter than particularly the one who was feeding him info as he will probably finish them!
Quote from: podge on February 02, 2024, 11:47:58 PMLike him or loathe him, and I prefer the latter, you have to give wee Jeff some level of credit for his performance over the last week. He has played a blinder one way or another. I really can't believe he has managed to move the masses so quickly with seemingly a very minimal level of fuss.
Also, has Ian Og not been remarkably quiet?
Quickly? :o
Quote from: Sportacus on February 02, 2024, 10:35:27 PMJeffrey has got away with it so far, but there is no question the Irish Sea border remains.
Everyone's a winner I suppose.
Jeffrey has seen some common sense and realised that he was going to have to compromise. Hard to know if he truly believed they were going to get everything they wanted or was he just holding out for a some what acceptable deal.
The likes of Bryson, Allister etc... aren't stupid either. They know this deal is as good as they are going to get. They plain and simple don't want a SF FM. This is just a smoke screen.
Is there any word of roads being blocked? I drove from Crossmaglen to Newry this morning and the road was clear, apart from a herd of cattle at Mullaghban
Quote from: Dougal Maguire on February 03, 2024, 01:35:41 PMIs there any word of roads being blocked? I drove from Crossmaglen to Newry this morning and the road was clear, apart from a herd of cattle at Mullaghban
Rumours of worried sheep around Fords cross as well but maybe they're gone now!
I took a little detour to see if Justy McNulty was at home but he wasn't. Mind you there was no indication as to whether he had headed North or South
Quote from: Ghost on February 03, 2024, 12:51:58 PMQuote from: Sportacus on February 02, 2024, 10:35:27 PMJeffrey has got away with it so far, but there is no question the Irish Sea border remains.
Everyone's a winner I suppose.
Jeffrey has seen some common sense and realised that he was going to have to compromise. Hard to know if he truly believed they were going to get everything they wanted or was he just holding out for a some what acceptable deal.
The likes of Bryson, Allister etc... aren't stupid either. They know this deal is as good as they are going to get. They plain and simple don't want a SF FM. This is just a smoke screen.
I hadn't actually heard this said until the other day. Jim Allister said Jeffrey has sold out and allowed Michelle O'Neill become first minister, and he was clearly pissed about it.
Just heard Pengelly say she was honoured to be first ministers along with MON. She couldn't bear to say a Republican was first minister, but that they were both FM's.
Technically they are the same role, but the title says different
Quote from: Dougal Maguire on February 03, 2024, 01:43:44 PMI took a little detour to see if Justy McNulty was at home but he wasn't. Mind you there was no indication as to whether he had headed North or South
He was at Stormont in an earlier picture I seen. Anyone in Laois have a helicopter he could borrow to get him to the match later?
Can't see him getting to Wexford for 6.
McNulty getting another touch now on TV. He's going to have to make a decision one way or another.
Even when Stormont wasn't sitting , I'm sure he Was under pressure from some of his constituents about his two roles.
SDLP have a dilemma - if they withdraw the whip may choose to be an independent MLA.
Maybe Justin could stand in Laois at next General Election and take the seat of the retiring Charlie Flanagan.
Regardless of what's going on in Stormont, Saturday should normally be the busiest day of the week for a Parliamentarian as that's the day they deal with constituency matters. I was in Newry last Saturday and his office was closed. Not a good message for his constituents
Personally I think the gaa makes him a more recognised person and am sure he doing as much if not more than 50% of people at stormont. As for his office not open, u really want go there,as there a few I see not doing any business on Saturday.
Quote from: AustinPowers on February 03, 2024, 03:28:44 PMMcNulty getting another touch now on TV. He's going to have to make a decision one way or another.
Even when Stormont wasn't sitting , I'm sure he Was under pressure from some of his constituents about his two roles.
And proper order too. The two jobs are not compatible. The SDLP and Justin need to made a choice.
Quote from: Dougal Maguire on February 03, 2024, 03:32:36 PMRegardless of what's going on in Stormont, Saturday should normally be the busiest day of the week for a Parliamentarian as that's the day they deal with constituency matters. I was in Newry last Saturday and his office was closed. Not a good message for his constituents
Does Mickey Brady open on a Saturday?
Quote from: The Boy Wonder on February 03, 2024, 03:32:07 PMSDLP have a dilemma - if they withdraw the whip may choose to be an independent MLA.
Maybe Justin could stand in Laois at next General Election and take the seat of the retiring Charlie Flanagan.
He would likely continue to sit as an independent until the next election if the SDLP withdraw the whip. That said, he doesn't have a huge profile despite being an MLA for quite a few years now. The SDLP never put him forward for TV interviews or anything of that nature.
If he does sit as an independent until that election he wouldn't retain his seat, the SDLP would take it from him when the time comes, or unionists would benefit from a split vote between him and the SDLP.
Quote from: Tony Baloney on February 03, 2024, 04:08:22 PMQuote from: Dougal Maguire on February 03, 2024, 03:32:36 PMRegardless of what's going on in Stormont, Saturday should normally be the busiest day of the week for a Parliamentarian as that's the day they deal with constituency matters. I was in Newry last Saturday and his office was closed. Not a good message for his constituents
Does Mickey Brady open on a Saturday?
Friday would historically be the constituency day for MLA's and MP's as most parliamentary business takes place from a Monday-Thursday.
Quote from: Tony Baloney on February 03, 2024, 04:08:22 PMQuote from: Dougal Maguire on February 03, 2024, 03:32:36 PMRegardless of what's going on in Stormont, Saturday should normally be the busiest day of the week for a Parliamentarian as that's the day they deal with constituency matters. I was in Newry last Saturday and his office was closed. Not a good message for his constituents
Does Mickey Brady open on a Saturday?
Absolutely. The SF constituency office is a hive of activity on a Saturday
I have had to contact my local councillors and MLA a few times over the years and have never had to set foot in their offices. It's not the 1980s. They are all easily contactable
First time Finance not picked first ?
Now the dust has settled and whether you believe it or not, everyone needs to subtly maintain the narrative that the DUP sold out and there still is an Irish Sea border. Time to twist the knife ;D
Quote from: thebigfella on February 03, 2024, 05:09:22 PMNow the dust has settled and whether you believe it or not, everyone needs to subtly maintain the narrative that the DUP sold out and there still is an Irish Sea border. Time to twist the knife ;D
Caught about half of this earlier.. Paul Givan laying into Red Jim and Red Jim laying into Pengelly was great TV
Quote from: Deerstalker on February 03, 2024, 04:41:42 PMFirst time Finance not picked first ?
The Finance person I have never heard of. In a normal government finance is serious post, with an experienced person. In NI, SF seem to think ministries should be shuffled around for some other objective other than experience.
Quote from: armaghniac on February 03, 2024, 05:43:42 PMQuote from: Deerstalker on February 03, 2024, 04:41:42 PMFirst time Finance not picked first ?
The Finance person I have never heard of. In a normal government finance is serious post, with an experienced person. In NI, SF seem to think ministries should be shuffled around for some other objective other than experience.
None of them are qualified for any of it. It's just jobs for the lads.
If I got enough votes , even though I'm not qualified/experienced, could I get the Laois job? (Well, they're going to need somebody soon ).
Quote from: AustinPowers on February 03, 2024, 06:45:31 PMQuote from: armaghniac on February 03, 2024, 05:43:42 PMQuote from: Deerstalker on February 03, 2024, 04:41:42 PMFirst time Finance not picked first ?
The Finance person I have never heard of. In a normal government finance is serious post, with an experienced person. In NI, SF seem to think ministries should be shuffled around for some other objective other than experience.
None of them are qualified for any of it. It's just jobs for the lads.
If I got enough votes , even though I'm not qualified/experienced, could I get the Laois job? (Well, they're going to need somebody soon ).
Exactly. Does anyone actually think these lads or the likes of Carla Lockhart in the Commons are actually reading out their own words?! They are blow-up dolls with the smart people sitting in offices behind the scenes.
nothern ireland politics is all about connections and who you know and who you brown nose suppose lots of world politics is like that.
Quote from: ranch on February 03, 2024, 04:10:16 PMQuote from: The Boy Wonder on February 03, 2024, 03:32:07 PMSDLP have a dilemma - if they withdraw the whip may choose to be an independent MLA.
Maybe Justin could stand in Laois at next General Election and take the seat of the retiring Charlie Flanagan.
He would likely continue to sit as an independent until the next election if the SDLP withdraw the whip. That said, he doesn't have a huge profile despite being an MLA for quite a few years now. The SDLP never put him forward for TV interviews or anything of that nature.
If he does sit as an independent until that election he wouldn't retain his seat, the SDLP would take it from him when the time comes, or unionists would benefit from a split vote between him and the SDLP.
He must have notions about himself. If he can't do the job because he has to be in Laois then hand it back.
Quote from: Eire90 on February 03, 2024, 07:04:17 PMnothern ireland politics is all about connections and who you know and who you brown nose suppose lots of world politics is like that.
Just like office politics
Quote from: armaghniac on February 03, 2024, 05:43:42 PMQuote from: Deerstalker on February 03, 2024, 04:41:42 PMFirst time Finance not picked first ?
The Finance person I have never heard of. In a normal government finance is serious post, with an experienced person. In NI, SF seem to think ministries should be shuffled around for some other objective other than experience.
Caoimhe Archibald has a PhD, had a high profile in previous finance committee and was a regular in the media
PhD in what excately?
Quote from: armaghniac on February 03, 2024, 05:43:42 PMQuote from: Deerstalker on February 03, 2024, 04:41:42 PMFirst time Finance not picked first ?
The Finance person I have never heard of. In a normal government finance is serious post, with an experienced person. In NI, SF seem to think ministries should be shuffled around for some other objective other than experience.
In a normal country the person in charge of Finance is a groupthinker who follows the rules and never thinks. Every so often the shit hits the fan and he or she has no idea what to do.
Paschal is probably going to emulate Brian Cowen in the next 18 months
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CREDXtbfnb0
Quote from: Eire90 on February 03, 2024, 07:04:17 PMnothern ireland politics is all about connections and who you know and who you brown nose suppose lots of world politics is like that.
I presume you're from the 26 counties?
And you make that statement with no hint of irony.
Sure that is politics. Difference in north is you can make it through nailing colours to whatever mast.
Quote from: Eire90 on February 03, 2024, 07:04:17 PMnothern ireland politics is all about connections and who you know and who you brown nose suppose lots of world politics is like that.
Thank God that doesn't happen in the the republic or anywhere else.
Quotethe unelected bridesmaid as deputy
Had to laugh at that line from Allister.
Justin McNulty suspended by SDLP
Quote from: Nanderson on February 03, 2024, 10:14:38 PMJustin McNulty suspended by SDLP
Interesting to see which of his two jobs pays more and he keeps doing.
Quote from: SaffronSports on February 03, 2024, 11:02:08 PMQuote from: Nanderson on February 03, 2024, 10:14:38 PMJustin McNulty suspended by SDLP
Interesting to see which of his two jobs pays more and he keeps doing.
I would say Laois pays more
Quote from: clarshack on February 03, 2024, 11:20:26 PMQuote from: Nanderson on February 03, 2024, 10:14:38 PMJustin McNulty suspended by SDLP
Suspended without pay?
They probably can't withhold his pay as his wage will come from public money. If it's unresolved he could still be an independent MLA or join another party until the next election anyway.
Quote from: clarshack on February 03, 2024, 11:20:26 PMQuote from: Nanderson on February 03, 2024, 10:14:38 PMJustin McNulty suspended by SDLP
Suspended without pay?
The SDLP do not pay him, I expect, so they can hardly suspend his pay.
Quote from: SaffronSports on February 03, 2024, 11:28:51 PMQuote from: clarshack on February 03, 2024, 11:20:26 PMQuote from: Nanderson on February 03, 2024, 10:14:38 PMJustin McNulty suspended by SDLP
Suspended without pay?
They probably can't withhold his pay as his wage will come from public money. If it's unresolved he could still be an independent MLA or join another party until the next election anyway.
He's dead in the water as a politician.
He blocked a mate on fb at the height of the Covid shenanigans. Who had the last laugh now Justin eh?!
(I jest, my friend is a cockwomble and deserved it)
So the spongers in the north go back to work after a 2 year holiday and this is news???
They even managed to vote in a deputy prime minister of their wee country who didn't even stand for election
The fact a county manager treats it with such contempt speaks volumes ;D
Quote from: Mikhail Prokhorov on February 04, 2024, 12:16:31 AMSo the spongers in the north go back to work after a 2 year holiday and this is news???
They even managed to vote in a deputy prime minister of their wee country who didn't even stand for election
The fact a county manager treats it with such contempt speaks volumes ;D
That's not the term she used.
When others called her deputy though , she looked mighty miffed
Quote from: AustinPowers on February 04, 2024, 12:26:21 AMQuote from: Mikhail Prokhorov on February 04, 2024, 12:16:31 AMSo the spongers in the north go back to work after a 2 year holiday and this is news???
They even managed to vote in a deputy prime minister of their wee country who didn't even stand for election
The fact a county manager treats it with such contempt speaks volumes ;D
That's not the term she used.
When others called her deputy though , she looked mighty miffed
Well her own party referred to it as Deputy FM in their socials so....
It's actually brilliant watching the DUP'ers squirm.
Think Allisters head might actually explode.
I like Jim when you hear him talk it makes me feel we have gone back to the eighties ;D
Yer man McNulty was taking the piss. I know he probably didn't think it was starting up again so soon but it ain't a good look being a part time mla when the ones do it full time are pretty f**king useless, wants his cake and eat it.
Quote from: Armagh18 on February 04, 2024, 08:18:58 AMIt's actually brilliant watching the DUP'ers squirm.
Think Allisters head might actually explode.
A big thing for me is seeing them on the opposite sides of the chamber now. It's the optics of it.
This must really really hurt unionists. Seeing the little guys on their side of the chamber now.
McNulty has had the SDLP whip suspended but he can continue as an independent. The only way SDLP can do anything is if he resigns his seat and they co-opt someone on. If that happened it would likely be Pete Byrne. Problem they have is McNulty is very popular and is a 'figure'. They have died a complete death in south Armagh and south down and he is hanging them in there. Byrne is a much more competent operator and is the better person to be there but he doesn't have the profile. McNulty's father is old school SDLP and was at the forefront with Seamus Mallon from the very start so his son has a lot of wriggle room
Quote from: brokencrossbar1 on February 04, 2024, 09:33:44 AMMcNulty has had the SDLP whip suspended but he can continue as an independent. The only way SDLP can do anything is if he resigns his seat and they co-opt someone on. If that happened it would likely be Pete Byrne. Problem they have is McNulty is very popular and is a 'figure'. They have died a complete death in south Armagh and south down and he is hanging them in there. Byrne is a much more competent operator and is the better person to be there but he doesn't have the profile. McNulty's father is old school SDLP and was at the forefront with Seamus Mallon from the very start so his son has a lot of wriggle room
I think he's showing a bit of contempt to be honest. His predecessors, Seamus Mallon for example, worked day and night to represent their constituents and to stand up to discrimination. They didn't make those sacrifices so that today's representatives can complacently dip in and dip out when it suits. He should choose one and drop the other.
Quote from: SaffronSports on February 03, 2024, 11:28:51 PMQuote from: clarshack on February 03, 2024, 11:20:26 PMQuote from: Nanderson on February 03, 2024, 10:14:38 PMJustin McNulty suspended by SDLP
Suspended without pay?
They probably can't withhold his pay as his wage will come from public money. If it's unresolved he could still be an independent MLA or join another party until the next election anyway.
Independent or not, still would be impossible to find the time to be a county manager as well.
Thought it was harsh to be honest. The timetable clash only came about mid week when the DUP agreed to the deal, there was nothing he could have done. I thought the SDLP would have gave him a weeks grace to quit Laois but maybe he's made it clear he intended to continue with both? I don't think that's sustainable either.
Always thought he'd have put politics first when push came to shove just for financial reasons but frig knows what Laois are paying him...
Bad optics and nothing more. Won't see Stormont on a Saturday or Sunday for a long time. If it wasn't for knee jerks you'd see no movement from the SDLP
McNulty managing Laois was discussed on political programs when he took the role a few months back . The SDLP has had plenty of time to deal with it .
Regardless of the time needed for him to sit in Stormont (how often do they sit really?), he still has to represent the people of his constituency, and he could hardly have been doing that well, while he's been trekking to Laois 3-4 nights a week
Quote from: clarshack on February 04, 2024, 11:39:58 AMQuote from: SaffronSports on February 03, 2024, 11:28:51 PMQuote from: clarshack on February 03, 2024, 11:20:26 PMQuote from: Nanderson on February 03, 2024, 10:14:38 PMJustin McNulty suspended by SDLP
Suspended without pay?
They probably can't withhold his pay as his wage will come from public money. If it's unresolved he could still be an independent MLA or join another party until the next election anyway.
Independent or not, still would be impossible to find the time to be a county manager as well.
Yeah they're both jobs that wouldn't be your conventional 9-5 or 40 hours per week. Technically if Laois were happy enough he could carry on with both but you'd be guaranteed he wouldn't get re-elected.
Quote from: RedHand88 on February 04, 2024, 12:41:10 PMThought it was harsh to be honest. The timetable clash only came about mid week when the DUP agreed to the deal, there was nothing he could have done. I thought the SDLP would have gave him a weeks grace to quit Laois but maybe he's made it clear he intended to continue with both? I don't think that's sustainable either.
Always thought he'd have put politics first when push came to shove just for financial reasons but frig knows what Laois are paying him...
£55k plus about £100k in expenses, allowances etc. for a few years is hard to turn your back on, especially if you've got the missus in as "staff".
Quote from: SaffronSports on February 04, 2024, 01:06:29 PMQuote from: clarshack on February 04, 2024, 11:39:58 AMQuote from: SaffronSports on February 03, 2024, 11:28:51 PMQuote from: clarshack on February 03, 2024, 11:20:26 PMQuote from: Nanderson on February 03, 2024, 10:14:38 PMJustin McNulty suspended by SDLP
Suspended without pay?
They probably can't withhold his pay as his wage will come from public money. If it's unresolved he could still be an independent MLA or join another party until the next election anyway.
Independent or not, still would be impossible to find the time to be a county manager as well.
Yeah they're both jobs that wouldn't be your conventional 9-5 or 40 hours per week. Technically if Laois were happy enough he could carry on with both but you'd be guaranteed he wouldn't get re-elected.
I wouldn't vote for him anyway but really wouldn't bother me if a politician took that job on.
Quote from: AustinPowers on February 04, 2024, 12:57:00 PMMcNulty managing Laois was discussed on political programs when he took the role a few months back . The SDLP has had plenty of time to deal with it .
Regardless of the time needed for him to sit in Stormont (how often do they sit really?), he still has to represent the people of his constituency, and he could hardly have been doing that well, while he's been trekking to Laois 3-4 nights a week
He obviously didn't think the DUP would cave so early
One of the reasons that loyalists are so poor is the UK tendency to shaft the losers of economic change instead of supporting them
This a strong argument for reunification
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nairn-Anderson_thesis
The Nairn-Anderson thesis is a theory of British economic and political decline developed in the 1960s and 1970s by political theorist Tom Nairn and historian Perry Anderson.[1][2]
The thesis suggests that Britain's early development into a capitalist society was so successful that it failed to overturn archaic social structures and institutions like the power of the aristocracy. By contrast, continental European states like Germany introduced efficient administrations and educational systems as part of a "second" bourgeois revolution. The result for Britain, wrote Anderson, is that "the triumphs of the past become the bane of the present."[3]
The thesis was first developed in a series of essays in The New Left Review[4] and is cited today in discussions of Britain's post-Imperial decline and "dysfunctional" institutions.[
Quote from: Armagh18 on February 04, 2024, 01:34:03 PMQuote from: SaffronSports on February 04, 2024, 01:06:29 PMQuote from: clarshack on February 04, 2024, 11:39:58 AMQuote from: SaffronSports on February 03, 2024, 11:28:51 PMQuote from: clarshack on February 03, 2024, 11:20:26 PMQuote from: Nanderson on February 03, 2024, 10:14:38 PMJustin McNulty suspended by SDLP
Suspended without pay?
They probably can't withhold his pay as his wage will come from public money. If it's unresolved he could still be an independent MLA or join another party until the next election anyway.
Independent or not, still would be impossible to find the time to be a county manager as well.
Yeah they're both jobs that wouldn't be your conventional 9-5 or 40 hours per week. Technically if Laois were happy enough he could carry on with both but you'd be guaranteed he wouldn't get re-elected.
I wouldn't vote for him anyway but really wouldn't bother me if a politician took that job on.
I just don't think the two jobs are compatible for one man. Something like teaching, you know your hours and you're not working at the weekend. As an MLA, Stormont can run late into the evening, you'll have committees that you're on, you have loads of constituency issues to deal with. I don't feel it would be possible to do both to the best of your ability.
Enough of this nonsense about double jobbing. Surely a politician is entitled to some downtime to pursue his other interests and hobbies. What's wrong with managing an amateur GAA team on a Saturday evening or indeed a Sunday ? Yes, there's also a couple of evenings training during the week involving a bit of travel. And all for a few bob to put diesel in the car and some tea and sandwiches. Greater love hath no man for the GAA.
Bad misstep from Justin, on a day of major historical importance within the statelet, the political junket is also potentially a more long term lucrative role, wrong on all fronts
But you no problem DUP not working for 2 yrs, but all cheer because they bck allowing Michelle O'Neil to be first minister
Quote from: Wildweasel74 on February 04, 2024, 05:56:01 PMBut you no problem DUP not working for 2 yrs, but all cheer because they bck allowing Michelle O'Neil to be first minister
Tell me ya scundered without telling me ya scundered
McNulty has just about enough intelligence not to eat himself
What's this even doing on DUP thread?
So he took a helicopter to the Laois game & is considering legal action against SDLP :D
County management is a full time role so I'm not sure how the 2 jobs can be reconciled. Add in the 10 or so hours travel and I'm not sure how anyone could expect to deliver as both a county manager and MLA. I remember listening to Oisin McConville and Davy Burke at the end of last year saying how county management was so mentally draining and all consuming so I don't know how he can expect to do both jobs to the level required. I think he should pick one and the county managers job is certain to be the more lucrative!
If Geezer was working as an MLA I can only imagine the criticism he would be getting.
Idiotic by McNulty. First day back at Stormont and the SDLP lose an MLA and a UUP MLA has a go at party colleague Robin Swann!
Quote from: Pub Bore on February 05, 2024, 10:31:00 AMIdiotic by McNulty. First day back at Stormont and the SDLP lose an MLA and a UUP MLA has a go at party colleague Robin Swann!
He's right about Swann, just using the Health post as a shop window to try and get into Westminster
Quote from: RedHand88 on February 02, 2024, 06:35:38 PMQuote from: Kidder81 on February 02, 2024, 06:12:10 PMDonaldson well fit for Nolan this morning, not often you see a local politician sitting an a show like that for an hour.
Why won't one of the big two take Health ?
Because the changes needed to make it sustainable (Bengoa) are not politically ideal. Everyone wants a hospital in their doorstep, which just isn't feasible and closing hospitals or centralising healthcare isn't exactly a vote winner.
Agree on Donaldson, he was excellent and corrected Nolan several times. Also enjoyed his takedown of Brysons commissioned "legal opinion". Its basically comprised of carefully crafted questions to give the impression it backs up their point of view.
The internal mechanisms within Stormont make in almost impossible to enact something as foundational as the Bengoa report.
It would be a huge drain on the budget initially and that would mean other departments headed up by members of other parties losing out and the political fallout from that would mean it just wouldn't happen.
Quote from: Kidder81 on February 05, 2024, 10:37:41 AMQuote from: Pub Bore on February 05, 2024, 10:31:00 AMIdiotic by McNulty. First day back at Stormont and the SDLP lose an MLA and a UUP MLA has a go at party colleague Robin Swann!
He's right about Swann, just using the Health post as a shop window to try and get into Westminster
Westminster is more lucrative and it definitely looks like Swann has his sights set there. The expenses and perks far outweigh anything Stormont can provide.
Quote from: yellowcard on February 05, 2024, 10:41:49 AMQuote from: Kidder81 on February 05, 2024, 10:37:41 AMQuote from: Pub Bore on February 05, 2024, 10:31:00 AMIdiotic by McNulty. First day back at Stormont and the SDLP lose an MLA and a UUP MLA has a go at party colleague Robin Swann!
He's right about Swann, just using the Health post as a shop window to try and get into Westminster
Westminster is more lucrative and it definitely looks like Swann has his sights set there. The expenses and perks far outweigh anything Stormont can provide.
And much less hassle
Quote from: yellowcard on February 05, 2024, 10:07:28 AMCounty management is a full time role so I'm not sure how the 2 jobs can be reconciled. Add in the 10 or so hours travel and I'm not sure how anyone could expect to deliver as both a county manager and MLA. I remember listening to Oisin McConville and Davy Burke at the end of last year saying how county management was so mentally draining and all consuming so I don't know how he can expect to do both jobs to the level required. I think he should pick one and the county managers job is certain to be the more lucrative!
If Geezer was working as an MLA I can only imagine the criticism he would be getting.
Maybe in the short term but long term he would have pension etc to consider
Quote from: Pub Bore on February 05, 2024, 10:31:00 AMIdiotic by McNulty. First day back at Stormont and the SDLP lose an MLA and a UUP MLA has a go at party colleague Robin Swann!
Did no-one in the SDLP catch on that there was a clash and have a word with the man? It was even mentioned on this forum on Thursday. It seems like poor communication all round.
Quote from: lurganblue on February 05, 2024, 10:47:34 AMQuote from: Pub Bore on February 05, 2024, 10:31:00 AMIdiotic by McNulty. First day back at Stormont and the SDLP lose an MLA and a UUP MLA has a go at party colleague Robin Swann!
Did no-one in the SDLP catch on that there was a clash and have a word with the man? It was even mentioned on this forum on Thursday. It seems like poor communication all round.
They did. I think Justy is being pig headed about it and refusing to even discuss it. It's been poorly handled but McNulty hasn't been overly cooperative.
Quote from: trailer on February 05, 2024, 11:10:44 AMQuote from: lurganblue on February 05, 2024, 10:47:34 AMQuote from: Pub Bore on February 05, 2024, 10:31:00 AMIdiotic by McNulty. First day back at Stormont and the SDLP lose an MLA and a UUP MLA has a go at party colleague Robin Swann!
Did no-one in the SDLP catch on that there was a clash and have a word with the man? It was even mentioned on this forum on Thursday. It seems like poor communication all round.
They did. I think Justy is being pig headed about it and refusing to even discuss it. It's been poorly handled but McNulty hasn't been overly cooperative.
Wouldn't be like him.
Quote from: yellowcard on February 05, 2024, 10:41:49 AMQuote from: Kidder81 on February 05, 2024, 10:37:41 AMQuote from: Pub Bore on February 05, 2024, 10:31:00 AMIdiotic by McNulty. First day back at Stormont and the SDLP lose an MLA and a UUP MLA has a go at party colleague Robin Swann!
He's right about Swann, just using the Health post as a shop window to try and get into Westminster
Westminster is more lucrative and it definitely looks like Swann has his sights set there. The expenses and perks far outweigh anything Stormont can provide.
Would he run in NA against Ian Óg?
Quote from: trailer on February 05, 2024, 11:10:44 AMQuote from: lurganblue on February 05, 2024, 10:47:34 AMQuote from: Pub Bore on February 05, 2024, 10:31:00 AMIdiotic by McNulty. First day back at Stormont and the SDLP lose an MLA and a UUP MLA has a go at party colleague Robin Swann!
Did no-one in the SDLP catch on that there was a clash and have a word with the man? It was even mentioned on this forum on Thursday. It seems like poor communication all round.
They did. I think Justy is being pig headed about it and refusing to even discuss it. It's been poorly handled but McNulty hasn't been overly cooperative.
That lad O'Toole annoys me.
Always seems to have a head cold when talking. >:(
Quote from: marty34 on February 05, 2024, 11:38:22 AMQuote from: yellowcard on February 05, 2024, 10:41:49 AMQuote from: Kidder81 on February 05, 2024, 10:37:41 AMQuote from: Pub Bore on February 05, 2024, 10:31:00 AMIdiotic by McNulty. First day back at Stormont and the SDLP lose an MLA and a UUP MLA has a go at party colleague Robin Swann!
He's right about Swann, just using the Health post as a shop window to try and get into Westminster
Westminster is more lucrative and it definitely looks like Swann has his sights set there. The expenses and perks far outweigh anything Stormont can provide.
Would he run in NA against Ian Óg?
I was going to post, what would a man of his age be bothered with going to Westminster, then I checked that he's my age!! Is he old or do we always look at ourselves as being a lot younger lol
Quote from: marty34 on February 05, 2024, 11:38:22 AMQuote from: yellowcard on February 05, 2024, 10:41:49 AMQuote from: Kidder81 on February 05, 2024, 10:37:41 AMQuote from: Pub Bore on February 05, 2024, 10:31:00 AMIdiotic by McNulty. First day back at Stormont and the SDLP lose an MLA and a UUP MLA has a go at party colleague Robin Swann!
He's right about Swann, just using the Health post as a shop window to try and get into Westminster
Westminster is more lucrative and it definitely looks like Swann has his sights set there. The expenses and perks far outweigh anything Stormont can provide.
Would he run in NA against Ian Óg?
He has done so in the past and never really laid a glove on him.
That seat is really a safe seat for the DUP and has been this years. Ian Og at this stage can do and say anything he likes and still get in. It's not he's adding any value to anyone's life.
There is a big risk that for ideological reasons the DUP will close down the option of using EU market access to drive investment and grow the North's economy.
Jim Allister now claiming that Poots wanted to deck him after the Stormont sitting on Saturday. It's a circus on the hill.
Quote from: yellowcard on February 05, 2024, 12:29:19 PMJim Allister now claiming that Poots wanted to deck him after the Stormont sitting on Saturday. It's a circus on the hill.
Was there a queue?
Quote from: Pub Bore on February 05, 2024, 10:31:00 AMIdiotic by McNulty. First day back at Stormont and the SDLP lose an MLA and a UUP MLA has a go at party colleague Robin Swann!
Who had a go at Swann?
Quote from: yellowcard on February 05, 2024, 12:29:19 PMJim Allister now claiming that Poots wanted to deck him after the Stormont sitting on Saturday. It's a circus on the hill.
Oh yes, the big impartial speaker was on saying that he couldnt respond to Jim but if he could have, he would have had his clock cleaned ;D
Quote from: lurganblue on February 05, 2024, 10:47:34 AMQuote from: Pub Bore on February 05, 2024, 10:31:00 AMIdiotic by McNulty. First day back at Stormont and the SDLP lose an MLA and a UUP MLA has a go at party colleague Robin Swann!
Did no-one in the SDLP catch on that there was a clash and have a word with the man? It was even mentioned on this forum on Thursday. It seems like poor communication all round.
OToole was on the View on Thursday night and when he was asked about McNulty he said that McNulty was expected to be at Stormont etc.
You could tell OToole wasnt happy that McNulty was double jobbing so this was on the cards if McNulty went to the game
Quote from: lurganblue on February 05, 2024, 12:53:38 PMQuote from: yellowcard on February 05, 2024, 12:29:19 PMJim Allister now claiming that Poots wanted to deck him after the Stormont sitting on Saturday. It's a circus on the hill.
Oh yes, the big impartial speaker was on saying that he couldnt respond to Jim but if he could have, he would have had his clock cleaned ;D
I heard that this morning.
Surely he should be banned from being the speaker if he uses language like that.
I thought you had to be very neutral as regards being the speaker.
Can Mc Nulty just declare as an independent then and go it alone until the next election?
In fairness, being a county manager is a full time job. Far harder if there is a lot of travel time involved also.
Ideal job for a teacher. 9:00 - 4:00pm. And off during the summer.
Quote from: marty34 on February 05, 2024, 01:06:42 PMCan Mc Nulty just declare as an independent then and go it alone until the next election?
In fairness, being a county manager is a full time job. Far harder if there is a lot of travel time involved also.
Ideal job for a teacher. 9:00 - 4:00pm. And off during the summer.
It's not officially though. It's an amateur sport with volunteers and everyone is entitled to do what they want in their own time.
No idea what the contracted hours of an MLA are, but I suspect in terms of employment there is nothing can be done.
Personally, I think the SDLP have become largely irrelevant. How effective is going into opposition in NI under current structures. It's a shame really, as it narrows the voting alternatives for nationalists.
Quote from: tbrick18 on February 05, 2024, 01:18:47 PMQuote from: marty34 on February 05, 2024, 01:06:42 PMCan Mc Nulty just declare as an independent then and go it alone until the next election?
In fairness, being a county manager is a full time job. Far harder if there is a lot of travel time involved also.
Ideal job for a teacher. 9:00 - 4:00pm. And off during the summer.
It's not officially though. It's an amateur sport with volunteers and everyone is entitled to do what they want in their own time.
No idea what the contracted hours of an MLA are, but I suspect in terms of employment there is nothing can be done.
Personally, I think the SDLP have become largely irrelevant. How effective is going into opposition in NI under current structures. It's a shame really, as it narrows the voting alternatives for nationalists.
Fair enough but it (an inter-county manager) is a full time job. Serious hours involved in organising etc.
You're not going to get an inter-county manager doing 10 hours a week. Never.
Quote from: marty34 on February 05, 2024, 01:06:42 PMCan Mc Nulty just declare as an independent then and go it alone until the next election?
In fairness, being a county manager is a full time job. Far harder if there is a lot of travel time involved also.
Ideal job for a teacher. 9:00 - 4:00pm. And off during the summer.
Yes, it is the individual who is elected, not the party.
Quote from: Dougal Maguire on February 05, 2024, 12:38:12 PMQuote from: Pub Bore on February 05, 2024, 10:31:00 AMIdiotic by McNulty. First day back at Stormont and the SDLP lose an MLA and a UUP MLA has a go at party colleague Robin Swann!
Who had a go at Swann?
Andy Allen criticised his decision to stand for Westminster
and become a minister in the Executive.
Apparently Colum Eastwood wasn't there either. Not a good from the SDLP.
Quote from: general_lee on February 05, 2024, 01:42:54 PMApparently Colum Eastwood wasn't there either. Not a good from the SDLP.
He's an MP not an MLA. He's been quoted as saying he didn't want to steal O'Toole's thunder.
Quote from: Pub Bore on February 05, 2024, 01:27:33 PMQuote from: Dougal Maguire on February 05, 2024, 12:38:12 PMQuote from: Pub Bore on February 05, 2024, 10:31:00 AMIdiotic by McNulty. First day back at Stormont and the SDLP lose an MLA and a UUP MLA has a go at party colleague Robin Swann!
Who had a go at Swann?
Andy Allen criticised his decision to stand for Westminster and become a minister in the Executive.
Apparently UUP now discussing Swann not running for Westminster. Major f**k up as Swann was actually moving to run in a UUP target seat.
Quote from: Dougal Maguire on February 03, 2024, 03:32:36 PMRegardless of what's going on in Stormont, Saturday should normally be the busiest day of the week for a Parliamentarian as that's the day they deal with constituency matters. I was in Newry last Saturday and his office was closed. Not a good message for his constituents
Actually Friday is designated for constituency matters, Stormont doesn't sit, save for exceptional circumstances.
I agree that Friday is a day for consistency matters, dealing with local correspondence but Saturday is normally the day that they run their constituency surgeries in order to facilitate people who are working
Quote from: Dougal Maguire on February 05, 2024, 02:22:30 PMI agree that Friday is a day for consistency matters, dealing with local correspondence but Saturday is normally the day that they run their constituency surgeries in order to facilitate people who are working
Email or any electronic channels not reached Armagh yet ?
Quote from: Kidder81 on February 05, 2024, 02:38:30 PMQuote from: Dougal Maguire on February 05, 2024, 02:22:30 PMI agree that Friday is a day for consistency matters, dealing with local correspondence but Saturday is normally the day that they run their constituency surgeries in order to facilitate people who are working
Email or any electronic channels not reached Armagh yet ?
😂In the vast majority of cases people with an issue like to discuss it face to face
Quote from: Pub Bore on February 05, 2024, 01:52:36 PMQuote from: Pub Bore on February 05, 2024, 01:27:33 PMQuote from: Dougal Maguire on February 05, 2024, 12:38:12 PMQuote from: Pub Bore on February 05, 2024, 10:31:00 AMIdiotic by McNulty. First day back at Stormont and the SDLP lose an MLA and a UUP MLA has a go at party colleague Robin Swann!
Who had a go at Swann?
Andy Allen criticised his decision to stand for Westminster and become a minister in the Executive.
Apparently UUP now discussing Swann not running for Westminster. Major f**k up as Swann was actually moving to run in a UUP target seat.
Swann would likely win that seat too as he would get a lot of tactical anti DUP votes
Re unelected Little-Pengelly as deputy first minister, is that because no elected DUP assembly member would want to be seen to be inferior to a fenian?
Quote from: Main Street on February 05, 2024, 04:49:04 PMRe unelected Little-Pengelly as deputy first minister, is that because no elected DUP assembly member would want to be seen to be inferior to a fenian?
Susan McKay touches on this the last few days and adds in a bit of misogyny for good measure, but I think it's her loyalty to wee Jeffrey is probably the biggest reason as it looks like he can't trust too many in that party, MLA's or MP's.
Quote from: Main Street on February 05, 2024, 04:49:04 PMRe unelected Little-Pengelly as deputy first minister, is that because no elected DUP assembly member would want to be seen to be inferior to a fenian?
Don't know. But what really fucks me off about her elevation to DFM is that she sat in the BBC studio at the time of the Assembly results and stated that she didn't speak for the DUP nor was she a member of the DUP. Not one week later she was co-opted in. It is that out and out bullshit that she and others spout that gets on my goat.
Besides all that she probably did zero canvassing in LV for JD when he was running. She continues to fail upwards. I think she won one election in her life and now she holds the highest political office in NI.
If parties are going to continue with this then a list of who will be co-opted needs to be published at the time of nominations.
Quote from: johnnycool on February 05, 2024, 04:55:17 PMQuote from: Main Street on February 05, 2024, 04:49:04 PMRe unelected Little-Pengelly as deputy first minister, is that because no elected DUP assembly member would want to be seen to be inferior to a fenian?
Susan McKay touches on this the last few days and adds in a bit of misogyny for good measure, but I think it's her loyalty to wee Jeffrey is probably the biggest reason as it looks like he can't trust too many in that party, MLA's or MP's.
Not all criticism of women is misogyny. That fucks me off as well. Women hold the highest political office and I am ok with that. But they aren't above scrutiny.
I see their king has had some bad news.
Quote from: trailer on February 05, 2024, 05:13:38 PMQuote from: Main Street on February 05, 2024, 04:49:04 PMRe unelected Little-Pengelly as deputy first minister, is that because no elected DUP assembly member would want to be seen to be inferior to a fenian?
Don't know. But what really fucks me off about her elevation to DFM is that she sat in the BBC studio at the time of the Assembly results and stated that she didn't speak for the DUP nor was she a member of the DUP. Not one week later she was co-opted in. It is that out and out bullshit that she and others spout that gets on my goat.
Besides all that she probably did zero canvassing in LV for JD when he was running. She continues to fail upwards. I think she won one election in her life and now she holds the highest political office in NI.
If parties are going to continue with this then a list of who will be co-opted needs to be published at the time of nominations.
The list would be too long
Quote from: trailer on February 05, 2024, 05:15:51 PMQuote from: johnnycool on February 05, 2024, 04:55:17 PMQuote from: Main Street on February 05, 2024, 04:49:04 PMRe unelected Little-Pengelly as deputy first minister, is that because no elected DUP assembly member would want to be seen to be inferior to a fenian?
Susan McKay touches on this the last few days and adds in a bit of misogyny for good measure, but I think it's her loyalty to wee Jeffrey is probably the biggest reason as it looks like he can't trust too many in that party, MLA's or MP's.
Not all criticism of women is misogyny. That fucks me off as well. Women hold the highest political office and I am ok with that. But they aren't above scrutiny.
I'd agree with you on that point, but the misogyny thing was in relation to the male members of the DUP not wanting to be subservient or seen to be subservient to Michelle O'Neill in this "deputy" role.
All alleged obviously.
Quote from: trailer on February 05, 2024, 05:13:38 PMQuote from: Main Street on February 05, 2024, 04:49:04 PMRe unelected Little-Pengelly as deputy first minister, is that because no elected DUP assembly member would want to be seen to be inferior to a fenian?
Don't know. But what really fucks me off about her elevation to DFM is that she sat in the BBC studio at the time of the Assembly results and stated that she didn't speak for the DUP nor was she a member of the DUP. Not one week later she was co-opted in. It is that out and out bullshit that she and others spout that gets on my goat.
Besides all that she probably did zero canvassing in LV for JD when he was running. She continues to fail upwards. I think she won one election in her life and now she holds the highest political office in NI.
If parties are going to continue with this then a list of who will be co-opted needs to be published at the time of nominations.
Not often I'd agree with you Trailer, but nail on the head here.
There might also be an unspoken reluctance in DUP to have a man serving as deputy to a woman.
And I'd expect too that certain senior DUP figures would not want to be in the position of implementing the protocol.
Can you imagine Sammy Wilson as deputy? Or Gregory?
The DUP are short on credible candidates...even in NI terms.
Absolutely no way there was going to be a male DUP deputy FM. They needed someone high enough profile and the likes of Paul Givan or Gordon Lyons would not even consider it. The imagery of having a man 'subservient' to a woman would not sit well with them
Technically they were all subservient to Arlene not so long ago? A republican woman is a different kettle altogether.
DUP have put a woman in so none of the men had to play second fiddle
Also as it gives them the progressive optic - woman heading up a lead role
They've also deliberately put ELP forward despite being unelected specifically as a f**k you to Nationalists and to try and cheapen/dilute the achievement
At the end of the day they took the soup, and they will continue to do so as they only thing they care about is their own salaries, expenses and getting re-elected to stay on the gravy train
Their lack of real leadership, plan and the unionist brain drain will be their downfall
Quote from: tiempo on February 06, 2024, 11:53:02 AMDUP have put a woman in so none of the men had to play second fiddle
Also as it gives them the progressive optic - woman heading up a lead role
They've also deliberately put ELP forward despite being unelected specifically as a f**k you to Nationalists and to try and cheapen/dilute the achievement
At the end of the day they took the soup, and they will continue to do so as they only thing they care about is their own salaries, expenses and getting re-elected to stay on the gravy train
Their lack of real leadership, plan and the unionist brain drain will be their downfall
Hard to argue with any of that, but what is their strategy for the next election or do they not think that far ahead?
ELP has proven unelectable in the past, so chances of her getting in through a vote are slim enough.
Quote from: tiempo on February 06, 2024, 11:53:02 AMDUP have put a woman in so none of the men had to play second fiddle
Also as it gives them the progressive optic - woman heading up a lead role
They've also deliberately put ELP forward despite being unelected specifically as a f**k you to Nationalists and to try and cheapen/dilute the achievement
At the end of the day they took the soup, and they will continue to do so as they only thing they care about is their own salaries, expenses and getting re-elected to stay on the gravy train
Their lack of real leadership, plan and the unionist brain drain will be their downfall
100% nail on the head!
Quote from: balladmaker on February 06, 2024, 12:12:54 PMQuote from: tiempo on February 06, 2024, 11:53:02 AMDUP have put a woman in so none of the men had to play second fiddle
Also as it gives them the progressive optic - woman heading up a lead role
They've also deliberately put ELP forward despite being unelected specifically as a f**k you to Nationalists and to try and cheapen/dilute the achievement
At the end of the day they took the soup, and they will continue to do so as they only thing they care about is their own salaries, expenses and getting re-elected to stay on the gravy train
Their lack of real leadership, plan and the unionist brain drain will be their downfall
100% nail on the head!
Surely that will backfire with ELP having no real creditability at the elections and with such a seasoned campaigner like MON that she will wipe the floor with her?
I wouldn't have ELP down as a door mat either, and she could surely see through the "lets put a woman" in there attitude (which I don't think it is)
I'd say they'll stick ELP in a safe seat to get her over the line.
Plus this will help her raise her profile.
Quote from: tiempo on February 06, 2024, 11:53:02 AMDUP have put a woman in so none of the men had to play second fiddle
Also as it gives them the progressive optic - woman heading up a lead role
They've also deliberately put ELP forward despite being unelected specifically as a f**k you to Nationalists and to try and cheapen/dilute the achievement
At the end of the day they took the soup, and they will continue to do so as they only thing they care about is their own salaries, expenses and getting re-elected to stay on the gravy train
Their lack of real leadership, plan and the unionist brain drain will be their downfall
Yep x 100
Quote from: NAG1 on February 06, 2024, 12:01:30 PMQuote from: tiempo on February 06, 2024, 11:53:02 AMDUP have put a woman in so none of the men had to play second fiddle
Also as it gives them the progressive optic - woman heading up a lead role
They've also deliberately put ELP forward despite being unelected specifically as a f**k you to Nationalists and to try and cheapen/dilute the achievement
At the end of the day they took the soup, and they will continue to do so as they only thing they care about is their own salaries, expenses and getting re-elected to stay on the gravy train
Their lack of real leadership, plan and the unionist brain drain will be their downfall
Hard to argue with any of that, but what is their strategy for the next election or do they not think that far ahead?
ELP has proven unelectable in the past, so chances of her getting in through a vote are slim enough.
I think you know the answer to that already. It seems that for a long time now they are only capable of thinking about a day in advance. Hence the mess they made of Brexit and everything else since. And it is glorious to watch.
Quote from: NAG1 on February 06, 2024, 12:01:30 PMHard to argue with any of that, but what is their strategy for the next election or do they not think that far ahead?
ELP has proven unelectable in the past, so chances of her getting in through a vote are slim enough.
Bogeyman bogeyman bogeyman
Quote from: marty34 on February 06, 2024, 12:28:04 PMI'd say they'll stick ELP in a safe seat to get her over the line.
Plus this will help her raise her profile.
Poots will go at the end of the term and she'll be back to the safe DUP South Belfast seat.
Wonder how long will DUPUDA stay in?
https://m.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/northern-ireland/rumblings-within-dup-continue-as-emma-little-pengelly-defends-return-to-stormont/a1889379380.html
There seems be a real effort by the DUP lately
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-68490776.amp
My flabber is gasted!
You can see a wee bit of a shift now with them. Jeffrey's speech etc said it. To preserve the "union" they'll need to appease more than DUP voters. Question is will this lose them voters in the process.
I do expect them to revert back to the norm at some point...
Quote from: armaghniac on March 06, 2024, 02:13:05 PMThere seems be a real effort by the DUP lately
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-68490776.amp
Maybe the penny has finally dropped that in order to try and stop the runaway train that is a United Ireland , unionism needs to make NI appealing to nationalists . I doubt it though
Quote from: imtommygunn on March 06, 2024, 02:22:43 PMYou can see a wee bit of a shift now with them. Jeffrey's speech etc said it. To preserve the "union" they'll need to appease more than DUP voters. Question is will this lose them voters in the process.
I do expect them to revert back to the norm at some point...
Robinson came out with the same sort of talk back in the day.
Then Belfast City Council stopped flying the Butcher's apron...........
Quote from: AustinPowers on March 06, 2024, 04:04:28 PMQuote from: armaghniac on March 06, 2024, 02:13:05 PMThere seems be a real effort by the DUP lately
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-68490776.amp
Maybe the penny has finally dropped that in order to try and stop the runaway train that is a United Ireland , unionism needs to make NI appealing to nationalists . I doubt it though
Can't see it unfortunately. And the reason is that making NI appealing to a nationalist will automatically make it unappealing to some unionists who see every grain of equality as a stripping of their Britishness. It's a zero sum game.
Big day for the DUP yesterday. Givan speaking Irish and ELP proving to be better with camog than Michelle. It was nice to see.
Someone better tell Paul Givan that the Waves of Tory doesn't mean the number of Prime Ministers brought down by Brexit
This DUP U-turn is astounding given their hardline position up until the beginning of this year. It's fairly clear that they have had a change of strategy and are now almost just stealing the clothes of the UUP. They had to try something different as they were losing votes but I'd imagine there are those within the party who are finding this new version hard to stomach. It will be interesting to see if they gain enough votes towards the middle to counteract the votes that they will lose on the hard right.
Quote from: lurganblue on March 07, 2024, 09:07:13 AMBig day for the DUP yesterday. Givan speaking Irish and ELP proving to be better with camog than Michelle. It was nice to see.
ELP went with the golf grip, either that or she's a cítog.
Michelle lost my vote after that, poor co-ordination altogether!
Quote from: yellowcard on March 07, 2024, 09:54:44 AMThis DUP U-turn is astounding given their hardline position up until the beginning of this year. It's fairly clear that they have had a change of strategy and are now almost just stealing the clothes of the UUP. They had to try something different as they were losing votes but I'd imagine there are those within the party who are finding this new version hard to stomach. It will be interesting to see if they gain enough votes towards the middle to counteract the votes that they will lose on the hard right.
Only thinv is they'll lose vote to the other side, the TUV.
What they gain one way, they'll lose the other way I think.
Quote from: lurganblue on March 07, 2024, 09:07:13 AMBig day for the DUP yesterday. Givan speaking Irish and ELP proving to be better with camog than Michelle. It was nice to see.
A real 'love in' at the minute between DUP and Sinn Fein.
What's next, M O'N to make a guest appearance in Moygashel on the 11th night?
There was an article in the Irish Times recently where Eamonnn Mallie said that Emma Pengelly was more cross-culturally aware than people realise. He said he had created a poetry reading group during COVID and when she was asked to recite, she chose a poem by Eiléan Ní Chuilleanáin. I think Givan was by DUP standards on the more liberal side and left the Free Presbyterian church when they criticised him for attending an ecumenical service. But it's still the party of extremists, a good few of them now sitting in the home for the bewildered called the House of Lords.
DUP
We're reasonable ...
We're reasonable ...
We're reasonable ...
We're reasonable ...
Is it not reasonable to block Casement or if it has to go ahead there needs to be major £££ spaffed in PUL areas for reparations
Thats how i see it
Quote from: weareros on March 07, 2024, 11:50:07 AMThere was an article in the Irish Times recently where Eamonnn Mallie said that Emma Pengelly was more cross-culturally aware than people realise. He said he had created a poetry reading group during COVID and when she was asked to recite, she chose a poem by Eiléan Ní Chuilleanáin. I think Givan was by DUP standards on the more liberal side and left the Free Presbyterian church when they criticised him for attending an ecumenical service.
That would be an ecumenical matter ?
QuoteBut it's still the party of extremists, a good few of them now sitting in the home for the bewildered called the House of Lords.
Couldn't help laughing out loud at that one! ;D
Quote from: LC on March 07, 2024, 10:55:58 AMQuote from: lurganblue on March 07, 2024, 09:07:13 AMBig day for the DUP yesterday. Givan speaking Irish and ELP proving to be better with camog than Michelle. It was nice to see.
A real 'love in' at the minute between DUP and Sinn Fein.
What's next, M O'N to make a guest appearance in Moygashel on the 11th night?
I thought she made an appearance there every year?
Quote from: tiempo on March 07, 2024, 12:02:48 PMDUP
We're reasonable ...
We're reasonable ...
We're reasonable ...
We're reasonable ...
Is it not reasonable to block Casement or if it has to go ahead there needs to be major £££ spaffed in PUL areas for reparations
Thats how i see it
You've got it in one. No such thing as distributing funding on the basis of need rather themmuns got it so we must get it too
Quote from: AustinPowers on March 07, 2024, 12:28:39 PMQuote from: LC on March 07, 2024, 10:55:58 AMQuote from: lurganblue on March 07, 2024, 09:07:13 AMBig day for the DUP yesterday. Givan speaking Irish and ELP proving to be better with camog than Michelle. It was nice to see.
A real 'love in' at the minute between DUP and Sinn Fein.
What's next, M O'N to make a guest appearance in Moygashel on the 11th night?
I thought she made an appearance there every year?
I see what you done there
Can we reword them the stoop Sinn fein party these days lol.
Quote from: Dougal Maguire on March 07, 2024, 01:06:04 PMQuote from: tiempo on March 07, 2024, 12:02:48 PMDUP
We're reasonable ...
We're reasonable ...
We're reasonable ...
We're reasonable ...
Is it not reasonable to block Casement or if it has to go ahead there needs to be major £££ spaffed in PUL areas for reparations
Thats how i see it
You've got it in one. No such thing as distributing funding on the basis of need rather themmuns got it so we must get it too
Indeed
Quote from: Dougal Maguire on February 25, 2024, 02:22:33 AMQuote from: RadioGAAGAA on February 24, 2024, 09:52:28 PMQuote from: Dreadnought on February 23, 2024, 09:45:10 PMAlright then non lunatic. What's your grand plan? Corrigan Park forever?
Already said it many, many times on the thread. But for your benefit.
- Replace the old main stand with a new one, covered seating. All the facilities they could ever want could be placed underneath this as the new structure could be far more significantly hollowed out relative to old, and the back of it could be extended over the road to add further floor space. No big difference to light on houses to the West of Casement as the existing stand already blocks it.
- Stick a roof over the (renewed) terrace on the far side of the pitch. The back end of this structure can hold the badly needed amenities. It'd be relatively low profile though.
- Renew the terraces at both ends of the pitch. Don't cover them. If there is sufficient demand - as determined by polls, one of the ends could be uncovered seats.
Capacity of 30-40k for the one or two times a year it may be needed - which would be during the summer. Comfortably sufficient covered capacity for during the autumn/winter/spring. 3 or 4 significantly different price tiers.
Basically the stadium that the GAA needs at a cost that will benefit all in the long-run.
Instead we're getting an expensive to build, expensive to maintain milestone, which will come with astronomical ticket prices.
But hey - the Ulster Council might be able to hold a few concerts. That's what this is about right? Otherwise it makes no sense to build what they are trying to build.
Great idea. Windsor all covered all seated, Ravenhill something similar. Casement as suggested above. Croppy lie down
Quote from: Shamrock Shore on March 06, 2024, 02:19:41 PMMy flabber is gasted!
I hope that you have recovered enough to face it again
https://twitter.com/BelTel/status/1765816360934740366
(https://pbs.twimg.com/card_img/1765816181657686016/Pj5o3yJo?format=jpg&name=small)
Quote from: Duine Inteacht Eile on March 07, 2024, 07:15:11 PMQuote from: Dougal Maguire on March 07, 2024, 01:06:04 PMQuote from: tiempo on March 07, 2024, 12:02:48 PMDUP
We're reasonable ...
We're reasonable ...
We're reasonable ...
We're reasonable ...
Is it not reasonable to block Casement or if it has to go ahead there needs to be major £££ spaffed in PUL areas for reparations
Thats how i see it
You've got it in one. No such thing as distributing funding on the basis of need rather themmuns got it so we must get it too
Indeed
Quote from: Dougal Maguire on February 25, 2024, 02:22:33 AMQuote from: RadioGAAGAA on February 24, 2024, 09:52:28 PMQuote from: Dreadnought on February 23, 2024, 09:45:10 PMAlright then non lunatic. What's your grand plan? Corrigan Park forever?
Already said it many, many times on the thread. But for your benefit.
- Replace the old main stand with a new one, covered seating. All the facilities they could ever want could be placed underneath this as the new structure could be far more significantly hollowed out relative to old, and the back of it could be extended over the road to add further floor space. No big difference to light on houses to the West of Casement as the existing stand already blocks it.
- Stick a roof over the (renewed) terrace on the far side of the pitch. The back end of this structure can hold the badly needed amenities. It'd be relatively low profile though.
- Renew the terraces at both ends of the pitch. Don't cover them. If there is sufficient demand - as determined by polls, one of the ends could be uncovered seats.
Capacity of 30-40k for the one or two times a year it may be needed - which would be during the summer. Comfortably sufficient covered capacity for during the autumn/winter/spring. 3 or 4 significantly different price tiers.
Basically the stadium that the GAA needs at a cost that will benefit all in the long-run.
Instead we're getting an expensive to build, expensive to maintain milestone, which will come with astronomical ticket prices.
But hey - the Ulster Council might be able to hold a few concerts. That's what this is about right? Otherwise it makes no sense to build what they are trying to build.
Great idea. Windsor all covered all seated, Ravenhill something similar. Casement as suggested above. Croppy lie down
Windsor and Ravenhill all seated and covered as that's what the need is now to meet supporter's requirements. Casements supporters have the same requirements
Quote from: Dougal Maguire on March 07, 2024, 11:30:16 PMQuote from: Duine Inteacht Eile on March 07, 2024, 07:15:11 PMQuote from: Dougal Maguire on March 07, 2024, 01:06:04 PMQuote from: tiempo on March 07, 2024, 12:02:48 PMDUP
We're reasonable ...
We're reasonable ...
We're reasonable ...
We're reasonable ...
Is it not reasonable to block Casement or if it has to go ahead there needs to be major £££ spaffed in PUL areas for reparations
Thats how i see it
You've got it in one. No such thing as distributing funding on the basis of need rather themmuns got it so we must get it too
Indeed
Quote from: Dougal Maguire on February 25, 2024, 02:22:33 AMQuote from: RadioGAAGAA on February 24, 2024, 09:52:28 PMQuote from: Dreadnought on February 23, 2024, 09:45:10 PMAlright then non lunatic. What's your grand plan? Corrigan Park forever?
Already said it many, many times on the thread. But for your benefit.
- Replace the old main stand with a new one, covered seating. All the facilities they could ever want could be placed underneath this as the new structure could be far more significantly hollowed out relative to old, and the back of it could be extended over the road to add further floor space. No big difference to light on houses to the West of Casement as the existing stand already blocks it.
- Stick a roof over the (renewed) terrace on the far side of the pitch. The back end of this structure can hold the badly needed amenities. It'd be relatively low profile though.
- Renew the terraces at both ends of the pitch. Don't cover them. If there is sufficient demand - as determined by polls, one of the ends could be uncovered seats.
Capacity of 30-40k for the one or two times a year it may be needed - which would be during the summer. Comfortably sufficient covered capacity for during the autumn/winter/spring. 3 or 4 significantly different price tiers.
Basically the stadium that the GAA needs at a cost that will benefit all in the long-run.
Instead we're getting an expensive to build, expensive to maintain milestone, which will come with astronomical ticket prices.
But hey - the Ulster Council might be able to hold a few concerts. That's what this is about right? Otherwise it makes no sense to build what they are trying to build.
Great idea. Windsor all covered all seated, Ravenhill something similar. Casement as suggested above. Croppy lie down
Windsor and Ravenhill all seated and covered as that's what the need is now to meet supporter's requirements. Casements supporters have the same requirements
I see Glentoran boss out in big support of getting Casement built so it could host the 'Big 2' matches ;D
That reminds me of the old joke about 2050 cup final result:
Linfield 2-11 Glentoran 3-6
My spidey senses tell me there's pockets getting lined to incentivize these recent pr initiatives. Just so out of character for the likes of Poots for it to feel real real
Paul Givan IRA
Emma Little Pengelly IRA
Edwin Poots IRA
Hats off to the DUP. They are playing a blinder. No missteps at all.
Deal is done, wait and see the investment in the Shankhill over the next 12 months in an education hub linked to Ulster University. People are meeting with loyalist groups to get them on board. This is all about hearts and minds, making unionist 'Irish' the norm so that the younger generation don't see any difference when the border is gone.
Quote from: trailer on March 08, 2024, 10:41:02 AMPaul Givan IRA
Emma Little Pengelly IRA
Edwin Poots IRA
Hats off to the DUP. They are playing a blinder. No missteps at all.
Preparing the path to an All Ireland outcome.....
Quote from: brokencrossbar1 on March 08, 2024, 11:51:57 AMDeal is done, wait and see the investment in the Shankhill over the next 12 months in an education hub linked to Ulster University. People are meeting with loyalist groups to get them on board. This is all about hearts and minds, making unionist 'Irish' the norm so that the younger generation don't see any difference when the border is gone.
If that was the case that kids from those deprived backgrounds were getting a help out and a sight of a different future from building bonfires and looking up to drug dealers driving X5's then I'd have no qualms about that.
Getting loyalist groups onboard normally means greasing a few palms
Quote from: theskull1 on March 08, 2024, 10:07:42 AMMy spidey senses tell me there's pockets getting lined to incentivize these recent pr initiatives. Just so out of character for the likes of Poots for it to feel real real
I'm getting quite uncomfortable about it, it's so out of character of the DUP I'm wondering if they've been hit by a collective bolt of lightning of the road to
Damascus Ballymoney!
Quote from: johnnycool on March 08, 2024, 01:38:54 PMQuote from: brokencrossbar1 on March 08, 2024, 11:51:57 AMDeal is done, wait and see the investment in the Shankhill over the next 12 months in an education hub linked to Ulster University. People are meeting with loyalist groups to get them on board. This is all about hearts and minds, making unionist 'Irish' the norm so that the younger generation don't see any difference when the border is gone.
If that was the case that kids from those deprived backgrounds were getting a help out and a sight of a different future from building bonfires and looking up to drug dealers driving X5's then I'd have no qualms about that.
Getting loyalist groups onboard normally means greasing a few palms
Make no mistake about it JC, it still means exactly the same. There are very few 'structures' within the loyalist communities to invest in. This money will be filtered through these communities and end up in the same hands as all the other monies have.
All we are doing is making consultants and gate keepers richer than they already are.
Quote from: johnnycool on March 08, 2024, 02:18:19 PMQuote from: theskull1 on March 08, 2024, 10:07:42 AMMy spidey senses tell me there's pockets getting lined to incentivize these recent pr initiatives. Just so out of character for the likes of Poots for it to feel real real
I'm getting quite uncomfortable about it, it's so out of character of the DUP I'm wondering if they've been hit by a collective bolt of lightning of the road to Damascus Ballymoney!
This is a leap year isn't it? Ah well , that explains everything ......
Quote from: theskull1 on March 08, 2024, 10:07:42 AMMy spidey senses tell me there's pockets getting lined to incentivize these recent pr initiatives. Just so out of character for the likes of Poots for it to feel real real
Red white and blue or green, white and gold our local politicians soon throw their principles out the window when it comes to the £££.
It's ok - Paul Girvan has things back to normal and is mingling with binlid and saying he will oppose the sea border.
Quote from: imtommygunn on March 09, 2024, 08:30:56 AMIt's ok - Paul Girvan has things back to normal and is mingling with binlid and saying he will oppose the sea border.
Was getting worried there for a while!
Quote from: AustinPowers on March 08, 2024, 11:51:20 PMQuote from: johnnycool on March 08, 2024, 02:18:19 PMQuote from: theskull1 on March 08, 2024, 10:07:42 AMMy spidey senses tell me there's pockets getting lined to incentivize these recent pr initiatives. Just so out of character for the likes of Poots for it to feel real real
I'm getting quite uncomfortable about it, it's so out of character of the DUP I'm wondering if they've been hit by a collective bolt of lightning of the road to Damascus Ballymoney!
This is a leap year isn't it? Ah well , that explains everything ......
Think you've just won post of the year!
Quote from: Dougal Maguire on March 07, 2024, 11:30:16 PMWindsor and Ravenhill all seated and covered as that's what the need is now to meet supporter's requirements. Casements supporters have the same requirements
Interesting that you ignored this (http://gaaboard.com/board/index.php?msg=2256811) post made in response to the quoted and several days before you posted the above.
Quote from: RadioGAAGAA on February 25, 2024, 09:44:33 AMQuote from: Dougal Maguire on February 25, 2024, 02:22:33 AMGreat idea. Windsor all covered all seated, Ravenhill something similar. Casement as suggested above. Croppy lie down
Something similar to all-covered all-seated... except of course Ravenhill has 3 sides covered seats, 1 side partially-covered terrace and 3 sides uncovered terrace. ???
Quote from: RadioGAAGAA on March 09, 2024, 09:57:44 AMQuote from: Dougal Maguire on March 07, 2024, 11:30:16 PMWindsor and Ravenhill all seated and covered as that's what the need is now to meet supporter's requirements. Casements supporters have the same requirements
Interesting that you ignored this (http://gaaboard.com/board/index.php?msg=2256811) post made in response to the quoted and several days before you posted the above.
Quote from: RadioGAAGAA on February 25, 2024, 09:44:33 AMQuote from: Dougal Maguire on February 25, 2024, 02:22:33 AMGreat idea. Windsor all covered all seated, Ravenhill something similar. Casement as suggested above. Croppy lie down
Something similar to all-covered all-seated... except of course Ravenhill has 3 sides covered seats, 1 side partially-covered terrace and 3 sides uncovered terrace. ???
To be honest, looking at the date and time, I obviously had a few pints in me when I posted that. You're right in that Something along the lines of Ravenhill would be sufficient although it wouldn't win any design awards.
I wonder if the brits were worried that their new Extremism definition might include the Orange Order?
probably not as orange order are seen as conservative types
will the irsp be classed as as extremists now as they have the word socialists in their name.
Quote from: Eire90 on March 14, 2024, 05:17:55 PMprobably not as orange order are seen as conservative types
will the irsp be classed as as extremists now as they have the word socialists in their name.
Are they still going?
well their military wing is suppose to be officially gone but the irsp are active in strabane derry belfast dublin
No doubt making a very positive contribution to their communities............
Quote from: LC on March 14, 2024, 07:30:41 PMNo doubt making a very positive contribution to their communities............
As with any organisation it has its bad eggs (IRSP has more than most tbf) but they have a few hard working and respected activists in Derry
I see the DUP leadership are currently in America.
You'd wonder what the boycott was all about in regards to the sea border. Nothing has changed.
I wonder will they lose votes to the TUV or will things just move on?
Quote from: Brendan on March 14, 2024, 08:49:38 PMQuote from: LC on March 14, 2024, 07:30:41 PMNo doubt making a very positive contribution to their communities............
As with any organisation it has its bad eggs (IRSP has more than most tbf) but they have a few hard working and respected activists in Derry
In terms of few they must be in the 'count with one hand territory'. Most of whom I have heard of / have come across would not have a proper day job (heaven forbid), instead of the they are on the community worker gravy train. In relation to being 'respected' well lets just say they are not sort of people you would want to fall out with.
https://www.reddit.com/r/northernireland/s/lrHzpvYI4f (https://www.reddit.com/r/northernireland/s/lrHzpvYI4f)
There are too many catholics in my uni class. What do I do?
How dare those Catholics try to get educated.
Quote from: Armagh18 on March 16, 2024, 09:41:19 AMHow dare those Catholics try to get educated.
And worse succeed in getting educated and taking our jobs......
Next thing "they'll be running our (sic) Country(sic)"
It gets worse for Jim and Co....
(Apologies for the source)
https://m.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/northern-ireland/figures-reveal-scale-of-post-windsor-framework-checks-on-goods-entering-ni-from-gb/a699851418.html
Quote from: Armagh18 on March 16, 2024, 09:41:19 AMHow dare those Catholics try to get educated.
And wear GAA tops to lecturers.....
Snarlene telling anyone who will listen that it's "better together". No, not an all-Ireland or European Union 😐
Allister talking through his hole. He was the only Prod in his Queens law class in...1974?
Quote from: gallsman on March 16, 2024, 02:26:24 PMAllister talking through his hole. He was the only Prod in his Queens law class in...1974?
And if he was whose fault is that?
Them pesky Fenians again. How dare they get educated to try and fight their way out of being treated as second class citizens.
Quote from: gallsman on March 16, 2024, 02:26:24 PMAllister talking through his hole. He was the only Prod in his Queens law class in...1974?
I'm not sure that's what he said.
He said that he was the first person in 10 years from his school, while there were 12 from St Whatever's.
Though I still wouldn't rule out that he was talking through his hole.
He said he was the only one from his school that year to go Queens law (disputed by Reddit contributors) and the insinuation was that pretty much everyone else around him was a taig.
That's not necessarily the insinuation.
The insinuation was that the nationalist community was driving young people towards law in order to take control of the judiciary.
Quote from: Duine Inteacht Eile on March 17, 2024, 07:52:10 AMQuote from: gallsman on March 16, 2024, 02:26:24 PMAllister talking through his hole. He was the only Prod in his Queens law class in...1974?
I'm not sure that's what he said.
He said that he was the first person in 10 years from his school, while there were 12 from St Whatever's.
Though I still wouldn't rule out that he was talking through his hole.
I think it was sectarian loaded message...the class was full of people from St. ....blah, blah blah. He was having a dig I reckon.
Be interesting to hear the full Q & A...if you could call it that.
The young lad in the uni class seemed to be annoyed with all the GAA tops.
Too late.
I think the demographic of the north is only hitting them now.
Too late.
With the DUP 'changing its spots' recently and trying to be all moderate. The penny has finally dropped.
Quote from: Duine Inteacht Eile on March 17, 2024, 07:52:10 AMQuote from: gallsman on March 16, 2024, 02:26:24 PMAllister talking through his hole. He was the only Prod in his Queens law class in...1974?
I'm not sure that's what he said.
He said that he was the first person in 10 years from his school, while there were 12 from St Whatever's.
Though I still wouldn't rule out that he was talking through his hole.
First post underneath the video dispels that myth right away.
Far be it from me, but Bryson was right in his reply (jesus, I can't believe I'm typing this) but continue on with your studies and work for a better future, it's what was driven into us from the 70's on, get an education as you won't be able to walk into a job in the shipyard/Shorts/Civil Service/Peelers like our Protestant neighbours.
Equality can be a bollox when you're used to entitlement.
Jim's bitterness in relation to the current judiciary is great ;D
Yeah but it wasn't driven into people by some army council boy landing round to the house of everyone with kids in them. It was driven into us by our parents. It wasn't some pre planned notion of this will get a united ireland - it was a notion that education will give you better chances in life. These boys seem to think that it was a joined up effort by the entire population. Bonkers.
Quote from: imtommygunn on March 19, 2024, 02:49:17 PMYeah but it wasn't driven into people by some army council boy landing round to the house of everyone with kids in them. It was driven into us by our parents. It wasn't some pre planned notion of this will get a united ireland - it was a notion that education will give you better chances in life. These boys seem to think that it was a joined up effort by the entire population. Bonkers.
Well said.
Quote from: StephenC on March 19, 2024, 03:01:47 PMQuote from: imtommygunn on March 19, 2024, 02:49:17 PMYeah but it wasn't driven into people by some army council boy landing round to the house of everyone with kids in them. It was driven into us by our parents. It wasn't some pre planned notion of this will get a united ireland - it was a notion that education will give you better chances in life. These boys seem to think that it was a joined up effort by the entire population. Bonkers.
Well said.
But that is the absolute perception out there even amongst the non-hardliners, everything was one big conspiracy against them, it was all joined up thinking by those pesky Taigs.
Quote from: NAG1 on March 19, 2024, 03:17:13 PMQuote from: StephenC on March 19, 2024, 03:01:47 PMQuote from: imtommygunn on March 19, 2024, 02:49:17 PMYeah but it wasn't driven into people by some army council boy landing round to the house of everyone with kids in them. It was driven into us by our parents. It wasn't some pre planned notion of this will get a united ireland - it was a notion that education will give you better chances in life. These boys seem to think that it was a joined up effort by the entire population. Bonkers.
Well said.
But that is the absolute perception out there even amongst the non-hardliners, everything was one big conspiracy against them, it was all joined up thinking by those pesky Taigs.
I don't think that's true at all tbh.
Quote from: NAG1 on March 19, 2024, 03:17:13 PMQuote from: StephenC on March 19, 2024, 03:01:47 PMQuote from: imtommygunn on March 19, 2024, 02:49:17 PMYeah but it wasn't driven into people by some army council boy landing round to the house of everyone with kids in them. It was driven into us by our parents. It wasn't some pre planned notion of this will get a united ireland - it was a notion that education will give you better chances in life. These boys seem to think that it was a joined up effort by the entire population. Bonkers.
Well said.
But that is the absolute perception out there even amongst the non-hardliners, everything was one big conspiracy against them, it was all joined up thinking by those pesky Taigs.
Education is much more class orientated within unionism than nationalism and the DUP have never seem to be overly interesting in addressing this.
Tbh there should be phds in this. There was shorts etc etc and walking into jobs with no education while catholics etc had to get educated. That has more or less now stopped so families who would have assumed to basically be on a gravy train without the effort to educate etc now will be no more.
One of the biggest enemies of the "PUL" community is the DUP. It does nothing to lift up people in poor areas etc.
Quote from: imtommygunn on March 19, 2024, 04:17:33 PMTbh there should be phds in this. There was shorts etc etc and walking into jobs with no education while catholics etc had to get educated. That has more or less now stopped so families who would have assumed to basically be on a gravy train without the effort to educate etc now will be no more.
One of the biggest enemies of the "PUL" community is the DUP. It does nothing to lift up people in poor areas etc.
Basically that's what happened to the Shankill. Generations of families were guaranteed a job in the local factories, and across town in the shipyard. They didn't need to worry about education and over several generations the idea of educational attainment died out. When fair employment eventually kicked in they were left floundering.
Quote from: imtommygunn on March 19, 2024, 04:17:33 PMTbh there should be phds in this. There was shorts etc etc and walking into jobs with no education while catholics etc had to get educated. That has more or less now stopped so families who would have assumed to basically be on a gravy train without the effort to educate etc now will be no more.
One of the biggest enemies of the "PUL" community is the DUP. It does nothing to lift up people in poor areas etc.
And why would they as if the locals get "too" educated they might cast their vote elsewhere. The fear of themmuns is a stronger draw in many communities than the draw a better life and getting the f**k out of there.
Quote from: Tony Baloney on March 19, 2024, 04:41:35 PMQuote from: imtommygunn on March 19, 2024, 04:17:33 PMTbh there should be phds in this. There was shorts etc etc and walking into jobs with no education while catholics etc had to get educated. That has more or less now stopped so families who would have assumed to basically be on a gravy train without the effort to educate etc now will be no more.
One of the biggest enemies of the "PUL" community is the DUP. It does nothing to lift up people in poor areas etc.
And why would they as if the locals get "too" educated they might cast their vote elsewhere. The fear of themmuns is a stronger draw in many communities than the draw a better life and getting the f**k out of their.
There is an enormous themmuns factor in the DUP, everything is positioned in opposition to normal Irish people.
Quote from: johnnycool on March 19, 2024, 02:28:12 PMQuote from: Duine Inteacht Eile on March 17, 2024, 07:52:10 AMQuote from: gallsman on March 16, 2024, 02:26:24 PMAllister talking through his hole. He was the only Prod in his Queens law class in...1974?
I'm not sure that's what he said.
He said that he was the first person in 10 years from his school, while there were 12 from St Whatever's.
Though I still wouldn't rule out that he was talking through his hole.
First post underneath the video dispels that myth right away.
Far be it from me, but Bryson was right in his reply (jesus, I can't believe I'm typing this) but continue on with your studies and work for a better future, it's what was driven into us from the 70's on, get an education as you won't be able to walk into a job in the shipyard/Shorts/Civil Service/Peelers like our Protestant neighbours.
Equality can be a bollox when you're used to entitlement.
Jim's bitterness in relation to the current judiciary is great ;D
It says everything when the likes of Jamie and Co are only figuring this out now.
I see that the DUP were playing silly buggers about the EU in the Assembly today. The "honeymoon" did not last long.
It's time for Jamie Bryson to join the TUV and stand for election. But I'd be surprised if he does because he knows that it could spell the end for him.
Quote from: LC on March 19, 2024, 05:06:22 PMQuote from: johnnycool on March 19, 2024, 02:28:12 PMQuote from: Duine Inteacht Eile on March 17, 2024, 07:52:10 AMQuote from: gallsman on March 16, 2024, 02:26:24 PMAllister talking through his hole. He was the only Prod in his Queens law class in...1974?
I'm not sure that's what he said.
He said that he was the first person in 10 years from his school, while there were 12 from St Whatever's.
Though I still wouldn't rule out that he was talking through his hole.
First post underneath the video dispels that myth right away.
Far be it from me, but Bryson was right in his reply (jesus, I can't believe I'm typing this) but continue on with your studies and work for a better future, it's what was driven into us from the 70's on, get an education as you won't be able to walk into a job in the shipyard/Shorts/Civil Service/Peelers like our Protestant neighbours.
Equality can be a bollox when you're used to entitlement.
Jim's bitterness in relation to the current judiciary is great ;D
It says everything when the likes of Jamie and Co are only figuring this out now.
Jamie didn't take his bigotry to task, with him full of resentment and fear (supposedly) being surrounded by GAA shirts at law school. Jamie's message was plough on son to the end, we need bigot lawyers (not lawyers without bigotry).
(https://i0.wp.com/uklawweekly.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/09/Hutz.jpg?fit=500%2C382&ssl=1)
Quote from: Duine Inteacht Eile on March 17, 2024, 07:52:10 AMQuote from: gallsman on March 16, 2024, 02:26:24 PMAllister talking through his hole. He was the only Prod in his Queens law class in...1974?
I'm not sure that's what he said.
He said that he was the first person in 10 years from his school, while there were 12 from St Whatever's.
Though I still wouldn't rule out that he was talking through his hole.
According to Wikipedia he went to Regent House Grammar School, only 1 law student in 10 years seems pretty unlikely.
Quote from: dec on March 19, 2024, 09:26:42 PMQuote from: Duine Inteacht Eile on March 17, 2024, 07:52:10 AMQuote from: gallsman on March 16, 2024, 02:26:24 PMAllister talking through his hole. He was the only Prod in his Queens law class in...1974?
I'm not sure that's what he said.
He said that he was the first person in 10 years from his school, while there were 12 from St Whatever's.
Though I still wouldn't rule out that he was talking through his hole.
According to Wikipedia he went to Regent House Grammar School, only 1 law student in 10 years seems pretty unlikely.
Jim Allister is 70 years of age so I'd be surprised if he was surrounded by nationalists as much as he claims back in the 1970s. It might be different now but I can't imagine the professions were being flooded with nationalists at that stage.
Quote from: dec on March 19, 2024, 09:26:42 PMQuote from: Duine Inteacht Eile on March 17, 2024, 07:52:10 AMQuote from: gallsman on March 16, 2024, 02:26:24 PMAllister talking through his hole. He was the only Prod in his Queens law class in...1974?
I'm not sure that's what he said.
He said that he was the first person in 10 years from his school, while there were 12 from St Whatever's.
Though I still wouldn't rule out that he was talking through his hole.
According to Wikipedia he went to Regent House Grammar School, only 1 law student in 10 years seems pretty unlikely.
Sweet fúck, he's from my part of the world then.
:o
Mutantards always had a bitter element to it in all fairness and the landed gentry around it are no different, they just hide it better but it came out every once in a while.
I see wee Jeffrey appears to have deleted his twitter account.
Meanwhile apropos of nothing.
A husband and wife from Co Down have been charged with a series of historical sexual offences against two children.
The 61-year old male was arrested at his home alongside his wife around 6am on Thursday, March, 28.
https://www.belfastlive.co.uk/news/northern-ireland/husband-wife-co-down-charged-28907532
MSM performing their function this morning it would appear.
:-X
Now do Willie McCrea
Quote from: Harold Disgracey on March 29, 2024, 12:37:25 AMI see wee Jeffrey appears to have deleted his twitter account.
Meanwhile apropos of nothing.
A husband and wife from Co Down have been charged with a series of historical sexual offences against two children.
The 61-year old male was arrested at his home alongside his wife around 6am on Thursday, March, 28.
https://www.belfastlive.co.uk/news/northern-ireland/husband-wife-co-down-charged-28907532
it is probably only a coincidence that according to Wiki Jeffrey is also 61!
Went to his Wikipedia and looked at the revision history
There was an entry added this morning at 07:56:29 stating only that he closed his Twitter and Instagram on March 28th. Exactly one minute later that entry was removed
Nothing at all from the usually very active PSNI Twitter feed and the BBC etc etc!
Quote from: johnnycool on March 29, 2024, 09:42:52 AMNothing at all from the usually very active PSNI Twitter feed and the BBC etc etc!
Tbf it was the lead story on the 9.30 news on bbc radio ulster
Quote from: smort on March 29, 2024, 09:44:20 AMQuote from: johnnycool on March 29, 2024, 09:42:52 AMNothing at all from the usually very active PSNI Twitter feed and the BBC etc etc!
Tbf it was the lead story on the 9.30 news on bbc radio ulster
That would mean having to listen to Nolan and that's not going to happen!
BBC Northern Ireland have a brief report about the charges "Man, 61, charged over non-recent sexual offences"
J Allister was complaining about super injunctions around 12 March seemed rather random at the time but maybe he was hinting at something.
Quote from: johnnycool on March 29, 2024, 09:52:38 AMQuote from: smort on March 29, 2024, 09:44:20 AMQuote from: johnnycool on March 29, 2024, 09:42:52 AMNothing at all from the usually very active PSNI Twitter feed and the BBC etc etc!
Tbf it was the lead story on the 9.30 news on bbc radio ulster
That would mean having to listen to Nolan and that's not going to happen!
I know, tuned in today for the first time in a while. Hoping for a bit of gossip
If, and it's a big if, this is him they'll kick him out and pull down stormont again...
With the Orange Order rejecting the deal this week, then it doesn't augur well.
It's only the 3rd or 4th story now on the 10 o'clock news
Interesting
There's a lot of speculation on this(though there probably is on everything with social media etc these days). Be a bit mad if so.
Quote from: Aaron Boone on March 29, 2024, 10:00:16 AMWith the Orange Order rejecting the deal this week, then it doesn't augur well.
The Orange Order saying NO 😮.
What's new?
Quote from: smort on March 29, 2024, 10:01:57 AMIt's only the 3rd or 4th story now on the 10 o'clock news
Interesting
They are not in court for three and a half weeks, so what could a new bulletin say? The only thing that could appear on the news was a statement that it wasn't him and the lack of that is damning. One wonders what the DUP are at, there must be panic among some there e.g. Pengelly is a Donaldson affiliate and has made a decent effort at her role.
'If' true, will just be another chapter in the eventual demise of their gerrymandered statelet.
Quote from: Rossfan on March 29, 2024, 10:20:16 AMQuote from: Aaron Boone on March 29, 2024, 10:00:16 AMWith the Orange Order rejecting the deal this week, then it doesn't augur well.
The Orange Order saying NO 😮.
What's new?
In a normal society absolutely no one would give a fúck what an organisation like the OO supports or doesn't support.
they will deflect by saying what about the adams family
Quote from: Eire90 on March 29, 2024, 10:43:23 AMthey will deflect by saying what about the adams family
if it were to be him he'll have to be turfed out.
Quote from: Eire90 on March 29, 2024, 10:43:23 AMthey will deflect by saying what about the adams family
Great show. Hasn't dated well
if its him they will turf him out but they will a bit of deflection by talking a adams too its already begun
Quote from: Eire90 on March 29, 2024, 10:54:05 AMif its him they will turf him out but they will a bit of deflection by talking a adams too its already begun
[/quoteQuote from: Eire90 on March 29, 2024, 10:54:05 AMif its him they will turf him out but they will a bit of deflection by talking a adams too its already begun
Not an Adams fan I take it?
;D What gave it away.
Quote from: balladmaker on March 29, 2024, 10:28:48 AM'If' true, will just be another chapter in the eventual demise of their gerrymandered statelet.
I mean never mind the fact that there allegedly seriously sexual crimes against children here, look at the silver lining that it's a leading unionist! How can we take advantage of this from a constitutional perspective?!
Repulsive.
Quote from: gallsman on March 29, 2024, 11:11:07 AMI mean never mind the fact that there allegedly seriously sexual crimes against children here, look at the silver lining that it's a leading unionist! How can we take advantage of this from a constitutional perspective?!
Repulsive.
Maybe its just me but I find that question repulsive :-\
That's my point.
Quote from: gallsman on March 29, 2024, 11:15:40 AMThat's my point.
Thanks for agreeing with me gallsman ;)
..... penny only dropped there now re reading 8)
DavidMcKeown will be on later tonight telling you guys to be "Careful Now"
Quote from: Shamrock Shore on March 29, 2024, 11:24:04 AMQuote from: clarshack on March 29, 2024, 10:47:52 AMwas really hoping it was Varadkar when I heard the rumours about an 'Irish Politician' but will take this one too if it's who people are saying.
Not much going on in your head, is there?
Who else do you hope abuses children?
FFS!
Horrendous.
In terms of the political situation. Bryson and his cronies have gone head first into the "Jeffrey was coerced" narrative... The DUP are facing another huge crisis which which I don't think will have the same outcome as the last.
talks of emergency dup meeting
Quote from: Shamrock Shore on March 29, 2024, 11:24:04 AMNot much going on in your head, is there?
Who else do you hope abuses children?
FFS!
That's not what I meant ffs and you should know that. All I knew at the time was that a politician was to be arrested but didn't know what for. Hopefully whoever it is that was arrested and charged that if they're found guilty they face the full extent of the law. Deleted the original post so that there isn't any confusion.
can the media keep being quiet about it will they have to inform the public of the dup meeting if that is true
You're not allowed to name defendants for Sexual offences in the North.
Quote from: screenexile on March 29, 2024, 12:10:51 PMYou're not allowed to name defendants for Sexual offences in the North.
But we can use full stops, which is mighty
Quote from: theskull1 on March 29, 2024, 11:15:06 AMQuote from: gallsman on March 29, 2024, 11:11:07 AMI mean never mind the fact that there allegedly seriously sexual crimes against children here, look at the silver lining that it's a leading unionist! How can we take advantage of this from a constitutional perspective?!
Repulsive.
Maybe its just me but I find that question repulsive :-\
This type of thing crosses every political and social divide. Yet people pile on to imply some particular propensity among one group or the other or schadenfreude at their discomfort, when really this is everywhere.
So, has the male involved fled across the shuck while the female remains in the home?
Quote from: Eire90 on March 29, 2024, 12:03:26 PMcan the media keep being quiet about it will they have to inform the public of the dup meeting if that is true
It's very prominent on the BBC NI site. 61 year old man, 57 year old woman.
https://bbc.com/news/uk-northern-ireland-68692007
Confirmed as Jeff.
Quote"The Party Chairman has received a letter from Sir Jeffrey Donaldson MP confirming that he has been charged with allegations of an historical nature and indicating that he is stepping down as Leader of the Democratic Unionist Party with immediate effect.
In accordance with the Party Rules, the Party Officers have suspended Mr Donaldson from membership, pending the outcome of a judicial process.
The Party Officers have this morning unanimously appointed Mr Gavin Robinson MP as the Interim Party Leader."
https://mydup.com/news/dup-statement-3
Holy. Christ.
This person of 61 years of age has resigned
Shocking stuff and when the dust settles the question has to be why this is only coming out now for something that the statement claims is of an historical nature.
Quote from: yellowcard on March 29, 2024, 01:08:31 PMShocking stuff and when the dust settles the question has to be why this is only coming out now for something that the statement claims is of an historical nature.
The suggestion is that the victim only spoke out recently.
Quote from: screenexile on March 29, 2024, 12:10:51 PMYou're not allowed to name defendants for Sexual offences in the North.
And nobody gets named until they are charged
A 61 year old County Down man and his wife arrested for historical child sex abuse allegations including rape. And in a completely unrelated story, DUP Leader Jeffrey Donaldson, 61, from County Down, has deleted all his social media. Mad Ted.
Quote from: Saffrongael on March 29, 2024, 01:15:02 PMQuote from: screenexile on March 29, 2024, 12:10:51 PMYou're not allowed to name defendants for Sexual offences in the North.
And nobody gets named until they are charged
The two were charged when the reports came out earlier with no names included.
Just a tad late there Itchy.
This is happening to the sitting DUP leader, and all the while the files of Kincora etc remain closed, protecting others
Bryson making hay.
As Bill Hicks once said, anyone that far to the right is hiding something
Apologies for my tardiness
Quote from: Applesisapples on March 29, 2024, 01:35:48 PMBryson making hay.
Making hay on rape allegations is pretty low, though it is Byrson
Wonder what prominent solicitor would take this on? JF? lol
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on March 29, 2024, 01:41:52 PMWonder what prominent solicitor would take this on? JF? lol
Probably his own solicitor I'd imagine.
Sadly a victim or victims at the heart of it, but the bollix in me is having a laugh at Nolan, no show until Monday morning, he'll be gutted.
Quote from: Applesisapples on March 29, 2024, 01:35:48 PMBryson making hay.
Allister too, although of course he reminded people that there's a family at the centre of this story.
Horrible bastards the pair of them
Anyone who believes the allegations or timing of them are some sort of conspiracy is a lunatic. Donaldson going as leader of DUP gives the brexit fanatics and anti-framework wing another opportunity to swing the DUP in their direction. It benefits those J Bryson is implying have been wronged by forces unknown keeping the allegations quiet and railroading in the safeguarding the union agreement.
Seems likely to prompt another round of inter unionist fighting over who loves the union most.
Quote from: Sportacus on March 29, 2024, 02:00:34 PMSadly a victim or victims at the heart of it, but the bollix in me is having a laugh at Nolan, no show until Monday morning, he'll be gutted.
I don't listen to Nolan, why's the joke on him.
Quote from: north_antrim_hound on March 29, 2024, 02:11:20 PMQuote from: Sportacus on March 29, 2024, 02:00:34 PMSadly a victim or victims at the heart of it, but the bollix in me is having a laugh at Nolan, no show until Monday morning, he'll be gutted.
I don't listen to Nolan, why's the joke on him.
Because he loves to break the big stories and be the main man.
He couldn't lift the lid on it.
Bryson is a bad wee f**ker and Allister is not much better. Two bad people who you would rather would have no public profile whatsoever.
Convenient timing for the hardliners after he agreed to go back in to government.
Quote from: gallsman on March 29, 2024, 02:03:49 PMQuote from: Applesisapples on March 29, 2024, 01:35:48 PMBryson making hay.
Allister too, although of course he reminded people that there's a family at the centre of this story.
Horrible bastards the pair of them
He wasn't too worried about his mate Tweed's family, the rancid wee bastard
Exactly >:( Scum of the earth.
nolan does a show on 5 live friday saturday sunday nights
Big news breaking about the leader of the DUP. Only caught the end of it.
Quote from: Olly on March 29, 2024, 02:45:49 PMBig news breaking about the leader of the DUP. Only caught the end of it.
The end of Jeffrey is his best bit
Quote from: dec on March 29, 2024, 02:14:09 PMConvenient timing for the hardliners after he agreed to go back in to government.
That would be my thinking too.
Might we see Stormont collapse again? I wouldn't be surprised with big Jeff gone., and Robinson now head honcho
In 10 years they have had as leaders;
Ian Paisley
Peter Robinson
Arlene Foster
Edwin Poots
Jeffrey Donaldson
Gavin Robinson
The melt-down continues.
In the words of the late Ian Paisley (senior) ''Where's Jeffrey?''
I wouldn't have much faith in Robinson's ability to keep anything together or lead in any way. A human burger.
Quote from: From the Bunker on March 29, 2024, 03:16:08 PMIn 10 years they have had as leaders;
Ian Paisley
Peter Robinson
Arlene Foster
Edwin Poots
Jeffrey Donaldson
Gavin Robinson
The melt-down continues.
In the words of the late Ian Paisley (senior) ''Where's Jeffrey?''
Its a poisoned chalice for whoever steps in next as well. They will have to appoint a leader soon as there are elections coming up in the next year. I don't see too many who would be queuing up to get the job with all of the issues that they have to deal with.
Quote from: yellowcard on March 29, 2024, 03:19:43 PMQuote from: From the Bunker on March 29, 2024, 03:16:08 PMIn 10 years they have had as leaders;
Ian Paisley
Peter Robinson
Arlene Foster
Edwin Poots
Jeffrey Donaldson
Gavin Robinson
The melt-down continues.
In the words of the late Ian Paisley (senior) ''Where's Jeffrey?''
Its a poisoned chalice for whoever steps in next as well. They will have to appoint a leader soon as there are elections coming up in the next year. I don't see too many who would be queuing up to get the job with all of the issues that they have to deal with.
Maybe the unelected Emma Little-Pengelly could be leader? Sure she is Deputy First Minister? For a Party who were very worried about Mandates in the 70's and 80's, they sure let their own moral hardline slip when it came to their own.
Quote from: yellowcard on March 29, 2024, 03:19:43 PMQuote from: From the Bunker on March 29, 2024, 03:16:08 PMIn 10 years they have had as leaders;
Ian Paisley
Peter Robinson
Arlene Foster
Edwin Poots
Jeffrey Donaldson
Gavin Robinson
The melt-down continues.
In the words of the late Ian Paisley (senior) ''Where's Jeffrey?''
Its a poisoned chalice for whoever steps in next as well. They will have to appoint a leader soon as there are elections coming up in the next year. I don't see too many who would be queuing up to get the job with all of the issues that they have to deal with.
According to Alex Kane on RTE they can't risk a poisonous pro/anti Deal row in an election so Gavin whashisname will be appointed leader.
Quote from: Itchy on March 29, 2024, 01:36:44 PMAs Bill Hicks once said, anyone that far to the right is hiding something
Apologies for my tardiness
Christopher Hitchens:
Whenever I hear some bigmouth in Washington or the Christian heartland banging on about the evils of sodomy or whatever, I mentally enter his name in my notebook and contentedly set my watch. Sooner rather than later, he will be discovered down on his weary and well-worn old knees in some dreary motel or latrine, with an expired Visa card, having tried to pay well over the odds to be peed upon by some Apache transvestite.
Quote from: AustinPowers on March 29, 2024, 03:10:30 PMQuote from: dec on March 29, 2024, 02:14:09 PMConvenient timing for the hardliners after he agreed to go back in to government.
That would be my thinking too.
Might we see Stormont collapse again? I wouldn't be surprised with big Jeff gone., and Robinson now head honcho
Alex Kane was talking about negotiations for a single Unionist porty. Any more detail on that ?
Quote from: seafoid on March 29, 2024, 03:36:45 PMQuote from: AustinPowers on March 29, 2024, 03:10:30 PMQuote from: dec on March 29, 2024, 02:14:09 PMConvenient timing for the hardliners after he agreed to go back in to government.
That would be my thinking too.
Might we see Stormont collapse again? I wouldn't be surprised with big Jeff gone., and Robinson now head honcho
Alex Kane was talking about negotiations for a single Unionist porty. Any more detail on that ?
Are you taking the piss out of the Malone Road accent?
Doug Beattie, without doing very much may end of King of the Castle...
The party of God, led by the following...
Ian Paisley - Inciter in chief of countless acts of sectarian violence and murder and otherwise too many things to mention
Peter Robinson - Invader of clontibret and up to his oxters in dodgy Nama dealings. Wife shagged a young'un
Arlene Foster - RHI overseer and suspected of cruelty to crocodiles
Edwin Poots - Prima facie clean, but the young boy's a suspected crook with planning shenanigans
Jeffrey Donaldson - Charged with sexual abuse
Gavin Robinson - TBC...
Nah, that'd be "pahty". Porty would be more your neck of the woods and the south Derry types ;D
There is something very significant about Gormfhlaith ni Thuairisg speaking Irish on RTE Radio 1 and telling the nation on the news at 4 that the leader of the DUP has resigned due to a criminal investigation. Curry my yoghurt.
ft.com/content/fcf6e9f2-82fd-4a03-8945-a3679c6bc640...
Even the most brilliant political strategies must ultimately be measured against their outcomes.
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/GJ2k7Z6WkAARd_l?format=jpg&name=medium)
Must be very bad, even the orange order suspended him.
Quote from: Itchy on March 29, 2024, 05:01:00 PMMust be very bad, even the orange order suspended him.
When did that shower get morals?
Seen it mentioned on here but is it official that the alleged victim was underage??
Quote from: dec on March 29, 2024, 04:58:54 PM(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/GJ2k7Z6WkAARd_l?format=jpg&name=medium)
[/quoteQuote from: dec on March 29, 2024, 04:58:54 PM(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/GJ2k7Z6WkAARd_l?format=jpg&name=medium)
That should be his prison attire
All those photos around the house of people shaking hands with Jeff will be getting binned!
The UDR will take his name off their wall too
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on March 29, 2024, 05:09:11 PMAll those photos around the house of people shaking hands with Jeff will be getting binned!
The UDR will take his name off their wall too
All the ones up on people's Dart boards will stay UP though. These things balance themselves out over......
Quote from: HiMucker on March 29, 2024, 05:17:32 PMQuote from: Milltown Row2 on March 29, 2024, 05:09:11 PMAll those photos around the house of people shaking hands with Jeff will be getting binned!
The UDR will take his name off their wall too
All the ones up on people's Dart boards will stay UP though. These things balance themselves out over......
Those photo's will be handy to light the fire on the 11th!
Will he lose his ''SIR'' title?
how does this effect northern ireland and all ireland will they not just move on from this and throw donaldson under the bus how does this change NI politically apart from an internal dup thing.
Quote from: Eire90 on March 29, 2024, 05:29:12 PMhow does this effect northern ireland and all ireland will they not just move on from this and throw donaldson under the bus how does this change NI politically apart from an internal dup thing.
Quote from: From the Bunker on March 29, 2024, 05:26:44 PMWill he lose his ''SIR'' title?
That will be coming down the line if he is found guilty, I would say.
Quote from: Eire90 on March 29, 2024, 05:29:12 PMhow does this effect northern ireland and all ireland will they not just move on from this and throw donaldson under the bus how does this change NI politically apart from an internal dup thing.
If those who didn't want to back into power sharing are now in charge then this could have serious implications.
I heard rumours that that victims were close relatives.
He's away to London, separately it seems. Has been taking canoe lessons lately
Quote from: nrico2006 on March 29, 2024, 05:32:40 PMQuote from: Eire90 on March 29, 2024, 05:29:12 PMhow does this effect northern ireland and all ireland will they not just move on from this and throw donaldson under the bus how does this change NI politically apart from an internal dup thing.
If these who didn't want to back into power sharing are now in charge then this could have serious implications.
I heard rumours that that victims were close relatives.
Multiple victims? Jaysus.
Quote from: Eire90 on March 29, 2024, 05:29:12 PMhow does this effect northern ireland and all ireland will they not just move on from this and throw donaldson under the bus how does this change NI politically apart from an internal dup thing.
A big opportunity now for the opponents of the Windsor Framework. Gavin Robinson doesn't have the kudos to take the party forward, they are too divided. Nigel Dodds is a big string puller in the background and then you have the mavericks like Sammy and the hardliners like Carla. They'll chose a new leader but I'm not really sure how they hold it together because they're not sure whether they are for or against the current arrangement - border in the Irish Sea and second fiddle to Michelle, but trying to 'make NI work'. And ironically that means instability for the Assembly etc.
Will they just wait till the next election or will him stepping down generate a by-election ?
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on March 29, 2024, 06:13:44 PMWill they just wait till the next election or will him stepping down generate a by-election ?
It should generate a by election but will anyone be in a hurry to do this?
Sorcha Eastwood's chances much improved.
Quote from: armaghniac on March 29, 2024, 06:20:18 PMQuote from: Milltown Row2 on March 29, 2024, 06:13:44 PMWill they just wait till the next election or will him stepping down generate a by-election ?
It should generate a by election but will anyone be in a hurry to do this?
Sorcha Eastwood's chances much improved.
The last protest vote Peter Robinson lost the safest seat in Belfast
if assembly goes down again could anyone be arsed with listening nolan and crawley talking every day abou twhen it will be back up again.
Quote from: Eire90 on March 29, 2024, 06:27:50 PMif assembly goes down again could anyone be arsed with listening nolan and crawley talking every day abou twhen it will be back up again.
The rent a mob crowd of "commentators" like David McCann, Alex Kane and Suzanne Breen will be happy anyway
strange thing is donaldson probably win an election if he ran as unionist independent
Quote from: armaghniac on March 29, 2024, 06:20:18 PMQuote from: Milltown Row2 on March 29, 2024, 06:13:44 PMWill they just wait till the next election or will him stepping down generate a by-election ?
It should generate a by election but will anyone be in a hurry to do this?
Sorcha Eastwood's chances much improved.
If the DUP lose 2 Westminster seats and presuming the Shinners don't a single unionist party will be imperative
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_MPs_for_constituencies_in_Northern_Ireland_(2019%E2%80%93present)
Quote from: From the Bunker on March 29, 2024, 05:26:44 PMWill he lose his ''SIR'' title?
Imagine seeing these titles bestowed, career elevation through to the leader of the DUP, all this happening through the eyes of his victims. The world can be a very cruel place at times
Quote from: Sportacus on March 29, 2024, 06:10:40 PMQuote from: Eire90 on March 29, 2024, 05:29:12 PMhow does this effect northern ireland and all ireland will they not just move on from this and throw donaldson under the bus how does this change NI politically apart from an internal dup thing.
A big opportunity now for the opponents of the Windsor Framework. Gavin Robinson doesn't have the kudos to take the party forward, they are too divided. Nigel Dodds is a big string puller in the background and then you have the mavericks like Sammy and the hardliners like Carla. They'll chose a new leader but I'm not really sure how they hold it together because they're not sure whether they are for or against the current arrangement - border in the Irish Sea and second fiddle to Michelle, but trying to 'make NI work'. And ironically that means instability for the Assembly etc.
I can't see it going that way even if we Jamie is filling his pants with excitement. The DUP democratically decided to go back to Stormont and this doesn't change that fact.
Quote from: JoG2 on March 29, 2024, 07:02:12 PMQuote from: From the Bunker on March 29, 2024, 05:26:44 PMWill he lose his ''SIR'' title?
Imagine seeing these titles bestowed, career elevation through to the leader of the DUP, all this happening through the eyes of his victims. The world can be a very cruel place at times
He would have been earmarked for a cushy wee number in the Lords to see out his days.
Quote from: seafoid on March 29, 2024, 06:57:34 PMQuote from: armaghniac on March 29, 2024, 06:20:18 PMQuote from: Milltown Row2 on March 29, 2024, 06:13:44 PMWill they just wait till the next election or will him stepping down generate a by-election ?
It should generate a by election but will anyone be in a hurry to do this?
Sorcha Eastwood's chances much improved.
If the DUP lose 2 Westminster seats and presuming the Shinners don't a single unionist party will be imperative
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_MPs_for_constituencies_in_Northern_Ireland_(2019%E2%80%93present)
Can someone correct me if I am wrong that they can survive a by-election being called as we are in Election year? Michelle Gildernew, Micky Brady and Francie Molly all stepping down there seats but no by-elections.
However if a by-election is called in Lagan Valley Alliance will need lot to go there way - turnout would need to strong and most by elections turnout figures aren't great.
Quote from: seafoid on March 29, 2024, 06:57:34 PMQuote from: armaghniac on March 29, 2024, 06:20:18 PMQuote from: Milltown Row2 on March 29, 2024, 06:13:44 PMWill they just wait till the next election or will him stepping down generate a by-election ?
It should generate a by election but will anyone be in a hurry to do this?
Sorcha Eastwood's chances much improved.
If the DUP lose 2 Westminster seats and presuming the Shinners don't a single unionist party will be imperative
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_MPs_for_constituencies_in_Northern_Ireland_(2019%E2%80%93present)
It's their only hope of remaining a substantial block. Alliance are stealing from both sides who don't want to identify with old skool NI Civil war politics.
Although (I presume) the DUP party are innocent in all this, You cannot feel that it will tarnish the Party.
And who of the minnow Unionist Parties would want to Align with them?
Quote from: drillsergeant on March 29, 2024, 07:32:54 PMCan someone correct me if I am wrong that they can survive a by-election being called as we are in Election year? Michelle Gildernew, Micky Brady and Francie Molly all stepping down there seats but no by-elections.
These people have presumably stated that they want to stop not attending at the next election, but they are still in situ now and still enjoy the confidence of their voters. I suppose the question is whether the DUP want a quick change or see advantage in delay.
allegations against enoch powell too a hero the british right wing
Jesus. I've had a day where, for different reasons, I had no glance at X/ Twitter, and heard no news. Just spent the last half hour reading back over about 10 pages here. A classic 'Did I miss anything?' episode for me...
Gavin Robinson talking about how they have faith in the criminal justice system. Let's remember that the next time a DUPer is whinging about there being too many taigs in the judiciary.
Quote from: drillsergeant on March 29, 2024, 07:32:54 PMQuote from: seafoid on March 29, 2024, 06:57:34 PMQuote from: armaghniac on March 29, 2024, 06:20:18 PMQuote from: Milltown Row2 on March 29, 2024, 06:13:44 PMWill they just wait till the next election or will him stepping down generate a by-election ?
It should generate a by election but will anyone be in a hurry to do this?
Sorcha Eastwood's chances much improved.
If the DUP lose 2 Westminster seats and presuming the Shinners don't a single unionist party will be imperative
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_MPs_for_constituencies_in_Northern_Ireland_(2019%E2%80%93present)
Can someone correct me if I am wrong that they can survive a by-election being called as we are in Election year? Michelle Gildernew, Micky Brady and Francie Molly all stepping down there seats but no by-elections.
However if a by-election is called in Lagan Valley Alliance will need lot to go there way - turnout would need to strong and most by elections turnout figures aren't great.
JD has not resigned as an MP as yet so no bye election required. If he does it will be called within 3 months. The SF representatives mentioned are stepping down at the next election so again no bye election required.
Quote from: JoG2 on March 29, 2024, 07:02:12 PMQuote from: From the Bunker on March 29, 2024, 05:26:44 PMWill he lose his ''SIR'' title?
Imagine seeing these titles bestowed, career elevation through to the leader of the DUP, all this happening through the eyes of his victims. The world can be a very cruel place at times
That's why the victims are to be congratulated. Must have taken huge courage to name someone as high and mighty as that.
Quote from: GTP on March 29, 2024, 08:59:09 PMThe SF representatives mentioned are stepping down at the next election so again no bye election required.
Gildernew is contesting the European seat in June. Will she step down if elected? She should, but with Westminster election one a few months later I wonder would there be any point.
Do you think it'll get to the point when you're not electable unless you've a dark past? Personally, I wouldn't vote for anyone who is clean-cut. They're usually hiding something. That's why Sinn Fein are doing well.
The expenses he ran up watching films in hotel room was strange behaviour
Quote from: Eire90 on March 29, 2024, 07:52:53 PMallegations against enoch powell too a hero the british right wing
The Good Friday Teardown
Has Markethill woman Little-Pengelly got a ticket for Sunday?
Quote from: NotedObserver on March 29, 2024, 10:20:42 PMThe expenses he ran up watching films in hotel room was strange behaviour
Very strange and not much made of it.
MPs are strange. Claim a lot of expenses too...on strange stuff also.
Quote from: Orior on March 29, 2024, 10:46:49 PMHas Markethill woman Little-Pengelly got a ticket for Sunday?
I think her husband is getting a new gig with the DE. Although 6 members of the board voted against his going by the report.
Quote from: marty34 on March 29, 2024, 10:49:22 PMQuote from: Orior on March 29, 2024, 10:46:49 PMHas Markethill woman Little-Pengelly got a ticket for Sunday?
I think her husband is getting a new gig with the DE. Although 6 members of the board voted against his going by the report.
He's got the Interim Head of EA post. People will be keeping a tight eye on where the money is being spent.
Quote from: Eire90 on March 29, 2024, 07:52:53 PMallegations against enoch powell too a hero the british right wing
Wasn't it Powell that once claimed it was the CIA that killed Mountbatten?
Quote from: Saffrongael on March 29, 2024, 06:36:05 PMQuote from: Eire90 on March 29, 2024, 06:27:50 PMif assembly goes down again could anyone be arsed with listening nolan and crawley talking every day abou twhen it will be back up again.
The rent a mob crowd of "commentators" like David McCann, Alex Kane and Suzanne Breen will be happy anyway
I find Gareth Gordon the pick of the current bunch. Comes across as down to earth and well informed.
Quote from: NotedObserver on March 29, 2024, 10:20:42 PMThe expenses he ran up watching films in hotel room was strange behaviour
Always wondered why that story never got more scrutiny. A certain type of movie can be expensive.
Quote from: Sportacus on March 29, 2024, 10:56:03 PMQuote from: Saffrongael on March 29, 2024, 06:36:05 PMQuote from: Eire90 on March 29, 2024, 06:27:50 PMif assembly goes down again could anyone be arsed with listening nolan and crawley talking every day abou twhen it will be back up again.
The rent a mob crowd of "commentators" like David McCann, Alex Kane and Suzanne Breen will be happy anyway
I find Gareth Gordon the pick of the current bunch. Comes across as down to earth and well informed.
David McCann always appears balanced.
Quote from: Tony Baloney on March 29, 2024, 10:50:54 PMQuote from: marty34 on March 29, 2024, 10:49:22 PMQuote from: Orior on March 29, 2024, 10:46:49 PMHas Markethill woman Little-Pengelly got a ticket for Sunday?
I think her husband is getting a new gig with the DE. Although 6 members of the board voted against his going by the report.
He's got the Interim Head of EA post. People will be keeping a tight eye on where the money is being spent.
True. Jobs for the boys.
Quote from: Sportacus on March 29, 2024, 10:56:03 PMQuote from: Saffrongael on March 29, 2024, 06:36:05 PMQuote from: Eire90 on March 29, 2024, 06:27:50 PMif assembly goes down again could anyone be arsed with listening nolan and crawley talking every day abou twhen it will be back up again.
The rent a mob crowd of "commentators" like David McCann, Alex Kane and Suzanne Breen will be happy anyway
I find Gareth Gordon the pick of the current bunch. Comes across as down to earth and well informed.
GG is BBC NI political correspondent. He's a journalist (and you're right, a good one), not a commentator.
Is it a coincidence this news broke just before a bank holiday weekend, or is that a cynical view ?
Quote from: gallsman on March 29, 2024, 09:23:34 PMQuote from: GTP on March 29, 2024, 08:59:09 PMThe SF representatives mentioned are stepping down at the next election so again no bye election required.
Gildernew is contesting the European seat in June. Will she step down if elected? She should, but with Westminster election one a few months later I wonder would there be any point.
My understanding is dual mandates are not permitted so she would have to resign. Bye election would depend on if a general election was to be within the 3 months of resignation.
Quote from: GTP on March 30, 2024, 12:05:55 AMQuote from: gallsman on March 29, 2024, 09:23:34 PMQuote from: GTP on March 29, 2024, 08:59:09 PMThe SF representatives mentioned are stepping down at the next election so again no bye election required.
Gildernew is contesting the European seat in June. Will she step down if elected? She should, but with Westminster election one a few months later I wonder would there be any point.
My understanding is dual mandates are not permitted so she would have to resign. Bye election would depend on if a general election was to be within the 3 months of resignation.
With General Election looming surely now the DUP are looking over there shoulders in South Antrim, East Belfast and now Lagan Valley.
Regarding FST - Sinn Fein will need a strong candidate to hold that seat. No doubt they face a unity Unionist Candidate with it going to the wire.
Quote from: screenexile on March 29, 2024, 12:10:51 PMYou're not allowed to name defendants for Sexual offences in the North.
Yes you are. You aren't allowed to name complainants
Quote from: David McKeown on March 30, 2024, 12:49:23 AMQuote from: screenexile on March 29, 2024, 12:10:51 PMYou're not allowed to name defendants for Sexual offences in the North.
Yes you are. You aren't allowed to name complainants
You can't name defendants if doing so identifies the complainants (ie sex offences committed within a family). However, if the complainants waive their right to anonymity, then the defendants can be named.
Quote from: red hander on March 30, 2024, 01:59:59 AMQuote from: David McKeown on March 30, 2024, 12:49:23 AMQuote from: screenexile on March 29, 2024, 12:10:51 PMYou're not allowed to name defendants for Sexual offences in the North.
Yes you are. You aren't allowed to name complainants
You can't name defendants if doing so identifies the complainants (ie sex offences committed within a family). However, if the complainants waive their right to anonymity, then the defendants can be named.
This is like 'good, better, best' in the Antiques Roadshow
Quote from: Wee Barky on March 30, 2024, 12:00:49 AMIs it a coincidence this news broke just before a bank holiday weekend, or is that a cynical view ?
Not everything is a conspiracy.
Quote from: RedHand88 on March 30, 2024, 06:21:58 AMQuote from: Wee Barky on March 30, 2024, 12:00:49 AMIs it a coincidence this news broke just before a bank holiday weekend, or is that a cynical view ?
Not everything is a conspiracy.
I had thec exact same conversation with my Mrs yesterday funny enough. Gives it all time to die down over the long weekend. I'd say there's been a political choice (or consideration at the very least) made on the timing of the arrest. It's just the way shit works, Chief constables are political beasts. - not to protect wee Jeff either but Stormont itself.
Quote from: bennydorano on March 30, 2024, 06:57:06 AMQuote from: RedHand88 on March 30, 2024, 06:21:58 AMQuote from: Wee Barky on March 30, 2024, 12:00:49 AMIs it a coincidence this news broke just before a bank holiday weekend, or is that a cynical view ?
Not everything is a conspiracy.
I had thec exact same conversation with my Mrs yesterday funny enough. Gives it all time to die down over the long weekend. I'd say there's been a political choice (or consideration at the very least) made on the timing of the arrest. It's just the way shit works, Chief constables are political beasts. - not to protect wee Jeff either but Stormont itself.
Yeah, timing is everything.
Plus no Nolan for a day or two!
Quote from: drillsergeant on March 30, 2024, 12:27:26 AMQuote from: GTP on March 30, 2024, 12:05:55 AMQuote from: gallsman on March 29, 2024, 09:23:34 PMQuote from: GTP on March 29, 2024, 08:59:09 PMThe SF representatives mentioned are stepping down at the next election so again no bye election required.
Gildernew is contesting the European seat in June. Will she step down if elected? She should, but with Westminster election one a few months later I wonder would there be any point.
My understanding is dual mandates are not permitted so she would have to resign. Bye election would depend on if a general election was to be within the 3 months of resignation.
With General Election looming surely now the DUP are looking over there shoulders in South Antrim, East Belfast and now Lagan Valley.
Regarding FST - Sinn Fein will need a strong candidate to hold that seat. No doubt they face a unity Unionist Candidate with it going to the wire.
With demographic shift FST should finally be beyond Unionism even with a unity candidate. I think this year they will win comfortably, although comfortably in FST in recent years has been double figures😂.
Lagan valley most certainly is in play, will be interesting to see how the unionist community reacts to the Donaldson fall out, will they keep voting DUP to keep SF out, will they drift to the TUV headbangers. If the UUP don't massively profit from this crisis then they truly are finished.
SA now looks good for UUP. EB, LV and even EA and Strangford could big improvements for Alliance with maybe a couple of gains.
If the nationalist voters bothered to turn up in upper banned for a change then SF could come through the middle of split unionist vote. EL is similar but would need a miracle perfect storm.
Quote from: JPGJOHNNYG on March 30, 2024, 07:57:12 AMQuote from: drillsergeant on March 30, 2024, 12:27:26 AMQuote from: GTP on March 30, 2024, 12:05:55 AMQuote from: gallsman on March 29, 2024, 09:23:34 PMQuote from: GTP on March 29, 2024, 08:59:09 PMThe SF representatives mentioned are stepping down at the next election so again no bye election required.
Gildernew is contesting the European seat in June. Will she step down if elected? She should, but with Westminster election one a few months later I wonder would there be any point.
My understanding is dual mandates are not permitted so she would have to resign. Bye election would depend on if a general election was to be within the 3 months of resignation.
With General Election looming surely now the DUP are looking over there shoulders in South Antrim, East Belfast and now Lagan Valley.
Regarding FST - Sinn Fein will need a strong candidate to hold that seat. No doubt they face a unity Unionist Candidate with it going to the wire.
With demographic shift FST should finally be beyond Unionism even with a unity candidate. I think this year they will win comfortably, although comfortably in FST in recent years has been double figures😂.
Lagan valley most certainly is in play, will be interesting to see how the unionist community reacts to the Donaldson fall out, will they keep voting DUP to keep SF out, will they drift to the TUV headbangers. If the UUP don't massively profit from this crisis then they truly are finished.
SA now looks good for UUP. EB, LV and even EA and Strangford could see big improvements for Alliance with maybe a couple of gains.
If the nationalist voters bothered to turn up in upper bann for a change then SF could come through the middle of a split unionist vote. EL is similar but would need a miracle perfect storm.
Quote from: JPGJOHNNYG on March 30, 2024, 07:57:12 AMQuote from: drillsergeant on March 30, 2024, 12:27:26 AMQuote from: GTP on March 30, 2024, 12:05:55 AMQuote from: gallsman on March 29, 2024, 09:23:34 PMQuote from: GTP on March 29, 2024, 08:59:09 PMThe SF representatives mentioned are stepping down at the next election so again no bye election required.
Gildernew is contesting the European seat in June. Will she step down if elected? She should, but with Westminster election one a few months later I wonder would there be any point.
My understanding is dual mandates are not permitted so she would have to resign. Bye election would depend on if a general election was to be within the 3 months of resignation.
With General Election looming surely now the DUP are looking over there shoulders in South Antrim, East Belfast and now Lagan Valley.
Regarding FST - Sinn Fein will need a strong candidate to hold that seat. No doubt they face a unity Unionist Candidate with it going to the wire.
With demographic shift FST should finally be beyond Unionism even with a unity candidate. I think this year they will win comfortably, although comfortably in FST in recent years has been double figures😂.
Lagan valley most certainly is in play, will be interesting to see how the unionist community reacts to the Donaldson fall out, will they keep voting DUP to keep SF out, will they drift to the TUV headbangers. If the UUP don't massively profit from this crisis then they truly are finished.
SA now looks good for UUP. EB, LV and even EA and Strangford could big improvements for Alliance with maybe a couple of gains.
If the nationalist voters bothered to turn up in upper banned for a change then SF could come through the middle of split unionist vote. EL is similar but would need a miracle perfect storm.
I think all this will depend on the DUP's path over the next few weeks.
Will the 'no/never'people at WM take control of the party now and drive it further to the right?
Will they kick back against going back into Stormont? Now is their chance.
Will this renergise a united unionist party covering all strands of unionism?
Be interesting to see what their plan of action is.
It's all too early to state will will happens in 12 months. A week, as they say, is a long time in politics.
Quote from: red hander on March 30, 2024, 01:59:59 AMQuote from: David McKeown on March 30, 2024, 12:49:23 AMQuote from: screenexile on March 29, 2024, 12:10:51 PMYou're not allowed to name defendants for Sexual offences in the North.
Yes you are. You aren't allowed to name complainants
You can't name defendants if doing so identifies the complainants (ie sex offences committed within a family). However, if the complainants waive their right to anonymity, then the defendants can be named.
Yes jigsaw identification. You cant publish any details that could lead to the identification of a complainant. So the way that is usually done is if there's a familial relationship the press might say a man has appeared in court accused of raping his grandmother for example or Joe Bloggs has appeared in court accused of rape (but then provide no details as to the relationship with the complainant). In the Donaldson case now that his name is out there, it will not be allowed to publish any details relating to the connection if any between him and the complainants.
what is the purpose of bringing down stormont again apart from it being some childish temper tantrum what do they want the tories or labour to give them
If this brings Stormont down it is surely time for something different.
Think it will be ok though.
Quote from: Armagh18 on March 30, 2024, 10:18:23 AMIf this brings Stormont down it is surely time for something different.
Think it will be ok though.
Joint rule from Dublin and London.
An open threat to do that would likely be enough to keep them in.
joint rule would give loyalists a reason to return to arms
Quote from: RadioGAAGAA on March 30, 2024, 10:36:15 AMQuote from: Armagh18 on March 30, 2024, 10:18:23 AMIf this brings Stormont down it is surely time for something different.
Think it will be ok though.
Joint rule from Dublin and London.
An open threat to do that would likely be enough to keep them in.
Yeah smart move would be to make that known to them behind closed doors.
Zero interest in joint rule would just be a massive fudge for 50 years
Quote from: JPGJOHNNYG on March 30, 2024, 10:56:46 AMZero interest in joint rule would just be a massive fudge for 50 years
As opposed to the massive success Stormont has been lol
Quote from: Armagh18 on March 30, 2024, 10:18:23 AMIf this brings Stormont down it is surely time for something different.
Think it will be ok though.
A breakup of the DUP is more likely.
Are some of the dup freemasons is the freemasons protestant.
https://villagemagazine.ie/judge-a-king-by-his-courtiers-sir-jeffrey-donaldson-the-new-leader-of-the-dup/
Quote from: Eire90 on March 30, 2024, 11:15:41 AMAre some of the dup freemasons is the freemasons protestant.
Cé?
Quote from: Armagh18 on March 30, 2024, 10:18:23 AMIf this brings Stormont down it is surely time for something different.
Think it will be ok though.
Because of the New Decade New Approach deal, bringing down Stormont doesn't have the same leverage as before. The executive will continue to run on a caretaker basis for 6 months so will be no loss of ministers making funding decisions. ALso an election has to be called within 24 weeks of the collapse
Quote from: Nanderson on March 30, 2024, 11:33:41 AMQuote from: Armagh18 on March 30, 2024, 10:18:23 AMIf this brings Stormont down it is surely time for something different.
Think it will be ok though.
Because of the New Decade New Approach deal, bringing down Stormont doesn't have the same leverage as before. The executive will continue to run on a caretaker basis for 6 months so will be no loss of ministers making funding decisions. ALso an election has to be called within 24 weeks of the collapse
the DUP want an election like a hole in the head
Wasn't expecting THAT headline when I opened the Independent app this morning! :o
I think this will leave the Donaldsonite wing vulnerable and the headbangers will smell blood. I don't think there will be a clear winner and there'll be another period of crisis, which will be compounded by opinion polling, and election results etc..
The deal now is tainted even though it's quite a separate thing to Donaldson's behaviour, but it's very much his deal. ELP is his appointee so she is weak, especially having been co-opted.
I'd assume they'll lose some votes to TUV and UUP and even more just won't be motivated to vote. So you'll see a fractured and reduced unionist vote and a more motivated Nationalist/Other vote. The DUP were just above the water line in the last LEA, so depending on how things go before then, unionism could lose a lot of MLAs. You'd have to expect them to lose at least one MP, maybe three. If Robinson was leader and lost his, that would be a big blow.
I'd sort of been thankful and optimistic to see the DUP moving in a more reasonable/conciliatory direction and some sort of normal, but maybe unionism tearing itself apart might be better in the long run.
That said, you'd have expected most people (plenty of reasonable people vote for them) to have abandoned them by now over their spectacular failures and backwardness and they've somehow always managed to keep or win back support, so they could recover or maintain.
Quote from: Eire90 on March 30, 2024, 10:46:49 AMjoint rule would give loyalists a reason to return to arms
Quote from: JPGJOHNNYG on March 30, 2024, 10:56:46 AMZero interest in joint rule would just be a massive fudge for 50 years
Consider it a soft landing toward an eventual United Ireland.
In that context, a border poll is more likely to have them up in arms, and with joint rule, the soft unionists here (that is, those that could be swayed by economics) will have a better chance to see the potential benefits of a United Ireland as media focus moves from, or at least spits between, Westminster to the Dail.
I would consider formal joint governance a massive step toward making the transition to a United Ireland as peaceful and prosperous as possible.
Peaceful, where you lads been past 50yrs, Loyalists not accept it, end of. same way the IRA didn't in the 70's.The outcome will be no different, only in reverse this time.
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/GJ85xLGWEAALpAX?format=jpg&name=large)
Quote from: Wildweasel74 on March 30, 2024, 08:31:28 PMPeaceful, where you lads been past 50yrs, Loyalists not accept it, end of. same way the IRA didn't in the 70's.The outcome will be no different, only in reverse this time.
Are the Brits going to fund the loyalists this time? I doubt they have a 10th of the brain power the provos did. I don't think they'll do too much.
they dont need funding they can cause major disruption
Quote from: Eire90 on March 31, 2024, 07:42:59 AMthey dont need funding they can cause major disruption
Likely short term. No shipyard to down tools & march into city centre, no power plant to take over and cause power cuts.
A new settlement could easily kick the can down the road like Britain/China did with Hong Kong. It will be a 32 county country but Stormont still exists in a soft form and people can still choose to be British. Let the future politicians deal with it.
Quote from: Wildweasel74 on March 30, 2024, 08:31:28 PMPeaceful, where you lads been past 50yrs, Loyalists not accept it, end of. same way the IRA didn't in the 70's.The outcome will be no different, only in reverse this time.
f**king wise up.
The c***ts can barely fill a single orange lodge for their wee sea border meetings.
The most they could muster was a burnt out bus on the Shankill and some graffiti in Larne.
The best political minds they have are sectarian idiots like Bryson and Moore Holmes.
The only weapons they have are lying rusted buried somewhere near Markethill.
The actual paramilitaries themselves are fractured, divided and more concerned with the importation and sale of narcotics.
They won't have the state on hand to turn a blind eye, facilitate or actively participate in murdering Catholics like they did before.
They couldn't match the IRA at the peak of the Troubles with all the help they could get, they'll hardly emulate them now.
There's also the problem for them the percentage of the population identifying as British is falling and what's left is ancient so not many of them are going to be capable of much, same as Unionists crying on about the Provo army Council, those men are ready for retirement
Quote from: Eire90 on March 31, 2024, 07:42:59 AMthey dont need funding they can cause major disruption
The recent protests of the Flag the Backstop and Protocol are the height of their powers, re major disruption.
1974 is long gone.
They have nothing keft but emoty threats and comical scaremongering
they could ring bombscares into major social gathrings north and south and threaten to attack polling stations and confront politicians directly north and south do major roadblocks to shut economy down.They could also make a deal with the far right in the south.
The far right huh?
Quote from: Eire90 on March 31, 2024, 11:24:54 AMthey could ring bombscares into major social gathrings north and south and threaten to attack polling stations and confront politicians directly north and south do major roadblocks to shut economy down.They could also make a deal with the far right in the south.
Lol wut.
Quote from: Eire90 on March 31, 2024, 11:24:54 AMthey could ring bombscares into major social gathrings north and south and threaten to attack polling stations and confront politicians directly north and south do major roadblocks to shut economy down.They could also make a deal with the far right in the south.
Seriously ?
Surely you don't believe that.
Quote from: Derryman forever on March 31, 2024, 12:49:05 PMQuote from: Eire90 on March 31, 2024, 11:24:54 AMthey could ring bombscares into major social gathrings north and south and threaten to attack polling stations and confront politicians directly north and south do major roadblocks to shut economy down.They could also make a deal with the far right in the south.
Seriously ?
Surely you don't believe that.
Sometimes I think he's Olly ;D
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on March 31, 2024, 12:50:24 PMQuote from: Derryman forever on March 31, 2024, 12:49:05 PMQuote from: Eire90 on March 31, 2024, 11:24:54 AMthey could ring bombscares into major social gathrings north and south and threaten to attack polling stations and confront politicians directly north and south do major roadblocks to shut economy down.They could also make a deal with the far right in the south.
Seriously ?
Surely you don't believe that.
Sometimes I think he's Olly ;D
Is olly off his trolley?
Quote from: Wildweasel74 on March 30, 2024, 08:31:28 PMPeaceful, where you lads been past 50yrs, Loyalists not accept it, end of. same way the IRA didn't in the 70's.The outcome will be no different, only in reverse this time.
Did you miss the
as possible at the end?
Quote from: Eire90 on March 31, 2024, 11:24:54 AMthey could ring bombscares into major social gathrings north and south and threaten to attack polling stations and confront politicians directly north and south do major roadblocks to shut economy down.They could also make a deal with the far right in the south.
:o !
Wonder will Jeff be cancelled ;)
Will the placard waving mad people be outside his house demanding something?
He could end up in jail here. I think there is a strong chance he will.
Quote from: imtommygunn on April 01, 2024, 12:37:24 PMHe could end up in jail here. I think there is a strong chance he will.
The fact he was charged suggests to me that he will.
This wont stop the dup from saying they are good chrisitian people
Quote from: AustinPowers on April 01, 2024, 01:07:31 PMQuote from: imtommygunn on April 01, 2024, 12:37:24 PMHe could end up in jail here. I think there is a strong chance he will.
The fact he was charged suggests to me that he will.
In general, it is very hard to prove beyond reasonable doubt a crime that happened years ago, which is the standard of proof that should be required in criminal trials. It becomes a he said/she said, which cannot provide proof beyond reasonable doubt.
But whether he goes to jail or not, he is finished.
Jail probably depends on whether the stuff in the WhatsApp is true. If there's a confession on tape then he'll probably go inside.
I'm no legal expert but surely the fact the Mrs has also been charged with aiding and abetting suggests there's a strong chance of a successful conviction?
I would have thought so. No question of whether he's finished professionally now.
Quote from: imtommygunn on April 01, 2024, 12:37:24 PMHe could end up in jail here. I think there is a strong chance he will.
Are charges like these not punishable by lengthy sentences? Isn't rape several years by itself? Without all the other stuff?
I imagine so. If he's guilty of what is alleged he could be due a lengthy enough stint. I think the surface has only been scratched with this.
if hes guilty will paramilitaries be looking to get at him too.
Quote from: Eire90 on April 01, 2024, 06:23:32 PMif hes guilty will paramilitaries be looking to get at him too.
I'd say the vikings would be his main danger. Or maybe the banthas.
Quote from: SaffronSports on April 01, 2024, 03:59:09 PMJail probably depends on whether the stuff in the WhatsApp is true. If there's a confession on tape then he'll probably go inside.
What's this about Whatsapp Saffron? Must have missed a bit
Who the alleged victims are... mods wouldn't appreciate it being posted.
Quote from: imtommygunn on April 01, 2024, 06:40:46 PMWho the alleged victims are... mods wouldn't appreciate it being posted.
I think they have instructed lawyers to go through social media and take people to task over putting 'names' out there.
Those WhatsApp messages, those that sourced and forwarded on would need to be careful I'd imagine
Peer to peer encryption plus the forwarding doesn't say who it's forwarded from so would tend to be alright in WhatsApp but it's definitely something it would be very silly to put near social media if you were that way inclined.
Ah yes. Got that Whatsapp 😉
Seen the whatsapp there. Someone actually had it on facebook. Obviously like everything that goes around on whatsapp you've to take it with a huge pinch of salt.
What could be done if you were caught sharing it around?
Quote from: Armagh18 on April 01, 2024, 07:45:09 PMSeen the whatsapp there. Someone actually had it on facebook. Obviously like everything that goes around on whatsapp you've to take it with a huge pinch of salt.
What could be done if you were caught sharing it around?
Think you can be done for contempt of court but how realistic is that if hundreds maybe even thousands of people have shared it?
Quote from: clarshack on April 01, 2024, 08:14:19 PMQuote from: Armagh18 on April 01, 2024, 07:45:09 PMSeen the whatsapp there. Someone actually had it on facebook. Obviously like everything that goes around on whatsapp you've to take it with a huge pinch of salt.
What could be done if you were caught sharing it around?
Think you can be done for contempt of court but how realistic is that if hundreds maybe even thousands of people have shared it?
It isn't desirable that thousands of people share it, if they cannot find a jury who has not seen this stuff then he is off Scot free.
Quote from: armaghniac on April 01, 2024, 08:17:45 PMQuote from: clarshack on April 01, 2024, 08:14:19 PMQuote from: Armagh18 on April 01, 2024, 07:45:09 PMSeen the whatsapp there. Someone actually had it on facebook. Obviously like everything that goes around on whatsapp you've to take it with a huge pinch of salt.
What could be done if you were caught sharing it around?
Think you can be done for contempt of court but how realistic is that if hundreds maybe even thousands of people have shared it?
It isn't desirable that thousands of people share it, if they cannot find a jury who has not seen this stuff then he is off Scot free.
Sure he can do the diplock court procedure lol.. I'm sure he was a supporter of it back in the day
I wouldn't imagine it carries that much weight.
If it did sure the criminals would just be putting a pile of stuff around about themselves.
You could get bots tweeting it millions of times a minute if you wanted.
Quote from: general_lee on April 01, 2024, 04:13:58 PMI'm no legal expert but surely the fact the Mrs has also been charged with aiding and abetting suggests there's a strong chance of a successful conviction?
Quote from: AustinPowers on April 01, 2024, 01:07:31 PMQuote from: imtommygunn on April 01, 2024, 12:37:24 PMHe could end up in jail here. I think there is a strong chance he will.
The fact he was charged suggests to me that he will.
Statistically there's more likelihood of you being convicted if you have been reported and prosecution decision issues to go by way of summons albeit the differences aren't startling in the grand scheme of things. Statistics would show about 81% of charge sheet decisions result in successful prosecutions and about 89% of cases that go by way of summons do.
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on April 01, 2024, 06:48:35 PMQuote from: imtommygunn on April 01, 2024, 06:40:46 PMWho the alleged victims are... mods wouldn't appreciate it being posted.
I think they have instructed lawyers to go through social media and take people to task over putting 'names' out there.
Those WhatsApp messages, those that sourced and forwarded on would need to be careful I'd imagine
Its a criminal offence to disclose any information that can lead to the identification of a victim of a sexual offence. Whilst I dont expect PSNI to start seizing phones of people forwarding Whatsapps etc I do know they are pretty stong on investigating anyone who posts names on X or Facebook or the like.
I haven't seen any whatsapps but I have been told who the alleged victims are - I won't repeat though.
Has he been accused of something more than rape?
Will he lose his knighthood? Ultimate fall from grace for someone of his ilk.
If guilty, I really hope full weight of the law comes down hard on him. Particularly given his public standing.
Quote from: Eire90 on April 01, 2024, 03:18:39 PMThis wont stop the dup from saying they are good chrisitian people
They are full of hypocrites. Whatever you think about the troubles, no side is without blame. I think SF at least recognise that and recognise that there's subjectivity. The DUP didn't/won't concede anything, as if any inequality was either imagined or deserved by CNR.
The DUP go on about the PIRA and terrorism as if they are principled pacifists, yet will ignore or defend Bloody Sunday, the RUC, UDR, British army etc. established misdeeds, collusion and corruption. They conveniently forget that they were involved with setting up their own paramilitary organisation too and their cosy relationships with other paramilitaries. Likewise they'll bring up Michelle O'Neill's father and ignore ELP's father.
I think, regrettably, the way forward is to agree to disagree, but agree on a peaceful future. I think this is the road SF are going down (mainly as its in their interests and could help smooth the way for a UI).
Quote from: tbrick18 on April 02, 2024, 12:34:47 PMWill he lose his knighthood?
Does it not make him fit in better with the rest of them?
Just another Sir Odious p***k who was honoured for his services to ass-licking the right hole.
When did big Jeff get his knighthood? And what did he actually get it for?
I mean , he never won Wimbledon or an Olympic gold medal like those other deserving knighted folk.
Quote from: AustinPowers on April 02, 2024, 06:17:22 PMWhen did big Jeff get his knighthood? And what did he actually get it for?
I mean , he never won Wimbledon or an Olympic gold medal like those other deserving knighted folk.
Very good question.
Quote from: Armamike on April 02, 2024, 06:22:28 PMQuote from: AustinPowers on April 02, 2024, 06:17:22 PMWhen did big Jeff get his knighthood? And what did he actually get it for?
I mean , he never won Wimbledon or an Olympic gold medal like those other deserving knighted folk.
Very good question.
Services to
saying no politics. I'd say he was shoe in to be fast tracked into Lords when he lost the MP seat in lagan valley. Obviously losing the seat is a guarantee now and his lordship is well and truely in the mud
Quote from: Nanderson on April 02, 2024, 06:27:01 PMQuote from: Armamike on April 02, 2024, 06:22:28 PMQuote from: AustinPowers on April 02, 2024, 06:17:22 PMWhen did big Jeff get his knighthood? And what did he actually get it for?
I mean , he never won Wimbledon or an Olympic gold medal like those other deserving knighted folk.
Very good question.
Services to saying no politics. I'd say he was shoe in to be fast tracked into Lords when he lost the MP seat in lagan valley. Obviously losing the seat is a guarantee now and his lordship is well and truely in the mud
He wouldn't be the first lord involved in moral turpitude, not even in Belfast.
Quote from: seafoid on April 02, 2024, 06:34:41 PMQuote from: Nanderson on April 02, 2024, 06:27:01 PMQuote from: Armamike on April 02, 2024, 06:22:28 PMQuote from: AustinPowers on April 02, 2024, 06:17:22 PMWhen did big Jeff get his knighthood? And what did he actually get it for?
I mean , he never won Wimbledon or an Olympic gold medal like those other deserving knighted folk.
Very good question.
Services to saying no politics. I'd say he was shoe in to be fast tracked into Lords when he lost the MP seat in lagan valley. Obviously losing the seat is a guarantee now and his lordship is well and truely in the mud
He wouldn't be the first lord involved in moral turpitude, not even in Belfast.
He's Lisburn, a different city altogether ;)
Quote from: Nanderson on April 02, 2024, 06:27:01 PMQuote from: Armamike on April 02, 2024, 06:22:28 PMQuote from: AustinPowers on April 02, 2024, 06:17:22 PMWhen did big Jeff get his knighthood? And what did he actually get it for?
I mean , he never won Wimbledon or an Olympic gold medal like those other deserving knighted folk.
Very good question.
Services to saying no politics. I'd say he was shoe in to be fast tracked into Lords when he lost the MP seat in lagan valley. Obviously losing the seat is a guarantee now and his lordship is well and truely in the mud
I remember looking that up a few years ago as I was shocked that he was knighted, especially given his hard it is for some, more deserving, recipients.
Quote from: nrico2006 on April 02, 2024, 11:03:35 PMQuote from: Nanderson on April 02, 2024, 06:27:01 PMQuote from: Armamike on April 02, 2024, 06:22:28 PMQuote from: AustinPowers on April 02, 2024, 06:17:22 PMWhen did big Jeff get his knighthood? And what did he actually get it for?
I mean , he never won Wimbledon or an Olympic gold medal like those other deserving knighted folk.
Very good question.
Services to saying no politics. I'd say he was shoe in to be fast tracked into Lords when he lost the MP seat in lagan valley. Obviously losing the seat is a guarantee now and his lordship is well and truely in the mud
I remember looking that up a few years ago as I was shocked that he was knighted, especially given his hard it is for some, more deserving, recipients.
You make it sound like a British knighthood is something to cherish and be proud of?? ;D
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on April 02, 2024, 06:35:56 PMQuote from: seafoid on April 02, 2024, 06:34:41 PMQuote from: Nanderson on April 02, 2024, 06:27:01 PMQuote from: Armamike on April 02, 2024, 06:22:28 PMQuote from: AustinPowers on April 02, 2024, 06:17:22 PMWhen did big Jeff get his knighthood? And what did he actually get it for?
I mean , he never won Wimbledon or an Olympic gold medal like those other deserving knighted folk.
Very good question.
Services to saying no politics. I'd say he was shoe in to be fast tracked into Lords when he lost the MP seat in lagan valley. Obviously losing the seat is a guarantee now and his lordship is well and truely in the mud
He wouldn't be the first lord involved in moral turpitude, not even in Belfast.
He's Lisburn, a different city altogether ;)
And not surprisingly he's from Kilkeel, that wee lovely fishing village bedecked in flegs all year round!
Is Harry and Megan still some sort of Duke or Duchess over that quaint wee shíthole?
Quote from: Armagh4sam2024 on April 02, 2024, 11:37:43 PMQuote from: nrico2006 on April 02, 2024, 11:03:35 PMQuote from: Nanderson on April 02, 2024, 06:27:01 PMQuote from: Armamike on April 02, 2024, 06:22:28 PMQuote from: AustinPowers on April 02, 2024, 06:17:22 PMWhen did big Jeff get his knighthood? And what did he actually get it for?
I mean , he never won Wimbledon or an Olympic gold medal like those other deserving knighted folk.
Very good question.
Services to saying no politics. I'd say he was shoe in to be fast tracked into Lords when he lost the MP seat in lagan valley. Obviously losing the seat is a guarantee now and his lordship is well and truely in the mud
I remember looking that up a few years ago as I was shocked that he was knighted, especially given his hard it is for some, more deserving, recipients.
You make it sound like a British knighthood is something to cherish and be proud of?? ;D
I thought wee Jeff got his medal for services to smugness and sanctimony. And lest we forget, his dad wasn't a welcome sight at any catholic owned farm in south Down.
Quote from: johnnycool on April 03, 2024, 09:54:12 AMQuote from: Milltown Row2 on April 02, 2024, 06:35:56 PMQuote from: seafoid on April 02, 2024, 06:34:41 PMQuote from: Nanderson on April 02, 2024, 06:27:01 PMQuote from: Armamike on April 02, 2024, 06:22:28 PMQuote from: AustinPowers on April 02, 2024, 06:17:22 PMWhen did big Jeff get his knighthood? And what did he actually get it for?
I mean , he never won Wimbledon or an Olympic gold medal like those other deserving knighted folk.
Very good question.
Services to saying no politics. I'd say he was shoe in to be fast tracked into Lords when he lost the MP seat in lagan valley. Obviously losing the seat is a guarantee now and his lordship is well and truely in the mud
He wouldn't be the first lord involved in moral turpitude, not even in Belfast.
He's Lisburn, a different city altogether ;)
And not surprisingly he's from Kilkeel, that wee lovely fishing village bedecked in flegs all year round!
Is Harry and Megan still some sort of Duke or Duchess over that quaint wee shíthole?
Hey Kilkeel might be a shithole. But it's my shithole :'( :'(
Is it as bad as Carrick?
Jesus Carla Lockhart looks like she has anorexia
Irrespective of anything physical she's a horrendous human being. So young and the bitterness hanging out of her.
Absolutely nothing between the ears on her either. How on earth she's become a big hitter is beyond me. If David Simpson wasn't busy waving his pipe all over Upper Bann, I suspect he'd still be in Westminster and she'd still be a mid tier MLA that very few people paid any heed to.
It's the stuff round bloody sunday etc that gets me on her. The whys and wherefores of the whole thing aside it's just so antagonistic and disrespectful.
Quote from: imtommygunn on April 05, 2024, 09:54:11 AMIt's the stuff round bloody sunday etc that gets me on her. The whys and wherefores of the whole thing aside it's just so antagonistic and disrespectful.
She is a product of her upbringing and background. Though they would try to say otherwise the DUP's demographic is a mirror image of SF's which includes ultra loyalist/republican opinion through to more main stream. Like many SF politicians Lockhart panders to that loyalist bloc for votes.
Quote from: Applesisapples on April 05, 2024, 10:05:43 AMQuote from: imtommygunn on April 05, 2024, 09:54:11 AMIt's the stuff round bloody sunday etc that gets me on her. The whys and wherefores of the whole thing aside it's just so antagonistic and disrespectful.
She is a product of her upbringing and background. Though they would try to say otherwise the DUP's demographic is a mirror image of SF's which includes ultra loyalist/republican opinion through to more main stream. Like many SF politicians Lockhart panders to that loyalist bloc for votes.
Good man. Now can you name me a SF MP that is the reflection of Carla.
I wouldn't want to be giving them my vote.
Quote from: Derryman forever on April 05, 2024, 12:21:41 PMQuote from: Applesisapples on April 05, 2024, 10:05:43 AMQuote from: imtommygunn on April 05, 2024, 09:54:11 AMIt's the stuff round bloody sunday etc that gets me on her. The whys and wherefores of the whole thing aside it's just so antagonistic and disrespectful.
She is a product of her upbringing and background. Though they would try to say otherwise the DUP's demographic is a mirror image of SF's which includes ultra loyalist/republican opinion through to more main stream. Like many SF politicians Lockhart panders to that loyalist bloc for votes.
Good man. Now can you name me a SF MP that is the reflection of Carla.
I wouldn't want to be giving them my vote.
It was her that brought up the Drumcree March again, wanting it "resolved". It was resolved 20 odd years ago. And three young lads lost their lives because of it. Imagine that mayhem happening again.
But as you say , the Drumcree talk would be music to a lot of knuckledraggers ears and a few more votes for Skeletor.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-68857236
Not hard to know what side of the community the current Education Minister is from.
That being said if it had been 4 CCMS schools scheduled for closure and it was a new SF Education minister they would do exactly the same.
Not hard to know there are elections around the corner.
Just about sums up NI (parish) politics.
A school with 13 pupils, 3 teachers and 3 support staff.
Surely that can't continue.
I wonder how far away the next 'similiar' primary school is to each of them?
Is there not an enrolment figure in primary and once it dips below that, there needs to be an assessment down on it.
Politicians won't make good decisions - like hospitals etc.
By 13 pupils is very low.
Quote from: marty34 on April 20, 2024, 08:12:56 AMA school with 13 pupils, 3 teachers and 3 support staff.
Surely that can't continue.
I wonder how far away the next 'similiar' primary school is to each of them?
Is there not an enrolment figure in primary and once it dips below that, there needs to be an assessment down on it.
Politicians won't make good decisions - like hospitals etc.
By 13 pupils is very low.
I'm all for small primary schools, local where everyone knows each other, to this day my best friends are ones from primary school but jeez 13 is very low
Numbers are low for sure, and I'm not at all saying that should stay open, but if these were small, rural banks or post offices, or schools for that matter, I'm nationalist areas, would you be quite so triggered by it?
Schools that size aren't sustainable regardless of green or orange and they should be closed. This is the DUP doing DUP things but the Shinners would be no different. Politicians here don't like making difficult decisions.
I agree, not sustainable, but there'd not be a word said if the shoe was on they other foot.
However, why are we so quick to accept that schools should close, but banks and post offices have to stay open?
Quote from: gallsman on April 20, 2024, 10:46:50 AMI agree, not sustainable, but there'd not be a word said if the shoe was on they other foot.
However, why are we so quick to accept that schools should close, but banks and post offices have to stay open?
John O'Dowd wasn't afraid to close or attempt to close Catholic schools in rural areas. Ultimately though CCMS share some responsibility.
Quote from: Armagh18 on April 20, 2024, 09:07:21 AMQuote from: marty34 on April 20, 2024, 08:12:56 AMA school with 13 pupils, 3 teachers and 3 support staff.
Surely that can't continue.
I wonder how far away the next 'similiar' primary school is to each of them?
Is there not an enrolment figure in primary and once it dips below that, there needs to be an assessment down on it.
Politicians won't make good decisions - like hospitals etc.
By 13 pupils is very low.
That's kids from P1 to P7, so at best two per age group and a classroom size of 4 or 5 for each teacher...
Nuts
Fine Gael favourite, crater face Hoey having a go at Jarlath Burns and the GAA
https://x.com/catharinehoey/status/1782365465433498036?s=46
Quote from: Orior on April 22, 2024, 05:40:40 PMFine Gael favourite, crater face Hoey having a go at Jarlath Burns and the GAA
https://x.com/catharinehoey/status/1782365465433498036?s=46
::) Kate be in the same mould as Jamie and Jim.. I wouldn't pay much heed to her.
Massive bigot who deserves no airtime. How anyone ever elected her in England I don't know - she's bonkers.
Dudley Edwards getting in on the act too
https://x.com/ruthde/status/1782437508644516335?s=46
Quote from: Orior on April 22, 2024, 05:40:40 PMFine Gael favourite, crater face Hoey having a go at Jarlath Burns and the GAA
https://x.com/catharinehoey/status/1782365465433498036?s=46
What paper is that article from? The Newsletter?
People of Rathlin not too happy about Zelda from The Terrahawks using their name when Bojo the Clown gave the bitch some ermine to wear
RDE, Kate Hoey, and Owen Polly FFS. All 3 of them ooze bitterness. I listened to the interview on TalkBack and thought he spoke very well.
Hoey is a weird one as she apparently supported the civil rights movement and was on record as supporting a United Ireland up until the 1990s I think?
It's likewise interesting to see some of the original founders of the DUP, who would be pretty hardcore protestants and Davy Adams, a former UDA man, coming out basically saying things like they think a United Ireland is inevitable or that they'd be open to persuasion.
It's really hard to know where sentiments are among PUL, with many unwilling to speak out because of the grief they'd get. Likewise there's plenty of spin and narratives.
I think people in general aren't that well informed, north and south (in different ways). The headlines are always on what way people would vote if a vote was tomorrow, but we don't know what they'd be voting for. The polling on preference and aspiration, seems to show a very solid block of 30-35% who are against a UI full stop, a similar number who would vote for a UI regardless, maybe another 30-35% who aspire to unity, but aren't fully convinced yet and then 10-15% don't knows. That should be what drives the debate. I'm not sure why this is glossed over so much by governments and media. I think there's some who just want it to go away for political reasons or personal preference and others who want to have the margin larger so it can be a smoother process.
Quote from: AustinPowers on April 22, 2024, 07:07:26 PMQuote from: Orior on April 22, 2024, 05:40:40 PMFine Gael favourite, crater face Hoey having a go at Jarlath Burns and the GAA
https://x.com/catharinehoey/status/1782365465433498036?s=46
What paper is that article from? The Newsletter?
Yes, Newsletter
Big day for Jeffrey and the DUP in Newry
Donaldson, 61, faces 11 charges: one count of rape, one count of gross indecency towards a child and nine counts of indecent assault on a female from 1985 to 2006. The allegations relate to two complainants.
Jesus, that's not good....
''His wife Eleanor Donaldson, 58, is facing four charges including aiding and abetting the offence.''
Does that mean turning a blind eye to what was going on?
I've noticed that none of the papers are referring to him as ''Sir''
Quote from: From the Bunker on April 24, 2024, 03:31:17 PM''His wife Eleanor Donaldson, 58, is facing four charges including aiding and abetting the offence.''
Does that mean turning a blind eye to what was going on?
I've noticed that none of the papers are referring to him as ''Sir''
Does he still get paid as a MP etc.?
Quote from: marty34 on April 24, 2024, 05:19:09 PMQuote from: From the Bunker on April 24, 2024, 03:31:17 PM''His wife Eleanor Donaldson, 58, is facing four charges including aiding and abetting the offence.''
Does that mean turning a blind eye to what was going on?
I've noticed that none of the papers are referring to him as ''Sir''
Does he still get paid as a MP etc.?
He hasn't yet been convicted of anything. This will take a while, and there may well be an election before this process takes its course. MPs are eligible to receive a loss-of-office payment if they lose at an election, but I suppose he would have to run in the election to get that. There is also a winding-up payment to close the office etc,. he might not get that if he resigns so better to wait for an election.
with his christian fish symbol
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/GL7kfHBW8AAPu4D?format=jpg)
Having been WhatsApp'd some of the allegations around what is supposed to have happened and who the victims are, I really hope an example is made of him and his wife if they are proven to be correct. There must be a substantial body of evidence if it has gotten as far as it has though. If he's found guilty - he's had some nerve to put himself out in the public domain the way he has for the last 30odd years and shows a complete disregard for the victims.
There's always the flip side to that I suppose too, if he's innocent its a hell of an ordeal to go through.
Only thing for sure is that there are no winners, but hopefully justice is service.
If he's guilty of what he's alleged to be guilty of then he'd have no shame so wouldn't bat an eyelid about victims. If he's not no reason he shouldn't be in public life.
A completely mad one. Could be staring at a lengthy enough jail term. Who knows what way it will pan out.
Quote from: tbrick18 on April 24, 2024, 08:25:27 PMOnly thing for sure is that there are no winners, but hopefully justice is service.
As I said before, it is hard to see how you can prove something 20 years ago beyond reasonable doubt, I doubt there were witnesses other than his wife.
Some of the videos I seen after court was a bit ridiculous (The getaway car not being available didn't help either)
He's still innocent until proven otherwise though , is he not?
Quote from: AustinPowers on April 24, 2024, 09:19:23 PMSome of the videos I seen after court was a bit ridiculous (The getaway car not being available didn't help either)
He's still innocent until proven otherwise though , is he not?
Indeed he is, regardless of who or what he is.
Quote from: imtommygunn on April 24, 2024, 08:34:23 PMIf he's guilty of what he's alleged to be guilty of then he'd have no shame so wouldn't bat an eyelid about victims. If he's not no reason he shouldn't be in public life.
A completely mad one. Could be staring at a lengthy enough jail term. Who knows what way it will pan out.
Hadn't thought of it like that, but I guess that's right.
Agree with other posters though - innocent until proven otherwise.
Quote from: armaghniac on April 24, 2024, 08:34:36 PMQuote from: tbrick18 on April 24, 2024, 08:25:27 PMOnly thing for sure is that there are no winners, but hopefully justice is service.
As I said before, it is hard to see how you can prove something 20 years ago beyond reasonable doubt, I doubt there were witnesses other than his wife.
Hearing other cases the PPS didn't prosecute due unlikelihood of conviction even when there is evidence, they must feel there's a high chance of conviction based on what ever evidence they have. No?
I've no idea myself - I'm doing a lot of reading between the lines and may well be getting it wrong.
Quote from: tbrick18 on April 24, 2024, 10:29:15 PMQuote from: armaghniac on April 24, 2024, 08:34:36 PMQuote from: tbrick18 on April 24, 2024, 08:25:27 PMOnly thing for sure is that there are no winners, but hopefully justice is service.
As I said before, it is hard to see how you can prove something 20 years ago beyond reasonable doubt, I doubt there were witnesses other than his wife.
Hearing other cases the PPS didn't prosecute due unlikelihood of conviction even when there is evidence, they must feel there's a high chance of conviction based on what ever evidence they have. No?
I've no idea myself - I'm doing a lot of reading between the lines and may well be getting it wrong.
Today was the 1st appearance. I'd be shocked if the PPS even have the full file yet let alone have made a decision. It would be unusual for them to have the full file yet particularly if the allegations only surfaced in March.
Quote from: David McKeown on April 24, 2024, 10:33:49 PMQuote from: tbrick18 on April 24, 2024, 10:29:15 PMQuote from: armaghniac on April 24, 2024, 08:34:36 PMQuote from: tbrick18 on April 24, 2024, 08:25:27 PMOnly thing for sure is that there are no winners, but hopefully justice is service.
As I said before, it is hard to see how you can prove something 20 years ago beyond reasonable doubt, I doubt there were witnesses other than his wife.
Hearing other cases the PPS didn't prosecute due unlikelihood of conviction even when there is evidence, they must feel there's a high chance of conviction based on what ever evidence they have. No?
I've no idea myself - I'm doing a lot of reading between the lines and may well be getting it wrong.
Today was the 1st appearance. I'd be shocked if the PPS even have the full file yet let alone have made a decision. It would be unusual for them to have the full file yet particularly if the allegations only surfaced in March.
However, at present this case seems different from teachers, coaches etc where there are multiple people to come forward. But you never know.
Quote from: armaghniac on April 24, 2024, 11:25:51 PMQuote from: David McKeown on April 24, 2024, 10:33:49 PMQuote from: tbrick18 on April 24, 2024, 10:29:15 PMQuote from: armaghniac on April 24, 2024, 08:34:36 PMQuote from: tbrick18 on April 24, 2024, 08:25:27 PMOnly thing for sure is that there are no winners, but hopefully justice is service.
As I said before, it is hard to see how you can prove something 20 years ago beyond reasonable doubt, I doubt there were witnesses other than his wife.
Hearing other cases the PPS didn't prosecute due unlikelihood of conviction even when there is evidence, they must feel there's a high chance of conviction based on what ever evidence they have. No?
I've no idea myself - I'm doing a lot of reading between the lines and may well be getting it wrong.
Today was the 1st appearance. I'd be shocked if the PPS even have the full file yet let alone have made a decision. It would be unusual for them to have the full file yet particularly if the allegations only surfaced in March.
However, at present this case seems different from teachers, coaches etc where there are multiple people to come forward. But you never know.
Are there not two people involved in this?
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on April 25, 2024, 07:27:31 AMQuote from: armaghniac on April 24, 2024, 11:25:51 PMQuote from: David McKeown on April 24, 2024, 10:33:49 PMQuote from: tbrick18 on April 24, 2024, 10:29:15 PMQuote from: armaghniac on April 24, 2024, 08:34:36 PMQuote from: tbrick18 on April 24, 2024, 08:25:27 PMOnly thing for sure is that there are no winners, but hopefully justice is service.
As I said before, it is hard to see how you can prove something 20 years ago beyond reasonable doubt, I doubt there were witnesses other than his wife.
Hearing other cases the PPS didn't prosecute due unlikelihood of conviction even when there is evidence, they must feel there's a high chance of conviction based on what ever evidence they have. No?
I've no idea myself - I'm doing a lot of reading between the lines and may well be getting it wrong.
Today was the 1st appearance. I'd be shocked if the PPS even have the full file yet let alone have made a decision. It would be unusual for them to have the full file yet particularly if the allegations only surfaced in March.
However, at present this case seems different from teachers, coaches etc where there are multiple people to come forward. But you never know.
Are there not two people involved in this?
yes
Quote from: Applesisapples on April 25, 2024, 09:06:21 AMQuote from: Milltown Row2 on April 25, 2024, 07:27:31 AMQuote from: armaghniac on April 24, 2024, 11:25:51 PMQuote from: David McKeown on April 24, 2024, 10:33:49 PMQuote from: tbrick18 on April 24, 2024, 10:29:15 PMQuote from: armaghniac on April 24, 2024, 08:34:36 PMQuote from: tbrick18 on April 24, 2024, 08:25:27 PMOnly thing for sure is that there are no winners, but hopefully justice is service.
As I said before, it is hard to see how you can prove something 20 years ago beyond reasonable doubt, I doubt there were witnesses other than his wife.
Hearing other cases the PPS didn't prosecute due unlikelihood of conviction even when there is evidence, they must feel there's a high chance of conviction based on what ever evidence they have. No?
I've no idea myself - I'm doing a lot of reading between the lines and may well be getting it wrong.
Today was the 1st appearance. I'd be shocked if the PPS even have the full file yet let alone have made a decision. It would be unusual for them to have the full file yet particularly if the allegations only surfaced in March.
However, at present this case seems different from teachers, coaches etc where there are multiple people to come forward. But you never know.
Are there not two people involved in this?
yes
Then it shouldn't fall down to a he said she said scenario?
Been plenty of legacy cases were people have been found guilty, but I'd worry on how they will throw together a set of jurors for this shambles
Quote from: David McKeown on April 24, 2024, 10:33:49 PMQuote from: tbrick18 on April 24, 2024, 10:29:15 PMQuote from: armaghniac on April 24, 2024, 08:34:36 PMQuote from: tbrick18 on April 24, 2024, 08:25:27 PMOnly thing for sure is that there are no winners, but hopefully justice is service.
As I said before, it is hard to see how you can prove something 20 years ago beyond reasonable doubt, I doubt there were witnesses other than his wife.
Hearing other cases the PPS didn't prosecute due unlikelihood of conviction even when there is evidence, they must feel there's a high chance of conviction based on what ever evidence they have. No?
I've no idea myself - I'm doing a lot of reading between the lines and may well be getting it wrong.
Today was the 1st appearance. I'd be shocked if the PPS even have the full file yet let alone have made a decision. It would be unusual for them to have the full file yet particularly if the allegations only surfaced in March.
So does that mean the PPS could still decide not prosecute?
I've no idea how these things work, I'd made the assumption it only gets this far if the PPS are already in a position to prosecute.
Interesting.
Fact the police went straight to charge I think should give an indication in this case.
That's not to decide on the outcome before it has been in front of the court, but the police obviously feel there is case here to be presented.
I see one of the charges relates to 1985 and Donaldson was married in 1987. As for the Lady Eleanor (any Lindisfarne fans out there?), David McKeown will know better than me but I think "aiding and abetting" usually suggests something more active than just knowing and doing nothing about it?
Seen some tosser making a dick of himself outside the courtroom when Donaldson came out. Some people do anything to post online.
Quote from: Wildweasel74 on April 25, 2024, 11:09:53 AMSeen some tosser making a dick of himself outside the courtroom when Donaldson came out. Some people do anything to post online.
Allegedly a TUV supporter, but that could be BS.
Although the same moron posts another video where he's approached by Ben Lowry who seems to know him going by the interaction.
Whoever it is there's something seriously wrong with them...
Quote from: Wildweasel74 on April 25, 2024, 11:09:53 AMSeen some tosser making a dick of himself outside the courtroom when Donaldson came out. Some people do anything to post online.
Major c**k up by the police to bring him out and no transport. Saw a photo of that man and he looks exactly like you expect him to. Bryson seems to think he's a republican.
Quote from: RedHand88 on April 25, 2024, 01:25:00 PMQuote from: Wildweasel74 on April 25, 2024, 11:09:53 AMSeen some tosser making a dick of himself outside the courtroom when Donaldson came out. Some people do anything to post online.
Major c**k up by the police to bring him out and no transport. Saw a photo of that man and he looks exactly like you expect him to. Bryson seems to think he's a republican.
https://twitter.com/i/status/1783121474527580403 (https://twitter.com/i/status/1783121474527580403)
I'm almost certain Ben Lowry says good to see you to him and seemed to know where he was from.
Could be a republican but highly unlikely.
Quote from: johnnycool on April 25, 2024, 02:11:25 PMQuote from: RedHand88 on April 25, 2024, 01:25:00 PMQuote from: Wildweasel74 on April 25, 2024, 11:09:53 AMSeen some tosser making a dick of himself outside the courtroom when Donaldson came out. Some people do anything to post online.
Major c**k up by the police to bring him out and no transport. Saw a photo of that man and he looks exactly like you expect him to. Bryson seems to think he's a republican.
https://twitter.com/i/status/1783121474527580403 (https://twitter.com/i/status/1783121474527580403)
I'm almost certain Ben Lowry says good to see you to him and seemed to know where he was from.
Could be a republican but highly unlikely.
Doesn't look like he knows him to me. Ben Lowry just being nosy.
Quote from: johnnycool on April 25, 2024, 12:20:13 PMQuote from: Wildweasel74 on April 25, 2024, 11:09:53 AMSeen some tosser making a dick of himself outside the courtroom when Donaldson came out. Some people do anything to post online.
Allegedly a TUV supporter, but that could be BS.
Although the same moron posts another video where he's approached by Ben Lowry who seems to know him going by the interaction.
That's a nyuck if ever I heard one. Doubt he's a TUV man.
https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-68647494.amp
Quote from: tbrick18 on April 25, 2024, 09:57:40 AMQuote from: David McKeown on April 24, 2024, 10:33:49 PMQuote from: tbrick18 on April 24, 2024, 10:29:15 PMQuote from: armaghniac on April 24, 2024, 08:34:36 PMQuote from: tbrick18 on April 24, 2024, 08:25:27 PMOnly thing for sure is that there are no winners, but hopefully justice is service.
As I said before, it is hard to see how you can prove something 20 years ago beyond reasonable doubt, I doubt there were witnesses other than his wife.
Hearing other cases the PPS didn't prosecute due unlikelihood of conviction even when there is evidence, they must feel there's a high chance of conviction based on what ever evidence they have. No?
I've no idea myself - I'm doing a lot of reading between the lines and may well be getting it wrong.
Today was the 1st appearance. I'd be shocked if the PPS even have the full file yet let alone have made a decision. It would be unusual for them to have the full file yet particularly if the allegations only surfaced in March.
So does that mean the PPS could still decide not prosecute?
I've no idea how these things work, I'd made the assumption it only gets this far if the PPS are already in a position to prosecute.
Interesting.
Police once they arrest someone can question them for a total period of initially 24 hours before they must release them without charge or charge them. That time can be extended firstly by senior by police officers and then by courts. Until that time is used up police can release upon pre charge bail in order to gather further evidence but conditions are largely unenforceable (not going into the details of that here not really relevant). Once police believe they have sufficient evidence to establish a prime facie case they can charge. Alternatively they can release for report. Neither way suggests the evidence is any stronger or weaker than the other it more comes down to the perceived necessity by police for bail conditions and/or a remand. The reason some are charged is essentially that police believe there a likelihood of reoffending if not charged, is there a likelihood of interference with witnesses or is there a likelihood of absconding. Rarely there may be other reasons for charging such as to uphold public confidence but these are rare.
If an individual is charged they can be kept to the next remand court (the next day or two if its over a holiday or weekend) if PSNI feel that remand is necessary to meet the above. Or they can be released on post charge bail by the custody sergeant who will set a date within 28 days for a defendant to appear at court and will set bail conditions. That is what happened in this case.
After charge PSNI will continue to gather evidence and collate the already gathered evidence in order to submit a file to the PPS. Once a file is received it will be allocated to a suitably qualified prosecutor who will review the file and if necessary request the police to gather further evidence. Once the PPS have a full file they will decide whether to prosecute and what charges are to be prosecuted and where they are to be prosecuted.
Asking how long that process will last is like asking how long is a piece of string. I recently had a fast tracked one that took 14 months but I've had ones take anything from 4 months to 3 years. It depends on the amount of evidence, the quality, the likelihood of getting more, how busy the directing officer is, how busy the investigating officer is etc etc.
With a charge sheet case the court will keep under review how long things are taking. Had the case been taken for report then its simply a case of when PPS can get round to it, but defendants aren't on bail in report cases.
Statistically report cases have a higher conviction rate but a lower decision to prosecute rate but there's very little difference.
Ultimately all cases investigated by police are sent to PPS for decision. A lot never see the light of day, some get dropped after being charged and others get prosecuted the whole way to trial. At this moment nothing has happened that I am aware of that could lead to any proper conclusions on the strength of the evidence and we would simply be speculating.
Quote from: David McKeown on April 25, 2024, 07:31:48 PMQuote from: tbrick18 on April 25, 2024, 09:57:40 AMQuote from: David McKeown on April 24, 2024, 10:33:49 PMQuote from: tbrick18 on April 24, 2024, 10:29:15 PMQuote from: armaghniac on April 24, 2024, 08:34:36 PMQuote from: tbrick18 on April 24, 2024, 08:25:27 PMOnly thing for sure is that there are no winners, but hopefully justice is service.
As I said before, it is hard to see how you can prove something 20 years ago beyond reasonable doubt, I doubt there were witnesses other than his wife.
Hearing other cases the PPS didn't prosecute due unlikelihood of conviction even when there is evidence, they must feel there's a high chance of conviction based on what ever evidence they have. No?
I've no idea myself - I'm doing a lot of reading between the lines and may well be getting it wrong.
Today was the 1st appearance. I'd be shocked if the PPS even have the full file yet let alone have made a decision. It would be unusual for them to have the full file yet particularly if the allegations only surfaced in March.
So does that mean the PPS could still decide not prosecute?
I've no idea how these things work, I'd made the assumption it only gets this far if the PPS are already in a position to prosecute.
Interesting.
Police once they arrest someone can question them for a total period of initially 24 hours before they must release them without charge or charge them. That time can be extended firstly by senior by police officers and then by courts. Until that time is used up police can release upon pre charge bail in order to gather further evidence but conditions are largely unenforceable (not going into the details of that here not really relevant). Once police believe they have sufficient evidence to establish a prime facie case they can charge. Alternatively they can release for report. Neither way suggests the evidence is any stronger or weaker than the other it more comes down to the perceived necessity by police for bail conditions and/or a remand. The reason some are charged is essentially that police believe there a likelihood of reoffending if not charged, is there a likelihood of interference with witnesses or is there a likelihood of absconding. Rarely there may be other reasons for charging such as to uphold public confidence but these are rare.
If an individual is charged they can be kept to the next remand court (the next day or two if its over a holiday or weekend) if PSNI feel that remand is necessary to meet the above. Or they can be released on post charge bail by the custody sergeant who will set a date within 28 days for a defendant to appear at court and will set bail conditions. That is what happened in this case.
After charge PSNI will continue to gather evidence and collate the already gathered evidence in order to submit a file to the PPS. Once a file is received it will be allocated to a suitably qualified prosecutor who will review the file and if necessary request the police to gather further evidence. Once the PPS have a full file they will decide whether to prosecute and what charges are to be prosecuted and where they are to be prosecuted.
Asking how long that process will last is like asking how long is a piece of string. I recently had a fast tracked one that took 14 months but I've had ones take anything from 4 months to 3 years. It depends on the amount of evidence, the quality, the likelihood of getting more, how busy the directing officer is, how busy the investigating officer is etc etc.
With a charge sheet case the court will keep under review how long things are taking. Had the case been taken for report then its simply a case of when PPS can get round to it, but defendants aren't on bail in report cases.
Statistically report cases have a higher conviction rate but a lower decision to prosecute rate but there's very little difference.
Ultimately all cases investigated by police are sent to PPS for decision. A lot never see the light of day, some get dropped after being charged and others get prosecuted the whole way to trial. At this moment nothing has happened that I am aware of that could lead to any proper conclusions on the strength of the evidence and we would simply be speculating.
A simple "the PPS might decide not to prosecute" would have sufficed. ;D ;D ;D
Thanks for that - definitely an education for me on the process.
All the more reason for people not to jump to conclusions at this stage of things I guess as anything could happen.
Quote from: tbrick18 on April 25, 2024, 08:41:55 PMQuote from: David McKeown on April 25, 2024, 07:31:48 PMQuote from: tbrick18 on April 25, 2024, 09:57:40 AMQuote from: David McKeown on April 24, 2024, 10:33:49 PMQuote from: tbrick18 on April 24, 2024, 10:29:15 PMQuote from: armaghniac on April 24, 2024, 08:34:36 PMQuote from: tbrick18 on April 24, 2024, 08:25:27 PMOnly thing for sure is that there are no winners, but hopefully justice is service.
As I said before, it is hard to see how you can prove something 20 years ago beyond reasonable doubt, I doubt there were witnesses other than his wife.
Hearing other cases the PPS didn't prosecute due unlikelihood of conviction even when there is evidence, they must feel there's a high chance of conviction based on what ever evidence they have. No?
I've no idea myself - I'm doing a lot of reading between the lines and may well be getting it wrong.
Today was the 1st appearance. I'd be shocked if the PPS even have the full file yet let alone have made a decision. It would be unusual for them to have the full file yet particularly if the allegations only surfaced in March.
So does that mean the PPS could still decide not prosecute?
I've no idea how these things work, I'd made the assumption it only gets this far if the PPS are already in a position to prosecute.
Interesting.
Police once they arrest someone can question them for a total period of initially 24 hours before they must release them without charge or charge them. That time can be extended firstly by senior by police officers and then by courts. Until that time is used up police can release upon pre charge bail in order to gather further evidence but conditions are largely unenforceable (not going into the details of that here not really relevant). Once police believe they have sufficient evidence to establish a prime facie case they can charge. Alternatively they can release for report. Neither way suggests the evidence is any stronger or weaker than the other it more comes down to the perceived necessity by police for bail conditions and/or a remand. The reason some are charged is essentially that police believe there a likelihood of reoffending if not charged, is there a likelihood of interference with witnesses or is there a likelihood of absconding. Rarely there may be other reasons for charging such as to uphold public confidence but these are rare.
If an individual is charged they can be kept to the next remand court (the next day or two if its over a holiday or weekend) if PSNI feel that remand is necessary to meet the above. Or they can be released on post charge bail by the custody sergeant who will set a date within 28 days for a defendant to appear at court and will set bail conditions. That is what happened in this case.
After charge PSNI will continue to gather evidence and collate the already gathered evidence in order to submit a file to the PPS. Once a file is received it will be allocated to a suitably qualified prosecutor who will review the file and if necessary request the police to gather further evidence. Once the PPS have a full file they will decide whether to prosecute and what charges are to be prosecuted and where they are to be prosecuted.
Asking how long that process will last is like asking how long is a piece of string. I recently had a fast tracked one that took 14 months but I've had ones take anything from 4 months to 3 years. It depends on the amount of evidence, the quality, the likelihood of getting more, how busy the directing officer is, how busy the investigating officer is etc etc.
With a charge sheet case the court will keep under review how long things are taking. Had the case been taken for report then its simply a case of when PPS can get round to it, but defendants aren't on bail in report cases.
Statistically report cases have a higher conviction rate but a lower decision to prosecute rate but there's very little difference.
Ultimately all cases investigated by police are sent to PPS for decision. A lot never see the light of day, some get dropped after being charged and others get prosecuted the whole way to trial. At this moment nothing has happened that I am aware of that could lead to any proper conclusions on the strength of the evidence and we would simply be speculating.
A simple "the PPS might decide not to prosecute" would have sufficed. ;D ;D ;D
Thanks for that - definitely an education for me on the process.
All the more reason for people not to jump to conclusions at this stage of things I guess as anything could happen.
That'll be £700 please.
David, regarding the PPS. How many people work there?
So say a case comes to them from the cops. Do a small group of them look at it and decide to prosecute or is it discussed between a big group and an answer is given?
I was just wondering how it works. I hear PPS mentioned a lot but am just wondering how it is behind the scenes.
Quote from: johnnycool on April 25, 2024, 02:11:25 PMQuote from: RedHand88 on April 25, 2024, 01:25:00 PMQuote from: Wildweasel74 on April 25, 2024, 11:09:53 AMSeen some tosser making a dick of himself outside the courtroom when Donaldson came out. Some people do anything to post online.
Major c**k up by the police to bring him out and no transport. Saw a photo of that man and he looks exactly like you expect him to. Bryson seems to think he's a republican.
https://twitter.com/i/status/1783121474527580403 (https://twitter.com/i/status/1783121474527580403)
I'm almost certain Ben Lowry says good to see you to him and seemed to know where he was from.
Could be a republican but highly unlikely.
The "good to see you" greeting was so low key as to mean the sewer rats I have to associate with in order to get a bit of info.
Quote from: marty34 on April 25, 2024, 09:31:05 PMDavid, regarding the PPS. How many people work there?
So say a case comes to them from the cops. Do a small group of them look at it and decide to prosecute or is it discussed between a big group and an answer is given?
I was just wondering how it works. I hear PPS mentioned a lot but am just wondering how it is behind the scenes.
Not sure of the exact numbers but around 150 - 200 prosecutors and 300 - 350 support staff split across different regions and specialisms. Cases will be effectively triaged to the correct team and level of seniority. Ultimately it's the directing officers responsibility but they will know seek help and assistance from colleagues and superiors if necessary.