Messages

Thanks, Deel, I would have missed it otherwise. They were great, the lot of them but Luke was something else!
RIP.
Same to Ronnie and Ciaran. There won't be the likes of them again.

[Why we can do this sometimes and not others is a f*king mystery though!]

I think the hype and pressure thing is overstated - we came from 6 points down to beat the dubs in Croker and against Tyrone in 04, they levelled it with a goal and looked set to push on and win it but instead we ended up winning by 3 points. Why we can do this sometimes and not others is a f*king mystery though!

KMcL and B Gibbons from Knockmore prob deserve a run in the corners during the league next year.

It sure is a mystery and it doesn't look as if we will get to the bottom of it any time soon. But if we look outside the county for answers, we may find that we are not alone. I do agree with Moysider when he says piseogs and hoodoos etc. have nothing to do with it.
Throughout this decade there have been many times where you'd have a steward's enquiry if we were talking racing. It is easy to overlook the fact that Cork imploded against Kerry in the final of 2007. Kerry won pulling up and the margin was 10 points. Yet Cork had earlier run them very close in the Munster final. (1-15 to 1-13)
Kerry had bombed against Meath in a semi in 2001, (?)  totally against form and Meath in turn collapsed against Galway in that final. They also had gone in as short odds favourites in that game.
Dublin could match Mayo anytime for unexpectedly falling apart. The lark of bonding with their fans on the Hill has backfired most of the time and the team is hyped up out of all proportion. I think it's very reasonable to say that the Dubs suffer from the pressure of fans' expectations and the attention of the media in equal measure.
There have many other examples where 'formlines' were very wide of the mark but I am only mentioning the most spectacular ones.
I think we had no hangups about history or anything else back in '96 but the media attention and the fans did get to the team in the drawn game. How else could one explain the collapse in form as we led by six points with only a quarter or less to go?
The Mayo lads were mighty that day and only the Meath full back line had any sort of control over their opponents.
But that was also the year that the media turned the final into a big time event and the spotlight was turned on the players. Meath ad their fans had recent experience of winning finals but the hype in Mayo passed all bounds.
Maughan's pleas to supporters to tone things down and ease the pressure on the lads fell on deaf ears.
Things were not quite as bad in '04 but again Maughan felt the need to call for restraint and again he was largely unheeded. The same was the case in '06 when Mickey Moran asked for his team to be left alone to get on with the preparations.
I don't know what Paul Caffrey or Pat Gilroy asked Dubs' fans to do but I imagine they would feel the same as Maughan and Moran.
This year, I feel O'Mahony and his team made good progress and should have gone at least one step further.
To have any chance against Kerry, they'd need to have beaten Meath out of sight in spite of woeful reffing and the hand of history and anything else you can think of. Sure, there are lessons to be learned but I think some sort of start has been made.

Did anyone hear the Cain Ward interview on Newstalk? One of the most honest sports interviews I've heard in a long time.

He completely dismissed ideas of romance leading Meath to a semi-final and history getting on top of Mayo which the interviewer kept angling towards. The more honest he was the more the interviewer realised he was asking stupid questions.

For those of you who didn't read the Tribune yesterday, Ewan MacKenna had an interesting piece about Mayo's defeat the previous week and how the mindset of Mayo people generally contributed to this loss.
I don't disagree at all with the general thrust of his argument and I thought those of us who follow Mayo should take note.
To summarise some of his main points, I agree that Mayo arrived in town on a mission to avenge past wrongs.
Meath turned up to win a quarter-final.
Mayo media and fans must take a lot of the blame because of the pressure was on the players to overcome history and we did suffer from the decisions of an inept referee.  MacKenna mentioned Liam McHale and how he won't speak to Pat McEaney because he sent him off all of 13 years ago. Now, that was hardly a help to O'Mahony as he tried to keep the team focused on the task in hand.
McHale deserved the red card. He set some leadership standards by running in from a distance started clattering lugholes all around. It was rough luck on Mayo that he got the line but he was guilty of a sending off offence. Period.
It was tough on Mayo that McEaney did not decide to pick out a player of equal value to Meath and send him off to balance the loss on both sides but he didn't.  MacKenna got it right, IMO, when he said McHale's resentment is a product of his environment.
I'd go further and say that this perceived sense of rough justice is holding both team and fans back in a big way.
The report went on to say that Mayo continue to accommodate the best 15 players in the county when selection should be about using the best guys to do the job. I certainly accept that you'd never guess how competitive the Mayo club scene is when you think of the county team's performance. I just wish we had a couple of hardy roots like David Brady out there and to hell with the artistes.
MacKenna makes the point that unlike Galway, we shouldn't throw a tantrum and sack the manager; O'Mahony is making progress. I also think Johnno is at long last on the right track and I'm not nearly as disappointed as last year or the one before. His team is starting to take shape and next year should be a better organised and more mature outfit. But he will continue to go nowhere as long as he has to depend on those who were around in '04 and '06; in the 3 serious championship games this season, I noticed one worrying trait.
Mayo started out very well but became rattled when the opposition steadied up and began to come at them. The Galway and Meath matches were ideal for leaders to emerge. I would have expected some of the seasoned hands to have stepped up to the mark and steady the younger lads around them but this did not materialise. For most of them the best days are over and we will have to look to the u21s and minors of recent years for salvation.
The players are there alright but it will take time. We also need a bit more luck and a bit less Liam McHale & co.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uWow42TCwzg&feature=fvw

The thread title is very apt; there is really nothing I can say.
Except possibly that  a few health care people should keep her stepfather company for  year or two.

The happiest day following my county?
Mayo just don't do happy days!
We generally have bad days and we have badder days and that generally is our lot.
Effing the ref, win or lose, is what we specialise in and we have got quite good at that.
We blame the poor, blind so and so no matter what the result is.
I suppose my happiest day is the day the bloody ref is really as bad as we make him out to be and that usually means every time we play.
But the rest of yiz had better watch out as we are also expert at bouncing back, ready for more. Next year things will be different and we really will be at a loss when Sam comes our way and we will have nothing to moan about.
You have all been warned; Johnno is going to get you and I'll be stumped for excuses.

A bit like that song that started "I get knocked down and I get up again". Should that be the new Mayo County song

I'm afraid it already is and the trouble with starting all over again is that you need to get knocked down first.
Never fear, Bro, things are about to change.
The West's Awake will be heard and feared throughout the land, especially on the third Sunday of September 2010 and indeed on the same date for many years in the future.

sorry sam but i don't think we need a new thread re mayo enough has been said on the mayo v's meath thread time to sit back till february enjoy the winter and the games of 25 top prize been a turkey that you have to kill and pluck yourself , the turf is all home the hay is saved and please god the government will sort out the farmers reps so sit back enjoy the Ai final and we will see what happens next year.

Bang on DR; I really wish all Mayo fans could think the same way.
It's time to give the players and management team a breather and let them lick their wounds in private. There isn't a single mother's son amongst them that didn't give it his best shot and if we are feeling the need to lean on each others' shoulders, the lads must be feeling 10 times worse.
Mind you, I do appreciate that SOS is feeling the pinch over there. If I were in OZ, I'd need my comfort blanket too.  But the lads are all amateurs and need space and time to prepare for another go next year and they can and will pick up vibes from those around them.
I'm being deadly serious here:
It seems to me that Mayo teams and fans are getting too accustomed to the role of gallant losers and kind of enjoy getting the commiserations of others when we inevitably go belly up yet again. Eff the tag of romantics on a hopeless quest for something we will never find. It will always be a case of getting robbed by incompetent refs, blind umpires, nasty bullies and whatever you're having yourself.
BTW; I can't disagree with anything that SOS has listed.
We do indeed have cautious grounds for optimism and Id wish the team well and encourage them to regroup when the time comes around.
After all, stuffing the heron chokers was all the manager set his sights on this year

I am calling on all hurling fans who subscribe to the hurling page to boycot this section of the forums and post any GAA related topic that is not solely a football issue on the Hurling Threads.  Topics like "Season Tickets" RTE, Pundits etc.  I think it is a shame that some posters hold hurling in such contempt that they have to criticise it so much to an extent that they "had to watch it as a double header" but have no interest in it.

Boycott the GAA section and post on the hurling thread only, even the Cork strikers and the GPA have more solidarity with the real GAA than some but not all on the GAA section.

Bud, the problem for me is that if posters were to boycott the football section of the board and switch en masse to the hurling end instead it would be a case of replacing one form of discrimination with another.
I'd like to see threads of mutual interest posted in both but I have no desire to impose any sort of control over posters' freedom of choice. If the majority of board members opt to join in on football threads and stay aloof from the hurling section I think the reason is clear; the majority have more interest in football than in hurling.
I love hurling but I don't want to force my views on anyone else. I will always keep track of the Mayo hurlers and go to watch them most times- if they are playing anywhere inside 40-50 miles from Dublin.
Now, many Mayo heads got up after the football game last Sunday and tried to get far away from the place as quickly as possible. I'd imagine watching another game of any sort was the last thing on their minds. For many, apart from the sickening, there was the matter of beating afternoon traffic jams and some needed to get back to milk the cows or the likes. I'd imagine that many Meath fans were thinking along the same lines.
If the popularity of hurling is ever to increase, there is only one way to bring this about and that is to promote the game in the so-called football-only counties. I'd go further and say there are two major reasons why this isn't proving successful. Many county boards don't give a damn about hurling and see it as major pain in the butt. The Mayo county board is just one of the many to treat the hurlers as second-class citizens. Hurling means extra expense and could prove a distraction for dual players.
But there is another reason and that is an ingrained snobbishness amongst hurling people in the traditional hurling counties. Some are worse than others. To those aristocrats, football is a bog man's game and they don't want to see it gaining any sort of profile in their home patch.

[Mayo lost 18-4 on their own kickouts which is a shocking statistic]

I actually thought its was defence and midfield that were mayo's problems. The Problems with shot selection in the last 15 mins- came from players who weren't forwards- so I'd disagree with you on the mayo forwards. If I was a meath man I'd be asking myself how mayo still scored 1-15. I actually thought Mayo did ok up front last Sunday but were ripped apart of the breaks and defence. Mayo lost 18-4 on their own kickouts which is a shocking statistic.

Where did you get that from? its a staggering stat!

I know, luder, it is a shocking statistic but I have read it elsewhere also. I think it was on the RTE site but yesterday wasn't my day for reasoned analysis! I can't be sure where I saw it.
Today, I'm seeing things with a bit more detachment; O'Mahony may indeed have a long term strategy. If he has, I think he knows that he wont get places until he has a full squad from the u21 teams of the last few years  and this will take another year at the very least.
The midfielders on Sunday were the two most experienced players on the field. They failed to produce the goods as they did against Galway. I'm betting that neither will figure in his plans for next year. I'd go further and say that Andy, Peadar and possibly Trevor will be all of the old squad still around come next season.
I read somewhere that the average age of the present side is only 23. It's a very big ask to expect them to stay calm and focused in a pressure game at Headquarters. It was the time for the older hands to rise to the occasion and provide leadership for the young lads and they failed to do this. I don't know how many of the lads were playing for the first time in Croker but even an u21 final couldn't compare with the pressures they were under last day—and the likes of Liam McHale bringing up his personal grievances in public was no help either. Same goes for Maughan with his ever so subtle damning with faint praise all the time.
FFS, McHale got the line that day because he deserved to go! That's black and white. He ran in and started swinging clatters all around him and McEananey was perfectly within his rights to show him the red card. The fact is that only 3 or so would still be on the field if the ref applied the rules. The tanned one was as guilty as anyone else.
Any other considerations are secondary to this fact and I wish he'd just shut up.
O'Mahony stated that he was aiming for a Connacht title this year. Now that I've settled down a bit, I have to say that was a fair enough goal to aim for under the circumstance

Fine display by Meath yesterday, can anyone tell me why every year Mayo get hyped out of all proportion (like the dubs really), did Mayo even fancy a crack at Kerry when all is said and done ?

So; what's another year?
Johnny Logan's song could be our county anthem.
Looking at the greater picture, we have become so used to being hit by bad luck, poor referees and shots fated to always hit the post on the wrong side. Yesterday was just another day for me in a long, long list of what might have beens.
It seems the feeling that we are always going to get knocked off the rails somehow is deeply ingrained in our collective psyche and this resignation seems to affect our players as well.
I was worried about Keith Duggan's book when it was published because it provided proof for many that we are indeed condemned to go on and on, always being denied our just desserts by forces outside our control.
I lived in Bective for 12 years and have many genuine friends from that area and some of them are very much involved with county affairs. To a man, they have always maintained that Mayo teams are softies and Meath will always beat them. 
As late as yesterday morning, a few of them I met up with were feeling very confident about their chances; to a man and a couple of women too, they were mighty relieved that it was Mayo and not Galway they were going to face. I'd go further and say that Kerry would have preferred it if Mayo had somehow got over Meath and were to be their next opponents.
Colm O'Rourke summed it up well in one of his first pieces in the Sunday Independent back in the early nineties. His colleagues and he never considered defeat whenever they met Mayo. The football was always going to be pretty to watch but the end would always be the same; when Meath upped the ante, Mayo would knuckle under. How many other counties take the same for granted?
Without doubt, luck wasn't on our side yesterday and the same applied many times in the past. But I wonder at the same time that if we had found ourselves 6 points up with 20 minutes to go, would we have self-destructed.

This malaise doesn't seem to exist at u21 level and yesterday we had lots of lads with medals to prove it. Even a manager with a proven track record made no difference either. For me, the result yesterday will reinforce the "Oh woe is me" mentality and we will now find it even harder to ever get to the Promised Land.
Yep, we sure had our quota of hard luck yesterday and that's for sure but a team with a tougher mindset would never have let Meath back into the game. If the roles were reversed, would Meath have obliged us in the same way and obligingly gone off the boil?
I wish Meath every success and hope they go all the way. They can't be held responsible for Mayo's mental frailties.

Personally, I don't think he deserved that

I teetotally agree with you.

This won't go down well - but it's my honest opinion ...

I think Meath are an average team

Mayo should beat them ... with a struggle

Connacht football is not at the same standard as Leinster, Munster or Ulster football and I expect when Mayo meet a good team like Kerry/Cork/Tyrone .... even a Kildare or Dublin ... Mayo (Galway even) will get stuffed

Connacht people will find that their football is behind the rest of the country

JMohan, I respect your opinion but I disagree, In your logic answer me this, Why didnt Sligo get stuffed so by Kerry in there backyard?, and to be honest Id class mayo a bit ahead of us but it doesnt mean mayo will beat Kerry. No chance mayo will get stuffed though imo.

Fair point about Sligo - though You could point to the 'troubles' Kerry were having.
Sligo are a tough team to beat and the motivation to play Sligo would be alot less than Dublin, Tyrone, Cork etc - I think that's a fair point.

Mayo are a decent team, but both teams going at it 100% ?

Ya was waiting for that one, getting a lynching by the own supporters for losing to Sligo at home wouldnt motivate Kerry at all. I mean it was all down to Kerry playing bad and us playing above ourselves, there all the cliches arent they?

Whilst I take on board that Kerry probably played better yday but werent they let, Dublins FB line wouldnt be a patch on ours IMO but sure whos heard of Harrison McGuire Donovan before? We were lucky we had our strengths were Kerry were strong so it kinda balanced itself out...and thus ensured a tight game is the reality of what happened.

Ya know what??
I agree fully with you, Sligonian, and I've no problem saying it either.
Kerry didn't go out against Sligo for the sake of making up numbers; they were getting a lot of stick from their own supporters who are as unreasonable as we are.
Their players wouldn't have relished the thought of going back home after being bet by a crowd of nobodies. A bit of hard luck and the lack of a killer instinct stopped the nobodies from becoming somebodies that day.  The very same could be said about your match with Galway.
But Mayo too and lots of other counties could go on and on about the ones who got away from them. There are a few Kerry heads I know who'd pass a wet weekend moaning about their own hard luck stories.
Sligo seems to be short of a few quality players to be the finished article but if they manage to come up just two or three, the rest of us can watch out.
Ourselves nearly got nabbed by Galway at the finish but weren't and there's the difference.  We went in expecting to win and we did. Sligo went out after listening to their fans and even their county board officials saying that a good result would be to finish less than four or five points behind. Yee half-expected to lose and yee got what yee anticipating. (That's enough bloody yees for a while.)
I'm a bit concerned about Meath next weekend. They remind me of Galway. You could bate them off the pitch but you can't take your eye off them until they are back in their civvies again. Meath have fought their way out of too many lost causes in the past for any one to take them lightly. The players may have changed but the self-belief lives on.
I think Mayo will win this one by a few points but I won't relax until it's all done and dusted.  As long as none of them go out thinking of revenge for '96 or that sort of thing, we should get by.

Maybe Mayo will get beaten by Meath.

If we win, another thrashing might be in the offing for us against Kerry.

But don't be writing off Connacht Football. Mayo and Galway are both Division 1 teams. Minor championships for Galway and Ros in past 3 years, Mayo coming close. Good showings at under 21 level. I think both would compete with Kildare and Dublin and have no doubt that they would beat Wicklow.

Indeed Barney, Meath could well hockey us. On the other hand we could give them a dose of what we handed out to Roscommon. Dublin were hopeless against Westmeath and stepped it up somewhat against Kildare. On the basis of that game, they were installed as big favourites against Kerry.
Not to be outdone, Kerry were totally inept in all their games up to yesterday and while I'm at it, Tyrone seemed to determined to disgrace themselves against Mayo last year before they stepped it up; as Kerry did yesterday.
Now, if anyone can draw a form line through all of this and claims that what's still to come will go according to form, I'd say he'd be either a brave man or a fool.
A brave man wouldn't even try..
Back about five to six years ago, we had a series of inexplicable dips in form from some of the major sides. Remember Kerry vs. Meath and then Meath in turn against Galway? You could include Mayo against Kerry in '04.
The young wan is a behavioural psychologist and doing pretty well at that sort of crap.
She came out and told me that the seesaw in form made sense. The players are only amateurs and still act and think like amateurs. They are being subjected to pressures from all sides to a degree unheard of before.  Worst of all, they're being subjected to all sorts of psychological tests and are given diet and training regimes to follow that mess up their ordinary life.
All of those who set the schedules and give the motivational talks wouldn't know what a clatter off David Brady or Francie Bellew feels like and can't really connect with what goes on out on the field. Video analysis, sez she, only serves to turn players into robots; they're being conditioned to act according to a preset formula and spontaneity and natural instincts fall by the wayside.
She further said that many of the players we were talking about back then will go on to develop severe emotional and psychological problems when they retire and are suddenly cut adrift from all those attempts to manipulate their bodies and minds.

Its there for us on Sunday if we want it bad enough.

I have fancied Mayo to go all the way this year and nothing I saw this weekend changes my mind.

You've certainly been pushing Mayo hard all Summer but to be honest I don't think they would live with Kerry on today's display (neither would we before anyone starts). I'm sure the Mayo lads would have preferred the Dubs any day of the week as they have proved they can be a bit flaky down through the years near the business end of the championship. That said Kerry may not reach the same dizzy heights again in the semi-final but even 80% of that performance today would probably still be good enough. Anyway all this is getting a bit ahead of ourselves as Meath are probably feeling slightly overlooked.

I'm 101% with you on this.

if the mayo keeper came out for the ball instead of letting it hop over the bar it ye could have won it 

WOW. Finally someone has solved the mystery!
So if we stopped the ball from bouning over the bar we could have won it? That's great, thanks for that. Such a radical and insightful analysis. 

Sorry, slightly sarcastic there 
But I think it's fair to say Mayo people have heard and thought about that bouncing ball more than enough times since 96

Tubberman!!
You being sarcastic?
It's a word I'd have never link with you.
(Maybe a few others okay but I thought it was reasoned and balanced analysis all the way- until this admission.)
However, to be (slightly) serious here, I hope our beloved team and our equally beloved manager keep their eyes on the ball next week and don't get distracted by thoughts of bouncing balls of 13 years ago.
Batin' Meath should be just one step along the road and nothing more.

However, I do have a gripe about what happened in '96 and it has nothing to do with bouncing balls or Liam McHale- or Colm Coyle for that matter.
Mayo lads here will know I mentioned this one before so I'll keep this short and sweet:
Before the '96 replay Pat McEaney went to both dressing rooms.
He discussed his interpretation of the rules with the players.
He stated that he was not going to allow quick free kicks to be taken.
(BTW; all this is according to some of the Mayo players)
Coming up to the end, Meath got a free in close to goal.
Mayo defenders were slow to take up position as the same ref had said there would be no quick frees. (Yup; I have watched endless replays and they were slow to form up.)
However, Geraghty got away with taking this one quickly and we all know what happened next.
I have absolutely nothing personal against any Meath player or fan but the same can't be said about the ref - if what members of the Mayo team said in public is true.
The hoor should've  been tarred and feathered long ago but I'm still living in hope.