"the kids are alright!!??"

[lawnseed]

I've four preteen kids. I wondering is it my fault that the second fella came home from school and announced the teachers strike is off because "some man McGuiness is dead" I was a little surprised that he hadn't heard of martin McGuiness he's 11.
I asked them what history they are taught.. they can name the succession of English kings and queens and know about the stone age and iron age but don't know about the GPO or 1916, They're not taught about partition or the hungerstrikers or the peace process..
where do you start? I don't want to embitter them but in my version of history that's inevitable.
So is it "once upon a time there were four green fields?" or there was this fella bobby sands?
Shouldn't the schools be teaching this? or maybe there should be history lessons somewhere that they can go.?
My mother remembers going to vote and unionists/Orangemen spitting on them and trying to trip them up as they entered the polling station is this the type of thing the modern kid needs to know?

I know someone is going say its all at the touch of a button- so is how to cook Chinese food but we all go to the takeaway.

Have you tackled this or what's your best solution

Maybe theyre better off not knowing..
       

[guy crouchback]

the winners write the histories. 
in the south we got the opposite it was 800 years of oppression with a clear line of differentiation between the bad english the good Irish with no grey areas  all all irish history stopped with independence, the rest was far to messy.

in secondary school if you studied history for leaving cert it was a little bit more nuanced but huge parts were left out.

i have a great interest in history and hope to pass it on to my kids but i dont think the way ill do it is buy giving my version of history as opposed to what they get at school but rather show them how interesting history can be, from the Celts to the Romans to the local area, bits of everything, exciting stories.
if they take to it then they will become interested in their own history and will want to know more.

[J70]

I think I was an adult before I ever read anything that set the English conquest and occupation of Ireland in any context except "England bad/evil, poor little Ireland good". No mention of how wider European geopolitics played a role. The Spanish Armada was basically the noble Spanish coming to help out their fellow downtrodden catholics out of the goodness of their hearts.

I guess lawnseed's kids are getting the opposite side of the same coin in the schooling in the north?

[Minder]

Where have you been Lawnseed ?

[stew]

the winners write the histories. 
in the south we got the opposite it was 800 years of oppression with a clear line of differentiation between the bad english the good Irish with no grey areas  all all irish history stopped with independence, the rest was far to messy.

in secondary school if you studied history for leaving cert it was a little bit more nuanced but huge parts were left out.

i have a great interest in history and hope to pass it on to my kids but i dont think the way ill do it is buy giving my version of history as opposed to what they get at school but rather show them how interesting history can be, from the Celts to the Romans to the local area, bits of everything, exciting stories.
if they take to it then they will become interested in their own history and will want to know more.

Who lost exactly???

There are no winners or losers in the north, only survivors and victims, the brits never beat us nor us them, look at the GFA for proof.

[OgraAnDun]

How do you secure the Union? Make sure children from a nationalist background don't have a clue what happened in the past.

[lawnseed]

Where have you been Lawnseed ?

well minder ive been to hell in a handcart and back..
the physical health hasn't been so good and following that.. lets say I haven't been myself

I'm back on here hopefully for some decent craic and maybe some sensible debate/conversation.

I genuinely feel ill at ease just now in terms of what's going on around me. brexit shite, Scotland referendum, rhi, unionists in the minority in Stormont, possible nordieland referendum, possible united Ireland... theres just so much going on all at the same time where does a man start?

It seems like I have to start right here and educate my own kids on stuff that has went on during my short life never mind the last hundred years.   

[Milltown Row2]

We had a curriculum to follow at school and that's that, it's down to kids reading up on it themselves and making a judgement based on their own findings and feelings about it.... never embed your own thoughts but certainly play devils advocate with them over views you differ on... I've two teenage non religious girls who could not give a stuff about the need and current events! Bliss

[guy crouchback]

the winners write the histories. 
in the south we got the opposite it was 800 years of oppression with a clear line of differentiation between the bad english the good Irish with no grey areas  all all irish history stopped with independence, the rest was far to messy.

in secondary school if you studied history for leaving cert it was a little bit more nuanced but huge parts were left out.

i have a great interest in history and hope to pass it on to my kids but i dont think the way ill do it is buy giving my version of history as opposed to what they get at school but rather show them how interesting history can be, from the Celts to the Romans to the local area, bits of everything, exciting stories.
if they take to it then they will become interested in their own history and will want to know more.

Who lost exactly???

There are no winners or losers in the north, only survivors and victims, the brits never beat us nor us them, look at the GFA for proof.

the winners write the history books is just a saying, i'm simply saying you will get different interpretations of history based on the perspective you are looking at it from.

[Esmarelda]

How about this for trying to write the history books

http://www.mercurynews.com/2017/01/18/california-lawmaker-wants-schools-to-teach-children-about-alleged-russian-interference-in-election/

[screenexile]

Preteen is a bit early for all that I would have thought it's still a fairly basic curriculum at that age. We started to learn about the troubles in 5th year if I remember right and that was only because we were in the NICCEA exam board.

Other schools who were doing a different History exam from the non NI board didn't look at it. I'd be happy enough for kids to know that stuff when they get to 15/16.

[The Gs Man]

My girl (13), is learning about the Troubles next year (3rd year in the North) she said.

I tend to give my 3 kids (13, 10 and 6) only bits and pieces of info and only when they ask.

[johnneycool]

the winners write the histories. 
in the south we got the opposite it was 800 years of oppression with a clear line of differentiation between the bad english the good Irish with no grey areas  all all irish history stopped with independence, the rest was far to messy.

in secondary school if you studied history for leaving cert it was a little bit more nuanced but huge parts were left out.

i have a great interest in history and hope to pass it on to my kids but i dont think the way ill do it is buy giving my version of history as opposed to what they get at school but rather show them how interesting history can be, from the Celts to the Romans to the local area, bits of everything, exciting stories.
if they take to it then they will become interested in their own history and will want to know more.

Who lost exactly???

There are no winners or losers in the north, only survivors and victims, the brits never beat us nor us them, look at the GFA for proof.

the winners write the history books in just a saying, i'm simply saying you will get different interpretations of history based on the perspective you are looking at it from.

Funnily enough I'd this issue recently as the wee lad was learning about the Irish "famine" (calling it that irks me enough).

He'd to answer questions based on a couple of paragraphs he'd to read and one was "Do you think the government did enough to help the people?"

He was about to answer "Yes, because they set up soup kitchens" and when you read the paragraphs that was indeed in it and very little else.
Then I went off one one, explaining how that whilst the potatoes were diseased that all the other food stuffs were shipped off the east coast of Ireland to England, you had to renounce your catholic faith to get soup in these kitchens and that the Queen of England turned back aid from Turkey  as they'd given far more than her and it would embarrass her.

I don't want to blight him with bigotry, but I won't let him get his only understanding of Irish history from text books written with a very British slant.

[haranguerer]

Give them as much information as possible. You may not be able to get them into it, but have it available at least.

One thing growing up here did for me was give me a very healthy cynicism for anything I was told, especially from official outlets - you'd see stories on the news and you'd know it was rubbish. That remains a problem here - unionists believe what what they were told.

As important as any of the knowledge you might pass  on is the awareness that there are differences depending on viewpoint, and at the end of the day we each have to make up our own mind on the 'truth'.

[Billys Boots]

https://www.amazon.co.uk/History-Ireland-250-Episodes/

I'm reading this (loo book) at the moment, and it is certainly different to the way I remember (foggily) on how history was taught in National School.  Ireland wasn't really a nation at the time of the Spanish Armada; more a collection of self-interested chieftains and warlords, who pissed off English monarchs and colonialists individually and (sometimes) collectively.  Interesting and recommended book.