Stormont Assembly Elections 2017

[Minder]

Dead cert that the DUP want to rev up the polarising politics to blind/scare the stupid masses, let the talks fail and go for fresh elections. Personally think too much of SF's language has been too heavy handed and fairly self indulgent and is playing into the DUP's plans.

There is undeniably a desire on the part of DUP and SF to wipe out UUP and SDLP respectively. And they each sense blood

Yeah absolutely, they know they are going to be wedded to each other for a long time (maybe SF will be the biggest party but DUP will be their partners) at Stormont and want absolute power.

[vallankumous]

actually think that SF should not have pushed the end of unionist domination point, subtly they should have pushed shared future, working together etc
then appeal to sdlp supporters that they need a bigger mandate to push the equality points etc

the way it is going they are now portrayed as the boogeyman and its playing into the united unionism hands
if we don't stick together you will be frog marched into a united Ireland

Yes, I think you're right.
It's very difficult to do though. It was a major talking point among journalists and very hard to play down a victory. it could back fire now though.

Unionists could seek another election and their only target is one or two more seats and it's a victory. it's easy to see where unionism went wrong in this election but it's not easy to see where nationalism went right. If SF bringing down Stromont was a boost to them, they've played that card. It's impossible to know if the nationalist community are angry. They had their vote and got a result. Is that anger still there? Have the DUP been punished enough?
You seen with the reaction to FF after the economy went tits up, the electorate felt they'd punished them enough very soon after that. Also, with the loss of the majority and the veto and the widely accepted fact that nesbitt made a mistake, it's hard to see Unionism transfer across as much in a new election.

[LCohen]

There are multiple unionist parties because there are  multiple strands of unionism. Even the current suite of parties are themselves coalitions (apart from TUV which only comes in one form). Within the UUP vote there are people who could not vote for the DUP brand, or could cosy up to the Simon Hamilton side of the party but not the Edwin  Poots side. Alliance would be a big recipient of votes if politicians polarise non-sectarian unionism

The last 100 odd years of voting would suggest otherwise
Stop applying logic when it comes to unionism

Are you saying everyone in Northern Ireland is sectarian or just the ones who disagree with you on a united ireland?

I would vote to remain in U.K. So would the wife. Are we sectarian?
[/quote

My reply to your post didn't refer to sectarianism or the UI agenda so why are you bringing that up
Your post was in relation to the subject of different strains of unionism and they are to polerised now to implement a collective voting strategy
My reply was to suggest that when it came to keeping the nationalist representation in office in a minority the unionist always collaborated regardless of their unionist ideology 
How you can deduce that I implied everyone in N Ireland is sectarian is beyond me
You and your good wife has every right to vote to remain in the UK and it doesn't make you sectarian
But it does make you a unionist ( you certainly have the confrontational gene )which is your choice
And I respect your right to vote that way

You didn't specify which part of my post you disagreed with so presumed you disagreed with all of it (including the existence of non sectarian unionists).

Of course there are shades of unionism and of course in 2017 and beyond there are unionists who will not vote for DUP or some extended form of DUP even if it was the only expressly unionist candidate on offer.

There are definitely unionists who don't just vote to suppress nationalist representation and the are unionists who embrace nationalist representation but find SF hard to take due to their "special " history. Many in the south agree.

What makes me confrontational?

[Milltown Row2]

So people complain that the media keep referring to NI politics and Green and Orange... the vast majority of this thread has been the same thing.

The odd post relates to education/jobs/welfare/hospital waiting lists/welbeing/infrastructure/wages/less tax on the poor more tax on the rich....

Dire stuff indeed.. get out and vote so that we can keep themus out!! Anyone who votes based on that is a clampit (IMHO) 

[vallankumous]

So people complain that the media keep referring to NI politics and Green and Orange... the vast majority of this thread has been the same thing.

The odd post relates to education/jobs/welfare/hospital waiting lists/welbeing/infrastructure/wages/less tax on the poor more tax on the rich....

Dire stuff indeed.. get out and vote so that we can keep themus out!! Anyone who votes based on that is a clampit (IMHO) 

It's more nationalism and unionism than green and orange.

Same as if the big issue in the UK being in or out of the union with Europe. Honest to good politics.
green and Orange is used by lazy journalists for easy understanding of a dumb audience.

[LCohen]

So people complain that the media keep referring to NI politics and Green and Orange... the vast majority of this thread has been the same thing.

The odd post relates to education/jobs/welfare/hospital waiting lists/welbeing/infrastructure/wages/less tax on the poor more tax on the rich....

Dire stuff indeed.. get out and vote so that we can keep themus out!! Anyone who votes based on that is a clampit (IMHO) 

Not enough people think as you do but many do and more and more all the time. For the time being the entrenched orange and green merchants are the ones more likely to vote.

The real uk government position is not as a shield for unionism but to allow all of us to stew in our own juices until we work it out for ourselves. The senseless green and orange voters are pointlessly delaying us all in the stew

[omagh_gael]

Gerry Adam's face in front of the cameras everyday of the week is pointless, imo, for increasing the nationalist vote and a fillip for the DUP if a re-election is to be won. He is an unnecessary distraction, unless their long game is to disrupt the system and push for direct rule. A risky game to play.

[Taylor]

So people complain that the media keep referring to NI politics and Green and Orange... the vast majority of this thread has been the same thing.

The odd post relates to education/jobs/welfare/hospital waiting lists/welbeing/infrastructure/wages/less tax on the poor more tax on the rich....

Dire stuff indeed.. get out and vote so that we can keep themus out!! Anyone who votes based on that is a clampit (IMHO) 

Completely agree.
I think I called it depressing before the election..........after the election I would call it the same old depressing shite.
Usuns v themmuns

[Tony Baloney]

Gerry Adam's face in front of the cameras everyday of the week is pointless, imo, for increasing the nationalist vote and a fillip for the DUP if a re-election is to be won. He is an unnecessary distraction, unless their long game is to disrupt the system and push for direct rule. A risky game to play.

As some of the lads have said it could be a direct ploy to have a total carve-up in a snap election where the Unionists come out for the DUP in force (especially with Gerry making headlines today saying a UI is now a possibility!) leaving the UUP in tatters and same for SF and SDLP. SF and DUP simply cannot lose from another election. I think it is a done deal at this stage. However, after the next election someone has to give in as it will still be Arlene in position so is she going to step down when she has her POC back or will SF remove the requirement for her to step aside. I woudl say she would step aside on the basis that an increase in the DUP vote will have "secured the union".

[Jim_Murphy_74]

There are multiple unionist parties because there are  multiple strands of unionism. Even the current suite of parties are themselves coalitions (apart from TUV which only comes in one form). Within the UUP vote there are people who could not vote for the DUP brand, or could cosy up to the Simon Hamilton side of the party but not the Edwin  Poots side. Alliance would be a big recipient of votes if politicians polarise non-sectarian unionism

I think that DUP recognise that danger.  Hence I think they will play a more reasonable card (and as I posted earlier hope that a bit of Shinner arrogance will cause things to run aground with their dealings with Brokenshire) and hope to capture some disaffected UUP to get them back ahead of Shinners.

As Milltown Row2 points out that seems to be what it's all about: no one particularly interested in what policies would make Northern Ireland a better place.  If you abide by the adage that you get the politicians you deserve then for the majority it is about Usuns v themmuns

Gerry Adam's face in front of the cameras everyday of the week is pointless, imo, for increasing the nationalist vote and a fillip for the DUP if a re-election is to be won. He is an unnecessary distraction, unless their long game is to disrupt the system and push for direct rule. A risky game to play.

His presence and his comments today convey that Shinners are more interested in bigger things than getting Stormont back running.  Grist to Arlene's mill about "radical republican agenda". 

If this goes to another election, she will be playing the "I told you so" card.

/Jim.

[north_antrim_hound]

So people complain that the media keep referring to NI politics and Green and Orange... the vast majority of this thread has been the same thing.

The odd post relates to education/jobs/welfare/hospital waiting lists/welbeing/infrastructure/wages/less tax on the poor more tax on the rich....

Dire stuff indeed.. get out and vote so that we can keep themus out!! Anyone who votes based on that is a clampit (IMHO) 

Valid point but the way most nationalist voted impeded a party that used a veto to over rule any legislation they did not adhere to and used their political powers to line their own pockets at every opportunity
It was bordering on a dictatorship
Do you really think that if SF were in the same position they would act the same
If they did they would lose more of the nationalist electorate than the DUP did
Imagine they have gained 20 odd thousand more votes
It's very much a case of " what do you have to do to get the sack around here"

When it comes to the big two I don't buy this "one is as bad as the other"
I wouldn't describe anyone who tactically voted to over throw the corrupt DUP as clampits
I would describe anyone who voted DUP as An electorate that puts the union before an effcient government that concentrates on what's best for all the people

[Minder]

So people complain that the media keep referring to NI politics and Green and Orange... the vast majority of this thread has been the same thing.

The odd post relates to education/jobs/welfare/hospital waiting lists/welbeing/infrastructure/wages/less tax on the poor more tax on the rich....

Dire stuff indeed.. get out and vote so that we can keep themus out!! Anyone who votes based on that is a clampit (IMHO) 

Valid point but the way most nationalist voted impeded a party that used a veto to over rule any legislation they did not adhere to and used their political powers to line their own pockets at every opportunity
It was bordering on a dictatorship
Do you really think that if SF were in the same position they would act the same
If they did they would lose more of the nationalist electorate than the DUP did
Imagine they have gained 20 odd thousand more votes
It's very much a case of " what do you have to do to get the sack around here"

When it comes to the big two I don't buy this "one is as bad as the other"
I wouldn't describe anyone who tactically voted to over throw the corrupt DUP as clampits
I would describe anyone who voted DUP as An electorate that puts the union before an effcient government that concentrates on what's best for all the people

SF gave themselves £700k of public money in the "Research Services Ireland" scam so let's not kid ourselves that SF don't like a bit of free money too, at the tax payers expense

[Owenmoresider]

What is the point in another election. Absolute waste of time and money.

Yeah fcuk that, to get the exact same result give or take a seat

Nationalist apathy (like this) could result in a vastly different result. If there is another one, its vital the nationalist vote is even more motivated than at the last one, as the unionist vote will be. If they increase their vote/seats, it will have been a result for them.

Is there any seat when the SDLP and SF could combine to lose the DUP a seat?

Strangford is a possibility for the SDLP if SF were to step down.

The SDLP got nearly all of the SF transfers and still didn't get over the line

Lost by 225, the 240 odd votes that went to Alliance would have been useful, as would the 70 or so that didn't transfer.

[JPGJOHNNYG]

Still trying to work out how unity in an stv election is of any use at all if anything it is going to result in a lower unionist turnout so bring it on.

[Applesisapples]

Can Apples point out how education would suffer in a UI?
Or welfare seeing as 26 Co rates are much higher than 6 Cos rates??
As for another election. .... boycott it.

Not saying they would suffer, the perception is that they would not be free at the point of delivery.