Man Utd Thread:

[magpie seanie]

3.04pm AZ, yeah. Excellent piece on Liam Whelan on the42.ie last night/today. Just such a tremendously sad thing to occur. RIP Babes.

[Armamike]

RIP the Busby babes.  A sad day of remembrance for Bobby Charlton and Harry Gregg.  Are they the only 2 surviving members?

[magpie seanie]

Yes, I believe so.

[AZOffaly]

Here's the article you spoke of Seanie. The Michael Burke in the photograph at the end, his brother in law, is the dad of a good friend of mine. He (my friend) used to tell us how well United looked after the families with free tickets and the like. I was very impressed by that.

http://www.the42.ie/liam-whelan-munich-air-disaster-busby-babes-60th-anniversary-3785714-Feb2018/

[TabClear]

Here's the article you spoke of Seanie. The Michael Burke in the photograph at the end, his brother in law, is the dad of a good friend of mine. He (my friend) used to tell us how well United looked after the families with free tickets and the like. I was very impressed by that.

http://www.the42.ie/liam-whelan-munich-air-disaster-busby-babes-60th-anniversary-3785714-Feb2018/

Great article. Tragic day for football. RIP

[Avondhu star]

Here's the article you spoke of Seanie. The Michael Burke in the photograph at the end, his brother in law, is the dad of a good friend of mine. He (my friend) used to tell us how well United looked after the families with free tickets and the like. I was very impressed by that.

http://www.the42.ie/liam-whelan-munich-air-disaster-busby-babes-60th-anniversary-3785714-Feb2018/

I don't know how true that is. The families could have done with financial support rather than a few free tickets. It was a terrible tragedy and only right that it is commemorated

[Over the Bar]

Here's the article you spoke of Seanie. The Michael Burke in the photograph at the end, his brother in law, is the dad of a good friend of mine. He (my friend) used to tell us how well United looked after the families with free tickets and the like. I was very impressed by that.

http://www.the42.ie/liam-whelan-munich-air-disaster-busby-babes-60th-anniversary-3785714-Feb2018/

I don't know how true that is. The families could have done with financial support rather than a few free tickets. It was a terrible tragedy and only right that it is commemorated

It was a different era as shown by the fact Bill Foulkes was expected to play less than 2 weeks later.    It's not that United were uncaring, just the way it was back then.  Across all industries and sectors, the families of men killed in the course of their work rarely got any financial assistance from their employer.  Perhaps an ex-gratia £100 to cover funeral costs if they were lucky that came with a note of 'no liability'. 

[AZOffaly]

Here's the article you spoke of Seanie. The Michael Burke in the photograph at the end, his brother in law, is the dad of a good friend of mine. He (my friend) used to tell us how well United looked after the families with free tickets and the like. I was very impressed by that.

http://www.the42.ie/liam-whelan-munich-air-disaster-busby-babes-60th-anniversary-3785714-Feb2018/

I don't know how true that is. The families could have done with financial support rather than a few free tickets. It was a terrible tragedy and only right that it is commemorated

Bear in mind I'm talking about 40 years after the fact. The lad I know is the same age as myself so is only really aware of things from the 80s onwards. I'm not sure what money would do at that stage but he was very happy with how they were treated at old Trafford.

[Asal Mor]

Here's the article you spoke of Seanie. The Michael Burke in the photograph at the end, his brother in law, is the dad of a good friend of mine. He (my friend) used to tell us how well United looked after the families with free tickets and the like. I was very impressed by that.

http://www.the42.ie/liam-whelan-munich-air-disaster-busby-babes-60th-anniversary-3785714-Feb2018/

I don't know how true that is. The families could have done with financial support rather than a few free tickets. It was a terrible tragedy and only right that it is commemorated

Johnny Giles was saying last week on Off the Ball that the families were treated disgracefully for years after the crash.

I found this on

http://www.punditarena.com/football/english-football/cheffernan/forgetting-the-past-manchester-united-and-munich-58/

In 2002, Harry Greggs, United's goalkeeper at the time of the crash published his autobiography entitled 'Harry's Game'. Harry had played hero the night of the crash, saving many lives when he bravely decided to risk his own life in pulling survivors from the wreckage.

One of the lucky survivors, Harry returned playing after Munich and was part of the Busby revival in the 1960s. Greggs was a United man through and through. He even acted as a coach and scout for the Red Devils in his retirement. Despite his allegiances to the club, Greggs revealed some uncomfortable truths about the aftermath of Munich.

Jackie Blanchflower, the Northern Ireland defender, was the first to suffer from United's ill treatment. When it became clear to the club that Blanchflower would never play football again, the club soon cut ties with the man from Belfast. First they withdrew his taxi rights, a crippling blow for a man who struggled to walk after Munich.

Next, Blanchflower was evicted from his club accommodation despite his wife being heavily pregnant at the time. The Reds were quick to cut away those players who were no longer of use. Blanchflower wasn't the only victim of such ill-treatment either. The Reds withdrew rented accommodation for all the survivors who couldn't play football again.

Johnny Berry was evicted from his club house and was later fired by United through a letter. Albert Scanlon, another survivor badly affected by the disaster played with United for a short time in the aftermath of Munich before being transferred to Newcastle. Busby allegedly told Scanlon that if he ever fell on hard times Busby would help him out. When Scanlon did turn to Busby, his pleas seemingly fell on deaf ears. Anger at Scanlon's treatment still affects Albert's family.

Often ex-players were left to depend upon the kindness of United fans and not the club. In a sign of good will many taxi drivers in Manchester offered the men free transportation. Such respect was not given by United. Greggs isn't the only one to make such accusations either.

Jeff Connor and Gary James have both recently published works backing up the shocking claims made by Harry Greggs.

[Asal Mor]

I find it hard to look at the commemoration without cynicism. I suspect that at least part of the motivation in commemorating it to the extent they do is branding of the product. They should acknowledge the mistreatment of those families on days like today. It baffles me how people can feel an emotional attachment to these businesses. I'm glad we have the GAA (I know it's not perfect and some people get paid but still....).

[Milltown Row2]

I find it hard to look at the commemoration without cynicism. I suspect that at least part of the motivation in commemorating it to the extent they do is branding of the product. They should acknowledge the mistreatment of those families on days like today. It baffles me how people can feel an emotional attachment to these businesses. I'm glad we have the GAA (I know it's not perfect and some people get paid but still....).

I think in 1958 these clubs were less a business in relation to now and how they are branded , what happened to ex players was wrong but seemed to be the common thing! Doesn't make it right of course.. 

I think if such a thing happened today then the players and families would be well looked after. You have to look at it based on the time

[Kickham csc]

I find it hard to look at the commemoration without cynicism. I suspect that at least part of the motivation in commemorating it to the extent they do is branding of the product. They should acknowledge the mistreatment of those families on days like today. It baffles me how people can feel an emotional attachment to these businesses. I'm glad we have the GAA (I know it's not perfect and some people get paid but still....).

I think in 1958 these clubs were less a business in relation to now and how they are branded , what happened to ex players was wrong but seemed to be the common thing! Doesn't make it right of course.. 

I think if such a thing happened today then the players and families would be well looked after. You have to look at it based on the time

But the plane crash was not a common thing.....

I agree with the sentiment that United should at least acknowledge any mistreatments. It is a major event in their history, and if I look at my father's generation, they are predominantly United fans and when I ask them why, Munich is a major reason. So United's fan base grew, and they still commemorate it (as they should), but the commemoration would mean a lot more if they acknowledge any mistakes in their treatment of the survivors   

[Milltown Row2]

I find it hard to look at the commemoration without cynicism. I suspect that at least part of the motivation in commemorating it to the extent they do is branding of the product. They should acknowledge the mistreatment of those families on days like today. It baffles me how people can feel an emotional attachment to these businesses. I'm glad we have the GAA (I know it's not perfect and some people get paid but still....).

I think in 1958 these clubs were less a business in relation to now and how they are branded , what happened to ex players was wrong but seemed to be the common thing! Doesn't make it right of course.. 

I think if such a thing happened today then the players and families would be well looked after. You have to look at it based on the time

But the plane crash was not a common thing.....

I agree with the sentiment that United should at least acknowledge any mistreatments. It is a major event in their history, and if I look at my father's generation, they are predominantly United fans and when I ask them why, Munich is a major reason. So United's fan base grew, and they still commemorate it (as they should), but the commemoration would mean a lot more if they acknowledge any mistakes in their treatment of the survivors

It was a common thing in that clubs didnt look after ex players when they fell on hard times, is what I meant.. I dont think the club knew that this palne crash would generate a huge fan base, that came after, long after. I think Utd should at the very least compensate (I'm not sure what was done at the time) the familes.

[Asal Mor]

They started to look after the families financially in latter years but some of those they had mistreated had already passed away. You'd have to imagine the marketing department have a hand in how it's commemorated (when you pay players half a million a week the marketing department has to have a hand in everything) but it all seems very hollow and insincere if you don't acknowledge that you ruined the lives of the wounded. I'm disappointed that Bobby Charlton takes part in it without commenting on the treatment of the injured. They were his team mates and if he'd sat in a different seat that night he could have been crocked and turfed out onto the street.

[Asal Mor]

I find it hard to look at the commemoration without cynicism. I suspect that at least part of the motivation in commemorating it to the extent they do is branding of the product. They should acknowledge the mistreatment of those families on days like today. It baffles me how people can feel an emotional attachment to these businesses. I'm glad we have the GAA (I know it's not perfect and some people get paid but still....).

I think in 1958 these clubs were less a business in relation to now and how they are branded , what happened to ex players was wrong but seemed to be the common thing! Doesn't make it right of course.. 

I think if such a thing happened today then the players and families would be well looked after. You have to look at it based on the time

I accept it was the culture at the time MR but does it not make ceremonies like yesterday seem farcical and disingenuous when they make such a fuss of the dead but gloss over their mistreatment of the wounded?