Clerical abuse!

Started by D4S, May 20, 2009, 05:09:14 PM

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We all know this disgusting scandal is as a result of The Church and The State, but who do you hold mostly accountable, and should therefore pay out the most in compensation to victims?

The State
The Church
Split 50/50

The Iceman

I have purposely stayed away from the thread for a few days and in reading the last 6/7 pages there is nothing being solved, no compromises, no conceding points and no willingness to understand.
Myles seems to dominate with his anger and inability to actually read people's posts and try to understand their point before picking one little aspect of what they said and going off on a rant. 
It is nearly impossible to engage with people in a serious discussion unless they have the intelligence to discuss the issue seriously.
I will always keep myself mentally alert, physically strong and morally straight

longrunsthefox

Quote from: The Iceman on May 26, 2009, 02:37:20 PM
I have purposely stayed away from the thread for a few days and in reading the last 6/7 pages there is nothing being solved, no compromises, no conceding points and no willingness to understand.
Myles seems to dominate with his anger and inability to actually read people's posts and try to understand their point before picking one little aspect of what they said and going off on a rant. 
It is nearly impossible to engage with people in a serious discussion unless they have the intelligence to discuss the issue seriously.

Patronising or wot? Maybe you need to find another discussion board then...

mylestheslasher

I reserve my understanding for the little orphans, brutalised children, brutalised single mothers etc etc that suffered inhuman abuse at the hands of so called holy men. The abuse was "endemic" and "systematic". The bodies within the church (for example the christian brothers) have not cooperated with the enquiry, have taken legal action to prevent any of their evil monsters from being named and to this day have not even forked out the money that they said they would (i believe only 50% has been paid to date). The church has been apologetic and has gone on what to me seems to be a PR stunt of suggesting that the orders should look at paying more, while knowing that the orders have no intention of paying more. We hear from bishops about the bad priests that were there which totally ignores what the report said about "endemic" and "systematic". There were not only a few bad apples, on the contrary there were only a few good apples. And there were a whole lot of bad ones outside these schools that knew full well about it and did sweet FA. So you want me to understand the churches position. I say f**k the church. Let them get the money they morally owe to these people. The tax payer should not be forking out for the evil carried out by and covered up by the church. I think I have a right to be angry and I'm not the only one. Those that come on here and the first thing they do is make excuses for the church not doing what is right -  they are the ones that are showing no understanding for the innocents that were broken. They are the ones that lack intelligence, so caught up in the brainwashing of teh church that can't even tell the difference of right and wrong in even as black and white a case as this. They are the people that should look into their hearts and ask are they living a christian life as described by the bible. I don't think they are.

guy crouchback

#243
Quoteuestions and Answers, May 25th.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9jHqndf9Kx4

Maybe the commission in itself is out of kilter, regardless of who's stumping up the bills.

One very brave and eloquent man.



i watched this last night and can safely say it was one of the most powerful and moving  moments of television i have ever seen.

mylestheslasher

Quote from: guy crouchback on May 26, 2009, 03:48:02 PM
Quoteuestions and Answers, May 25th.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9jHqndf9Kx4

Maybe the commission in itself is out of kilter, regardless of who's stumping up the bills.

One very brave and eloquent man.



Indeed. A brave man. That sets the tone for this debate - not understanding of the church and not the Jokes of Orior. I suppose Iceman thinks he is too angry?

i watched this last night and can safley say it was one of the most powerful and moving  momemts of television i have ever seen.

orangeman

Quote from: guy crouchback on May 26, 2009, 03:48:02 PM
Quoteuestions and Answers, May 25th.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9jHqndf9Kx4

Maybe the commission in itself is out of kilter, regardless of who's stumping up the bills.

One very brave and eloquent man.




Jesus Christ of Almighty - this made the hairs stand on the back of my neck. This man's testimony was frightening to say the least - 2 days after he was brought to the home, he was raped, then beaten by 2 of them for a solid hour with not a shred of cloth on his body.


This testimony really puts it into perspective.

i watched this last night and can safley say it was one of the most powerful and moving  momemts of television i have ever seen.

longrunsthefox

I heard on the radio that there was a nun in full attire collecting for the Sisters of (no) Mercy in Cork city on Saturday. Typical denial and arrogance as they were the worst perpetrators

Declan

QuoteQuestions and Answers, May 25th.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9jHqndf9Kx4

Maybe the commission in itself is out of kilter, regardless of who's stumping up the bills.

One very brave and eloquent man.

This should be shown again and again to illustrate what these bastards did. The whole lot of them should be named and charges brought against them in open court. Watched it and can safely say I haven't been as upset by anything I've seen or heard in a long long time.

Billys Boots

Noel Dempsey was a shook-looking man after that - and, in fairness, who wouldn't be?  A very moving account of an atrocity. 
My hands are stained with thistle milk ...

Orior

Quote from: longrunsthefox on May 26, 2009, 04:50:01 PM
I heard on the radio that there was a nun in full attire collecting for the Sisters of (no) Mercy in Cork city on Saturday. Typical denial and arrogance as they were the worst perpetrators

Are you serious? Baby, bath water!
Cover me in chocolate and feed me to the lesbians

orangeman

Quote from: longrunsthefox on May 26, 2009, 04:50:01 PM
I heard on the radio that there was a nun in full attire collecting for the Sisters of (no) Mercy in Cork city on Saturday. Typical denial and arrogance as they were the worst perpetrators

That was for the 2008 panel - new track suits needed for Sunday. The county board have let them down again.   ;)

orangeman

Quote from: longrunsthefox on May 26, 2009, 04:50:01 PM
I heard on the radio that there was a nun in full attire collecting for the Sisters of (no) Mercy in Cork city on Saturday. Typical denial and arrogance as they were the worst perpetrators

Seriously though, how far do you take this ?


Do you stop going to chapel ?


Do you change religion ?


Do you stop putting money in the envelope ?


Where does it end ?

Declan


QuoteSeriously though, how far do you take this ?
Quote

Until the guilty have been brought to justice

QuoteDo you stop going to chapel ?
Quote
A very personal choice I'd have thought and I can see how people could stop going.

QuoteDo you change religion ?
Quote
It's not the religion I'd have thought was the issue but the institutions

QuoteDo you stop putting money in the envelope ?
Quote
I have


Where does it end ?

orangeman

Justice meaning what exactly ???


Jail terms ???


Public apologies ?


Sack cloth and ashes ??



More compensation ??


A bit of all the above ??



The Iceman

#254
A very moving and brave act in deed.

Let's get something straight here  - I am all for justice. I am all for the Church taking the blame and atoning for the sins of its clergy and members.  If you take the time to read over the thread again and my posts in particular I think you will find this to be true.
My point is that we should be realistic in how this justice is obtained.

We can't tear down Churches or schools or parochial houses and sell off the land.  It isn't an option.
We can't tell people to stop going to Church, to stop supporting their Church and their parish - at least for me this isn't an option.

My point all along has been to come up with some realistic suggestions to seek justice for the victims.

I will always keep myself mentally alert, physically strong and morally straight