More Dissident-Republican Activity

[omagh_gael]

@Bingo...the protest is about the end of strip searches not what you have stated. Not to say i support or condone what happened yesterday, f**king tubes need strung up.

[playwiththewind1st]

What odds on Colin Duffy being inside Antrim barracks by lunchtime?

Not quite lunchtime, but not far off it, apparently.

[angermanagement]

Duffy....

How would one man have as much influence as that HS I am just trying to understand it, there are staunch places all over the place but none seem to be as militant as Lurgan.

Sorry, that wasn't an answer to you. Just heard he was lifted.

Didn't take long for him to be lifted.

http://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/local-national/northern-ireland/republican-colin-duffy-arrested-in-hunt-for-m1-ambush-killers-of-prison-officer-david-black-16233140.html

[theticklemister]

I'd love to know what these gangsters think Ireland would look like if they freed it?

How many in Lurgan are living in their warped world?

It's nothing to do with freeing Ireland. Killing a screw is obviously directly related to the ongoing protest in Maghaberry. An agreement reached two years ago still has not been implemented despite a number of legal and legitimate protests. Was only a matter of time before it stepped up another level.

You trying to justify it with the above?

No just answering a question with a bit of perspective.

Perspective. Yeah, prisoners in a jail are struggling to get their drugs smuggled in or get the ride, so we'll kill some old fella.

tube

[Nally Stand]

I'd love to know what these gangsters think Ireland would look like if they freed it?

How many in Lurgan are living in their warped world?

It's nothing to do with freeing Ireland. Killing a screw is obviously directly related to the ongoing protest in Maghaberry. An agreement reached two years ago still has not been implemented despite a number of legal and legitimate protests. Was only a matter of time before it stepped up another level.

You trying to justify it with the above?

No just answering a question with a bit of perspective.

Perspective. Yeah, prisoners in a jail are struggling to get their drugs smuggled in or get the ride, so we'll kill some old fella.

Better to remain silent and be thought a fool than to speak out and remove all doubt.

[Club Rossa]

Man lifted in Ardboe,raided the house at 1.55am this morning.

[Bingo]

Hahaha, the expected repsonse.

[Evil Genius]

It's nothing to do with freeing Ireland. Killing a screw is obviously directly related to the ongoing protest in Maghaberry. An agreement reached two years ago still has not been implemented despite a number of legal and legitimate protests. Was only a matter of time before it stepped up another level.

So assuming for the sake of argument that you are correct in your opening assertion, do you consider the murder of  this man to be a justifiable escalation of the prisons campaign?

And what would be your reaction if some Prison Officer decided to murder a prisoner in Maghaberry, so as to "even up the score"?

[haveaharp]

One way to avoid being stripped searched i guess would be to get with the rest of the population and stop the activities that lands one in such an environment.

Maybe that is a leap too far for those involved.

[Ulick]

http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk/2012/nov/01/murdered-northern-ireland-prison-officer-orange

His concerns were shared by the head of the Prison Officers' Association of Northern Ireland, Finlay Spratt, who claimed the government had put his members in the firing line by reducing their security. "They have stripped away all the security around prison officers. They treat us now as if we live in normal society," he said.

The Prison "Service" up here hasn't recruited any new members since 1994 meaning the vast majority (something like 80%+) are over 25 years in and over 60% have been there 30+ years. An RUC style clear-out of the old guard never happened, so a lot of these boys are still fighting the war 18 years later and still getting the danger-money they received pre-ceasefires. That puts the majority of them there during the Hunger Strikes and the 1983 leg-breakings and torture. It's probably them who have resisted the implementation of the 2010 strip search agreement by refusing to operate the a BOSS chair and continuing to use full body cavity searches as a matter of routine. The thing that's missed about the current protest is that the prisoners are not objecting to strip searching in principle, only to the frequency as to which it's happening e.g. in a day in which a prisoner goes to the canteen and takes a visit, he could be subjected to forced full body cavity search 6 or 8 times. That in my opinion is humiliating, degrading and completely unnecessary when there is a BOSS chair there which could be used instead. The screws are using strip searches for the same reasons they did "back in the (good old) day", to assert power, dominance and torture - I can think of no other reason. 

Someone else on this tread asked why there are so many dissidents around the Lurgan area, well things like this feed into it and give them a sense of grievance. Prison protests give them a sense of legitimacy and continuity going back to before the Tan War, the mass hunger strikes of the 20s and 30s, executions in the 40's and hunger strikes again in the 70s & 80s. May be bollocks but a lot of people are prepared to buy into it when they see the parallels.  Duffy is the perfect example. Pre-Massereene he was confining himself to political activism with the likes of Éirígí. After two years on protest he gets out, ditches Éirígí and publicly aligns himself violent dissidents.

[Evil Genius]

http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk/2012/nov/01/murdered-northern-ireland-prison-officer-orange

His concerns were shared by the head of the Prison Officers' Association of Northern Ireland, Finlay Spratt, who claimed the government had put his members in the firing line by reducing their security. "They have stripped away all the security around prison officers. They treat us now as if we live in normal society," he said.

The Prison "Service" up here hasn't recruited any new members since 1994 meaning the vast majority (something like 80%+) are over 25 years in and over 60% have been there 30+ years. An RUC style clear-out of the old guard never happened, so a lot of these boys are still fighting the war 18 years later and still getting the danger-money they received pre-ceasefires. That puts the majority of them there during the Hunger Strikes and the 1983 leg-breakings and torture. It's probably them who have resisted the implementation of the 2010 strip search agreement by refusing to operate the a BOSS chair and continuing to use full body cavity searches as a matter of routine. The thing that's missed about the current protest is that the prisoners are not objecting to strip searching in principle, only to the frequency as to which it's happening e.g. in a day in which a prisoner goes to the canteen and takes a visit, he could be subjected to forced full body cavity search 6 or 8 times. That in my opinion is humiliating, degrading and completely unnecessary when there is a BOSS chair there which could be used instead. The screws are using strip searches for the same reasons they did "back in the (good old) day", to assert power, dominance and torture - I can think of no other reason. 

Someone else on this tread asked why there are so many dissidents around the Lurgan area, well things like this feed into it and give them a sense of grievance. Prison protests give them a sense of legitimacy and continuity going back to before the Tan War, the mass hunger strikes of the 20s and 30s, executions in the 40's and hunger strikes again in the 70s & 80s. May be bollocks but a lot of people are prepared to buy into it when they see the parallels.  Duffy is the perfect example. Pre-Massereene he was confining himself to political activism with the likes of Éirígí. After two years on protest he gets out, ditches Éirígí and publicly aligns himself violent dissidents.

You clearly have an interest in this topic and imply detailed knowledge.

Therefore any chance you could reply to my two simple queries in post #724, above?

Just in case you missed them, they were:
So assuming for the sake of argument that you are correct [in your assertion that this killing was nothing to do with any 'Free Ireland' campaign], do you consider the murder of  this man to be a justifiable escalation of the prisons campaign?

And what would be your reaction if some Prison Officer decided to murder a prisoner in Maghaberry, so as to "even up the score"?

[Hereiam]

Ulick u have hit the nail on the head with that post.

[Maguire01]

http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk/2012/nov/01/murdered-northern-ireland-prison-officer-orange

His concerns were shared by the head of the Prison Officers' Association of Northern Ireland, Finlay Spratt, who claimed the government had put his members in the firing line by reducing their security. "They have stripped away all the security around prison officers. They treat us now as if we live in normal society," he said.

The Prison "Service" up here hasn't recruited any new members since 1994 meaning the vast majority (something like 80%+) are over 25 years in and over 60% have been there 30+ years. An RUC style clear-out of the old guard never happened, so a lot of these boys are still fighting the war 18 years later and still getting the danger-money they received pre-ceasefires. That puts the majority of them there during the Hunger Strikes and the 1983 leg-breakings and torture. It's probably them who have resisted the implementation of the 2010 strip search agreement by refusing to operate the a BOSS chair and continuing to use full body cavity searches as a matter of routine. The thing that's missed about the current protest is that the prisoners are not objecting to strip searching in principle, only to the frequency as to which it's happening e.g. in a day in which a prisoner goes to the canteen and takes a visit, he could be subjected to forced full body cavity search 6 or 8 times. That in my opinion is humiliating, degrading and completely unnecessary when there is a BOSS chair there which could be used instead. The screws are using strip searches for the same reasons they did "back in the (good old) day", to assert power, dominance and torture - I can think of no other reason. 

Yet if I understand correctly, those who murdered this man wouldn't be that interested in reform of the Prison Service, in the same way that the "RUC style clear-out" didn't stop them targeting PSNI officers.

And the motivation may have been the strip search issue. But it also coincides with Prison Service boss appealing for Catholic applicants only a few days ago:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-20088779

[Ulick]

Yet if I understand correctly, those who murdered this man wouldn't be that interested in reform of the Prison Service, in the same way that the "RUC style clear-out" didn't stop them targeting PSNI officers.

And the motivation may have been the strip search issue. But it also coincides with Prison Service boss appealing for Catholic applicants only a few days ago:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-20088779

I've no idea whether they want reform or not but it's there for all to see that an agreement was reached in 2010 which was subsequently reneged on. When similar protests failed in the 70s and 80s the inevitable result was the targeting for screws on the outside.

My point is that the prison regime is contributing to support for the dissidents on the outside by radicalising people who may otherwise not have bothered. All of those prisoners have friends and relations on the outside who are being drawn into supporting the protest on humanitarian grounds. For their troubles they are vilified by all and sundry for their association with the prisoners despite the fact they may not even have been convicted. In such circumstances it's easy to see why they might start to veer towards the dissidents. I've seen this happen with the relations of the many Lurgan prisoners currently in Maghaberry.

The prison boss appealing for Catholic applicants means nothing. The RUC and UDR did it for years and had no effect and it will have no effect until it's cleared out or disbanded in the same way as the RUC and UDR.

[Club Rossa]

Correction,the house in Ardboe was raided but nobody lifted.