£12,000 payout if someone was killed in the troubles ???????

[Maguire01]

This is ridiculous. There most definitely should be a hierarchy of victims. Some people had a choice in what happened to them, others didn't. Money should not be given to the family of someone who was killed whilst trying to kill others.

Also, it's hardly fair to give £12k across the board to all families anyway as some will quite clearly not need the money. Those who died at the start of the troubles may have no close family still alive - for example, is it right that grandchildren should benefit from losing a grandparent who died before they were even born?
Furthermore - and this is not getting into the hierarchy of victims issue, rather the need for monetary compensation - the families of any police or army personnel who died would surely have received a massive cut from their employers when they died (pension/insurance etc)? Surely £12k would pale into insignificance against this money.

I'd also love to know where the random figure of £12k came from(?) It seems a very strange price to put on a person's life.
£12k is an insult to genuine victims, and the overall cost of £40m is an insult to the rest of us. Better to move on and build 10 integrated schools with it.

[orangeman]

Whilst there are families / ex wives / children etc out there who could do with the £12k, personally I think it's not very well thought out, there are so many holes you can pick in it, so many what ifs and what abouts, but as someone said, not altogether a surprise in the society we've lived in for so many years.

Final point  -


If Adams, Mc Guiness, Murphy, Doherty and all the SF politicians who are drawing salaries from the British Government, why not give the families of fallen heroes the £12k payment ?? It's small change really compared to the money SF and their buddies have made from cigarettes, petrol, diesel and all sorts of criminal activity - and don't forget that for about 4 or 5 years after the ceasefire, a blind eye was turned by the Brits to all the criminality by a lot of ex Provos - so they were allowed to earn their money from "legitimate" criminality. So £12k is a pittance.

[Superstar]

Anything but the truth!!

If im picking you up right, thats the best response on this thread. Ive heard reports that if a family accepts this payment then they have to more or less drop their whole case there may be for an enquiry. Well f**k that!!!!! Do they really think that they can buy the silence of thos who lost loved ones during the conflict through their policies of collusion with £12,000.  Let them keep their money, let the truth come out, because it will in the end, and then and only then can the families of these victims draw a line under what has happened.

[longrunsthefox]

Okay McGuire...So maybe they should phone you to decide who is top of the hierarchy list   Nobody had a choice in being brought up in this society and were products of that whether from Shankill or Falls though agreed put all the money into something else can help all of society.    

[Maguire01]

Okay McGuire...So maybe they should phone you to decide who is top of the hierarchy list   Nobody had a choice in being brought up in this society and were products of that whether from Shankill or Falls though agreed put all the money into something else can help all of society.    

Why would they phone me (i'm assuming it's me you were replying to)? I don't have the answer for the hierarchy - i doubt there's any scientific/accurate way of determining a definitive hierarchy.

Yes, people are products of their society - but not everyone who grew up on the Falls or Shankill lifted a gun or planted a bomb. Some people had choices, others didn't. I just don't think you can say that someone who was killed planting a bomb was a victim, in the same way as an innocent civilian who died as a result of that bomb; the civilian was going about their normal business and the bomber was going out of their way to kill. Can you not see the difference?

[under the bar]

Why not just give £12k to everyone who lived through the troubles killed relatives or not?  I missed school days and nights out over the head of it and had to live with helicopters whizzing about!

Elaine Moore on the consultative group is a bit of a looker!   

[pintsofguinness]

Yes, people are products of their society - but not everyone who grew up on the Falls or Shankill lifted a gun or planted a bomb. Some people had choices, others didn't. I just don't think you can say that someone who was killed planting a bomb was a victim, in the same way as an innocent civilian who died as a result of that bomb; the civilian was going about their normal business and the bomber was going out of their way to kill. Can you not see the difference?

What about the policeman or the solider? They made choices too.  I assume they'd be on your list with the bomber?

[pintsofguinness]

Anything but the truth!!

If im picking you up right, thats the best response on this thread. Ive heard reports that if a family accepts this payment then they have to more or less drop their whole case there may be for an enquiry. Well f**k that!!!!! Do they really think that they can buy the silence of thos who lost loved ones during the conflict through their policies of collusion with £12,000.  Let them keep their money, let the truth come out, because it will in the end, and then and only then can the families of these victims draw a line under what has happened.

Exactly, forget the money, tell the truth about what happened.  I thnk the truth is the only answer to people being able to even think about moving on.

[Maguire01]

Yes, people are products of their society - but not everyone who grew up on the Falls or Shankill lifted a gun or planted a bomb. Some people had choices, others didn't. I just don't think you can say that someone who was killed planting a bomb was a victim, in the same way as an innocent civilian who died as a result of that bomb; the civilian was going about their normal business and the bomber was going out of their way to kill. Can you not see the difference?

What about the policeman or the solider? They made choices too.  I assume they'd be on your list with the bomber?

As i've already said, i think their families will already have been accommodated financially because of their jobs. I don't think they need £12k. They made a choice and their jobs put them in the line of fire. They're obviously different to the innocent civilians.

[orangeman]

So is this where we're at after so many years talking shite in Stormont ??


Give everybody who was killed £12k for their silence on the issue and given that £12k in a credit crunch situation is worth a whole lot more than it would have been a few years ago, then it's worth doing ??


What do you get for being injured physically or mentally ?

How much do those who ended up in wheelchairs, psychiatric hospitals, end of a rope, addiction clinics get ?

[The Watcher Pat]

Do you think the gangsters that were killed on both sides are deserving of a payout too Pat ?

No i dont..read my post..SOME "innocent" people lost their lives..Including my uncle and these people deserve the money...

[pintsofguinness]

Do you think the gangsters that were killed on both sides are deserving of a payout too Pat ?

No i dont..read my post..SOME "innocent" people lost their lives..Including my uncle and these people deserve the money...

You could never have it that who you view as innocent gets the money.

[The Watcher Pat]

Do you think the gangsters that were killed on both sides are deserving of a payout too Pat ?

No i dont..read my post..SOME "innocent" people lost their lives..Including my uncle and these people deserve the money...

You could never have it that who you view as innocent gets the money.

Well any one who is not a member of any organisation then..Including RUC UDR ETC there was too much collusion involved in the troubles plus they have been paid handsomely already compared to the "innocent victim"

[pintsofguinness]

Do you think the gangsters that were killed on both sides are deserving of a payout too Pat ?

No i dont..read my post..SOME "innocent" people lost their lives..Including my uncle and these people deserve the money...

You could never have it that who you view as innocent gets the money.

Well any one who is not a member of any organisation then..Including RUC UDR ETC there was too much collusion involved in the troubles plus they have been paid handsomely already compared to the "innocent victim"

Then what about people who were injured? There's never going to be a clear cut answer.

I dont think throwing money at the problem is going to help and I acctually think it would insult a lot of people who are searching for years for the truth on their loved one's death, in fact it makes me angry that they think money will make it all go away, it won't.

[The Watcher Pat]

Do you think the gangsters that were killed on both sides are deserving of a payout too Pat ?

No i dont..read my post..SOME "innocent" people lost their lives..Including my uncle and these people deserve the money...

You could never have it that who you view as innocent gets the money.

Well any one who is not a member of any organisation then..Including RUC UDR ETC there was too much collusion involved in the troubles plus they have been paid handsomely already compared to the "innocent victim"

Then what about people who were injured? There's never going to be a clear cut answer.

I dont think throwing money at the problem is going to help and I acctually think it would insult a lot of people who are searching for years for the truth on their loved one's death, in fact it makes me angry that they think money will make it all go away, it won't.

It may help families who are struggling financially but if as some one said it comes at the price of justice i do agree with you ...keep the money but what i'm saying is some families could do with it and do deserve it..