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Just wondering which Fianna Fail member will lead Fianna Fail on the Opposition benchs after the 2007 General Election against the Fine Gael-Labour Coalition Government?

Dream on, the electorate are not that stupid

Well I see 3 voted for Berrrttttieee so some of them must be  ;)

FHS I think that yourself and a few more posters on this board will be surprised when the results come in, FF to hold steady maybe lose a seat or two, SF to get 12+ seats and an SF FF + Independants Government in for June!  ;)

So that would be a NASTY surprise then  :D

Quote from: Gaoth Dobhair Abu on May 11, 2007, 08:26:40 PM
FHS I think that yourself and a few more posters on this board will be surprised when the results come in, FF to hold steady maybe lose a seat or two, SF to get 12+ seats and an SF FF + Independants Government in for June!  ;)

If FF lose "a seat or two", they could probably form a minority government with the rump of what's left of the PD's.

I do believe that the Irish electorate will rid themselves of the blight that is the PD's - hopefully!  >:(

FHS have you never hear of the saying - There's no gain without pain!  ;)

And swap them for the Shinners? Plus ça change . . .

Quote from: deiseach on May 11, 2007, 08:40:55 PM
And swap them for the Shinners? Plus ça change . . .

Jezuz Deiseach, as much as you MAY hate the Shinners, you seriously cannot compare them to the PD'S!!!  ???

Quote from: Gaoth Dobhair Abu on May 11, 2007, 08:45:38 PM

Quote from: deiseach on May 11, 2007, 08:40:55 PM
And swap them for the Shinners? Plus ça change . . .

Jezuz Deiseach, as much as you MAY hate the Shinners, you seriously cannot compare them to the PD'S!!!  ???

I would Crush them both.

As much as I despise the PDs I never heard of them killing anyone.

Quote from: deiseach on May 11, 2007, 08:40:55 PM
And swap them for the Shinners? Plus ça change . . .

Well at least McDowell has never supported murderers especially of the Guardai.....no matter how bad he has sunk....

Its a total disgrace Gerry McCabes murders are about to walk free and those murders masters SeinFein/IRA are in Government in the North and now they threathen our Republic.

Quote from: Gaoth Dobhair Abu on May 11, 2007, 08:45:38 PM
Jezuz Deiseach, as much as you MAY hate the Shinners, you seriously cannot compare them to the PD'S!!!  ???

I think of them in terms of the politics of the Federal Republic of Germany:

Progressive Democrats = Free Democrats
Sinn Fein = Baader-Meinhoff Gang

 :) :) :)I still do'nt think that we are going to have a Fine Gael /Labour Coalition.   So Fishead's question does not arise.

Quote from: Gaoth Dobhair Abu on May 11, 2007, 08:26:40 PM
FHS I think that yourself and a few more posters on this board will be surprised when the results come in, FF to hold steady maybe lose a seat or two, SF to get 12+ seats and an SF FF + Independants Government in for June!  ;)

:D :D :D :D :D You're Dreaming....

I'd hardly say dreaming. Its still unlikely but if the polls from todays Irish Times hold then 10% will see SF with 12 seats or so (even taking into account their difficulties with transfers). With the PDs on the verge of destruction, SF added to the independents will probably prevent either FF/ PDs or the rainbow gaining the taoiseach's office. In that situation its all up for grabs and myt gut instinct would be  (and I could be very wrong) that given a choice between opposition and government with SF, Bertie will take the same option as his good friend Doc Paisley.

If FF find themselves with enough seats to form a government with Sinn Fein plus independents, they'll surely be in a position to form one with Labour which wouldn't need the independents. And I don't think we're at the stage where the Soldiers would consider the Shinners more respectable than even a Stickie-led Labour. They'll have to wait until the 31st Dail at least to institute their eat-the-rich policies.

Quote from: Louth Exile on May 11, 2007, 10:11:55 PM

Quote from: Gaoth Dobhair Abu on May 11, 2007, 08:26:40 PM
FHS I think that yourself and a few more posters on this board will be surprised when the results come in, FF to hold steady maybe lose a seat or two, SF to get 12+ seats and an SF FF + Independants Government in for June!  ;)

:D :D :D :D :D You're Dreaming....

We'll see. It's a strong possibility.

QuoteAnd I don't think we're at the stage where the Soldiers would consider the Shinners more respectable than even a Stickie-led Labour.

Well in fairness current Labour party position is that they will not go into government with FF themselves. OK we all think that'll change when push comes to shove but would Rabitte have to go first since it was pretty much his crusade to "get Bertie out". Its going to be very interesting.

The precedent is definitely there (when Dick Spring did his major U-turn) and Rabitte was at pains to make sure he didn't rule out a possible coalition with FF. He wants 'this' govt out FF/PD, therefore FF/Lab would be a different ball game in his book. If the seats fall the way the two options were FF/SF+Indo's or just FF/Lab it is long odds on that it would be FF/Lab

And the odds reflect that FF/ Lab is 2/1 whereas FF/ SF is 7/1 with Paddy Power. Although I'm pretty sure those odds have tumbled, think SF in government was at least double that last time I checked.

Worth a look at Bertie to be next taoiseach at 10/11.

Wil Bertie get a backseat or a fronbench role if he was ousted, he is both FFs biggest asset and liability at the same time, corrupt but popular, what an Irish outlook on Governance  ???

Quote from: Gaoth Dobhair Abu on May 12, 2007, 12:48:53 AM

Quote from: Louth Exile on May 11, 2007, 10:11:55 PM

Quote from: Gaoth Dobhair Abu on May 11, 2007, 08:26:40 PM
FHS I think that yourself and a few more posters on this board will be surprised when the results come in, FF to hold steady maybe lose a seat or two, SF to get 12+ seats and an SF FF + Independants Government in for June!  ;)

:D :D :D :D :D You're Dreaming....

We'll see. It's a strong possibility.

There is about as much chance of Gerry Adams getting elected to the Dail this time as there is of FF only losing 1 or 2 seats.......if they lose less than 15 they will be doing well...

Very emotional Fianna FAILure canvasser in the audience on Q & A tonight, he was almost crying and sounded like Kevin Keegan "Id really love to beat them, sob sob"

I wish I hadn't cast my vote, Michael Martin was talking up Sein Fein, I reckon he wants to be the next leader of Fianna FAIL and try and get a coalition with Sein Fein. Unfortunatly for them both they will be in opposition.

Quote from: Fishead_Sam on May 15, 2007, 12:18:21 AM
Very emotional Fianna FAILure canvasser in the audience on Q & A tonight, he was almost crying and sounded like Kevin Keegan "Id really love to beat them, sob sob"

I wish I hadn't cast my vote, Michael Martin was talking up Sein Fein, I reckon he wants to be the next leader of Fianna FAIL and try and get a coalition with Sein Fein. Unfortunatly for them both they will be in opposition.

He was very emotional alright, I thought that Paudge Connolly the Monaghan/Cavan Hospital candidate came across very well. In relation to Martin, he was a terrible minister for health, and now he is minister for enterprise and his own consitituncey is losing jobs like a leaky bucket over the last 12 months. He is a bloody useless minister, but the one thing he can do is argue the point very well. Thought Dick Bruton came across very poorly and did anyone notice Gormley forgetting Brendan Howlin's name?

PS: Watched the first half of Copper & Hobbs talking to C O'C of SF on TV3 last night. At one point Hobbs asked him how was he going to pay for the extra beds in the health service "Are you going to rob a bank" Even I thought that was a bit much, given that he is an elected representative.

Did Martin not introduce the smoking ban?

Quote from: Gaoth Dobhair Abu on May 15, 2007, 10:41:21 AM
Did Martin not introduce the smoking ban?

No problem, we'll give him that, but he did nothing for waiting lists or the crisis in A&E

Quote from: Louth Exile on May 15, 2007, 10:52:59 AM

Quote from: Gaoth Dobhair Abu on May 15, 2007, 10:41:21 AM
Did Martin not introduce the smoking ban?

No problem, we'll give him that, but he did nothing for waiting lists or the crisis in A&E

Agreed, but the health service has been underfunded for years, up grading and improvements to the services have also been neglected for years (the same thing is happening to the NHS) I think that quite a few health ministers in the past would have to hold their hands up on that one.

Quote from: Gaoth Dobhair Abu on May 15, 2007, 10:58:03 AM

Quote from: Louth Exile on May 15, 2007, 10:52:59 AM

Quote from: Gaoth Dobhair Abu on May 15, 2007, 10:41:21 AM
Did Martin not introduce the smoking ban?

No problem, we'll give him that, but he did nothing for waiting lists or the crisis in A&E

Agreed, but the health service has been underfunded for years, up grading and improvements to the services have also been neglected for years (the same thing is happening to the NHS) I think that quite a few health ministers in the past would have to hold their hands up on that one.

I feel that they are actually putting very significant funds into the health service. They are just not getting any bang for their buck! Reforming the health boards into the HSE seemed like a good idea, it hasn't worked out that way. There are far too many managers, no successfull company in the private sector is run with the same ineptness as the health service is.

Quote from: Louth Exile on May 15, 2007, 11:07:11 AM

Quote from: Gaoth Dobhair Abu on May 15, 2007, 10:58:03 AM

Quote from: Louth Exile on May 15, 2007, 10:52:59 AM

Quote from: Gaoth Dobhair Abu on May 15, 2007, 10:41:21 AM
Did Martin not introduce the smoking ban?

No problem, we'll give him that, but he did nothing for waiting lists or the crisis in A&E

Agreed, but the health service has been underfunded for years, up grading and improvements to the services have also been neglected for years (the same thing is happening to the NHS) I think that quite a few health ministers in the past would have to hold their hands up on that one.

I feel that they are actually putting very significant funds into the health service. They are just not getting any bang for their buck! Reforming the health boards into the HSE seemed like a good idea, it hasn't worked out that way. There are far too many managers, no successfull company in the private sector is run with the same ineptness as the health service is.

The NHS is run similarly with far too many managers and consultants and not enough real workers!!!

Quote from: The True Rebel on May 11, 2007, 08:59:01 PM

Quote from: Gaoth Dobhair Abu on May 11, 2007, 08:45:38 PM

Quote from: deiseach on May 11, 2007, 08:40:55 PM
And swap them for the Shinners? Plus ça change . . .

Jezuz Deiseach, as much as you MAY hate the Shinners, you seriously cannot compare them to the PD'S!!!  ???

I would Crush them both.
As much as I despise the PDs I never heard of them killing anyone.

::) oh for fux sake what drivel

so you say that SF are killers then ?

I'd say mary lou is a handy exponent of a bowie knife and an AKA 47 alright !

jeez even oul paisley doesnt trot out the sf/ira cr*p any more.

I can see that some of you have 'issues' with change and some of those sf folks taking seats in your locality.

I certainly do not like some of the SF candidates and even less for some of the sf supporters (south of the border)
but
as all parties have an element within their ranks of embezlement and corruption/brown envelopes etc - I dont think there could be too many stones cast by any parties...

grow up

Lynchboy

The difference is that other parties aren't going around desperately trying to get killers released from prison...other parties don't have their election workers driving around the country with fake guarda uniforms etc....you don't have other parties members being implicated in murdering innocent people or spying on people (O'Snodaighs mates) etc....

Quote from: DUBSFORSAM1 on May 15, 2007, 02:16:37 PM
Lynchboy
The difference is that other parties aren't going around desperately trying to get killers released from prison...other parties don't have their election workers driving around the country with fake guarda uniforms etc....you don't have other parties members being implicated in murdering innocent people or spying on people (O'Snodaighs mates) etc....

I think the mass hysteria has influenced too many people -yourself included.

I certainly do not agree with that gang that killed mc cabe. IMO for a multitude of reasons they should get life. There was the agreement as part of the GFA or whatever (the usual behind the scenes agreements thrashed out) that all prisoners get released and the proviso included those south of the border - ie the mccabe killers.

BUT
the sf party certainly did not
'go around desperately trying to get killers released from prison'
a few certainly championed their cause and as it was agreed between FF, brit gov and sf that this would happen, obv some people HAD to speak out (or lose complete face).
I notice you are not including ahearn in this group- as he was as bad as adams initially about releasing them

Republicans that I know are happy enough that these guys are not released. SO to say sf and even republicans were 'desperately' trying is over doing it and hyping it up to the extreme.

as for part two of what you say
I would say that in the main most of these parties now do not do such things as
' have their election workers driving around the country with fake guarda uniforms etc....you don't have other parties members being implicated in murdering innocent people or spying on people (O'Snodaighs mates) etc....'
but this isnt par for the course either - plus only a few decades ago - YES they mostly all did (collins , devalera etc)
so to be pedantic these parties were all guilty of this type of thing.
If it is time that has passed that allows this to be forgotten of FG / FF etc - then surely time has passed for the GFA /ceasefire/decommissioning etc
but you will make up your own mind/justifications/excuses as we all will and do.


Anyhow- corruption , spying , criminality is all part of the same thing - illegal. And FG/FF have been caught in the act in recent years/decade of such offenses.
They are all the same. North of the border you might have some differentiation. Not down here.
IMO