Burns wants rid of Tricolour & Anthem to attract Protestants to GAA

[foxcommander]

Would an acceptance of Jarlaths proposal be an abandonment of the core priniciples of the G.A.A. While the association is avowedly non sectarian and non party political it is founded on clear nationalist principles ie. the support for a 32 Co.soveriegn irish republic the promotion of irish culture  , games ,language,dance etc. and the fostering of a national irish conscienceness. These principles were clearly stated by the founders in 1884 and have been reiterated in every official guide published since.

Yes - fewer around with principles these days though as is evident.

[Rossfan]

Would an acceptance of Jarlaths proposal be an abandonment of the core priniciples of the G.A.A. While the association is avowedly non sectarian and non party political it is founded on clear nationalist principles ie. the support for a 32 Co.soveriegn irish republic the promotion of irish culture  , games ,language,dance etc. and the fostering of a national irish conscienceness. These principles were clearly stated by the founders in 1884 and have been reiterated in every official guide published since.

No.

+1.
GAA should stick to promoting their games - as they mainly do no matter what sort of blather is at the start of an T.O.

[T Fearon]

GAA nationalist? Dining with the Queen,Sitting on the North's Policing Board,Receiving loads of British grant aid in the North? Don't make me laugh

[seafoid]

GAA nationalist? Dining with the Queen,Sitting on the North's Policing Board,Receiving loads of British grant aid in the North? Don't make me laugh

Shinners do it as well. The GAA is 32 county and it means a lot . Sure there would be no nordies on here if it were 26 county. 

[tonysoprano]

I completely agree with Jarlath. Nobody on here, including myself, gives a rats ass about including hard line unionists. They are never going to attend our games anyway. As a nordy I know many Protestants who love sport and have a genuine interest in our games. They feel awkward attending any matches because of the anthem and the flying of the tricolour. No place for it in my opinion.  You should be able to go to watch a sport without feeling uncomfortable.

[omaghjoe]

Would an acceptance of Jarlaths proposal be an abandonment of the core priniciples of the G.A.A. While the association is avowedly non sectarian and non party political it is founded on clear nationalist principles ie. the support for a 32 Co.soveriegn irish republic the promotion of irish culture  , games ,language,dance etc. and the fostering of a national irish conscienceness. These principles were clearly stated by the founders in 1884 and have been reiterated in every official guide published since.

Does the GAA acutally have this as a core principle ? I dont think so.
If it did it could not be non-political

[twohands!!!]

Would an acceptance of Jarlaths proposal be an abandonment of the core priniciples of the G.A.A. While the association is avowedly non sectarian and non party political it is founded on clear nationalist principles ie. the support for a 32 Co.soveriegn irish republic the promotion of irish culture  , games ,language,dance etc. and the fostering of a national irish conscienceness. These principles were clearly stated by the founders in 1884 and have been reiterated in every official guide published since.

Those "core principles" are only still there for historic reasons and I would say there is only a tiny minority of members for whom "support for a 32 Co.soveriegn irish republic the promotion of irish culture  , games ,language,dance etc. and the fostering of a national irish conscienceness." represents their idea of what the GAA is about nowadays.

[armaghniac]

Would an acceptance of Jarlaths proposal be an abandonment of the core priniciples of the G.A.A. While the association is avowedly non sectarian and non party political it is founded on clear nationalist principles ie. the support for a 32 Co.soveriegn irish republic the promotion of irish culture  , games ,language,dance etc. and the fostering of a national irish conscienceness. These principles were clearly stated by the founders in 1884 and have been reiterated in every official guide published since.

Does the GAA acutally have this as a core principle ? I dont think so.
If it did it could not be non-political

The GAA is a community organisation, people gather in the parish, the county and the country to work together. It is non party political, but supports the general interests of the country and its culture and language. People whose aim is to have the country as a colony of another country have never quite fitted into this.

[Eamonnca1]

I knew the PC brigade would be on to this article - falling over themselves to try accommodate the likes of Tom Elliott.

If anything why doesn't the rugby team remove the anthem and the flag. Can't really claim to be Irish playing a British sport. And as for their cringeworthy fans belting out the national anthem...

I stopped reading at "PC brigade."

[Eamonnca1]

Here's the best part. The people who would prefer to keep the anthem and flag as it is are the same people who most fervently want a united Ireland.

To achieve a united Ireland you need to convince a majority in the north to go for it.

To convince a majority in the north to go for it means getting a critical mass of moderate northern Protestants on board.

Getting a critical mass of moderate northern Protestants on board means making them more comfortable with Irish culture do it doesn't feel foreign or hostile to them.

Getting them more comfortable with Irish culture means making it more accessible to them through gestures like the one Jarlath proposes.

So the ones going on about how we should stick to the status quo are advocating a course that makes Irish unity less likely and more difficult to achieve.

[omaghjoe]

Would an acceptance of Jarlaths proposal be an abandonment of the core priniciples of the G.A.A. While the association is avowedly non sectarian and non party political it is founded on clear nationalist principles ie. the support for a 32 Co.soveriegn irish republic the promotion of irish culture  , games ,language,dance etc. and the fostering of a national irish conscienceness. These principles were clearly stated by the founders in 1884 and have been reiterated in every official guide published since.

Does the GAA acutally have this as a core principle ? I dont think so.
If it did it could not be non-political

The GAA is a community organisation, people gather in the parish, the county and the country to work together. It is non party political, but supports the general interests of the country and its culture and language. People whose aim is to have the country as a colony of another country have never quite fitted into this.

I agree with most of what your saying but your nationalist overtones appear to cloud you judgement towards the end

Culture, tradition and community come first. Where they are common or similar, Nationalism (in Europe at least) groups them under an umbrella with the aim of creating a sovereign state. And often wields this commonality for rule and power.

I see the GAA as primarily a sporting organisation that promotes the traditional games but secondary as a cultural one promoting other traditions such as language and music. It is also an umbrella organisation like sovereign nationalism but the key difference is in its actual aim is to promote the traditions not to wield them as a tool for political power.

[armaghniac]

To achieve a united Ireland you need to convince a majority in the north to go for it.

To convince a majority in the north to go for it you need to sort out the NI economy.

Getting a critical mass of moderate northern Protestants on board means making them more comfortable with Irish culture do it doesn't feel foreign or hostile to them.

Getting them more comfortable with Irish culture means making it more accessible to them through gestures like the one Jarlath proposes.

I see the GAA as primarily a sporting organisation that promotes the traditional games but secondary as a cultural one promoting other traditions such as language and music. It is also an umbrella organisation like sovereign nationalism but the key difference is in its actual aim is to promote the traditions not to wield them as a tool for political power.

Fair enough. But the GAA is not making a symbol of political power, it is using collective Irish symbols to associate with the Irish people in the same way as the St Patrick's day parade in New York.

Gesture is the appropriate word. You are not changing the culture you are merely concealing the Irish nature of it, which is pretty pointless.

So the ones going on about how we should stick to the status quo are advocating a course that makes Irish unity less likely and more difficult to achieve.
[/quote]

[omaghjoe]

To achieve a united Ireland you need to convince a majority in the north to go for it.

To convince a majority in the north to go for it you need to sort out the NI economy.

Getting a critical mass of moderate northern Protestants on board means making them more comfortable with Irish culture do it doesn't feel foreign or hostile to them.

Getting them more comfortable with Irish culture means making it more accessible to them through gestures like the one Jarlath proposes.

I see the GAA as primarily a sporting organisation that promotes the traditional games but secondary as a cultural one promoting other traditions such as language and music. It is also an umbrella organisation like sovereign nationalism but the key difference is in its actual aim is to promote the traditions not to wield them as a tool for political power.

Fair enough. But the GAA is not making a symbol of political power, it is using collective Irish symbols to associate with the Irish people in the same way as the St Patrick's day parade in New York.

Gesture is the appropriate word. You are not changing the culture you are merely concealing the Irish nature of it, which is pretty pointless.

So the ones going on about how we should stick to the status quo are advocating a course that makes Irish unity less likely and more difficult to achieve.

[/quote]

A united Ireland is irrelevant to this discussion, this is not about a superficial thing like a flag that is supposed to bond us. It about the actual thing that bonds us...culture and tradition

There is no need to use collective symbols associated with sovereign nationalism. The GAA uses the symbols of Irish Nationalism as they have common roots, but there is no reason to do so and removing them does not take away any Irishness from the GAA. In fact it frees up the organisation to be the true guardian of the thing that bonds us, our culture and tradition.

[armaghniac]

There is no need to use collective symbols associated with sovereign nationalism. The GAA uses the symbols of Irish Nationalism as they have common roots, but there is no reason to do so and removing them does not take away any Irishness from the GAA. In fact it frees up the organisation to be the true guardian of the thing that bonds us, our culture and tradition.

There is no reason not to do so if Irish people like to be represented by such things. We need to reclaim the tricolour from SF rallies and braindead teenagers tacking flags to poles and not pander to people with a divisive political agenda.

[theticklemister]

Should  the real question  be......... Can we not get the feckin national anthem removed at the end of discos in the free state?

I'll tell ye a wee story anyways along the same lines as I can't get to sleep.....

One time many years ago.......for  my home club's first ever year playing senior football I decided to do a program for each home game. What I decided to do was to look at the visiting team's club name and tell people a bit of history about them. It so happens we had Eoghain Rua, Wolfe Tones, Watty Graham's and Robert Emmetts visiting us. Republican people from our history. Needless to say, the back of each program was an Irish republican history so to speak every two weeks.

Anyway..... I got a message from the secretary of the club stating 'there is too much Republican propaganda being placed in these publications'. I did not reply. I asked around the club and it was general consensus that I have. I stayed strong nonetheless.

Anyway.... It turns out all the lads were having the craic with me

And anyway again......... Although this was a bit of banter, I know for a fact that this probably was indeed the consensus but was not put through the proper channels.


Anyway, moral of the story is....... Burns is doing this for his own gain.