prod schools closing..

[lawnseed]

i'm hearing that there are dozens of protestant primary schools facing closure. do any of you live near one whose numbers have fallen dramatically lately. about 2 years ago there was a big shout from unionist politicians complaining that the catholic schools around derry were catering for hundreds of donegal kids in a practice called "grannying" where the kids gave the address of relations in derry to enable them to attend schools in derry. this complaint was quickly hushed up when the same unionists realised that many of their schools in border areas were dependant on southern prods to maintain numbers or face closure.
  now however the problem seems to be coming to a head with the numbers  dwindling all over the six counties, prod secondary schools and grammers are openly canvassing catholic primary schools for pupils. a nearby prod primary school i understand has 9 pupils and 3 teachers. has anyone else any news on this

[Tony Baloney]

i'm hearing that there are dozens of protestant primary schools facing closure. do any of you live near one whose numbers have fallen dramatically lately. about 2 years ago there was a big shout from unionist politicians complaining that the catholic schools around derry were catering for hundreds of donegal kids in a practice called "grannying" where the kids gave the address of relations in derry to enable them to attend schools in derry. this complaint was quickly hushed up when the same unionists realised that many of their schools in border areas were dependant on southern prods to maintain numbers or face closure.
  now however the problem seems to be coming to a head with the numbers  dwindling all over the six counties, prod secondary schools and grammers are openly canvassing catholic primary schools for pupils. a nearby prod primary school i understand has 9 pupils and 3 teachers. has anyone else any news on this

You'll no doubt fire out some evidence and statistics to support your claims. Also, I'm sure border prods haven't exactly got a glut of non-Catholic schools to send their children to on the southern side of the border compared to their Catholic counterparts.

[Minder]

Lawnseed, are you Nally Stands autistic brother?

[lawnseed]

thanks typ! you've certainly given food for thought. it doesn't look good for either sector of education. the reason i brought the subject up was I'd met up with an old schoolmate whose now a primary school principal. he was telling me the situation was bad in the catholic sector but that the state primary schools are much more endangered and that the next couple of years will see alot of changes.
personally i don't think religion should be a school subject at all, there is no reason why the various religions couldn't set up their own classes outside school hours to teach those who want to participate (including adults)

BTW. I'm not using the term 'prod' in a derogatory way merely a jovial abbreviation. where a person spends his/her sunday mornings is of no interest or consequence to me

[mylestheslasher]

Why would catholics in Donegal want to send their kids into Derry for education? I would have thought if there was to be educational migration it would be in the opposite direction.

[under the bar]

Does anyone here actually disagree with kids of any denomination being taught on whichever side of the border their parents choose?   Personally I would not care if kids from the Shankill Road were brought in buses to be taught in Dundalk, in fact actively support it.

[Tony Baloney]

Does anyone here actually disagree with kids of any denomination being taught on whichever side of the border their parents choose?   Personally I would not care if kids from the Shankill Road were brought in buses to be taught in Dundalk, in fact actively support it.

It's a moot point. I would assume Dept of Education funds are allocated solely for provision of education to residents of the 6 counties. Surely bussing people in to take advantage of free education in the north is fraud in the same way that plenty of border folk claim the dole on both sides.

[lawnseed]

Does anyone here actually disagree with kids of any denomination being taught on whichever side of the border their parents choose?   Personally I would not care if kids from the Shankill Road were brought in buses to be taught in Dundalk, in fact actively support it.

It's a moot point. I would assume Dept of Education funds are allocated solely for provision of education to residents of the 6 counties. Surely bussing people in to take advantage of free education in the north is fraud in the same way that plenty of border folk claim the dole on both sides.

don't think there are many claiming the dole on both sides of the border at the moment tony. the brother in law came home from england, hes a farney man and when he tried to sign on in carrickmacross he was nearly arrested outside the dole office then they took take his english reg car that he brought home. he'd been in the uk for 18mths and was entitled to a change of residence exemption from vrt but the hassel was unreal

[Gaffer]

don't think there are many claiming the dole on both sides of the border at the moment tony. [/quote]

[Ulick]

has anyone else any news on this

The NI Schools Census shows that the proportion of children attending "prod" schools has been falling every year since records began in 1998: (http://www.deni.gov.uk/enrolment_time_series_updated0910.xls). However, if you look at the projections based on birth rates for the next 6 years you'll see that the total number of children who will be attending primary schools will at least maintain current levels or even show a slight rise (http://www.deni.gov.uk/0910_school_population_proj_-_published.xls).

Based on current birth rates, there is no evidence to suggest the the 12 year trend of falling numbers in "prod" schools is going to be halted. Indeed if you look at the birthrate statistics you find that the highest birthrates are (logically enough) in areas with the most women at the average childbearing age (29.5years). These women would have been 21 when the 2001 census was taken. The diagram below shows the religious breakdown of 21 year of females by Council area in the 2001 census. Of the areas in the top 14 birthrates, only one is majority protestant at the female childbearing age.



So while TYP is correct to focus on the failure to implement a long term sustainability policy, actual total school numbers will not be dropping in the next few years, with post primary numbers actually increasing from current numbers. However your friend is correct to say that sustainability problems will be felt more acutely in the "prod" state schools across the board.

Anecdotally, I can tell you that in South Belfast we've been canvassed by two local "prod" pre-schools and nurseries, whereas we're been told by the local PP that we'll have to have our two boys names down at least a year, preferably two years to have a chance of getting into the two local Catholic primaries (St Brendan's & Holy Rosary).

[lawnseed]

so prods quit having sex when they couldnt get up the garvaghy road?