Armagh Club football & hurling

[corn02]

It's simple - play with one withdrawn half-back instead of two.

Corn, thats the way it was this year, you had AK and C McKeever trying to get forward and then get back to cover for Aidan and as mentioned above thats what exposed armagh against a fast team.  It's ok to play that type of system in NL, but championship football has moved on i'm afraid.
I agree with fullback on MOR, he's a real battler and wins loads of breaking ball more than any other current forward they have. "hope that didn't sound to negative"

No it wasn't. Vernon and MOR both played withdrawn roles. AOR wasn't caught for pace at all this year, I don't know were that is coming from, please give examples. McKeever hardly crossed the halfway line after the Cavan match.

[Aghdavoyle]

i'll have to stick up for my clubmen here... someone should name one example against wexford when aor was caught for pace - just one. mor is vital to armagh and anyone who thinks either o'rourke lacks pace doesn't know them at all.

[bennydorano]

I would have a problem with the role AOR has moreso than the player himself, although he is getting no younger or faster.  I recall saying early last spring that AOR's role in the team was a luxury, that would be exposed by better teams - ultimately it wasn't exposed by a better team, but by our own sh1t tactics.  I would like to see  a move towards a more positive type of football, and I dont think we can do that by playing AOR in the same role as this year.

I hope some of the older players move on, but the utterings of Enda McNulty in the papers and the lure of playing Tyrone would suggest otherwise. McGrane should still be good for a contribution, I thought this year's County championship exposed Bellew badly.  Time to bite the bullet and rebuild properly.

[corn02]

I would have a problem with the role AOR has moreso than the player himself, although he is getting no younger or faster.  I recall saying early last spring that AOR's role in the team was a luxury, that would be exposed by better teams - ultimately it wasn't exposed by a better team, but by our own sh1t tactics.  I would like to see  a move towards a more positive type of football, and I dont think we can do that by playing AOR in the same role as this year.

I hope some of the older players move on, but the utterings of Enda McNulty in the papers and the lure of playing Tyrone would suggest otherwise. McGrane should still be good for a contribution, I thought this year's County championship exposed Bellew badly.  Time to bite the bullet and rebuild properly.

See rational, evidence-based reasoning. I agree re: playing Aidan in that role but I think he should be deployed as a orthodox CHB, Geezer was never the quickest either. I would also swap Vernon and AK and keep MOR withdrawn. Therefore your defnce and midfeild are protected and you play with five forwards instead of four.

The same team will be around next year and very few will be gone. League will have added signifance this year - romotion is a must.

[winsamsoon]

There was a major difference in Geezer and Aidan O'Rourke. Geezer was put there for his stopping ability. His hard hitting and his tackling, so as anyone coming down the middle at the Armagh team knew what they would be getting. Aidan O'Rourke wouldn't be the physical enough to do this job.Therefore the obvious centre half back is Mc Keever. Aidan O' Rourke is there to start the attacks from deep and his main strength is his distribution of the ball. He could pick a man out with a pin point (something Mc Geeney struggled with). Some of you lads are asking for examples of when he got caught for pace. When we say he was caught for pace we don't mean that someone out ran him. But if you look at the two Fermangh games and to a lesser extent the Wexford game. Where you had smaller nippier forwards that were able to bypass the likes of O'Rourke and he was exposed. He has been a great servant but he should now move over as should enda and let the younger lads come through.

[full back]

There was a major difference in Geezer and Martin O'Rourke. Geezer was put there for his stopping ability. His hard hitting and his tackling, so as anyone coming down the middle at the Armagh team knew what they would be getting. Martin O'Rourke wouldn't be the physical enough to do this job.Therefore the obvious centre half back is Mc Keever. Martin O' Rourke is there to start the attacks from deep and his main strength is his distribution of the ball. He could pick a man out with a pin point (something Mc Geeney struggled with). Some of you lads are asking for examples of when he got caught for pace. When we say he was caught for pace we don't mean that someone out ran him. But if you look at the two Fermangh games and to a lesser extent the Wexford game. Where you had smaller nippier forwards that were able to bypass the likes of O'Rourke and he was exposed. He has been a great servant but he should now move over as should enda and let the younger lads come through.

Why are we talking about Martin O 'Rourke
Do you know the CHB wasnt Martin winsam?

[Final Whistle]

IMO Ger Reid's the ideal candidate to shore up the Armagh defence.

[Aghdavoyle]

Some of you lads are asking for examples of when he got caught for pace. When we say he was caught for pace we don't mean that someone out ran him. But if you look at the two Fermangh games and to a lesser extent the Wexford game. Where you had smaller nippier forwards that were able to bypass the likes of O'Rourke and he was exposed.

i'm not sure i follow... what does that mean in practical terms?

do you mean he "missed tackles" in these games?

[corn02]

There was a major difference in Geezer and Martin O'Rourke. Geezer was put there for his stopping ability. His hard hitting and his tackling, so as anyone coming down the middle at the Armagh team knew what they would be getting. Martin O'Rourke wouldn't be the physical enough to do this job.Therefore the obvious centre half back is Mc Keever. Martin O' Rourke is there to start the attacks from deep and his main strength is his distribution of the ball. He could pick a man out with a pin point (something Mc Geeney struggled with). Some of you lads are asking for examples of when he got caught for pace. When we say he was caught for pace we don't mean that someone out ran him. But if you look at the two Fermangh games and to a lesser extent the Wexford game. Where you had smaller nippier forwards that were able to bypass the likes of O'Rourke and he was exposed. He has been a great servant but he should now move over as should enda and let the younger lads come through.

Believ me physical abilty is not a problem for Aidan. Probably one of the strongest on the team. Disagree, when your faced with waves of attacks you can only do so much. Every defender struggled that day. The turning point came froma long ball, not a forward runner.

[billy the kid]

Was not at any of the games today but the third most consistent SENIOR team in armagh this year (Cullyhanna) is beat by an intermediate second division football team from Derry

Any body any opinions on this?

Greenlough are a Third division team in Derry and actually finished in the bottom half of the table.

Second year in a row this has happened, Last year the Derry intermediate champions were from Division 3 and actually spent nearly the whole year down at the bottom of the division but stayed up after winning last few games, and they hammered the Armagh intermediate champions in first round of ulster who were in Div 1 Armagh at the time although they were relegated at end of year. It was Wolf tones or whitecross, I can never remember which.

[winsamsoon]

It is Aidan i am talking about full back i am half a sleep today. Still haven't got over the tiredness of the Calzaghe fight

[winsamsoon]

Whilst i acknowledge Corn that he wasn't the only one on the day that was badly exposed (and i already stated that) . I also acknowledge that it is difficult to defend when you have wave after wave of half backs attacking you. But lads lets face it the lad isn't getting any younger. The Dromintee lads seem to be taking this as a criticism of Aidan and you couldn't be any further from the truth. He's been a great servant but the legs to play at this level simply aren't there anymore.

In Practical terms Aghdavoyle it simply means that he hasn't got the pace to mark a smaller younger player at intercounty level. Sure he still could float the odd pass up field and maybe even venture up and get the odd score but Armagh are not the kind of team that can afford to carry passengers. Armagh need six defenders that are capable of defending be it fast or slow men. For too long the Armagh defense has been exposed because of the overall lack of pace. the time now has come for the older servants to make way ie Bellew, O'Rourke and  Mc Nulty. They simply don't have the legs anymore to cope with the modern forward. Sure enough Armagh won an Ulster this year but all in all Ulster was pretty poor in comparison to the previous 6 or 7 years. Armagh beat a bad Down Team and struggled to beat a bad Fermanagh team. They were eventually beaten by a bad Fermanagh team. These teams haven't a hope in hell in winning an all Ireland. So i guess in practical terms in means that if Armagh have any All Ireland aspirations then the older guys must make way for a new group of players.

Tyrone had to do it after Peter Canavan hung the boots up . Tyrone went into a period of Transition but it wasn't anything major or overly noticeable. They where still winning the odd national league . As a result they came back stronger than ever and won an All Ireland. This won't be the case in Armagh because we will have lads hanging in there preventing the younger lads coming through and only hampering future prospects. This will only do harm in the long run. Mc Donnell should now be given the time and proper chance to rebuild the Armagh team not from scratch but using guys like Clarke, Mallon, Mc Donnell and mc keever to led a new team onto the future. A clean break now will only reap rewards sooner rather than later.

[corn02]

Not taking it as anti-Dromintee Win and you raise valid points. Maybe I have blue-tinted specs on, but I thought Aidan was one of our better players last year and I think he is well capable of another good Championship - his league form will be interesting.

His pace is akin to Geezers - both great readers of the game - pace not essential. For me, Aidan had a specific role this year and done it very well. Tactics may have made him look weak, but I didn't see that.

[Donagh]

Winsamsoon, is that Armagh or the Clans you are talking about there?   

[winsamsoon]

Donagh The clans are about another 10 steps behind Armagh again  There aren't enough pages to write about the clans.