Casement Park in line for major overhaul - 40,000 all seater Stadium.

[Sportacus]

There are just far too many more pressing priorities.  As a tax payer and an Antrim gael I don't want £33mn extra spent on this. Spend it on schools and hospitals, give nurses, doctors and teachers a pay rise. 

Swallow your pride, go back to the drawing board and build an Athletic Grounds size stadium in west Belfast which will have a good atmosphere for Antrim GAA.

Spend whatever's left on Clones.  If we ever get back there, the drive down the road will be part of the craic.

[Taylor]

Well from your posts right from page 1 you've made it quite clear you don't want a new Casement (right from i don't want to f**king sit down to watch a match),

we get it you don't want it built.

You obviously don't "get it".

I've consistently called for a suitably sized and appropriate stadium.

20k, one seated stand, one covered terrace. The Athletic grounds are a fine template that they should seek to copy.

No white elephant.

I do get, I just disagree with you. We should get a 34,000 seating stadium that we (Ulster & Antrim Gaels) deserve. I know not everyone wants it and that's fair enough but as i stated above you'll find a poll would show a high demand for it.

Why do you think Ulster & Antrim gaels deserve it illdecide?

And I dont mean a new stadium (which Antrim should obviously have) but why we deserve, specifically, a 34,000 stadium ?

[RadioGAAGAA]

Can admin add a poll to this thread please?

[illdecide]

Well from your posts right from page 1 you've made it quite clear you don't want a new Casement (right from i don't want to f**king sit down to watch a match),

we get it you don't want it built.

You obviously don't "get it".

I've consistently called for a suitably sized and appropriate stadium.

20k, one seated stand, one covered terrace. The Athletic grounds are a fine template that they should seek to copy.

No white elephant.

I do get, I just disagree with you. We should get a 34,000 seating stadium that we (Ulster & Antrim Gaels) deserve. I know not everyone wants it and that's fair enough but as i stated above you'll find a poll would show a high demand for it.

Why do you think Ulster & Antrim gaels deserve it illdecide?

And I dont mean a new stadium (which Antrim should obviously have) but why we deserve, specifically, a 34,000 stadium ?

Leinster & Munster have great stadiums for Provincial finals or big games that merit it, Connacht is a bit like Ulster but eventually will get a big upgrade & I believe Ulster should get the same. Clones i agree with most of you has/had a great buzz for Ulster Final day but it's getting run down and will need a fortune spent on it as well geographically not ideal (which isn't a game changer). Money is set aside for the stadium at Casement and the fact that Antrim have to play their matches at club grounds (and different grounds on a regular basis). IMO (maybe just mine) I want it and I believe most other people would want it too( although maybe not on the Board). I know there is a bit of an increase needed for the stadium but lets be honest guys in Government terms it's pennies and i get all your ideas where that extra money could go but every year there are millions set aside for sports and other projects no matter what is spent on Health & Education etc and for the record if i thought for one minute that it was 2 schools or 20 nurses or the Stadium I'd never vote for the stadium, it doesn't work like that. It's not one or the other...

[Milltown Row2]

There are just far too many more pressing priorities.  As a tax payer and an Antrim gael I don't want £33mn extra spent on this. Spend it on schools and hospitals, give nurses, doctors and teachers a pay rise. 

Swallow your pride, go back to the drawing board and build an Athletic Grounds size stadium in west Belfast which will have a good atmosphere for Antrim GAA.

Spend whatever's left on Clones.  If we ever get back there, the drive down the road will be part of the craic.

No point stopping at Casement for poor use of government funding, they paid wages for over 3 years to MLA's for feck all, the lack of infrastructure throughout the north is terrible, the links between the M1 and M2 need sorting out and while they are sorting that a bridge linking the M3 would be a good addition also. also getting to Derry on

Building a stadium in Belfast isn't a bad thing, most major cities have multi sports stadiums, we currently have two,  soccer and rugby, why not have a decent one for GAA? yes the plans are probably way over the top but building something like the Athletic grounds isn't looking into the future, if we get to the point that the GAA grows and grows the way we want it, surely some foresight into building a decent modern stadium would be the right thing to do?

25k would be my size of stadium, but the plans and infrastructure needs to be in place to facilitate all needs, safety being the being the main one. Its not going anywhere but Casement

[Taylor]

Well from your posts right from page 1 you've made it quite clear you don't want a new Casement (right from i don't want to f**king sit down to watch a match),

we get it you don't want it built.

You obviously don't "get it".

I've consistently called for a suitably sized and appropriate stadium.

20k, one seated stand, one covered terrace. The Athletic grounds are a fine template that they should seek to copy.

No white elephant.

I do get, I just disagree with you. We should get a 34,000 seating stadium that we (Ulster & Antrim Gaels) deserve. I know not everyone wants it and that's fair enough but as i stated above you'll find a poll would show a high demand for it.

Why do you think Ulster & Antrim gaels deserve it illdecide?

And I dont mean a new stadium (which Antrim should obviously have) but why we deserve, specifically, a 34,000 stadium ?

Leinster & Munster have great stadiums for Provincial finals or big games that merit it, Connacht is a bit like Ulster but eventually will get a big upgrade & I believe Ulster should get the same. Clones i agree with most of you has/had a great buzz for Ulster Final day but it's getting run down and will need a fortune spent on it as well geographically not ideal (which isn't a game changer). Money is set aside for the stadium at Casement and the fact that Antrim have to play their matches at club grounds (and different grounds on a regular basis). IMO (maybe just mine) I want it and I believe most other people would want it too( although maybe not on the Board). I know there is a bit of an increase needed for the stadium but lets be honest guys in Government terms it's pennies and i get all your ideas where that extra money could go but every year there are millions set aside for sports and other projects no matter what is spent on Health & Education etc and for the record if i thought for one minute that it was 2 schools or 20 nurses or the Stadium I'd never vote for the stadium, it doesn't work like that. It's not one or the other...

First point is Antrim definitely need a county ground and it is frankly a disgrace they havent got one.

I have an issue with the additional money that is now needed for the stadium and the size of it.

Who is at fault for now going back looking an extra £30 odd million?

Both Windsor & Ravenhill have a capacity of less than 20k but we think we need one over 34k and want over £30m more than what was agreed to do this.

A stadium of 25k would be more than enough and would mean not as much of the extra money (if any) is needed

[JPGJOHNNYG]

So most people seem happy with 25000. A new design is throwing more money at it before anything has actually been built. Surely having seats at the terrace end will drop another few thousand off the capacity giving around 30000 some 10000 less than the original plan.

[RadioGAAGAA]

yes the plans are probably way over the top but building something like the Athletic grounds isn't looking into the future, if we get to the point that the GAA grows and grows the way we want it, surely some foresight into building a decent modern stadium would be the right thing to do?

Nothing to stop the main stand being designed such that another tier can be added in future.

Even the East terrace roof could be structured for an additional (seated) tier in future.

[johnnycool]

So most people seem happy with 25000. A new design is throwing more money at it before anything has actually been built. Surely having seats at the terrace end will drop another few thousand off the capacity giving around 30000 some 10000 less than the original plan.

Take the roof off the Owenvarragh side like the Gaelic Grounds in Limerick.

More sunshine for the residents and greatly reduced costs.

[Evil Genius]

In all this talk about capacity needs and deserts etc, many of the 30k+ camp are (wilfully?) overlooking one thing.

Which is that due to physical constraints on access/egress/evacuation in an emergency, the GAA have not yet been able to persuade the planning authorities that they may safely and legally build a stadium that size.

And unless or until that hurdle can be overcome (and I can't see it myself), then they must surely cut their cloth accordingly.

My (uneducated) guess is that they might get away with around 25k. And while this might not satisfy the "Build It And They Will Come" visionaries, it nevertheless confers a number of other advantages:

1. Medium-sized stadium more nearly suited to Antrim's needs (Clones can still do the really big Ulster games);
2. The Stormont money alone should be sufficient to build it;
3. The GAA's £15m could then be reallocated towards other projects, including in Antrim itself;
4. Better relations with all their immediate neighbours.

[Evil Genius]

In all this talk about capacity needs and just deserts etc, many of the 30k+ camp are (wilfully?) overlooking one thing.

Which is that due to physical constraints on access/egress/evacuation in an emergency, the GAA have not yet been able to persuade the planning authorities that they may safely and legally build a stadium that size on that site.

And unless or until that hurdle can be overcome (and I can't see it myself), then they must surely cut their cloth accordingly.

My (uneducated) guess is that they might get away with around 25k. And while this might not satisfy all the "Build It And They Will Come" visionaries, it nevertheless confers a number of other advantages:

1. Medium-sized stadium more nearly suited to Antrim's needs (Clones can still do the really big Ulster games, VAT-free);
2. The Stormont money alone should be sufficient to build it;
3. The GAA's £15m could then be reallocated towards other projects, including in Antrim itself;
4. Better relations with all their immediate neighbours.

Moreover, stadia these days only have a "shelf-life" of around 50 years. So if an "interim" 25k stadium could be used to develop Gaelic games in Belfast/Antrim to somewhere nearer its potential over the next couple of decades, that should give Ulster GAA time to plan forward for a potentially much larger successor stadium in the decades to follow.

[Tony Baloney]

Well from your posts right from page 1 you've made it quite clear you don't want a new Casement (right from i don't want to f**king sit down to watch a match),

we get it you don't want it built.

You obviously don't "get it".

I've consistently called for a suitably sized and appropriate stadium.

20k, one seated stand, one covered terrace. The Athletic grounds are a fine template that they should seek to copy.

No white elephant.

I do get, I just disagree with you. We should get a 34,000 seating stadium that we (Ulster & Antrim Gaels) deserve. I know not everyone wants it and that's fair enough but as i stated above you'll find a poll would show a high demand for it.

Why do you think Ulster & Antrim gaels deserve it illdecide?

And I dont mean a new stadium (which Antrim should obviously have) but why we deserve, specifically, a 34,000 stadium ?

Leinster & Munster have great stadiums for Provincial finals or big games that merit it, Connacht is a bit like Ulster but eventually will get a big upgrade & I believe Ulster should get the same. Clones i agree with most of you has/had a great buzz for Ulster Final day but it's getting run down and will need a fortune spent on it as well geographically not ideal (which isn't a game changer). Money is set aside for the stadium at Casement and the fact that Antrim have to play their matches at club grounds (and different grounds on a regular basis). IMO (maybe just mine) I want it and I believe most other people would want it too( although maybe not on the Board). I know there is a bit of an increase needed for the stadium but lets be honest guys in Government terms it's pennies and i get all your ideas where that extra money could go but every year there are millions set aside for sports and other projects no matter what is spent on Health & Education etc and for the record if i thought for one minute that it was 2 schools or 20 nurses or the Stadium I'd never vote for the stadium, it doesn't work like that. It's not one or the other...

You seem to be repeatedly making a case that people don't want it built. They do, it's just that people don't see the need for the proposed capacity. Let's face it, the initial plans for this were a vanity project with figures based on concerts etc. and not "gaels". It would be almost empty ~350 days of the year but still requiring an army of people to maintain it. In its current guise, in the current climate, it is a nonsense project.

Antrim don't have a county ground and they should have one. Do they need to play in a 34k seater county ground? A resounding no!

Build a top class 25k stadium with the available capital. Let's get on with it.

[armaghniac]

Build a top class 25k stadium with the available capital. Let's get on with it.

Good idea, give Antrim a free ground that is feck all use to the GAA generally.

[illdecide]

Not 100% sure haven't the time to troll thru the pages but I believe the actual figure (open to correction) for evacuation safely in the 8 mins (max) allocated is/was 18,000. Think of how many time the Ulster Council and Antrim Co Board put patrons Health & Safety at risk playing games at the old Casement when there were crowds exceeding 18,000, having a full house at the old Casement and if there ever had of been an incident how would that have ended...

[twohands!!!]

Has anyone actually run any numbers whatsoever in terms of capacity versus cost.
How many times would a 30k seater stadium be expected to sell out over the next 20/25/30 years versus a 25k seater versus a 35k seater.
How much would a 25k/30k/35k seater costs versus the expected extra revenue they would bring in.
I would say most of the GAA stadia in Ireland rarely if ever hit full capacity.
From what I could find from a quick search PuC in Cork has only sold out to its full capacity of 45k once since it opened as a sports venue and that was for the Liam Millar charity gig.

The following are the attendences for all the championship games in hurling and football

Cork v Limerick 2018 hurling 34,607
Wexford v Waterford 2017 hurling 31,753
Cork v Tipp 2019 2017 hurling 30,274
Tipp v Clare 2017 hurling 28,567
Cork v Kerry 2018 football 27,764
Cork v Waterford 2019 hurling 26,521
Cork v Clare 2018 hurling 24,490
Cork v Kerry 2019 football 18,265
Clare v Wexford 2019 hurling 10,225
Cork v Limerick 2019 football 3,128

So far it looks like a 35k seater would have been sufficient.