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Non GAA Discussion => General discussion => Topic started by: highorlow on July 29, 2017, 10:16:04 PM

Title: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: highorlow on July 29, 2017, 10:16:04 PM
Time to get these pests to pay road tax like the rest of us.
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: gallsman on July 29, 2017, 10:18:08 PM
You pay road tax? Where?
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: highorlow on July 29, 2017, 10:21:19 PM
I do it online
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: thebigfella on July 29, 2017, 10:25:22 PM
When you pay online, does it go to a nice Nigerian fella?
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: laoislad on July 29, 2017, 10:27:32 PM
They are all a shower of c***ts.
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: DickyRock on July 29, 2017, 10:30:05 PM
I've never paid road tax in the north as it was abolished long before I was born :P. There's no tax that directly goes on to roads afaik.
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: The Subbie on July 29, 2017, 10:31:00 PM
Quote from: laoislad on July 29, 2017, 10:27:32 PM
They are all a shower of c***ts.
That's a bit harsh on Nigerian princes, bit of history there by the sound of it
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: heffo on July 29, 2017, 10:33:16 PM
We pay motor tax in Ireland on motortax.ie - is it different up North?
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: Milltown Row2 on July 29, 2017, 10:41:59 PM
Quote from: heffo on July 29, 2017, 10:33:16 PM
We pay motor tax in Ireland on motortax.ie - is it different up North?

Haven't paid tax in a while, neither had wife
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: highorlow on July 29, 2017, 10:47:59 PM
Bike Tax should be brought in.  It should be scaled like motor tax so the Lycra lads with their expensive bikes pay more, akin to the 4x4 brigade.  All hi nellies exempt like classic cars.
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: Tony Baloney on July 29, 2017, 11:09:45 PM
For this. Not all of them are pests but a large proportion are wankers. Some fella was killed a few weeks ago so there was a lot of bollox on social media about respecting cyclists. If I was a cyclist I'd be wanting respect the people driving the machinery.
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: Milltown Row2 on July 29, 2017, 11:35:01 PM
Quote from: Tony Baloney on July 29, 2017, 11:09:45 PM
For this. Not all of them are pests but a large proportion are w**kers. Some fella was killed a few weeks ago so there was a lot of bollox on social media about respecting cyclists. If I was a cyclist I'd be wanting respect the people driving the machinery.

There's as many dicks (percentage wise) driving both! They have been taxing bikes in Europe for years, don't see the problem as long as they use the money to create cycle lanes... we are still building new roads without putting them in place

But I've never seen as worst car drivers than I did this summer States side, fecking dicks of the highest order
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: Tony Baloney on July 30, 2017, 12:41:35 AM
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on July 29, 2017, 11:35:01 PM
Quote from: Tony Baloney on July 29, 2017, 11:09:45 PM
For this. Not all of them are pests but a large proportion are w**kers. Some fella was killed a few weeks ago so there was a lot of bollox on social media about respecting cyclists. If I was a cyclist I'd be wanting respect the people driving the machinery.

There's as many dicks (percentage wise) driving both! They have been taxing bikes in Europe for years, don't see the problem as long as they use the money to create cycle lanes... we are still building new roads without putting them in place

But I've never seen as worst car drivers than I did this summer States side, fecking dicks of the highest order
Cycle lanes are for towns and cities and Im all for them. Its the pricks out on the weekend holding up traffic that are a scourge.
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: Owen Brannigan on July 30, 2017, 08:09:57 AM
Quote from: heffo on July 29, 2017, 10:33:16 PM
We pay motor tax in Ireland on motortax.ie - is it different up North?

Up to April 2017, the motor tax or Vehicle Excise Duty (VED) was based on CO2 emissions, so some cars were duty free, some polluters like my 2L diesel VW only charged £30, other slight polluters like a little old petrol 1.2L charged up to £100.  All based on reducing CO2 while ignoring NOx output which is not regarded by governments or car manufacturers in Europe. Even now there is no legislation on it.

The result of so many fuel efficient engines both petrol and diesel was that UK income from VED has drastically fallen. So, from April 2017, all new cars are charged a base level of duty of £140 pa and a sliding scale surcharge based on CO2 output. Cars costs over £40k have an additional surcharge of £310 pa

The only exemptions are for electric cars which are not charged duty except for cars costing over £40k pay £310 pa, e.g. any Tesla even though they are non-direct polluters.
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: punt kick on July 31, 2017, 09:52:31 AM
Quote from: Tony Baloney on July 30, 2017, 12:41:35 AM
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on July 29, 2017, 11:35:01 PM
Quote from: Tony Baloney on July 29, 2017, 11:09:45 PM
For this. Not all of them are pests but a large proportion are w**kers. Some fella was killed a few weeks ago so there was a lot of bollox on social media about respecting cyclists. If I was a cyclist I'd be wanting respect the people driving the machinery.

There's as many dicks (percentage wise) driving both! They have been taxing bikes in Europe for years, don't see the problem as long as they use the money to create cycle lanes... we are still building new roads without putting them in place

But I've never seen as worst car drivers than I did this summer States side, fecking dicks of the highest order
Cycle lanes are for towns and cities and Im all for them. Its the pricks out on the weekend holding up traffic that are a scourge.

Yip riding 4 abreast even tractors pull over when they are holding up traffic - not these shower of fuckwits!
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: Dire Ear on July 31, 2017, 11:48:05 AM
Quote from: punt kick on July 31, 2017, 09:52:31 AM
Quote from: Tony Baloney on July 30, 2017, 12:41:35 AM
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on July 29, 2017, 11:35:01 PM
Quote from: Tony Baloney on July 29, 2017, 11:09:45 PM
For this. Not all of them are pests but a large proportion are w**kers. Some fella was killed a few weeks ago so there was a lot of bollox on social media about respecting cyclists. If I was a cyclist I'd be wanting respect the people driving the machinery.

There's as many dicks (percentage wise) driving both! They have been taxing bikes in Europe for years, don't see the problem as long as they use the money to create cycle lanes... we are still building new roads without putting them in place

But I've never seen as worst car drivers than I did this summer States side, fecking dicks of the highest order
Cycle lanes are for towns and cities and Im all for them. Its the pricks out on the weekend holding up traffic that are a scourge.

Yip riding 4 abreast even tractors pull over when they are holding up traffic - not these shower of fuckwits!
yes , hoors
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: Taylor on July 31, 2017, 11:59:37 AM
Hateful bunch alright.

Not only on country roads where they assume they own the road but it is gas to see them in cities where they drive on the road but if there is a jam or red light ahead they conveniently hop onto the footpath and continue their journey.
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: OakleafCounty on July 31, 2017, 12:23:35 PM
There are some hateful cyclists but there are also hateful pedestrians on country roads and far more hateful drivers throwing rubbish out their windows and driving like maniacs. Also plenty of hateful tractor drivers who have no respect for other people living in the area. You can't tax people for using something that emits no Co2 emissions or pollution at a time when governments need to be encouraging people to curb their car addiction.
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: punt kick on July 31, 2017, 01:00:45 PM
Quote from: OakleafCounty on July 31, 2017, 12:23:35 PM
There are some hateful cyclists but there are also hateful pedestrians on country roads and far more hateful drivers throwing rubbish out their windows and driving like maniacs. Also plenty of hateful tractor drivers who have no respect for other people living in the area. You can't tax people for using something that emits no Co2 emissions or pollution at a time when governments need to be encouraging people to curb their car addiction.

You could fine the bastards for dangerous driving, running red lights etc or breaking the highway code.  Take the bikes off them and scrap them if they don't pay a fixed penalty.  Maybe it's got to the stage to ride a bike on the road you need a licence!
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: bennydorano on July 31, 2017, 01:04:51 PM
I love flouting shit & annoying motorists. Makes my day.
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: OakleafCounty on July 31, 2017, 01:21:35 PM
Quote from: punt kick on July 31, 2017, 01:00:45 PM
Quote from: OakleafCounty on July 31, 2017, 12:23:35 PM
There are some hateful cyclists but there are also hateful pedestrians on country roads and far more hateful drivers throwing rubbish out their windows and driving like maniacs. Also plenty of hateful tractor drivers who have no respect for other people living in the area. You can't tax people for using something that emits no Co2 emissions or pollution at a time when governments need to be encouraging people to curb their car addiction.

You could fine the b**tards for dangerous driving, running red lights etc or breaking the highway code.  Take the bikes off them and scrap them if they don't pay a fixed penalty.  Maybe it's got to the stage to ride a bike on the road you need a licence!

Can't disagree with that. A couple of weeks ago a cyclist flew out past a give way sign in front of me and didn't even look sideways. I could have killed him if I was driving a bit faster. If his bike had a registration plate and I had a dash cam he'd have been done for it.
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: punt kick on July 31, 2017, 01:31:32 PM
You won't get any apologists for such behaviour from the cycling fraternity here though, as they are all arrogant c***ts.
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: punt kick on July 31, 2017, 01:32:47 PM
Quote from: AQMP on July 31, 2017, 01:29:48 PM
Has a cyclist ever killed a car driver?

So it is up to the motorist to watch out for cyclists not obeying the rules of the road - catch a f**king grip of your helmet kid.
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: Dire Ear on July 31, 2017, 01:33:39 PM
Quote from: AQMP on July 31, 2017, 01:29:48 PM
Has a cyclist ever killed a car driver?

Probably not, seems like a silly question
Since you are a cyclist, can you answer me this; why should your hobby hold me up on my journeys?
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: punt kick on July 31, 2017, 01:39:30 PM
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1394015/Cyclist-killed-motorist-road-rage-attack-driver-opened-car-door-him.html (http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1394015/Cyclist-killed-motorist-road-rage-attack-driver-opened-car-door-him.html)

A cyclist was jailed for 18 months today after he killed a motorist who opened his car door in front of him.
Tony Magdi, 52, died three weeks after being assaulted outside his greengrocer's shop in Hove, East Sussex, on November 7 last year.
Paul Lambeth, 36, was originally charged with inflicting grievous bodily harm, but this was changed to manslaughter following Mr Magdi's death at Hurstwood Park Neurological Centre in Haywards Heath on November 28.
Sentencing him at Hove Crown Court, Judge Michael Lawson QC said he had given Lambeth credit for pleading guilty at the first available opportunity.
But he added that the fact that he did not give himself up straight away -  and only did so after he had already been identified as a suspect and police were looking for him - was a strong aggravating factor.
Outlining the circumstances of the case, prosecutor Amy Packham said Lambeth had been cycling with two friends, James Jones and Michael Wilson, eastbound along Portland Road towards central Hove at around midday when the incident happened.
The three men were cycling in a line with Mr Jones in front when they approached Mr Magdi's Jaguar which had just pulled up and parked. Mr Magdi then opened his door before the cyclists had passed.

'The door struck a passing cyclist. There was a collision between the cyclist and the door,' Miss Packham said.
'This cyclist was not the defendant, it was his friend Mr James Jones, and they collided, causing Mr Jones to lose control of his bike and fall on to the road.'
Miss Packham said the collision forced Lambeth and Mr Wilson to brake and swerve, while a fourth passing cyclist, Anthony Randles, fell off his bike.
The court heard that, although all four cyclists were initially angry with Mr Magdi - with Lambeth hurling insults at the apologetic driver - 'the immediate confrontation and anger had passed'.
Miss Packham continued: 'It was at this point that the defendant suddenly punched Mr Magdi without provocation' and he fell hard on to the pavement.'
The prosecutor said Mr Jones then shouted at Lambeth, asking him why he had landed the punch, to which he replied: 'I'm not wearing it.'
Lambeth then mounted his bike and cycled away with Mr Wilson.
Mr Jones and Mr Randles tried to assist Mr Magdi by putting him in the recovery position, but when it became clear that he was unconscious and unresponsive, Mr Jones too panicked and fled the scene.
A passing doctor came to Mr Magdi's aid and he was taken to the Royal Sussex County Hospital in Brighton by ambulance.
However, a CT scan showed he had significant bleeding on his brain and he was transferred to Hurstwood Park where he died three weeks later.

Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: punt kick on July 31, 2017, 01:47:49 PM
Good man AQMP you are coming across well - keep popping up deaths there I am sure the families of the victims will appreciate their love ones being used as fodder by yourself.  The last one hasn't even the circumstances, if I was a cyclist I would try to avoid one of the busiest roads in any country!
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: laoislad on July 31, 2017, 01:52:40 PM
Are you saying cyclists are never in the wrong AQMP?
Of course drivers need to be careful around cyclists but cyclists should start be more careful themselves also.
It isn't always car drivers fault.
Some of the things I've seen cyclists do around Dublin city is crazy. I saw one nearly knock down a young mother pushing a pram the other day because he didn't stop at a red light.
When someone shouted after him he just stuck his finger up at them and kept going.
There is a large majority who are self entitled pricks  who want everyone else to obey the rules while they completely ignore them themselves.
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: punt kick on July 31, 2017, 01:53:16 PM
Quote from: AQMP on July 31, 2017, 01:48:24 PM
Quote from: Dire Ear on July 31, 2017, 01:33:39 PM
Quote from: AQMP on July 31, 2017, 01:29:48 PM
Has a cyclist ever killed a car driver?

Probably not, seems like a silly question. Since you are a cyclist, can you answer me this; why should your hobby hold me up on my journeys?

::)

Care to answer his question?
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: punt kick on July 31, 2017, 01:53:57 PM
Quote from: AQMP on July 31, 2017, 01:52:32 PM
Quote from: punt kick on July 31, 2017, 01:47:49 PM
Good man AQMP you are coming across well - keep popping up deaths there I am sure the families of the victims will appreciate their love ones being used as fodder by yourself.  The last one hasn't even the circumstances, if I was a cyclist I would try to avoid one of the busiest roads in any country!

Right, but I'm sure the families will appreciate you blaming their loved ones for their own deaths?

Point out where I blamed cyclists for their own deaths?
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: laoislad on July 31, 2017, 01:58:49 PM
Quote from: AQMP on July 31, 2017, 01:29:48 PM
Has a cyclist ever killed a car driver?
Consider a situation where a cyclist breaks a red light or comes out of a junction without stopping and a car has to avoid them and crashes into another car or wall or whatever.
This is a highly likely scenario and I'd be shocked if something like has never happened.
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: J70 on July 31, 2017, 02:15:55 PM
Quote from: punt kick on July 31, 2017, 01:39:30 PM
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1394015/Cyclist-killed-motorist-road-rage-attack-driver-opened-car-door-him.html (http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1394015/Cyclist-killed-motorist-road-rage-attack-driver-opened-car-door-him.html)

A cyclist was jailed for 18 months today after he killed a motorist who opened his car door in front of him.
Tony Magdi, 52, died three weeks after being assaulted outside his greengrocer's shop in Hove, East Sussex, on November 7 last year.
Paul Lambeth, 36, was originally charged with inflicting grievous bodily harm, but this was changed to manslaughter following Mr Magdi's death at Hurstwood Park Neurological Centre in Haywards Heath on November 28.
Sentencing him at Hove Crown Court, Judge Michael Lawson QC said he had given Lambeth credit for pleading guilty at the first available opportunity.
But he added that the fact that he did not give himself up straight away -  and only did so after he had already been identified as a suspect and police were looking for him - was a strong aggravating factor.
Outlining the circumstances of the case, prosecutor Amy Packham said Lambeth had been cycling with two friends, James Jones and Michael Wilson, eastbound along Portland Road towards central Hove at around midday when the incident happened.
The three men were cycling in a line with Mr Jones in front when they approached Mr Magdi's Jaguar which had just pulled up and parked. Mr Magdi then opened his door before the cyclists had passed.

'The door struck a passing cyclist. There was a collision between the cyclist and the door,' Miss Packham said.
'This cyclist was not the defendant, it was his friend Mr James Jones, and they collided, causing Mr Jones to lose control of his bike and fall on to the road.'
Miss Packham said the collision forced Lambeth and Mr Wilson to brake and swerve, while a fourth passing cyclist, Anthony Randles, fell off his bike.
The court heard that, although all four cyclists were initially angry with Mr Magdi - with Lambeth hurling insults at the apologetic driver - 'the immediate confrontation and anger had passed'.
Miss Packham continued: 'It was at this point that the defendant suddenly punched Mr Magdi without provocation' and he fell hard on to the pavement.'
The prosecutor said Mr Jones then shouted at Lambeth, asking him why he had landed the punch, to which he replied: 'I'm not wearing it.'
Lambeth then mounted his bike and cycled away with Mr Wilson.
Mr Jones and Mr Randles tried to assist Mr Magdi by putting him in the recovery position, but when it became clear that he was unconscious and unresponsive, Mr Jones too panicked and fled the scene.
A passing doctor came to Mr Magdi's aid and he was taken to the Royal Sussex County Hospital in Brighton by ambulance.
However, a CT scan showed he had significant bleeding on his brain and he was transferred to Hurstwood Park where he died three weeks later.

What has this got to do with the topic?

The cause of death was not a person in the process of cycling. It was a post-accident (which appears to have been the car driver's fault) assault.
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: punt kick on July 31, 2017, 02:16:25 PM
Quote from: AQMP on July 31, 2017, 02:02:51 PM
Quote from: punt kick on July 31, 2017, 01:53:57 PM
Quote from: AQMP on July 31, 2017, 01:52:32 PM
Quote from: punt kick on July 31, 2017, 01:47:49 PM
Good man AQMP you are coming across well - keep popping up deaths there I am sure the families of the victims will appreciate their love ones being used as fodder by yourself.  The last one hasn't even the circumstances, if I was a cyclist I would try to avoid one of the busiest roads in any country!

Right, but I'm sure the families will appreciate you blaming their loved ones for their own deaths?

Point out where I blamed cyclists for their own deaths?

if I was a cyclist I would try to avoid one of the busiest roads in any country! 

I understood this to infer that he shouldn't have been there in the first place?  If that's not what you meant, then apologies

It was more a general statement of fact.
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: punt kick on July 31, 2017, 02:19:34 PM
Quote from: J70 on July 31, 2017, 02:15:55 PM

What has this got to do with the topic?

The cause of death was not a person in the process of cycling. It was a post-accident (which appears to have been the car driver's fault) assault.

It was road rage from a cyclist at a motorist, and not even the cyclist the motorist accidentally clipped - some gobshite coming behind.
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: punt kick on July 31, 2017, 02:21:01 PM
Quote from: AQMP on July 31, 2017, 02:06:12 PM
Quote from: punt kick on July 31, 2017, 01:53:16 PM
Quote from: AQMP on July 31, 2017, 01:48:24 PM
Quote from: Dire Ear on July 31, 2017, 01:33:39 PM
Quote from: AQMP on July 31, 2017, 01:29:48 PM
Has a cyclist ever killed a car driver?

Probably not, seems like a silly question. Since you are a cyclist, can you answer me this; why should your hobby hold me up on my journeys?

::)

Care to answer his question?

A few weeks ago I was held up going to visit my old Mum by a crowd going to a football match.

Did everyone at the football match walk side by side for 10 miles and ignore the fact you and line of cars were behind them, does this happen you daily?
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: J70 on July 31, 2017, 02:21:53 PM
Quote from: Dire Ear on July 31, 2017, 01:33:39 PM
Quote from: AQMP on July 31, 2017, 01:29:48 PM
Has a cyclist ever killed a car driver?

Probably not, seems like a silly question
Since you are a cyclist, can you answer me this; why should your hobby hold me up on my journeys?

Well sure why should trucks and agricultural machinery hold you up as well with their lower speed limits and capabilities?

And why do I sometimes get stuck behind old people and other slow people when walking on a narrow footpath? ::)
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: J70 on July 31, 2017, 02:25:03 PM
Quote from: punt kick on July 31, 2017, 02:19:34 PM
Quote from: J70 on July 31, 2017, 02:15:55 PM

What has this got to do with the topic?

The cause of death was not a person in the process of cycling. It was a post-accident (which appears to have been the car driver's fault) assault.

It was road rage from a cyclist at a motorist, and not even the cyclist the motorist accidentally clipped - some gobshite coming behind.

Yes, clearly this idiot has anger issues and he will pay for them.

What that has got to do with the risk to motorists from cyclists in general is beyond me?

Unless of course you have some stats to shed light on the issue?

Are car drivers more at risk, from road rage or otherwise, from the average cyclist or car driver?

And how about the relative risk to cyclists?
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: Dire Ear on July 31, 2017, 02:26:44 PM
Quote from: J70 on July 31, 2017, 02:21:53 PM
Quote from: Dire Ear on July 31, 2017, 01:33:39 PM
Quote from: AQMP on July 31, 2017, 01:29:48 PM
Has a cyclist ever killed a car driver?

Probably not, seems like a silly question
Since you are a cyclist, can you answer me this; why should your hobby hold me up on my journeys?

Well sure why should trucks and agricultural machinery hold you up as well with their lower speed limits and capabilities?

And why do I sometimes get stuck behind old people and other slow people when walking on a narrow footpath? ::)
Maybe you should read the question.......hobby
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: J70 on July 31, 2017, 02:30:49 PM
Quote from: AQMP on July 31, 2017, 02:20:53 PM
....however I would be in favour it being compulsory for all cyclists (say over the age of 16 to avoid kiddies on stabilisers) to have adequate insurance.  Cycling Ireland do offer insurance through their membership.  Most club cyclists will be but there is a huge amount of leisure cyclists out there who aren't.  I'd even consider compulsory membership of CI for all bike users and give CI more responsibility for ensuring cyclists are aware of their responsibilities on the road.

OK fess up time, as you may have guessed, I do a bit of cycling but I'm just making the point that the "all cyclists are pricks and cnuts" attitude can be challenged.

DeBlasio has been installing bike lanes on a lot of the streets in NYC. And of course the complaints are coming thick and fast about cyclist behaviour, same as here, from drivers, bitching because they lost a lane and their journey home might take five minutes longer.

Of course, none of them have anything to say about the appalling standard and behaviour of drivers of cars, trucks etc. on New York roads and streets. Between speeding, tailgating, talking/texting on phones, reckless, aggressive driving, breaking red lights, unsafe overtaking and the rest, you're taking your life in your hands just driving, never mind cycling. And I would safely say at least half the drivers here don't know what an indicator light is, or if they do, the correct way to use it.
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: J70 on July 31, 2017, 02:31:31 PM
Quote from: Dire Ear on July 31, 2017, 02:26:44 PM
Quote from: J70 on July 31, 2017, 02:21:53 PM
Quote from: Dire Ear on July 31, 2017, 01:33:39 PM
Quote from: AQMP on July 31, 2017, 01:29:48 PM
Has a cyclist ever killed a car driver?

Probably not, seems like a silly question
Since you are a cyclist, can you answer me this; why should your hobby hold me up on my journeys?

Well sure why should trucks and agricultural machinery hold you up as well with their lower speed limits and capabilities?

And why do I sometimes get stuck behind old people and other slow people when walking on a narrow footpath? ::)
Maybe you should read the question.......hobby

I read it, and I don't see the relevance.

Feel free to explain.
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: punt kick on July 31, 2017, 02:44:34 PM
Quote from: J70 on July 31, 2017, 02:25:03 PM
Quote from: punt kick on July 31, 2017, 02:19:34 PM
Quote from: J70 on July 31, 2017, 02:15:55 PM

What has this got to do with the topic?

The cause of death was not a person in the process of cycling. It was a post-accident (which appears to have been the car driver's fault) assault.

It was road rage from a cyclist at a motorist, and not even the cyclist the motorist accidentally clipped - some gobshite coming behind.

Yes, clearly this idiot has anger issues and he will pay for them.

What that has got to do with the risk to motorists from cyclists in general is beyond me?

Unless of course you have some stats to shed light on the issue?

Are car drivers more at risk, from road rage or otherwise, from the average cyclist or car driver?

And how about the relative risk to cyclists?

Quote from: AQMP on July 31, 2017, 01:29:48 PM
Has a cyclist ever killed a car driver?

Was the question - that link was the answer, you need any further explanation or can you grasp that?
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: J70 on July 31, 2017, 02:52:29 PM
Quote from: punt kick on July 31, 2017, 02:44:34 PM
Quote from: J70 on July 31, 2017, 02:25:03 PM
Quote from: punt kick on July 31, 2017, 02:19:34 PM
Quote from: J70 on July 31, 2017, 02:15:55 PM

What has this got to do with the topic?

The cause of death was not a person in the process of cycling. It was a post-accident (which appears to have been the car driver's fault) assault.

It was road rage from a cyclist at a motorist, and not even the cyclist the motorist accidentally clipped - some gobshite coming behind.

Yes, clearly this idiot has anger issues and he will pay for them.

What that has got to do with the risk to motorists from cyclists in general is beyond me?

Unless of course you have some stats to shed light on the issue?

Are car drivers more at risk, from road rage or otherwise, from the average cyclist or car driver?

And how about the relative risk to cyclists?

Quote from: AQMP on July 31, 2017, 01:29:48 PM
Has a cyclist ever killed a car driver?

Was the question - that link was the answer, you need any further explanation or can you grasp that?

I think the implication of the question was about the actions of a cyclist while CYCLING ever killing a car driver.

NOT a road rage incident in reaction to a car driver seriously endangering a cyclist.
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: punt kick on July 31, 2017, 03:42:39 PM
He was CYCLING behind the guy who had an accident and killed the motorist who caused the accident - it was a direct answer to a direct question.
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: keeperlit on July 31, 2017, 03:46:00 PM
Quote from: AQMP on July 31, 2017, 02:20:53 PM
....however I would be in favour it being compulsory for all cyclists (say over the age of 16 to avoid kiddies on stabilisers) to have adequate insurance.  Cycling Ireland do offer insurance through their membership.  Most club cyclists will be but there is a huge amount of leisure cyclists out there who aren't.  I'd even consider compulsory membership of CI for all bike users and give CI more responsibility for ensuring cyclists are aware of their responsibilities on the road.

OK fess up time, as you may have guessed, I do a bit of cycling but I'm just making the point that the "all cyclists are pricks and cnuts" attitude can be challenged.

What would the point of Insurance be- whenever they do cause accidents or thump the side/roof of your car causing damage on narrow country roads they just ride on and there is no way of identifying them.
One incident I was involved in was were after pulling out of the lane of my own house on a narrow country road and sitting  behind a cyclist for about 1/2 mile. During this 1/2 mile the fellow had about 4 places that he could have pulled into and allowed me pass. I politely beeped as I gave him the benefit of the doubt that he did not hear me. He then preceded to give me and my father a tirade of abuse and sat bang in the middle of the road for about 1 & 1/2 miles. I eventually  passed him and jumped out of the car (calmly) to ask him what the problem was. The first thing that came out of his mouth was ' I'll have your house, your car the whole lot if you come near me' as he ride on. I had no intention of touching him but just wanted to find out what his problem was. Brave fella. Protected by his an anonymity but knew were I lived and would have had a number plate, etc.

And this is not one isolated incident with just this lad been a t@sser. Another brave lycra head followed my mother up into the yard and thumped and banged at the car roof. Called the police couldn't do a thing as there is no way of identifying these cowards and by the time police would react they are long gone. And then have the cheek to come crying victim when something happens. Several other incidents like this on our road.

In my opinion, there is a large majority of the lycra brigade who treat other road users like this, as woe betide you would affect their time trials.   All about the stats you know.
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: Hardy on July 31, 2017, 03:53:19 PM
Quote from: punt kick on July 31, 2017, 03:42:39 PM
He was CYCLING behind the guy who had an accident and killed the motorist who caused the accident - it was a direct answer to a direct question.

I think I can help.

QuoteLambeth then mounted his bike and cycled away

This implies that when he punched the victim he was not mounted on his bike. Therefore, he wasn't a cyclist when he committed the killing. Therefore this was not a case of a cyclist killing a car driver. Doubly so, as the "car driver" was presumably stopped when he was attacked and therefore not a driver.

Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: haveaharp on July 31, 2017, 03:53:42 PM
Quote from: keeperlit on July 31, 2017, 03:46:00 PM
Quote from: AQMP on July 31, 2017, 02:20:53 PM
....however I would be in favour it being compulsory for all cyclists (say over the age of 16 to avoid kiddies on stabilisers) to have adequate insurance.  Cycling Ireland do offer insurance through their membership.  Most club cyclists will be but there is a huge amount of leisure cyclists out there who aren't.  I'd even consider compulsory membership of CI for all bike users and give CI more responsibility for ensuring cyclists are aware of their responsibilities on the road.

OK fess up time, as you may have guessed, I do a bit of cycling but I'm just making the point that the "all cyclists are pricks and cnuts" attitude can be challenged.

What would the point of Insurance be- whenever they do cause accidents or thump the side/roof of your car causing damage on narrow country roads they just ride on and there is no way of identifying them.
One incident I was involved in was were after pulling out of the lane of my own house on a narrow country road and sitting  behind a cyclist for about 1/2 mile. During this 1/2 mile the fellow had about 4 places that he could have pulled into and allowed me pass. I politely beeped as I gave him the benefit of the doubt that he did not hear me. He then preceded to give me and my father a tirade of abuse and sat bang in the middle of the road for about 1 & 1/2 miles. I eventually  passed him and jumped out of the car (calmly) to ask him what the problem was. The first thing that came out of his mouth was ' I'll have your house, your car the whole lot if you come near me' as he ride on. I had no intention of touching him but just wanted to find out what his problem was. Brave fella. Protected by his an anonymity but knew were I lived and would have had a number plate, etc.

And this is not one isolated incident with just this lad been a t@sser. Another brave lycra head followed my mother up into the yard and thumped and banged at the car roof. Called the police couldn't do a thing as there is no way of identifying these cowards and by the time police would react they are long gone. And then have the cheek to come crying victim when something happens. Several other incidents like this on our road.

In my opinion, there is a large majority of the lycra brigade who treat other road users like this, as woe betide you would affect their time trials.   All about the stats you know.


The could have pulled in and allowed you to pass ? I'm baffled. Why should he ? What was your rush?
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: laoislad on July 31, 2017, 04:07:03 PM
Quote from: haveaharp on July 31, 2017, 03:53:42 PM
Quote from: keeperlit on July 31, 2017, 03:46:00 PM
Quote from: AQMP on July 31, 2017, 02:20:53 PM
....however I would be in favour it being compulsory for all cyclists (say over the age of 16 to avoid kiddies on stabilisers) to have adequate insurance.  Cycling Ireland do offer insurance through their membership.  Most club cyclists will be but there is a huge amount of leisure cyclists out there who aren't.  I'd even consider compulsory membership of CI for all bike users and give CI more responsibility for ensuring cyclists are aware of their responsibilities on the road.

OK fess up time, as you may have guessed, I do a bit of cycling but I'm just making the point that the "all cyclists are pricks and cnuts" attitude can be challenged.

What would the point of Insurance be- whenever they do cause accidents or thump the side/roof of your car causing damage on narrow country roads they just ride on and there is no way of identifying them.
One incident I was involved in was were after pulling out of the lane of my own house on a narrow country road and sitting  behind a cyclist for about 1/2 mile. During this 1/2 mile the fellow had about 4 places that he could have pulled into and allowed me pass. I politely beeped as I gave him the benefit of the doubt that he did not hear me. He then preceded to give me and my father a tirade of abuse and sat bang in the middle of the road for about 1 & 1/2 miles. I eventually  passed him and jumped out of the car (calmly) to ask him what the problem was. The first thing that came out of his mouth was ' I'll have your house, your car the whole lot if you come near me' as he ride on. I had no intention of touching him but just wanted to find out what his problem was. Brave fella. Protected by his an anonymity but knew were I lived and would have had a number plate, etc.

And this is not one isolated incident with just this lad been a t@sser. Another brave lycra head followed my mother up into the yard and thumped and banged at the car roof. Called the police couldn't do a thing as there is no way of identifying these cowards and by the time police would react they are long gone. And then have the cheek to come crying victim when something happens. Several other incidents like this on our road.

In my opinion, there is a large majority of the lycra brigade who treat other road users like this, as woe betide you would affect their time trials.   All about the stats you know.


The could have pulled in and allowed you to pass ? I'm baffled. Why should he ? What was your rush?
You're right of course..why should he let them pass.
Like why would I let the old man behind me in the queue go ahead of me when I have a full trolly of shopping and he only has a loaf of bread..Or why would you hold the door open for someone..Or let someone out of a junction in slow moving traffic..
Its called manners..
So yeah you may ask why should he pull over..I'll ask you why wouldn't he pull over? Where is the harm in not being a p***k?
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: haveaharp on July 31, 2017, 04:10:35 PM
Quote from: laoislad on July 31, 2017, 04:07:03 PM
Quote from: haveaharp on July 31, 2017, 03:53:42 PM
Quote from: keeperlit on July 31, 2017, 03:46:00 PM
Quote from: AQMP on July 31, 2017, 02:20:53 PM
....however I would be in favour it being compulsory for all cyclists (say over the age of 16 to avoid kiddies on stabilisers) to have adequate insurance.  Cycling Ireland do offer insurance through their membership.  Most club cyclists will be but there is a huge amount of leisure cyclists out there who aren't.  I'd even consider compulsory membership of CI for all bike users and give CI more responsibility for ensuring cyclists are aware of their responsibilities on the road.

OK fess up time, as you may have guessed, I do a bit of cycling but I'm just making the point that the "all cyclists are pricks and cnuts" attitude can be challenged.

What would the point of Insurance be- whenever they do cause accidents or thump the side/roof of your car causing damage on narrow country roads they just ride on and there is no way of identifying them.
One incident I was involved in was were after pulling out of the lane of my own house on a narrow country road and sitting  behind a cyclist for about 1/2 mile. During this 1/2 mile the fellow had about 4 places that he could have pulled into and allowed me pass. I politely beeped as I gave him the benefit of the doubt that he did not hear me. He then preceded to give me and my father a tirade of abuse and sat bang in the middle of the road for about 1 & 1/2 miles. I eventually  passed him and jumped out of the car (calmly) to ask him what the problem was. The first thing that came out of his mouth was ' I'll have your house, your car the whole lot if you come near me' as he ride on. I had no intention of touching him but just wanted to find out what his problem was. Brave fella. Protected by his an anonymity but knew were I lived and would have had a number plate, etc.

And this is not one isolated incident with just this lad been a t@sser. Another brave lycra head followed my mother up into the yard and thumped and banged at the car roof. Called the police couldn't do a thing as there is no way of identifying these cowards and by the time police would react they are long gone. And then have the cheek to come crying victim when something happens. Several other incidents like this on our road.

In my opinion, there is a large majority of the lycra brigade who treat other road users like this, as woe betide you would affect their time trials.   All about the stats you know.


The could have pulled in and allowed you to pass ? I'm baffled. Why should he ? What was your rush?
You're right of course..why should he let them pass.
Like why would I let the old man behind me in the queue ahead of me when I have a full trolly of shopping and he only has a loaf of bread..Or why would you hold the door open for someone..Or let someone out of a junction in slow moving traffic..
Its called manners..
So yeah you may ask why should he pull over..I'll ask you why wouldn't he pull over? Where is the harm in not being a p***k?

Because quite simply within a minute or so he would be able to pass. Drivers think they have the right to pass cyclists with close passes left right and centre yet the same 4x4 driving twats will slow to a crawl for someone on a horse. Whats the difference ?
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: haveaharp on July 31, 2017, 04:12:53 PM
that said not all 4x4 drivers are twats. ;) Audi's Smartcars and Range rovers usually are though.
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: Tony Baloney on July 31, 2017, 04:23:52 PM
Quote from: haveaharp on July 31, 2017, 03:53:42 PM
Quote from: keeperlit on July 31, 2017, 03:46:00 PM
Quote from: AQMP on July 31, 2017, 02:20:53 PM
....however I would be in favour it being compulsory for all cyclists (say over the age of 16 to avoid kiddies on stabilisers) to have adequate insurance.  Cycling Ireland do offer insurance through their membership.  Most club cyclists will be but there is a huge amount of leisure cyclists out there who aren't.  I'd even consider compulsory membership of CI for all bike users and give CI more responsibility for ensuring cyclists are aware of their responsibilities on the road.

OK fess up time, as you may have guessed, I do a bit of cycling but I'm just making the point that the "all cyclists are pricks and cnuts" attitude can be challenged.

What would the point of Insurance be- whenever they do cause accidents or thump the side/roof of your car causing damage on narrow country roads they just ride on and there is no way of identifying them.
One incident I was involved in was were after pulling out of the lane of my own house on a narrow country road and sitting  behind a cyclist for about 1/2 mile. During this 1/2 mile the fellow had about 4 places that he could have pulled into and allowed me pass. I politely beeped as I gave him the benefit of the doubt that he did not hear me. He then preceded to give me and my father a tirade of abuse and sat bang in the middle of the road for about 1 & 1/2 miles. I eventually  passed him and jumped out of the car (calmly) to ask him what the problem was. The first thing that came out of his mouth was ' I'll have your house, your car the whole lot if you come near me' as he ride on. I had no intention of touching him but just wanted to find out what his problem was. Brave fella. Protected by his an anonymity but knew were I lived and would have had a number plate, etc.

And this is not one isolated incident with just this lad been a t@sser. Another brave lycra head followed my mother up into the yard and thumped and banged at the car roof. Called the police couldn't do a thing as there is no way of identifying these cowards and by the time police would react they are long gone. And then have the cheek to come crying victim when something happens. Several other incidents like this on our road.

In my opinion, there is a large majority of the lycra brigade who treat other road users like this, as woe betide you would affect their time trials.   All about the stats you know.


The could have pulled in and allowed you to pass ? I'm baffled. Why should he ? What was your rush?
What a pathetic response. Yes why let someone pass? They might be transporting a sick child* or pregnant woman to hospital. Or on their way to an appointment or work. The list goes on but you can be rest assured the driver of the car has something more important to be at that than the useless cnut on the bike.

*Someone I know had a neighbour call round giving off that they were on their way to an out of hours appointment with their baby when they got stuck in a massive tailback due to their son in laws cycling club. Needless to say not one cyclist made any attempt to give way. When he confronted the son in law about it, the response was a shrug of the shoulders.
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: AZOffaly on July 31, 2017, 04:25:49 PM
A horse is a live animal that can spook if you startle it. 

I don't have problems with single cyclists, but I do hate those little peletons that clog up country lanes, and don't give a shite who is behind them. At least tractors and the like are working!
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: Tony Baloney on July 31, 2017, 04:29:34 PM
Quote from: AZOffaly on July 31, 2017, 04:25:49 PM
A horse is a live animal that can spook if you startle it. 

I don't have problems with single cyclists, but I do hate those little peletons that clog up country lanes, and don't give a shite who is behind them. At least tractors and the like are working!
That's the shit you face round here. Single cyclists or small groups are no bother but the big cycling clubs riding 2 abreast chatting are a menace. They shouldn't be a allowed to be in groups more than 2 cars in length and should leave spaces in between for overtaking.
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: Hound on July 31, 2017, 04:29:55 PM
Quote from: AZOffaly on July 31, 2017, 04:25:49 PM
A horse is a live animal that can spook if you startle it. 

I don't have problems with single cyclists, but I do hate those little peletons that clog up country lanes, and don't give a shite who is behind them. At least tractors and the like are working!
LL hit the nail on the head. It's just manners. Most people have them, some people don't. Lycra clad cyclists seem to be overwhelmingly in the latter category.
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: J70 on July 31, 2017, 04:41:38 PM
Quote from: punt kick on July 31, 2017, 03:42:39 PM
He was CYCLING behind the guy who had an accident and killed the motorist who caused the accident - it was a direct answer to a direct question.

But its an irrelevant answer, which is my point. His conduct while cycling and the results thereof are not what killed that man and are not in question. His anger management problem, his resort to violence, and his callous/cowardly lack of concern for his victim are the issue.

Had he run a red light or shot out on to the street out of nowhere or was weaving in and out of traffic, causing an accident with a car in which a driver was killed, then that would be relevant to the question.

Its like the stories we see on the board occasionally when the Indo or whatever leads with a headline about "GAA player in deadly assault" or whatever, and the incident in question took place in a night club or some other setting and circumstances that had nothing whatsoever to do with the person being a GAA player/member.

Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: haveaharp on July 31, 2017, 04:45:58 PM
Quote from: Tony Baloney on July 31, 2017, 04:23:52 PM
Quote from: haveaharp on July 31, 2017, 03:53:42 PM
Quote from: keeperlit on July 31, 2017, 03:46:00 PM
Quote from: AQMP on July 31, 2017, 02:20:53 PM
....however I would be in favour it being compulsory for all cyclists (say over the age of 16 to avoid kiddies on stabilisers) to have adequate insurance.  Cycling Ireland do offer insurance through their membership.  Most club cyclists will be but there is a huge amount of leisure cyclists out there who aren't.  I'd even consider compulsory membership of CI for all bike users and give CI more responsibility for ensuring cyclists are aware of their responsibilities on the road.

OK fess up time, as you may have guessed, I do a bit of cycling but I'm just making the point that the "all cyclists are pricks and cnuts" attitude can be challenged.

What would the point of Insurance be- whenever they do cause accidents or thump the side/roof of your car causing damage on narrow country roads they just ride on and there is no way of identifying them.
One incident I was involved in was were after pulling out of the lane of my own house on a narrow country road and sitting  behind a cyclist for about 1/2 mile. During this 1/2 mile the fellow had about 4 places that he could have pulled into and allowed me pass. I politely beeped as I gave him the benefit of the doubt that he did not hear me. He then preceded to give me and my father a tirade of abuse and sat bang in the middle of the road for about 1 & 1/2 miles. I eventually  passed him and jumped out of the car (calmly) to ask him what the problem was. The first thing that came out of his mouth was ' I'll have your house, your car the whole lot if you come near me' as he ride on. I had no intention of touching him but just wanted to find out what his problem was. Brave fella. Protected by his an anonymity but knew were I lived and would have had a number plate, etc.

And this is not one isolated incident with just this lad been a t@sser. Another brave lycra head followed my mother up into the yard and thumped and banged at the car roof. Called the police couldn't do a thing as there is no way of identifying these cowards and by the time police would react they are long gone. And then have the cheek to come crying victim when something happens. Several other incidents like this on our road.

In my opinion, there is a large majority of the lycra brigade who treat other road users like this, as woe betide you would affect their time trials.   All about the stats you know.


The could have pulled in and allowed you to pass ? I'm baffled. Why should he ? What was your rush?
What a pathetic response. Yes why let someone pass? They might be transporting a sick child* or pregnant woman to hospital. Or on their way to an appointment or work. The list goes on but you can be rest assured the driver of the car has something more important to be at that than the useless cnut on the bike.

*Someone I know had a neighbour call round giving off that they were on their way to an out of hours appointment with their baby when they got stuck in a massive tailback due to their son in laws cycling club. Needless to say not one cyclist made any attempt to give way. When he confronted the son in law about it, the response was a shrug of the shoulders.

Clearly lots of petrol heads on this thread. Their time more important than anyone elses.
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: haveaharp on July 31, 2017, 04:49:08 PM
Part of the driving test should be to do 50 hrs on a bike over a month or so. Get some perspective on how much of an asshole some people behind a wheel actually are.
Cycling clubs are perfectly entitled to ride 2 a breast and how often does their peleton actually become bigger than say an articulated truck. Are we clamouring for trucks to be removed from the road ?
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: laoislad on July 31, 2017, 04:51:51 PM
Quote from: haveaharp on July 31, 2017, 04:49:08 PM
Part of the driving test should be to do 50 hrs on a bike over a month or so. Get some perspective on how much of an asshole some people behind a wheel actually are.
Cycling clubs are perfectly entitled to ride 2 a breast and how often does their peleton actually become bigger than say an articulated truck. Are we clamouring for trucks to be removed from the road ?
I've  got big into fitness and keeping myself in shape the last few years. Would prefer the running above all else but have a bike at home that I take out on occasion. I've got more abuse off other cyclists than I have off car drivers.
Stopped at a red light one evening and this tour de France wannabe gives me an earful for stopping as he nearly went into the back of me, he then just sped off through the red light before I could answer him.
I wouldn't be a fan of wearing lycra so maybe he didn't like the running shorts and Liverpool Jersey I was wearing. I'm sure he had a Strava segment that he just had to beat at the time...f**k the red light.
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: square_ball on July 31, 2017, 04:53:30 PM
Quote from: haveaharp on July 31, 2017, 04:49:08 PM
Part of the driving test should be to do 50 hrs on a bike over a month or so. Get some perspective on how much of an asshole some people behind a wheel actually are.
Cycling clubs are perfectly entitled to ride 2 a breast and how often does their peleton actually become bigger than say an articulated truck. Are we clamouring for trucks to be removed from the road ?

Do trucks travel at 15-20mph??
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: haveaharp on July 31, 2017, 04:55:28 PM
Quote from: square_ball on July 31, 2017, 04:53:30 PM
Quote from: haveaharp on July 31, 2017, 04:49:08 PM
Part of the driving test should be to do 50 hrs on a bike over a month or so. Get some perspective on how much of an asshole some people behind a wheel actually are.
Cycling clubs are perfectly entitled to ride 2 a breast and how often does their peleton actually become bigger than say an articulated truck. Are we clamouring for trucks to be removed from the road ?

Do trucks travel at 15-20mph??

No therefore the cyclists at 15-20mph must be easier and quicker to overtake
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: Tony Baloney on July 31, 2017, 04:56:00 PM
Quote from: haveaharp on July 31, 2017, 04:49:08 PM
Part of the driving test should be to do 50 hrs on a bike over a month or so. Get some perspective on how much of an asshole some people behind a wheel actually are.
Cycling clubs are perfectly entitled to ride 2 a breast and how often does their peleton actually become bigger than say an articulated truck. Are we clamouring for trucks to be removed from the road ?
That's the best you can come up with  ??? Take yourself over to Hoganstand.
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: haveaharp on July 31, 2017, 04:56:24 PM
Quote from: laoislad on July 31, 2017, 04:51:51 PM
Quote from: haveaharp on July 31, 2017, 04:49:08 PM
Part of the driving test should be to do 50 hrs on a bike over a month or so. Get some perspective on how much of an asshole some people behind a wheel actually are.
Cycling clubs are perfectly entitled to ride 2 a breast and how often does their peleton actually become bigger than say an articulated truck. Are we clamouring for trucks to be removed from the road ?
I've  got big into fitness and keeping myself in shape the last few years. Would prefer the running above all else but have a bike at home that I take out on occasion. I've got more abuse off other cyclists than I have off car drivers.
Stopped at a red light one evening and this tour de France wannabe gives me an earful for stopping as he nearly went into the back of me, he then just sped off through the red light before I could answer him.
I wouldn't be a fan of wearing lycra so maybe he didn't like the running shorts and Liverpool Jersey I was wearing. I'm sure he had a Strava segment that he just had to beat at the time...f**k the red light.

Well in fairness LL that guy was a gobshite. On the road follow the rules - give respect and get respect.
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: take_yer_points on July 31, 2017, 05:01:28 PM
Quote from: haveaharp on July 31, 2017, 04:49:08 PM
Part of the driving test should be to do 50 hrs on a bike over a month or so. Get some perspective on how much of an asshole some people behind a wheel actually are.
Cycling clubs are perfectly entitled to ride 2 a breast and how often does their peleton actually become bigger than say an articulated truck. Are we clamouring for trucks to be removed from the road ?

I thought it was single file on busy roads??
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: keeperlit on July 31, 2017, 05:08:38 PM
Quote from: haveaharp on July 31, 2017, 03:53:42 PM
Quote from: keeperlit on July 31, 2017, 03:46:00 PM
Quote from: AQMP on July 31, 2017, 02:20:53 PM
....however I would be in favour it being compulsory for all cyclists (say over the age of 16 to avoid kiddies on stabilisers) to have adequate insurance.  Cycling Ireland do offer insurance through their membership.  Most club cyclists will be but there is a huge amount of leisure cyclists out there who aren't.  I'd even consider compulsory membership of CI for all bike users and give CI more responsibility for ensuring cyclists are aware of their responsibilities on the road.

OK fess up time, as you may have guessed, I do a bit of cycling but I'm just making the point that the "all cyclists are pricks and cnuts" attitude can be challenged.

What would the point of Insurance be- whenever they do cause accidents or thump the side/roof of your car causing damage on narrow country roads they just ride on and there is no way of identifying them.
One incident I was involved in was were after pulling out of the lane of my own house on a narrow country road and sitting  behind a cyclist for about 1/2 mile. During this 1/2 mile the fellow had about 4 places that he could have pulled into and allowed me pass. I politely beeped as I gave him the benefit of the doubt that he did not hear me. He then preceded to give me and my father a tirade of abuse and sat bang in the middle of the road for about 1 & 1/2 miles. I eventually  passed him and jumped out of the car (calmly) to ask him what the problem was. The first thing that came out of his mouth was ' I'll have your house, your car the whole lot if you come near me' as he ride on. I had no intention of touching him but just wanted to find out what his problem was. Brave fella. Protected by his an anonymity but knew were I lived and would have had a number plate, etc.

And this is not one isolated incident with just this lad been a t@sser. Another brave lycra head followed my mother up into the yard and thumped and banged at the car roof. Called the police couldn't do a thing as there is no way of identifying these cowards and by the time police would react they are long gone. And then have the cheek to come crying victim when something happens. Several other incidents like this on our road.

In my opinion, there is a large majority of the lycra brigade who treat other road users like this, as woe betide you would affect their time trials.   All about the stats you know.


The could have pulled in and allowed you to pass ? I'm baffled. Why should he ? What was your rush?

I think you are conveniently missing my point here.
What my rush was is completely irrelevant.

My point in reply to AQMP was what would be the point in making Insurance mandatory for cyclists. They do what they like and ride on, and it is virtually impossible to identify them.  For insurance to work they would have to have some sort of way of making these boys identifiable. At least when a car is involved in an accident you have the starting point of a number plate.

These pricks ride about with no absolutely no respect for other road users and whenever they are challenged about their aggressive behaviour,  their first defense is 'I'm gonna sue you'.

When we were brought up and were going about the roads on our bikes we were always taught that if you see a tractor/car/lorry coming towards you, you ditched the bike and waited for the vehicle to pass. But then we were brought up to have manners.
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: square_ball on July 31, 2017, 05:19:28 PM
Quote from: haveaharp on July 31, 2017, 04:55:28 PM
Quote from: square_ball on July 31, 2017, 04:53:30 PM
Quote from: haveaharp on July 31, 2017, 04:49:08 PM
Part of the driving test should be to do 50 hrs on a bike over a month or so. Get some perspective on how much of an asshole some people behind a wheel actually are.
Cycling clubs are perfectly entitled to ride 2 a breast and how often does their peleton actually become bigger than say an articulated truck. Are we clamouring for trucks to be removed from the road ?

Do trucks travel at 15-20mph??

No therefore the cyclists at 15-20mph must be easier and quicker to overtake

So you think you should just overtake whenever you like because the cyclists are going slow??
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: Tony Baloney on July 31, 2017, 05:31:39 PM
Quote from: take_yer_points on July 31, 2017, 05:01:28 PM
Quote from: haveaharp on July 31, 2017, 04:49:08 PM
Part of the driving test should be to do 50 hrs on a bike over a month or so. Get some perspective on how much of an asshole some people behind a wheel actually are.
Cycling clubs are perfectly entitled to ride 2 a breast and how often does their peleton actually become bigger than say an articulated truck. Are we clamouring for trucks to be removed from the road ?

I thought it was single file on busy roads??
It is.
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: JimStynes on July 31, 2017, 06:13:45 PM
What's the answer to this then? Ban bikes from the road? Because that's not a realistic answer! I think a good step would be that no more than 16 in a group - 8 rows of cyclists two abreast. Anymore than that then it is too long a line for cars to overtake. Cycling clubs need to be more sensible about picking their route. The club I am in goes on a very busy stretch of road at the start of their club run on a Saturday morning, I stopped cycling on the Sat morning run because it was that dangerous.

Belgium, France,  Spain's culture is some much more accepting of cycling and they give a lot more respect to cyclists on the road. When I started cycling I couldn't believe how bad some drivers were and how aggressive they are on the road. It has become extremely dangerous to be on the roads. People saying about riding two abreast - it is much safer to ride two abreast. If you are riding single file cars will squeeze past you and leave you very little room.  Also, there are a lot of bad cyclists as well and I have witnessed cyclists breaking red lights and taking stupid risks on a Saturday club run. Cycling is a great sport and it does more good than harm in the country.
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: Hardy on July 31, 2017, 06:43:52 PM
Quote from: haveaharp on July 31, 2017, 04:10:35 PM
Quote from: laoislad on July 31, 2017, 04:07:03 PM
Quote from: haveaharp on July 31, 2017, 03:53:42 PM
Quote from: keeperlit on July 31, 2017, 03:46:00 PM
Quote from: AQMP on July 31, 2017, 02:20:53 PM
....however I would be in favour it being compulsory for all cyclists (say over the age of 16 to avoid kiddies on stabilisers) to have adequate insurance.  Cycling Ireland do offer insurance through their membership.  Most club cyclists will be but there is a huge amount of leisure cyclists out there who aren't.  I'd even consider compulsory membership of CI for all bike users and give CI more responsibility for ensuring cyclists are aware of their responsibilities on the road.

OK fess up time, as you may have guessed, I do a bit of cycling but I'm just making the point that the "all cyclists are pricks and cnuts" attitude can be challenged.

What would the point of Insurance be- whenever they do cause accidents or thump the side/roof of your car causing damage on narrow country roads they just ride on and there is no way of identifying them.
One incident I was involved in was were after pulling out of the lane of my own house on a narrow country road and sitting  behind a cyclist for about 1/2 mile. During this 1/2 mile the fellow had about 4 places that he could have pulled into and allowed me pass. I politely beeped as I gave him the benefit of the doubt that he did not hear me. He then preceded to give me and my father a tirade of abuse and sat bang in the middle of the road for about 1 & 1/2 miles. I eventually  passed him and jumped out of the car (calmly) to ask him what the problem was. The first thing that came out of his mouth was ' I'll have your house, your car the whole lot if you come near me' as he ride on. I had no intention of touching him but just wanted to find out what his problem was. Brave fella. Protected by his an anonymity but knew were I lived and would have had a number plate, etc.

And this is not one isolated incident with just this lad been a t@sser. Another brave lycra head followed my mother up into the yard and thumped and banged at the car roof. Called the police couldn't do a thing as there is no way of identifying these cowards and by the time police would react they are long gone. And then have the cheek to come crying victim when something happens. Several other incidents like this on our road.

In my opinion, there is a large majority of the lycra brigade who treat other road users like this, as woe betide you would affect their time trials.   All about the stats you know.


The could have pulled in and allowed you to pass ? I'm baffled. Why should he ? What was your rush?
You're right of course..why should he let them pass.
Like why would I let the old man behind me in the queue ahead of me when I have a full trolly of shopping and he only has a loaf of bread..Or why would you hold the door open for someone..Or let someone out of a junction in slow moving traffic..
Its called manners..
So yeah you may ask why should he pull over..I'll ask you why wouldn't he pull over? Where is the harm in not being a p***k?

Because quite simply within a minute or so he would be able to pass. Drivers think they have the right to pass cyclists with close passes left right and centre yet the same 4x4 driving t**ts will slow to a crawl for someone on a horse. Whats the difference ?

Obvious. Nobody would want to hurt a horse.
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: Leonardo on July 31, 2017, 06:47:46 PM
Working in London this week and just in from a run. The cyclists in this city are mental. No stopping at red lights for some, onto footpaths for others to avoid red light, and when some do actually stop at red lights they all make their way to front of the queue by weaving through the cars. Absolute madness. Almost got knocked over by 2 cyclists that are clearly making their way home from the Tour de France given the speed they doing. Straight through the red light and had cheek to roar something along the lines of you faaaaaaaackiinnnng caaaaaant
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: Eamonnca1 on July 31, 2017, 06:59:45 PM
Quote from: Tony Baloney on July 31, 2017, 05:31:39 PM
Quote from: take_yer_points on July 31, 2017, 05:01:28 PM
Quote from: haveaharp on July 31, 2017, 04:49:08 PM
Part of the driving test should be to do 50 hrs on a bike over a month or so. Get some perspective on how much of an asshole some people behind a wheel actually are.
Cycling clubs are perfectly entitled to ride 2 a breast and how often does their peleton actually become bigger than say an articulated truck. Are we clamouring for trucks to be removed from the road ?

I thought it was single file on busy roads??
It is.

No it isn't.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8NGdQDEkWCE (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8NGdQDEkWCE)
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: Taylor on July 31, 2017, 07:02:17 PM
Quote from: Tony Baloney on July 31, 2017, 05:31:39 PM
Quote from: take_yer_points on July 31, 2017, 05:01:28 PM
Quote from: haveaharp on July 31, 2017, 04:49:08 PM
Part of the driving test should be to do 50 hrs on a bike over a month or so. Get some perspective on how much of an asshole some people behind a wheel actually are.
Cycling clubs are perfectly entitled to ride 2 a breast and how often does their peleton actually become bigger than say an articulated truck. Are we clamouring for trucks to be removed from the road ?

I thought it was single file on busy roads??
It is.

It is but they clearly ignore this and are never pulled up on it.
Need a deterrent for the idiots to obey the law
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: Eamonnca1 on July 31, 2017, 07:18:09 PM
From the RSA:

Quote"In the company of one or more cyclists, you must have due regard to other users of the road, and you must take full account of prevailing road conditions. On occasion, it may be safe to cycle two abreast, but you must not cycle in a manner likely to create an obstruction for other road users."

This is wide open to interpretation. Riding single file can cause a bigger obstruction than riding two abreast. Nowhere does it say you must always ride single file on busy roads. Stop quoting non-existent rules.
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: Tony Baloney on July 31, 2017, 07:48:16 PM
Quote from: Eamonnca1 on July 31, 2017, 07:18:09 PM
From the RSA:

Quote"In the company of one or more cyclists, you must have due regard to other users of the road, and you must take full account of prevailing road conditions. On occasion, it may be safe to cycle two abreast, but you must not cycle in a manner likely to create an obstruction for other road users."

This is wide open to interpretation. Riding single file can cause a bigger obstruction than riding two abreast. Nowhere does it say you must always ride single file on busy roads. Stop quoting non-existent rules.
How about you check Rule 66 in the Highway Code. Make sure to come back and apologise. Check 68 when you are there which requires cyclists to be considerate.
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: Tony Baloney on July 31, 2017, 07:56:54 PM
To save any bother.

Rule 66
You should

keep both hands on the handlebars except when signalling or changing gear
keep both feet on the pedals
never ride more than two abreast, and ride in single file on narrow or busy roads and when riding round bends
not ride close behind another vehicle
not carry anything which will affect your balance or may get tangled up with your wheels or chain
be considerate of other road users, particularly blind and partially sighted pedestrians. Let them know you are there when necessary, for example, by ringing your bell if you have one. It is recommended that a bell be fitted.

Rule 68
You MUST NOT

carry a passenger unless your cycle has been built or adapted to carry one
hold onto a moving vehicle or trailer
ride in a dangerous, careless or inconsiderate manner
ride when under the influence of drink or drugs, including medicine.
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: punt kick on July 31, 2017, 09:09:14 PM
Quote from: Hardy on July 31, 2017, 03:53:19 PM
Quote from: punt kick on July 31, 2017, 03:42:39 PM
He was CYCLING behind the guy who had an accident and killed the motorist who caused the accident - it was a direct answer to a direct question.

I think I can help.

QuoteLambeth then mounted his bike and cycled away

This implies that when he punched the victim he was not mounted on his bike. Therefore, he wasn't a cyclist when he committed the killing. Therefore this was not a case of a cyclist killing a car driver. Doubly so, as the "car driver" was presumably stopped when he was attacked and therefore not a driver.

Your semantics are amusing, on this occasion they make you look like a bit of a dick.  Is a taxi driver parked up waiting for his next fare not a taxi driver, an ambulance driver helping take a patient into the hospital not an ambulance driver!
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: punt kick on July 31, 2017, 09:11:40 PM
Quote from: haveaharp on July 31, 2017, 04:55:28 PM
Quote from: square_ball on July 31, 2017, 04:53:30 PM
Quote from: haveaharp on July 31, 2017, 04:49:08 PM
Part of the driving test should be to do 50 hrs on a bike over a month or so. Get some perspective on how much of an asshole some people behind a wheel actually are.
Cycling clubs are perfectly entitled to ride 2 a breast and how often does their peleton actually become bigger than say an articulated truck. Are we clamouring for trucks to be removed from the road ?

Do trucks travel at 15-20mph??

No therefore the cyclists at 15-20mph must be easier and quicker to overtake

3 abreast and 20 of them strung out!
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: punt kick on July 31, 2017, 09:12:52 PM
Quote from: Tony Baloney on July 31, 2017, 07:56:54 PM
To save any bother.

Rule 66
You should

keep both hands on the handlebars except when signalling or changing gear
keep both feet on the pedals
never ride more than two abreast, and ride in single file on narrow or busy roads and when riding round bends
not ride close behind another vehicle
not carry anything which will affect your balance or may get tangled up with your wheels or chain
be considerate of other road users, particularly blind and partially sighted pedestrians. Let them know you are there when necessary, for example, by ringing your bell if you have one. It is recommended that a bell be fitted.

Rule 68
You MUST NOT

carry a passenger unless your cycle has been built or adapted to carry one
hold onto a moving vehicle or trailer
ride in a dangerous, careless or inconsiderate manner
ride when under the influence of drink or drugs, including medicine.

And if they infringe their summer / spring / winter bike should be took off them and scrapped should they not pay a fine, arseholes.
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: Milltown Row2 on July 31, 2017, 09:24:49 PM
Jesus! A lot of anger on this thread.... get a bit of perspective, nearly 70 people died on the roads last year, bad driving, drunk driving, texting or on phone.... drivers would need to get their act together
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: dclane on July 31, 2017, 09:35:38 PM
70? There was nearly 180 killed on the road last year.
There's been 90+ already this year.
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: Aughafad on July 31, 2017, 09:38:08 PM
Think he is talking about the north not the south
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: Milltown Row2 on July 31, 2017, 09:39:58 PM
Quote from: dclane on July 31, 2017, 09:35:38 PM
70? There was nearly 180 killed on the road last year.
There's been 90+ already this year.

Belfast telegraph has it wrong, you southern drivers are halons

http://m.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/northern-ireland/northern-ireland-road-deaths-fall-to-68-in-2016-but-safety-still-police-priority-35334656.html
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: Hardy on July 31, 2017, 09:40:38 PM
Quote from: punt kick on July 31, 2017, 09:09:14 PM
Quote from: Hardy on July 31, 2017, 03:53:19 PM
Quote from: punt kick on July 31, 2017, 03:42:39 PM
He was CYCLING behind the guy who had an accident and killed the motorist who caused the accident - it was a direct answer to a direct question.

I think I can help.

QuoteLambeth then mounted his bike and cycled away

This implies that when he punched the victim he was not mounted on his bike. Therefore, he wasn't a cyclist when he committed the killing. Therefore this was not a case of a cyclist killing a car driver. Doubly so, as the "car driver" was presumably stopped when he was attacked and therefore not a driver.

Your semantics are amusing, on this occasion they make you look like a bit of a dick.  Is a taxi driver parked up waiting for his next fare not a taxi driver, an ambulance driver helping take a patient into the hospital not an ambulance driver!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=miSP9YwhktQ (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=miSP9YwhktQ)
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: dclane on July 31, 2017, 09:42:18 PM
Quote from: Aughafad on July 31, 2017, 09:38:08 PM
Think he is talking about the north not the south
He should have been more specific.  Not everyone who posts on here is from the North.
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: Milltown Row2 on July 31, 2017, 09:46:27 PM
Quote from: dclane on July 31, 2017, 09:42:18 PM
Quote from: Aughafad on July 31, 2017, 09:38:08 PM
Think he is talking about the north not the south
He should have been more specific.  Not everyone who posts on here is from the North.

70 plus the 180 from down south then. Just for you
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: bennydorano on July 31, 2017, 09:54:31 PM
An asshole is an asshole wether he's on a bike or in a car and he'll generally act accordingly. As someone who rides a lot of solo miles I find threads like these (& the daily Facebook rants) very unnerving. Motorists (who don't cycle) have no idea how vulnerable a cyclist is, I have been down a few times in crashes & icey conditions and I know how painful it can be, I dread to think what a motor vehicle could do to me.

Group riding is a fact of life these days and motorists are going to have to get over themselves. It really is no different than overtaking a Lorry or the likes.

Regarding the opening post, taxing cyclists won't change behaviour. I can see a day when a chip system that might be the equivalent of a number plate will come to pass.  I already pay £80 odd annually for my cycling licence anyway - as well as my car tax, income tax & national insurance contributions. 
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: Eamonnca1 on July 31, 2017, 10:03:15 PM
Quote from: dclane on July 31, 2017, 09:42:18 PM
Quote from: Aughafad on July 31, 2017, 09:38:08 PM
Think he is talking about the north not the south
He should have been more specific.  Not everyone who posts on here is from the North.

I assumed he was talking about the free state which is why I quoted free state rules.
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: Eamonnca1 on July 31, 2017, 10:05:20 PM
Riding single file makes it harder to overtake because it makes the group longer. Riding abreast makes it easier to get past because it shortens the group.

(https://scontent-sjc2-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/10256475_10152273620214064_1203984363263311781_n.jpg?oh=dc880ef4d7f27a3c1cd3992f24f87919&oe=59F32329)
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: Tony Baloney on July 31, 2017, 10:08:47 PM
Quote from: bennydorano on July 31, 2017, 09:54:31 PM
An asshole is an asshole wether he's on a bike or in a car and he'll generally act accordingly. As someone who rides a lot of solo miles I find threads like these (& the daily Facebook rants) very unnerving. Motorists (who don't cycle) have no idea how vulnerable a cyclist is, I have been down a few times in crashes & icey conditions and I know how painful it can be, I dread to think what a motor vehicle could do to me.

Group riding is a fact of life these days and motorists are going to have to get over themselves. It really is no different than overtaking a Lorry or the likes.

Regarding the opening post, taxing cyclists won't change behaviour. I can see a day when a chip system that might be the equivalent of a number plate will come to pass.  I already pay £80 odd annually for my cycling licence anyway - as well as my car tax, income tax & national insurance contributions.
Not this again. When a mass group of cyclists can move at the same speed as a lorry I'll stop moaning about them.

There is room for everyone on the road and I always overtake lone cyclists on the opposite side of the road as if it was a car. They arent the problem. It's the idiots who allow a build-up of traffic on busy roads who need to be sanctioned. Motorists in the south pull aside to allow faster traffic to pass, tractors (sometimes, the pricks!) aside to let faster moving traffic pass. Why can large groups of cyclists not have the same level of civility?
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: laoislad on July 31, 2017, 10:11:01 PM
Quote from: Eamonnca1 on July 31, 2017, 10:05:20 PM
Riding single file makes it harder to overtake because it makes the group longer. Riding abreast makes it easier to get past because it shortens the group.

(https://scontent-sjc2-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/10256475_10152273620214064_1203984363263311781_n.jpg?oh=dc880ef4d7f27a3c1cd3992f24f87919&oe=59F32329)
f**king typical cyclists...they are on the wrong side of the road.
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: thewobbler on July 31, 2017, 10:17:40 PM
It's a tad condescending to suggest that motorists don't understand how vulnerable cyclists are.

Motorists face a similar situation every day in that there are HGVs and buses on the road, and if you happen to run into one, it's game over. Hence we (almost) all give them a little bit more room and leeway. We all use our feet from time to time as well and there's genuinely not many people who take a risk when walking (or jogging) in a busy road system.

From my observations, those that are drawn to cycling - especially those who need lycra to cycle - seem to have a deficiency in this department. It takes a pecualiar personality to want to put your life at risk to ensure that others are inconvenienced for your pleasure.

Part of this festers from the pack mentality of getting involved in a sport, but I do believe most of it is a personality trait, which in any other situation could be described politely as a selfish disregard for others.

----

It's not practical to force cyclists to be insured. But it is becoming necessary that their actions and behaviours on the road are assessed, and if needs be punished, in line with all other road users.
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: Taylor on July 31, 2017, 10:21:45 PM
Quote from: thewobbler on July 31, 2017, 10:17:40 PM
It's a tad condescending to suggest that motorists don't understand how vulnerable cyclists are.

Motorists face a similar situation every day in that there are HGVs and buses on the road, and if you happen to run into one, it's game over. Hence we (almost) all give them a little bit more room and leeway. We all use our feet from time to time as well and there's genuinely not many people who take a risk when walking (or jogging) in a busy road system.

From my observations, those that are drawn to cycling - especially those who need lycra to cycle - seem to have a deficiency in this department. It takes a pecualiar personality to want to put your life at risk to ensure that others are inconvenienced for your pleasure.

Part of this festers from the pack mentality of getting involved in a sport, but I do believe most of it is a personality trait, which in any other situation could be described politely as a selfish disregard for others.

----

It's not practical to force cyclists to be insured. But it is becoming necessary that their actions and behaviours on the road are assessed, and if needs be punished, in line with all other road users.

+1
Great post
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: bennydorano on July 31, 2017, 10:39:43 PM
Quote from: Tony Baloney on July 31, 2017, 10:08:47 PM
Quote from: bennydorano on July 31, 2017, 09:54:31 PM
An asshole is an asshole wether he's on a bike or in a car and he'll generally act accordingly. As someone who rides a lot of solo miles I find threads like these (& the daily Facebook rants) very unnerving. Motorists (who don't cycle) have no idea how vulnerable a cyclist is, I have been down a few times in crashes & icey conditions and I know how painful it can be, I dread to think what a motor vehicle could do to me.

Group riding is a fact of life these days and motorists are going to have to get over themselves. It really is no different than overtaking a Lorry or the likes.

Regarding the opening post, taxing cyclists won't change behaviour. I can see a day when a chip system that might be the equivalent of a number plate will come to pass.  I already pay £80 odd annually for my cycling licence anyway - as well as my car tax, income tax & national insurance contributions.
Not this again. When a mass group of cyclists can move at the same speed as a lorry I'll stop moaning about them.

There is room for everyone on the road and I always overtake lone cyclists on the opposite side of the road as if it was a car. They arent the problem. It's the idiots who allow a build-up of traffic on busy roads who need to be sanctioned. Motorists in the south pull aside to allow faster traffic to pass, tractors (sometimes, the pricks!) aside to let faster moving traffic pass. Why can large groups of cyclists not have the same level of civility?
Just pull over every 2 minutes?

Surely a slow moving bunch of cyclists is easier to overtake than a lorry? I don't understand that logic?
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: Hardy on July 31, 2017, 11:00:39 PM
Quote from: thewobbler on July 31, 2017, 10:17:40 PM
It's a tad condescending to suggest that motorists don't understand how vulnerable cyclists are.

Motorists face a similar situation every day in that there are HGVs and buses on the road, and if you happen to run into one, it's game over. Hence we (almost) all give them a little bit more room and leeway. We all use our feet from time to time as well and there's genuinely not many people who take a risk when walking (or jogging) in a busy road system.

From my observations, those that are drawn to cycling - especially those who need lycra to cycle - seem to have a deficiency in this department. It takes a pecualiar personality to want to put your life at risk to ensure that others are inconvenienced for your pleasure.

Part of this festers from the pack mentality of getting involved in a sport, but I do believe most of it is a personality trait, which in any other situation could be described politely as a selfish disregard for others.

----

It's not practical to force cyclists to be insured. But it is becoming necessary that their actions and behaviours on the road are assessed, and if needs be punished, in line with all other road users.

Nailed it.
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: Tony Baloney on July 31, 2017, 11:28:49 PM
Quote from: bennydorano on July 31, 2017, 10:39:43 PM
Quote from: Tony Baloney on July 31, 2017, 10:08:47 PM
Quote from: bennydorano on July 31, 2017, 09:54:31 PM
An asshole is an asshole wether he's on a bike or in a car and he'll generally act accordingly. As someone who rides a lot of solo miles I find threads like these (& the daily Facebook rants) very unnerving. Motorists (who don't cycle) have no idea how vulnerable a cyclist is, I have been down a few times in crashes & icey conditions and I know how painful it can be, I dread to think what a motor vehicle could do to me.

Group riding is a fact of life these days and motorists are going to have to get over themselves. It really is no different than overtaking a Lorry or the likes.

Regarding the opening post, taxing cyclists won't change behaviour. I can see a day when a chip system that might be the equivalent of a number plate will come to pass.  I already pay £80 odd annually for my cycling licence anyway - as well as my car tax, income tax & national insurance contributions.
Not this again. When a mass group of cyclists can move at the same speed as a lorry I'll stop moaning about them.

There is room for everyone on the road and I always overtake lone cyclists on the opposite side of the road as if it was a car. They arent the problem. It's the idiots who allow a build-up of traffic on busy roads who need to be sanctioned. Motorists in the south pull aside to allow faster traffic to pass, tractors (sometimes, the pricks!) aside to let faster moving traffic pass. Why can large groups of cyclists not have the same level of civility?
Just pull over every 2 minutes?

Surely a slow moving bunch of cyclists is easier to overtake than a lorry? I don't understand that logic?
As practically everyone has said above that is correct in theory but not when you have about 30 in a stretched out group on the Monaghan Road. I'm regularly stuck behind groups like that.

Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: Eamonnca1 on July 31, 2017, 11:40:49 PM
Quote from: thewobbler on July 31, 2017, 10:17:40 PM
It's a tad condescending to suggest that motorists don't understand how vulnerable cyclists are.

Motorists face a similar situation every day in that there are HGVs and buses on the road, and if you happen to run into one, it's game over. Hence we (almost) all give them a little bit more room and leeway. We all use our feet from time to time as well and there's genuinely not many people who take a risk when walking (or jogging) in a busy road system.

From my observations, those that are drawn to cycling - especially those who need lycra to cycle - seem to have a deficiency in this department. It takes a pecualiar personality to want to put your life at risk to ensure that others are inconvenienced for your pleasure.

Part of this festers from the pack mentality of getting involved in a sport, but I do believe most of it is a personality trait, which in any other situation could be described politely as a selfish disregard for others.

----

It's not practical to force cyclists to be insured. But it is becoming necessary that their actions and behaviours on the road are assessed, and if needs be punished, in line with all other road users.

I've read some sh*te in my time but that takes the cake. The mentality of cyclists is "we just want to get there alive." The mentality of motorists is "I own this road and how dare you get in my way, and by the way I reserve the right to break every traffic rule in the book while wagging my sanctimonious finger at the rest of yiz for violating non-existent rules about riding abreast."

Get a grip, you whinging shower of apes!
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: bennydorano on July 31, 2017, 11:46:56 PM
I got into cycling as a fundraiser for my club. I started off overweight and gradually got myself fit again, I've went through the stages from newbie to racing now. Cycling is a culture that most people don't get.

To say that " It takes a pecualiar personality to want to put your life at risk to ensure that others are inconvenienced" is a ludicrous statement to make. I suspect that is the mentality of someone who suffers from road rage at any road delay.
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: bennydorano on July 31, 2017, 11:54:56 PM
Quote from: Tony Baloney on July 31, 2017, 11:28:49 PM
Quote from: bennydorano on July 31, 2017, 10:39:43 PM
Quote from: Tony Baloney on July 31, 2017, 10:08:47 PM
Quote from: bennydorano on July 31, 2017, 09:54:31 PM
An asshole is an asshole wether he's on a bike or in a car and he'll generally act accordingly. As someone who rides a lot of solo miles I find threads like these (& the daily Facebook rants) very unnerving. Motorists (who don't cycle) have no idea how vulnerable a cyclist is, I have been down a few times in crashes & icey conditions and I know how painful it can be, I dread to think what a motor vehicle could do to me.

Group riding is a fact of life these days and motorists are going to have to get over themselves. It really is no different than overtaking a Lorry or the likes.

Regarding the opening post, taxing cyclists won't change behaviour. I can see a day when a chip system that might be the equivalent of a number plate will come to pass.  I already pay £80 odd annually for my cycling licence anyway - as well as my car tax, income tax & national insurance contributions.
Not this again. When a mass group of cyclists can move at the same speed as a lorry I'll stop moaning about them.

There is room for everyone on the road and I always overtake lone cyclists on the opposite side of the road as if it was a car. They arent the problem. It's the idiots who allow a build-up of traffic on busy roads who need to be sanctioned. Motorists in the south pull aside to allow faster traffic to pass, tractors (sometimes, the pricks!) aside to let faster moving traffic pass. Why can large groups of cyclists not have the same level of civility?
Just pull over every 2 minutes?

Surely a slow moving bunch of cyclists is easier to overtake than a lorry? I don't understand that logic?
As practically everyone has said above that is correct in theory but not when you have about 30 in a stretched out group on the Monaghan Road. I'm regularly stuck behind groups like that.
That's likely me and our club😅
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: Eamonnca1 on August 01, 2017, 12:00:33 AM
And another thing. What's up with the title of this thread? We don't give out about soccer players wearing soccer shorts, or runners wearing running gear when out for a run, or swimmers wearing swimming gear in the pool. Anybody who gives out about cyclists wearing cycling gear when cycling needs their head examined. Try riding a bike 80 miles in a pair of denim jeans and let me know how comfortable that is, you depressingly fat clowns.
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: haveaharp on August 01, 2017, 08:10:45 AM
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on July 31, 2017, 09:24:49 PM
Jesus! A lot of anger on this thread.... get a bit of perspective, nearly 70 people died on the roads last year, bad driving, drunk driving, texting or on phone.... drivers would need to get their act together

exactly - start with the morons on phones before worrying about cyclists i'd suggest.
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: punt kick on August 01, 2017, 09:08:42 AM
Quote from: Eamonnca1 on August 01, 2017, 12:00:33 AM
And another thing. What's up with the title of this thread? We don't give out about soccer players wearing soccer shorts, or runners wearing running gear when out for a run, or swimmers wearing swimming gear in the pool. Anybody who gives out about cyclists wearing cycling gear when cycling needs their head examined. Try riding a bike 80 miles in a pair of denim jeans and let me know how comfortable that is, you depressingly fat clowns.

Oh dear so everyone who doesn't ride 80 miles is a fat clown, bet you are on of the pricks skip red lights and weave between cars when traffic is slow, be some out cry if a motorist weaved between a slow moving group of cyclists - one rule for one set of road user and none for thw arrogant fuckwits on bikes.
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: yellowcard on August 01, 2017, 09:29:29 AM
Quote from: thewobbler on July 31, 2017, 10:17:40 PM

From my observations, those that are drawn to cycling - especially those who need lycra to cycle - seem to have a deficiency in this department. It takes a pecualiar personality to want to put your life at risk to ensure that others are inconvenienced for your pleasure.


That's simply a ludicrous statement. A broad sweeping generalisation that does nothing to help the debate but just plays up to a stereotype. Yes, there are indeed some cyclists who have little consideration for other road users in the same way that there are similar type motorists. To cast aspersions on their personality for wanting to enage in a physical pursuit is as daft as it gets.

Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: thewobbler on August 01, 2017, 09:47:38 AM
Quote from: yellowcard on August 01, 2017, 09:29:29 AM
Quote from: thewobbler on July 31, 2017, 10:17:40 PM

From my observations, those that are drawn to cycling - especially those who need lycra to cycle - seem to have a deficiency in this department. It takes a pecualiar personality to want to put your life at risk to ensure that others are inconvenienced for your pleasure.


That's simply a ludicrous statement. A broad sweeping generalisation that does nothing to help the debate but just plays up to a stereotype. Yes, there are indeed some cyclists who have little consideration for other road users in the same way that there are similar type motorists. To cast aspersions on their personality for wanting to enage in a physical pursuit is as daft as it gets.



See here's the thing. There's literally a thousand active pastimes people can engage in. But cycling is the one that inconveniences other people going about their lives, more than any other leisure pursuit.

You and other cyclists believe you have the right to take "ownership" of roads.... yet these roads which cost thousands, maybe tens of thousands, of pounds per yard  to build and maintain, were not actually built for cyclists.

That said I'm more than happy that they have a multi purpose function and I'd even go so far as to encourage cycling. But, only when they're cognisant of their status; so if they're holding up normal traffic flows they pull over until it's restored, if they are behaving in a way that makes the road less safe for its other users, they are penalised and then banned for multiple infractions.

Is that really too much to ask?
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: Applesisapples on August 01, 2017, 09:58:59 AM
I have been a cyclist, though it is now more sporadic than it used to be, and my waistline proves that. I am always conscious that they are riding the road as it comes and may have to make adjustments for potholes gratings etc... That said there are so many cyclists, mainly it should be said in clubs who ride the road with a sense of entitlement and disregard for other users including people and vehicles. Cyclists also need to display some courtesy.
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: yellowcard on August 01, 2017, 10:39:50 AM
Quote from: thewobbler on August 01, 2017, 09:47:38 AM
Quote from: yellowcard on August 01, 2017, 09:29:29 AM
Quote from: thewobbler on July 31, 2017, 10:17:40 PM

From my observations, those that are drawn to cycling - especially those who need lycra to cycle - seem to have a deficiency in this department. It takes a pecualiar personality to want to put your life at risk to ensure that others are inconvenienced for your pleasure.


That's simply a ludicrous statement. A broad sweeping generalisation that does nothing to help the debate but just plays up to a stereotype. Yes, there are indeed some cyclists who have little consideration for other road users in the same way that there are similar type motorists. To cast aspersions on their personality for wanting to enage in a physical pursuit is as daft as it gets.



See here's the thing. There's literally a thousand active pastimes people can engage in. But cycling is the one that inconveniences other people going about their lives, more than any other leisure pursuit.

You and other cyclists believe you have the right to take "ownership" of roads.... yet these roads which cost thousands, maybe tens of thousands, of pounds per yard  to build and maintain, were not actually built for cyclists.

That said I'm more than happy that they have a multi purpose function and I'd even go so far as to encourage cycling. But, only when they're cognisant of their status; so if they're holding up normal traffic flows they pull over until it's restored, if they are behaving in a way that makes the road less safe for its other users, they are penalised and then banned for multiple infractions.

Is that really too much to ask?

I don't believe cyclists have the right to take ownership of the roads, so that's simply not true. Some may behave in a manner that leaves you with this opinion but its the sweeping generalisation I have a problem with. In the same way that there are plenty of selfish assholes on bikes, there are also plenty behind the wheel of a motor vehicle. I don't think tarring them all with the one brush helps anybody.
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: Taylor on August 01, 2017, 10:45:55 AM
Do cyclists in any way contribute to the upkeep of the roads that they use?

If runners are out on the road do they run 3, 4 or even 5 abreast?
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: thewobbler on August 01, 2017, 10:49:15 AM
Quote from: yellowcard on August 01, 2017, 10:39:50 AM
Quote from: thewobbler on August 01, 2017, 09:47:38 AM
Quote from: yellowcard on August 01, 2017, 09:29:29 AM
Quote from: thewobbler on July 31, 2017, 10:17:40 PM

From my observations, those that are drawn to cycling - especially those who need lycra to cycle - seem to have a deficiency in this department. It takes a pecualiar personality to want to put your life at risk to ensure that others are inconvenienced for your pleasure.



That's simply a ludicrous statement. A broad sweeping generalisation that does nothing to help the debate but just plays up to a stereotype. Yes, there are indeed some cyclists who have little consideration for other road users in the same way that there are similar type motorists. To cast aspersions on their personality for wanting to enage in a physical pursuit is as daft as it gets.



See here's the thing. There's literally a thousand active pastimes people can engage in. But cycling is the one that inconveniences other people going about their lives, more than any other leisure pursuit.

You and other cyclists believe you have the right to take "ownership" of roads.... yet these roads which cost thousands, maybe tens of thousands, of pounds per yard  to build and maintain, were not actually built for cyclists.

That said I'm more than happy that they have a multi purpose function and I'd even go so far as to encourage cycling. But, only when they're cognisant of their status; so if they're holding up normal traffic flows they pull over until it's restored, if they are behaving in a way that makes the road less safe for its other users, they are penalised and then banned for multiple infractions.

Is that really too much to ask?

I don't believe cyclists have the right to take ownership of the roads, so that's simply not true. Some may behave in a manner that leaves you with this opinion but its the sweeping generalisation I have a problem with. In the same way that there are plenty of selfish assholes on bikes, there are also plenty behind the wheel of a motor vehicle. I don't think tarring them all with the one brush helps anybody.

Which brings us full circle back to the point of this thread.

Motorists when they behave irrationally, irresponsibly or dangerously, do so as an individual entity and it is their licence alone and their insurance alone, their reputation alone at stake. That's the ultimate deterrent. It doesn't always work, but it does work.

Cyclists don't face this deterrent, which is wrong in itself. But the problem is exacerbated further by the collective nature of road cyclists which sees them seemingly deflect and refute any instances of wrongdoing, and often in a militant way.

That, ultimately is the difference. When a vehicle causes a road accident, it appals me and every other motorist. When a cyclist causes a road accident, it is more often than not covered up and table-turned by his Lycra buddies.
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: ashman on August 01, 2017, 10:51:26 AM
The Irish roads had a sudden growth of cyclists from the start of the decade .  There was never a big cycling culture here like say in the continent.   A massive bandwagon grew in the last 3 years in particular and particularly the competitive culture that grew where people in their 40s thought they were doing TDF time trials .

Much of the tensions are coming from this . 
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: highorlow on August 01, 2017, 10:57:11 AM
QuoteAnd another thing. What's up with the title of this thread? We don't give out about soccer players wearing soccer shorts, or runners wearing running gear when out for a run, or swimmers wearing swimming gear in the pool. Anybody who gives out about cyclists wearing cycling gear when cycling needs their head examined. Try riding a bike 80 miles in a pair of denim jeans and let me know how comfortable that is, you depressingly fat clowns.

Its because the Lyrca brigade are the worst culprits. Can you not just get a bike machine attachment and plonk yourself in the back garden for 80 miles instead?
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: Tonto on August 01, 2017, 11:09:12 AM
As a casual cyclist (i.e. Out by myself, not in a club, not racing) opinions like the ones on this thread scare the absolute crap out of me.

I'm a driver too and it frustrates me to see cyclists flouting the rules of the road knowing that other drivers are observing this and treating all cyclists as a menace. In fact I would argue that with every road law a cyclist breaks they put another cyclist in danger of a road rage incident.

There is definitely an arrogance and misunderstanding on both sides. I just hope that when people see me out on the road (in Lycra!) they don't see the "cyclist" that for example  jumped onto the pavement to avoid a red light but they might actually consider that I'm a dad, husband, son and brother.
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: lfdown2 on August 01, 2017, 11:18:48 AM
I have to say it is depressing reading the comments from what would normally be the more reasonable contributors.

I only took up cycling this year to complete the ring of Kerry cycle, I find it a very enjoyable pastime, I am not a member of a club and generally follow the rules of the road, I say generally because I would ride 2 abreast if not on my own (not as per the highway code), reasons being; I find motorists give greater room to 2 cyclists riding alongside each other than a single cyclist & when driving I find it easier passing 2 cyclists riding alongside each other than 2 cyclists strung out. I also wear lycra, same way I wear trainers when running or boots when playing football.

Would the general consensus be that cyclists should be banned from the road entirely or what is the answer?

I am also a motorist and have seen incorrect behavior form cyclists, no different from that which I have seen from other motorists. I do not consider I have ownership of the road whether on a bike or in a car, I am happy to share the road with all road users and could think of nothing worse than having an injury (or worse) of another individual on my conscience whether a cyclist, walker or motorist.
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: dclane on August 01, 2017, 11:43:26 AM
Quote from: haveaharp on August 01, 2017, 08:10:45 AM
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on July 31, 2017, 09:24:49 PM
Jesus! A lot of anger on this thread.... get a bit of perspective, nearly 70 people died on the roads last year, bad driving, drunk driving, texting or on phone.... drivers would need to get their act together

exactly - start with the morons on phones before worrying about cyclists i'd suggest.
Plenty of cyclists use their phone to text and whatever whilst cycling.
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: haveaharp on August 01, 2017, 11:45:16 AM
Quote from: dclane on August 01, 2017, 11:43:26 AM
Quote from: haveaharp on August 01, 2017, 08:10:45 AM
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on July 31, 2017, 09:24:49 PM
Jesus! A lot of anger on this thread.... get a bit of perspective, nearly 70 people died on the roads last year, bad driving, drunk driving, texting or on phone.... drivers would need to get their act together

exactly - start with the morons on phones before worrying about cyclists i'd suggest.
Plenty of cyclists use their phone to text and whatever whilst cycling.

Well they shouldnt. Doesnt make it right for a motorist to make or take a call. A car is essentially a lethal weapon.
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: dclane on August 01, 2017, 11:50:09 AM
Quote from: haveaharp on August 01, 2017, 11:45:16 AM
Quote from: dclane on August 01, 2017, 11:43:26 AM
Quote from: haveaharp on August 01, 2017, 08:10:45 AM
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on July 31, 2017, 09:24:49 PM
Jesus! A lot of anger on this thread.... get a bit of perspective, nearly 70 people died on the roads last year, bad driving, drunk driving, texting or on phone.... drivers would need to get their act together

exactly - start with the morons on phones before worrying about cyclists i'd suggest.
Plenty of cyclists use their phone to text and whatever whilst cycling.

Well they shouldnt. Doesnt make it right for a motorist to make or take a call. A car is essentially a lethal weapon.
Have you ever broken a red light when out for a cycle?
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: haveaharp on August 01, 2017, 11:54:43 AM
Quote from: dclane on August 01, 2017, 11:50:09 AM
Quote from: haveaharp on August 01, 2017, 11:45:16 AM
Quote from: dclane on August 01, 2017, 11:43:26 AM
Quote from: haveaharp on August 01, 2017, 08:10:45 AM
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on July 31, 2017, 09:24:49 PM
Jesus! A lot of anger on this thread.... get a bit of perspective, nearly 70 people died on the roads last year, bad driving, drunk driving, texting or on phone.... drivers would need to get their act together

exactly - start with the morons on phones before worrying about cyclists i'd suggest.
Plenty of cyclists use their phone to text and whatever whilst cycling.

Well they shouldnt. Doesnt make it right for a motorist to make or take a call. A car is essentially a lethal weapon.
Have you ever broken a red light when out for a cycle?

Not once, as i dont fancy getting cut in 2 by whatever is coming out of the light that is on green
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: dclane on August 01, 2017, 12:03:02 PM
Lol. It's funny how no cyclist has ever done it when you ask them yet 99% of the ones I see do it when I'm out driving.
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: Milltown Row2 on August 01, 2017, 12:49:18 PM
Quote from: dclane on August 01, 2017, 12:03:02 PM
Lol. It's funny how no cyclist has ever done it when you ask them yet 99% of the ones I see do it when I'm out driving.

Ever accelerate at a yellow light to past a junction? Have you ever driven over 30 in a 30 mile zone? have you ever undertaken a car?

There are pricks behind the wheel and on a bike, should they pay raod tax? yep but the money must go towards improving the roads for cyclists to be on... i dont think anyone would have a problem with that
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: Hardy on August 01, 2017, 12:58:59 PM
2 abreast vs. single file - the guideline is very clear, as pointed out by Tony Baloney. But the lycra troop overwhelmingly insist on riding 2 abreast in all circumstances, including on very narrow roads and on bends. It seems to have become a dogma for them and from their rhetoric it's clear that it's a militant claiming of equality with motorised traffic.

That's just very stupid, as wobbler pointed out, not to mention the basic good manners argument. You don't see pedestrians walking two-or-more abreast on roads where there is no footpath, militantly claiming their right to hold up traffic whose normal pace is much higher than theirs. There's a practical reason beyond good manners for that. Pedestrians understand a simple logic that seems to evade cyclists as an organised group.

Another basic example of good manners that I've never seen cyclists use - when they're out in large groups, why do they insist on forming a continuous line, be it single file or two-or-more abreast? A basic courtesy would be to travel in pairs with gaps of 50 metres or so. But I suppose that wouldn't look like a peloton.

Oh and to the argument that there are arseholes behind the wheels of many cars - who has ever denied that? This thread, though, is about arsehole cyclists.
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: bennydorano on August 01, 2017, 01:17:07 PM
It's getting hard to tell if these posts are for real or a piss take tbh.
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: Tony Baloney on August 01, 2017, 01:24:58 PM
Good post Hardy.
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: Taylor on August 01, 2017, 01:27:01 PM
Great post Hardy
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: keeperlit on August 01, 2017, 01:27:14 PM
Which brings us full circle back to the point of this thread.

Motorists when they behave irrationally, irresponsibly or dangerously, do so as an individual entity and it is their licence alone and their insurance alone, their reputation alone at stake. That's the ultimate deterrent. It doesn't always work, but it does work.

Cyclists don't face this deterrent, which is wrong in itself. But the problem is exacerbated further by the collective nature of road cyclists which sees them seemingly deflect and refute any instances of wrongdoing, and often in a militant way.

That, ultimately is the difference. When a vehicle causes a road accident, it appals me and every other motorist. When a cyclist causes a road accident, it is more often than not covered up and table-turned by his Lycra buddies.
[/quote]

Nailed it again- and have seen this happen also. A large group of cyclists making all sort of accusations against a motorist. A video was produced to highlight the fact that the accusations made were completely false and it was in fact the cyclists who had acted aggressively and wrongly. Didn't take to long for the previously baying mob to ride on as they had put a dent in the car. This was a group of 20 cyclists and not one of them man enough to take their colleague to task - all backed him to the hilt. Only unfortunate thing was that the police were not called and statements etc taken before video was produced. Would have been able to show them up for the bullying, cowardly liars that they are in court.

I know the normal defence from the cycling fraternity is that there are as many bad motorists as there is bad cyclists and that whenever you highlight an incident "you can't tar all cyclists with the same brush" But the above example shows that this was not one arrogant bad egg acting on his own. This was one arrogant p***k backed up by another 19 pricks.

I have no problem with cycling but cyclists need to show some courtesy on the road and stop been arrogant pricks who feel they have more right to be on the road than everybody else. 

Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: punt kick on August 01, 2017, 01:31:57 PM
Quote from: bennydorano on August 01, 2017, 01:17:07 PM
It's getting hard to tell if these posts are for real or a piss take tbh.

You obviously have you lycra blinkers on.
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: Taylor on August 01, 2017, 01:35:44 PM
Motorists are held accountable for their actions when caught and there are speed cameras, traffic stops, bus lane cameras, cars with cameras to track if someone went into a bus lane etc etc etc.

Cyclists arent held accountable for anything and dont give two shites about anyone
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: oisinog on August 01, 2017, 05:17:31 PM
At the end of the day there are dicks who drive cars and dicks who ride bikes.

For info I do both I cycle to work a couple of days a week and I drive a couple of days a week.

For every youtube video of a bad cyclist I can show you a bad one of a driver so it works both ways.

The biggest problem both North and South are our roads are not designed for modren cars never mind modren cars and cyclists.

We need a bit of give and take from all road users
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: Tony Baloney on August 01, 2017, 05:47:54 PM
Quote from: oisinog on August 01, 2017, 05:17:31 PM
At the end of the day there are dicks who drive cars and dicks who ride bikes.

For info I do both I cycle to work a couple of days a week and I drive a couple of days a week.

For every youtube video of a bad cyclist I can show you a bad one of a driver so it works both ways.

The biggest problem both North and South are our roads are not designed for modren cars never mind modren cars and cyclists.

We need a bit of give and take from all road users
Four day week must be nice.
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: Puckoon on August 01, 2017, 05:57:32 PM
Regardless of the debate - anyone who wants to classify the cyclists on the basis of what they're wearing is showing themselves up to be the traditional bog hopping, begrudging curmudgeon fool that's been berating anyone who stepped outside of the norm for years. Probably complained back in the day about the lads that wore white boots, the lads that had a fancy haircut, the lads who were too tan, the lads who had tattoos or ear rings, the lads who own a nice car or the first guy to wear under armour on a cold league day. Those lads are all winning medals with clubs and counties and it doesn't matter a shite what they wore or how they did it.

Got no interest in cycling - but some of you should cop yourself on with the lycra nonsense around here. Bunchawankers
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: dclane on August 01, 2017, 06:00:34 PM
Quote from: Puckoon on August 01, 2017, 05:57:32 PM
Regardless of the debate - anyone who wants to classify the cyclists on the basis of what they're wearing is showing themselves up to be the traditional bog hopping, begrudging curmudgeon fool that's been berating anyone who stepped outside of the norm for years. Probably complained back in the day about the lads that wore white boots, the lads that had a fancy haircut, the lads who were too tan, the lads who had tattoos or ear rings, the lads who own a nice car or the first guy to wear under armour on a cold league day. Those lads are all winning medals with clubs and counties and it doesn't matter a shite what they wore or how they did it.


All of them? What kind of nonsense are you talking.
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: Eamonnca1 on August 01, 2017, 06:02:59 PM
Quote from: punt kick on August 01, 2017, 09:08:42 AM
Oh dear so everyone who doesn't ride 80 miles is a fat clown, bet you are on of the pricks skip red lights and weave between cars when traffic is slow, be some out cry if a motorist weaved between a slow moving group of cyclists - one rule for one set of road user and none for thw arrogant fuckwits on bikes.

Oh please! If cyclists ran red lights at the rate we're accused of we'd be extinct within a week. I obey all red lights because I want to get there alive, which is more than I can say for the drivers who think that red means "stop after three seconds, but it's okay for about three more cars to go through in the meantime." And as for weaving through traffic, lane-splitting is perfectly legal where I live. Motorbikes can do it and so can I. So suck it up.
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: Eamonnca1 on August 01, 2017, 06:04:15 PM
Quote from: haveaharp on August 01, 2017, 08:10:45 AM
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on July 31, 2017, 09:24:49 PM
Jesus! A lot of anger on this thread.... get a bit of perspective, nearly 70 people died on the roads last year, bad driving, drunk driving, texting or on phone.... drivers would need to get their act together

exactly - start with the morons on phones before worrying about cyclists i'd suggest.

Hear hear. About 50 pedestrians get killed by drivers in San Francisco every year. But once, a few years ago, one pedestrian was killed by a cyclist. Guess which case got wall-to-wall media coverage?
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: Eamonnca1 on August 01, 2017, 06:08:04 PM
Quote from: thewobbler on August 01, 2017, 09:47:38 AM

See here's the thing. There's literally a thousand active pastimes people can engage in. But cycling is the one that inconveniences other people going about their lives, more than any other leisure pursuit.

You and other cyclists believe you have the right to take "ownership" of roads.... yet these roads which cost thousands, maybe tens of thousands, of pounds per yard  to build and maintain, were not actually built for cyclists.

That said I'm more than happy that they have a multi purpose function and I'd even go so far as to encourage cycling. But, only when they're cognisant of their status; so if they're holding up normal traffic flows they pull over until it's restored, if they are behaving in a way that makes the road less safe for its other users, they are penalised and then banned for multiple infractions.

Is that really too much to ask?

Oh get over yourself, you self-important twerp. You expect me to move over an encourage an unsafe pass just so you can shave a few milliseconds off your trip to the off-license for a six-pack of beer and tube of Pringles? What makes your journey so important? Chances are you're going to be sitting behind me at the next red light anyway, so you might as well listen to the radio, relax, and stop thinking you're in such a hurry.

BTW, roads in the US were initially paved because cyclists lobbied for it. So roads were not "built for cars." Oh and cyclists pay more than their fair share of taxes to fund them, so don't give me any of your "motorists own the road" guff. It's a shared resource. Get over it.
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: Eamonnca1 on August 01, 2017, 06:09:22 PM
Quote from: Taylor on August 01, 2017, 10:45:55 AM
Do cyclists in any way contribute to the upkeep of the roads that they use?

If runners are out on the road do they run 3, 4 or even 5 abreast?

If runners were able to cruise at 20MPH and get up to 40MPH then you might have some sort of point. But you don't. So put a sock in it.
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: Eamonnca1 on August 01, 2017, 06:10:37 PM
Quote from: highorlow on August 01, 2017, 10:57:11 AM
QuoteAnd another thing. What's up with the title of this thread? We don't give out about soccer players wearing soccer shorts, or runners wearing running gear when out for a run, or swimmers wearing swimming gear in the pool. Anybody who gives out about cyclists wearing cycling gear when cycling needs their head examined. Try riding a bike 80 miles in a pair of denim jeans and let me know how comfortable that is, you depressingly fat clowns.

Its because the Lyrca brigade are the worst culprits. Can you not just get a bike machine attachment and plonk yourself in the back garden for 80 miles instead?

No thanks. I'll just let you stay off the road and order your groceries online since you hate sharing the road so much.
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: dclane on August 01, 2017, 06:11:41 PM
Have you anger issues Eamonn?
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: Eamonnca1 on August 01, 2017, 06:12:02 PM
Quote from: dclane on August 01, 2017, 11:43:26 AM
Plenty of cyclists use their phone to text and whatever whilst cycling.

Bumkum. I've seen it about twice in my life ever. I wish I could say the same about motorists.
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: Eamonnca1 on August 01, 2017, 06:12:54 PM
Quote from: dclane on August 01, 2017, 12:03:02 PM
Lol. It's funny how no cyclist has ever done it when you ask them yet 99% of the ones I see do it when I'm out driving.

Well put the phone down and you'll see plenty of cyclists waiting patiently for the light to turn green.
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: dclane on August 01, 2017, 06:14:43 PM
Have you anger issues Eamonn?
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: Eamonnca1 on August 01, 2017, 06:16:36 PM
Quote from: Hardy on August 01, 2017, 12:58:59 PM
2 abreast vs. single file - the guideline is very clear, as pointed out by Tony Baloney. But the lycra troop overwhelmingly insist on riding 2 abreast in all circumstances, including on very narrow roads and on bends. It seems to have become a dogma for them and from their rhetoric it's clear that it's a militant claiming of equality with motorised traffic.

That's just very stupid, as wobbler pointed out, not to mention the basic good manners argument. You don't see pedestrians walking two-or-more abreast on roads where there is no footpath, militantly claiming their right to hold up traffic whose normal pace is much higher than theirs. There's a practical reason beyond good manners for that. Pedestrians understand a simple logic that seems to evade cyclists as an organised group.

Another basic example of good manners that I've never seen cyclists use - when they're out in large groups, why do they insist on forming a continuous line, be it single file or two-or-more abreast? A basic courtesy would be to travel in pairs with gaps of 50 metres or so. But I suppose that wouldn't look like a peloton.

Oh and to the argument that there are arseholes behind the wheels of many cars - who has ever denied that? This thread, though, is about arsehole cyclists.
I'm going to explain this nice and slowly because it's clear that you're a simpleton. Riding in a single group, two abreast, makes it quicker, safer, and easier to overtake. Riding in a single line makes the group twice as long and hence almost impossible to get past on winding roads with short overtaking opportunities. Breaking the group up into small sections would make it even harder for you to get past because you'd have to repeat the process several times. You're welcome.

And shut up about runners. They can't cruise at 20MPH or get up to 40MPH, plus they have to go against traffic where there's no footpath. Stop opening your mouth and revealing to the world how stupid you are.
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: Eamonnca1 on August 01, 2017, 06:18:03 PM
Quote from: Puckoon on August 01, 2017, 05:57:32 PM
Regardless of the debate - anyone who wants to classify the cyclists on the basis of what they're wearing is showing themselves up to be the traditional bog hopping, begrudging curmudgeon fool that's been berating anyone who stepped outside of the norm for years. Probably complained back in the day about the lads that wore white boots, the lads that had a fancy haircut, the lads who were too tan, the lads who had tattoos or ear rings, the lads who own a nice car or the first guy to wear under armour on a cold league day. Those lads are all winning medals with clubs and counties and it doesn't matter a shite what they wore or how they did it.

Got no interest in cycling - but some of you should cop yourself on with the lycra nonsense around here. Bunchawankers

Hear bloody hear. They're like the cider-swilling hoodie-wearing scumbags standing at street corners shouting abuse at anyone that runs or cycles past.
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: Eamonnca1 on August 01, 2017, 06:18:36 PM
Quote from: dclane on August 01, 2017, 06:11:41 PM
Have you anger issues Eamonn?

I have a low tolerance threshold for stupidity.
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: Hardy on August 01, 2017, 06:18:49 PM
Quote from: Puckoon on August 01, 2017, 05:57:32 PM
Regardless of the debate - anyone who wants to classify the cyclists on the basis of what they're wearing is showing themselves up to be the traditional bog hopping, begrudging curmudgeon fool that's been berating anyone who stepped outside of the norm for years. Probably complained back in the day about the lads that wore white boots, the lads that had a fancy haircut, the lads who were too tan, the lads who had tattoos or ear rings, the lads who own a nice car or the first guy to wear under armour on a cold league day. Those lads are all winning medals with clubs and counties and it doesn't matter a shite what they wore or how they did it.

Got no interest in cycling - but some of you should cop yourself on with the lycra nonsense around here. Bunchawankers


Who disparaged the lycra or said there was anything wrong with it? People are just using it as a convenient (OK, even facile) common trait to categorise them.

But now that you mention it, what is it with the lycra? Is it the standard material for gear in any other sport? Surely, being synthetic, it's awful sweaty?
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: dclane on August 01, 2017, 06:21:03 PM
Quote from: Eamonnca1 on August 01, 2017, 06:18:36 PM
Quote from: dclane on August 01, 2017, 06:11:41 PM
Have you anger issues Eamonn?

I have a low tolerance threshold for stupidity.
I think you're a little unhinged myself.
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: Hardy on August 01, 2017, 06:21:18 PM
Quote from: Eamonnca1 on August 01, 2017, 06:16:36 PM
Quote from: Hardy on August 01, 2017, 12:58:59 PM
2 abreast vs. single file - the guideline is very clear, as pointed out by Tony Baloney. But the lycra troop overwhelmingly insist on riding 2 abreast in all circumstances, including on very narrow roads and on bends. It seems to have become a dogma for them and from their rhetoric it's clear that it's a militant claiming of equality with motorised traffic.

That's just very stupid, as wobbler pointed out, not to mention the basic good manners argument. You don't see pedestrians walking two-or-more abreast on roads where there is no footpath, militantly claiming their right to hold up traffic whose normal pace is much higher than theirs. There's a practical reason beyond good manners for that. Pedestrians understand a simple logic that seems to evade cyclists as an organised group.

Another basic example of good manners that I've never seen cyclists use - when they're out in large groups, why do they insist on forming a continuous line, be it single file or two-or-more abreast? A basic courtesy would be to travel in pairs with gaps of 50 metres or so. But I suppose that wouldn't look like a peloton.

Oh and to the argument that there are arseholes behind the wheels of many cars - who has ever denied that? This thread, though, is about arsehole cyclists.
I'm going to explain this nice and slowly because it's clear that you're a simpleton. Riding in a single group, two abreast, makes it quicker, safer, and easier to overtake. Riding in a single line makes the group twice as long and hence almost impossible to get past on winding roads with short overtaking opportunities. Breaking the group up into small sections would make it even harder for you to get past because you'd have to repeat the process several times. You're welcome.

And shut up about runners. They can't cruise at 20MPH or get up to 40MPH, plus they have to go against traffic where there's no footpath. Stop opening your mouth and revealing to the world how stupid you are.

You really are, without any apparent effort as it seems to come naturally to you, confirming the stereotype of cyclist as arrogant w**ker.
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: Eamonnca1 on August 01, 2017, 06:23:30 PM
Quote from: Hardy on August 01, 2017, 06:18:49 PM
Who disparaged the lycra or said there was anything wrong with it? People are just using it as a convenient (OK, even facile) common trait to categorise them.
The cheap thoughtless OP refers to "lycra-clad cyclist" as "pests."

Quote
But now that you mention it, what is it with the lycra? Is it the standard material for gear in any other sport?
Yes.

QuoteSurely, being synthetic, it's awful sweaty?
No. It "wicks" sweat away from the skin. Because of the stretchy properties it doesn't flap around in the wind and slow you down like a parachute. It's comfortable and practical.
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: Eamonnca1 on August 01, 2017, 06:25:13 PM
Quote from: Hardy on August 01, 2017, 06:21:18 PM
You really are, without any apparent effort as it seems to come naturally to you, confirming the stereotype of cyclist as arrogant w**ker.

Do I look like someone who cares what anyone thinks?

I've explained numerous times that riding two abreast makes it easier to get past rather than harder, but you people are determined to prevent that information from getting into your thick skulls. There's nothing more I can do for you. You deserve nothing more than scorn and ridicule.
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: Eamonnca1 on August 01, 2017, 06:26:01 PM
Quote from: dclane on August 01, 2017, 06:21:03 PM
Quote from: Eamonnca1 on August 01, 2017, 06:18:36 PM
Quote from: dclane on August 01, 2017, 06:11:41 PM
Have you anger issues Eamonn?

I have a low tolerance threshold for stupidity.
I think you're a little unhinged myself.

I'll make a note of that.
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: dclane on August 01, 2017, 06:31:50 PM
Lycra isn't all bad.
(http://images.mcn.bauercdn.com/forumgallery/76/727576/174520_526010.jpg)
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: Hardy on August 01, 2017, 06:34:05 PM
Quote from: Eamonnca1 on August 01, 2017, 06:25:13 PM
Quote from: Hardy on August 01, 2017, 06:21:18 PM
You really are, without any apparent effort as it seems to come naturally to you, confirming the stereotype of cyclist as arrogant w**ker.

Do I look like someone who cares what anyone thinks?

I've explained numerous times that riding two abreast makes it easier to get past rather than harder, but you people are determined to prevent that information from getting into your thick skulls. There's nothing more I can do for you. You deserve nothing more than scorn and ridicule.

[Post removed on mature reflection - no point in fuelling smebody's anger.]
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: Eamonnca1 on August 01, 2017, 06:49:07 PM
Was it something I said?
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: Aughafad on August 01, 2017, 07:17:16 PM
http://metro.co.uk/2017/07/06/cyclist-almost-killed-after-colliding-with-lorry-at-busy-london-junction-6759940/


Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: Dire Ear on August 01, 2017, 07:37:43 PM
Quote from: Eamonnca1 on August 01, 2017, 06:49:07 PM
Was it something I said?
You're very abusive, arrogant, full of self-importance..and possibly alcohol!! :D
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: Eamonnca1 on August 01, 2017, 07:52:18 PM
Quote from: Dire Ear on August 01, 2017, 07:37:43 PM
Quote from: Eamonnca1 on August 01, 2017, 06:49:07 PM
Was it something I said?
You're very abusive, arrogant, full of self-importance..and possibly alcohol!! :D

That's uncalled for. I haven't had a drop!
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: thewobbler on August 01, 2017, 10:21:07 PM
did I just read it right that because someone paved a footpath 100 years ago for a bicycle route, that every road, even those that are reinforced specifically for HGV carriage, will always be fair game?

I'd suggest the Orange Order's right to match the Queen's Highway holds a greater claim.

----

As for single file. Eamon, you don't live in Ireland so let me remind you that the majority of country roads over here were built so that two lorries can pass safely on either side, with not a whole lot of room beyond that.

Therefore in the majority of these cases, a car can pass a pedestrian or a single file cyclist on their side of the road, with a little caution, without having to adjust speed significantly. The "caution" comes from blind bends and looking out for high sided vehicles coming the opposite direction. Do that and (in a car) you'll be able to give a cyclist / pedestrian a clear metre of breathing room.

When cyclists ride these roads two abreast, put simply it means that every passing manoeuvre requires greater judgement and better execution. Which inevitably leads to tailbacks, as each and every motor vehicle has to apply the same caution.

Is it really that difficult to understand?

Now it's Saturday afternoon and you're driving through County Down, up through the Mournes, which is basically one long type of the road described above. It's also full of hills that few cyclists can take on at over 10mph. And farmers in tractors trying to make a living. And HGV drivers trying to make a living.

I don't have to be in a hurry to find that frustrating. Not do the other 100 cars that have rocked up before and after me, all crawling through roads at 12% the speed limit and about 25% of the safe speed for the roads.

But hi, someone build a cycle path back in 1870 that later became a road. Rock on lads. You deserve it.

Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: Eamonnca1 on August 01, 2017, 10:48:17 PM
Quote from: thewobbler on August 01, 2017, 10:21:07 PM
did I just read it right that because someone paved a footpath 100 years ago for a bicycle route, that every road, even those that are reinforced specifically for HGV carriage, will always be fair game?

I'd suggest the Orange Order's right to match the Queen's Highway holds a greater claim.

----

As for single file. Eamon, you don't live in Ireland so let me remind you that the majority of country roads over here were built so that two lorries can pass safely on either side, with not a whole lot of room beyond that.

Therefore in the majority of these cases, a car can pass a pedestrian or a single file cyclist on their side of the road, with a little caution, without having to adjust speed significantly.

Okay, I stopped reading here because I call BS. I grew up in Ireland and I'm well aware of how wide the roads are. They are not wide. It is NOT! safe to pass a cyclist on the vast majority of roads without having to cross the centre line if you're going to give the requisite clearance. In other words, it's not safe to pass when they're riding single file, ergo the only thing riding two abreast does is makes it easier to get past because it shortens the group.
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: punt kick on August 02, 2017, 10:27:48 AM
Quote from: Hardy on August 01, 2017, 06:21:18 PM
Quote from: Eamonnca1 on August 01, 2017, 06:16:36 PM
Quote from: Hardy on August 01, 2017, 12:58:59 PM
2 abreast vs. single file - the guideline is very clear, as pointed out by Tony Baloney. But the lycra troop overwhelmingly insist on riding 2 abreast in all circumstances, including on very narrow roads and on bends. It seems to have become a dogma for them and from their rhetoric it's clear that it's a militant claiming of equality with motorised traffic.

That's just very stupid, as wobbler pointed out, not to mention the basic good manners argument. You don't see pedestrians walking two-or-more abreast on roads where there is no footpath, militantly claiming their right to hold up traffic whose normal pace is much higher than theirs. There's a practical reason beyond good manners for that. Pedestrians understand a simple logic that seems to evade cyclists as an organised group.

Another basic example of good manners that I've never seen cyclists use - when they're out in large groups, why do they insist on forming a continuous line, be it single file or two-or-more abreast? A basic courtesy would be to travel in pairs with gaps of 50 metres or so. But I suppose that wouldn't look like a peloton.

Oh and to the argument that there are arseholes behind the wheels of many cars - who has ever denied that? This thread, though, is about arsehole cyclists.
I'm going to explain this nice and slowly because it's clear that you're a simpleton. Riding in a single group, two abreast, makes it quicker, safer, and easier to overtake. Riding in a single line makes the group twice as long and hence almost impossible to get past on winding roads with short overtaking opportunities. Breaking the group up into small sections would make it even harder for you to get past because you'd have to repeat the process several times. You're welcome.

And shut up about runners. They can't cruise at 20MPH or get up to 40MPH, plus they have to go against traffic where there's no footpath. Stop opening your mouth and revealing to the world how stupid you are.

You really are, without any apparent effort as it seems to come naturally to you, confirming the stereotype of cyclist as arrogant w**ker.

The truest post on this thread.
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: haveaharp on August 02, 2017, 10:51:28 AM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6fKof31u-2o (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6fKof31u-2o)

Is that Hardy or Wobbler in the aul Peugeot ?
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: dclane on August 02, 2017, 11:32:42 AM
https://youtu.be/JtV51NUtg4Y
Including cyclists on phones even though crazy Eamonn says it doesn't happen.
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: dclane on August 02, 2017, 11:40:53 AM
https://youtu.be/mILv0v_FrEI
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: haveaharp on August 02, 2017, 11:53:10 AM
The point is if a cyclist is an idiot (of which clearly there are some) they are moving at relatively low speed on a machine weighing under 10kgs. If a motorist is an idiot he is likely in a machine weighing enough to maim, crush, kill someone should they hit a cyclist. The arrogance of some on this thread is quite astounding.
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: dclane on August 02, 2017, 12:00:01 PM
Quote from: haveaharp on August 02, 2017, 11:53:10 AM
The point is if a cyclist is an idiot (of which clearly there are some) they are moving at relatively low speed on a machine weighing under 10kgs. If a motorist is an idiot he is likely in a machine weighing enough to maim, crush, kill someone should they hit a cyclist. The arrogance of some on this thread is quite astounding.
I agree. Cyclists are very arrogant.
Especially the lycra clad knobs.
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: haveaharp on August 02, 2017, 12:09:14 PM
Quote from: dclane on August 02, 2017, 12:00:01 PM
Quote from: haveaharp on August 02, 2017, 11:53:10 AM
The point is if a cyclist is an idiot (of which clearly there are some) they are moving at relatively low speed on a machine weighing under 10kgs. If a motorist is an idiot he is likely in a machine weighing enough to maim, crush, kill someone should they hit a cyclist. The arrogance of some on this thread is quite astounding.
I agree. Cyclists are very arrogant.
Especially the lycra clad knobs.

Righto
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: Hardy on August 02, 2017, 12:10:35 PM
Quote from: haveaharp on August 02, 2017, 11:53:10 AM
The point is if a cyclist is an idiot (of which clearly there are some) they are moving at relatively low speed on a machine weighing under 10kgs. If a motorist is an idiot he is likely in a machine weighing enough to maim, crush, kill someone should they hit a cyclist. The arrogance of some on this thread is quite astounding.

Some! Have you looked at those videos? What strikes one about those clips is that they are perfectly everyday. The behaviour illustrated is not exceptional - we see it all the time. In every example, more cyclists are breaking red lights than aren't.

So it's not just SOME cyclists who are dangerous, arrogant idiots. It's a very large proportion, if not a majority in some cases. They insist on equal status with motorised traffic by militantly asserting their supposed right to hold up road users whose normal pace is higher than theirs, but at the same time insist on ignoring the laws and rules that all but a minuscule percentage of the rest of road users obey.

How many cars, buses or trucks did you see breaking red lights while cyclists were merrily ignoring them? That's the whole point of what we're talking about here.

And I'm sorry, but the argument that it's OK as they're small and won't do much damage is idiotic.
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: haveaharp on August 02, 2017, 12:34:06 PM
Quote from: Hardy on August 02, 2017, 12:10:35 PM
Quote from: haveaharp on August 02, 2017, 11:53:10 AM
The point is if a cyclist is an idiot (of which clearly there are some) they are moving at relatively low speed on a machine weighing under 10kgs. If a motorist is an idiot he is likely in a machine weighing enough to maim, crush, kill someone should they hit a cyclist. The arrogance of some on this thread is quite astounding.

Some! Have you looked at those videos? What strikes one about those clips is that they are perfectly everyday. The behaviour illustrated is not exceptional - we see it all the time. In every example, more cyclists are breaking red lights than aren't.

So it's not just SOME cyclists who are dangerous, arrogant idiots. It's a very large proportion, if not a majority in some cases. They insist on equal status with motorised traffic by militantly asserting their supposed right to hold up road users whose normal pace is higher than theirs, but at the same time insist on ignoring the laws and rules that all but a minuscule percentage of the rest of road users obey.

How many cars, buses or trucks did you see breaking red lights while cyclists were merrily ignoring them? That's the whole point of what we're talking about here.

And I'm sorry, but the argument that it's OK as they're small and won't do much damage is idiotic.

Idiotic ? Get hit by a cyclist or a truck or jeep, hmmmnn which one is least likely to kill you ?


Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: punt kick on August 02, 2017, 12:36:56 PM
Quote from: haveaharp on August 02, 2017, 12:34:06 PM
Quote from: Hardy on August 02, 2017, 12:10:35 PM
Quote from: haveaharp on August 02, 2017, 11:53:10 AM
The point is if a cyclist is an idiot (of which clearly there are some) they are moving at relatively low speed on a machine weighing under 10kgs. If a motorist is an idiot he is likely in a machine weighing enough to maim, crush, kill someone should they hit a cyclist. The arrogance of some on this thread is quite astounding.

Some! Have you looked at those videos? What strikes one about those clips is that they are perfectly everyday. The behaviour illustrated is not exceptional - we see it all the time. In every example, more cyclists are breaking red lights than aren't.

So it's not just SOME cyclists who are dangerous, arrogant idiots. It's a very large proportion, if not a majority in some cases. They insist on equal status with motorised traffic by militantly asserting their supposed right to hold up road users whose normal pace is higher than theirs, but at the same time insist on ignoring the laws and rules that all but a minuscule percentage of the rest of road users obey.

How many cars, buses or trucks did you see breaking red lights while cyclists were merrily ignoring them? That's the whole point of what we're talking about here.

And I'm sorry, but the argument that it's OK as they're small and won't do much damage is idiotic.

Idiotic ? Get hit by a cyclist or a truck or jeep, hmmmnn which one is least likely to kill you ?

So if a cyclist breaks a red light and gets mowed down, is that the motorists fault, or if the motorist swerves to avoid said p***k and hits another car is that the motorists fault?
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: haveaharp on August 02, 2017, 12:38:22 PM
Quote from: punt kick on August 02, 2017, 12:36:56 PM
Quote from: haveaharp on August 02, 2017, 12:34:06 PM
Quote from: Hardy on August 02, 2017, 12:10:35 PM
Quote from: haveaharp on August 02, 2017, 11:53:10 AM
The point is if a cyclist is an idiot (of which clearly there are some) they are moving at relatively low speed on a machine weighing under 10kgs. If a motorist is an idiot he is likely in a machine weighing enough to maim, crush, kill someone should they hit a cyclist. The arrogance of some on this thread is quite astounding.

Some! Have you looked at those videos? What strikes one about those clips is that they are perfectly everyday. The behaviour illustrated is not exceptional - we see it all the time. In every example, more cyclists are breaking red lights than aren't.

So it's not just SOME cyclists who are dangerous, arrogant idiots. It's a very large proportion, if not a majority in some cases. They insist on equal status with motorised traffic by militantly asserting their supposed right to hold up road users whose normal pace is higher than theirs, but at the same time insist on ignoring the laws and rules that all but a minuscule percentage of the rest of road users obey.

How many cars, buses or trucks did you see breaking red lights while cyclists were merrily ignoring them? That's the whole point of what we're talking about here.

And I'm sorry, but the argument that it's OK as they're small and won't do much damage is idiotic.

Idiotic ? Get hit by a cyclist or a truck or jeep, hmmmnn which one is least likely to kill you ?

So if a cyclist breaks a red light and gets mowed down, is that the motorists fault, or if the motorist swerves to avoid said p***k and hits another car is that the motorists fault?

Of course it isn't.
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: Hardy on August 02, 2017, 12:50:20 PM
Quote from: haveaharp on August 02, 2017, 12:34:06 PM
Quote from: Hardy on August 02, 2017, 12:10:35 PM
Quote from: haveaharp on August 02, 2017, 11:53:10 AM
The point is if a cyclist is an idiot (of which clearly there are some) they are moving at relatively low speed on a machine weighing under 10kgs. If a motorist is an idiot he is likely in a machine weighing enough to maim, crush, kill someone should they hit a cyclist. The arrogance of some on this thread is quite astounding.

Some! Have you looked at those videos? What strikes one about those clips is that they are perfectly everyday. The behaviour illustrated is not exceptional - we see it all the time. In every example, more cyclists are breaking red lights than aren't.

So it's not just SOME cyclists who are dangerous, arrogant idiots. It's a very large proportion, if not a majority in some cases. They insist on equal status with motorised traffic by militantly asserting their supposed right to hold up road users whose normal pace is higher than theirs, but at the same time insist on ignoring the laws and rules that all but a minuscule percentage of the rest of road users obey.

How many cars, buses or trucks did you see breaking red lights while cyclists were merrily ignoring them? That's the whole point of what we're talking about here.

And I'm sorry, but the argument that it's OK as they're small and won't do much damage is idiotic.

Idiotic ? Get hit by a cyclist or a truck or jeep, hmmmnn which one is least likely to kill you ?

If that was the only consideration in determining the rules of the road then, yes, as you stated in your first quoted post, that would be "the point".

I think the point of this thread is the fact that a large proportion of cyclists flout the rules of the road with effective impunity, causing danger to themselves and, more importantly, others. If you want the point to be the comparative capabilities of bikes and buses to hurt people, fire away and start a thread with that point.
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: Milltown Row2 on August 02, 2017, 01:24:38 PM
Quote from: Hardy on August 02, 2017, 12:50:20 PM
Quote from: haveaharp on August 02, 2017, 12:34:06 PM
Quote from: Hardy on August 02, 2017, 12:10:35 PM
Quote from: haveaharp on August 02, 2017, 11:53:10 AM
The point is if a cyclist is an idiot (of which clearly there are some) they are moving at relatively low speed on a machine weighing under 10kgs. If a motorist is an idiot he is likely in a machine weighing enough to maim, crush, kill someone should they hit a cyclist. The arrogance of some on this thread is quite astounding.

Some! Have you looked at those videos? What strikes one about those clips is that they are perfectly everyday. The behaviour illustrated is not exceptional - we see it all the time. In every example, more cyclists are breaking red lights than aren't.

So it's not just SOME cyclists who are dangerous, arrogant idiots. It's a very large proportion, if not a majority in some cases. They insist on equal status with motorised traffic by militantly asserting their supposed right to hold up road users whose normal pace is higher than theirs, but at the same time insist on ignoring the laws and rules that all but a minuscule percentage of the rest of road users obey.

How many cars, buses or trucks did you see breaking red lights while cyclists were merrily ignoring them? That's the whole point of what we're talking about here.

And I'm sorry, but the argument that it's OK as they're small and won't do much damage is idiotic.

Idiotic ? Get hit by a cyclist or a truck or jeep, hmmmnn which one is least likely to kill you ?

If that was the only consideration in determining the rules of the road then, yes, as you stated in your first quoted post, that would be "the point".

I think the point of this thread is the fact that a large proportion of cyclists flout the rules of the road with effective impunity, causing danger to themselves and, more importantly, others. If you want the point to be the comparative capabilities of bikes and buses to hurt people, fire away and start a thread with that point.

The point of the thread would be the title? should they pay tax? Yes, as long as its put back to cycle safety like road tax would be for road safety of cars... next some people be looking for taxing people to wald the pavements as you get plenty pricks doing that also.

threads get hijacked along the way and most go on the petty route and its lost, people take it thick and a lot of name calling to annoymous posters... found a nice video of our careful drivers out there

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DmALmLjWIN4
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: johnneycool on August 02, 2017, 01:30:39 PM
Quote from: Hardy on August 02, 2017, 12:10:35 PM
Quote from: haveaharp on August 02, 2017, 11:53:10 AM
The point is if a cyclist is an idiot (of which clearly there are some) they are moving at relatively low speed on a machine weighing under 10kgs. If a motorist is an idiot he is likely in a machine weighing enough to maim, crush, kill someone should they hit a cyclist. The arrogance of some on this thread is quite astounding.

Some! Have you looked at those videos? What strikes one about those clips is that they are perfectly everyday. The behaviour illustrated is not exceptional - we see it all the time. In every example, more cyclists are breaking red lights than aren't.

So it's not just SOME cyclists who are dangerous, arrogant idiots. It's a very large proportion, if not a majority in some cases. They insist on equal status with motorised traffic by militantly asserting their supposed right to hold up road users whose normal pace is higher than theirs, but at the same time insist on ignoring the laws and rules that all but a minuscule percentage of the rest of road users obey.

How many cars, buses or trucks did you see breaking red lights while cyclists were merrily ignoring them? That's the whole point of what we're talking about here.

And I'm sorry, but the argument that it's OK as they're small and won't do much damage is idiotic.

Hardy,
   if you saw this cycling up the Navan Road I'm sure you'd soon change your mind on the lycra!!

(http://www.wigglestatic.com/images/santini-wmn-r3-bib-10-zoom.jpg)
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: Hardy on August 02, 2017, 01:31:46 PM
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on August 02, 2017, 01:24:38 PM
Quote from: Hardy on August 02, 2017, 12:50:20 PM
Quote from: haveaharp on August 02, 2017, 12:34:06 PM
Quote from: Hardy on August 02, 2017, 12:10:35 PM
Quote from: haveaharp on August 02, 2017, 11:53:10 AM
The point is if a cyclist is an idiot (of which clearly there are some) they are moving at relatively low speed on a machine weighing under 10kgs. If a motorist is an idiot he is likely in a machine weighing enough to maim, crush, kill someone should they hit a cyclist. The arrogance of some on this thread is quite astounding.

Some! Have you looked at those videos? What strikes one about those clips is that they are perfectly everyday. The behaviour illustrated is not exceptional - we see it all the time. In every example, more cyclists are breaking red lights than aren't.

So it's not just SOME cyclists who are dangerous, arrogant idiots. It's a very large proportion, if not a majority in some cases. They insist on equal status with motorised traffic by militantly asserting their supposed right to hold up road users whose normal pace is higher than theirs, but at the same time insist on ignoring the laws and rules that all but a minuscule percentage of the rest of road users obey.

How many cars, buses or trucks did you see breaking red lights while cyclists were merrily ignoring them? That's the whole point of what we're talking about here.

And I'm sorry, but the argument that it's OK as they're small and won't do much damage is idiotic.

Idiotic ? Get hit by a cyclist or a truck or jeep, hmmmnn which one is least likely to kill you ?

If that was the only consideration in determining the rules of the road then, yes, as you stated in your first quoted post, that would be "the point".

I think the point of this thread is the fact that a large proportion of cyclists flout the rules of the road with effective impunity, causing danger to themselves and, more importantly, others. If you want the point to be the comparative capabilities of bikes and buses to hurt people, fire away and start a thread with that point.

The point of the thread would be the title? should they pay tax? Yes, as long as its put back to cycle safety like road tax would be for road safety of cars... next some people be looking for taxing people to wald the pavements as you get plenty pricks doing that also.

threads get hijacked along the way and most go on the petty route and its lost, people take it thick and a lot of name calling to annoymous posters... found a nice video of our careful drivers out there

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DmALmLjWIN4 (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DmALmLjWIN4)

Here's a nice video of some elephants:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lF8em4uPdCg (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lF8em4uPdCg)
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: Hardy on August 02, 2017, 01:32:43 PM
Quote from: johnneycool on August 02, 2017, 01:30:39 PM
Quote from: Hardy on August 02, 2017, 12:10:35 PM
Quote from: haveaharp on August 02, 2017, 11:53:10 AM
The point is if a cyclist is an idiot (of which clearly there are some) they are moving at relatively low speed on a machine weighing under 10kgs. If a motorist is an idiot he is likely in a machine weighing enough to maim, crush, kill someone should they hit a cyclist. The arrogance of some on this thread is quite astounding.

Some! Have you looked at those videos? What strikes one about those clips is that they are perfectly everyday. The behaviour illustrated is not exceptional - we see it all the time. In every example, more cyclists are breaking red lights than aren't.

So it's not just SOME cyclists who are dangerous, arrogant idiots. It's a very large proportion, if not a majority in some cases. They insist on equal status with motorised traffic by militantly asserting their supposed right to hold up road users whose normal pace is higher than theirs, but at the same time insist on ignoring the laws and rules that all but a minuscule percentage of the rest of road users obey.

How many cars, buses or trucks did you see breaking red lights while cyclists were merrily ignoring them? That's the whole point of what we're talking about here.

And I'm sorry, but the argument that it's OK as they're small and won't do much damage is idiotic.

Hardy,
   if you saw this cycling up the Navan Road I'm sure you'd soon change your mind on the lycra!!

(http://www.wigglestatic.com/images/santini-wmn-r3-bib-10-zoom.jpg)

Still too much lycra.  :P
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: Eamonnca1 on August 02, 2017, 05:14:47 PM
Quote from: Hardy on August 02, 2017, 12:50:20 PM

If that was the only consideration in determining the rules of the road then, yes, as you stated in your first quoted post, that would be "the point".

I think the point of this thread is the fact that a large proportion of cyclists flout the rules of the road with effective impunity, causing danger to themselves and, more importantly, others. If you want the point to be the comparative capabilities of bikes and buses to hurt people, fire away and start a thread with that point.

The day when motorists start obeying the traffic laws will be the day when I start listening to their sanctimonious advice about the rules of the road.
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: punt kick on August 02, 2017, 05:30:37 PM
Quote from: Eamonnca1 on August 02, 2017, 05:14:47 PM
Quote from: Hardy on August 02, 2017, 12:50:20 PM

If that was the only consideration in determining the rules of the road then, yes, as you stated in your first quoted post, that would be "the point".

I think the point of this thread is the fact that a large proportion of cyclists flout the rules of the road with effective impunity, causing danger to themselves and, more importantly, others. If you want the point to be the comparative capabilities of bikes and buses to hurt people, fire away and start a thread with that point.

The day when motorists start obeying the traffic laws will be the day when I start listening to their sanctimonious advice about the rules of the road.

That day might come when your arrogant attitude gets you or someone else seriously hurt.  You really are a typical arrogant p***k of a cyclist.
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: bennydorano on August 02, 2017, 05:33:22 PM
Why is this always such an emotive issue? I've read more sensible contributions on a dailymailonline immigration discussion.
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: Eamonnca1 on August 02, 2017, 05:46:17 PM
Quote from: punt kick on August 02, 2017, 05:30:37 PM
That day might come when your arrogant attitude gets you or someone else seriously hurt.
Is that supposed to be some sort of threat?

Quote
You really are a typical arrogant p***k of a cyclist.

Says one who thinks the road is his own private property and probably thinks speed limits are advisory. Shower of sanctimonious cretins, the whole bleedin' lot of ya!
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: Fat Angry Motorist on August 03, 2017, 12:50:42 PM
Quote from: Hardy on August 02, 2017, 12:10:35 PM
Quote from: haveaharp on August 02, 2017, 11:53:10 AM
The point is if a cyclist is an idiot (of which clearly there are some) they are moving at relatively low speed on a machine weighing under 10kgs. If a motorist is an idiot he is likely in a machine weighing enough to maim, crush, kill someone should they hit a cyclist. The arrogance of some on this thread is quite astounding.

Some! Have you looked at those videos? What strikes one about those clips is that they are perfectly everyday. The behaviour illustrated is not exceptional - we see it all the time. In every example, more cyclists are breaking red lights than aren't.

So it's not just SOME cyclists who are dangerous, arrogant idiots. It's a very large proportion, if not a majority in some cases. They insist on equal status with motorised traffic by militantly asserting their supposed right to hold up road users whose normal pace is higher than theirs, but at the same time insist on ignoring the laws and rules that all but a minuscule percentage of the rest of road users obey.

How many cars, buses or trucks did you see breaking red lights while cyclists were merrily ignoring them? That's the whole point of what we're talking about here.

And I'm sorry, but the argument that it's OK as they're small and won't do much damage is idiotic.

And it was at this point that I realised that this thread was a wind up.
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: Fat Angry Motorist on August 03, 2017, 12:54:39 PM
Quote from: Tonto on August 01, 2017, 11:09:12 AM
As a casual cyclist (i.e. Out by myself, not in a club, not racing) opinions like the ones on this thread scare the absolute crap out of me.

I'm a driver too and it frustrates me to see cyclists flouting the rules of the road knowing that other drivers are observing this and treating all cyclists as a menace. In fact I would argue that with every road law a cyclist breaks they put another cyclist in danger of a road rage incident.

There is definitely an arrogance and misunderstanding on both sides. I just hope that when people see me out on the road (in Lycra!) they don't see the "cyclist" that for example  jumped onto the pavement to avoid a red light but they might actually consider that I'm a dad, husband, son and brother.

If Carlsberg did GAA Board posts
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: Hardy on August 03, 2017, 02:54:49 PM
Eammonn, you're losing the run of yourself.
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: punt kick on August 03, 2017, 04:15:02 PM
Probably needs a good ride.
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: Taylor on August 03, 2017, 04:27:49 PM
One can only assume he was full of liquor when he was posting on this thread previously.

If not I would have worries about the man
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: Eamonnca1 on August 03, 2017, 05:32:37 PM
Quote from: punt kick on August 03, 2017, 04:15:02 PM
Probably needs a good ride.

I have a good ride everyday. I ride my bike to work.
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: Eamonnca1 on August 03, 2017, 07:43:09 PM
Quote from: Taylor on August 01, 2017, 01:27:01 PM
Great post Hardy

No. It's a terrible post.
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: Gabriel_Hurl on August 03, 2017, 08:51:18 PM
Did a cyclist run away with punt kick's woman (or fella - it is 2017 after all) or something? He seems very angry with them?
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: Hardy on August 03, 2017, 09:20:28 PM
Quote from: Eamonnca1 on August 03, 2017, 07:43:09 PM
Quote from: Taylor on August 01, 2017, 01:27:01 PM
Great post Hardy

No. It's a terrible post.

Sad. The head of the Boy Scouts of America called and said it was the best post ever on the internet.
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: Eamonnca1 on August 03, 2017, 10:06:01 PM
Quote from: Hardy on August 03, 2017, 09:20:28 PM
Sad. The head of the Boy Scouts of America called and said it was the best post ever on the internet.

;D
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: Keyser soze on August 04, 2017, 11:02:33 AM
I am  mainly a motorist but do an occasional bit of cycling. I live in an area where there are lots of cyclists and a few cycling clubs. When I get caught behind a cyclist or a group of cyclists it can be a bit frustrating but tbh this wouldn't happen any more than 3 or 4 times a year.

By the sounds of things some people on the board are sitting behind groups of cyclists on a daily basis and being held up for considerable periods. I don't know where they live that this can happen, most cycling clubs go out in the evening or of a weekend morning not at rush hour or other peak periods. Anybody who is out in the morning at rush hour is probably cycling to work.

I have been out on my own and holding near the side of the road on an A road with nothing coming the other way and have had cars passing me with inches to spare on many occasions when I clearly haven't held them up at all as the road had been clear for a good while before they came up behind me.

I cannot understand the levels of rage on here for cyclists, some of the comments are hysterical and some are so inane as to be surely the result of hysteria. Though Eamonca has gone a bit too far himself lol.

Driving licences used to say on the back "care ,courtesy and consideration saves lives"....we would maybe all do well to exercise this maxim more often.
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: Mayo4Sam on August 04, 2017, 12:58:36 PM
Long before I ever started cycling properly I drove a tractor, the amount of people that blow the horn at you for being on the road is ridiculous. I'd consider myself fairly courteous, I pull in when I can and let the traffic pass. What i've learned is that people do not like being held up at all, they don't see you as traffic they see you as holding up traffic.

There is a large portion of cyclists who are sanctimonious pr**ks, there is no doubting it but some things cyclists do are for their own safety. I cycle out from the ditch so that anyone passing me has to actually cross the white line to do so, the guy in the car has to treat me like traffic.
I personally obey the ROTR on a bike, much more so than I do when I'm in a car and I see in Dublin hoards of cyclists breaking red lights, or my pet hate in Galway people cycling on the footpath but watch any traffic lights and see how many people break the lights, go on any road and see how many people overtake you when you're doing the speed limit. Who decides which laws are ok to break and which aren't?

Going back to my original point, people just don't like being held up and never will so they act like arseholes which in turn makes people react like arseholes and soon we're all arseholes
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: Taylor on August 04, 2017, 01:18:50 PM
Quote from: Mayo4Sam on August 04, 2017, 12:58:36 PM
Long before I ever started cycling properly I drove a tractor, the amount of people that blow the horn at you for being on the road is ridiculous. I'd consider myself fairly courteous, I pull in when I can and let the traffic pass. What i've learned is that people do not like being held up at all, they don't see you as traffic they see you as holding up traffic.

There is a large portion of cyclists who are sanctimonious pr**ks, there is no doubting it but some things cyclists do are for their own safety. I cycle out from the ditch so that anyone passing me has to actually cross the white line to do so, the guy in the car has to treat me like traffic.
I personally obey the ROTR on a bike, much more so than I do when I'm in a car and I see in Dublin hoards of cyclists breaking red lights, or my pet hate in Galway people cycling on the footpath but watch any traffic lights and see how many people break the lights, go on any road and see how many people overtake you when you're doing the speed limit. Who decides which laws are ok to break and which aren't?

Going back to my original point, people just don't like being held up and never will so they act like arseholes which in turn makes people react like arseholes and soon we're all arseholes

Typical attitude of a cyclist.
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: Fat Angry Motorist on August 04, 2017, 01:20:36 PM
Quote from: Keyser soze on August 04, 2017, 11:02:33 AM
I am  mainly a motorist but do an occasional bit of cycling. I live in an area where there are lots of cyclists and a few cycling clubs. When I get caught behind a cyclist or a group of cyclists it can be a bit frustrating but tbh this wouldn't happen any more than 3 or 4 times a year.

By the sounds of things some people on the board are sitting behind groups of cyclists on a daily basis and being held up for considerable periods. I don't know where they live that this can happen, most cycling clubs go out in the evening or of a weekend morning not at rush hour or other peak periods. Anybody who is out in the morning at rush hour is probably cycling to work.

I have been out on my own and holding near the side of the road on an A road with nothing coming the other way and have had cars passing me with inches to spare on many occasions when I clearly haven't held them up at all as the road had been clear for a good while before they came up behind me.

I cannot understand the levels of rage on here for cyclists, some of the comments are hysterical and some are so inane as to be surely the result of hysteria. Though Eamonca has gone a bit too far himself lol.

Driving licences used to say on the back "care ,courtesy and consideration saves lives"....we would maybe all do well to exercise this maxim more often.

Takes a few reads to separate the WUMs from the real headers!
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: Fat Angry Motorist on August 04, 2017, 01:21:10 PM
Quote from: Gabriel_Hurl on August 03, 2017, 08:51:18 PM
Did a cyclist run away with punt kick's woman (or fella - it is 2017 after all) or something? He seems very angry with them?

Definitely single i'd guess.
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: Mayo4Sam on August 04, 2017, 01:25:34 PM
Quote from: Taylor on August 04, 2017, 01:18:50 PM
Quote from: Mayo4Sam on August 04, 2017, 12:58:36 PM
Long before I ever started cycling properly I drove a tractor, the amount of people that blow the horn at you for being on the road is ridiculous. I'd consider myself fairly courteous, I pull in when I can and let the traffic pass. What i've learned is that people do not like being held up at all, they don't see you as traffic they see you as holding up traffic.

There is a large portion of cyclists who are sanctimonious pr**ks, there is no doubting it but some things cyclists do are for their own safety. I cycle out from the ditch so that anyone passing me has to actually cross the white line to do so, the guy in the car has to treat me like traffic.
I personally obey the ROTR on a bike, much more so than I do when I'm in a car and I see in Dublin hoards of cyclists breaking red lights, or my pet hate in Galway people cycling on the footpath but watch any traffic lights and see how many people break the lights, go on any road and see how many people overtake you when you're doing the speed limit. Who decides which laws are ok to break and which aren't?

Going back to my original point, people just don't like being held up and never will so they act like arseholes which in turn makes people react like arseholes and soon we're all arseholes

Typical attitude of a cyclist.

Genuine question, whats wrong with that attitude?

I'll elaborate in saying that if I don't make cars cross the white line (and actually overtake) then they will just try and go by even if there is a car coming towards them
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: Taylor on August 04, 2017, 01:28:43 PM
Quote from: Mayo4Sam on August 04, 2017, 01:25:34 PM
Quote from: Taylor on August 04, 2017, 01:18:50 PM
Quote from: Mayo4Sam on August 04, 2017, 12:58:36 PM
Long before I ever started cycling properly I drove a tractor, the amount of people that blow the horn at you for being on the road is ridiculous. I'd consider myself fairly courteous, I pull in when I can and let the traffic pass. What i've learned is that people do not like being held up at all, they don't see you as traffic they see you as holding up traffic.

There is a large portion of cyclists who are sanctimonious pr**ks, there is no doubting it but some things cyclists do are for their own safety. I cycle out from the ditch so that anyone passing me has to actually cross the white line to do so, the guy in the car has to treat me like traffic.
I personally obey the ROTR on a bike, much more so than I do when I'm in a car and I see in Dublin hoards of cyclists breaking red lights, or my pet hate in Galway people cycling on the footpath but watch any traffic lights and see how many people break the lights, go on any road and see how many people overtake you when you're doing the speed limit. Who decides which laws are ok to break and which aren't?

Going back to my original point, people just don't like being held up and never will so they act like arseholes which in turn makes people react like arseholes and soon we're all arseholes

Typical attitude of a cyclist.

Genuine question, whats wrong with that attitude?

I'll elaborate in saying that if I don't make cars cross the white line (and actually overtake) then they will just try and go by even if there is a car coming towards them

You are making it more dangerous than ever for drivers then.

Roads were built for cars and drivers pay tax.
When are car comes behind you would it be an idea to actually stop if you are holding them up too long?
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: Mayo4Sam on August 04, 2017, 01:44:13 PM
I pay tax, lots of it, my taxes pay for the roads

Where do you stand on tractors? Should they be allowed on the road? By your rationale they pay motor tax so they should but I'd cycle quicker than a tractor
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: Taylor on August 04, 2017, 01:55:47 PM
Quote from: Mayo4Sam on August 04, 2017, 01:44:13 PM
I pay tax, lots of it, my taxes pay for the roads

Where do you stand on tractors? Should they be allowed on the road? By your rationale they pay motor tax so they should but I'd cycle quicker than a tractor

On the whole tractor drivers:

1. respect the rules of the road &
2. let cars past where possible

Same cant be said for cyclists on either count
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: Fat Angry Motorist on August 04, 2017, 02:02:09 PM
Quote from: Taylor on August 04, 2017, 01:28:43 PM
Quote from: Mayo4Sam on August 04, 2017, 01:25:34 PM
Quote from: Taylor on August 04, 2017, 01:18:50 PM
Quote from: Mayo4Sam on August 04, 2017, 12:58:36 PM
Long before I ever started cycling properly I drove a tractor, the amount of people that blow the horn at you for being on the road is ridiculous. I'd consider myself fairly courteous, I pull in when I can and let the traffic pass. What i've learned is that people do not like being held up at all, they don't see you as traffic they see you as holding up traffic.

There is a large portion of cyclists who are sanctimonious pr**ks, there is no doubting it but some things cyclists do are for their own safety. I cycle out from the ditch so that anyone passing me has to actually cross the white line to do so, the guy in the car has to treat me like traffic.
I personally obey the ROTR on a bike, much more so than I do when I'm in a car and I see in Dublin hoards of cyclists breaking red lights, or my pet hate in Galway people cycling on the footpath but watch any traffic lights and see how many people break the lights, go on any road and see how many people overtake you when you're doing the speed limit. Who decides which laws are ok to break and which aren't?

Going back to my original point, people just don't like being held up and never will so they act like arseholes which in turn makes people react like arseholes and soon we're all arseholes

Typical attitude of a cyclist.

Genuine question, whats wrong with that attitude?

I'll elaborate in saying that if I don't make cars cross the white line (and actually overtake) then they will just try and go by even if there is a car coming towards them

You are making it more dangerous than ever for drivers then.

Roads were built for cars and drivers pay tax.
When are car comes behind you would it be an idea to actually stop if you are holding them up too long?

Earlier in this thread the highway code was used to support the fact that cyclists riding two abreast is not a fixed right.  This is what it says about overtaking:

Rule 163

Overtake only when it is safe and legal to do so. You should:

give motorcyclists, cyclists and horse riders at least as much room as you would when overtaking a car.
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: Fat Angry Motorist on August 04, 2017, 02:05:58 PM
Quote from: Taylor on August 04, 2017, 01:55:47 PM
Quote from: Mayo4Sam on August 04, 2017, 01:44:13 PM
I pay tax, lots of it, my taxes pay for the roads

Where do you stand on tractors? Should they be allowed on the road? By your rationale they pay motor tax so they should but I'd cycle quicker than a tractor

On the whole tractor drivers:

1. respect the rules of the road &
2. let cars past where possible

Same cant be said for cyclists on either count

I honestly think cyclists breaking the rules of the road comes from them being, and maybe observing, drivers in the first place.
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: Taylor on August 04, 2017, 02:24:50 PM
Quote from: Fat Angry Motorist on August 04, 2017, 02:05:58 PM
Quote from: Taylor on August 04, 2017, 01:55:47 PM
Quote from: Mayo4Sam on August 04, 2017, 01:44:13 PM
I pay tax, lots of it, my taxes pay for the roads

Where do you stand on tractors? Should they be allowed on the road? By your rationale they pay motor tax so they should but I'd cycle quicker than a tractor

On the whole tractor drivers:

1. respect the rules of the road &
2. let cars past where possible

Same cant be said for cyclists on either count

I honestly think cyclists breaking the rules of the road comes from them being, and maybe observing, drivers in the first place.

Hopping onto kerbs when there is a red light wouldnt be a done thing for drivers?

Moving across the road when someone attempts to overtake you wouldnt be a done thing either with drivers?
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: Keyser soze on August 04, 2017, 02:27:02 PM
For a single cyclist riding tight to the verge is a non-starter, storm drains, rubbish, loose screenings etc make it far too dangerous to do so which is why you will see most cyclists sitting at least a metre from the verge.

In terms of riding as a group it is impracticable and a lot less safe to ride in single file as it makes the overtake distance a lot longer than it would be for a single large bunch, the logic of cycling groups is that it is safer to bunch up than to make a long continuous line as it is less dangerous.

Again I don't understand why there is so much angst about this as I get held up by cyclists only on a very rare occasion and when I have been held up it might be for at the very maximum 5 minutes. Also this has always occurred at off peak times, usually on a saturday/sunday morning.

Are there people who are being held up for long periods of time on a regular basis?
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: Milltown Row2 on August 04, 2017, 02:38:14 PM
This thread has to be the biggest wind up!!!
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: Keyser soze on August 04, 2017, 02:42:03 PM
Quote from: Taylor on August 04, 2017, 02:24:50 PM
Quote from: Fat Angry Motorist on August 04, 2017, 02:05:58 PM
Quote from: Taylor on August 04, 2017, 01:55:47 PM
Quote from: Mayo4Sam on August 04, 2017, 01:44:13 PM
I pay tax, lots of it, my taxes pay for the roads

Where do you stand on tractors? Should they be allowed on the road? By your rationale they pay motor tax so they should but I'd cycle quicker than a tractor

On the whole tractor drivers:

1. respect the rules of the road &
2. let cars past where possible

Same cant be said for cyclists on either count

I honestly think cyclists breaking the rules of the road comes from them being, and maybe observing, drivers in the first place.

Hopping onto kerbs when there is a red light wouldnt be a done thing for drivers?

Moving across the road when someone attempts to overtake you wouldnt be a done thing either with drivers?

Are you saying that cyclists do that? I've never seen a cyclist do either of those things and I would say you hardly have either given the paucity of traffic lights in Tyrone lol.

For the latter anybody that would do that obviously has a death wish if they did that deliberately.

Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: Fat Angry Motorist on August 04, 2017, 02:42:20 PM
Quote from: Taylor on August 04, 2017, 02:24:50 PM
Quote from: Fat Angry Motorist on August 04, 2017, 02:05:58 PM
Quote from: Taylor on August 04, 2017, 01:55:47 PM
Quote from: Mayo4Sam on August 04, 2017, 01:44:13 PM
I pay tax, lots of it, my taxes pay for the roads

Where do you stand on tractors? Should they be allowed on the road? By your rationale they pay motor tax so they should but I'd cycle quicker than a tractor

On the whole tractor drivers:

1. respect the rules of the road &
2. let cars past where possible

Same cant be said for cyclists on either count

I honestly think cyclists breaking the rules of the road comes from them being, and maybe observing, drivers in the first place.

Hopping onto kerbs when there is a red light wouldnt be a done thing for drivers?

Moving across the road when someone attempts to overtake you wouldnt be a done thing either with drivers?

Does a cyclist riding on the footpath (which is illegal) really affect motorists that much?  As pointed out above you should be giving a cyclist the same room as you would a car to overtake so why would a cyclist veer across the white line just to annoy you?

I think you'll be a much happier bunny if you follow the rules and guidelines of the highway code yourself?

Rule 212
When passing motorcyclists and cyclists, give them plenty of room (see Rules 162 to 167). If they look over their shoulder it could mean that they intend to pull out, turn right or change direction. Give them time and space to do so.

Rule 213
Motorcyclists and cyclists may suddenly need to avoid uneven road surfaces and obstacles such as drain covers or oily, wet or icy patches on the road. Give them plenty of room and pay particular attention to any sudden change of direction they may have to make
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: Fat Angry Motorist on August 04, 2017, 02:43:58 PM
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on August 04, 2017, 02:38:14 PM
This thread has to be the biggest wind up!!!

Some are serious, some are on the wind up!  There's a couple of posters here who must spend their days driving around the country looking for cyclists to get offended by!
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: Milltown Row2 on August 04, 2017, 02:51:51 PM
Most groups are out on the roads Sat or Sunday at around 7.30 am and finished up before 11 or 12pm during the week you wont get that much either, mornings provided they are dry ya might get the odd nut goingt to work on his bike and in Belfast since the Belfst bike hire there are more but as yet Ive not seen anything thats annoying... during the winter there are hardly anyone out due to the frost/rain/and the dark nights and mornings

So they are either looking for these cyclists all the time, has happened to them once or twice and they have multiplied it by a hundred or they are just grump fat farts who will gripe at anything... I'm going for all of the above
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: Fat Angry Motorist on August 04, 2017, 03:28:53 PM
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on August 04, 2017, 02:51:51 PM
Most groups are out on the roads Sat or Sunday at around 7.30 am and finished up before 11 or 12pm during the week you wont get that much either, mornings provided they are dry ya might get the odd nut goingt to work on his bike and in Belfast since the Belfst bike hire there are more but as yet Ive not seen anything thats annoying... during the winter there are hardly anyone out due to the frost/rain/and the dark nights and mornings

So they are either looking for these cyclists all the time, has happened to them once or twice and they have multiplied it by a hundred or they are just grump fat farts who will gripe at anything... I'm going for all of the above

My ranking:

grumpy fat farts who will gripe at anything - 1
has happened to them once or twice and they have multiplied it by a hundred - 2
they are either looking for these cyclists all the time - 3




Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: Eamonnca1 on August 04, 2017, 05:55:48 PM
All-Ireland champion whingers, the whole bloody lot of them.
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: Eamonnca1 on August 04, 2017, 09:15:49 PM
Quote from: Taylor on August 04, 2017, 02:24:50 PM

Hopping onto kerbs when there is a red light wouldnt be a done thing for drivers?

I love it when drivers give out about cyclists on the footpath. They seem to spend one half of their lives roaring at riders to get off the road, and the other half whinging about it when they do.
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: bennydorano on August 09, 2017, 04:12:06 PM
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/av/uk-england-london-40860045/putney-bridge-cctv-of-jogger-pushing-woman-in-front-of-bus

Thought this would be appropriate in this thread considering the hysteria and what not.
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: Gabriel_Hurl on August 09, 2017, 04:33:57 PM
probably more appropriate in the running thread
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: bennydorano on August 09, 2017, 05:11:21 PM
If you read the nonsense on this thread it's very appropriate here in an inappropriate way.
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: Milltown Row2 on August 09, 2017, 06:25:58 PM
I'm a runner and if you are trying to get a pb and some bird is in your path then I'd push her too!! Pedestrians are nasty and ignorant to runners, fat lazy feckers who just walk, must be a drain on the NHS also! Cycle paths runner paths and walkers should just get the Bus  :o
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: Eamonnca1 on August 09, 2017, 07:11:56 PM
She should have been walking single file!
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: mrdeeds on August 09, 2017, 07:39:21 PM
Watch it back carefully and it looks like she tries to trip him.
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: Dire Ear on August 23, 2017, 04:11:54 PM
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-41028321
A cyclist who knocked over and killed a 44 year-old woman in east London last year has been cleared of her manslaughter.
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: punt kick on August 23, 2017, 04:42:29 PM
Quote from: Dire Ear on August 23, 2017, 04:11:54 PM
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-41028321
A cyclist who knocked over and killed a 44 year-old woman in east London last year has been cleared of her manslaughter.

He should sue her family for her being in his way.
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: Eamonnca1 on August 23, 2017, 05:35:04 PM
Quote from: Dire Ear on August 23, 2017, 04:11:54 PM
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-41028321
A cyclist who knocked over and killed a 44 year-old woman in east London last year has been cleared of her manslaughter.

And how many car drivers killed pedestrians since then? Hundreds of pedestrians are killed by car drivers every year and there's not a word about it, but you always hear about the one cyclist in ten years who killed a pedestrian.

"In the 12 months between 2013 and 2014, the number of pedestrian fatalities on the road went up by 12%, from 398 to 446, whilst the number who were seriously injured rose by 1.3% to 5,063. Minor injuries impacted upon 19,923 people."
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: Fat Angry Motorist on August 25, 2017, 03:06:07 PM
Quote from: Dire Ear on August 23, 2017, 04:11:54 PM
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-41028321
A cyclist who knocked over and killed a 44 year-old woman in east London last year has been cleared of her manslaughter.

This was an interesting case that has attracted a lot of media coverage i suppose cos it's rare for something this to happen.  Sounds to me like tthe verdict was probably right.  I do a bit of cycling now and again and this time I agree with the husband of the victim.  Though he was acquitted of manslaughter the cyclist was convicted under some law that dates from 1861 and was meant to cover the driving of horse and carts.  The law needs updated and I think cyclists should be brought under the modern laws that cover cars etc where that is relevant.

This guy came across as a bit of a dick and though that's not against the law, riding this type of track bike on the road is, and he was in the wrong even if he hadn't hit anyone, that's why theyre called track bikes.  The prosecution accepted taht the victim has stepped out into the road in front of the cyclist about 6m away and then stepped back into his path as they tried to avoid one another but argued that if the bike had front brakes he would have been able to stop and the court accepted this.  But it looked like he's going to get a spell at her maj's pleasure.

A rare enough case but to cyclists - track bikes belong on the track, they're built for speed, don't ride them on the road especially in a city.

Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: haranguerer on August 25, 2017, 04:26:02 PM
He did come across as an awful p***k, but the charge seems to be a load of bollocks imo.

What does wanton and furious driving have to do with him having a front brake or not? That's what he was charged with, and its completely separate to your (and most other peoples) justification for the punishment. The braking distances claimed are questionable too, as is the fact as to whether its even the right course of action to brake at all. Populist decision to prosecute, ridiculous to try to initially go for manslaughter.

Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: Eamonnca1 on August 25, 2017, 04:49:59 PM
Reminds me of the case of a fella who was riding his bike under the speed limit but still got done under an archaic law for "pedaling furiously."
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: yellowcard on August 25, 2017, 04:57:17 PM
What is the rule on cycling on motorways? I regularly see cyclists on the hardshoulder of the M1 Belfast-Dublin. If it is not illegal then I think it should be. Come to think of it, tractors and other such slow moving machinery should also be banned from motorways as it is highly dangerous for vehicles travelling at such a slow speed on a fast moving road.
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: Eamonnca1 on August 25, 2017, 05:10:01 PM
Quote from: yellowcard on August 25, 2017, 04:57:17 PM
What is the rule on cycling on motorways? I regularly see cyclists on the hardshoulder of the M1 Belfast-Dublin. If it is not illegal then I think it should be. Come to think of it, tractors and other such slow moving machinery should also be banned from motorways as it is highly dangerous for vehicles travelling at such a slow speed on a fast moving road.

Allowed on dual carriageways, not allowed on motorways. I think the rule is you have to be capable of 50mph to be allowed on a motorway.
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: punt kick on August 26, 2017, 11:03:31 AM
Quote from: Eamonnca1 on August 25, 2017, 04:49:59 PM
Reminds me of the case of a fella who was riding his bike under the speed limit but still got done under an archaic law for "pedaling furiously."

Slap it up him.
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: bennydorano on August 29, 2017, 01:07:10 PM
https://amp.theguardian.com/environment/bike-blog/2017/aug/29/is-the-uk-really-menaced-by-reckless-cyclists
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: Puckoon on August 29, 2017, 06:22:35 PM
http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-41081756 (http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-41081756)

Seems like Chris Hoy might need his mouth taxed...

Olympic legend Sir Chris Hoy says Lycra can look "awful" on anyone weighing more than 8st (49kg) and that amateur cyclists don't have to pull on a pair of tight-fitting shorts to look good. Is he right?

It is a question that many amateur cyclists will have asked at some point: does my belly/legs/bum* (*delete as appropriate) look big in this?

But according to Sir Chris - the six-time Olympic gold winning cyclist - not enough people think before pulling on a pair of Lycra leggings.

"Lycra isn't the most elegant material you can wear and professional cycling gear generally looks awful on pretty much anyone heavier than 8st," he wrote in GQ magazine.

He said the desire of so-called "mamils" - the dreaded middle-aged man in Lycra - to be seen in the latest high-performance Team Sky cycling kit all too often results in a tummy-turning experience for onlookers.




"Personally, I feel sorry for mamils," he wrote. "When they walk into a cafe dressed head-to-toe in Lycra, you always spot people sniggering at them."

So what do cyclists make of that?


Tom RochesterImage copyright Tom Rochester
Image caption
Tom, right, began cycling four years ago

Tom Rochester, 48, from Norfolk, weighed almost 28st when he took up cycling four years ago.

He did so wearing a 15-year-old pair of ill-fitting rugby shorts and an equally ill-fitting T-shirt.

Tom says his cobbled together cycling outfit did nothing for his self-confidence - or help his efforts on the bike.

He believes he would have packed his bike away for good within a few weeks if he had not found something more suitable to wear.

"When I did that first 25-mile ride with a couple of thousand other cyclists all in Lycra I was conscious that although I was trying to achieve something and better myself that I was probably the most ill-dressed person there."

"There is a sense of empowerment with it," he says about pulling on his fitted Lycra outfit.

"If you feel that you look good then you are halfway there."

'Dad's old jumper'

When Karen Wheeler first started cycling four years ago, the only clothes she could find to fit her were men's extra-large clothing from Tesco.

It made her feel like she was wearing one of her dad's "old jumpers".

"I felt like I looked like a fat bird who was trying to lose weight," she says.

The 50-year-old from Chichester weighs almost 20st and now cycles about three times a week.

She says wearing properly fitting Lycra clothing makes her feel "like a cyclist" and is disappointed by Sir Chris's comments.

"It is about looking good and it is about how it makes you feel on your bike," she adds. "I don't actually care what everybody else thinks about me because I feel I look good in it."


Sir Chris HoyImage copyright PA
Image caption
Sir Chris Hoy was regularly seen in Lycra during his track cycling career

Lynn Bye co-founded Fat Lad At The Back alongside her husband, Richard.

It sells cycling clothes for the "larger lads and lasses", with items fitting people up to a 60-inch waist or chest. She says her largest items would be regarded as a XXXXXXXXXXL size in most shops.

Expecting cyclists who are overweight to be happy to wear jogging bottoms and a T-shirt on a ride is self-defeating, she says. They will get hotter more quickly than in specialist wear and can feel alienated among other riders.

"It is difficult for somebody who comes from an elite cycling background to just say 'you can wear what you want'.

"It is like a supermodel saying you can wear what you want. But to a lot of people it makes a difference."

She added: "What we have found is a lot of people want to get into cycling, they've gone out to buy an XXXL top and tried it on in the changing room and it looks ridiculous," she says.

"We find that making people feel part of the cycling community makes them feel like they belong and makes them feel like they should be doing it."


Team Sky at the Spain's La VueltaImage copyright EPA
Image caption
So-called mamils often look like Team Sky wannabes, Sir Chris said

However, Pete Reynolds, a blogger who writes about cycling styles, says Sir Chris's comments have a point.

Pete, who is originally from Liverpool but currently lives in Berlin, says the British attitude to cycling - and particularly about what to wear while on two wheels - is very different to the attitudes of our Continental cousins.

"If you go to other places in Europe - in Amsterdam, or Copenhagen, or here in Berlin - people are riding around in everyday clothing," he says.

"I think people in the UK see cycling as a sport rather than a means of transport," he says, adding: "I think it creates an image of cycling that is undesirable and unattainable."

He also says the sight of a cyclist in full kit may also dehumanise them.

"When people are setting out in their full gear they don't look human. In Europe it is just a person on a bike rather than 'a cyclist'."

He says there has been a mini-revolution in what is available for cyclists to wear on rides, with specialist jeans and shirts available in lighter, more suitable materials.

"In the UK, we are associating cycling with riding the Tour de France," he adds, "and it is making it seem much harder than it should be to a lot of people."
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: Eamonnca1 on August 29, 2017, 07:10:50 PM
D*ckhead. Would he prefer riders to wear soccer shorts with a plumber's cleavage sticking out the back?
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: Eamonnca1 on August 29, 2017, 07:11:48 PM
Quote from: bennydorano on August 29, 2017, 01:07:10 PM
https://amp.theguardian.com/environment/bike-blog/2017/aug/29/is-the-uk-really-menaced-by-reckless-cyclists

No. It's menaced by reckless drivers.

Next question.
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: Hardy on August 30, 2017, 09:00:11 AM
Quote from: Eamonnca1 on August 29, 2017, 07:10:50 PM
D*ckhead. Would he prefer riders to wear soccer shorts with a plumber's cleavage sticking out the back?

Yes - those are the two options.
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: Eamonnca1 on August 30, 2017, 04:58:42 PM
If you want to look ridiculous on a bike then go right ahead and wear your soccer shorts. I'll stick to the gear that was actually designed for cycling.
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: thebigfella on August 30, 2017, 05:09:30 PM
Quote from: Eamonnca1 on August 30, 2017, 04:58:42 PM
If you want to look ridiculous on a bike then go right ahead and wear your soccer shorts. I'll stick to the gear that was actually designed for cycling.

Designed for 8 stone cyclists though and not fat fcuks
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: haveaharp on August 30, 2017, 05:14:36 PM
Aye that's why it's stretchy
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: Eamonnca1 on August 30, 2017, 06:23:09 PM
I don't care what they wear. I have more respect for a fat person on a bike and trying to get slimmer than a fat person sitting on a couch drinking a can of Harp, smoking a packet of Woodbines, eating KFC Bargain Bucket, and watching football on TV while he makes himself even bigger.

S'funny how it was always the cider louts at the side of the street that were the quickest to shout "get those f****g knees up" while you ride past. This thread has brought that crowd out in force. Nothing but a shower of good-for-nothing shell-suit-wearing dole-scrounging gulpins the whole blllllloody lot of ya!
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: AZOffaly on August 30, 2017, 06:29:56 PM
Quote from: Eamonnca1 on August 30, 2017, 06:23:09 PM
I don't care what they wear. I have more respect for a fat person on a bike and trying to get slimmer than a fat person sitting on a couch drinking a can of Harp, smoking a packet of Woodbines, eating KFC Bargain Bucket, and watching football on TV while he makes himself even bigger.

S'funny how it was always the cider louts at the side of the street that were the quickest to shout "get those f****g knees up" while you ride past. This thread has brought that crowd out in force. Nothing but a shower of good-for-nothing shell-suit-wearing dole-scrounging gulpins the whole blllllloody lot of ya!

Nice. It's good the way America has made you more thoughtful and balanced. Must be all that California fresh air.
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: Eamonnca1 on August 30, 2017, 07:44:01 PM
Quote from: AZOffaly on August 30, 2017, 06:29:56 PM
Nice. It's good the way America has made you more thoughtful and balanced. Must be all that California fresh air.

It is. I'm actually reminiscing about the gobsh*tes that would shout abuse at me or anyone exercising when I lived in England. The same boys wouldn't be able to run the length of themselves.

Here in California it's considered normal to be out for a run or a spin on the bike and you don't get young ones standing about on street corners like you would in Manchester.
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: Ball Hopper on August 30, 2017, 07:51:46 PM
Quote from: Eamonnca1 on August 30, 2017, 07:44:01 PM
Quote from: AZOffaly on August 30, 2017, 06:29:56 PM
Nice. It's good the way America has made you more thoughtful and balanced. Must be all that California fresh air.

It is. I'm actually reminiscing about the gobsh*tes that would shout abuse at me or anyone exercising when I lived in England. The same boys wouldn't be able to run the length of themselves.

Here in California it's considered normal to be out for a run or a spin on the bike and you don't get young ones standing about on street corners like you would in Manchester.

Speaking of lycra...you running North American finals in SF this weekend, Eamo?

Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: johnneycool on August 31, 2017, 12:06:17 PM
Quote from: thebigfella on August 30, 2017, 05:09:30 PM
Quote from: Eamonnca1 on August 30, 2017, 04:58:42 PM
If you want to look ridiculous on a bike then go right ahead and wear your soccer shorts. I'll stick to the gear that was actually designed for cycling.

Designed for 8 stone cyclists though and not fat fcuks

I thought they do other sizes, there you go.

Say what you like but you need the padded shorts on for any sort of comfort. The O'Neills range just doesn't cut it when your nads and gooch are in bits.
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: Keyser soze on August 31, 2017, 01:21:25 PM
It's not like you would ever see anyone over 8 stone in soccer gear lol. And most of them haven't been on a pitch in decades, if ever.   
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: GJL on August 31, 2017, 02:32:40 PM
I started cycling in June. My a$$ is only now getting used to it. You need the padded shorts...believe me.
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: thebigfella on August 31, 2017, 05:05:28 PM
I don't think anyone said padded shorts are needed, just the road cycling gear is designed for the more athletic cyclist  ;)

Mountain biking shorts etc... are just as suitable and look way better on heavier cyclists.
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: Eamonnca1 on August 31, 2017, 06:27:32 PM
Quote from: Ball Hopper on August 30, 2017, 07:51:46 PM
Speaking of lycra...you running North American finals in SF this weekend, Eamo?

Not running the show but I'll be there on Sat and Sun armed with my camera. Will you be about?
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: Ball Hopper on August 31, 2017, 07:34:54 PM
Quote from: Eamonnca1 on August 31, 2017, 06:27:32 PM
Quote from: Ball Hopper on August 30, 2017, 07:51:46 PM
Speaking of lycra...you running North American finals in SF this weekend, Eamo?

Not running the show but I'll be there on Sat and Sun armed with my camera. Will you be about?

Might be in on Sunday...very warm weather expected.
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: Eamonnca1 on August 31, 2017, 08:48:45 PM
Can blow hot and cold on the island. Once that evening fog comes in...
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: mrdeeds on August 31, 2017, 09:28:04 PM
As if Chris Hoy was 8 stone. Most sprinters would be well over 8 stone.
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: illdecide on August 31, 2017, 10:11:20 PM
Quote from: mrdeeds on August 31, 2017, 09:28:04 PM
As if Chris Hoy was 8 stone. Most sprinters would be well over 8 stone.

The cheeky bollix is about 16 stone
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: highorlow on December 12, 2017, 03:28:04 PM
http://www.thejournal.ie/cyclists-protest-dismount-signs-luas-3746077-Dec2017/

Good lord. It's only a small little section of the system. Moaners.
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: laoislad on December 12, 2017, 04:09:08 PM
Quote from: highorlow on December 12, 2017, 03:28:04 PM
http://www.thejournal.ie/cyclists-protest-dismount-signs-luas-3746077-Dec2017/

Good lord. It's only a small little section of the system. Moaners.
Cnuts.
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: Eamonnca1 on December 12, 2017, 09:03:54 PM
Quote from: highorlow on December 12, 2017, 03:28:04 PM
http://www.thejournal.ie/cyclists-protest-dismount-signs-luas-3746077-Dec2017/

Good lord. It's only a small little section of the system. Moaners.

We'll make you get out and push your car through "only a small little section of the system" and we'll see how well you respond to it.
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: highorlow on December 12, 2017, 09:26:11 PM
I pay my car tax. Can't they cycle through trinity college?

I'd rather hear solutions from cyclists rather than a constant whine fest.
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: Eamonnca1 on December 12, 2017, 11:17:42 PM
Oh please! The biggest whiners have always been car drivers. You only have to read this thread to see youse whining like wounded puppies about the site of a five minute protest (that didn't impact the vast majority of you). The only reason youse are getting bent out of shape about this is cyclists are finally making their voices heard and they're starting to stick up for themselves. Suck it up, you whining pack of petulant crybabies!
Title: Re: Is it finally time to tax our Lycra clad cyclists ?
Post by: illdecide on December 13, 2017, 09:18:12 AM
Quote from: highorlow on December 12, 2017, 09:26:11 PM
I pay my car tax. Can't they cycle through trinity college?

I'd rather hear solutions from cyclists rather than a constant whine fest.

Buy a car with less emissions and you'll pay little too no tax...that's what you're taxed on and have been for a long time.