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Whatever about your Dublin friends Lar I dont remember Liam doing much wrong in 88. He was targeted too and took a hammering and still with only one arm any use he was sent in ff and got a goal with another disallowed as far as I remember. I remember meeting him the Tuesday night after and his shoulder and back looked like he d been in a car crash.

I remember some gammy Dublin midfielders in my time. Likes of Jim Ronayne and Declan Bolger were no Christmas tree fairies.

Back to McHale. He did nt play club until minor and his feet never really caught up. But I would argue that he still scored more than Willie Joe including at least 2 championship goals. I dont recollect Willie Joe ever score a championship goal. Not having a go at WJP but his distribution could be wicked while very few players have McHale's radar on the field. His link with Nallen v Kerry in 96 perfect.

McHale could never make a fist of full-forward for some reason. Johnno started this failed initiative 91 in the Hyde. McHale was started at ff even though we were playing into a gale and Killoran and Newton took command at midfield against TJ and a young Colm Mac I think. It was silly stuff and still annoys me to this day.

I would say he was the most effective Mayo player on view that day against Meath.The only fault one could find was
his insistence on trying to solo at every opportunity and the poor fist he made of it. But in most other respects
he was very good and Meath had  men deployed to watch him like a hawk. The pulling and dragging was something
fierce and I'm surprised how much dirt he put up with-or the ref let Meath away with.
I wasn't too impressed either with Liam's colleagues who were content to stand back and leave him to fight it out
with two or three opponents every time he went for a ball.
I give him great credit for the effort he was to put in over the years to improve all aspects of his game. I'd say
that by '96 he was the most complete all rounder in the country.

I would certainly have him in front of WJ when both were at their peak and that is the height of praise for any man.
But WJ was at his peak or thereabouts for a much longer period and he was never to play with a team of the calibre of the side in '96. Only Ciaran Mac in later years could match Liam for his radar  and both were far ahead of any others I have seen. Unfortunately, they both shared another trait and that was their unreliability when taking shots at goal.
That was always a problem with Willie Joe; his brain and his boots didn't always work in harmony.
I had always assumed that Liam's reluctance or maybe downright refusal to play FF was the reason he didn't move in there.

Compliments to the sensible majority above.

Just another thing I'd like to add. It can be very dangerous to take what someone puts up here and judge them as a person on it. I was and am guilty of that myself. Lets take Sligonian. To a man all the Sligo posters fell out with him and I must admit I thought he was a complete numbskull at one time. Since then I've emailed, pm'ed and spoken to the lad and I must admit I was completely wrong. I don't always agree with his views or the way he goes about things and he knows that. we still disagree but I understand him a bit better and see that sometimes things get taken up a way he doesn't want them to. He's well able to fight his own battles and doesn't need me to say this (hope he's not annoyed I did) but I just wanted to. Its worth bearing in mind. I read all the threads like Nixon/O'Shea but don't get involved cos there's nothing to add.

All very valid points, seanie.
I did take Sligonian for a total WUM at one stage but when I mentioned this some time ago, a few of you Sligo lads took the trouble to PM me and filled me in. I’d also add than when I did make enquiries about Ray Tully and Nace O’Dowd, I got 4 PMs in reply that gave me the information I was seeking and I certainly appreciate this.
I was just trying to get Sligoian to somehow understand that he would not be welcome on any topic anywhere if he kept on barging in any playing the same tiresome tune over and over again- even when discussing Sligo matters with Sligo posters.
For me, there are two problems whenever he sets up his stall.
Mayo threads get a wide readership and being indiscreet, like on the Nixon/ O’Shea topic, can be dangerous. Firstly, he can provoke a hostile reaction from Mayo lads who don’t know anything about him and every Sligo and Rossie poster here could feel insulted; things could get very nasty indeed. None us from Connacht can afford to look down on anyone else now or indeed at any time.
Secondly, he has a habit of making very wild statements and from past experience I know that those can become even more dangerous as time goes on if he isn’t pulled up. Insinuations about the integrity of anyone on the Connacht Council might become direct accusations if let go unchallenged.
I have tried to shoo him off onto a thread of his own. The readership there wouldn’t be so much of a problem. I quite like the lad and I don’t mind him at all but I just wish he wasn’t so dedicated to his cause.
Rossfan is no bother to me at all. He can take it as well as give it but he could think of something fresh to stir up a bit of banter once in a while.
He can be brilliant on some threads over in the general section when he takes on some of the Unionist posters and gives them his unique slant on Irish history. If only we had more like him, the Northern problem would have been solved long ago. The whole blessed place would have been blown up by now!

[Liam played against the Dubs in ’85 and he was as ungainly and awkward as could be]

Thats fair enough, I can understand your line of thinking but WJP makes your list  ahead of McHale even though you say McHale was the best mid-fielder we ever had....

Willie Joe again has two All-Stars, and had the versitility of playing in the forwards and rarely went a game without getting a score. He played from 1977-1992 (I think) and would just shave it ahead of McHale in my book.

For my tuppence worth, Liam was indeed the best midfielder we have had – but only for a limited time.
He was a slow developer and only reached his full potential around the time of the ’96 final. He had spent a long number of years getting there, whereas Wilie Joe rose to the top and stayed there for a much longer spell.
Liam played against the Dubs in ’85 and he was as ungainly and awkward as could be. The Dub supporters jeered every time he tried to solo and I’m afraid they had good reason to. But he was able to gain possession and distribute the ball better than anyone else even then. His timing and his ability with the ball in his hand was undisputed but once he tried any sort of footwork, his inexperience showed up. Fair dues to him, he persevered and by ’96 he was almost the finished article but he was never good at shooting for points. Like Ciaran Mac was to be, he scored some spectacular long range ones alright but he missed far more from easy positions and he did insist on having a go when he could have been better off passing it to a better placed colleague.
Shooting did not come easily to Liam but he insisted on having a go far too many times. 
Willie Joe was consistent and never failed to give it his best shot and I cannot recall a single game where he was outplayed by any marker from any other county. You could also add that Mayo had the best defence in the country in the mid 90s and Liam had plenty of able colleagues to help him out, whereas the same couldn’t be said for Wilie Joe. There were always some good players behind him but Liam had generally better all around support.
I would be very glad to have either back right now but I wouldn’t attempt to compare them one to one. Different times and different teams, I guess.

Lar I don't think Liam played in those games in 1985. I always thought his 1st appearance in Croker was against Monaghan in the League quarter final in 1986.

Accordng to http://mayogaablog.com/?p=2749 this was the team against Roscommon in the Connacht Final and I don't think Liam McHale came in after that.

MAYO: Eugene Lavin; Martin Carney, Peter Forde, Dermot Flanagan; Frank Noone, John Maughan, John Finn; TJ Kilgallon, WJ Padden; Henry Gavin (0-1), Jimmy Burke, Noel Durcan (1-1); Kevin McStay (0-7, five frees, one ‘50’), Sean Lowry (1-0), Eugene McHale (0-2).  Subs: Padraig Brogan for Gavin, Des McHale for Brogan, Billy Fitzpatrick for McHale.

Geez, muppet, I stand corrected here.
It was the semi against Meath in ‘88 that I was referring to.
I was in with a crowd of Dublin fans up on the Cusack for that game and I got almighty stick from the whole effin lot of them every time Liam looked down at his boots so that’s why  the Dubs jeering stuck in my mind.

I was at the semis in ’85 and ’88 so I’m afraid I mixed them up.

Abbeysider,
Colm Mac was a great player without doubt. He was tireless and never, ever slackened off- a lot like Shane Ryan for Dublin in more recent times. But for all of that, he was very awkward and inaccurate in his passing and shooting.
Right now, the chances of a bit of domestic harmony for the foreseeable future is about as remote as Mayo’s chances of an All Ireland - or the possibility of Sligonian shutting up. 
Here’s another quote for ya and it comes straight from the heart;_

“Women are meant to be loved; not understood.”
That was Oscar Wilde’s opinion and right now I’m in full agreement with him- on this one anyway!

Willie Joe... Liam McHale...
I would be very glad to have either back right now but I wouldn’t attempt to compare them one to one. Different times and different teams, I guess.

Jez Lar I dont know about that.
Sure Willie Joe must be in his 50's at this stage and McHale would probably be in his 40's would he?

It would be a big ask... 

First of all, if I don't get away from this computer, I've just been told I better go and graze the long acre if I want to get any dinner.
Do you ever hear that one before.
With regard to Liam and Willie Joe, I could give you a very direct answer to that one but I don't want to offend a townie of yours any more than I have to!

Thats fair enough, I can understand your line of thinking but WJP makes your list  ahead of McHale even though you say McHale was the best mid-fielder we ever had....

Willie Joe again has two All-Stars, and had the versitility of playing in the forwards and rarely went a game without getting a score. He played from 1977-1992 (I think) and would just shave it ahead of McHale in my book.

For my tuppence worth, Liam was indeed the best midfielder we have had – but only for a limited time.
He was a slow developer and only reached his full potential around the time of the ’96 final. He had spent a long number of years getting there, whereas Wilie Joe rose to the top and stayed there for a much longer spell.
Liam played against the Dubs in ’85 and he was as ungainly and awkward as could be. The Dub supporters jeered every time he tried to solo and I’m afraid they had good reason to. But he was able to gain possession and distribute the ball better than anyone else even then. His timing and his ability with the ball in his hand was undisputed but once he tried any sort of footwork, his inexperience showed up. Fair dues to him, he persevered and by ’96 he was almost the finished article but he was never good at shooting for points. Like Ciaran Mac was to be, he scored some spectacular long range ones alright but he missed far more from easy positions and he did insist on having a go when he could have been better off passing it to a better placed colleague.
Shooting did not come easily to Liam but he insisted on having a go far too many times. 
Willie Joe was consistent and never failed to give it his best shot and I cannot recall a single game where he was outplayed by any marker from any other county. You could also add that Mayo had the best defence in the country in the mid 90s and Liam had plenty of able colleagues to help him out, whereas the same couldn’t be said for Wilie Joe. There were always some good players behind him but Liam had generally better all around support.
I would be very glad to have either back right now but I wouldn’t attempt to compare them one to one. Different times and different teams, I guess.

I too remember where I was at the time I heard the news and I was very close to tears when I was told it by a garda at a checkpoint in sheep country. I  was coming down from Dublin to visit the parents that day. We happened to know each other and he first told me to pull in and switch off the engine as he had some shocking news for me. He had tears in his eyes and I was unable to drive on for a good ten minutes when he told me John had been shot.
The respect and admiration for that man was unbelievable and it would be impossible to explain this to anyone who is too young to remember him in his prime.
I know damn well the ref that day saw it all but pretended not to notice. It was well known that John Morley was fearless but wouldn't hurt a child. If he ran after Pateen, Pateen deserved it and I heard no complaints from a single Galwegian either.

Here is the problem with a thread like this (other than the typo in the heading), there are a lot of Sligo and Ros posters who aren't delusional keyboard warriors like the two mentioned above.

But a thread like this might get their backs up which is not really desirable.

That's my opinion also.
I don't mind taking the gruesome twosome on anytime but there are extremely sound lads (and lassies?) from both Sligo and Roscommon on here and I do not want to offend them. Trying to talk sense to Sligonian is like trying to get milk from a bull and he won't get the "irony" one little bit so you're only likely to insult Seanie or Owenmoresider and others like them.
Same applies to Turlough and ross matt and several other Rossie fans; apart from the odd bit of banter that most of us get up to, they add to any discussion without provoking hostility anywhere.

Probably sorting out his friday night with Roger and Evil Genius

I think youll find Rossfan is there already. At least I hope he is for I keep on asking him to go back the general section and let Roger have another blast of Rossie logic.
EG is one of the ablest debaters I have ever come across and I can't draw him into a clash with the Rossie at all. Roger is able too but very straightfaced and doesn't pick react to banter at all.
He doesn't seem able to cope with Rossfan at all (Does any of us?) and he goes ape when hit by a bit of Roscommon wit. I'd forget about trying to smarten Sligonian up any day if I thought Roiger and Rossfan were having another intellectual exchange.

There is something unnatural about an alliance between Sligonian and Rossfan.

Ihate ya, Muppet; why didn't I think of that!

Older informed opinion would lead one to believe that Padraic Carney and John Morley were great as was Tom Langan as a ff. Flanagan a brilliant leader and organiser/tactician.

In my time Willie Joe stands out as does McDonald and McHale, because even on an ordinary day for him he was usually the most influential player on the field. Then there s Nallen of course.

Those that were great losses to the county were Brogan, Ted Webb and Ger Geraghty.
Geraghty was probably the most complete player the last 30-40 years. He was the best player on the u21 team of 84 which had a few very good players.

Moysider, Do you remember the time Morley lost the rag with Pateen Donnellan and chased after him down the sideline in Mchale Park? It was a CF, I think and Pateen was up to what Pateen did best. He was being a sneakyy little git.
Anyhow, he floored one of our smaller lads- Gay Nevin, I think and Morley saw it. With a roar  you''d hear behind the Reek, he made for Donnellan, who took off like a frightened rabbiit for the safety of the endline and jumped in amongst a crowd of Galway supporters.
he had about 30 yards of a headstart but Morley was closing in fast before Pateen got away.
The ref apparently didn't see anything- fair dues to the man.

Geez, that's an impossible one to answer!
I think it all depends on when I saw them in action and on how I was feeling at the time. You'd then have to think of their inspirational effect on those around them as well as their actual level of football skill.
I know I'll never settle on any three (or 33) but I'll nominate:

Joe Corcoran
Willie Joe Padden
Ciaran McDonald

Dosen't Lar Naparka seem fair wise just because of his picture...jaysus i'd listen to anything he has to say

Janey, you seem to be following me about; I thought only Tubberman and Rossfan did that!

[some]

Jasus but there's some bitter twisted oul yokes from Mayo posting here.

Some??
Any one in particular getting under your fleece? 

Sean Flanagan
Tommy Langan
Ciaran McDonald

I can't believe people are leaving out Sean Flanagan and Tommy Langan. That'd be someone leaving Christy Ring out of the top 3 Cork hurlers, just because they hadn't seen him play.

You could be right about Sean Flanagan and Tom Langan but I doubt many here could go on anything other than hearsay.  If you were to consider them as candidates you could consider Padraig Carney from that era also. He was inducted into the Hall of Fame for his contribution to the GAA and I have never heard dissent from anyone who knew him from that time no matter where they hailed from.
Me oul' fella often told me Patsy Flannelly from the 30s- 40s era was untouchable and he also had the greatest of praise for Purty Kelly and Gerard Courell. His view was shared by just about all of his contemporaries that I spoke to.
I am surprised that Kevin Cahill hasn't turned up on anyone's list. We still have come nowhere close to finding someone to fill his boots.

[More bait for me Lar, I think I'll stop biting now.]

More bait for me Lar, I think I'll stop biting now.
Bet ya you won’t!

Fair play, Sligonian, I’m glad you can take a hint. (Phew!)
But somehow I don’t think you are gonna stop.
As always, I says it as I sees it and there is nothing deliberately insulting in anything I have said to you. But I was a good man beside a mixer in my day and I can keep shovelling it back as long as you care to throw it.
I have asked you several times to start your own thread where you can chew sour grapes until you get a dose of the runs.
Otherwise, you will keep your lament up here until Pierce Hanley is back in the green and red again.

The Sligo V Mayowestrossouthsligo thread will be some craic in May 2010. Chat ye then. Looking forward to it.
You may indeed be looking forward to it now but I doubt if you will be so upbeat when it arrives.
For one thing, I expect Tom Parsons to be the star of the Mayo team by then. That lad has serious potential and as long as he is playing class football with a class county, he can only improve. I wish we have a few more like him. Come to think of it, maybe we do have them. I’d keep any eye on the other 6 or 7 lads from his village that play for Charlestown.
Between Charlestown/Bellaghy and Ballagh, we could field a side that would bate the lard off any county in Connacht. Okay, maybe not the rest of Mayo, but Sligo or Roscommon wouldn’t be a bother, would they? 
You know what? While you and Rossfan are still loitering about the place, I just might start a thread myself. The topic will be to name the best three Mayo players that hail from Ballagh. (I wouldn’t want to ignore you either so maybe I’ll include Bellaghy as well.)
How about “Rhubarbs or Sour Grapes” for the title?
Anyone want to put a few suggestions forward?

Its antagonistic idiots like Sligonian and Rossfan that destroy these threads.
Pure and simple gutter posters that drag the whole thing down

No need for personal abuse you st***** bo**** of a ****

Thats typical pathetic personal abuse from an idiot poster from useless footballing county.
Your just like every Roscommon red-neck fan I ever met at a match.

Empty vessels....

I was making the point that yourself and Sligonian are antagonistic WUMs and you brought this topic to new lows.

We were discussing Nixon and the possibility of more young players joining the AFL but your quips about Hanly and Sligonian's pathetic digs re: Parsons brought the whole thread down.

Set-up another thread if you need to get something off your chest.

I hate to say it but im disappointed in the Mayo posters rising to this crap and taking the bate.
These arguments have gone on countless threads, and by arguing back on these topic we are all spoiling it and playing into the hand of these attentions seekers.

I know I am as much at fault as any two others put together but I’m an unreconstructable sadist and I can’t resist making them squeal!  They won’t go away and when the first two or three pages of any Mayo topic have been posted and most genuine posters have had their say, I can’t help it but I love to keep ‘em at it.
My sense of common sense is not nearly as well developed as my sense of smell.
I can get the scent of sour grapes as soon as it wafts across the border at Carracastle and boy, do I love it!
I would much prefer being called a rhubarb any day than a sour grape and I hope Rossfan has every reason to keep bitching till the end of time- or until he gets the chip off his shoulder, whichever is the longest. My money is on the latter.
I really don’t mind him at all- he’s probably a sound lad in other ways but he does suffer fom a severe dose of bedgrudgery arthritis and that’s an incurable disease.
In short, Rossfan can keep on bitching as long as Ballagh keeps on producing. 
Still, he comes in several grades above Sligonian in the cop on stakes.
I tease him from time to time on purely humanitarian grounds.
I’d be very much inclined to have him where we can keep an eye on him!
It would be no bother to him to start World War Three if he ever finds himself at a loose end amongst the Arabs out there.
I honestly believe humanity should thank Stephenite, myself and the others who work so hard to keep him out of harm’s way.