WC 2030 Bid

[Ed Ricketts]

https://www.nenaghguardian.ie/2021/03/03/mbappe-and-messi-to-grace-semple-stadium/

Whatbis it about Tipp and gombeen politicians

If Roger Milla can score World Cup goals at 42 then I'm sure Messi can too!

[thewobbler]

The thing that interests me more BB is the where the value lies in a large scale infrastructure project.

The majority of new grounds in the English Midlands where built to circa 30k capacity, because its plenty enough. Would the owners of Derby / Hull / Coventry / Mk Dons really want another 10,000 empty seats to maintain after an expensive joint venture?

Meanwhile who could really justify an expensive refit of creaking old grounds like Bramall Lane, Elland Road or City Ground?

Leicester's rise as football force marks them as the most suitable candidate.

That still leaves the bid with a location conundrum. And this has to play into Cork and Belfast's hands. The former probably has the need for a modern 40k capacity stadium, while the latter has an infrastructure project in a stage where it's going to happen anyway, and a large envelope would be welcomed by all.

[Baile Brigín 2]

The thing that interests me more BB is the where the value lies in a large scale infrastructure project.

The majority of new grounds in the English Midlands where built to circa 30k capacity, because its plenty enough. Would the owners of Derby / Hull / Coventry / Mk Dons really want another 10,000 empty seats to maintain after an expensive joint venture?

Meanwhile who could really justify an expensive refit of creaking old grounds like Bramall Lane, Elland Road or City Ground?

Leicester's rise as football force marks them as the most suitable candidate.

That still leaves the bid with a location conundrum. And this has to play into Cork and Belfast's hands. The former probably has the need for a modern 40k capacity stadium, while the latter has an infrastructure project in a stage where it's going to happen anyway, and a large envelope would be welcomed by all.

Isn't that exactly why the Nigels aren't going alone? No major infrastructure building required.

But if Hull or Derby can't justify a new stand how can you justify a new 40k stadium in Cork or Belfast? Who would use it? Lets not dwell on Casement but Turners Cross is a fine stadium and does what it needs to do. Rugby went with Limerick and PuC is way to big.

With the possible exception of Leeds who will be rebuilding anyway I can't see any significant stadium work for the bid. Which to repeat is the point

[sid waddell]

I suspect FIFA don't much like the idea of a World Cup using existing stadiums with little work done on them

They like grandiose projects with lots of new stadiums which are destined to end up as white elephants

South Africa, Brazil, Russia, Qatar, the US is an exception because it's the US

The South American bid would fit that bill for 2030

I think populations are rebelling against that idea though, and likely will be further into that line of thinking if and when this pandemic ends

The chain of events in Brazil which led to Bolsonaro winning began with protests in 2013 - anger at the amount of money being spent on World Cup stadiums was one of the driving forces of those protests

[sid waddell]

There are a litany of plastic bowls in England which can be fairly easily upgraded to 40k or more

Leicester, Derby, Middlesbrough, Southampton, Stoke, Reading, Hull etc

Ashton Gate in Bristol is not a plastic bowl but would be another possible candidate for upgrade

Molineux in Wolverhampton too

England could easily do this on their own if they wanted to

The political aspect is interesting - they clearly feel they've a better chance in terms of persuading people if they have Scotland, Wales, NI and particularly Ireland on board, though given our farcical record of bidding for major championships I don't know why they'd think that

5 automatic qualifications would surely be several bridges too far for FIFA and UEFA, especially with qualification places in Europe being at a premium

Whatever about Ireland, I don't see how NI would add anything at all to the bid

Two or three countries max seems logical, anything beyond that seems unwieldy, can't see Ireland being involved when it comes down to it

Most of those cities fall well short of the infrastructure criteria

Don't know about that

I'd say Leicester, Bristol, Southampton at least would be well capable

All of these places are on motorways with mostly high speed rail links

When you look at some of the places that have hosted World Cup matches of late and will do in 2022, I struggle to see how any of them would be behind

I mean how would Southampton or even Hull be behind Asuncion or Timisoara in terms of infrastructure

[Baile Brigín 2]

There are a litany of plastic bowls in England which can be fairly easily upgraded to 40k or more

Leicester, Derby, Middlesbrough, Southampton, Stoke, Reading, Hull etc

Ashton Gate in Bristol is not a plastic bowl but would be another possible candidate for upgrade

Molineux in Wolverhampton too

England could easily do this on their own if they wanted to

The political aspect is interesting - they clearly feel they've a better chance in terms of persuading people if they have Scotland, Wales, NI and particularly Ireland on board, though given our farcical record of bidding for major championships I don't know why they'd think that

5 automatic qualifications would surely be several bridges too far for FIFA and UEFA, especially with qualification places in Europe being at a premium

Whatever about Ireland, I don't see how NI would add anything at all to the bid

Two or three countries max seems logical, anything beyond that seems unwieldy, can't see Ireland being involved when it comes down to it

Most of those cities fall well short of the infrastructure criteria

Don't know about that

I'd say Leicester, Bristol, Southampton at least would be well capable

All of these places are on motorways with mostly high speed rail links

When you look at some of the places that have hosted World Cup matches of late and will do in 2022, I struggle to see how any of them would be behind

I mean how would Southampton or even Hull be behind Asuncion or Timisoara in terms of infrastructure

None of those cities have 40,000 seater stadia...

That's the point.  There aren't actually many eligible cities in England with the stadia. Loads with 30k.

[sid waddell]

But the point is they can be easily upgraded, they're mostly newbuilds with ample space to expand

None of the other bids currently have the requisite amount of stadiums

World Cups almost always require significant upgrading of stadiums

[Eamonnca1]

The Americans could have easily hosted a 48 team 2026 World Cup if they wanted to.

So why didn't they?

All but one venue is NFL. No soccer grounds

The USA currently has 18 soccer-specific stadiums, capacity ranges from 18,000 to 27,000. Quite a bit short of the 40,000 minimum needed for the World Cup, but still noteworthy.

[Eamonnca1]

The Americans could have easily hosted a 48 team 2026 World Cup if they wanted to.

So why didn't they?

All but one venue is NFL. No soccer grounds

I dunno - cost?
What does the fact they are using NFL stadiums have to do with it?

So which is it? Easy to do or too costly?

That college stadia aren't 'good enough' and soccer grounds are too small meaning that leaves them with a relatively small pool of stadia to chose from.

This is what college stadiums look like stateside:

[Baile Brigín 2]

Exactly. 50's builds, rarely roofed and ginormous. Do that job but not this job.

[seafoid]

https://www.nenaghguardian.ie/2021/03/03/mbappe-and-messi-to-grace-semple-stadium/

Whatbis it about Tipp and gombeen politicians

Hon Tipp

[sid waddell]

Exactly. 50's builds, rarely roofed and ginormous. Do that job but not this job.

The one photographed there is a 2006 build

Its predecessor on the same site hosted a World Cup and Superbowl

Most NFL grounds don't have a roof either

MetLife stadium doesn't have one and that's likely to stage the 2026 World Cup final

Personally I think college stadiums kick the ass of NFL stadiums in general

[dec]

The problem with most of the college stadiums from a World Cup perspective is the location. Tuscaloosa, Ann Arbor, College Station, Gainesville etc are not really cities that that tourists want to visit.

[Gabriel_Hurl]

Which is why - outside of the Rose Bowl - none are being used for venues in 2026

[sid waddell]

The problem with most of the college stadiums from a World Cup perspective is the location. Tuscaloosa, Ann Arbor, College Station, Gainesville etc are not really cities that that tourists want to visit.

Berkeley, Stanford, LA Coliseum (USC), the Cotton Bowl in Dallas, the Sun Devil stadium in Phoenix are all in big metro areas

The Cotton Bowl hosted the 1994 World Cup as well and has been considerably upgraded since, it's a fantastic venue but it seems it isn't in contention for 2026 because of the Cowboys' stadium, which is for me an inferior venue