Official Cavan GAA Thread

[Itchy]

I'm sorry but this doesnt happen in counties that are serious about winning. There is a deficiency in our players, they dont want to do what is needed to succeed (which is their right).

I wonder what a dedicated stalworth like Martin Reilly thinks, hence few years left to win that Ulster and these boys pretty much have made sure that wont happen this year.

Winning Ulster? Realistically we are a marquee forward, a free taker and a total of about 5/6 positions short of being a team of real contenders for Ulster. Short of that we would need a massive slice of luck to land the Anglo Celt cup.
These 3 lads are a massive loss especially for the league which has been a happier hunting ground for us over the last few years but as far as championship goes, without more help, these lads are not winning an Ulster medal. Too many players go missing in the hard games. If they feel burned out then you have to respect that, hope they go away and find the gra again. It's not ideal granted and for a small county the loss will be more pronounced but plenty of top players walk away for a bit. Some with AI medals in their pockets. It's a huge commitment playing IC and the grass might look greener on the other side. But it's a very short career so hopefully they miss it badly when they're away and are chomping at the bit to come back.
In the meantime we have to get on with it and be positive. It's a chance for more players to step up to the mark when the chips are down. It's going to be physical and tough in the league next year and there are now less hiding places on the field. If the voids are filled then long term we could end up with a stronger team.

It's a vicious circle. When you start to think and believe like you say above then you will win  nothing. I've bo doubt our mentally weak players think exactly like that and that's why they leave like this. Dessue Moan retured today after 16 years I think with Monaghan. That's why monaghan win a few Ulster's and we win  nothing. Sickens me to say it

Eh. I was in Clones for both of Dessie's triumphs. Without Conor McManus I'd say he'd be retiring empty handed and may have done so long before now. That's not to say he's not a great stalwart. He deserves his successes and played a vital role in those victories but McManus was unreal, especially the second day.
I don't like labeling our players mentally weak either. Everyone hits their wall at some stage and going up against bigger counties with bigger talent pools the bar is naturally going to be higher. There's no shame in meeting your match. I wouldn't be too quick either to question their commitment. They sacrifice a hell of a lot. If there's better players in the county let them stand up.

I never said there were better players in the county. What I said was they are mentally weak and I stand by that. You can see it on the field too when they play Tyrone or Donegal, bet before the ball is thrown in. I could also say they lack belief. I feel sorry for players like Martin Reilly, never gave up, keeps coming back hoping to get across the line for glory and then in December you find out that 3 of your best players aren't going to commit. But you know Martin keeps going back because he loves the jersey. I suppose we can only hope they come back hungry for success.

[Look-Up!]

I'm sorry but this doesnt happen in counties that are serious about winning. There is a deficiency in our players, they dont want to do what is needed to succeed (which is their right).

I wonder what a dedicated stalworth like Martin Reilly thinks, hence few years left to win that Ulster and these boys pretty much have made sure that wont happen this year.

Winning Ulster? Realistically we are a marquee forward, a free taker and a total of about 5/6 positions short of being a team of real contenders for Ulster. Short of that we would need a massive slice of luck to land the Anglo Celt cup.
These 3 lads are a massive loss especially for the league which has been a happier hunting ground for us over the last few years but as far as championship goes, without more help, these lads are not winning an Ulster medal. Too many players go missing in the hard games. If they feel burned out then you have to respect that, hope they go away and find the gra again. It's not ideal granted and for a small county the loss will be more pronounced but plenty of top players walk away for a bit. Some with AI medals in their pockets. It's a huge commitment playing IC and the grass might look greener on the other side. But it's a very short career so hopefully they miss it badly when they're away and are chomping at the bit to come back.
In the meantime we have to get on with it and be positive. It's a chance for more players to step up to the mark when the chips are down. It's going to be physical and tough in the league next year and there are now less hiding places on the field. If the voids are filled then long term we could end up with a stronger team.

It's a vicious circle. When you start to think and believe like you say above then you will win  nothing. I've bo doubt our mentally weak players think exactly like that and that's why they leave like this. Dessue Moan retured today after 16 years I think with Monaghan. That's why monaghan win a few Ulster's and we win  nothing. Sickens me to say it

Eh. I was in Clones for both of Dessie's triumphs. Without Conor McManus I'd say he'd be retiring empty handed and may have done so long before now. That's not to say he's not a great stalwart. He deserves his successes and played a vital role in those victories but McManus was unreal, especially the second day.
I don't like labeling our players mentally weak either. Everyone hits their wall at some stage and going up against bigger counties with bigger talent pools the bar is naturally going to be higher. There's no shame in meeting your match. I wouldn't be too quick either to question their commitment. They sacrifice a hell of a lot. If there's better players in the county let them stand up.

I never said there were better players in the county. What I said was they are mentally weak and I stand by that. You can see it on the field too when they play Tyrone or Donegal, bet before the ball is thrown in. I could also say they lack belief. I feel sorry for players like Martin Reilly, never gave up, keeps coming back hoping to get across the line for glory and then in December you find out that 3 of your best players aren't going to commit. But you know Martin keeps going back because he loves the jersey. I suppose we can only hope they come back hungry for success.

They are beaten well by Donegal and Tyrone because they do not have the quality to get scores in a pressure cooker environment. Miss handy frees. Go 20 minutes without scoring and then find themselves 6/7 points down. Only so much pressure our defense can soak up before the dam finally bursts. They are not the ones who go missing in games but to top it all off they are the ones who have come in for some particularly unfair criticism on social media this year especially on that kip of a forum HS. I don't blame them if they feel they need a break. That kind of crap has got to effect lads and I wouldn't put it down as mental weakness. I'd imagine they're a lot tougher upstairs than a lot of the "fans" running them down.

[Itchy]

I'm sorry but this doesnt happen in counties that are serious about winning. There is a deficiency in our players, they dont want to do what is needed to succeed (which is their right).

I wonder what a dedicated stalworth like Martin Reilly thinks, hence few years left to win that Ulster and these boys pretty much have made sure that wont happen this year.

Winning Ulster? Realistically we are a marquee forward, a free taker and a total of about 5/6 positions short of being a team of real contenders for Ulster. Short of that we would need a massive slice of luck to land the Anglo Celt cup.
These 3 lads are a massive loss especially for the league which has been a happier hunting ground for us over the last few years but as far as championship goes, without more help, these lads are not winning an Ulster medal. Too many players go missing in the hard games. If they feel burned out then you have to respect that, hope they go away and find the gra again. It's not ideal granted and for a small county the loss will be more pronounced but plenty of top players walk away for a bit. Some with AI medals in their pockets. It's a huge commitment playing IC and the grass might look greener on the other side. But it's a very short career so hopefully they miss it badly when they're away and are chomping at the bit to come back.
In the meantime we have to get on with it and be positive. It's a chance for more players to step up to the mark when the chips are down. It's going to be physical and tough in the league next year and there are now less hiding places on the field. If the voids are filled then long term we could end up with a stronger team.

It's a vicious circle. When you start to think and believe like you say above then you will win  nothing. I've bo doubt our mentally weak players think exactly like that and that's why they leave like this. Dessue Moan retured today after 16 years I think with Monaghan. That's why monaghan win a few Ulster's and we win  nothing. Sickens me to say it

Eh. I was in Clones for both of Dessie's triumphs. Without Conor McManus I'd say he'd be retiring empty handed and may have done so long before now. That's not to say he's not a great stalwart. He deserves his successes and played a vital role in those victories but McManus was unreal, especially the second day.
I don't like labeling our players mentally weak either. Everyone hits their wall at some stage and going up against bigger counties with bigger talent pools the bar is naturally going to be higher. There's no shame in meeting your match. I wouldn't be too quick either to question their commitment. They sacrifice a hell of a lot. If there's better players in the county let them stand up.

I never said there were better players in the county. What I said was they are mentally weak and I stand by that. You can see it on the field too when they play Tyrone or Donegal, bet before the ball is thrown in. I could also say they lack belief. I feel sorry for players like Martin Reilly, never gave up, keeps coming back hoping to get across the line for glory and then in December you find out that 3 of your best players aren't going to commit. But you know Martin keeps going back because he loves the jersey. I suppose we can only hope they come back hungry for success.

They are beaten well by Donegal and Tyrone because they do not have the quality to get scores in a pressure cooker environment. Miss handy frees. Go 20 minutes without scoring and then find themselves 6/7 points down. Only so much pressure our defense can soak up before the dam finally bursts. They are not the ones who go missing in games but to top it all off they are the ones who have come in for some particularly unfair criticism on social media this year especially on that kip of a forum HS. I don't blame them if they feel they need a break. That kind of crap has got to effect lads and I wouldn't put it down as mental weakness. I'd imagine they're a lot tougher upstairs than a lot of the "fans" running them down.

I understand you being defensive of these players and 99/100 I am too. But it is clear the players in general are weak mentally and lack leadership. Why do lads miss easy frees when the pressure comes on for example. It is in the head as the same lads will knock them over with their eyes closes in a league match. When a team gets a run on Cavan and goes 6/7 points up who stands up and is counted on the Cavan team. Maybe Martin Reilly but he is only one and in fairness McVitty did too. Thats about it. Clarke getting himself sent off for stupid things is another sign of mental weakness, subconsciously looking for an out.

If I were Mickey Graham my first appointment this year would be a top class sports Psychologist.

[Look-Up!]

I'm sorry but this doesnt happen in counties that are serious about winning. There is a deficiency in our players, they dont want to do what is needed to succeed (which is their right).

I wonder what a dedicated stalworth like Martin Reilly thinks, hence few years left to win that Ulster and these boys pretty much have made sure that wont happen this year.

Winning Ulster? Realistically we are a marquee forward, a free taker and a total of about 5/6 positions short of being a team of real contenders for Ulster. Short of that we would need a massive slice of luck to land the Anglo Celt cup.
These 3 lads are a massive loss especially for the league which has been a happier hunting ground for us over the last few years but as far as championship goes, without more help, these lads are not winning an Ulster medal. Too many players go missing in the hard games. If they feel burned out then you have to respect that, hope they go away and find the gra again. It's not ideal granted and for a small county the loss will be more pronounced but plenty of top players walk away for a bit. Some with AI medals in their pockets. It's a huge commitment playing IC and the grass might look greener on the other side. But it's a very short career so hopefully they miss it badly when they're away and are chomping at the bit to come back.
In the meantime we have to get on with it and be positive. It's a chance for more players to step up to the mark when the chips are down. It's going to be physical and tough in the league next year and there are now less hiding places on the field. If the voids are filled then long term we could end up with a stronger team.

It's a vicious circle. When you start to think and believe like you say above then you will win  nothing. I've bo doubt our mentally weak players think exactly like that and that's why they leave like this. Dessue Moan retured today after 16 years I think with Monaghan. That's why monaghan win a few Ulster's and we win  nothing. Sickens me to say it

Eh. I was in Clones for both of Dessie's triumphs. Without Conor McManus I'd say he'd be retiring empty handed and may have done so long before now. That's not to say he's not a great stalwart. He deserves his successes and played a vital role in those victories but McManus was unreal, especially the second day.
I don't like labeling our players mentally weak either. Everyone hits their wall at some stage and going up against bigger counties with bigger talent pools the bar is naturally going to be higher. There's no shame in meeting your match. I wouldn't be too quick either to question their commitment. They sacrifice a hell of a lot. If there's better players in the county let them stand up.

I never said there were better players in the county. What I said was they are mentally weak and I stand by that. You can see it on the field too when they play Tyrone or Donegal, bet before the ball is thrown in. I could also say they lack belief. I feel sorry for players like Martin Reilly, never gave up, keeps coming back hoping to get across the line for glory and then in December you find out that 3 of your best players aren't going to commit. But you know Martin keeps going back because he loves the jersey. I suppose we can only hope they come back hungry for success.

They are beaten well by Donegal and Tyrone because they do not have the quality to get scores in a pressure cooker environment. Miss handy frees. Go 20 minutes without scoring and then find themselves 6/7 points down. Only so much pressure our defense can soak up before the dam finally bursts. They are not the ones who go missing in games but to top it all off they are the ones who have come in for some particularly unfair criticism on social media this year especially on that kip of a forum HS. I don't blame them if they feel they need a break. That kind of crap has got to effect lads and I wouldn't put it down as mental weakness. I'd imagine they're a lot tougher upstairs than a lot of the "fans" running them down.

I understand you being defensive of these players and 99/100 I am too. But it is clear the players in general are weak mentally and lack leadership. Why do lads miss easy frees when the pressure comes on for example. It is in the head as the same lads will knock them over with their eyes closes in a league match. When a team gets a run on Cavan and goes 6/7 points up who stands up and is counted on the Cavan team. Maybe Martin Reilly but he is only one and in fairness McVitty did too. Thats about it. Clarke getting himself sent off for stupid things is another sign of mental weakness, subconsciously looking for an out.

If I were Mickey Graham my first appointment this year would be a top class sports Psychologist.

I just don't like the term mental weakness Itchy, as if there's something wrong with them. It's a quality issue, not mental. Top quality players have the attributes you allude to but most people don't have that complete package. There's a big difference in performing in front of 500 people, 1000 people or 25 plus thousand people. You either have it or you don't. You can get more comfortable in those environments the more you're exposed to them but the basics have to be there. Getting a shrink in to "fix" these lads will not improve that much.
Top quality professional teams around the world face the same problems. With all the resources available to them there's still really little in the end they can do. They just cast their net wider and get lads in who fit the bill, who have the temperament to do it on the big stages every time.
We don't operate like that. The lads who represent us are the lads we grew up with, our neighbours, cousins, friends etc They represent us! For good or bad, they put in huge sacrifices and leave all their limitations out there laid bare for all to see. I don't expect nor would I want them to be treated like Gods but a little bit of respect sometimes wouldn't be a bad thing and this year especially really pissed me off with the abuse some were getting.
Here's a thought. Forget about the sports psychologist for a moment or all the other bells and whistles. How about Cavan people going out there to see them and actually getting behind them and cheering them on. That might see some improvement.

[Westside]

Branding lads mentally weak is harsh Itchy. It's been a good decade for Cavan and the dark days of losing to Division 4 sides are gone for the moment at least. If lads are training right and giving it their all in good faith, you can't ask for much more.  If these lads are mentally weak I don't know what you'd call some of the jokers that pulled on the jersey in the noughties.

There's still lots of talent there. Mickey needs to find the lads that are hungry and go hard for Division 2 again. Get a league title if we can at all, get something tangible and see if it sparks the team to bigger things.

[Itchy]

Look, I am not talking about mental health here. I am talking about leadership, fighting to the end, standing up in the face of adversity. Its nothing to do with skill or football ability, but its the stuff that makes great players. I don't know how anyone can look at Cavan and say that we have it. Eamonn McGee said it, scratch the surface and you can see that there isnt much there (full quote escapes me).

Listen to the wearecavan podcast, there is a real problem. Mattie was the issue we all thought yet here is Mickey Graham, a Cavan man, a man who worked a miracle with a club team from a half parish in Longford. Yet hes at training and has 18 turn up. I'm done making excuses for them lads. Sorry.

[Cavan19]

Anyone playing county football these days wouldnt want to have a whole pile else going on in their life. Its ridiculous what's expected these days. I dont blame any lad for not committing. In counties like cavan the rewards are not there for these lads.

[Look-Up!]

Agree Cavan19. We're still in November and lads on the panel have been basically averaging 6 sessions a week for a month now. Picking out a number of the lowest attendance for that period is a bit disingenuous if it's going to be used to question commitment of players and allow a manager to get his excuses in early.
That's crazy demands on young lads. For all the talk about sports science, where the hell is the recovery factored in, both physical and mental? Professional teams would be scratching their heads at this. They take better care of lads because they are valuable assets and ruining them would be very counter productive. But alot of IC managers don't seem to give a crap about this. Crock them, send them back to their clubs and give another lad the call.
Fair enough a lot of work needs doing to get lads up to speed but lads on the go for 4-7 years have the core work done and if they feel they need an extended break and come back full tilt in the new year I don't see the problem. There should also be some duty of care to the new additions. Very frustrating for clubs when they get good young lads back from county who don't make the cut because they are carrying joint injuries and cannot shake them for the club season.

[rodney trotter]

Is it some players are brought in too soon, and when they should be in their peak between 26 - 29,they are burned out.
Clarke was brought it the year after he was Minor.

A player could player County football until 33 or 34 if looked after themselves. Faulkner I think was 21  when  played Senior, so probaly a better age..

[Itchy]

There are two things being discussed here as I see it. 1) The general pressures on training for a senior county team and 2) Cavan's loss of players which I believe are worse than in other comparable counties. I think in all the comments you can see posters mixing both up.

On No 1 I dont think there is much disagreement, something needs to be done. The GAA tried bans on county training but that has been abused/ignored.

On No 2 I believe every year we are starting from scratch with a new panel. As a result we will win nothing. If fellas arent going to give it everything we havent a hope. Listen to the wearecavan podcast last week and it was interesting, reading between the lines it seems to me Mickey is doing a reset. He wasnt happy with the commitment last year, he wasnt happy with "party buses". Maybe he is upping the Anti to see who wants to be a Cavan player and who wants to piss around and collect all the gear.

[Look-Up!]

There's more than the players collecting gear and there for the perks. Alot of people there getting paid by the training session and a nice little sideline it is too.
I'd love to see the sports science behind it if there was no money involved. I'd say we'd see a big U turn in "science" and all of a sudden less being more.

[Look-Up!]

Cavan a good bet for relegation this year if management don't wind the horns in a bit.

[marty34]

Cavan a good bet for relegation this year if management don't wind the horns in a bit.

Why, what's happened?

[Look-Up!]

Cavan a good bet for relegation this year if management don't wind the horns in a bit.

Why, what's happened?

Ridiculous demands on players. Couple more have walked and not fringe players. We'll see what the starting team is like come start of League and if they can coax some back but how they're operating at the moment I would be telling any young lad to stay well clear of that setup.
There has to be a little bit of respect and acceptance that there's a life outside football and there should be a bit of enjoyment in playing the game. No good either being treated like a dog this time of year to ultimately break down next year just before the football starts and miss your club season through injury. It's going to happen to quite a few.

[redzone]

There was a good interview with luke Kearney from donegal were he has to learn to walk again after all his operations from over training. Off the ball it was with