woman dies for want of a abortion

[Esmarelda]

I never understood the "sure it happens anyway" school of thought. Doesn't justify it.

Does it not justify dealing with it?

We could repeal the eight and replace it with "abortion in certain cases" and women would still travel to the UK for an abortion that didn't fit our particular criteria.

We could keep the eight and let all of our women that want an abortion continue going to the UK.

These, as I see it, are the two broad options other than giving women the choice of an abortion if they want it.

If we legislate for either of these then we'll be in a very similar situation to what we are now. And everyone can go back to sleep and pretend it's not happening.

[RedHand88]

Just because "it happens", does not mean you should automatically be complicit in it.

[Esmarelda]

Just because "it happens", does not mean you should automatically be complicit in it.

Who said it was? Such replies are very frustrating, with all due respect.

[armaghniac]

There are several things in this which do not seem to apply to other laws. Things like you can't tell people what to do and that the British should determine what the proper policy should be.

[Syferus]

People who try to compare women having abortions to criminals is so hard-hearted and lacking in compassion it's hard to know where to begin in debating the point, if it even qualifies as one and not as a distraction tactic.

[Íseal agus crua isteach a]

People who try to compare women having abortions to criminals is so hard-hearted and lacking in compassion it's hard to know where to begin in debating the point, if it even qualifies as one and not as a distraction tactic.

So when is there compassion for the baby? Im sure your glad your mother had you.

[Syferus]

People who try to compare women having abortions to criminals is so hard-hearted and lacking in compassion it's hard to know where to begin in debating the point, if it even qualifies as one and not as a distraction tactic.

So when is there compassion for the baby? Im sure your glad your mother had you.

Life is about choice.

[omaghjoe]

People who try to compare women having abortions to criminals is so hard-hearted and lacking in compassion it's hard to know where to begin in debating the point, if it even qualifies as one and not as a distraction tactic.

So when is there compassion for the baby? Im sure your glad your mother had you.

Life is about choice.

Is an unborn child informed enough to make the choice?
How would they communicate their decision?

[Syferus]

People who try to compare women having abortions to criminals is so hard-hearted and lacking in compassion it's hard to know where to begin in debating the point, if it even qualifies as one and not as a distraction tactic.

So when is there compassion for the baby? Im sure your glad your mother had you.

Life is about choice.

Is an unborn child informed enough to make the choice?
How would they communicate their decision?

It's the mother's choice. If you want to deny them that choice you'd need a very good reason why they shouldn't have control over their own bodies.

[omaghjoe]

I never understood the "sure it happens anyway" school of thought. Doesn't justify it.

Does it not justify dealing with it?

We could repeal the eight and replace it with "abortion in certain cases" and women would still travel to the UK for an abortion that didn't fit our particular criteria.

We could keep the eight and let all of our women that want an abortion continue going to the UK.

These, as I see it, are the two broad options other than giving women the choice of an abortion if they want it.

If we legislate for either of these then we'll be in a very similar situation to what we are now. And everyone can go back to sleep and pretend it's not happening.

Its not ideal to have someone going to other sovereign territory to carrying out something that is illegal in their place of residence
But you would have to apply the same standard for all laws that are legal in other sovereign territories
You would also need to stop potential weed smokers from boarding flights to Holland or California.
Stop the rich from having residency in the Caymans?
These are ignored at the minute (rightly or wrongly) mainly because they are next to near impossible to enforce.

[omaghjoe]

People who try to compare women having abortions to criminals is so hard-hearted and lacking in compassion it's hard to know where to begin in debating the point, if it even qualifies as one and not as a distraction tactic.

So when is there compassion for the baby? Im sure your glad your mother had you.

Life is about choice.

Is an unborn child informed enough to make the choice?
How would they communicate their decision?

It's the mother's choice. If you want to deny them that choice you'd need a very good reason why they shouldn't have control over their own bodies.

Yes that reason would be the taking of another life...

There is no better reason actually when I think about it

[Esmarelda]

I never understood the "sure it happens anyway" school of thought. Doesn't justify it.

Does it not justify dealing with it?

We could repeal the eight and replace it with "abortion in certain cases" and women would still travel to the UK for an abortion that didn't fit our particular criteria.

We could keep the eight and let all of our women that want an abortion continue going to the UK.

These, as I see it, are the two broad options other than giving women the choice of an abortion if they want it.

If we legislate for either of these then we'll be in a very similar situation to what we are now. And everyone can go back to sleep and pretend it's not happening.

Its not ideal to have someone going to other sovereign territory to carrying out something that is illegal in their place of residence
But you would have to apply the same standard for all laws that are legal in other sovereign territories
You would also need to stop potential weed smokers from boarding flights to Holland or California.
Stop the rich from having residency in the Caymans?
These are ignored at the minute (rightly or wrongly) mainly because they are next to near impossible to enforce.

Joe you keep on comparing this issue to other legal issues. Why won't you let the emotional side of the issue into your arguments? The inability to smoke marijuana recreationally in Ireland hardly warrants discussion here. It's unlikely to affect anyone's life in a profound way. If we're talking medical marijuana then I'd vote for that to be legalised too.

People who try to compare women having abortions to criminals is so hard-hearted and lacking in compassion it's hard to know where to begin in debating the point, if it even qualifies as one and not as a distraction tactic.

So when is there compassion for the baby? Im sure your glad your mother had you.

Life is about choice.

Is an unborn child informed enough to make the choice?
How would they communicate their decision?

They obviously can't communicate. Who do you think is best to make the decision in their absence? I'm going to go with the woman carrying the foetus.

[omaghjoe]

Actually Esm Id go with knowing what the child's choice is based on what every other form of life wants to do
.....and thats to live out their life until their natural death.

[omaghjoe]

As far as not making emotional side into my arguments I already have so that's just not true.

However I am specifically responding to an argument that because an illegal act "is happening anyway" then it should be made legal. Therefore its within a legal context or law enforcement context, there is no emotional arguments there... it is either legal or illegal, or difficult to enforce.

I agree that this is not a debate about marijuana, the analogy was for comparison purposes in terms of the law's enforcement.

[RedHand88]

"Ireland thinks" poll shows the gap narrowing, odds on a Yes win coming down a bit with the bookies. Is there still a chance this will not pass??