Referees Section (All Queries on Rulings Welcomed) No Smart Arses/Tyre Kickers

[off the laces]

Mac.
The keeper went up to catch the ball and the coner forward shouldered him in the midrift,the umpire said to both the second umpire and goalkeeper.

[AbbeySider]

I have a question

When a player is awarded a free is he/she allowed to hop and or solo the ball before he takes the free?

I see players at all ages hopping the ball before they take a free. However some players might take a small solo to get a feel for the ball.

We were playing a match last year and a player took a solo before kicking a free and a free was awarded against him.
This has lead me to believe that you cant solo the ball when about to take a free but many players get away with it.

clarification needed!

[off the laces]

Mac E.
He was a neutral and also a respected ulster referee.

[David McKeown]

Mac Eoghain

This is the question I was trying (badly) to ask earlier in the thread.  If its not illegal to solo the ball whats the difference as far as the rule book is concerned in a player catching his own miskick?  My understanding was once a free kick was kicked from the hand it was deemed taken unless the referee had been imformed the kick was to be taken from the ground.

David

[AbbeySider]

Abbeysider - I don't think there is any specific guidance on this, I remember a few years back there was instruction not to allow players to bounce or solo the ball but as far as I could pick up this is now obsolete. The rules don't specify any such instruction and the practice is widespread so I would love to know which rule or piece of guidance a ref was using that would disallow such a thing. Unless he was taking the 'collecting your own free kick' a bit too far.

On a lighter note regarding the above problem...
Last year one of the lads was taking a free kick from the mid-field area. The same fella plays a little rugby;
Instead of kicking a pass he takes a rugby "penalty" and "runs" it.

In effect he took a solo to himself and kept running. Everyone erupted with laughter and even the ref was nearly on his knees in stitches!


The game took nearly 5 minutes to resume when everyone gathered themselves again. Priceless stuff.

[hitzelsperger]

When a player is being tackled/ raped by 3 or more opponents and is on the ground, is it in the rules that he can punch the ball on the ground to get it out of the pile up? i remember hearing a few years ago that you could but any ref seems to blow it up!

[David McKeown]

That wasnt my understanding but I have asked a number of inter county referees that I have been interviewing recently and have gotten both answers so I guess its down to the referee in charge

[TheUmpire]

Mac Eoghain

This is the question I was trying (badly) to ask earlier in the thread.  If its not illegal to solo the ball whats the difference as far as the rule book is concerned in a player catching his own miskick?  My understanding was once a free kick was kicked from the hand it was deemed taken unless the referee had been imformed the kick was to be taken from the ground.

David

Rule 4.22(i) To play the ball again after taking a free kick/penalty/side-line kick before another player has touched it, unless the ball rebounds off the goal-posts/crossbar.  (i) Cancel free kick or side-line kick.
(ii) Throw in the ball where the foul occurred except as provided under EXCEPTION (v) of Rule 2.2

You can't kick the ball to yourself from a free (even if you miskick it). A free is defined by the word "kick" and the free is taken once the free takers toe meets the ball, so therefore you can hop the ball before a free kick.

On another note, if an event occurs during a game and no rule covers it then the event is deemed to be outside the rules.

There are a number of clarifications etc issued by central council and while they are hard to come by most county boards should have them all collated.

[Queenie]

I have one for all you Referees,

Man is soloing the ball within the rules of course, now he has just hopped the ball(Bounced it!) and then he drop kicks as seen on many an occasion?

Does this constitute a double bounce, as the ball makes contact twice in a row with the ground, before it makes contact with the foot, now don,t all rush in. Think about it, and then think about it again?

[Gabriel_Hurl]

I don't think it is a double bounce as he did not touch the ball with his hands after the second bounce.

[TheUmpire]

I have one for all you Referees,

Man is soloing the ball within the rules of course, now he has just hopped the ball(Bounced it!) and then he drop kicks as seen on many an occasion?

Does this constitute a double bounce, as the ball makes contact twice in a row with the ground, before it makes contact with the foot, now don,t all rush in. Think about it, and then think about it again?

A "drop kick" is a kick and therefore legal.

[OakLeaf]

I don't think it is a double bounce as he did not touch the ball with his hands after the second bounce.

Actually when you double bounce the foul occurs as you bounce the ball for the second time. Many players think that if you bounce the ball the second time and don't take it into your hands again, then that's alright. I'm afraid it isn't. If you bounce the ball the second time, it doesn't matter if you take it into your hands again or not, it's still a double bounce.

Now to the original question. I wouldn't blow someone up for a double bounce when they drop kick the ball. By the letter of the law if the ball hits the ground before they kick it then its a double bounce. However, it would be extremely difficult to tell, which came first, the kick or the contact with the ground. Almost every referee will let it go.

Let's put it this way, if the referee applied the letter of the law in every situation we'd be blowing all the time, e.g. the only legal way of tackling is to flick the ball with the open hand out of an opponents hands. How many times do players just flick at the ball? Very few. Most leave the hand in there for a short time (others longer). Most referees let the hand stay there for a short time before they'd blow but strictly speaking you're not allowed to leave the hand in the tackle for anything other than the time it takes to flick at the ball.

As you can see refereeing is not easy! It's a little like basketball being a non-contact sport  

[behind the wire]

oakleaf, are u saying that if a player bounces the ball then drop kicks it thats a foul? thats what it appears you are saying.

[rosnarun]

when the one hop rule was tried during the national league afew years back as soon as the ball hit the ground referees always called it a second hop. god my throart was sore cursing them

[OakLeaf]

oakleaf, are u saying that if a player bounces the ball then drop kicks it thats a foul? thats what it appears you are saying.

I suppose it depends on your interpretation of the bounce. In the rules the bounce is defined as: For a player to play the ball against the ground with his hand(s) and back to his
hand(s) again. What does "play the ball" actually mean? Strictly speaking if I "drop" the ball and it bounces up again and I catch it, then I've played it with my hands (i.e. a bounce). Following on from that if I bounce the ball, catch it, and then drop it to "drop kick" it, and it hits the ground fractionally before I kick it then you could say that's a double bounce.

ok, so that's not how I call it. If someone drops the ball to drop kick it then I won't count that as playing it (as in bouncing it). If someone drops it purposely to avoid being called for a double bounce, I blow that as a foul. I'm sure you've seen a player thinking about bouncing it and then realizing that they've already bounced it once, just dropping the ball to avoid being called for the double bounce. I'm afraid in that situation there is no escape.

I'd like to hear Offical Line's view on this one. It's not clear cut an open to intrepretation.