China Coronavirus

[Angelo]

Ah so the deaths without lockdown were greater than the deaths with a lockdown. That's a very comparable stat...

We had a vaccine for flu. Didn't stop it causing huge excess deaths and nobody batted an eyelid.

You seem to want to go and engage in mental gymnastics as to why that level of death is acceptable, only if its flu.

Back on the flu drum and access deaths.. the access deaths for flu was 22,000, not 50,000 so be more accurate with the figures.. There was a thread on here called the Aussie flu and lots of people discussed it and its effects at the time, so again inaccurate with your post, there was plenty in the news about it.

Are you saying the flu is the same as Covid?

Access deaths?

Was anyone calling for lockdowns, shutting businesses down, stopping people from visiting friends and loved ones for months during the flu season? Or did they just accept those level of deaths and say it's awful but these things happen?

It's clear what I'm saying, we accept record deaths during a flu season but when a new virus comes along with a different name we shut down society. It's clear the demograph who are the people at risk from Covid and those people have been failed by governments and the health dept in how they have handled this virus in hospitals and care homes.

[Angelo]

If only 1% of transmission of the virus happens outside why have we stopped
Outdoor sports
Outdoor retail
Golf

Starting to get awkward now

People who play sports have to train together as well. That means using the same dressing room/changing rooms etc.

The government want people to stay at home so they closed golf courses. They don't want people from different households traveling and meeting up.

I don't think you understand .

Fixed that for you.

Thanks for that 👍

Latest cases in the south show an average age of 45 years old and the latest deaths include an individual only 30 years old.

Do you want to mention the fact that 1/3 of people in hospital with Covid picked up in hospital.

Or do you just want to pedal more scaremongering?

Seen a report for 18% was picked up in hospital.. you're saying a third of covid is picked up in hospital.. seems at odds with what I seen

https://www.thejournal.ie/third-contracting-covid-in-hospital-varadkar-5331491-Jan2021/

AS MANY AS a third of patients with Covid-19 in hospital contracted the virus while being cared for in the hospital, Tánaiste Leo Varadkar has said.

The Tánaiste said the situation in Irish hospitals is "very serious".

Currently, there are 1,949 confirmed cases in hospital, with 219 in ICU.

While these numbers are beginning to fall, Varadkar said it is not happening "at the pace we would like".

There are "real concerns" about the clusters emerging in Irish hospitals, he said, adding:

"We know that nursing home clusters and hospital clusters are numerous. There's a lot of them. Most deaths sadly occur in nursing homes and hospitals.

"And indeed, it seems that as many as a third of patients in hospital got Covid in hospital, they didn't come in Covid positive, they picked up Covid while in the hospital. Now some of them may not be sick as a result, they may be sick for a different reason.

"But it still is a matter of real concern that so many people are acquiring Covid in our hospitals."

From a source you've used before, so it must be good...

To find "probable" hospital infections—that is, positive tests of patients who were in hospital for more than seven days—Full Fact was advised to find the difference between sets of data on new hospital cases and new hospital cases from the community. The data suggests that, between 1 August and 26 November, there were around 10,000 nosocomial infections (approximately 16% of all coronavirus infections recorded in hospitals).

This data is also broken down by hospital, but the issue is that people who develop symptoms and then test positive eight days after admission could still have been infected before they were admitted, as symptoms can take up to 14 days to appear. This makes it very difficult to be sure that these infections are definitely hospital acquired.

In May, it was reported that NHS England estimated that 10-20% of people in hospital with coronavirus had been infected while they were inpatients.

I said 1/3 and that's my source on it.

If you want to disregard it for a report 8 months ago then I suppose you are reaching for something that ties in with your agenda, aren't you?

We keep hearing excuses from the health service, they have fucked this up and people have died as a result. But it's easier pin the blame on somebody to visiting a friend or relative that they have not seen in a long time.

[Milltown Row2]

No this report was from 1st of August to end of November. this is a source you have used in the past

[imtommygunn]

Ah so the deaths without lockdown were greater than the deaths with a lockdown. That's a very comparable stat...

We had a vaccine for flu. Didn't stop it causing huge excess deaths and nobody batted an eyelid.

You seem to want to go and engage in mental gymnastics as to why that level of death is acceptable, only if its flu.

I'm glad you can tell me how I think. You've ignored my point.

You're the one ignoring things here and performing mental gymnastics to defend record deaths in flu season.

Why was it ok in Jan 2018?

Who said it was?

[Milltown Row2]

Ah so the deaths without lockdown were greater than the deaths with a lockdown. That's a very comparable stat...

We had a vaccine for flu. Didn't stop it causing huge excess deaths and nobody batted an eyelid.

You seem to want to go and engage in mental gymnastics as to why that level of death is acceptable, only if its flu.

I'm glad you can tell me how I think. You've ignored my point.

You're the one ignoring things here and performing mental gymnastics to defend record deaths in flu season.

Why was it ok in Jan 2018?

Who said it was?

Apparently everyone said nothing.. though there is a thread on here about the very same flu outbreak and plenty of news about in at the time, which caused so much death 22,000 (not 50k)

[Angelo]

Ah so the deaths without lockdown were greater than the deaths with a lockdown. That's a very comparable stat...

We had a vaccine for flu. Didn't stop it causing huge excess deaths and nobody batted an eyelid.

You seem to want to go and engage in mental gymnastics as to why that level of death is acceptable, only if its flu.

I'm glad you can tell me how I think. You've ignored my point.

You're the one ignoring things here and performing mental gymnastics to defend record deaths in flu season.

Why was it ok in Jan 2018?

Who said it was?

Well if you didn't think it was ok can you show me where you were screaming for lockdowns back then?

[Angelo]

Ah so the deaths without lockdown were greater than the deaths with a lockdown. That's a very comparable stat...

We had a vaccine for flu. Didn't stop it causing huge excess deaths and nobody batted an eyelid.

You seem to want to go and engage in mental gymnastics as to why that level of death is acceptable, only if its flu.

I'm glad you can tell me how I think. You've ignored my point.

You're the one ignoring things here and performing mental gymnastics to defend record deaths in flu season.

Why was it ok in Jan 2018?

Who said it was?

Apparently everyone said nothing.. though there is a thread on here about the very same flu outbreak and plenty of news about in at the time, which caused so much death 22,000 (not 50k)

So were or were you not shouting for lockdowns back then?

[johnnycool]

Ah so the deaths without lockdown were greater than the deaths with a lockdown. That's a very comparable stat...

We had a vaccine for flu. Didn't stop it causing huge excess deaths and nobody batted an eyelid.

You seem to want to go and engage in mental gymnastics as to why that level of death is acceptable, only if its flu.

I'm glad you can tell me how I think. You've ignored my point.

You're the one ignoring things here and performing mental gymnastics to defend record deaths in flu season.

Why was it ok in Jan 2018?

Who said it was?

Apparently everyone said nothing.. though there is a thread on here about the very same flu outbreak and plenty of news about in at the time, which caused so much death 22,000 (not 50k)

So were or were you not shouting for lockdowns back then?

Were you?

[Angelo]

Ah so the deaths without lockdown were greater than the deaths with a lockdown. That's a very comparable stat...

We had a vaccine for flu. Didn't stop it causing huge excess deaths and nobody batted an eyelid.

You seem to want to go and engage in mental gymnastics as to why that level of death is acceptable, only if its flu.

I'm glad you can tell me how I think. You've ignored my point.

You're the one ignoring things here and performing mental gymnastics to defend record deaths in flu season.

Why was it ok in Jan 2018?

Who said it was?

Apparently everyone said nothing.. though there is a thread on here about the very same flu outbreak and plenty of news about in at the time, which caused so much death 22,000 (not 50k)

So were or were you not shouting for lockdowns back then?

Were you?

I wasn't, neither am I shouting for them now,

I'm not a hypocrite like some on here.

[armaghniac]

You're the one ignoring things here and performing mental gymnastics to defend record deaths in flu season.

Why was it ok in Jan 2018?

If you compare the excess deaths for the USA, the Covid peak compared to 2018 is like comparing the Sperrins to the Himalayas.
https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2021/01/14/us/covid-19-death-toll.html

[Angelo]

You're the one ignoring things here and performing mental gymnastics to defend record deaths in flu season.

Why was it ok in Jan 2018?

If you compare the excess deaths for the USA, the Covid peak compared to 2018 is like comparing the Sperrins to the Himalayas.
https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2021/01/14/us/covid-19-death-toll.html

Not really concerned about America, am I?

Here the winter flu season of 17/18 would seem to have comparable death tolls to the same season in 20/21.

[johnnycool]

Ah so the deaths without lockdown were greater than the deaths with a lockdown. That's a very comparable stat...

We had a vaccine for flu. Didn't stop it causing huge excess deaths and nobody batted an eyelid.

You seem to want to go and engage in mental gymnastics as to why that level of death is acceptable, only if its flu.

I'm glad you can tell me how I think. You've ignored my point.

You're the one ignoring things here and performing mental gymnastics to defend record deaths in flu season.

Why was it ok in Jan 2018?

Who said it was?

Apparently everyone said nothing.. though there is a thread on here about the very same flu outbreak and plenty of news about in at the time, which caused so much death 22,000 (not 50k)

So were or were you not shouting for lockdowns back then?

Were you?

I wasn't, neither am I shouting for them now,

I'm not a hypocrite like some on here.

so 22/50K excess deaths over a 4 to 5 month period you could accept??

[Angelo]

Ah so the deaths without lockdown were greater than the deaths with a lockdown. That's a very comparable stat...

We had a vaccine for flu. Didn't stop it causing huge excess deaths and nobody batted an eyelid.

You seem to want to go and engage in mental gymnastics as to why that level of death is acceptable, only if its flu.

I'm glad you can tell me how I think. You've ignored my point.

You're the one ignoring things here and performing mental gymnastics to defend record deaths in flu season.

Why was it ok in Jan 2018?

Who said it was?

Apparently everyone said nothing.. though there is a thread on here about the very same flu outbreak and plenty of news about in at the time, which caused so much death 22,000 (not 50k)

So were or were you not shouting for lockdowns back then?

Were you?

I wasn't, neither am I shouting for them now,

I'm not a hypocrite like some on here.

so 22/50K excess deaths over a 4 to 5 month period you could accept??

You were happy to accept it too.

I didn't hear many speaking out against it. Were you looking for lockdowns back then?

You guys seem very preoccupied with what I think but you are not too forthcoming yourselves?

Would it be down to your hypocrisy by any chance? Tell me what you thought about the winter flu season in 17/18 Johnny? Show me your outrage back then where you looked for lockdowns to save lives?

[Louther]

https://www.hpsc.ie/a-z/respiratory/influenza/seasonalinfluenza/surveillance/influenzasurveillancereports/previousinfluenzaseasonssurveillancereports/20172018season/Influenza%202017-2018%20Annual%20Summary_Final.pdf

Angelo - would you just give over about the 2017/18 Flu season. You can rabbit on about it, people tragically lost their lives but it wasn't on the scale of Covid. It was excessive and worse than other years but it made the news, people discussed it and was a subsequent ramp up in vaccines for future flu seasons.

For ROI as per the above HSE report there was total of 255 deaths for the Flu in the entire season. Tragic for those affected. But we've had over 1,000 in January alone with massive restrictions in place.

The problem with common sense is that it's not common enough.

[Angelo]

https://www.hpsc.ie/a-z/respiratory/influenza/seasonalinfluenza/surveillance/influenzasurveillancereports/previousinfluenzaseasonssurveillancereports/20172018season/Influenza%202017-2018%20Annual%20Summary_Final.pdf

Angelo - would you just give over about the 2017/18 Flu season. You can rabbit on about it, people tragically lost their lives but it wasn't on the scale of Covid. It was excessive and worse than other years but it made the news, people discussed it and was a subsequent ramp up in vaccines for future flu seasons.

For ROI as per the above HSE report there was total of 255 deaths for the Flu in the entire season. Tragic for those affected. But we've had over 1,000 in January alone with massive restrictions in place.

The problem with common sense is that it's not common enough.

Which login did you mean to post that under?

The numbers of the 2017/18 winter flu are very clear.

I just find it odd how people can defend that death toll as acceptable and nothing to worry about yet call for the total shutdown of society for Covid.

It defies any semblance of logic. What is clear that people like you are extremely uncomfortable with their contradictions being highlighted?