Armagh next steps

[bennydorano]

At the risk of total pollution by our friendly neighbours what would Armagh supporters like to see happen next year? New management? Geezer stays but with a change in direction?

Its the latter for me. I've been assuming for a while Ciaran McKeever's fingerprints have been all over our style of play (last 2 seasons particularly) as it developed into the current eye cancer. I believe McGeeney has an agreement to stay until the end of next season anyway, I hope he stays along with the more senior players for at least another season. There has to be a change in style or at the very least mindset, which is very easy to say but much harder to implement. We're obviously not a million miles away as it stands.

[seafoid]

Armagh, like all other counties, needs a strategy for the new championship. Would it be possible to have a different style of play against Ulster teams outside of the ulster championship ?

[5times5times]

Question is, if Geezer goes, who's out there and free?

You could well have Armagh, Donegal & Tyrone looking managers for 2024 season.. Armagh's current crop is the best it will be in years, they have zero talent coming through, compared to other ulster counties.

[NAG1]

No coincidence that the two freshest teams over the weekend looked to be Dublin and Kerry.

This current set up is playing into their hands even more than before and that's saying something.

[yellowcard]

At the risk of total pollution by our friendly neighbours what would Armagh supporters like to see happen next year? New management? Geezer stays but with a change in direction?

Its the latter for me. I've been assuming for a while Ciaran McKeever's fingerprints have been all over our style of play (last 2 seasons particularly) as it developed into the current eye cancer. I believe McGeeney has an agreement to stay until the end of next season anyway, I hope he stays along with the more senior players for at least another season. There has to be a change in style or at the very least mindset, which is very easy to say but much harder to implement. We're obviously not a million miles away as it stands.

At the minute it feels as though time has almost ran out for the current side. Players like Grugan, Forker, Soupy, Murnin and Morgan are in their twilight years but without them the drop off could be huge and if Geezer went you could see a mass exodus of players. So I'd give him one more season.

The feeling is a lot different than after last season though when it seemed like we had a change of approach for the better after the Ballybofey defeat. The football was thrills and spills stuff that got you off the edge of your seat. The contrast with this season could not be any starker. I don't know whether that is down tp McKeever putting his stamp on things defensively or Donaghy not being able to get his attacking ideas across but ultimately the buck still stops with the manager. So I'd be a bit torn if we were being forced to continue watching more of the same stuff next season. And that is the biggest issue for me, not the actual defeats themselves. I still think we need to be careful what we wish for and for that reason I'd keep him in charge for another season with the caveat that there needs to be a change in approach.   

[trailer]

Seriously, no messing... Armagh need to start at the bottom. Underage. They don't win enough Ulster Minor or U-20 (Whatever the grade is now) at the moment. Never mind All Irelands. Have they won 3 underage All Irelands in their history? It's not a hard and fast rule but its a good indicator. Todays Kerry side won 5 minor titles in a row. That's the calibre all teams are competing against. Develop those players.

They need a Centre of Excellence. Have they started the one that was passed in planning?

Winning on the pitch starts off it. Armagh are behind all the top counties around the country.

[tbrick18]

Maybe put all the focus into road bowls?


I think it's a difficult position for Armagh.
They seem to rate geezer and the players, so I'd imagine it will be more of the same for another year and work on transition from defence to attack.
Maybe find a scoring forward from somewhere to play off RON.

[yellowcard]

Seriously, no messing... Armagh need to start at the bottom. Underage. They don't win enough Ulster Minor or U-20 (Whatever the grade is now) at the moment. Never mind All Irelands. Have they won 3 underage All Irelands in their history? It's not a hard and fast rule but its a good indicator. Todays Kerry side won 5 minor titles in a row. That's the calibre all teams are competing against. Develop those players.

They need a Centre of Excellence. Have they started the one that was passed in planning?

Winning on the pitch starts off it. Armagh are behind all the top counties around the country.

Can't believe I'm agreeing with you but that is precisely it.

We've neglected underage badly since 2009 and haven't even been competitive at either grade never mind competing to win Ulster titles. Thats where we need to start and we need to look at how those jobs are handed out because the development process hasn't been up to the level required. We aren't in a great place moving forward and could easily find ourselves languishing in division 3 in a few years with the lack of talent coming through and the current standard of the club game in the county.

Monaghan and Mayo have proven that you can remain competitive despite a raft of older players retiring or being phased out but the difference is that those counties have good underage systems and development pathways in place. I don't know whether Armagh will be as successful in being competitive at the top table over the next few years.

[naka]

Maybe put all the focus into road bowls?


I think it's a difficult position for Armagh.
They seem to rate geezer and the players, so I'd imagine it will be more of the same for another year and work on transition from defence to attack.
Maybe find a scoring forward from somewhere to play off RON.

most of us accept geezer is doing his best but tbf his limitations were exposed on saturday
we were scared to express ourselves and stifled in attack
it was painful to watch

genuinely think we have become over defensive all year and moved away from what we were good at
at no stage have we won a game comfortably ( save for Antrim and Down who were div 3)with this new system and more often than not have conceded late to either lose the game or to draw the game.

[Armamike]

Seriously, no messing... Armagh need to start at the bottom. Underage. They don't win enough Ulster Minor or U-20 (Whatever the grade is now) at the moment. Never mind All Irelands. Have they won 3 underage All Irelands in their history? It's not a hard and fast rule but its a good indicator. Todays Kerry side won 5 minor titles in a row. That's the calibre all teams are competing against. Develop those players.

They need a Centre of Excellence. Have they started the one that was passed in planning?

Winning on the pitch starts off it. Armagh are behind all the top counties around the country.

Can't believe I'm agreeing with you but that is precisely it.

We've neglected underage badly since 2009 and haven't even been competitive at either grade never mind competing to win Ulster titles. Thats where we need to start and we need to look at how those jobs are handed out because the development process hasn't been up to the level required. We aren't in a great place moving forward and could easily find ourselves languishing in division 3 in a few years with the lack of talent coming through and the current standard of the club game in the county.

Monaghan and Mayo have proven that you can remain competitive despite a raft of older players retiring or being phased out but the difference is that those counties have good underage systems and development pathways in place. I don't know whether Armagh will be as successful in being competitive at the top table over the next few years.

Trailer - I'm going to have to change my opinion of you. Good post.  Underage is the issue.  Like him or loathe McGeeney's been working with threadbare resources.  As yellow card says, we haven't been competitive at underage for years.  We have new guys coming onto the panel every year who've not won a championship game at underage.  it's not just about winning Ulsters or All -Irelands, it's being competitive and challenging,  winning a game or 2 each year at each level and being thereabouts.  Don't know enough about our underage set up but things were going well until around 2011 when the wheels came up.  Something isn't right. Not expecting us to be winning titles very often, but to show no signs of progress over 10 years suggests something is not working.  I see we were in the media last week with a new strategy - the second or 3rd one in the past 10-15 years.  I don't want to see any more strategy documents, just implementation. 

[bennydorano]

Underage is a long standing concern. The fact we are where we are in spite of it is a credit to McGeeney and is lost upon a lot of people in Armagh itself & beyond. I was also reading a post on Facebook this morning about how McGeeney is wasting a thriving club scene. Don't know what club scene he's watching tbh

[marty34]

Nothing coming through in Armagh's schools either.  No solid foundations coming in the club scene either.

South Derry really getting their act together this past 5 years at county level.

This is via the heavy lifting being done by the clubs in the area. Huge work going on, filtering into the schools and then coming into the underage county set-up.

A pathway to success with everyone pulling the one way.

[seafoid]

Armagh should aim for a semi next year.

[tonto1888]

Question is, if Geezer goes, who's out there and free?

You could well have Armagh, Donegal & Tyrone looking managers for 2024 season.. Armagh's current crop is the best it will be in years, they have zero talent coming through, compared to other ulster counties.

We don't have good underage teams but surely there is some talent coming through. Oisin Conaty being one example. Lad is only 20

[tonto1888]

Seriously, no messing... Armagh need to start at the bottom. Underage. They don't win enough Ulster Minor or U-20 (Whatever the grade is now) at the moment. Never mind All Irelands. Have they won 3 underage All Irelands in their history? It's not a hard and fast rule but its a good indicator. Todays Kerry side won 5 minor titles in a row. That's the calibre all teams are competing against. Develop those players.

They need a Centre of Excellence. Have they started the one that was passed in planning?

Winning on the pitch starts off it. Armagh are behind all the top counties around the country.

A fair post.

I sometimes wonder if we as Armagh fans are a bit delusional in what we expect from the team. We have 14 ulster titles. Half of them were won between 1999-2008. 3 between 1977 - 1982. We have never really been what you would call a successful team apart from the two periods above. I don't know why some of our fans expect us to be winning ulster and reaching the latter stages of the AI on a regular basis. Maybe a lot started watching during our most recent successful period