OK, so it struck me that a thread of its own was the best place to discuss the year's performances as a whole so far, and what options we have looking forward to the Championship, rather than bits and pieces at the end of threads about individual matches. So hopefully this thread can be used for all pre-championship discussion.
The league has been very topsy turvy to say the least! But we seem to be coming good of late with only the Meath performance significantly below par in the last month.
The following positions are nailed on for June:
1.
2. A Mallon
3.
4. Donaghy
5. A Kernan
6. A O'Rourke
7. McKeever
8. McGrane
9.
10. M. O'Rourke
11.
12.
13. McDonnell
14. Clarke
15.
Obviously there are a lot of blanks there, which for me is a good and bad thing. It demonstrates that we have more strength in depth in certain positions than we perhaps thought, but I would also have liked to have seen a more settled team at this point in the year.
So for me there are 6 positions to be determined:
Goalkeeper - Hearty or McKinney. Anyones guess who'll get the nod. I'd go for McKinney.
1 position in the Full Back line - Francie for defs if he's fit. If not then it will go to either Moriarty or McNulty. Of the latter two I'd go for McNulty but I'm hearing from several people that McDonnell rates Moriarty very highly, so I wouldn't be suprised at all to see him in there come June.
1 Midfielder - At the start of the year there seemed an abundance of riches: Toner, Lavery, Vernon, Loughran, Swift, O'Neill, Courtney, McKenna. But none have taken their opportunity to shine, which now leaves us in a very unhealthy position. Toner will probably get the go ahead because he has experience of championship football from last year. Personally, I'd love to see Lavery fit and getting a chance. Either that or someone donating one of their knees to John Toal.
Half Forward line - This is a nice selection dilemma as we seem to have 5/6 players going for the 3 positions. Only Martin O'Rourke is a certain starter. If Paddy McKeever can keep up the recent form he merits inclusion (another positive that he has provided in the last few games is good left sided free taking, as A Kernan seems to be having a lot of problems with the frees this year with both Cross and Armagh). That leaves one position between Vernon with his powerful running, or S Kernan with his excellent passing and superior scoring threat. Horses for courses on that choice for me. And then throw B Mallon into the mix and we have some very good options in this line.
No. 15 - For me this is a straight choice between Oisin and T Kernan. Perhaps B Mallon might offer more from play than either of those two, but as anyone who watched our first couple of league games this year could tell you, we, as all teams do, need a reliable right sided free taker.
So anyone else got any thought on potential team selections (even if you just cut and paste over from other threads)?
Also what does everyone make of Peter McDonnell so far? I'd give him an OK, but just an OK. He's done well to give so many of the newer players the opportunity to shine, but he has also been ridiculously slow to act on events during games. How long is he going to let us get cleaned out at midfield without devising some sort of plan to counter it? Methinks he needs to watch as many DVDs of Tyrone during the period from 2003 to 2005 as he can get his hands on, where they managed to win two AIs despite having no midfield, and find out how they coped.
It would also be interesting to hear from posters from other counties to see where we are at present in their eyes.
At the minute my team would be along the lines of
McKinney
McNulty Donaghy Mallon
AK AOR CmcK
MCGrane Toner
MOR SK Vernon
Mallon Clarke McDonnell
IMO, I reckon as a team our main liabilities are Hearty in nets, McNulty, Bellew and Paddy McKeever. Has to be either McNulty or Bellew in the FB line, dont think we can accommodate them both any more. Worringly, McDonnell does seem to be a huge fan of Moriarity.
McGrane has had a poor enough year to date and I'm hoping he'll give it a serious lash as I wouldn't be expecting him back next year, Toner has been the most consistent of our new MF'ers, don't think anyone has done enough to displace him.
I'm not sure that Vernon has done enough to nail down a place on the starting 15, but he would be on my team as I have seen on numerous occasions what he is capable off and with a bit of confidence he can do the same for the county. Paddy McKeever had a good end to the League, but he always seems to be very indisciplined and inconsistent, MOR, SK and CV gives a good line of creativity and doggedness. There's only one place up for grabs in the FF line, TK's star has certainly faded from his Cavan debut, a fully fit Brian Mallon would get my vote.
AFS – I seem to agree with most of you previous games analysis – can I be you best buddy too?
Keeper – McKinney is my choice (say his name quickly and you'd swear it was Geezer – but this is not the most compelling argument). While he hasn't the physical presence of Hearty, the latter has been decidedly dodgy recently and I think is that wee bit more prone to a clanger. McKinney is a good shot stopper and can pick out a man in space (from play not necessarily kickouts, even though I do believe him better in this area too). His kickouts on Sunday were a bit skied; he seemed to be getting under them rather than through them for length (the tees are too high) – but this is easily resolvable. Having Francie in front of him will add a bit of reassurance for dropping balls... which leads me nicely to...
Francie – went down to the Harps v Cross game on Sunday evening and Francie came on. He looked fresh enough following his solid performance earlier on in the day and he was again solid. Followed his man out the field and got a good strong tackling hand in. I think if fit he should come in at number 3 and young Donaghy, who has been impressive, could move to the corner. Donaghy has great pace and mobility and is a good reader of the game. I think he and Andy Mallon (Gareth Barry lookelikie) would be perfect on either side of Francie. Donahghy's pace is such an attribute that opposing team's deliveries into the corner will need to be pinpoint as Donaghy has the pace to win an ensuing race or get a hand in.
Half Back Line – picks itself. Some have reservations about Aaron's defending, but I feel this League campaign has seen him defend better than ever with a number of dispossessions and interceptions (seems to have added a bit more steel to his play too). I also think that his forays into the attacking area may not have to be frequent or as deep as the sudden appearance of a half forward line and greater movement up front has presented better passing opportunities, of which he has the vision and passing ability to exploit. Added to this is O'Rourke's passing, which has to me taken a bit of the pressure of the backs. We have been keeping a much better shape all over the field, and players have not had to compensate in other areas of the field than their brief. It's a simpler game and suits us. Our forward line don't thrive on high long balls: these men are classy ball players and can offer more creatively and in potency with the better ball being delivered and the man offering support off the shoulder.
Midfield: It is a problem area. McGrane is not the force of old. The options we have for the middle are potentially very good indeed. However, I feel it is a year or two too soon for them in an area of the field with such responsibility. Of all the best midfields in the country what age are the players when they are considered to be at their best in this sector? I would go with Toner. He is strong, mobile, has good hands and a great tackler. [by the by, I wouldn't mind seeing a Mallon/Toner/Donaghy full back line in a few years with a McKenna/Lavery midfield – shure only time will tell).
Half forward line: I have said before that I think we have been playing a nicer - and more effective for creating scoring chances - kind of game, which has come from the players available to receive the ball in this area of the field. And it's an area in which we have options. Stephen Kernan has really stepped up this year. He has added a bit of creativity and sends lovely balls inside (Ooo matron). I have criticised MOR in the past but he has played fantastically so far this season. A nark who will win frees and win dirty ball and get under the skin of the opposition. In saying this, I don't underestimate his footballing abilities and he has shown he has pretty good vision himself. It's why I'd have him ahead of Paddy McKeever in the CHF role. Paddy has had two good performances (Dublin particularly), but I think his passing ability has been overstated. I think he sees passes, but maybe doesn't consistently hit his target: a bit like his free-taking. Your heart can be in your mouth sometimes. He does offer a physicality and, like our other forward options, his attributes could be employed strategically. Yesterday, I would have liked to see Vernon in the remaining slot, but Brian Mallon looked a bit like his old self yesterday, full of incisive running and if he's fit, it'd be a toss up. Vernon has looked a bit leaden footed, but he offers great ball carrying ability and will win frees in scorable positions. Have seen him player better and b Not sure if his fitness is anywhere near 100%, and would expect better from him in the hard ground of summer. Courtney, I feel, should have been given a couple of more opportunities.
Full Forward Line: Only one position up for grabs here. For me Tony Kernan should get his chance. Our best performances have come with him on the field. He has very good vision and passing ability too. His movement has been fantastic; dragging defenders from the danger zone creating exploitable space. A totally honest and brave young lad. He also offers scoring ability and is a reliable enough free-taker. He's the one I'd start with.
Easy, isn't it.
Quote from: Imposerous on April 22, 2008, 11:57:47 AM
Francie – went down to the Harps v Cross game on Sunday evening and Francie came on. He looked fresh enough following his solid performance earlier on in the day and he was again solid. Followed his man out the field and got a good strong tackling hand in. I think if fit he should come in at number 3 and young Donaghy, who has been impressive, could move to the corner. Donaghy has great pace and mobility and is a good reader of the game. I think he and Andy Mallon (Gareth Barry lookelikie) would be perfect on either side of Francie. Donahghy's pace is such an attribute that opposing team's deliveries into the corner will need to be pinpoint as Donaghy has the pace to win an ensuing race or get a hand in.
That's clutching a bit attaching any credibilty to that performance, Harps were a beaten team when he came on and he played at wing half back ffs!
Oooo, touchy Benny. Understandable. Harps were beaten when the Cross pulled into Abbey Park. A spineless performance, truth be told.
Francie did what was asked of him. And his man was fresh off the subs bench, buslting MOR type of player. So, having had a full 70 mins intercounty earlier (esp having just come back) and judging on what Francie did, I don't think it is unreasonable to suggest that Francie is on his way back, and whay I'd like to see him start against Antrim/Cavan. No? FFS!
The player who came on was Harpo McKenna and believe it or not he was described later(in some quarters) in the social club as Harps MOTM!! He'll love the MOR comparison!
Neither will win any beauty competitions :-*.
I suppose i threw my tuppence worth into the cork thread so i'll just copy it here....
Disappointed with McKinney's kick outs in that he seemed to be getting under or slicing a lot of them. for the second week running there was a lot of pointing and shouting from the midfield. It's still McKinney as number one for me though. Francie showed a lot more sharpness and aggression yesterday and seems to be regaining his form. still 8 weeks at least to the championship so he should be near enough by then. the two corner backs were out to lunch yesterday. moriarty was solid enough first half but awful playing with the breeze. paul k was terrible throughout. caught ball watching, allowing his man away from him in behind and very poor in possession coming out. mallon should have been in sooner.
the half back line were their usual dependable selves. McKeever closes down whoever he marks and picks his breaks forward very well. i would expect him to win more break ball though. aaron's strengths and weaknesses are well known and i guess we're just gonna have to live with the frees he concedes every week. also very weak on the break ball. AOR had a quiet enough game but essentially rescued the game scoring one and setting up 2 of the last 4 points when the game was in the melting pot.
Midfield is a worry. Unlike a lot of poster i felt McGrane did well. he wasn't competing against Murphy directly at any stage and won lots of ball, even if it wasn't soaring fetches. McKenna is one for the future but will hardly play championship football this summer. it was good to see loughran on the pitch even if he did look rusty. it can only increase mcdonnell's options.
Brian mallon was very industrious before going off and almost had a great goal. i really like mallon as a player and he provides a cutting edge and sharpness noone else really does when he's on form. disappointed with vernon and McKeever. Vernon takes the wrong option quite a bit and doesn't release the ball until he's exhausted every avenue of carrying it first. McKeever as we know is very talented but how lazy is he? Only for O'Rourke jnr showing from behind him there'd have been no link to the two inside men. McKeever looked like a man happy with his performance last week and going through the motions. mighty free at the end though!
Orourke junior showed plety of promise i felt. his willingness to actually show in front is something that has been lacking in the team. he wasted a couple of opportunities early on but his first half point was probably the score of the game. i certainly think he carries more threat from open play than tony k or Oisin and its a pity he didn't get more game time in the league.Yestreday confirmed what most of us have suspected about oisin. there's a lot less in the legs than there used be and impact sub s his role now. mighty sideline ball and usual good frees but a few uncharachteristic misses from play. he is easily contained at this level die to his lack of pace and strength. i think swift has used up his last chance. showed well early on but chose to shoot continually from tight angles when there were men better placed around him. he became very static in the second half and could have come off earlier.
all in all a strong enough finish to the league. McDonnell will undoubtedly have learned much more than use mere mortals and i'm sure he'll have at least 13 of his championship side formulated. its a long time to the first round of ulster though and you never know what injuries might occur. at this moment i'd go for
McKinney
McNulty Donaghy Mallon
McKeever O'Rourke Kernan
McGrane Toner
Kernan s Mallon O'rourke
McDonnell Clarke O'Rourke
The three major areas for decision are in the full back line each of the forward lines. if McNulty can find his form i think he will be in. at ing forward i think it could come down to who you're playing and whether the guile of kernan or the power of vernon is needed. then i think its a straight decision between tony kernan and o'rourke junior and i think o'rourke contributes far more from play and i'm not sure kernan's free taking will be a necessity.
By the way, i'm sure there'll be challenge games, rumours, etc. between now and june so in the interest of not polluting the non armagh contributers maybe we could keep it all here.
Quote from: Imposerous on April 22, 2008, 01:21:31 PM
Oooo, touchy Benny. Understandable. Harps were beaten when the Cross pulled into Abbey Park. A spineless performance, truth be told.
Given your own words (above) horse, it only further highlights the irrelevance of using Francie's perfromance against us as justification for inclusion in the Ulster Senior Championship.
By the way - a straight talking poster - always a welcome addition to any thread. I look forward to hearing equally frank assessmnets of your own team's performances throughout this season, on this public forum! ;)
Rufus, I've a feeling you may already know my identity. And who knows, perhaps comments on my team's performances are already adequately documented by a well known City scribe.
Never hurts to play devil's advocate in a debate though (Benny didn't bite) and maybe the odd scathing comment from a 'perceived' outsider may help spark a bit of fire in the 'bellies'.
Any word of a final championship panel?? should be announced fairly soon i'd say
Anyone heading to the Wexford game at Clann Eireann this Sunday?
Might be interesting enough, possibly a last chance saloon game for several lads that are facing the chop from the championship panel.
i thot it may have been one of those games where the armagh team is one made up mostly of clann eirean players with a few county men in for good measure!
Quote from: Hank Everlast on April 30, 2008, 08:55:55 AM
i thot it may have been one of those games where the armagh team is one made up mostly of clann eirean players with a few county men in for good measure!
Probably right, but just thought that considering the time of year it is and the fact we don't play for ages, that there'd maybe be a few more familiar faces than expected.
Armagh 1-13 Wexford 0-09
Hearty
P Kernan
Bellew
McDonald
A Kernan
Toner
Courtenay
McKenna
Vernon
S Kernan
J Murtagh
Shorty Clarke
Oisin
Ryan Henderson (c)
S Forker
Wasn't at the game but apparently this was the team according to the Irish News, although I've heard from other sources that Moriarty and Mallon played in the backline.
By all accounts it seems to have been little more than a run around. Still good to get a win and good for Francie and some of the other boys to get more game time. Would be hard to see Wexford putting up much in the week after their league success, although they did have Matty Forde playing. I wonder about R Henderson too, he seems to be a young lad with potential and even though the main reason he would have been playing was due to it being his club's big day, i'm sure Peter McDonnell would've had half an eye on him with the county in mind.
Any more word on the finalised county panel?
Quote from: gander on May 06, 2008, 10:00:50 AM
Any more word on the finalised county panel?
No word yet. There was a wee tit bit in the Irish News last week that said that the panel had been finalised but I reckon that was a bit premature. The official website doesn't have anything up yet, and it seems to be fairly on the ball since it was redone a while ago with the U17 development squad up today, etc.
heard phil loughran is 1 of the ppl axed frm the county squad
Ryan Henderson is without doubt one of the best forwards in Armagh, the ability this lad has is unbelievable. His problem is that he's not the bravest and it's a well known fact if he gets roughed up he will go into his shell, i believe he has worked hard over the winter with the weights and boxing and hopefully that will toughen him up a bit.
panel of 35 has been named from what i heard with 10 reserves put in place as well (Standby) Philly Loughran and Duffy are two of these reserves along with Mal.....Panel wil go2press this week i'd say
Quote from: Real1995 on May 06, 2008, 10:46:58 AM
panel of 35 has been named from what i heard with 10 reserves put in place as well (Standby) Philly Loughran and Duffy are two of these reserves along with Mal.....Panel wil go2press this week i'd say
Surely its a panel of 35
including 10 reserves? I can't see them operating for the summer with 45 players in tow. 10 reserves + the 24/25 that you are allowed to name on match days seems about right.
Well they're heading to training camp this week so i'd imagine anyone heading would be on the championship panel?
Quote from: illdecide on May 06, 2008, 10:42:41 AM
Ryan Henderson is without doubt one of the best forwards in Armagh, the ability this lad has is unbelievable. His problem is that he's not the bravest and it's a well known fact if he gets roughed up he will go into his shell, i believe he has worked hard over the winter with the weights and boxing and hopefully that will toughen him up a bit.
Haven't seen much of the lad really, but from what you're say he'd be well worth a place on the county panel if he wasn't afraid of his own shite? Is this the general consensus on him?
Quote from: AFS on May 06, 2008, 10:53:38 AM
from what you're say he'd be well worth a place on the county panel if he wasn't afraid of his own shite? Is this the general consensus on him?
this wud b 110% corect
as far as i kno AFS its 35 wit 10 reserves, they wont be training but may be called up due to injurys to 35, it wil prob end up at a panel of 30 thou id say...but i agree its a lot of men to be carrying
Quote from: altovito on May 06, 2008, 10:56:43 AM
Quote from: AFS on May 06, 2008, 10:53:38 AM
from what you're say he'd be well worth a place on the county panel if he wasn't afraid of his own shite? Is this the general consensus on him?
this wud b 110% corect
Nice lad but i'm afraid it's 100% correct.
I was in the changing rooms in Davitt Park on Sunday when the Armagh team came in and holy f**k there was enough players to play 3 matches, surely they will not bring that amount of players to Portugal thats a waste of money as there are about 15 lads there that would never make the county team in any shape or form, just good club players in my view.
It is a panel of 30 with 5 reserves including Loughran and Duffy. There will then be 10 others who will be on standby and an eye will be kept on them through the year.
Spot on Corn02, the panel of 30 men and the 5 reserves will be travelling to Portugal and the other 10 lads just missed out and will be the ones who can be drafted in or out if other injuries occur.
FROM todays Irish News
THE Armagh senior football squad for the 2008 Championship has been announced. There are no surprise omissions in the 35-man panel and, unsurprisingly, Crossmaglen are best represented. The south Armagh side have eight players in the squad. There is a place for Conor Clarke, brother of Ronan, and for Ronan Austin, who has recovered from a broken ankle picked up in the McKenna Cup clash with Fermanagh. There is no place on the list for Cladys Phillip Loughran and Paul Duffy of Pearse Ogs despite both featuring for Peter McDonnell this year. The panel differentiates slightly from the one that will feature in tomorrow's Irish News Championship supplement which had already gone to print by the time the updated panel was announced.
Armagh SFC panel:
R Austin, F Bellew, C Clarke, R Clarke, P Courtney, B Donaghy, M. Ferris, S Forker, P Hearty, A Kernan, P Kernan, S Kernan, T Kernan, J Lavery, G Loughran, 0 McConville, B McDonald, S McDonnell, P McGrane, C McKeever, P McKeever, D McKenna, C McKinney, E McNulty, A Mallon, B Mallon, F Moriarty, G O'Neill, A O'Rourke, Martin O'Rourke, Micheal O'Rourke, B Shannon, G Swift, K Toner, C Vernon.
I'm surprised Duffy has been left out, I thought he was a bit overrated previously, but still a decent player
I always thought of Duffy as carbon copy of aaron kernan. both are gung ho attacking wing backs but defensively poor. as we found out against Kerry in 2006, you can't afford two if those on the same team. Big Loughran is a bit of a surprise too. 35 is a big panel. some names there too who surprise me, including ferris, clarke junior, austin, forker, paul kernan and barry mcdonald.
Quote from: Aghdavoyle on May 15, 2008, 11:38:55 AM
I always thought of Duffy as carbon copy of aaron kernan. both are gung ho attacking wing backs but defensively poor. as we found out against Kerry in 2006, you can't afford two if those on the same team. Big Loughran is a bit of a surprise too. 35 is a big panel. some names there too who surprise me, including ferris, clarke junior, austin, forker, paul kernan and barry mcdonald.
There are people in Armagh would would tell you that Clarke Junior was a better player than his brother. he is said to love his beer and really hasnt paid as much attention to the football as Ronan did.
No sign of Toal at all then? :(
As pointed out, no real surprises in the squad. From my club, disappointing for Liam O'Hare, I'd heard he was going very well in training but injuries meant he just never got a chance this year. Duffy's always done well enough for Armagh but I don't see half back as a problem position in any chance.
Would worry about Francie if he's starting this year. Have seen him against Cork and Wexford and I think he's still off the pace. Hopefully Portugal will have brought him on fitness wise. Would just about give him the nod over McNulty and Moriarty but think full back line could be a weakness.
Both our keepers are decent goalies but prone to mistakes. I'd just about go for McKinney at this stage but its a tight call. The saves he made against Cross in the county final stick out in my mind.
Half back line picks itself. In midfield I'm worried about McGrane and have been since Derry in the qualifiers last year. Hopefully he can get back to close to his best by June. Whatever (legitimate I think) criticism I've given Stephen Kernan in the past he certainly merits a starting place on his performances this year. Would go for O'Rourke and Vernon alongside him - Vernon maybe more on potential and Queens' preferences but there's certainly more improvement and potential in him than the likes of paddy McKeever.
Clarke and McDonnell in the forwards and I'd just about go for Brian Mallon over Oisin or T Kernan for the last spot.
Just reading the Irish News Championship supplement and there's an interesting inerview with aidan o'rourke. Most of it concerns him not being on the panel last year and his reasons for coming back. Inexplicably, Joe kernan isn't mentioned once. He thinks armagh can win sam this year.
WHAT ????? :D :D :D
That just brighened up my day.
Armagh for Sam 2008? What will they think of next?
Cavan and Antrim to serve up a game of football.
Armagh are still a decent team and def havent fallen as far as some would have you believe but they are a long way of the standard and capabilities of an All Ireland.
They will give Tyrone a run for it in the Ulster semi after their kick about against the winners of Cavan and Antrim an may even make an Ulster final but my moneys on who ever comes through the other side of the draw winning the Ulster and its a bit of a lottery who that will be.
Uladh there is a mention of Joe.
Read it again - he's mentioned once in a bit of background to the article only?
For Billy's benefit, maybe i should have included a " :o" after quoting him that he thinks armagh can win sam!
saw Joe coming out of B & Q today with some garden stuff along with his youngest son. Think he went into McDonalds then after and ate 42 burgers.
42?? Are we talking those small burgers or quarter pounders? I think I could do 42 of the small, they're f**king scrap!
42 quarter pounders with cheese. I think it filled him up just enough to not turn round and have a go at eating Ross.
Hear the news Joe is to be the new roving reporter on the sidelines for BBC's coverage??
Roving??! ???
Cavan could cause armagh problems. Could be a tight game.
I doubt it. Would still expect Armagh to get through fairly easy. Is this set for Clones or Breffni?
Breffni Park
Today's game lacked a bit of championship intensity, but Cavan were a lot better than I expected. You would like to think Armagh would get more tackles in than Antrim managed and knock Cavan of their stride, but I still wouldn't be putting a load of loot on Armagh to progress.
Not an overly big fan of Bellew but he may well be a better option on McCabe at FB than Donaghy - horses for courses and all that.
MCKinney
A MAllon, Bellew, Donaghy
AK, AOR, CMcKeever
McGrane - Toner
MOR, SK, Vernon
McDonnell, Clarke, TK?
That's the team I'd like to see start, Benny. Perhaps Brian Mallon may start if TK isn't fully fit.
After watching Johnston today I'd be worried if Finn Mo started on him as he hardly won a ball in front of his man the whole League and Seanie only needs half a yard to win the ball swivel and shoot (invariably over the bar).
Can't see Cavan getting even close to the space they got today. They are a pacy enough side and it won't be easy.
Quote from: bennydorano on May 18, 2008, 07:32:19 PM
MCKinney
A MAllon, Bellew, Donaghy
AK, AOR, CMcKeever
McGrane - Toner
MOR, SK, Vernon
McDonnell, Clarke, TK?
Will They like champ!
That's not the team that will start - trust me
Time for Cavan to actually produce something thats resembles football and not horse racing
QuoteTime for Cavan to actually produce something thats resembles football and not horse racing
........what? ???
Right so its Cavan. They looked alright today but Antrim were fairly poor. Would imagine if Antrim could hit them for 17 that we'd be able to rack up somewhere in the region of 25 to 30, but at the same time i'd expect Cavan to be better the next day so maybe not.
Considering how shaky our midfield has been this year it would be advisably for Cavan to start McCabe there against us, as it would give them a decent platform. I think he'd be wasted at full forward, Francie would be well fit for him.
Mallon able to handle Johnston? It might be a good idea to double mark him just in case. Not a lot else in that Cavan forward line that I'd be worried about.
NOTE: Would someone in charge maybe merge this thread with the 'Armagh v Cavan' thread that was put up lightening fast after today's match.
What's the story with Kieran Toner? I hear he did his knee in the U21 championship last week.
Is Tony McClelland still injured with his knee?
Yeah, def out against us on Thursday.
Although the Cavan forward unit played well yesterday, they will not be afforded anywhere near the space and time on the ball .
What would be more worrying for Cavan IMO would be that fact that the conceded 1-14 against a poor enough side.
Although Armagh generally never give out hidings, i would expect Armagh to win comfortably enough, even though the scoreboard may not tell the same story
Quote from: Skiddybadoo on May 18, 2008, 09:22:53 PM
That's the team I'd like to see start, Benny. Perhaps Brian Mallon may start if TK isn't fully fit.
After watching Johnston today I'd be worried if Finn Mo started on him as he hardly won a ball in front of his man the whole League and Seanie only needs half a yard to win the ball swivel and shoot (invariably over the bar).
Can't see Cavan getting even close to the space they got today. They are a pacy enough side and it won't be easy.
Johnson needs a the wind taken out of his sails early on, H was acting the bollocks wil mc nulty in the league game, you can bet your life on it, he will not be running round looking into the crowd kissing his wrist and punching the air. He will need that hair of his cut so he can see who is behind him
I saw nothing yesterday to have any concerns about. If Antrim can score 1-14 against Cavan I'd expect Armagh to score twice that. In fact Antrim should have score more.
Two worries here 1 Cavan already have a match under their belt and will know that they were involved in a timid game against Antrim. They also know that Armagh will hit a lot harder than Antrim . No matter what way you look at it a match in the championship no matter how easy, is a great way of working on strengths and weaknesses, Yes Cavan have both, physically they are strong, much much to physical for Antrim. On the weak side they depend to much on Johnstone ,and McCabe to a lesser extent .
Mulvey and Brady were two very useful subs to bring on, Changed the game in my opinion. Where Antrim missed Cavan scored
Home advantage will also be a real help no matter what way you look at it. The game will attract 25,000 which will hit it near capacity (30,000) This will be a big one for Keoghan and he knows it. Cavan beat a Down team a few years ago with three goals in the last ten minutes and yes Down were no world beaters and neither were Cavan . Armagh need to be firing on all cylinders. If Armagh play the way they did against Meath or Westmeath Then it will be the qualifiers and whatever that holds. Play like we know they can ie Dublin, Roscommom, Monaghan at times ,Cork in the final ten minutes then we are in with a big shout for honours this year. Make no mistake Cavan will be a tricky jump .We need the result, no matter about the style of play or how we go about getting it.
Quote from: bennydorano on May 18, 2008, 07:32:19 PM
MCKinney
A MAllon, Bellew, Donaghy
AK, AOR, CMcKeever
McGrane - Toner
MOR, SK, Vernon
McDonnell, Clarke, TK?
I def think that there is a role for paddy mckeever in there somewhere
MCKinney
A MAllon, Bellew, Donaghy
AK, AOR, CMcKeever
McGrane - Vernon
MOR, mckeever, SK,
McDonnell, Clarke, TK?
Quote from: Hank Everlast on May 19, 2008, 12:08:16 PM
Quote from: bennydorano on May 18, 2008, 07:32:19 PM
MCKinney
A MAllon, Bellew, Donaghy
AK, AOR, CMcKeever
McGrane - Toner
MOR, SK, Vernon
McDonnell, Clarke, TK?
I def think that there is a role for paddy mckeever in there somewhere
MCKinney
A MAllon, Bellew, Donaghy
AK, AOR, CMcKeever
McGrane - Vernon
MOR, mckeever, SK,
McDonnell, Clarke, TK?
I definetly like the look of this team Hank, it is the exact team that i was going to put down, Strong all round, and still plenty of options, the most obvious being toner at either midfield or in Full back or center half back positions, plenty of options for forwards, Mallon, Mc Conville, Clarke, Swift, In defence, we dont have as many options, Would love to still have Duffy as an option but for some reason unknown to me hes not there, We have mc Nulty, Finnian Mo who has yet to impress, always second to the ball and fouls a lot.
So to sum up, i think the Midfield and forward sectors are ok but we are lacking a bit of depth for defence (Just my opinion)
I break out in a cold sweat and come over all shivery at the thought of our full back line trying to cope with Clarke and McDonnell. :-\
It's natural for Armagh folk to be nervous and although McCabe will be fitter and Gunner Brady, Sean Brady, captain McKeever, Mulvey and the hallion Walsh should be in the reckoning for starts on June 15th, I really wouldn't be too worried about this game if I was an Armagh man.
If Cavan perform half as creditably as they did in Crossmaglen back in February and avoid a tanking on home turf, I reckon we'd be happy enough with that. It's the minors that most Cavan fans are following with any real interest....
Quote from: cavanmaniac on May 19, 2008, 02:37:35 PM
It's the minors that most Cavan fans are following with any real interest....
Armagh seem to be very young for a minor team, I know our club has 4 or 5 on the panel and they are all eligible again next year.
i think its time for us Cavan folk to hijack this thread so,
i think we will match Armagh for 60 minutes,before coming away with our usual hard luck story of losing by 4 or 5 points.
id be more interested in a good run in the qualifers with at least 2 victories.
wouldnt be able to guess a cavan team at this stage,give us another few weeks lads ;)
As for Ard Mhaca
No Oisin Starting? Impact sub?
strong half back line of Kernan, O Rourke and Pints favourite player ;D
Bellew would just love McCabe at full forward,hes made for Bellew, so i think we should try and shove Johnston in on him,Bellew is a terrific Full back,but he cant be very match fit.
Andy Mallon or Enda McNulty man Marking on Jelly?
Quote from: AFS on April 22, 2008, 01:32:12 AM
The following positions are nailed on for June:
1.
2. A Mallon
3.
4. Donaghy
5. A Kernan
6. A O'Rourke
7. McKeever
8. McGrane
9.
10. M. O'Rourke
11.
12.
13. McDonnell
14. Clarke
15.
So for me there are 6 positions to be determined:
Goalkeeper - Hearty or McKinney. Anyones guess who'll get the nod. I'd go for McKinney.
1 position in the Full Back line - Francie for defs if he's fit. If not then it will go to either Moriarty or McNulty. Of the latter two I'd go for McNulty but I'm hearing from several people that McDonnell rates Moriarty very highly, so I wouldn't be suprised at all to see him in there come June.
1 Midfielder - At the start of the year there seemed an abundance of riches: Toner, Lavery, Vernon, Loughran, Swift, O'Neill, Courtney, McKenna. But none have taken their opportunity to shine, which now leaves us in a very unhealthy position. Toner will probably get the go ahead because he has experience of championship football from last year. Personally, I'd love to see Lavery fit and getting a chance. Either that or someone donating one of their knees to John Toal.
Half Forward line - This is a nice selection dilemma as we seem to have 5/6 players going for the 3 positions. Only Martin O'Rourke is a certain starter. If Paddy McKeever can keep up the recent form he merits inclusion (another positive that he has provided in the last few games is good left sided free taking, as A Kernan seems to be having a lot of problems with the frees this year with both Cross and Armagh). That leaves one position between Vernon with his powerful running, or S Kernan with his excellent passing and superior scoring threat. Horses for courses on that choice for me. And then throw B Mallon into the mix and we have some very good options in this line.
No. 15 - For me this is a straight choice between Oisin and T Kernan. Perhaps B Mallon might offer more from play than either of those two, but as anyone who watched our first couple of league games this year could tell you, we, as all teams do, need a reliable right sided free taker.
OK, so this was my take on things about a month ago and really I don't think that very many of these questions have come any closer to being answered.
It looks like Francie is going to make it so we can maybe cross out that dilemma.
Goalie jersey is still up for grabs. Anyones guess ???
Midfield partner for Paul is also still available, although McKenna has started a couple of games in a row there now so maybe McDonnell is leaning in that direction? I think it will be quite telling who he starts midfield in Cullyhanna next weekend. I know for definite that I don't want to see Vernon there, despite being a fantastic footballer (and our future CHB in my opinion) he doesn't win anywhere near enough ball to be considered intercounty midfield material.
One spot in the half forward line. I'd still go for McKeever because of his useful free taking (especially with Aaron off the boil at frees the past while). No place for Vernon unfortunately :( but he's a brilliant impact sub to have to run at defenders in the last 20 minutes when they're tired.
The corner forward spot should still be between Oisin and Tony Kernan because intercounty teams don't win matches without recognised free takers. On reputation I'd go for Oisin if he's fit but if not I'd have no problems throwing TK in there because, despite his limitations, he always works his balls off and like his brothers he can hit a decent pass. No B Mallon, but again he's a fantastic impact sub to have on the line.
So all in all my team would be:
McKinney
Mallon
Bellew
Donaghy
Kernan
O'Rourke
McKeever
McGrane
??? - really have no clue (at a push Toner)
Kernan
McKeever
O'Rourke
McDonnell
Clarke
McConville
Any opinions? Should be well fit for Cavan imo, and if they're not they should pack the year in on the spot and forget about the qualifiers.
Definetly no start for Mc Conville!
Quote from: Onion Bag on May 19, 2008, 03:50:31 PM
Definetly no start for Mc Conville!
Is that an opinion or do you know something we don't? Care to clarify either way. He did score 1-4 in a challenge match a couple of weeks ago which would suggest that he's coming along rightly in terms of fitness.
Quote from: AFS on May 19, 2008, 04:00:21 PM
Quote from: Onion Bag on May 19, 2008, 03:50:31 PM
Definetly no start for Mc Conville!
Is that an opinion or do you know something we don't? Care to clarify either way. He did score 1-4 in a challenge match a couple of weeks ago which would suggest that he's coming along rightly in terms of fitness.
Sorry AFS, only my opinion, I just think he would make a great impact sub in the last 15-20mins, Peter the great Style, It would lift the team, the supporters and the roof
Quote from: Onion Bag on May 19, 2008, 04:05:12 PM
Quote from: AFS on May 19, 2008, 04:00:21 PM
Quote from: Onion Bag on May 19, 2008, 03:50:31 PM
Definetly no start for Mc Conville!
Is that an opinion or do you know something we don't? Care to clarify either way. He did score 1-4 in a challenge match a couple of weeks ago which would suggest that he's coming along rightly in terms of fitness.
Sorry AFS, only my opinion, I just think he would make a great impact sub in the last 15-20mins, Peter the great Style, It would lift the team, the supporters and the roof
Yep sure, but if he's fit I think he's definitely our best option so why should we leave him on the bench for the majority of the game? If only Brian Mallon could hit frees like TK, that would be the perfect solution...
QuoteIf only Brian Mallon could hit frees like TK, that would be the perfect solution...
Mallon's actually quite a decent free taker. Useta be very accurate for QUB. Maybe doesn't get the longer ones as well as Kernan might though.
If some Armagh fans expect them to score 2-28 against Cavan theyre either ignorant,stupid or both!
Quote from: Tyrone Dreamer on May 19, 2008, 05:26:51 PM
If some Armagh fans expect them to score 2-28 against Cavan theyre either ignorant,stupid or both!
I'd be happy enough to get a win & decent performance never mind talking about scorelines FFS
QuoteBellew would just love McCabe at full forward,hes made for Bellew, so i think we should try and shove Johnston in on him,Bellew is a terrific Full back,but he cant be very match fit.
Andy Mallon or Enda McNulty man Marking on Jelly?
Can't see both Bellew and McNulty starting. Enda's been out of favour since giving away that late free against Monaghan. It'll be Donaghy, Mallon and one of Bellew, McNulty or Moriarty in the full back line. Personally I'd go for Bellew.
Quote from: Tyrone Dreamer on May 19, 2008, 05:26:51 PM
If some Armagh fans expect them to score 2-28 against Cavan theyre either ignorant,stupid or both!
Why not? We recently ran up 4-20 against a Roscommon team that subsequently beat Cavan. :P
But in all seriousness I'd agree with Full Back - a win, a decent performance and a bit more game time for some of the lads coming back would be grand.
Due to the nature of Championship football, in Ulster in particular, I'd be surprised if Armagh came out on top by anymore than 4 or 5. In fact, I really don't want us to put up a big score because then we'd enter the national conscience again and I quite like the fact that we've been able to trundle along under everyone's radar this year.
If Armagh get complacent they'll be in trouble, especially with Cavan playing at home but they should have enough to win this one.
Cavan looked okay yesterday but there wasn't much intensity in the game and Antrim are a poor outfit. I'd be disappointed if Johnston is given the same time and space next time.
I'd like to see Peter McDonnell showing some faith in some of the younger lads, e.g. Vernon and T Kernan for this one, with a starting place over the likes of McKeever and McConville. If things aren't working out then by all means bring these more experienced heads on but it's time to give the younger lads their chance. Midfield is our biggest worry imo.
This going to be a massive test fro McDonnell. McCabe will start on the square, there is no way they will break up his partnership with SJ. I would start Francie for his physical strenngth and if things don't work out, you could drop McKeever into the full back line.
Quote from: Tyrone Dreamer on May 19, 2008, 05:26:51 PM
If some Armagh fans expect them to score 2-28 against Cavan theyre either ignorant,stupid or both!
stick to your own thread!
Tyro ne dreamer is spot on though, it was a stupid remark.
fancy this to be a difficult game for the orchardmen with the first fifty minutes or so being very tight, cavan arent as bad a side as people make out and armagh no longer have the physical present to batter teams into submission
my team,
hearty
mc nulty bellew mallon
mc keever o rourke kernan
mc grane toner/lavery/mckenna
kernan mc keever orourke
mc donald clarke t kernan
subs to come on
mc conville
vernon
donaghy
I doubt if Donaghy will be fit, he broke his thumb and is in plaster this last few weeks . Although less than a month to the game the plaster will not be off for another few weeks. He is training at the moment but thats about it. He may not start which would leave the full back line vulnerable as in truth Francie has not played much football to get him up to championship pace and neither has Andy Mallon.. To mark Johnstone we need Andy Mallon flying and he would do the job. Enda would foul johnstone but he would give him a few ticklers then we would see what Johnstones really made of. Finnian mo as I see it is a good player but not the standard yet . He did well against freeman in the Monaghan game . I feel The full back line and the midfield area are a source of weakness and looking at the Cavan team this is where there strengths lie ie full forward line and Midfield(mind you only when Mulvey and Brady came on). Make no mistake Cavan will be up for this one . This is their big chance .They are getting very few cuedoes for their win over Antrim. The scalp of an Armagh team would be their passport back to the big time as they would see it. They have absolutely nothing to loose and everything to gain. People who talk about 2.28 scores are living in a different planet . If we close down Johnstone and Mc Cabe then we should win if not its anyone s game . A great air of uncertainty hangs over this Armagh team. Theres a feeling of not knowing whether the jar is half full or half empty. If we perform to our best then its a win but if our away form of the league comes through then Cavan will beat us and make no mistake about it. Team, if all fit would in my opinion be
C Mc Kinney,
B Donaghy, F Bellew A Mallon
C Mckeever A o Rourke A Kernan
P McGrane K Toner
M O Rourke P McKeever C Vernon/S Kernan
S McDonell R Clarke T Kernan
M O Rourke could be the most important man on the field. To stop the supply into Johnston you have to win midfield. If O'Rourke continues his form from the league and wins all the dirty ball, we should get over the line.
Did ye see this on hoganstand, interview with Armagh manager. What the hell is he going on about....
The idea that Cavan had one eye on Armagh is ridiculous.
McDonnell: Cavan still have plenty in reserve
21 May 2008
Armagh boss Peter McDonnell believes that Cavan will be a much more formidable test than most think when the two sides meet in Breffni Park next month.
In their defeat of Antrim last Sunday, Cavan sprung some experienced players from the bench and McDonnell doesn't think that it was a mere coincidence that such effective players were held in reserve for the Breffni men.
"Let's just say, the idea that Cavan were putting people's feet to sleep wouldn't be beyond the realms of possibility," said McDonnell.
"It's not going to be easy going to Breffni Park, and I don't think Cavan will be holding anything in reserve for that game."
The Mullaghbawn man believes that resting "key personnel" was in anticipation of an Armagh visit on the Cavan manager's part.
"I think Donal Keogan is a very shrewd man," said McDonnell.
"The midfield that started against Antrim was the least effective - and the smallest in stature - that they have used this year.
"There were characters sitting along the subs there who would do nothing only enhance Cavan's ability."
Along with experienced players such as Padraig O'Reilly and Paul Brady making a strong impact as substitutes in Casement Park last weekend, team captain Mark McKeever is set to return from suspension to face Armagh on June 15.
Quote from: mylestheslasher on May 21, 2008, 04:24:46 PM
Did ye see this on hoganstand, interview with Armagh manager. What the hell is he going on about....
The idea that Cavan had one eye on Armagh is ridiculous.
McDonnell: Cavan still have plenty in reserve
21 May 2008
Armagh boss Peter McDonnell believes that Cavan will be a much more formidable test than most think when the two sides meet in Breffni Park next month.
In their defeat of Antrim last Sunday, Cavan sprung some experienced players from the bench and McDonnell doesn't think that it was a mere coincidence that such effective players were held in reserve for the Breffni men.
"Let's just say, the idea that Cavan were putting people's feet to sleep wouldn't be beyond the realms of possibility," said McDonnell.
"It's not going to be easy going to Breffni Park, and I don't think Cavan will be holding anything in reserve for that game."
The Mullaghbawn man believes that resting "key personnel" was in anticipation of an Armagh visit on the Cavan manager's part.
"I think Donal Keogan is a very shrewd man," said McDonnell.
"The midfield that started against Antrim was the least effective - and the smallest in stature - that they have used this year.
"There were characters sitting along the subs there who would do nothing only enhance Cavan's ability."
Along with experienced players such as Padraig O'Reilly and Paul Brady making a strong impact as substitutes in Casement Park last weekend, team captain Mark McKeever is set to return from suspension to face Armagh on June 15.
Mind games. Simply as that.
'Cavan are a lot better than people think.'
'Cavan will play a lot better against us.'
'We'll be lucky to scrape a win.'
etc, etc, etc
All part of taking the pressure off his own players while at the same time providing them with a gentle reminder that no championship games are won easy (unless you are playing Carlow, or Roscommon). This is nothing new really.
Just a bit of notice about the match on Saturday for anybody that's interested....
The Official Opening of the New Complex at St Patrick's GFC Cullyhanna will take place on Saturday 24th May 2008.
Details of which are as follows:-
1.30pm
Minor Football Challenge – St Patrick's (Armagh) v Ballyboden St Enda's (Dublin)
3.30pm
Official Opening Ceremony by GAA Director General, Paraic Duffy
4.00pm
Senior Football Challenge – Armagh v Dublin
Parking
Supervised parking will be available at St Patrick's Church and St Patrick's Primary School – both within walking distance of club.
Only Official Cars with passes will be allowed into the club grounds.
Three weeks out from the opening championship game would it be safe to expect a full strength team? did you boys get any sort of guarantees on that tac?
Quote
Three weeks out from the opening championship game would it be safe to expect a full strength team? did you boys get any sort of guarantees on that tac?
Not sure to be honest Uladh. Haven't heard anything anyway. I think he'll probably put out a strong team. Hope he gives a run to the likes of Enda, Francie, Brian mallon (if fit), Oisin. Basically the players who haven't had many games for the county this year. I'd say it'll be stronger than the team for Wexford anyway. Has any heard anything about the squad? My info tells me that there's still one or two lads on the panel who haven't been named officially.
Quote from: TacadoirArdMhacha on May 22, 2008, 12:23:14 PM
Quote
Three weeks out from the opening championship game would it be safe to expect a full strength team? did you boys get any sort of guarantees on that tac?
Not sure to be honest Uladh. Haven't heard anything anyway. I think he'll probably put out a strong team. Hope he gives a run to the likes of Enda, Francie, Brian mallon (if fit), Oisin. Basically the players who haven't had many games for the county this year. I'd say it'll be stronger than the team for Wexford anyway. Has any heard anything about the squad? My info tells me that there's still one or two lads on the panel who haven't been named officially.
Like who?
Armagh Team playing Dublin on Saturday at the opening in Cullyhanna (Throw In 3.45pm)
1. Ciaran McKinney (Pearse Ogs)
2. Andy Mallon (Pearse Ogs)
3. Francie Bellew (Crossmaglen)
4. Finnian Moriarty (Wolfe Tones)
5. Aaron Kernan (Crossmaglen)
6. Aiden O'Rourke (Dromintee)
7. Ciaran McKeever (St Patricks)
8. Charlie Vernon (Harps)
9. Paul McGrane (Ballyhegan)
10. Martin O' Rourke (Dromintee)
11. Liam O'Hare (St Patricks)
12. Paul Courtney (Ballyhegan)
13. Steven McDonnell (killeavey)
14. Ronan Clarke (Pearse Og)
15. Oisin McConville (Crossmaglen)
Interesting. No Enda McNulty, Stephen Kernan, Tony Kernan, Kieran Toner or Brian Mallon. i'd have expected most to feature.
i expert O'Hare's inclusion partly reflects the venue and this is the line where S Kernan and B Mallon would line out.
Anyone know how T Kernan's and Donaghy's injuries are?
wasnt impressed with Vernon at midfield in the McKenna Cup, although i know how good a player he is
always thought him as McGeeneys successor at centre back or as a wing forward.
from a Cavan perspective i would be more worried about Kieran Toner or David McKenna at centre field.
Not to sure about t kernan but b donaghy is still in plaster hopes to get it off soon . K toner will be out for three weeks , hurt the knee in an u-21 game a week or two ago It will be touch and go for these men to make the 15th June .
Quote from: BallyhaiseMan on May 23, 2008, 10:43:26 PM
wasnt impressed with Vernon at midfield in the McKenna Cup, although i know how good a player he is
always thought him as McGeeneys successor at centre back or as a wing forward.
from a Cavan perspective i would be more worried about Kieran Toner or David McKenna at centre field.
Have seen Vernon a few times this year and last... he has impressed me big time to be honest, he is hungry for the ball, does his damndest to get his hands (and feet) on it whenever he can and certainly isn't scared of a challenge.
If Kieran Toner is out for the Cavan game, we could be in trouble in MF, if Cavan threw in McCabe and your man Mulvey or even Walsh, we'd could be bullied. Huge a fan an all as I am of Vernon I dont think he's ready for intercounty MF yet, I reckon he'd be fine as a third Mf'er though. Without Toner what options have we there? McKenna - not ready, Courtney - not ready, Lavery-injured, O'Neill - might have to do but I dont think he's intercounty class yet either. Forgot about Nippy, he's been in good form lately, he could be first choice if Toner's not there.
Quote from: BallyhaiseMan on May 23, 2008, 10:43:26 PM
wasnt impressed with Vernon at midfield in the McKenna Cup, although i know how good a player he is
always thought him as McGeeneys successor at centre back or as a wing forward.
from a Cavan perspective i would be more worried about Kieran Toner or David McKenna at centre field.
This is accurate enough. By my reckoning Vernon will replace O'Rourke in the HB line in the next year or two. Of our emerging midfielders those two are also the most likely to form a partnership in the future, although James Lavery may have a part to play somewhere along the line (btw does anyone know whats up with him recently?)
McKenna at midfield on Saturday again (3 or 4 games in a row now), would it now be safe enough to assume that he has pushed himself into prime position to partner McGrane against Cavan?
hear Dublin beat ye in a challenge in cullyhanna 7-6
pretty low scoring for summer football, Did Kieran Toner get injured?
Quotehear Dublin beat ye in a challenge in cullyhanna 7-6
Actually Dublin scored a grand total of 0-8, I am sure Cavan can do as betterl. When Armagh have McDonnell & Clarke on they will score more then 0-6 though.
McKinney
A Mallon
Bellew
Moriarty
A Kernan
A O'R
McKeever
McKenna
Vernon
M O'R
B Mallon
S Kernan
Oisin
Swift
O'Hare
This was the team for the Dublin game BHman. Toner was already out with a bit of an injury but Vernon went off in this game seemingly with a bit of a problem. By all accounts it was a pretty poor game played at a slow tempo. Wouldn't read too much into it especially since we were missing up 7 or 8 first choice players, including our first choice midfield and full forward line.
Quote from: AFS on May 26, 2008, 02:34:42 PM
McKinney
A Mallon
Bellew
Moriarty
A Kernan
A O'R
McKeever
McKenna
Vernon
M O'R
B Mallon
S Kernan
Oisin
Swift
O'Hare
This was the team for the Dublin game BHman. Toner was already out with a bit of an injury but Vernon went off in this game seemingly with a bit of a problem. By all accounts it was a pretty poor game played at a slow tempo. Wouldn't read too much into it especially since we were missing up 7 or 8 first choice players, including our first choice midfield and full forward line.
would i be wrong in saying that could be your first choice defense? its good to be able to hold a dangerous Dublin forward line to 8 points.
Forward line is nothing compared to what it will be against us i can see.
Yep that is probably gonna be the defense for this year i'd say with the possible inclusion of Donaghy or maybe even McNulty in place of Moriarty, who is a weak link imo. Again its hard to know what sort of achievement holding the Dubs to 8 points really is. They're under strength at the minute and i'm sure they were under instruction not to be going to hard as they can't really afford to lose any more players before the Louth game.
BTW whats the level of interest in Cavan for the match, will yous bring a good crowd? I like Breffni Park, its tidy ground. Would be great if a decent atmosphere was generated on the day
Quote from: AFS on May 26, 2008, 03:28:47 PM
Yep that is probably gonna be the defense for this year i'd say with the possible inclusion of Donaghy or maybe even McNulty in place of Moriarty, who is a weak link imo. Again its hard to know what sort of achievement holding the Dubs to 8 points really is. They're under strength at the minute and i'm sure they were under instruction not to be going to hard as they can't really afford to lose any more players before the Louth game.
BTW whats the level of interest in Cavan for the match, will yous bring a good crowd? I like Breffni Park, its tidy ground. Would be great if a decent atmosphere was generated on the day
theres still little belief in this team around the county to be honest, we will have a fair crowd because its a home game,but the days of the huge Cavan following is gone for the forseeable future im afraid.
No real team news for Cavan to report, Martin Cahill was supposedly injured but he played against ourselves Saturday Night and looked fit.
I have some news to report on the Cavan front, Paul (the Gunner) Brady is heading State side for the summer again. only drafted into the panel 2 weeks before the Championship against Antrim, played for 15/20 mins as a sub. Apparently he only joined the panel because he was guaranteed to play and once he played, that guaranteed him the grant. Would this happen in any other county??
I may yet be proven wrong but ive heard it from a very reliable source. Wouldn't post it if I thought there was no truth to it. look at posts from a while back and things add up, im trying to find the relevant post and when i do ill post.
Message by cavan4ever - on: April 26, 2008, 10:45:47 AM
Speaking of the grant i heard the great one encouraged a player to come in 2 weeks ago by promise of the grant. player - "No Donal i have no interest i just want to play with club " Mr K -" sure come in for a few weeks u will get the grant" player - "ok"
Dunno if it was Paul he was talking about in this post because i don't think the Gunner had returned to the panel at this point.
Heard James Lavery is out for the year, he has a clot in his leg but they are unwilling to operate on it, so he's on medication - for a long time I assume.
I reckon nippy has really pushed himself into contention in MF, although Toner would still be my first choice if fit.
Quote from: bennydorano on May 26, 2008, 05:21:24 PM
Heard James Lavery is out for the year, he has a clot in his leg but they are unwilling to operate on it, so he's on medication - for a long time I assume.
I reckon nippy has really pushed himself into contention in MF, although Toner would still be my first choice if fit.
It must be one hell of a clot to keep him out of football for a year!!! Mrs BC has them in her lung and leg and has a filter in her vein but she leads a pretty normal life. She is able to do exercise as normal and is actually encouraged to do so. They don't do surgery on them as there is no real need to. Warfarin or Heptane generally clears them. There must be something more to it to be honest.
Could well be BC, but to be fair there's a bit of a difference between the oul pilates and intercounty football!!
Quote from: bennydorano on May 26, 2008, 08:30:53 PM
Could well be BC, but to be fair there's a bit of a difference between the oul pilates and intercounty football!!
There's also a big difference between Pilates and running 5 miles 4 times a week on the roads and doing the a 7 mile leg of the Cork marathon next week!
She does more tarining than me these days :P
Vernon hasn't broken any bones, just bad bruising.
Poor Charlie is going through a lot of wear and tear this year. Typical example of a lad playing too much football. The sooner he finishes in Queens the better for him (and us).
Quote from: AFS on May 27, 2008, 12:08:48 AM
Poor Charlie is going through a lot of wear and tear this year. Typical example of a lad playing too much football. The sooner he finishes in Queens the better for him (and us).
and what about his club? they are the biggest losers of all.
There might be enough clues in saturday's starting team to give us the championship team, although i haven't heard much about individual performances.
Safe to say McKinney is now number one and the half back line is sewn up?
Malon is a cert and so it seems is bellew given the injury situation. also seems moriarty is nailed on despite peoples' reservations. i think McDonnell has started him in every game has has presided over as manager?
Clarke and McDonnell will be joined by Tony K or McConville it seems and the two wing forward slots are O'Rourke and Kernan with centre forward between Mallon and McKeever?
Looks like McGrane's partner will be McKenna, swift or Vernon, probably the latter, in the absence of Toner. O'Neill seems to have disappeared.
McDonnell's team -
McKinney
Mallon
Bellew
Moriarty
McKeever
ORourke
Kernan
McGrane
Vernon
Kernan
Mallon
O'Rourke
McDonnell
Clarke
Kernan
Was at the Game on Saturday.
Not the best of games to say the least.
McKinney was in nets for the 1st Half and Hearty in for the 2nd Half.
Hearty saved a penallty from M Quinn and he also saved a certain goal - one on one.
So maybe Hearty should get the nod ?
Vernon came off injured before half time - he watched the 2nd half from the sideline with one of his feet in a basin of water.
Fair play to Cullyhanna - grand set up
If that is the team then i think that makes 8 changes from last year's team which played in the first round due to injuries or selection
Uladh, probably right, with the MF and CHF the only real questions, McKenna may just sneak it as he is that bit bigger height wise and therefore may take some repsonsibility off McGranes shoulders against a very tall Cavan midfield, but could go either way. Mallon would be preferred in my book with McKeever as a very useful impact sub.
McKenna would be my least favoured of all the MF options, too light and inexperienced, not sure if his height will make that big a difference (Charlie Vernon never gave him a sniff when the Harps played Cross in the U21 championship - the game Cross won easily not the county final we won - and Charlie's not the tallest). If it's not Toner, it would be Nippy for me.
Hearty and B Mallon did themselves no harm at all in Cullyhanna. Francie looked a bit slow, but he was never exactly a racehorse. He made two forays up the field, one soloing the ball when he was dispossessed and the other when he made a foot pass that was intercepted. Best to stick to his traditional role.
On the midfield thing i'd prefer O'Neill in the absence of Toner, though i understand his form is poor this year. He was certainly the best midfielder in the senior championship last year.
Quote from: bennydorano on May 27, 2008, 04:03:20 PM
(Charlie Vernon never gave him a sniff when the Harps played Cross in the U21 championship - the game Cross won easily not the county final we won - and Charlie's not the tallest).
When was this, Benny? 2007? I'd suggest that McKenna has come on since then, though I don't recall Vernon not giving him a sniff (was this the game at Mullabrack?) In fact I thought McKenna was ok, poor by his standards, but didn't think Vernon stood out that day.
McKenna has been playing much better of late. I don't think Vernon will be Armagh's midfied answer now or in the future, while he could do a job I don't think he's best suited there. I feel he can be caught a wee bit flat footed in the middle and he's much better bursting on to balls and surging into the scoring zone.
IMO McKenna (even though it's proba year or two too soon for him), Lavery, Toner and Swift are all ahead of him for an autmatic 8 or 9 shirt. For me Vernon is a certain starter, just not in the middle.
QuoteO'Neill seems to have disappeared.
He came on at full forward on Saturday. Didn't have the best of games but its difficult for him not having played there much. Is Toner definately out for Cavan? If so I'd go for Swift at midfield and fit Vernon into the forwards. Would definately go for either of those 2 ahead of McKenna. I'm fairly sure the backline will be what lined out on Saturday. Hope Donaghy's injury clears up in time though.
The goalkeeping call is tight. Hearty made a great one on one stop on Saturday. I think Hearty has the edge on kick outs, McKinney is a better shot stopper (his 3 saves in the county final last year were top class) while both of them have been shown to be prone to a head stagger or two under a high ball. Given that McKinney has never really got a chance to establish himself in the team during the championship I'd just about go for him over Hearty.
Quote from: Imposerous on May 27, 2008, 05:01:57 PM
Quote from: bennydorano on May 27, 2008, 04:03:20 PM
(Charlie Vernon never gave him a sniff when the Harps played Cross in the U21 championship - the game Cross won easily not the county final we won - and Charlie's not the tallest).
When was this, Benny? 2007? I'd suggest that McKenna has come on since then, though I don't recall Vernon not giving him a sniff (was this the game at Mullabrack?) In fact I thought McKenna was ok, poor by his standards, but didn't think Vernon stood out that day.
McKenna has been playing much better of late. I don't think Vernon will be Armagh's midfied answer now or in the future, while he could do a job I don't think he's best suited there. I feel he can be caught a wee bit flat footed in the middle and he's much better bursting on to balls and surging into the scoring zone.
IMO McKenna (even though it's proba year or two too soon for him), Lavery, Toner and Swift are all ahead of him for an autmatic 8 or 9 shirt. For me Vernon is a certain starter, just not in the middle.
couldn't have been, cross didnt play harps in the 2007 u21 championship. i agree vernon should play but not necessarily in the middle.
hard to pick mcgrane's partner, i think i would try swift and at least there are options to change things. havent been overly impressed with toner the last few times i seen him so i would have lavery ahead of him in the pecking order.
It was 2006 in Mullabrack, and while I dont want to get into a whole 'thing' about it I wrote this on the subject
Quote
Cross were superior in nearly every position and had a far greater cohesion and committment. Charlie Vernon seemed to be the only player capable of taking the game by the scruff of the neck but he had little support although I thought Joe Quigley and Deckie Coulter tried very hard.
Rufus had this to say in his report
Quote
Harps had few players who will look back on this match with any sort of satisfaction, although the efforts of Joe Quigley, Ciaran Clifford and Declan Coulter are worthy of mention whilst Charlie Vernon was, by the proverbial street, our best player on the pitch
David McKenna may well have come on (as has Vernon) but IMO he is not the answer at this moment in time. I would off course be delighted for him to prove me wrong if he does play.
wats wrong with toner that he cant play??
would like to see swift start myself as dont think he has got a proper crack at the whip at county level. saw him play once last yeaagainst the clans albeit at chf and he was the standout player on the field. think mckenna has got a few chances and though maybe the answer in time, the general consensus is it may be a cse of too soon. agree that vernon should start in the half forward line, along with mor and sk.would like see mallon start in the corner however think tk be nailed on to start due to his accuracy from the dead ball and his impact the last day v cavan. leaves a few good options from the bench mckeever, mallon, and oisin
Quote from: Uladh on May 27, 2008, 01:44:35 PM
There might be enough clues in saturday's starting team to give us the championship team, although i haven't heard much about individual performances.
Safe to say McKinney is now number one and the half back line is sewn up?
Malon is a cert and so it seems is bellew given the injury situation. also seems moriarty is nailed on despite peoples' reservations. i think McDonnell has started him in every game has has presided over as manager?
Clarke and McDonnell will be joined by Tony K or McConville it seems and the two wing forward slots are O'Rourke and Kernan with centre forward between Mallon and McKeever?
Looks like McGrane's partner will be McKenna, swift or Vernon, probably the latter, in the absence of Toner. O'Neill seems to have disappeared.
McDonnell's team -
McKinney
Mallon
Bellew
Moriarty
McKeever
ORourke
Kernan
McGrane
Vernon
Kernan
Mallon
O'Rourke
McDonnell
Clarke
Kernan
I think ridiculously this might be true, must be 12 or 13 games in a row now. I've seen him play 9 times this year by my reckoning and I don't think he's played well once, maybe against Monaghan but sure they're shit ;)
Anyone hazard a guess as to what McDonnell sees in the lad because I haven't a clue?
Any chance of Enda making it back for the Cavan game? Maybe if he's lost a few stone he'll stop giving away a couple of hundred frees a game. Would still like like in there ahead of Moriarty though.
he started and think played in every national league game couldnt see him being dropped at this stageesp after starting against the dubs. fellow clubman but dont think hes good enough personally doesnt stand out at club level got a complete runaround last week against sarsields
His name's Moriarty isn't it, sure that's all that matters.
Quote from: charlie stubbs on May 27, 2008, 08:46:42 PM
he started and think played in every national league game couldnt see him being dropped at this stageesp after starting against the dubs. fellow clubman but dont think hes good enough personally doesnt stand out at club level got a complete runaround last week against sarsields
ive seen him getting the run around every time we play the tones. and havent been impressed with him in the armagh jersey either. it is hard to see mcdonnell suddenly drop him though.
Vernon is a must start if we are to progress to the semi-final, he showed against dublin whens he's having a bad day he can still come up with the goods, he's a complete workhorse.
I hope mc kinney gets the number jersey that clown hearty had his chance!!
Hold on a secon d here, a must-start? I would prfer to see Charlie get the nod but to suggest he needsa to start for us to progress is a bit much.
McKinney made a couple of excellent stops against us at the weekend.
ok i accept he's not a must start but he needs to be given a chance, but we agree that mc kinney should start.
I agree surely. Hearty can not be everyone's favourite again becuaseof a great save against Dublin. He is more error prone and I think McKinney shades it, a good problem to have and our county is over run with good goalkeepers.
Having watched a number of games over the past few years featuring the young man, I think it's very worrying for us poor Cavan folk that the biggest thing Armagh fans have to argue about is whether or not Charlie Vernon should get a game. :-[
Your a cute hoor Homer. :P
The biggest worry for us armagh folk is that if stevie and ronan don't preform were fucked, but then again its only cavan no worries at al!!!
Quote from: charlie stubbs on May 27, 2008, 08:46:42 PM
he started and think played in every national league game couldnt see him being dropped at this stageesp after starting against the dubs. fellow clubman but dont think hes good enough personally doesnt stand out at club level got a complete runaround last week against sarsields
Started and think played?? If he started then surely he did play Charles?
Unless you're making a joke that he can't play but I don't think you're smart enough for this!!
Anyone I've spoken to regarding this match seems to think Armagh will win handy enough, I just dont see it myself and would be slightly worried. Has anyone seen any match betting? I would think the bookies would have it Cavan +2/3 at evens, anything more than that it would be very tempting.
Seems to be the feeling all right benny, which is worrying as you say. i can't see much in it. the league encounter is a fair indicator i'd say.
The perception of an easy ride could mean a poor crowd travelling from our part of the world. how many does brefni hold?
Armagh won't win by much, but hopefully they are fired up enough not to go out in round 1 for two years in a row. Breffni holds 30,000, it wll hardly be near full. However the ground will be much more comfortable than Ballybofey, so hopefully some that didn't go last year will go this time.
Armagh 4-28 Cavan 0-10. im afraid. ;)
Quote from: BallyhaiseMan on May 29, 2008, 05:27:24 PM
Armagh 4-28 Cavan 0-10. im afraid. ;)
Ah c'mon thats a totally unrealistic scoreline...
... we'll never concede 10 points with Andy and Francie back! ;)
The more I think about this one, the more I worry.
Those not expecting near a full-house will be in for a shock, the Cavan folk will be out in their droves and plenty will travel from here.
All the signs point to an Armagh win - new manager, rectifying last year's defeats and a much better team on paper.
Of course on the day it will come down to a performance and Cavan could easily catch us out. As I already stated it will come down to the break ball count. Both sides pocess deadly forwards in McDonnell and Clarke on our side and SJ on the other. McCabe should be a handful too but if we win midfield he will move out and eliminat one of their threats.
I say McKenna will start alongside McGrane and this worries me slightly. A great talent but is timing is still abit awol and he would need to be on his game. MOR and McKeever will have to be as fearless as they have been this year to win the breaks on either side of the middle. I think they will win this section.
Very quiet here lads.
What is the story with Paul Duffy, is he on the panel or not, i heard he was playing last weekend against Dublin in Cullyhana, Can anyone shed some light as to what the story is
What about Toner? Don't think he's kicked a ball since hurting his knee in the U21 Club champ, hardly going to be 'match fit' if deemed fit enough to start. Hope that McGrane has shaken of his League lethargy.
Quote from: AFS on May 29, 2008, 11:44:01 PM
Quote from: BallyhaiseMan on May 29, 2008, 05:27:24 PM
Armagh 4-28 Cavan 0-10. im afraid. ;)
Ah c'mon thats a totally unrealistic scoreline...
... we'll never concede 10 points with Andy and Francie back! ;)
:D :D :D :D
Quote from: Onion Bag on June 02, 2008, 03:55:20 PM
What is the story with Paul Duffy, is he on the panel or not, i heard he was playing last weekend against Dublin in Cullyhana, Can anyone shed some light as to what the story is
he's a reserve for the county, theres are 10/15 of them, if someone gets injured these players will get called up.
five reserves plus 10 back-ups.
Quote from: nutsy--1 on June 02, 2008, 05:43:55 PM
Quote from: Onion Bag on June 02, 2008, 03:55:20 PM
What is the story with Paul Duffy, is he on the panel or not, i heard he was playing last weekend against Dublin in Cullyhana, Can anyone shed some light as to what the story is
he's a reserve for the county, theres are 10/15 of them, if someone gets injured these players will get called up.
f**k that, i would rather stay at home than sitting waiting for someone to get injured so that i can get my ass onto the sub bench,
I assume they are already sitting at home waiting?
Well i would assume they are training with the squad, if someone gets injured they are going to have to be up to scratch
So there's 50 training? 35 plus 15 reserves?
Absolutely
So only 20 out of the 50 at county training will actually be involved in the championship games?
I can't see that being too benificial.
Surely the reserves would be better training with their clubs?
Remember that Keoghan's future depends on the outcome of this match ! ;)
Quote from: High Catch on June 03, 2008, 11:29:04 AM
So only 20 out of the 50 at county training will actually be involved in the championship games?
I can't see that being too benificial.
Surely the reserves would be better training with their clubs?
We are only assuming High Catch, we dont know
No i was just agreeing with the fact that the reserves are probably training full time with the panel, so that in the case of an injury they are aware of whats going on round them and they arent coming in Cold
You know the championship is fast approaching when the injury rumours start flying, so here goes -
My uncle went to watch armagh train in dundalk last night (fair crowd of spectators apparently) and he reports that aside from the lads training on their own none of ciaran McKeever, Aidan O'Rourke, Martin O'Rourke or Oisin McConville were stripped out. the very helpful physio (also from dundalk) told him and his friend that the first two are very unlikely to be ready for next week.
ye have te love de gossip.
If thats the case, we're f***ed
Quote from: Uladh on June 04, 2008, 10:35:21 AM
You know the championship is fast approaching when the injury rumours start flying, so here goes -
My uncle went to watch armagh train in dundalk last night (fair crowd of spectators apparently) and he reports that aside from the lads training on their own none of ciaran McKeever, Aidan O'Rourke, Martin O'Rourke or Oisin McConville were stripped out. the very helpful physio (also from dundalk) told him and his friend that the first two are very unlikely to be ready for next week.
ye have te love de gossip.
Any sign of Toner?
Training away apparently. the lads doing their own training included swift, brian mallon and one of the kernans though there were more who he didn't recognise
35 training. the panel of 30 plus five reserves. The other 10 are just kept an eye on at club level.
does anyone know who exactly the 5 reserves are, and the 10 on stand by?
why on earth would Armagh need an extended panel of 50??
Surely the trainings arent that intense.
Jesus lads do the maths it's 45 not 50.
Quote from: Uladh on June 03, 2008, 11:03:07 AM
So there's 50 training? 35 plus 15 reserves?
Im just goin by this man.
Thought 50 was a bit big but 45 isnt much better.
I know your only meant to keep a panel of 30 but I assumed Armagh were just doing what Tyrone done the last couple of years and kept 5 extra and then had these other 15 men, who lets face it bar an outbreak of the black death in the changing room, dont have a hope of playing for Armagh again this year.
Its 30 plus rthe five reserves. The there are 10 more who are in contention but not on the panel. So the panel is really only 35.
it realy doesn't matter how many people are on the panel, its the same 20-22 players that'l be playin. Do the minors play cavan or antrim??
Cavan minors beat Antrim, looked quite a decent side too.
McCabe scored 1-08 in a challenge against Longford at the w;end. Looks like he'll be staying at FF. Cavan were beaten and conceded a high score
Only thing I'd say about McCabe is that he would not have scored a lot from play. Goal was a penalty and a good few frees. He was right in front of me in the second half and to be honest the Longford full back in the second half handled him fairly well and definitely got the better of him. Mobillity is a problem for Dermot I think although there were a few scrambles around the goals just as a result of his pure size. He's a handful but the ball needs to be kept very close to the edge of the square. Johnston only played the last 15 minutes and Cavan seemed to be very intent on putting an awful lot long and high to McCabe. Don't know if it would have been the same if Johnston started but it didn't really change once he came on.
McCabe will be in FF as long as Cavan are breaking even around the middle. Any sign of Armagh getting the upper-hand and he will be out.
Quote from: North Longford on June 05, 2008, 09:02:13 AM
Only thing I'd say about McCabe is that he would not have scored a lot from play. Goal was a penalty and a good few frees. He was right in front of me in the second half and to be honest the Longford full back in the second half handled him fairly well and definitely got the better of him. Mobillity is a problem for Dermot I think although there were a few scrambles around the goals just as a result of his pure size. He's a handful but the ball needs to be kept very close to the edge of the square. Johnston only played the last 15 minutes and Cavan seemed to be very intent on putting an awful lot long and high to McCabe. Don't know if it would have been the same if Johnston started but it didn't really change once he came on.
I know what you are saying but I'd like to believe that these games are a means to test a few tactics. Probably in this case to try and refine the long ball to McCabe which was not so great againt Antrim. To be perfectly honest we would need to do more than break even in the middle to win this game with Armagh. I reckon we'd need 70% possesion from kick outs to have a chance. We just don't have men in the FB line to mark McDonald, Clarke and McConville.
I find it hard to believe that there's any chance McConville will start.
Surely not?
Reliably informed that armagh will line out as follows - McKinney, Mallon, Bellew, Moriarty, Kernan, Toner, McKeever, McGrane, Vernon, Kernan, Swift, O'Rourke, McDonnell, Clarke, McConville.
Obv AOR must be carrying an injury. Not the worst looking team. A bit different.
dmarsden, i am reliably informed that your team will not be starting
DM's team seems plausible from the bits and pieces i've picked up. what difference had you heard naka?
Hard to believe that the team is finalised a week and a half before the game, most people could fill a dozen or so positions at the minute. That team doesn't look too bad, AOR would be a big loss, but on a firmer sod he could be exposed by a nippy CHF - as could Toner. I'd rather see MCKeever at CHB.
AOR is struggling there is no doubt, but my info says that the centrehalf forward /back and midfield berths ( vernon and nippy)are not quite picked yet, also oisin is not a certain starter
toner may still be middle of the park with vernon/mckeever on the 40,
who would play CHB then?
Vernon?
AOR is easily our best CHB. His positional sense is so good that I can not fathom him getting the run around.
If fit, B Mallon has to be a contender for the half forward line.
or the number 15 jersey.
Team I would like to see if AOR is fit.
McKinney
Enda Bellew Mallon
McKeever AOR Kernan
McGrane Toner
O'Rourke Vernon McKeever
McDonnell Clarke Mallon.
How strong would our bench be?
Hearty, Moriarty, Shannon, Donaghy, O'Neill, Swift, TK, McKeever.
Jaysus corn, you're not even giving sk a spot on the bench? harsh, very harsh.
Quote from: corn02 on June 05, 2008, 12:54:18 PM
Vernon?
AOR is easily our best CHB. His positional sense is so good that I can not fathom him getting the run around.
I agree, Corn. When Benny Coulter gave McKeever, no mean feat, (I think he came off with a hand injury that day?) a torrid time in a league game 2 years ago in Newry, AO'R nullified him in the FB line. His reading of the game is supreme and makes up for any waeknesses in speed. A talent Francie also uses to great effect.
I have head from a failrly reliable source that McDonnell intends to start Oisin. Also heard (rightly of wrongly) that AO'R has asked Paddy Og not print his club name on the match programme and that he is infact not injured. Can anyone confirm/deny. AO'R was one of the reasons why I expected Armagh to perform much better this year than expected. I honestly believe that even during the glory years he would have done a better job at CHB than Geezer. Sacrilege? O'R's distribution is better than McGeeney's ever was. Geezer, while often feted for this gave away a surprising number of passes to the opposition.
Toner would do a good job in the in a lot of positions (probably best down the spine of the team) and I don't think he's as slow as some believe.
It would worry me however, if it is McDonnell's intention to give Moriarty the Seany Johnston brief. Finn throughout the League simply gave his men too much room - the only commodity Johnston needs to punish you.
Quote from: Imposerous on June 05, 2008, 01:38:08 PM
Also heard (rightly of wrongly) that AO'R has asked Paddy Og not print his club name on the match programme
Why is this?
Don't believe this for one minute.
Sure they would not be making programmes yet!!
I meant SK instead of McKeever, have been very impressed by Stephen this year.
Quote from: High Catch on June 05, 2008, 01:54:17 PM
Quote from: Imposerous on June 05, 2008, 01:38:08 PM
Also heard (rightly of wrongly) that AO'R has asked Paddy Og not print his club name on the match programme
Why is this?
Don't believe this for one minute.
Sure they would not be making programmes yet!!
Just reporting what I heard. Found it hard to believe too, but source was convinced.
All this chat and fretting about lineups and the like, I wouldn't bother if I was an Armagh man. Antrim and Longford are scoring against us for fun, I can only imagine the feasting that Ronie Clarke, Stevie D and wee Oisín are going to have. Gulp. :'(
Tell me this though, what sort of an outfit have the Armagh minors? I'll be going along mostly to support the young lads, they for one are well managed and prepared and have a decent enough shout after coming through a test of character the last day - not something associated with cavan underage sides.
On the grapevine, Armagh minors are very strong.
I hope Clarke and McDonnell are working well together this year, with Clarke last year we would have had enough to beat at least one of Donegal or Derry and would probably have made the QFs.
just as a matter of interest lads, anyone hear how austy is getting along? first year he´s been in the championship panel so i cant see him making an appearance or anything but any word on how´s doing in training etc?
I also forgot ORourke junior and McConville for the bench, some squad this year. Possibly the strongest squad since 02?
QuoteOn the grapevine, Armagh minors are very strong.
I heard they took an awful hiding off Down a few weeks back though.
Quote from: TacadoirArdMhacha on June 06, 2008, 08:05:27 PM
QuoteOn the grapevine, Armagh minors are very strong.
I heard they took an awful hiding off Down a few weeks back though.
I watched them beat Down fairly handy in the league too, Down must have been missing a few. From what I have seen and heard about Armagh they will be a lot stronger next year as they have a lot of lads eligible again.
Haven't seen this years minors but my uncle is a religious follower of the minor team every year. he reckons slightly weaker than last year
QuoteI watched them beat Down fairly handy in the league too, Down must have been missing a few. From what I have seen and heard about Armagh they will be a lot stronger next year as they have a lot of lads eligible again.
Frig I was near sure it was the minors playing Down I was told about. Wouldn't swear to it though. Could have been a challenge match I suppose.
They beat a full-strenght Monaghan team just before MonageFermanagh. Were missing quite a few too.
The minors were missing a few players due to injuries but most are back at training and they hope to have a full squad for next week :)
QuoteOn the grapevine, Armagh minors are very strong.
steriod-abuse in conjuction with weight-training can be dangerous tho :P
p.s. note to mods: this is a joke!
Quote from: TacadoirArdMhacha on June 06, 2008, 08:05:27 PM
QuoteOn the grapevine, Armagh minors are very strong.
I heard they took an awful hiding off Down a few weeks back though.
Both wont count against tyrone.
The draw yesterday will work grand in (hopefully) armagh's favour. a win of any kind, manybe even struggling, on sunday will slip them into the ulster semi final very quietly. all of the press this week will focus on the replay in newry.
its also an extra game to help tyrone get a head of steam built up!!
or down...
can they both lose?
Hear Vernon hasn't kicked a ball since his injury although has being training normally otherwise, cant be good preperation.
Cavan got well beat by Cork in a challenge on Friday night. Full back line and midfield were very poor so at this stage it not looking good for Sunday.
worrying that armagh have only played one game, against dublin, with half a team since the end of the league. how long id that 6/7 weeks? if they get a win i can only imagine the warly stages being very ropey
I wouldn't be overly confident of a great performance from Armagh. Never seem to perform well against Cavan, and it's a home game for them. There's a lot of question marks over Armagh following the patchy league performances. If Peter McDonnell has come up with a plan to get some ball around midfield then a fit Clarke and McDonnell should see us through, just about. I hope for Peter McDonnell's sake his reign gets off to a winning start and the confidence starts to build.
I was speaking to one of the Cork players tonight and he was saying that Cavan were very ordinary against them the other day and they had a fairly strong side out.
Like Armaike the big fear is tha lack of good game time the players have had. You will one or two players makig their championship debut and others who haven't played a whole lot in recent times. I think this will be a tricky game and if Cavan get off to a good start their dnader will beup and will make life very difficult. Armagh must be strong early in the middle of the field and take the game to Cavan otherwise they will be in trouble.
In sying all that I think they will win but not easily.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/northern_ireland/7324371.stm
Thats an interesting few comments from McDonnell. he says there will be no oisin and at least 2 debutants excluding tony kernan.
if memory serves, finn mo would not be a debutant? nor would vernon?
could that mean McKenna, Courtney or o'rourke junior?
Quote from: brokencrossbar1 on June 09, 2008, 11:24:58 PM
I was speaking to one of the Cork players tonight and he was saying that Cavan were very ordinary against them the other day and they had a fairly strong side out.
Like Armaike the big fear is tha lack of good game time the players have had. You will one or two players makig their championship debut and others who haven't played a whole lot in recent times. I think this will be a tricky game and if Cavan get off to a good start their dnader will beup and will make life very difficult. Armagh must be strong early in the middle of the field and take the game to Cavan otherwise they will be in trouble.
In sying all that I think they will win but not easily.
Pioneer meeting by any chance? :P
Quote from: Donagh on June 10, 2008, 01:08:30 AM
Quote from: brokencrossbar1 on June 09, 2008, 11:24:58 PM
I was speaking to one of the Cork players tonight and he was saying that Cavan were very ordinary against them the other day and they had a fairly strong side out.
Like Armaike the big fear is tha lack of good game time the players have had. You will one or two players makig their championship debut and others who haven't played a whole lot in recent times. I think this will be a tricky game and if Cavan get off to a good start their dnader will beup and will make life very difficult. Armagh must be strong early in the middle of the field and take the game to Cavan otherwise they will be in trouble.
In sying all that I think they will win but not easily.
Pioneer meeting by any chance? :P
Something like that ;)
O'Rourke jnr has to have chance doesn't he? I would not mind him at 15 the way he is playing for us.
Quote from: Uladh on June 09, 2008, 11:37:25 PM
http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/northern_ireland/7324371.stm
Thats an interesting few comments from McDonnell. he says there will be no oisin and at least 2 debutants excluding tony kernan.
if memory serves, finn mo would not be a debutant? nor would vernon?
could that mean McKenna, Courtney or o'rourke junior?
Vernon hasn't played championship before (article refers to Champ debutants). Find it hard to see him starting Michael O'Rourke, seeing as though he blanked him most of the year - I would be happy to have him in cormer forward. Nippy would be a champ debut as well.
Quote from: Uladh on June 09, 2008, 11:37:25 PM
http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/northern_ireland/7324371.stm
Thats an interesting few comments from McDonnell. he says there will be no oisin and at least 2 debutants excluding tony kernan.
if memory serves, finn mo would not be a debutant? nor would vernon?
could that mean McKenna, Courtney or o'rourke junior?
McDonnell is also quoted in the IN this morning saying that McGrane's partner at midfield will be Toner, McKenna or Vernon; I hope it's Toner. Also according to the manager James Lavery will be out for the whole year- disappointing!
Kevin Madden made a good point in The Irish News which may not be far of the mark.
he said if Cian Mackey drops deep like he did against Antrim, he will not be followed out the field and the likes of Aidan O'Rourke may drop back and act as a sweeper in front of Johnston & McCabe
I'd of said swift and vernon had played championship before as subs but of course when i think i can't remember it. obviously the (at least) 2 debutants has to come from vernon, swift, McKenna, O'Rourke, & tony k?
the rumours that aidan o'rourke won't make make it persist so could that bring paul kernan, martin ferris or shannon into the equation?
Quote from: Uladh on June 10, 2008, 11:15:08 AM
the rumours that aidan o'rourke won't make make it persist so could that bring paul kernan, martin ferris or shannon into the equation?
Worrying. Ferris showed good reading and positional sense in the U21 game against Donegal, but gave the ball away countless times. If he could lay the ball off a bit better I'd have him if it were a choice of those mentioned. Vernon could also play in the backline. What's the word on Donaghy. Thought he had a very impressive League campaign and saw him as a certain starter. Is the team that McDonnell names likely to see any late changes or will they play as selected.
Was talking to an armagh panellist yesterday and though they don't know the team yet he had a stab at what he thought it would be, trying to assess injuries and form in training -
McKinney, Mallon, Bellew, Moriarty, Kernan, ORourke, McKeever, Toner, McGrane, Kernan, McKeever, ORourke, McDonnell, Clarke, ORourke.
Does anyone know what time the game is @? 02:00PM OR 04:00PM
3.45 I think?
Cheers Corn, jasus it will be late before everyone will get home, Its a bad bastard of a road between Armagh and Cavan
Cavan team that played Cork
1. James Reilly
2. Michael Hannon
3. Rory Dunne
4. Dermot Sheridan
5. Padraig Reilly
6. Anthony Forde
7. John McCutheon
8. Michael McDonald
9. Mark McKeever
10. Martin Reilly
11. Ronan Flanagan
12. Cian Mackey
13. Eddie Reilly
14. Dermot McCabe
15. Seanie Johnston
at most 2 or 3 changes with Sheridan and Padraig Reily probably switching.
Martin Cahill coming in for McCutcheon.
And thats more than likely the Cavan team.
spoke to a guy who is 100% sure that OrOURKE WILL BE PLAYING, HE HAD A QUAD INJURY
Quote from: The GAA on June 10, 2008, 12:04:59 PM
Was talking to an armagh panellist yesterday and though they don't know the team yet he had a stab at what he thought it would be, trying to assess injuries and form in training -
McKinney, Mallon, Bellew, Moriarty, Kernan, ORourke, McKeever, Toner, McGrane, Kernan, McKeever, ORourke, McDonnell, Clarke, ORourke.
my source in the camp is giving me the same team.
If this is correct I think MOR jr is a better choice in the corner than kernan,would give more to the team and all round play than him
He's got himself on then HB? He never lacked confidence!
I'd have wee Brian in ahead of him jnr!
I'd also prefer Donaghy in the corner instead of Finn Mo, though he did rightly in Cross in the league on Seanie J.
Wouldn't rate finn mo county standard at all from what I have seen of him, though this isn't much just couple mckenna cup matches and the league highlights from the tv. But when the ones from your own club don't rate ya you're doing something wrong!
Quote from: Our Nail Loney on June 10, 2008, 04:36:39 PM
Wouldn't rate finn mo county standard at all from what I have seen of him, though this isn't much just couple mckenna cup matches and the league highlights from the tv. But when the ones from your own club don't rate ya you're doing something wrong!
Couldnt agree more Our Nail Loney, He fouls all day, dont rate him at all, and have played against him on numerous occasions at club level and he never stands out,
Finn Mo is the Armagh equivalent of Dan McCartan and that's not saying much!
heganboy r u sure the mor jr is playing sunday, my info differs ::)
i have been told that this is the one position that is still up for grabs, believe toner will be middle of the park with Francie and Andy Mallon and finnian mo full back line
Quote
Was talking to an armagh panellist yesterday and though they don't know the team yet he had a stab at what he thought it would be, trying to assess injuries and form in training -
McKinney, Mallon, Bellew, Moriarty, Kernan, ORourke, McKeever, Toner, McGrane, Kernan, McKeever, ORourke, McDonnell, Clarke, ORourke.
my source in the camp is giving me the same team.
Strange decision to play Miceal O'Rourke given how little he played him in the league. Think it may work out well however. Don't agree at all with playing Paddy McKeever ahead of Brian Mallon. I seen quotes from Peter McDonnell on Orchard County suggesting that Donaghy may be fit. Would start him if so.
going by some of the posters line-ups we have No freetaker ??? ??? ??? worrying..
Quote from: fcuksake on June 11, 2008, 12:08:02 AM
going by some of the posters line-ups we have No freetaker ??? ??? ??? worrying..
Paddy from the right, Stevie from the left...
no decent free takers then....
o rourke junior will be the free taker, but its no sure thing yet that he is starting,
It's unlikely that we'll see Vernon at all on Sunday. He is apprantly severly bruised from the toe to ankle and is finding it difficult to kick.
When is the team likely to be announded publically?
Quote from: Imposerous on June 11, 2008, 09:45:55 AM
It's unlikely that we'll see Vernon at all on Sunday. He is apprantly severly bruised from the toe to ankle and is finding it difficult to kick.
When is the team likely to be announded publically?
Tomorrow night after training.
Cheers, Goats. Apologies for the previous typo.
We are basing a lot on rumours at the moment. MOR JnR ABC featured in the tail end of the league, so it is viable. At the end of the day, it has been what? 8 weeks from the last league / competitive match so number 15 etc will probably go to who is flying in training and I would doubt we kno wfor sure.
Do people think Breffni will be full for this one? it has been a low key build up
Quote from: thebandit on June 11, 2008, 06:57:12 PM
Do people think Breffni will be full for this one? it has been a low key build up
I'd say there'll be 8-10,000 there of a Cavan crowd, and that's possibly optimistic. Any one with half a brain can see we have a seriously deficient team, especially at the back, and nobody but nobody believes we have a snifter of a chance with the set up we have at present. The minors playing on the same bill should help put a few extra through the turnstiles but judging by the interest and discussion on this thread alone, I'd say Armagh supporters might shade it in terms of numbers on the day.
If the crowd hits 20,000 then the Ulster council can consider it a very good day indeed.
Once again, ye cute hoor!
I reckon it will hit the 20 k mark no problem.
Well the Cavan management and players are sounding confident in the papers this week. Cavan seem to have a settled team and at least know where their problems lie? There's a lot of question marks over Armagh, some players out injured, some only coming back after long lay offs, others getting championship debuts, inconsistency in the league. Hard to know how it's going to pan out.
According to BBC:
Cavan: J Reilly, M Hannon, R Dunne, P O'Reilly, B Watters, A Forde, M Cahill, M McDonald, D McCabe, M Reilly, M McKeever, C Mackey, S Johnston, R Flanagan, J O'Reilly.
so, realistically thats:
Cavan: J Reilly, M Hannon, R Dunne, P O'Reilly, B Watters, A Forde, M Cahill, M McDonald, M McKeever, M Reilly, R Flanagan, C Mackey, S Johnston, D McCabe, J O'Reilly.
Quote from: Imposerous on June 11, 2008, 09:45:55 AM
It's unlikely that we'll see Vernon at all on Sunday. He is apprantly severly bruised from the toe to ankle and is finding it difficult to kick.
When is the team likely to be announded publically?
f**k this man is turning into a real injury magnet, he would remind you of Micheal Walsh of Down who ended up getting dropped from the Down panel becasuse of his injuries
I don't think that was why Walsh was dropped.
Team wil lgo out tonight.
Quote from: corn02 on June 12, 2008, 09:25:42 AM
I don't think that was why Walsh was dropped.
Team wil lgo out tonight.
It may not have been the only reason but his injuries sure didnt help his case
Uusally this thread is buzzing three days before a game.
There are far more armagh than cavan posters and for some reason the cavan lads don't seem to want to analyse their team selection!
We're starved of info on our lads and the gossip runs out of steam very quickly
What team do you think will take the field on Sunday Uladh?
Ha - you're scrapin for any sort of chat about the game! purely on what i think will start as opposed to the team i'd pic -
Hearty, Mallon, Bellew, Moriarty, Kernan, O'Rourke, McKeever, Toner, McGrane, Kernan, McKeever, O'Rourke, McDonnell, Clarke, Kernan.
yerself?
I am in work of course I am scraping for chat.
McKinney
Mallon Bellew Finn Mo
Kernan AOR McKeever
McKenna McGrane
O Rourke McKeever Kernan
O'Rourke Clarke McDonnell.
Fair bit of chatter that miceal o'rourke will start but i'm not sure that'll happen as McDonnell would have given him league action if he fancied him. i also find it hard to believe that Hearty won't be in goals given that McCabe will be looking for high balls launched in. as we've said, its guess work at this stage but somebody surely knows!
if i were picking the team it'd be
McKinney, mallon, Donaghy, McNulty, Kernan, O'Rourke, McKeever, Toner, McGrane, Vernon, Mallon, O'Rourke, McDonnell, Clarke, O'Rourke.
It'll be very interesting to see the team, MCDonnell will want to stamp his own mark on it - there'll probably be a shock inclusion in there somewhere.
I firmly believe if Finn MO and David McKenna both start we will be beaten, not that they are linked in any way - it'll just be one weak link too many. Finnian Mo marking Johnston in the gutters in Cross and marking him in Breffni on firm ground are different propositions, Mo will be on the sideline before 20 mins are gone if he does start. I dont have anything in particular against McKenna, I just think it's too early for him and he's far too light at the minute.
I'd tend to agree with your assessmentof moriarty but he's a dead cert. McDonnell has demonstrated that he has total faith in him. it's way too early for McKenna. one worry i'd have is that burren and E Ciaran lads have both told me that McDonnell is very reluctant to make changes during games. is there harps perspective on that side of him?
Cheers Uladh. Mr. Pain had forgotten about this thread's existence. Cavan are weak at the back. This is obvious to anyone with any interest in the game so its no secret. Mr. Pain cannot see any way Cavan can win on Sunday.
Quote from: Uladh on June 12, 2008, 12:11:17 PM
I'd tend to agree with your assessmentof moriarty but he's a dead cert. McDonnell has demonstrated that he has total faith in him. it's way too early for McKenna. one worry i'd have is that burren and E Ciaran lads have both told me that McDonnell is very reluctant to make changes during games. is there harps perspective on that side of him?
Cant recall that charge ever being levelled at him(although I dont know first hand), his management of Harps was largely uneventful, he would have went unnoticed a lot of the time.
i think its fair to say that andy mallon will mark johnston and toner will play midfield.
my only worry is corner forward ( free taking)and the worry that we havent yet decided on who will partner clarke and mc donald, i think our half back and half forwards are particularly strong with each player on same having a scoring threat,
Armagh by 6
Mr. Pain summed it up as Mr. Pain does-no bullshit and pretty much correct. Barry Watters & Rory Dunne are two young lads with undoubted potential but Keoghan thinks that throwing them in early is good for them in the long run. My opinion is that both will be substituted in the first half after we get an early thumping. We have hope in Johnston and McCabe but we need the ball for that to happen which I don't think we're going to get unless McKeever cleans up with the breaks. Hard to see anything other than an orchard victory.
Quote from: naka on June 12, 2008, 01:05:42 PM
i think its fair to say that andy mallon will mark johnston and toner will play midfield.
my only worry is corner forward ( free taking)and the worry that we havent yet decided on who will partner clarke and mc donald
I dare say that Peter McDonnell knows well and probably for some time who will play corner forward and who will hit the frees.
that us plebs still don't know won't affect things that much
uladh , oisin was going to start until he got injured and from what I hear they are still hoping that his position will improve sufficiently to allow him to take his place
Not what i hear. i believe Oisin was told very early in the year that impact sub would be the role management see him fitting into best
Quote from: bennydorano on June 12, 2008, 12:06:30 PM
Finnian Mo marking Johnston in the gutters in Cross and marking him in Breffni on firm ground are different propositions, Mo will be on the sideline before 20 mins are gone if he does start.
Very harsh on Finnian. I happen to know of him, and he's a fella that has put in a huge amount of effort into his game. I think he'll be able to handle whoever comes his way on sunday. Seen him curtail Johnson whilst playing for UUJ vs DCU in a sigerson game last year. The full forward line that day happened to be Mortimor,Johnston and Bernard Brogan, and delivering the ball in was Paddy Keenan, Eoin Lennon and Ross Mc Connell. Cavan dont have any of the quality of players that i've mentioned here and Moriarty was well fit for the challenge.
On another note, I think Armagh will progress in this game, Mc Donnell seems to get the best out of the younger players and id expect them to stand up and be counted on Sunday.
Quote from: young anail on June 12, 2008, 02:19:49 PM
Quote from: bennydorano on June 12, 2008, 12:06:30 PM
Finnian Mo marking Johnston in the gutters in Cross and marking him in Breffni on firm ground are different propositions, Mo will be on the sideline before 20 mins are gone if he does start.
Very harsh on Finnian. I happen to know of him, and he's a fella that has put in a huge amount of effort into his game. I think he'll be able to handle whoever comes his way on sunday. Seen him curtail Johnson whilst playing for UUJ vs DCU in a sigerson game last year. The full forward line that day happened to be Mortimor,Johnston and Bernard Brogan, and delivering the ball in was Paddy Keenan, Eoin Lennon and Ross Mc Connell. Cavan dont have any of the quality of players that i've mentioned here and Moriarty was well fit for the challenge.
On another note, I think Armagh will progress in this game, Mc Donnell seems to get the best out of the younger players and id expect them to stand up and be counted on Sunday.
Cavan have Dermot McCabe who is better than Eoin Lennon and Ross McConnell and Mark McKeever aswell as young DCU star Ronan Flanagan giving the ball into Johnston,
I hope to god you do put Moriarty on him,Big difference in Winter and Early Spring Sigerson Cup Football and Championship Football in June.
why is Brendan Donaghy not playing? he was brilliant against Donegal last year?
Quite a few cavan men we don't know much about. would any of you cavan lads like to give us a rating on the individuals on the team?
i dont know which players you dont know Uladh so here it goes.
James Reily (Drung) You know about him id say
Michael Hannon(Drumgoon), Best Man Marker on the team, and one of the best in Ulster on his day,will probably pick up McDonnell, He had an off day against Antrim so id expect alot better from him on Sunday
Rory Dunne,(Redhills), Hes a good young footballer only 19,But he doesnt have the speed of the mark to play Full back especially not on a player like Ronan Clarke(If hes on Clarke on sunday, we will lose)
Padraig O'Reilly, (Ballinagh) He might play Full Back,he can play anywhere from 2 to 9,Good player,great fielder,good in Posession but not the quickest in the world.
Barry Watters, (Drung) Another one of our young Brigade,very good player Hes also only 19,Can play in defense aswell as attack, we all on this board think its a year too early for him,and he has Gilmores groin(injury) but Keoghan is persisting with him, a future candidate for Player Burnout.
Anthony Forde,(Cavan Gaels) You know about him
Martin Cahill,(Denn) can play corner back or wing half back,Good in Posession, good positional awareness, but lacks out and out speed and isnt the biggest either.
Michael McDonald,(Drumgoon) big lad about 6'4, good fielder good at kicking scores,but isnt very agile , id also be worried about his fitness as he was just brought in to the panel in earl;y April.
Dermot McCabe,(Gowna) you know about him.
Martin Reilly,(Killygarry) Ex Burnley and youth Irish International at Soccer,Hes a wonderfully talented player with a cultured left foot and can kick scores from all angles,Only weakness is than he is small and relatively light.
Mark McKeever,(Gowna) id imagine you know about McKeever aswell, Great Talent,doesnt always produce unfortunately, he can play anywhere from Half back to full forward,Expect to see him midfield on Sunday alongside McDonald.
Cian Mackey,(Castlerahan) Armagh City FC player, we didnt want to see him anywhere near the team against Antrim,but he was a pleasant suprise, Great pace and ball carrying ability but doesnt have the best feet, expect him to drop deep.
Seanie Johnston,(Cavan Gaels) No Introduction needed.
Ronan Flanagan,(Castlerahan), One of our great young hopes,DCU Starlet,also very versitile can play in defense or attack,Great passer of the ball, Good feet and strong despite being small. Will start at CHF id expect
Jason O'Reilly. (Belturbet), You know him by now
we have alot of good young players like, Flanagan,Reily,Watters and Mackey but they are all small men,probably alot smaller than their Armagh Counterparts.
id be worried about the full back line and midfield.
What happened Lyng?
apart from the obvious i only knew the wing forward O'Reilly, who caught the eye in crossmaglen
Is Mackey the wee speed merchant that would have played compromise rules under Scullion a few years ago?
Quote from: Goats Do Shave on June 12, 2008, 03:03:29 PM
What happened Lyng?
Lost interest and decided to take a break . He isn't even playing club football this year.
Quote from: corn02 on June 12, 2008, 03:07:32 PM
Is Mackey the wee speed merchant that would have played compromise rules under Scullion a few years ago?
Yes, believe he captained the team that year.
I also seen him destroy a very good Down minor team in Cross around the same time. He seemed like a real star for the future, how has he got on since?
Anyone got any idea who is refereeing the game, jasus i have a watched a few games already and some of them are rubbish, Mc Enaney is still the best there is, BTW i hope its not that whore Bannon
McColdrick was grand last Sunday.
Didnt see that game, just the games i seen they were all seriously shite
Quote from: corn02 on June 12, 2008, 03:38:15 PM
I also seen him destroy a very good Down minor team in Cross around the same time. He seemed like a real star for the future, how has he got on since?
Has as of yet never really lived up to expectations with the seniors but at the same time is still performing well at club level.
The Antrim game would have be considered one of his best turnouts for the seniors but from a defensive point of view he allowed Tony Scullion (this could get confusing) to attack at whim and had the saffron man a pair of shooting boots on him we'd be posting in the Qualifiers Round One thread sooner rather than later :D
Homer,
I see you are a Ballinagh man, Just out of Curiosity What stage did yous get too last season after winning the Ulster IFC
Lost the semi-final to Dublin's Fingal Ravens, who then succumbed to Galway's Moycullen.
Fair Play to ya ;)
Any word on the Armagh Team
Armagh:
P Hearty,
A Mallon, F Bellew, F Moriarty,
C Vernon, A O'Rourke, C McKeever,
P McGrane, K Toner,
A Kernan, S Kernan, Martin O'Rourke,
S McDonnell, R Clarke, P McKeever.
Whats everyone think ?
Aaron switch with Vernon...
McKeever drop back with a Two Man forward line
seems that way shorts. much along the lines of what we expected
Vernon's well able to play the position, but hard to see it happening, although people have been crying out for Aaron to be tried in the HF line - not a time for experimenting. Swap Vernon & AK and it's a good solid team, the one real weak link is obvious to everyone apart from the man that matters. Also hope Hearty has one of his better days.
Great to see a Harpsman back on a Championship team (An Armagh one :)) It's been a while.
agree its not a time for expeimentin but looks like we are playin 7 defenders.....two man full forward line thou for sure
We had what was one of the strongest HB lines in the country and he goes and f><ks it up? Surely B Mallon could have been worth his place.
Quote from: bennydorano on June 12, 2008, 11:29:13 PM
the one real weak link is obvious to everyone apart from the man that matters.
what's that benny?
i wud say hes talking about corner back
ah right
Same 15, only lined out as;
Hearty
Andy Mallon
Francois
Finian Moriarty
Aaron Kernan
Aidan O Rourke
Ciaran McKeever
Paul McGrane
Kieran Toner
Charles Veron
Paddy McKeever
Martin O'Rourke
Stephen Kernan
Ronan Clarke
Super Stevie
I had assumed from that that Veron would be playing deep with SK droppng back into the half forward line and the deadly duo up front?
I reckon AOR will play sweeper, Charlie will be in the centre, Aaron fall back & Paddy fall back.
Rufus,
Is that the team for sunday
Would like to see Mc kinney get a shot in nets
As for the rest i would rather have Enda in there in corner back, dont know much about young Mo as i never seen him play
and would have liked to have seen Mick O rourke in the forward line, have been impressed with him anytime i seen him play with QUB
Basically as expected. As strong a 15 as we have at the minute and should be strong enough for Cavan on Sunday and looking at the Omagh game should be strong enough for whoever comes out of that match. Time will tell.
Quote from: Stevie Nicks on June 13, 2008, 08:21:04 AM
As strong a 15 as we have at the minute
its a strong 15, but not our strongest. this is no bad thing however. i would say the team is looking rounded and there is v good cover for all areas of the team. it's early days and we will only start to see what kind of a team develops over the coming month or two..to make the ulster final would be a good year.
like the look of that team, plenty of strength and some very good ball players,I believe ak will drop back into half back as will vernon with Aor playing a free role in the hole between full and half back, we have 5 scoring forwards on the pitch and would also expect ak to pop up with a scor or 2, overall best team we could put out at present
Very physical team. good bench.
who's named on the bench?
16 Ciaran McKinney Pearse Og
17. Micheal O'Rourke Dromintee
18. Brian Mallon Tir Na nOg
19. Gareth Swift Harps
20. Paul Courtney Ballyhegan
21. David McKenna Crossmaglen
22. Martin Ferris Carrickcruppin
23. Barry Shannon Dromintee
24. Brendan Donaghy Clonmore
25. Paul Duffy Pearse Og
26. Stefan Forker Maghery
27. Enda McNulty Na Fianna
28. Tony Kernan Crossmaglen
29. Gareth O'Neill Dromintee
30. Paul Kernan Crossmaglen
cheers
No McConville
Anybody know if the game is being shown on the web by RTE for us out of towners . Thanks.
There are 12 subs on that bench who I would be confident in if they came on.
On reflection, i'm happy enough with that line out. P McKeever will have to play for the 70 minutes rather than the 2 or 3 minutes here and there and hopefully sk can continue where he left off in the league adding a good creative dimension. there was very little physical football played over the course of the league so the question marks over his capacity to cope with that aspect of the game remains.
there's a very strong spine to the team and that's always important for armagh. great options off the bench, even in the absence of McConville.
I feel unusually confident of a win. o dear.
On paper it is ver good. The half-back and half-forward line are packed with powerhouses. SK needs to prove he can play as well in the heat of the championship and I think he will do well, hopefully anyway. Vernon looks like the third midfielder with MOR obviously dropping around that sector too. It means McKeever is going to have to run his bollix off.
Quote from: corn02 on June 13, 2008, 10:43:06 AM
It means McKeever is going to have to run his bollix off.
That would be the obvious worry.
Hopefully Moriarty will prove himself as well.
Andy Mallon - S Johnson
Francois - D McCabe
Finian Moriarty - J O'Reilly
Aaron Kernan - C Mackey
Aidan O Rourke - R Flanagan
Ciaran McKeever - M Reilly
Paul McGrane - M McDonald
Kieran Toner - M McKeever
Charles Veron - M Cahill
Paddy McKeever - A Forde
Martin O'Rourke - B Waters
Stephen Kernan - P O'Reilly
Ronan Clarke - R Dunne
Super Stevie - M Hannon
Heard Oisins back isnt in good shape at all, and he could struggle to play much ball this year for club or county!! Hopefully not the case as irrespective of age or form he was always worthy of a couple of points from play and would be the most reliable with a pressured free!!
Time for others to step up to the mark!! Midfield battle gonna be crucial as with Cavan on the back foot they might crack under the pressure!
Am I right in saying that we won our u-21 all-ireland in kingspan breffni and a few boys in first 15 played that day ? plus another few on the subs...hopefully another good days outing for them sunday.
Off the top of my head: Finn No, Duffy, The two Mallons (?), S Kernan, Swift.
It was in Breffni alright.
Quote from: corn02 on June 13, 2008, 11:28:21 AM
Off the top of my head: Finn No, Duffy, The two Mallons (?), S Kernan, Swift.
It was in Breffni alright.
AK was captain of that team
Quote from: Smokin Joe on June 13, 2008, 11:33:56 AM
Quote from: corn02 on June 13, 2008, 11:28:21 AM
Off the top of my head: Finn No, Duffy, The two Mallons (?), S Kernan, Swift.
It was in Breffni alright.
AK was captain of that team
Well Ciaran McKeever lifted the cup!
McKeever was the captain.
Others I think were Ronin Austin and.....
Quote from: Goats Do Shave on June 13, 2008, 11:35:01 AM
Quote from: Smokin Joe on June 13, 2008, 11:33:56 AM
Quote from: corn02 on June 13, 2008, 11:28:21 AM
Off the top of my head: Finn No, Duffy, The two Mallons (?), S Kernan, Swift.
It was in Breffni alright.
AK was captain of that team
Well Ciaran McKeever lifted the cup!
............ and made a memorable speech!
P Wilson; G Smyth, F Moriarty, A Mallon (0-01); A Kernan, C McKeever, capt, B McDonald; M Mackin, G Swift, G Loughran, S Kernan (1-03), P Toal (0-01); M McNamee (0-01), R Austin (1-01), B Mallon (0-1).
Quote from: corn02 on June 13, 2008, 11:28:21 AM
Off the top of my head: Finn No, Duffy, The two Mallons (?), S Kernan, Swift.
It was in Breffni alright.
Correct, both Brian and Andy played that day.
Quote from: Uladh on June 13, 2008, 11:09:10 AM
Stephen Kernan - P O'Reilly
Ronan Clarke - R Dunne
Super Stevie - M Hannon
I think Padraic O'Reilly is taking Clarke and Rory Dunne on Kernan.
Any of you lads be able to fill in the couterparts of these?....
Armagh HB line vs Cavan HF lineA Kernan - C Mackey
5ft 10" - 11stA O Rourke - R Flanagan
5ft 10" - 12stC McKeever - M Reilly
6ft - 111/2stArmagh HF line vs Cavan HB lineC Veron - M Cahill
5ft 11" - 12stP McKeever - A Forde
5ft 11" - 121/2stM O'Rourke - B Waters
5ft 11" - 111/2stI'm just hazarding a guess with our lads .....
CORN
What three subs would you not like to see coming on. ?
It is more a case of not being ready yet more than not bein ggood enough.
But the three would be Ferris, Forker and P. Kernan.
Does anyone know is it tickets for the stand or just pay at the gate, How many does Breffini Hold?
Tickets for the stand just.
Quote from: Onion Bag on June 13, 2008, 12:07:52 PM
Does anyone know is it tickets for the stand or just pay at the gate, How many does Breffini Hold?
From wiki...
QuoteBreffni Park known for sponsorship reasons as the Kingspan Breffni Park is a Gaelic Athletic Association stadium in Cavan, Ireland. It is the home of the Cavan Gaelic football team. The ground has an overall capacity of about 32,000 with a 6,000 seated capacity. It is one of the few stadiums in the country with floodlights.
Breffni is the historic name for area of Cavan/Leitrim.
Quote from: Sandy Hill on June 13, 2008, 11:42:09 AM
Quote from: Goats Do Shave on June 13, 2008, 11:35:01 AM
Quote from: Smokin Joe on June 13, 2008, 11:33:56 AM
Quote from: corn02 on June 13, 2008, 11:28:21 AM
Off the top of my head: Finn No, Duffy, The two Mallons (?), S Kernan, Swift.
It was in Breffni alright.
AK was captain of that team
Well Ciaran McKeever lifted the cup!
............ and made a memorable speech!
It was a f***ing brilliant speech!!!
I though Paul Duffy was off the panel, yet he is named as a sub???
Veron, K Toner and M O'Rourke are the only 3 players on the team without an All Ireland medal at either Senior, U-21 or club level. On top of that we have 8 All Ireland winners on the bench.
I'm gonna stick my neck out now, and say that apart from Kerry, Armagh will beat any and every team they meet this year!!
H'MON ARMAAAGHH!!!!
Ronan Flanagan is 5 " 7 or 8 max, and as for Martin Reilly being six foot and barry watters being only one inch off that?!
Yer 'avin a laugh mate! :o
Quote from: thebandit on June 13, 2008, 12:20:49 PM
I though Paul Duffy was off the panel, yet he is named as a sub???
Paul Duffy was on the injury list when the squad was announced
Quote from: Hollow Man on June 13, 2008, 12:26:51 PM
Ronan Flanagan is 5 " 7 or 8 max, and as for Martin Reilly being six foot and barry watters being only one inch off that?!
Yer 'avin a laugh mate! :o
I must be :D
As I said it's all complete guess work I actually had a few them down as a bit smaller (and lighter) but felt maybe it was just my pessimism coming through, so I topped a few of them up.
He is a great option there if someone is not pulling their weight namely Finn Mo
Im refering to Paul Duffy by the way ;)
As I said before, probably our strongst squad since 2002. Maybe nout our strongest 15, but the squad list reads well..
Quote from: Abble on June 13, 2008, 08:31:22 AM
Quote from: Stevie Nicks on June 13, 2008, 08:21:04 AM
As strong a 15 as we have at the minute
its a strong 15, but not our strongest. this is no bad thing however. i would say the team is looking rounded and there is v good cover for all areas of the team. it's early days and we will only start to see what kind of a team develops over the coming month or two..to make the ulster final would be a good year.
Any one in particular in mind?? Personally that is our best 15
QuotePersonally that is our best 15
That is a strong 15, but Oisin playing as well as he did as recently as the Ulster club final would be an improvement.
I don't think it would be. My strongest 15
McKinney
Enda Bellew Mallon
AK AOR McKeever
Toner McGrane
MOR Mallon SK
Stevie Clarke MOR/TK/McConville/Vernon
ciaran mckeever captained the u21's to all-ireland glory that year and could be seen as the man who will take over the captaincy from paul mcgrane when he decides to retire.
and no pints this is not to start an arguement given your love for mckeever!
I posted my prediction on the match on the Cavan page so might as well paste it into here too...
"Armagh don't normally hammer teams but I fear that Sunday could be the exception. I think Francie will handle McCabe on the square. I think Johnson will be marked by Mallon and if he causes too much trouble they'll stick a sweeper in front of him. I think that Armagh at worst will break even around the middle and that they will pump high balls into the FF line where McDonald and Clarke will do serious damage. I can see armagh getting 2/3 goals and winning this game by 6 points or more. I hope I am wrong"
As for attendance figures. I'd say no more than 15,000. I don't detect too much hope in the county to be honest. Also, do Armagh people really believe this is yer best team in a number of years. I haven't seen much evidence of that claim so far this year.
I believe it is our strongest squad since 02, a weak squad has been our downfall over the last few years.
QuoteAs for attendance figures. I'd say no more than 15,000.
If true, this would be sad attendance, it is not so long ago that Armagh brought 17-18000 to Ulster championship games. There were 28000 at the last Armagh Cavan game in Clones. It is difficult to know what the appetite is in Armagh since some didn't go to either game last year, but I would have thought we could muster 12,000 without too much difficulty. Cavan are at home, the weather is not so bad and throw in the odd neutral and the attendance will exceed 20,000.
It will easily exceed 20,000.
Quote from: Homer on June 13, 2008, 11:52:09 AM
Armagh HB line vs Cavan HF line
A Kernan - C Mackey 5ft 10" - 11st
A O Rourke - R Flanagan 5ft 10" - 12st
C McKeever - M Reilly 6ft - 111/2st
Armagh HF line vs Cavan HB line
C Veron - M Cahill 5ft 11" - 12st
P McKeever - A Forde 5ft 11" - 121/2st
M O'Rourke - B Waters 5ft 11" - 111/2st
I'm just hazarding a guess with our lads .....
total stab in the dark -
a kernan - 5'10" & 12 1/2 st
a o'rourke - 6'00" & 14 st
c mckeever - 5'11" & 13 1/2 st
c vernon - 6'00" & 15 st
p mckeever - 5'10" & 15st
m o'rourke - 5'11" & 14 st
Quote from: corn02 on June 13, 2008, 03:13:45 PM
It will easily exceed 20,000.
Only on the assumption that Armagh bring 13,000 with them. That's how bad it seems to have gone in Cavan at this stage. The days of the Hill 16 gates being shut one hour before the minor throw in in the 97 Semi Final are a dim distant memory. You can even get a sense of it on this board, the relative level of interest of Cavan and Armagh supporters. We should be really getting excited at this stage, having come through round one and an opportunity to have a go at Armagh but for whatever reason...........looking at those physical mis-match ups I can only assume we are hoping to play a fast running game...........
Im looking forward to the game as more as something to do on Sunday. I haven't even bought the new jersey and that used to be first thing to be done before start of championship. There is no buzz in the county atall this year. I expect Armagh to win it handy enough.
Our Armagh brethern think we're being fierce cute Cavan hoors with all this poor-mouthing, but take a look back through the Cavan thread and you'll see we've been pretty downbeat about our chances all year, since it became apparent in the league that we'd struggle to find our own arses with both hands tied behind our backs. Armagh will likely outnumber us in the crowd and to be honest, I think Cavan fans have suffered enough trekking in hope here there and everywhere to games, for years, and getting f**k all for it. So I for one don't blame them, everyone runs out of patience at some stage.
I'll reiterate that our only hope is Armagh having a very rusty off-day with a new manager that bottles it, allied with our own tendency to play half-decent (like last time against Armagh) when given no chance and there's no expectation to meet.
That said I still think it'll be in or around a scoreline of Armagh 2-15 Cavan 0-12. It might even be worse if Stevie and Ronan click, I really am worried about our defence. Hope I'm wrong but I don't think I am.
I'm more interested in the minors anyway.
Is this match going to be live or replay on the internet? And which site?
Good luck Armagh, dont expect it will be easy Cavan have potential to cause an upset
I'm attempting to watch the Cavan v Armagh game live on the RTE website from the United States.
I believe http://www.hide-my-ip.com/ will successfully but randomly conceal my ip address as being not in the united states. My fake ip address for example may show up as being in Germany or Canada or in the UK but if its not an Irish ip address this doesn't help (i.e.) I still won't be able to watch the game live on the RTE website.
Does anyone know how to permanently as needed obtain an Irish ip address even though your computer is not based in Ireland???
anyone know were you could watch the minor game live? online anywhere?
Does anyone know anywhere offering any odds for the minor match tomorrow? Or anyone know off the top of their heads?
According to this morning's Irish Times the match will be live tomorrow on www.rte.ie but I don't know if that applies to any part of the world other than the Republic.
Cavan 11/4, Armagh 4/11, Draw 8/1. A few things for our Armagh posters. The pessimism is indeed justified-we have little hope. We will be beaten in every sector of the field, from Dunne through to Watters, the two at midfield, the whole half forward line and Jason in the corner. That's too many individual battles that we're likely to lose. Cavan people have a great interest in Gaelic Football but how many of us have been told that we're "some fuckin eejit" to travel a long distance to a game? If you travel further south than Athlone or further north than Enniskillen that's what you're branded. The fair weather fans will be out on Sunday alright but not to the extent of 10 years ago. Gross mismanagement, poor player discipline and overall low morale and expectancy levels means that this coudl be a strole in the park for Armagh. And the worst point I've left for last-I'm not sure I give much of a shite if we win or not. To win with the team littered with post-league blow-ins including the Chicago 3 (forgive, but never forget), the treatment of players such as Fannin, Gaffney etc, talk of lock-ins and all the rest I don't feel like I want us to succeed under these circumstances. Another year written off with renewed false hope for next year will do me. I'll go of course but again, like with the Antrim game, it's more out of habit. Armagh by 8 with 4,000 in for the minor game, 11,000 in for the senior and 3,000 left at 4:50.
QuoteTo win with the team littered with post-league blow-ins including the Chicago 3 (forgive, but never forget)
Johnston is on the panel since December actually. He also scored 1-40 in the league and eight points against Antrim.
Your "point" is pathetic.
You're saying the management's a joke, players aren't being looked after and that you don't even care if they get a result, YET you still feel you can criticise players who missed one match last season (out of 11 in league and championship). How dare you!
Get a grip.
Quote from: Onion Bag on June 12, 2008, 03:39:49 PM
Anyone got any idea who is refereeing the game, jasus i have a watched a few games already and some of them are rubbish, Mc Enaney is still the best there is, BTW i hope its not that whore Bannon
David Coldrick is refereeing Sunday's game.
http://ulster.gaa.ie/2008/06/12/cavan-v-armagh-event-info/
Hollow Man, I've long being reading your bullshit posts on this site without a word of criticism due to the unfortunate fact that you're entitled to your opinion. Perhaps my wording of the Chicago 3 and the post-league players wasn't perfect but don't insult me by telling me who was on the panel and when they joined. Let us also not start a full-scale debate of the 3 men in question. I merely mentioned it as one of a number of reasons that I'm very downhearted about the whole inter-county scene in the county. And yes I certainly do dare to criticie players. If Johnston or anyone else told Keoghan this evening that they were heading on holidays in the morning would you be letting them on their way without a word of criticism? Sure it would only be one game. Don't mind the rest of the panel that are depending on them. And what the f**k does it matter how much anyone scored in the season or one game? Jesus f**king Christ the liikes of this bullshit attitude is just another one I could add to the list. I can almost smell the calibre of response I'm going to get. "he owes you nothing, he's been training hard for months, what gives you the right.............." And I haven't even touched on what your problem with me saying that the managment is a joke is? Have you been hibernating?
The Armagh team will probably line out like this:
Hearty
Moriarty Bellew Mallon
A O'Rourke
A Kernan K McKeever
Vernon
Toner McGrane
P McKeever M O'Rourke
S Kernan
Clarke McDonnell
Amid all the talk of the new style of play under McDonnell, the team that he has named will more than likely play in the Kernan pioneered formation.
Prediction for the game: Armagh 2-13 Cavan 1-10
P Courtenay "I cant wait until tomorrow"
C Vernon "Why Paul?"
P Courtenay "Cause I get better looking every day"
:D :D
Your "point" is pathetic.
You're saying the management's a joke, players aren't being looked after and that you don't even care if they get a result, YET you still feel you can criticise players who missed one match last season (out of 11 in league and championship). How dare you!
Get a grip
Ah yes the voice of sweet reason. Has the latest delivery of angry pills arrived hollow man? I don't necessarily agree with all the sentiments of my fellow east Cavan man but hes damned well entitled to them and no alone in holding them. Hope for one or two results tomorrow
anyone know if the minor games will be on the radio or online anywhere?
The 2nd half of the Minor game is on Radio Ulster Medium Wave at 1341 from 3.00pm.
just asking again, any minor betting?
Quote from: Armagh Exile on June 15, 2008, 11:47:49 AM
The 2nd half of the Minor game is on Radio Ulster Medium Wave at 1341 from 3.00pm.
cheers exile and try oddschecker.com for the minor game betting. usually has good range of betting but not sure bout the minor game
Aye had tried oddschecker an all, looks like none of the major firms offering any... Ah well, I'll do without...
anyone any updates on the minor game?
armagh minors beat by 6 points. 0-13 to 1-4. Armagh led 1-3 to 0-05 at h-time and only scored one point in 2nd half.
they must av been poor or was cavan good? u hear any sort of report on the game?
there was just a brief desciption on northern sound radio. just said armagh were terrible ion second half.
seanie johnston not getting anything today, wonder has he his ticket booked?
Any radio commentary available on the web
Cavan very poor - giving possession away too easily and Armagh a
look like comfortable winners at this stage.
Dec, it's on http://www.fivefm.co.uk/
Quote from: dec on June 15, 2008, 04:19:30 PM
Any radio commentary available on the web
Getting bits and pieces on rte. Can't get anything on www.highlandradio.com, which is unusual
How grey is ronan clarke!
I'm in Chicago and I'm listening to the Armagh/Cavan game on the Internet on Five FM.
Mrs. redandblack4ever
does mr redandblackforever ever get to use his account?
armagh 13-9 now, steven kernan point, having a really good game he is
whata save there from the keeper!!
Quote from: Oraisteach on June 15, 2008, 04:24:16 PM
Dec, it's on http://www.fivefm.co.uk/
thanks, got it.
armagh vs down in 2 weeks- there'll be rows in this house.
Cavan keeper kept them in it...
does anyone else think seanie johnston could be in trouble for the elbow he threw back it will tell us if the boys in the suits are doing there job right it was no differant than Cole's last week i not saying he should but just asking for consistiney
Quote from: heganboy on June 15, 2008, 05:19:27 PM
armagh vs down in 2 weeks- there'll be rows in this house.
Cavan keeper kept them in it...
Should be a good game, I have always thought Down were a bigger rivalry than Tyrone.
Do you think you will make it out to Fiona's for the game heganboy?
well it was what we expected,
First of all Hats off to Paul McGrane for a man of 33/34 he gave an exhibition of high fielding,
a man of 33/34 going up 3 or 4 inches above a young man of 21 in Michael McDonald really shows what is lacking in Cavan Football.
From a Cavan point of view, James Reily was tremendous, his shot stopping was brilliant, his short kickouts effective and to be fair he only kicked 1 or 2 that went straight to Armagh.
Cavan Full Back line done as well as they possibely could with a dominant Armagh midfield.Podge and Hannon were roasted at times when left 1 on 1,but with such midfield dominance like Armagh had,Nothing they could do about it.
Rory Dunne was really up against it with Stephen Kernans mobility and all round ability, Kernan kicked at least 0-2 from play and was very good.Dunne wasnt at the races.
Half back line, Barry Watters wasnt at the races, Forde was somewhat effective dropping in front of Clarke and McDonnell. Martin Cahill was ok,Paddy McKeever his opponent wasnt in the game.
Midfield, A Game of musical chairs, McDonald replaced by Mulvey who was then replaced by McDonald. Neither of them done a thing.
Mark McKeever couldnt compete with McGrane aerially and was moved off him, He was very good from general play and got on alot of ball.
Martin Reily, scored a good point,but was generally ineffective before being replaced,Too Light for this level,needs to bulk up.
Ronan Flanagan,Poor first half at CHF but was good when moved Corner Forward where he won a sight of ball on Fininan Moriarty,didnt get much support though.
Cian Mackey,Mixed the good and the bad, two good points,and carried the ball well,yet done some stupid things aswell.
Seanie Johnston, Kept quiet by Mallon in first half, only scored 1 free in first half, Very good in the second half, and took the fight to Armagh kicking points from play and frees. Hes the real deal as he showed in the second half.
Dermot McCabe,Caused problems for Bellew everytime the ball went in, which wasnt nearly enough, good from frees and scored a point from play.
Jason Reily, totally ineffective.
Subs, Sean Brady should have started,made a difference when he came on.
Lorcan Mulvey, enough said.
Eddie Reily, no ball went in to him.
Dermot Sheridan,only a blood sub.
For Armagh,
Hearty Solid enough in goals
Andy Mallon done well on Johnston,even though Johnston was very influential the second half and ended up with 0-7
Bellew was in Trouble everytime the ball went into McCabe,which wasnt enough from a Cavan point of view.
Moriarty was in trouble with Ronan Flanagan when he was moved into corner forward.Flanagan won a sight of ball.
Charlie Vernon was very good going forward kicking good scores and carrying powerfully, he wasnt really tested defensively though.
Aidan O Rourke was very good at Centre Half back and won a lot of ball dropping in front of Johnston and McCabe.
McKeever also good.
McGrane, Man of the Match,Majestic display of fielding.
Toner,Also very good game,Fielding outstanding and good on the ball.
Aaron Kernan,Only McGrane was so outstanding, would have been my vote for MOTM,He was everywhere,Carried well,Tackled well,Passed well, worked hard. Terrific performance.
Martin O Rourke, covered off the defense well and was good in overall play,Not his best game for Armagh but he was solid.
Paddy McKeever,Thought he done nothing to be honest and was lucky to remain on the field for so long.
Stevie McDonald,Won every ball that came into him,and kicked some great scores,should have had at least 1 goal aswell.
Ronan Clarke,outstanding aswell,very sharp looking,Great in the air and very accurate especially in the first half.
Stephen Kernan,Very good,kicked two points and was full of energy and gave his marker a horrid time.
If i were an Armagh man id be worried about Moriarty and Bellew in the Full Back line against the likes of McCumiskey,Danny Hughes and Benny Coulter,as i didnt think either were very good today.
Your midfield will hardly get the same dominance against Dan Gordon and Co.
All in all no complaints,the much better team won, and Best of luck against Down.
Why did Cavan take a midfielder off after 22 minutes, put on Lorcan Mulvey and then put the man they took off back on again for Lorcan Mulvey ??
What's going on there ?
Were there no other subs ?
Quote from: orangeman on June 15, 2008, 06:51:05 PM
Why did Cavan take a midfielder off after 22 minutes, put on Lorcan Mulvey and then put the man they took off back on again for Lorcan Mulvey ??
What's going on there ?
Were there no other subs ?
Of Course there were
we had Nicholas Walsh sitting there who at least wouldnt have accepted getting outfielded by McGrane time after time.
What can we say? Our Manager isnt the Brightest ;)
Quote from: BallyhaiseMan on June 15, 2008, 06:53:13 PM
Quote from: orangeman on June 15, 2008, 06:51:05 PM
Why did Cavan take a midfielder off after 22 minutes, put on Lorcan Mulvey and then put the man they took off back on again for Lorcan Mulvey ??
What's going on there ?
Were there no other subs ?
Of Course there were
we had Nicholas Walsh sitting there who could at least wouldnt have accepted getting outfielded by McGrane time after time.
What can we say? Our Manager isnt the Brightest ;)
Banty Mc Eneaney did the same thing with Rory Woods a few weeks ago against Fermanagh - there must be more in that school as well as Donal - Mickey Harte did it lst night with Kevin Hughes.
Quote from: orangeman on June 15, 2008, 06:54:52 PM
Quote from: BallyhaiseMan on June 15, 2008, 06:53:13 PM
Quote from: orangeman on June 15, 2008, 06:51:05 PM
Why did Cavan take a midfielder off after 22 minutes, put on Lorcan Mulvey and then put the man they took off back on again for Lorcan Mulvey ??
What's going on there ?
Were there no other subs ?
Of Course there were
we had Nicholas Walsh sitting there who could at least wouldnt have accepted getting outfielded by McGrane time after time.
What can we say? Our Manager isnt the Brightest ;)
Banty Mc Eneaney did the same thing with Rory Woods a few weeks ago against Fermanagh - there must be more in that school as well as Donal - Mickey Harte did it lst night with Kevin Hughes.
Its a sign of Management failure when you have to resort to substituting your substitutes(obviously injury being excpetions). Notice all 3 of those teams that you mentioned(including us) lost!
As the entire Armagh management and team claimed they weren't sure who won the game last night, the answer is Down.
In fact someone has already started a thread on the semi-final.
It seems that the little book of instructions for 'group-think' issued under the Kernan era has continued.Soooooo last century.
Quote from: Dubh driocht on June 15, 2008, 07:49:30 PM
It seems that the little book of instructions for 'group-think' issued under the Kernan era has continued.Soooooo last century.
Just like Championship winning Down teams then...
Thankfully our full back line did well and Hearty wasnt tested. There's obviously room for improvement as they gave away 13 points.
Half backs, midfield and half forwards worked well, great industry and Michael O'Rourke.
The full forward line are natural point takers but not goal scorers. As far as I could tell every chance was blasted straight at the keeper. S Kernan learned from this and did try to jink the keeper but he did well to save that one. Maybe they'd all be better picking their spot left or right.
Great to see such a massive crowd there 2day...match started very quietly though..was disappointed not to see a band there 2day, i usually enjoy the parade (think it gets the crowd going) instead we had bloody Malachi Cushe..ahhhhhh...tell u what that music was soo annoying and loud, Jasus i sound like my mother ;D
Was impressed with obviously McDonnell, Clarke, SK, Toner, Mallon but my God McGrane was something else today...if we have to take one big positive out of 2day it has to be Midfield, it was a big worry to us al during the league,so i hope it continues..... to sum it up i fell we played in 3rd / 4th gear at times, this bunch is capable of more so the future is bright...dont book ur hols jus yet
Thoroughly enjoyed the match today. Thought we played very well and only for the missed goal chances could have won by far more. Think we just had a wee bit too much class for Cavan, who were overally reliant on Johnston and McCabe.
Paul McGrane was absolutely immense. After the Derry game last year I had doubts about whether he'd be fit to continue at the highest level - thought he was way off the pace but I couldn't have been more wrong. Don't think I remember him catching more clean ball in one game in his entire time playing for Armagh.
Clarke and McDonnell both played well without cutting loose altogether. Ronan was probably our best forward. Stephen Kernan also had a decent dame although both he and McDonnell shoulda buried their goal chances. Also kicked 2 balls needlessly into the goalies hands and at least 1 resulted in a Cavan score. Charlie had a good game as well, his point in the second half after Cavan got within 2 was crucial. Only real problem in the forward line was Paddy McKeever, apart from one good score he wasn't at the races at all.
Thought the backs done reasonably well. Ciaran was fairly quiet, Aidan O'Rourke was very effective sweeping in front of Francie. Andy mallon was superb on Johnston in the first half, Moriarty done well and Francie broke well off McCabe.
Only negative point was the amount of possesion Cavan got from short kick outs. Very slack from Armagh.
All in all, a decent performance and if we carry on improving hopefully we'll be fit to at least put it up to Down in a fortnight. Keeping it competitive against a Down side clearly on their way to a 6th Sam Maguire after their heroics last night would be a superb achievement. ;)
Good result and performance. McGrane was immense but I actually would have given MOTM to Toner, for such a young man he was outstanding. All the debutants did well including Finnian Mo whom i would still have serious reservations about- I'd like to think Donaghy should get at least the corner back position but McDonnell's fondness of F Mo is pretty evident. thought Flannagan gave Andy Mallon a torrid time of it in the second half. AOR looks like he's carrying a hip/back injury, although he still played well. MOR got through his usual shift but some of his passing was poor. Some great movement going forward, but overall the style's not overly different to anything Joe Kernan ever did.
Happy to see Vernon have a good debut, still looks a bit nervous and could have got involved more, but he was obviously assigned a role - which he did very well, and he took a great point at a crucial stage after Cavan had scored 3 on the bounce. With a bit of experience he will be a big player for us for years to come. Thought we should have used the bench more, I would have had Paddy McKeever off after 20mins, but his great point probably saved him. The 2 subs used looked brought on as an afterthought.
Down will be a tougher task, they are not the jokers or recent years and they will be well up for it(must be 10 years or more since Down beat us??).
McGrane was majestic to watch today. Kept it simple and didn't attempt crazy defence-splitting passes he used to. McCabe was given a bit of a lesson in what a classy 70 min midfielder is like.
McGrane is some man .Clark McDonnell looked back on form.
QuoteThought we should have used the bench more, I would have had Paddy McKeever off after 20mins, but his great point probably saved him.
Fair enough Benny his point might have saved him after 20 minutes but to play the whole 70 minutes and only produce one decent moment isn't going to be good enough at this level. Can't understand why there were no subs brought on for 65 minutes.
Quote from: johnpower on June 15, 2008, 11:00:31 PM
McGrane is some man .Clark McDonnell looked back on form.
They do to an extent but the newbies aren't of the same quality compared to the school or '02. Good players but not of the McEntee/McGeeney class. Still don't see what many see in Ciaran McKeever.
Quote from: ONeill on June 15, 2008, 10:58:39 PM
McGrane was majestic to watch today. Kept it simple and didn't attempt crazy defence-splitting passes he used to. McCabe was given a bit of a lesson in what a classy 70 min midfielder is like.
Thats a bit unfair on McCabe who wasn't even playing midfield but he has nothing to prove anyway and has delivered many a classy performance himself in that area. McGrane was terrific today but bear in mind what he was up against as Cavan did not have a midfield to speak of, think of the huge amount of short kick outs they took to avoid midfield. I dont think anyone in Cavan can understand why Walsh and Brady were not given a chance there at some stage given the shambles it was but that is just one of the many imponderables that Mr Keoghan has constantly presented to us since he became manager, maybe Donal and his team will go to Chicago this year instead!
A decent performance with Armagh never really looking like they were going to be beaten. Defence played reasonably well, Vernon had a strong game going forward, but could still do a bit going back. Midfield very well and Toner looks like he could be the big plus of the year. The forwards moved well as a unit and had some great back up play. The understanding between the front two is something else.
BUT....Cavan as a team are poor. They have a number of excellent individual players who on their day will cause any opposition trouble. They, however, have no discernable game plan or style of play. It is all very individualistic and opportunistic. The Cavan defence played reasonable well considering the pressure they were under. They had no midfield. the forwards are not a unit and did not seem to know what they were at. Given all that they still took 12 points off Armagh, and in any ones language that was too many.
Down will be a different proposition as they have their dander up and will be cocky going into this game, but I am not fooled by yesterday's win. They are a good team but Tyrone were not physically fit for them and basically that is where Down won it, they wore them down. Tyrone do not have the safety option of giving it to O'Neill or Canavan so they are not the force they were. Armagh will take the hits and give back more with interest on them. It will be a tough encounter but I think Armagh will be too strong around the middle diamond and will launch the win from there.
Quote from: ONeill on June 15, 2008, 11:12:35 PM
Quote from: johnpower on June 15, 2008, 11:00:31 PM
McGrane is some man .Clark McDonnell looked back on form.
They do to an extent but the newbies aren't of the same quality compared to the school or '02. Good players but not of the McEntee/McGeeney class. Still don't see what many see in Ciaran McKeever.
i think its hard to compare these newbies on their first game to mc geeney/ mc entee's etc, i thought they did well today. mc keever was relatively quiet today but didnt need to be as effective, he will have down tortured in the semis.
Not the most entertaining match I have ever been at but kicking 17 points, 14 from play, is encouraging as it is not far off what we kicked in our two games last year.
Hearty - One awful kick-out and dropped only catch of the day (5.5)
Mallon - Did not give Johnston a sniff in the first, poorer in the second but still oozed class (7)
Bellew - Does not fill me with as much confidence as he ued to but solid. (6)
Finn Mo - Played well, conceded little and encouraging (7)
McKeever - Alot quieter than usal, which is probably good for a defender. (6)
AOR- Took a big hit early on, cleaned up well but did not get forward as much as usual (6.5)
AK- Very good at linking attack and defence. The one thing that has annoyed me about Kernan is the fact he wll sprint, catch up with a man but will not bothe putting in a tackle or a block (7.5)
Toner- What a game, rarely put a foot wrong (8.5)
McGrane Gave a display in fielding to match Gordons last week. (9 MOTM)
MOR- Gave away three stupid passes from four at the end of the first half yet the amount of ground covered by him was crazy. Must have set up about five or six points (7)
McKeever - Nice point but hardly touched leather. Misjudged alot and may lose his place (5.5)
Vernon - Thought he was poor to be honest looked a little lost. Kicked a great point when needed and grew as the match went on (6)
S Kernan - To stupid kicks into the 'keepers hands which resulted in at least onecore for Cavan. Poor at winning breaking ball but still kicked some superb scores. Proving me and alt of others wrong. (7.5)
Clarke - He's back. Excellent performance and caught a superb ball for Mconnells goal chance- (8)
McDonnell- His man did not touch the ball all day, a complete roasting (8)
Negatives:
- We dominated midfield for 70 mins and only won by four.
- Our tactics sill remain a touch negative
- Midfield can't possibly perfom as well again.
Positives
- 14 from play
-some fantastic moves and scores
That supid smiley is eight.
Quote from: brokencrossbar1 on June 15, 2008, 11:28:18 PM
BUT....Cavan as a team are poor. They have a number of excellent individual players who on their day will cause any opposition trouble. They, however, have no discernable game plan or style of play. It is all very individualistic and opportunistic. The Cavan defence played reasonable well considering the pressure they were under. They had no midfield. the forwards are not a unit and did not seem to know what they were at.
Well observed, opportunistic is the word. The lack of cohesion and pattern on the field is entirely in keeping with the scatter gun, panic-button, try anything/try everything approach of the manager off it. It's basically a whole lot of different parts being slotted and moved hither and yon in the hope some of it sticks and something comes off. Never was this better exemplified than when McCabe was forced to stride 40 yards to bawl Martin Cahill out of it for going for a point instead of dropping the ball into the square, promptly ignored by Cahill who just turned his back and trotted off. We singularly failed to hit McCabe for most of the day, despite a number of other apeals from the big man himself. What was our manager doing on the sideline and in training that this hotch-potch, disparate collection of individuals couldn't be coached to play a team game and hit big Dermot with high ball? Three times in the second half a decent ball went into him, the first he blasted over for a point and on the other two occasions the ball broke to Johnston I think and scores came of it. But still we refused to hoist them in there despite the evidence it had Armagh in a degree of trouble. The result probably wouldn't have been any different but it was baffling all the same and I suppose just another bewilderment in the crazy chapter of Keogan's messy reign.
Overall the game went as expected. I'd have taken a four point loss before the game, I expected us to be carved up for goals and only for Miller we would have been dismantled entirely. Our 'midfield' was an embarrassment to our county. McDonald tried hard but was literally stuck to the ground all day, Mulvey's rank lack of fitness was so glaring he looked like a bizarre panto character or something instead of an intercounty footballer and only the industry of McKeever saved us from total and utter wipeout. His performance along with that of Miller, Flanagan, Jelly, Mackey sometimes and Sean Brady to an extent show that there is still something there to work with if we take the long view and are prepared to build from the bottom up for the next two seasons. We'll be a soft touch in the qualifiers now and hopefully that'll be the end of Keogan and we can close the book on this disastrous money-saving adventure.
Armagh still have work to do in my opinion. No other team they meet will offer carte blanche in midfield like we did which will curb the influence of Clarke and McDonnell inside, who are serious box office with the ball in hand and the type of players you're glad to say you saw playing in the flesh. Neither hit top gear today and were still head and shoulders above everyone. I'd also be worried about the full back line against a more mobile, team-work oriented unit who are winning more ball around the middle, but they're worries for another day. Well done to Armagh and best of luck for the rest of the year now.
My day was more or less done once the minors won anyway, fair play to them they made heavy weather of it but in hindsight it's best to come through with ample room to improve and without making too many headlines. It'd be massive for us to make an Ulster final now and get back on the national stage for the first time since the 70s, here's hoping. :)
I thought McKeever did ok, he won alot more break ball than he normally does, & after a slow start, where he made some poor decisions, got a fine score & came into ait abit more. Helped out with the aerial bombardment of the Cavan full back line.
Down will be a tougher task, they are not the jokers or recent years and they will be well up for it(must be 10 years or more since Down beat us??
They haven't beat us since 1992 in the first round of the championship. Long may it continue!!! Although they seem to be making a better shape at it this year
Not a very convincing performance but a wins a win and it always heps to get a game under your belt. I wouldn't be too worried about Down - lets sort out our own game.
Quote from: SouthArmaghBandit on June 16, 2008, 09:37:01 AM
Not a very convincing performance but a wins a win and it always heps to get a game under your belt. I wouldn't be too worried about Down - lets sort out our own game.
When is the last time Armagh scored 17 points in a championship match?
I thought it was very convincing, a bit more fortune with the 3 goal chances & the peno for McGrane in the 1st half would have added the gloss, but I though Cavan were very economical.
Overall i'd be happy enough, but its worrying to concede 13 points against a Cavan team with no gameplan!
was extremely happy with performance, cavan got a few handy frees whilst we could have had a penalty as well as 3 goals,sk also dropped 2 into the keeper, was impressed with the movement of all players
Quote from: Goats Do Shave on June 16, 2008, 09:47:34 AM
the peno for McGrane
Are you mad?! I've never seen a man go down so easy in intercounty football. It wouldn't be a penalty in a Junior D game.
QuoteMcCabe was given a bit of a lesson in what a classy 70 min midfielder is like.
McCabe is one of the classiest midfielders Ulster football has ever seen. I say again, get a grip!
Cavan Maniac, great post. I agree 100 per cent.
Quote from: Hollow Man on June 16, 2008, 11:29:06 AM
QuoteMcCabe was given a bit of a lesson in what a classy 70 min midfielder is like.
McCabe is one of the classiest midfielders Ulster football has ever seen. I say again, get a grip!
Cavan Maniac, great post. I agree 100 per cent.
Yeah 10 years ago maybe!
Overall, quite happy with yesterday's performance, postive things were our midfield performance (although Cavan were rank in this department), the fact that when Cavan did tag a few scores on we seemed to be able to come back with a few scores ourselves, and also Clarke and McDonnell are back approaching their best.
I think that Peter McDonnell can be happy with his first outing as his more expansive gameplan did work well. I also think he was very brave in leaving Charlie Vernon on and that should be a fillip for the lad. As others have said he looked nervous and made a few mistakes and another manager could've taken him off but he left him out there and he grew into the game. If he gains more confidence in himself he'll be a big asset to us.
In the long run our move away from our reliance on the diagonal ball will reap benefits for Clarke and McDonnell as better passing and movement in the half forward line will draw defenders out from in front of them.
Quote from: screenexile on June 16, 2008, 11:38:47 AM
Quote from: Hollow Man on June 16, 2008, 11:29:06 AM
QuoteMcCabe was given a bit of a lesson in what a classy 70 min midfielder is like.
McCabe is one of the classiest midfielders Ulster football has ever seen. I say again, get a grip!
Cavan Maniac, great post. I agree 100 per cent.
Yeah 10 years ago maybe!
Screenexile can you not take your victory and show a bit of class? McCabe was goosing Tohill in an Ulster final before he hit his twenties, and beat Down on his own a few short years ago despite being crippled with the injuries that have curtailed him the majority of his career. He was doing it on the big stage and had his Allstar banked before McGrane became the household name he is today, and caused plenty of problems for big Francie on Sunday too, despite being criminally underused.
Perhaps you don't know too much about him just because he hasn't won as much as the Armagh lads, or because you think football didn't start until September 2002.
eh, i don't think screen exile is from armagh there fella
Well wherever he's from he could wind his neck in a wee bit, we have feck all to cling to in Cavan I didn't think I'd ever have to listen to ayone doubting McCabe's credentials... :-X
i accept your apology on behalf of the good people of armagh
Decent enough performance all round.
Although they tried hard the Cavan defence is very poor & Armagh could easily have ended up with 3-20.
Mc Grane & Toner played well and hope they carry this through to the Down game.
The passing in to Mc Donnell & Clarke was very good as was the movement from the inside line.
Good to see SK shining. A very good player who should flourish now there seems to be less pressure on him as JK is gone. Wonder will any critics from the board give him the praise he deserves now :-\
As for Down, you would have thought the won the Mc Kenna cup again ;) on Saturday evening the way they celebrated.
Cant f**king wait for the semi. It will give us the chance to put them boys in their box again
QuoteA very good player who should flourish now there seems to be less pressure on him as JK is gone. Wonder will any critics from the board give him the praise he deserves now Undecided
I think most people on here criticise when a player plays badly but give credit when he does well. In SK's case, there was a lot of the former in his first couple of years on the panel but much more of the former in the past 6 months.
I think if you read back Fillback I and others who doubted him gave him praise for yesterday.
Do ya think Joe's nice pink top was a present from the boys yesterday?
Can anyone send me a CD / DVD of the Cavan v Armagh match? I know the game was shown live on BBC2 and is also available on the RTE website but only if you're on the island of Ireland. I will pay but I desperately want to watch the entire game. Please send me a private message if you can help me out. Thanks