Martin Mc Guinness Passes Away at 66

Started by vallankumous, January 09, 2017, 10:51:11 PM

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Owen Brannigan

Quote from: theticklemister on April 02, 2017, 12:33:36 AM
Quote from: Minder on April 01, 2017, 10:31:39 PM
Quote from: grounded on April 01, 2017, 10:29:22 PM
The only thing that has any hope of working would be some form of truth and reconciliation forum like they had in SA. Anyrhing else i.e. trying to exclusively blame one group or another wont work. Many groups had a hand in the '  troubles '  e.g. both governments,  some political parties,  paramilitary groups and others.
                     By the logic of McGarry Sinn Fein, Fianna Fail and Fianna Gael should also apologise for the actions of the IRA during the war of independence or were their actions justified(there were plenty of atrocities during this conflict as well)?
                 
                     

It will never happen

Just like........

No decommissioning
Smash Stormont
No to meeting the Queen

  ::) ::) ::)


It will never happen because SF will never tolerate a truth commission where its members will be expected to come forward to take ownership for their actions even when if an amnesty is offered.

grounded

Quote from: Owen Brannigan on April 02, 2017, 11:50:07 AM
Quote from: theticklemister on April 02, 2017, 12:33:36 AM
Quote from: Minder on April 01, 2017, 10:31:39 PM
Quote from: grounded on April 01, 2017, 10:29:22 PM
The only thing that has any hope of working would be some form of truth and reconciliation forum like they had in SA. Anyrhing else i.e. trying to exclusively blame one group or another wont work. Many groups had a hand in the '  troubles '  e.g. both governments,  some political parties,  paramilitary groups and others.
                     By the logic of McGarry Sinn Fein, Fianna Fail and Fianna Gael should also apologise for the actions of the IRA during the war of independence or were their actions justified(there were plenty of atrocities during this conflict as well)?
                 
                     

It will never happen

Just like........

No decommissioning
Smash Stormont
No to meeting the Queen

  ::) ::) ::)


It will never happen because SF will never tolerate a truth commission where its members will be expected to come forward to take ownership for their actions even when if an amnesty is offered.

I think there are secrets that many groups would like to keep secret for a generation or two. Pat Finucane being only one example. Unfortunately I get the feeling that this is the way of it. Let the secrets die off with the protagonists. When the government's open the files in 50 years or so who will care?

Owen Brannigan

Quote from: grounded on April 02, 2017, 12:57:24 PM
Quote from: Owen Brannigan on April 02, 2017, 11:50:07 AM
Quote from: theticklemister on April 02, 2017, 12:33:36 AM
Quote from: Minder on April 01, 2017, 10:31:39 PM
Quote from: grounded on April 01, 2017, 10:29:22 PM
The only thing that has any hope of working would be some form of truth and reconciliation forum like they had in SA. Anyrhing else i.e. trying to exclusively blame one group or another wont work. Many groups had a hand in the '  troubles '  e.g. both governments,  some political parties,  paramilitary groups and others.
                     By the logic of McGarry Sinn Fein, Fianna Fail and Fianna Gael should also apologise for the actions of the IRA during the war of independence or were their actions justified(there were plenty of atrocities during this conflict as well)?
                 
                     

It will never happen

Just like........

No decommissioning
Smash Stormont
No to meeting the Queen

  ::) ::) ::)


It will never happen because SF will never tolerate a truth commission where its members will be expected to come forward to take ownership for their actions even when if an amnesty is offered.

I think there are secrets that many groups would like to keep secret for a generation or two. Pat Finucane being only one example. Unfortunately I get the feeling that this is the way of it. Let the secrets die off with the protagonists. When the government's open the files in 50 years or so who will care?


In this country?

Avondhu star

Quote from: Owen Brannigan on April 02, 2017, 01:05:56 PM
Quote from: grounded on April 02, 2017, 12:57:24 PM
Quote from: Owen Brannigan on April 02, 2017, 11:50:07 AM
Quote from: theticklemister on April 02, 2017, 12:33:36 AM
Quote from: Minder on April 01, 2017, 10:31:39 PM
Quote from: grounded on April 01, 2017, 10:29:22 PM
The only thing that has any hope of working would be some form of truth and reconciliation forum like they had in SA. Anyrhing else i.e. trying to exclusively blame one group or another wont work. Many groups had a hand in the '  troubles '  e.g. both governments,  some political parties,  paramilitary groups and others.
                     By the logic of McGarry Sinn Fein, Fianna Fail and Fianna Gael should also apologise for the actions of the IRA during the war of independence or were their actions justified(there were plenty of atrocities during this conflict as well)?
                 
                     

It will never happen

Just like........

No decommissioning
Smash Stormont
No to meeting the Queen

  ::) ::) ::)


It will never happen because SF will never tolerate a truth commission where its members will be expected to come forward to take ownership for their actions even when if an amnesty is offered.

I think there are secrets that many groups would like to keep secret for a generation or two. Pat Finucane being only one example. Unfortunately I get the feeling that this is the way of it. Let the secrets die off with the protagonists. When the government's open the files in 50 years or so who will care?


In this country?
Sure the files in Kew from 1916 to 1921 are still restricted
Lee Harvey Oswald , your country needs you

grounded

Quote from: Owen Brannigan on April 02, 2017, 01:05:56 PM
Quote from: grounded on April 02, 2017, 12:57:24 PM
Quote from: Owen Brannigan on April 02, 2017, 11:50:07 AM
Quote from: theticklemister on April 02, 2017, 12:33:36 AM
Quote from: Minder on April 01, 2017, 10:31:39 PM
Quote from: grounded on April 01, 2017, 10:29:22 PM
The only thing that has any hope of working would be some form of truth and reconciliation forum like they had in SA. Anyrhing else i.e. trying to exclusively blame one group or another wont work. Many groups had a hand in the '  troubles '  e.g. both governments,  some political parties,  paramilitary groups and others.
                     By the logic of McGarry Sinn Fein, Fianna Fail and Fianna Gael should also apologise for the actions of the IRA during the war of independence or were their actions justified(there were plenty of atrocities during this conflict as well)?
                 
                     

It will never happen

Just like........

No decommissioning
Smash Stormont
No to meeting the Queen

  ::) ::) ::)


It will never happen because SF will never tolerate a truth commission where its members will be expected to come forward to take ownership for their actions even when if an amnesty is offered.

I think there are secrets that many groups would like to keep secret for a generation or two. Pat Finucane being only one example. Unfortunately I get the feeling that this is the way of it. Let the secrets die off with the protagonists. When the government's open the files in 50 years or so who will care?


In this country?

I suppose you're right, its unlikely that most of the illegal activities carried out on and behalf of the British state will ever be revealed. Too many high level political players would be implicated.

theskull1

Quote from: Applesisapples on March 22, 2017, 10:33:17 AM
I will repeat, read James Kelly's Bonfires on the Hillsides.

Thanks for the recommendation Apples. Read this over the weekend and really enjoyed it. Sadly Westminsters 'keep the black north at arms length' approach is back in fashion again as they've bigger fish to fry with Europe.
It's a lot easier to sing karaoke than to sing opera

Applesisapples

Quote from: theskull1 on April 20, 2017, 11:31:42 AM
Quote from: Applesisapples on March 22, 2017, 10:33:17 AM
I will repeat, read James Kelly's Bonfires on the Hillsides.

Thanks for the recommendation Apples. Read this over the weekend and really enjoyed it. Sadly Westminsters 'keep the black north at arms length' approach is back in fashion again as they've bigger fish to fry with Europe.
Glad you enjoyed it, must read it again myself.

Tony Baloney

Quote from: Applesisapples on April 20, 2017, 04:53:23 PM
Quote from: theskull1 on April 20, 2017, 11:31:42 AM
Quote from: Applesisapples on March 22, 2017, 10:33:17 AM
I will repeat, read James Kelly's Bonfires on the Hillsides.

Thanks for the recommendation Apples. Read this over the weekend and really enjoyed it. Sadly Westminsters 'keep the black north at arms length' approach is back in fashion again as they've bigger fish to fry with Europe.
Glad you enjoyed it, must read it again myself.
What year was this published? I remember going to get my granny a copy at a signing in Donegall St. by James Kelly.

theskull1

Quote from: Tony Baloney on April 20, 2017, 06:49:37 PM
What year was this published? I remember going to get my granny a copy at a signing in Donegall St. by James Kelly.

1995 Tony
It's a lot easier to sing karaoke than to sing opera


theskull1

I paid less than half that for my 2nd hand copy off Amazon a few weeks ago
It's a lot easier to sing karaoke than to sing opera

Owen Brannigan

Quote from: theskull1 on April 21, 2017, 12:00:14 AM
I paid less than half that for my 2nd hand copy off Amazon a few weeks ago

Apparently the secondhand market is quite fluid and prices are fluctuating greatly.  In the last few weeks the Lost Lives: The Stories of the Men, Women and Children Who Died as a Result of the Northern Ireland Troubles has rocketed to £150 secondhand.

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Lost-Lives-Children-Northern-Troubles/dp/184018504X