Armagh Club football & hurling

[winsamsoon]

Yes put the harps in aswell. Cullyhanna too as they took the cross to a replay last year. Sure stick everyone in then that will eradicate n e hard feelings

[charlie stubbs]

Prob a bit premature but is this the start of another ten years of Cross dominance? No one could have forecast them winning Ulster this year, never mind the AI. The usual suspects will fancy themselves of toppling them, Ogs, Dromintee, Clans etc, will the next ten years be more competitive than the last? The current Cross team isn't as good on paper as days gone by yet they still do the business. Also are there any new forces making the break through? I think Clann Eireann have the potential in a few years they seem to clean up from U14 down.

Not sure Clans are in this bracket at the minute.  A very young team, who could develop over the next few years, though were very poor in last years championship and easily beaten by cullyhanna.  Imo St Pats, Og's, Dromintee and possibly Granemore will offer the biggest threat of toppling cross this year.  Granemore got a number of players back toward end of last year and have been knocking on the door for the last few years. A couple of big wins the last few years in cship v ogs and pats.  Was speaking to a harps player the other week and they have had a number of retirements/players not playing next year, so I feel getting back to div 1 be their main priority. 

[winsamsoon]

we will be happy enough not to be in that bracket as brackets count for fook all lad. Every game is different, the outcome is unknown.  In the championship anything can happen i would be confident we could beat Og's, Dromintee, Cullyhann or Granemore. Cross deserve a little more respect as they are the current holders but i certainly haven't seen anything from them that renders them unbeatable. Looking forward to the start of the season lads, opinions will chop and change and the banter will be as good as always. Has been a long winter and this thread has been too quiet.

[brokencrossbar1]

Lads answer me this, why do people feel that this Cross team is any more beatable than previous teams that have won the AI.  They have been variously described as mediocre, average, not quite as good as previous teams.  They are not as big as the team that I played on but they are significantly faster and younger.  Take Oisin out of the starting outfield team(Hearty has a longer career than the outfiueld players therefore I don't count him) then the average ages is something like 22.  Everyone of the starting defence is under 26.  The 2 midfielders are under 23, and the forward line apart from Oisin and SK are all under 25.  The point I am making is that they are all still maturing into men and I feel when they do they will be just as dominant as we were but the reality is when we were their age we never thought we would do what we eventually did.  They have a better bedrock then we had and an evolved system.  I don't know whether they will do what we did but I reckon that many people underestimate them.

[winsamsoon]

I would agree with what u are saying BC but even when I was playing against the so called past cross team that was so dominate I always went onto the pitch believing I could win. I still believe we can beat the cross if we play to our potential but that is only my opinion I wouldn't play football if I thought I was going out to get beat. On the issue of will the cross dominate for years to come like the past team. I would say no, they undoubtedly set a very high benchmark but I think the other teams have the potential to improve more than cross. Cross are not going to go any highier than winning an all Ireland as it is the highest achievement. I feel this will motivate other teams like the ogs did two years ago to give it a good rattle. With the resources available to clubs now this process shouldn't take ten years if the clubs are worth their salt

[Scarface]

BC - Cross will still take all the beating....in answer to your question tho, this team is not as intimidating as some of the other teams....you would feel you would have more of a chance against this current team...although there are good young players there now I feel it will be almost impossible to replace the 2 Mac's, Oisin, Francie and Donaldson. That was a very strong core of players - a few of which were exceptional. You have obviosuly unearthed a gem in Jamie Clarke though who looks a top player.

Winsamson - I know that it is never the 'done thing' to say you really did not believe that you could win a game but there were probably sometimes when you played Cross when you knew that it would be almost impossible for you to win. For example in that c'ship game a few years ago were they gave Clans a serious drubbing, you did not really believe that you were going to win that game did you? If you did you were being very gallant albeit terribly unrealistic. Clans surely have not beaten Cross in a meaningful game in years?

[brokencrossbar1]

BC - Cross will still take all the beating....in answer to your question tho, this team is not as intimidating as some of the other teams....you would feel you would have more of a chance against this current team...although there are good young players there now I feel it will be almost impossible to replace the 2 Mac's, Oisin, Francie and Donaldson. That was a very strong core of players - a few of which were exceptional. You have obviosuly unearthed a gem in Jamie Clarke though who looks a top player.

Winsamson - I know that it is never the 'done thing' to say you really did not believe that you could win a game but there were probably sometimes when you played Cross when you knew that it would be almost impossible for you to win. For example in that c'ship game a few years ago were they gave Clans a serious drubbing, you did not really believe that you were going to win that game did you? If you did you were being very gallant albeit terribly unrealistic. Clans surely have not beaten Cross in a meaningful game in years?

Scarface, they are a different type of team and I have to wonder where all this confidence stems from.  In the last 2 years we have been beaten 3 times I think it is in competetive football.  Obviously once by the Ogs and I thnk twice in the league over the 2 years.  Certainly Culloville beat us last year and maybe Dromintee the year before.  In many of those league games there would have been a good few absentees(as there would obviously have been in some of the other teams) but the point I am making is that even given the argument that this is a "lesser" team than we were before they still have a high rate of victories and are certainly a more rounded squad then we were before.  Time will tell but I think that the confidence of winning in Croke Park will give the likes of Jamie, Aaron cunningham, Johnny Hanratty etc an unbelieveable boost in confidence, remember none of the Kernans womn a club game in Croke Park either, nice wee lift there too.

[winsamsoon]

Well going on your reasoning then the only team that has beaten cross in a meaningful game is the ogs. But I can assure u all our games are meaningful against the cross even the league games. Especially the 2006 championship final. Saying that we had no belief that we could beat the cross is comical. We trained very hard in the two previous years to that championship game and that year. Do u seriously think we took the field of play expecting to loose? If we meet the cross this year in the latter stages of the championship our lads will be blooming with confidence and ready to win. A small matter of cruppen to get over first though 

[Scarface]

Understood Winsamson....having a healthier level of competition in Armagh football will be to everyones benefit anyway.

I still believe that many teams in Armagh were defeated before they started when playing Cross...then again when you looked at the opposing levels of artillery at hand it was a reasonable enough thought...bit like Grenada saying they were going to defeat America in a war....

[Applesisapples]

As a neutral observer I would have to say the current Cross team has a lot more potential than previous incarnations. In my opinion the previous team was set up to grind the opposition down, it had some great footballers not least of which was Oisin, the current team is still capable of doing that but has a greater number of superb footballers. I think the best is yet to come.

[winsamsoon]

Well I'll state it here now then cross will not win the next ten championships in Armagh at senior level. Any prices on offer?

[charlie stubbs]

Well going on your reasoning then the only team that has beaten cross in a meaningful game is the ogs. But I can assure u all our games are meaningful against the cross even the league games. Especially the 2006 championship final. Saying that we had no belief that we could beat the cross is comical. We trained very hard in the two previous years to that championship game and that year. Do u seriously think we took the field of play expecting to loose? If we meet the cross this year in the latter stages of the championship our lads will be blooming with confidence and ready to win. A small matter of cruppen to get over first though

winsam you may have had the opinion that you were going to beat cross in the final and confidence in your own ability is a good thing imo.  To get to the county final, the lads obviously would have been confident and rightly so.  however, when you consider cross had won the previous 11 championships there is bound to have been doubts in some of your players minds if you could beat cross that day(especially when bumpy got the line?)?

[winsamsoon]

listen lads on the day of a game of football the past really counts for nothing it is all what happens on the day. If say for example a team had won 100 championships in a row it wouldn't neccessarily mean they won win the 101st. The same goes for the Armagh championship this is why we play football to win. In 2006 we got to a county final and it was the hardest two years of training we had ever done we also won the league that year. Everyone of our players felt that we could beat cross. I was playing that day and i certainly felt we were well in the game. When Bumpy got the line as you correctly say obviously that was a big blow to us as he was not only a leader on the pitch for us but also our main scoring threat ie free taker and long range points. The sending off occured after about 17 mins and at that time the score was something like 3-3. At half time in that game it was more hopeful than confident as we realised it was always going to be uphill with 14 men against a team of the calibre of cross. Cross came out and got a quick goal which killed the game off as a contest. There finished something like 8 or 9 points in it. IMO if we would have had the full quota of players we were in with a great chance of beating Cross in Cross that day. Now since that we have declined rapidly with a large number of retirements and a large number of youth players coming on board. The last two years in particular were very poor but we have a new management set up this year and things are going pretty well. Theres a good bunch of lads there so we won't be lacking any confidence come the 17th of April and come the championship.

[charlie stubbs]

listen lads on the day of a game of football the past really counts for nothing it is all what happens on the day. If say for example a team had won 100 championships in a row it wouldn't neccessarily mean they won win the 101st. The same goes for the Armagh championship this is why we play football to win. In 2006 we got to a county final and it was the hardest two years of training we had ever done we also won the league that year. Everyone of our players felt that we could beat cross. I was playing that day and i certainly felt we were well in the game. When Bumpy got the line as you correctly say obviously that was a big blow to us as he was not only a leader on the pitch for us but also our main scoring threat ie free taker and long range points. The sending off occured after about 17 mins and at that time the score was something like 3-3. At half time in that game it was more hopeful than confident as we realised it was always going to be uphill with 14 men against a team of the calibre of cross. Cross came out and got a quick goal which killed the game off as a contest. There finished something like 8 or 9 points in it. IMO if we would have had the full quota of players we were in with a great chance of beating Cross in Cross that day. Now since that we have declined rapidly with a large number of retirements and a large number of youth players coming on board. The last two years in particular were very poor but we have a new management set up this year and things are going pretty well. Theres a good bunch of lads there so we won't be lacking any confidence come the 17th of April and come the championship.

saw yous play maghery in league last year and was impressed with you that day,lot of young lads showed up very well. from talking to a few of your players management and discipline were a few reasons why you were not as consistent as you would have liked last year.  with a new management team, hopefully for your sake these can be ironed out and yous can bring these lads on.  would be good have a north armagh team in latter stages of cship this year.  I know from our own club a number of retirements can be hard to take and the younger lads can take time to find their feet playing senior football. 

[winsamsoon]

Have u got ur cruppen top ironed for the championship yet