Armagh Club football & hurling

[fcuksake]

Missing 7/8 first team starters, not to mention the many many many more who have left the Harps since underage success e.g. I was talking to Martin McCoy and Kevin Kelly in the club after a game around 4 weeks ago, they told me that of the 30-something members of the County Armagh winning Feile Side in 2001 who travelled down south, they are the only 2 still playing. Says something about the state of affairs that 30 odd lads from just one age group can drop away. In dreamland, the Harps would certainly be the 2nd best team competing to be the best. Reality sucks.

That is dreadful Nahsville.

Of 3 Cross teams that went to the Feile Finals over the last 20 years or so the breakdown that played/play is probably something like this

1988 - 12 of us were on the senior squad for minimum 10 years, 6 are still playing.

1996 - 12 made the senior squad and 8-9 are still playing

2001 I think - about 7 of them have graduated to the senior squad.

So basically you have the core of the Cross squad is made up of those 3 teams with the likes of John D, added in.  If Harps cannot do something about this then there is only one road they will go.

To be fair BC, you and I have had this conversation before and I have been consistently trying to explain that this is a modern urban phenomenon. I am not going to get into exact stats here, but the Ogs and the Harps have underage success to match that of Cross, no doubt about it. Around the late eighties / early nineties we won a number of County Feile titles.

I recall, after running Cross to four points in the 2003 County semi-final, with a very young team, feeling elated with the manner of the perfromance and confidently predicting a Senior Title in five years. Half of that team is gone and with it dreams turned to dust. This time last year I named a Harps fifteen who had played County football (minor / Senior), were still of footballing age and who were not playing football at all - the reality of our situation. Meanwhile, a matter of weeks ago I go up to Cross and watch a young team hammer our Seniors - a young team made up of promising young players who are beating down the door (and probably each other in training) to get onto the Senior Team, i.e. success breeding success.

That is the reason why I believe Cross could win twenty titles in a row.

I agree Rufus that urban clubs can face difficulties that county clubs don't.  However, the minset of the individuals involved is everything.  Down here in Cork the bedrock of the GAA is urban.  You have Nemo who produce the majority of Cork titles from a few housing estates in the south city area.  Douglas are historically their great rivals(they are next door to each other and were originally one club I believe until a split in the 50-60's, and they wear the same coloured jersies) who are one of the up and coming clubs, Na Piarsaigh who have the O Hailpins and Gardiner and have the best underage structure I have ever heard of in a club, Blackrock, Sarsfields and St Finnbarrs are all strong clubs. The Glen (who the great Christy Ring palyed for and who have 3-4 Cork hurling panellists) and Erins Own(Brian Corcoran's team) are both urban teams. Outside of the west cork football teams, (Castlehaven, Clonakilty) and Newtownshandrum and Cloyne in the hurling the main teams are all urban teams.  Midleton for instance won the AI hurling in the early 90's I think and the town is about the size of Lurgan.

Where I am going with this is that there are actually more pulls on players in Cork than the north.  There is not the same "cultural" divide with rugby down here and many players play both, soccer is huge with 2 LOI teams in Cork City and Cobh Ramblers, bastketball has a large presence with UCC Demons having a very successful set up and athletics feed off the success of Dervel O'Rourke and Sonia O'Sullivan.  Coupled with the place being a major tourist area and somewhere where people really know how to enjoy themselves, there are many things to distract.  Yet, they continually churn out successful sporting teams across the board.  Obviously there is a larger population but for instance Newtownshandrum has a similar population to Cross.  Nemo would remind me very much of the Harps in that they take the majority of their players at under age levels from 4-5 housing estatess the size of Drumbreda.

There is a culture in Armagh city, and I have had a nember of years of experience of this having tricked around Drumbreda myself for a few years, where the party is all there is.  That is not a unique thing to Armagh but is more prevalent in my experience.  When we made the breakthrough it was like that and unfortunately I think it will be a bigger factor than anything else in stopping the Harps make the step up.  I don't know about 20 in a row, as that would be arrogant, but it is not impossible.  The one thing that always motivates the Cross players is history, and the making of new history

Gordons Gin

[brokencrossbar1]

Gordons Gin

Cheeky fcuker!!!!

[corn02]

Shokcing statistic re: Harps players who no longer play.

I had a wee look at our minor photo winning teahm this morning that won division 1. Only five no longer play and one of those is in the AFL. Certainly seems to be an urban problem.

[mhacadoir]

lads who is managing Clan na nGael this year?

Mhacadoir

Barry O'Hagan & Dairmaid Marsden with Brian lennon and Trevor boyd on the sideline

cheers!

[nashville]

Corn, just had a look at our Ulster Minor winning team from 2003, 16 of them no longer playing for us....

[corn02]

In five years yous have lost 16 players? That is crazy.

[nashville]

16 players from just ONE age group! And even in this case the argument of success can't be used, they won an Ulster title ffs! 16 added on to the many more from the other age groups, this isn't the Feile winning group I was talking about earlier, the Ulster winners are 2003, that group are the minor team from 2005 of which 30 have been lost. When I write this down myself it is actually astounding me!!

[brokencrossbar1]

That is terrible nashville.  I looked at the minor winning team of 2001 and I think at least 8 are on the seniors with maybe another 6-8 playing on the seconds team/B team. 

People have blamed Cross's success for the reasons behind players not hanging around to senior but that cannot be used as an excuse for 16 players to give up.  There needs to be more inward looking approaches in clubs to see why things are the way they are.

[corn02]

Similar numberin Dromintee BC.

If we had a drop out like the Haprs, we simply would not be able to function.

[full back]

Any word of the Culloville v Lissummon game last night?

[gaapunter]

Any word of the Culloville v Lissummon game last night?

full back i hear Culloville won by 8 points

[full back]

Cheers gaa
Expected them to win by more tbh

[corn02]

Was that intermediate?

[Hank Everlast]

yip i think that was the first championship match of the year!

[thebandit]

Culloville only won by 4 I think. Lissummon were ahead with 15 minutes to go!