Will you get a Covid vaccine if one becomes available in 2021?

[LCohen]

Oh dear thousands of deaths, have you the figures of those who actually died of Covid?

Oh dear.

Seay,

What do you propose we do now if you were running the show?

You were over it all

Sorry I can't see your answer, is it in hidden, do I have to do ctrl, alt, num lock, insert, delete to see?

Seaney

Do you object to posters not answering questions?

I couldn't care less.

And yet you post on it??

Makes you look a fraud.

Also complaining about an offence of which you are the number 1 offender (well admittedly the Angelo account also has a problem with it) also makes you look fraudulent

[JoG2]

Alternatively pressure has come about because the health system has been ignored for decades, brexit didn't help chasing foreign staff away,

All true - but ultimately irrelevant to charting a path out of where we are right now.

the first lockdown was bought in by everyone, nothing was achieved in this period as the government did feck all during these months, track and trace has been a shambles, eat out to help out was a disaster, telling everyone to get back to the office was a disaster, covid is a scourge but the bigger scourge is how the politicians handled it

Agree on everything there - go back to around page 20 of the coronavirus thread to see where I was on the matter back then.

and that wider impact on society.  Everyone is talking about the vulnerable as being those over 80 in a care home, what about those with disabilities, those in abusive relationships, those committing suicide because they have lost their jobs, those who are in isolation for months and months.

Everyone is vulnerable if the healthcare system completely breaks down. Not just the over 80s.

We have an icy snap, you fall and break a hip - but there is no capacity for an operation as all beds are full with people dying of pneumonia. What do you do then?

The system is already in the middle of collapsing.

I agree that its sh*t all round for many people. But you don't seem to grasp we'd be in much the same boat but with a much higher death toll if significant interventions were not taken (I would strongly argue the interventions have not been taken early enough, drastic enough and not for long enough).

Isn't it great to have you around to ensure I grasp things correctly, your patronisation is astounding, the health system was at bursting point and has been for decades, covid made the health care workers untouchable, there was a GP in Armagh doing a piece justifying her 6 figure salary except she was my GP you couldn't get to see her for love nor money, I had one anti inflammatory and a course of antibiotics prescribed over the phone with no consultation, this is happening all over - so much you don't need a pill for every ill.

So you asked for pills and got them prescribed without any consultation? Really? That would be medical negligence Seany. You could live like that GP for a year or 2

[LCohen]

I would love you to quote to say where I am anti vax, if you do that it would be great ta.

Well you have said you won't get but haven't given a clear supported reason why not.

I answered the thread title, as mentioned at this stage given my age and health, if I was to be in line I still mightn't get it next year, and knowing the executive nor in 2022!

But you haven't given a good reason for not getting it.

And now you seem to be grumbling that you are going to have to wait to get the thing you don't want to get. You are a diner who complains that the food is inedible AND the portions are too small.

There just doesn't seem to be any logic to your posts

[LCohen]

The Covid figure in UK is pie in the sky, is what I was alluding to.

Ok thanks.

You havent provided evidence of the collateral damage in care homes yet?

Could you tell me what you would do if you were in charge?

Because I cannot see anything you are in favour of

I am not in charge so it is a mute point.

What is a mute point?

You are on a discussion forum. When you argue for/against something just saying that you are not in charge and therefore don't need evidence or alternatives just makes you a rubbish poster.

As opposed to the virologists on the board following the narrative.

They are not virologists. Just posters with reliable sources.

What is a mute point though?

[Milltown Row2]

We all pay NI, the more your earn the more you pay, will you have a cap like 50K or something you have to be earning before you pay to see a doctor, might it not put folk off who are ill forking out 50 quid for a doctors appointment and cause longer harm?  Just because you can afford it doesn't mean all workers could, I remember where prescriptions were 5.50 or something I had no issue paying once a year or whenever I needed something, others are on daily medication, will everyone working pay?

Anyone working should pay for prescriptions, I don't see the issue here, why should you get it for free, standard fee across the board.

If you are unwell and need to see the doctor why wouldn't you go? So £50 would stop a working person from seeing the doctor? Knowing that the money will be used to improve the services they are getting then I can't see the problem.

I've not had a prescription in god know how long, I got tablets from the hospital one day I went when the gout kicked in

Do you think the NHS can continue to give out free prescriptions? How long will that last?

[LCohen]

The Covid figure in UK is pie in the sky, is what I was alluding to.

Fine it's pie in the sky.

What would you do if you were in charge on dealing with Covid? You clearly don't believe in the vaccines, so please tell what other solutions are available to get the country/economy back to some sort of normality in 2021?

Again if you quote where I said that it would be great ta, and as mentioned I am not in charge, but what hasn't helped the country is failed lockdowns and the resultant missed medical appointments, missed cancer diagnosis, mental health issues, abuse, isolation, unemployment etc. to save a health care where all the predictions were horseshite and where nightingale hospitals lay empty along with covid wards.

More nonsense as usual. Did your chemical engineer friend tell you the hospitals are empty? That's the kind of ridiculous fake facts he and you seem to specialise in


There are patients being treated in the car park of Antrim hospital tonight because the hospital is full.

Your ignorance isn't funny, it's actually dangerous. People who are unsure about the vaccine hear the paranoia and nonsense from people like yourself in the media and they start to doubt themselves. Fighting the disinformation from the anti vaccine loons will be a major issue for all governments to deal with.

Apart from the speed the vaccine was developed, which the medical experts have answered you can't offer any reasonable explanation why not to take the vaccine. You also offer no alternative to not taking it so what exactly do you want to happen in 2021?

No my doctor friend if you care to look back told me that at the start for the first months she went to an empty covid ward once a week and did nothing, so who covered her patients appointments then? I also said nightingale hospitals, but you make up your own lies.  So have we a situation now where covid patients irrespective of what their condition is take full precedence over every other medical condition - maybe if they triaged them a bit better, there were less than 10 in ICU so if you have a cough do you get a bed ahead of everyone else?

I don't see the 10pm news every evening telling how many daily deaths there were due to cancer, or how many new diagnosis of cancer or other illnesses, it's a covid state.  I also don't see any news outlet mention that the hospitals were a shambles before covid due to no executive for 3 years and no investment.

Again - what do you suggest is done Seany

I mentioned previously I am not in charge, I have not sought to be in charge, I do not get paid ridiculous money to be in charge,  so the point is mute.

If I described you as clueless presumably you would concur?

Another one of you "mute points". Please explain?

I would conclude you are akin to Milhouse who feels they are somehow morally, intellectually or educationally superior that the other 18 active members on this small irrelevant board, but sure you all can't meet in the pub I suppose so knock yourself out, whatever turns you on.

Surely it is possible for you to engage meaningfully in this debate?

It would be fair to say that you have very little to contribute and none of it cogent?
Similarly you struggle with logic and it leads you to make a long sequence of wrong turns and bad decisions?

I'm happy to consider any evidence to the contrary but that involves you posting evidence to a discussion board. Sure give it your best chance? Take the Christmas period

[GetOverTheBar]

More good news from the US FDA on the Moderna vaccine, which seems to perform in a similar way to the Pfizer one, and so it will be approved in a few days. It will likely be approved in Europe shortly after the Pfizer one. The Irish government has approved purchase of 875,000 doses of Moderna vaccine. The 6 counties should be getting 225,000 or so, Moderna has less orders from London than Pfizer of Oxford.

After both jabs, the vaccine was 94.1 per cent effective in a trial of about 30,000 participants. The vaccine was less effective in people over the age of 65, with an efficacy rate of 86.4 per cent. There were 30 severe cases of Covid-19 in the placebo group but none in the vaccinated group.

That is good news. If you refuse a vaccine and end up in hospital with Covid symptoms can we start issuing a bill to these people, or preferably pay prior to treatment.

If you smoke and end up in hospital with lung cancer, should you be billed, if you do extreme sports and end up in hospital because of an injury, should you be billed, if you drink and end up in hospital because of liver failure should you be billed, if you are obese and end up in hospital should you be billed, if you are in a car accident because of carless driving and end up in hospital, should you be billed - etc. etc. etc.

I've no problem with that..

Sure you don't - but you look like the moral guardian again in your wee domain!  So what treatment do you think should be "free at point of entry" even know we all pay our national insurance, on the NHS - can you give a list?

Prescriptions shouldn't be free for starters, if you're employed.

£50 fee for seeing the doctor, again, if employed.

Incentives or payments towards going private for the likes of non emergency treatments, so for instances free glasses and hearing aids, in the South they give, for hearing up to £1000 off providing they have PRSI

Private health care should be built into jobs..

We are not helping ourselves with obesity and smoking and poor general health, fast foods and sugar filled food isn't helping

I'm going for my first doctors appointment in nearly 30 years, it took three hours to get through on the phone, then the doctor (trainee GP) asked what was wrong and then gave me an appointment. My point is, I was working out of a doctors surgery for 3 years, every Friday, the same people were queued up the street in all weathers at 8am waiting to be seen by the doctors when they opened up at 9am.. How sick are we as a country that surgeries are completely bunged like that? The system needs looking at, its broken.

That's not a government problem essentially, that's generations of people not looking after themselves.

I've daughter that wasn't well, usual stuff from doctors was do this and try that, ended up went private, the specialist was able to sort everything out and arrange a set of treatment to help. This was after being fobbed off by the GP, in fairness to the GP they only have 15 minutes and have no specialised facilities to see what's wrong, just a referral, that will take up to a year, if your lucky.

I'm lucky that I am able to afford private care, if needed. If we want good health care then we as employed people have to pay more into it, and if we have better employment then more money would be invested into it

In fairness to the Governments and NHS they have warned about these things for years. People didn't give a toss, yet interestingly, they are the people who seem to bang the drum loudest about Covid these days.

Now there is a virus that ruthlessly exposes any weakness in the body caused by years of bad diet, smoking or other habits.....Oh Christ we have to lock it up forever.....

There are a lot of people out there at the moment regretting their years of mistreating the body, yet failing to acknowledge that those same years were entirely their own choices.

We've had every link under the sun, genetics, lack of vitamin D, is it a winter or summer virus.....Nobody has really said here, is this taking out people who smoked for 30+ years?

Like most things related to Covid 19 the research is incomplete. But your quite right, common sense would tell you smoking is linked to a whole host of pathological conditions that would definitely increase mortality rates in covid 19 infections.
        However, Wierdly there was some limited evidence that smoking may have had given some sort of protection against covid-19 infection the so called smoker's paradox.
        A quick google will throw up some links .
From a general public health perspective it would be great if this led to a reduction in the numbers quitting smoking. Perhaps a small positive from this awful pandemic?

Sorry, hate these chunky quotes that clog up forums but I certainly agree with you. Lets hope the lasting effect of this pandemic is that people do try and make the effort to lead a more active and healthy lifestyle.

[thebigfella]

I would conclude you are akin to Milhouse who feels they are somehow morally, intellectually or educationally superior that the other 18 active members on this small irrelevant board, but sure you all can't meet in the pub I suppose so knock yourself out, whatever turns you on.

So if it is irrelevant, why do you keep reincarnating yourself everytime you get banned?

[Seaney]

We all pay NI, the more your earn the more you pay, will you have a cap like 50K or something you have to be earning before you pay to see a doctor, might it not put folk off who are ill forking out 50 quid for a doctors appointment and cause longer harm?  Just because you can afford it doesn't mean all workers could, I remember where prescriptions were 5.50 or something I had no issue paying once a year or whenever I needed something, others are on daily medication, will everyone working pay?

Anyone working should pay for prescriptions, I don't see the issue here, why should you get it for free, standard fee across the board.

If you are unwell and need to see the doctor why wouldn't you go? So £50 would stop a working person from seeing the doctor? Knowing that the money will be used to improve the services they are getting then I can't see the problem.

I've not had a prescription in god know how long, I got tablets from the hospital one day I went when the gout kicked in

Do you think the NHS can continue to give out free prescriptions? How long will that last?

You wouldn't you would assume I am ok feck the rest as you have shown time and time again.

[Seaney]

Alternatively pressure has come about because the health system has been ignored for decades, brexit didn't help chasing foreign staff away,

All true - but ultimately irrelevant to charting a path out of where we are right now.

the first lockdown was bought in by everyone, nothing was achieved in this period as the government did feck all during these months, track and trace has been a shambles, eat out to help out was a disaster, telling everyone to get back to the office was a disaster, covid is a scourge but the bigger scourge is how the politicians handled it

Agree on everything there - go back to around page 20 of the coronavirus thread to see where I was on the matter back then.

and that wider impact on society.  Everyone is talking about the vulnerable as being those over 80 in a care home, what about those with disabilities, those in abusive relationships, those committing suicide because they have lost their jobs, those who are in isolation for months and months.

Everyone is vulnerable if the healthcare system completely breaks down. Not just the over 80s.

We have an icy snap, you fall and break a hip - but there is no capacity for an operation as all beds are full with people dying of pneumonia. What do you do then?

The system is already in the middle of collapsing.

I agree that its sh*t all round for many people. But you don't seem to grasp we'd be in much the same boat but with a much higher death toll if significant interventions were not taken (I would strongly argue the interventions have not been taken early enough, drastic enough and not for long enough).

Isn't it great to have you around to ensure I grasp things correctly, your patronisation is astounding, the health system was at bursting point and has been for decades, covid made the health care workers untouchable, there was a GP in Armagh doing a piece justifying her 6 figure salary except she was my GP you couldn't get to see her for love nor money, I had one anti inflammatory and a course of antibiotics prescribed over the phone with no consultation, this is happening all over - so much you don't need a pill for every ill.

So you asked for pills and got them prescribed without any consultation? Really? That would be medical negligence Seany. You could live like that GP for a year or 2

A nurse rang me back asked me my symptoms and what I thought it was and a prescription was left over, presumably signed by the doctor. I waited a few days and didn't use the antibiotic. 

[imtommygunn]

I would conclude you are akin to Milhouse who feels they are somehow morally, intellectually or educationally superior that the other 18 active members on this small irrelevant board, but sure you all can't meet in the pub I suppose so knock yourself out, whatever turns you on.

So if it is irrelevant, why do you keep reincarnating yourself everytime you get banned?

I find this hilarious. You 18 know it alls on this small irrelevant board I spend loads of time on (I clicked your name just to check... you're a hero member of this small irrelevant board  )

[Seaney]

I would love you to quote to say where I am anti vax, if you do that it would be great ta.

Well you have said you won't get but haven't given a clear supported reason why not.

I answered the thread title, as mentioned at this stage given my age and health, if I was to be in line I still mightn't get it next year, and knowing the executive nor in 2022!

But you haven't given a good reason for not getting it.

And now you seem to be grumbling that you are going to have to wait to get the thing you don't want to get. You are a diner who complains that the food is inedible AND the portions are too small.

There just doesn't seem to be any logic to your posts

It isn't compulsory  - I give my reasons for reluctance - read back.  As for the bit underlined - that you trying to be a good wordsmith?

[Seaney]

The Covid figure in UK is pie in the sky, is what I was alluding to.

Ok thanks.

You havent provided evidence of the collateral damage in care homes yet?

Could you tell me what you would do if you were in charge?

Because I cannot see anything you are in favour of

I am not in charge so it is a mute point.

What is a mute point?

You are on a discussion forum. When you argue for/against something just saying that you are not in charge and therefore don't need evidence or alternatives just makes you a rubbish poster.

As opposed to the virologists on the board following the narrative.

They are not virologists. Just posters with reliable sources.

What is a mute point though?

Google?

[Seaney]

I would conclude you are akin to Milhouse who feels they are somehow morally, intellectually or educationally superior that the other 18 active members on this small irrelevant board, but sure you all can't meet in the pub I suppose so knock yourself out, whatever turns you on.

So if it is irrelevant, why do you keep reincarnating yourself everytime you get banned?

I find this hilarious. You 18 know it alls on this small irrelevant board I spend loads of time on (I clicked your name just to check... you're a hero member of this small irrelevant board  )

You do know that is a counter based on posts and I am not really a hero?

[imtommygunn]

Ah you're too modest.