Will you get a Covid vaccine if one becomes available in 2021?

[LCohen]

Genuine question

Why have country leaders not scrambling to have this vaccine? Would they not do it live on air to instil a bit of trust among the populations. Now I know you can say it only right for the most venerable to get it first but surly these important people, who lets be honest are no spring chickens would be first in line to get it.

You were saying earlier that NI was being used by Uk as a guinea pig. What was your evidence for that?

Country leaders might well get the vaccine early but only after it has been approved in their respective countries.

[LCohen]

Oh dear thousands of deaths, have you the figures of those who actually died of Covid?

Oh dear.

Seay,

What do you propose we do now if you were running the show?

You were over it all

Sorry I can't see your answer, is it in hidden, do I have to do ctrl, alt, num lock, insert, delete to see?

Seaney

Do you object to posters not answering questions?

[LCohen]

I would love you to quote to say where I am anti vax, if you do that it would be great ta.

Well you have said you won't get but haven't given a clear supported reason why not.

[LCohen]

The Covid figure in UK is pie in the sky, is what I was alluding to.

Ok thanks.

You havent provided evidence of the collateral damage in care homes yet?

Could you tell me what you would do if you were in charge?

Because I cannot see anything you are in favour of

I am not in charge so it is a mute point.

What is a mute point?

You are on a discussion forum. When you argue for/against something just saying that you are not in charge and therefore don't need evidence or alternatives just makes you a rubbish poster.

[LCohen]

More good news from the US FDA on the Moderna vaccine, which seems to perform in a similar way to the Pfizer one, and so it will be approved in a few days. It will likely be approved in Europe shortly after the Pfizer one. The Irish government has approved purchase of 875,000 doses of Moderna vaccine. The 6 counties should be getting 225,000 or so, Moderna has less orders from London than Pfizer of Oxford.

After both jabs, the vaccine was 94.1 per cent effective in a trial of about 30,000 participants. The vaccine was less effective in people over the age of 65, with an efficacy rate of 86.4 per cent. There were 30 severe cases of Covid-19 in the placebo group but none in the vaccinated group.

That is good news. If you refuse a vaccine and end up in hospital with Covid symptoms can we start issuing a bill to these people, or preferably pay prior to treatment.

If you smoke and end up in hospital with lung cancer, should you be billed, if you do extreme sports and end up in hospital because of an injury, should you be billed, if you drink and end up in hospital because of liver failure should you be billed, if you are obese and end up in hospital should you be billed, if you are in a car accident because of carless driving and end up in hospital, should you be billed - etc. etc. etc.

In the long run I would not be surprised if you were billed for those.

But they are not comparable with a sage vaccine being available for free for a contagious disease. When we get to a capability of 100% coverage on the vaccine then yes there may be consequences for those who don't get vaccinated. It will be a couple of years before we are at 100% coverage though. Even if we tried

[LCohen]

The Covid figure in UK is pie in the sky, is what I was alluding to.

Fine it's pie in the sky.

What would you do if you were in charge on dealing with Covid? You clearly don't believe in the vaccines, so please tell what other solutions are available to get the country/economy back to some sort of normality in 2021?

Again if you quote where I said that it would be great ta, and as mentioned I am not in charge, but what hasn't helped the country is failed lockdowns and the resultant missed medical appointments, missed cancer diagnosis, mental health issues, abuse, isolation, unemployment etc. to save a health care where all the predictions were horseshite and where nightingale hospitals lay empty along with covid wards.

More nonsense as usual. Did your chemical engineer friend tell you the hospitals are empty? That's the kind of ridiculous fake facts he and you seem to specialise in


There are patients being treated in the car park of Antrim hospital tonight because the hospital is full.

Your ignorance isn't funny, it's actually dangerous. People who are unsure about the vaccine hear the paranoia and nonsense from people like yourself in the media and they start to doubt themselves. Fighting the disinformation from the anti vaccine loons will be a major issue for all governments to deal with.

Apart from the speed the vaccine was developed, which the medical experts have answered you can't offer any reasonable explanation why not to take the vaccine. You also offer no alternative to not taking it so what exactly do you want to happen in 2021?

No my doctor friend if you care to look back told me that at the start for the first months she went to an empty covid ward once a week and did nothing, so who covered her patients appointments then? I also said nightingale hospitals, but you make up your own lies.  So have we a situation now where covid patients irrespective of what their condition is take full precedence over every other medical condition - maybe if they triaged them a bit better, there were less than 10 in ICU so if you have a cough do you get a bed ahead of everyone else?

I don't see the 10pm news every evening telling how many daily deaths there were due to cancer, or how many new diagnosis of cancer or other illnesses, it's a covid state.  I also don't see any news outlet mention that the hospitals were a shambles before covid due to no executive for 3 years and no investment.

Again - what do you suggest is done Seany

I mentioned previously I am not in charge, I have not sought to be in charge, I do not get paid ridiculous money to be in charge,  so the point is mute.

If I described you as clueless presumably you would concur?

Another one of you "mute points". Please explain?

[LCohen]

More good news from the US FDA on the Moderna vaccine, which seems to perform in a similar way to the Pfizer one, and so it will be approved in a few days. It will likely be approved in Europe shortly after the Pfizer one. The Irish government has approved purchase of 875,000 doses of Moderna vaccine. The 6 counties should be getting 225,000 or so, Moderna has less orders from London than Pfizer of Oxford.

After both jabs, the vaccine was 94.1 per cent effective in a trial of about 30,000 participants. The vaccine was less effective in people over the age of 65, with an efficacy rate of 86.4 per cent. There were 30 severe cases of Covid-19 in the placebo group but none in the vaccinated group.

That is good news. If you refuse a vaccine and end up in hospital with Covid symptoms can we start issuing a bill to these people, or preferably pay prior to treatment.

If you smoke and end up in hospital with lung cancer, should you be billed, if you do extreme sports and end up in hospital because of an injury, should you be billed, if you drink and end up in hospital because of liver failure should you be billed, if you are obese and end up in hospital should you be billed, if you are in a car accident because of carless driving and end up in hospital, should you be billed - etc. etc. etc.

I've no problem with that..

Sure you don't - but you look like the moral guardian again in your wee domain!  So what treatment do you think should be "free at point of entry" even know we all pay our national insurance, on the NHS - can you give a list?

What has national insurance got to do with things?

[grounded]

More good news from the US FDA on the Moderna vaccine, which seems to perform in a similar way to the Pfizer one, and so it will be approved in a few days. It will likely be approved in Europe shortly after the Pfizer one. The Irish government has approved purchase of 875,000 doses of Moderna vaccine. The 6 counties should be getting 225,000 or so, Moderna has less orders from London than Pfizer of Oxford.

After both jabs, the vaccine was 94.1 per cent effective in a trial of about 30,000 participants. The vaccine was less effective in people over the age of 65, with an efficacy rate of 86.4 per cent. There were 30 severe cases of Covid-19 in the placebo group but none in the vaccinated group.

That is good news. If you refuse a vaccine and end up in hospital with Covid symptoms can we start issuing a bill to these people, or preferably pay prior to treatment.

If you smoke and end up in hospital with lung cancer, should you be billed, if you do extreme sports and end up in hospital because of an injury, should you be billed, if you drink and end up in hospital because of liver failure should you be billed, if you are obese and end up in hospital should you be billed, if you are in a car accident because of carless driving and end up in hospital, should you be billed - etc. etc. etc.

I've no problem with that..

Sure you don't - but you look like the moral guardian again in your wee domain!  So what treatment do you think should be "free at point of entry" even know we all pay our national insurance, on the NHS - can you give a list?

Prescriptions shouldn't be free for starters, if you're employed.

£50 fee for seeing the doctor, again, if employed.

Incentives or payments towards going private for the likes of non emergency treatments, so for instances free glasses and hearing aids, in the South they give, for hearing up to £1000 off providing they have PRSI

Private health care should be built into jobs..

We are not helping ourselves with obesity and smoking and poor general health, fast foods and sugar filled food isn't helping

I'm going for my first doctors appointment in nearly 30 years, it took three hours to get through on the phone, then the doctor (trainee GP) asked what was wrong and then gave me an appointment. My point is, I was working out of a doctors surgery for 3 years, every Friday, the same people were queued up the street in all weathers at 8am waiting to be seen by the doctors when they opened up at 9am.. How sick are we as a country that surgeries are completely bunged like that? The system needs looking at, its broken.

That's not a government problem essentially, that's generations of people not looking after themselves.

I've daughter that wasn't well, usual stuff from doctors was do this and try that, ended up went private, the specialist was able to sort everything out and arrange a set of treatment to help. This was after being fobbed off by the GP, in fairness to the GP they only have 15 minutes and have no specialised facilities to see what's wrong, just a referral, that will take up to a year, if your lucky.

I'm lucky that I am able to afford private care, if needed. If we want good health care then we as employed people have to pay more into it, and if we have better employment then more money would be invested into it

In fairness to the Governments and NHS they have warned about these things for years. People didn't give a toss, yet interestingly, they are the people who seem to bang the drum loudest about Covid these days.

Now there is a virus that ruthlessly exposes any weakness in the body caused by years of bad diet, smoking or other habits.....Oh Christ we have to lock it up forever.....

There are a lot of people out there at the moment regretting their years of mistreating the body, yet failing to acknowledge that those same years were entirely their own choices.

We've had every link under the sun, genetics, lack of vitamin D, is it a winter or summer virus.....Nobody has really said here, is this taking out people who smoked for 30+ years?

Like most things related to Covid 19 the research is incomplete. But your quite right, common sense would tell you smoking is linked to a whole host of pathological conditions that would definitely increase mortality rates in covid 19 infections.
        However, Wierdly there was some limited evidence that smoking may have had given some sort of protection against covid-19 infection the so called smoker's paradox.
        A quick google will throw up some links .
From a general public health perspective it would be great if this led to a reduction in the numbers quitting smoking. Perhaps a small positive from this awful pandemic?

[Seaney]

Isn't it great to have you around to ensure I grasp things correctly, your patronisation is astounding,

Unfortunately your ignorance is even more astounding than my patronising.

A humble patronising keyboard warrior - who would have thought.

I'll leave you to grab the last word as I'm sure in your head it'll somehow validate your "argument".



Anyway. In summary:
- vaccine is fundamentally safe unless you have an allergy to any of the carrier chemicals.
- vaccine is required to protect not only people from covid, but people from other ailments as they will get treated quicker, better and not have to run the gauntlet of getting covid in hospital with an already compromised immune system.
- vaccine is required to get the economy up and running, as a drastic spike in cases and sickness will only see further economic contractions and job losses.
- vaccine is required to protect people from the mental anguish of losing loved ones, especially those that are carers for others.

And Ill leave you to quote where I have voiced anti-vax sentiments as opposed to a cautious approach to an expediently developed vaccine, but don't let truth get in the way of your narrative.

Your chemical engineer friend who you like to quote doesn't let the truth or facts get in the way of his/her opinions either. Next time he/she tries to give you any information/stats for vaccines or covid issues have a word.

You are really hung up on someone you know nothing about, his advice is sound.

[LCohen]

So have we a situation now where covid patients irrespective of what their condition is take full precedence over every other medical condition - maybe if they triaged them a bit better, there were less than 10 in ICU so if you have a cough do you get a bed ahead of everyone else?

We have a situation now where patients with every other medical condition are being infected with COVID on the wards because the system has collapsed under pressure.

Pressure which has come about because the government was far too reticent in implementing and enforcing clear lockdowns.

Alternatively pressure has come about because the health system has been ignored for decades, brexit didn't help chasing foreign staff away, the first lockdown was bought in by everyone, nothing was achieved in this period as the government did feck all during these months, track and trace has been a shambles, eat out to help out was a disaster, telling everyone to get back to the office was a disaster, covid is a scourge but the bigger scourge is how the politicians handled it and that wider impact on society.  Everyone is talking about the vulnerable as being those over 80 in a care home, what about those with disabilities, those in abusive relationships, those committing suicide because they have lost their jobs, those who are in isolation for months and months.

Christ there are bits in there that I actually agree with.

What steps, had they been taken, would have made you think the pandemic had been well handled?

[Seaney]

Oh dear thousands of deaths, have you the figures of those who actually died of Covid?

Oh dear.

Seay,

What do you propose we do now if you were running the show?

You were over it all

Sorry I can't see your answer, is it in hidden, do I have to do ctrl, alt, num lock, insert, delete to see?

Seaney

Do you object to posters not answering questions?

I couldn't care less.

[LCohen]

More good news from the US FDA on the Moderna vaccine, which seems to perform in a similar way to the Pfizer one, and so it will be approved in a few days. It will likely be approved in Europe shortly after the Pfizer one. The Irish government has approved purchase of 875,000 doses of Moderna vaccine. The 6 counties should be getting 225,000 or so, Moderna has less orders from London than Pfizer of Oxford.

After both jabs, the vaccine was 94.1 per cent effective in a trial of about 30,000 participants. The vaccine was less effective in people over the age of 65, with an efficacy rate of 86.4 per cent. There were 30 severe cases of Covid-19 in the placebo group but none in the vaccinated group.

That is good news. If you refuse a vaccine and end up in hospital with Covid symptoms can we start issuing a bill to these people, or preferably pay prior to treatment.

If you smoke and end up in hospital with lung cancer, should you be billed, if you do extreme sports and end up in hospital because of an injury, should you be billed, if you drink and end up in hospital because of liver failure should you be billed, if you are obese and end up in hospital should you be billed, if you are in a car accident because of carless driving and end up in hospital, should you be billed - etc. etc. etc.

I've no problem with that..

Sure you don't - but you look like the moral guardian again in your wee domain!  So what treatment do you think should be "free at point of entry" even know we all pay our national insurance, on the NHS - can you give a list?

Prescriptions shouldn't be free for starters, if you're employed.

£50 fee for seeing the doctor, again, if employed.

Incentives or payments towards going private for the likes of non emergency treatments, so for instances free glasses and hearing aids, in the South they give, for hearing up to £1000 off providing they have PRSI

Private health care should be built into jobs..

We are not helping ourselves with obesity and smoking and poor general health, fast foods and sugar filled food isn't helping

I'm going for my first doctors appointment in nearly 30 years, it took three hours to get through on the phone, then the doctor (trainee GP) asked what was wrong and then gave me an appointment. My point is, I was working out of a doctors surgery for 3 years, every Friday, the same people were queued up the street in all weathers at 8am waiting to be seen by the doctors when they opened up at 9am.. How sick are we as a country that surgeries are completely bunged like that? The system needs looking at, its broken.

That's not a government problem essentially, that's generations of people not looking after themselves.

I've daughter that wasn't well, usual stuff from doctors was do this and try that, ended up went private, the specialist was able to sort everything out and arrange a set of treatment to help. This was after being fobbed off by the GP, in fairness to the GP they only have 15 minutes and have no specialised facilities to see what's wrong, just a referral, that will take up to a year, if your lucky.

I'm lucky that I am able to afford private care, if needed. If we want good health care then we as employed people have to pay more into it, and if we have better employment then more money would be invested into it

So are you going scrap national insurance?

What is your fascination with National Insurance?

[Seaney]

I would love you to quote to say where I am anti vax, if you do that it would be great ta.

Well you have said you won't get but haven't given a clear supported reason why not.

I answered the thread title, as mentioned at this stage given my age and health, if I was to be in line I still mightn't get it next year, and knowing the executive nor in 2022!

[Seaney]

The Covid figure in UK is pie in the sky, is what I was alluding to.

Ok thanks.

You havent provided evidence of the collateral damage in care homes yet?

Could you tell me what you would do if you were in charge?

Because I cannot see anything you are in favour of

I am not in charge so it is a mute point.

What is a mute point?

You are on a discussion forum. When you argue for/against something just saying that you are not in charge and therefore don't need evidence or alternatives just makes you a rubbish poster.

As opposed to the virologists on the board following the narrative.

[Seaney]

The Covid figure in UK is pie in the sky, is what I was alluding to.

Fine it's pie in the sky.

What would you do if you were in charge on dealing with Covid? You clearly don't believe in the vaccines, so please tell what other solutions are available to get the country/economy back to some sort of normality in 2021?

Again if you quote where I said that it would be great ta, and as mentioned I am not in charge, but what hasn't helped the country is failed lockdowns and the resultant missed medical appointments, missed cancer diagnosis, mental health issues, abuse, isolation, unemployment etc. to save a health care where all the predictions were horseshite and where nightingale hospitals lay empty along with covid wards.

More nonsense as usual. Did your chemical engineer friend tell you the hospitals are empty? That's the kind of ridiculous fake facts he and you seem to specialise in


There are patients being treated in the car park of Antrim hospital tonight because the hospital is full.

Your ignorance isn't funny, it's actually dangerous. People who are unsure about the vaccine hear the paranoia and nonsense from people like yourself in the media and they start to doubt themselves. Fighting the disinformation from the anti vaccine loons will be a major issue for all governments to deal with.

Apart from the speed the vaccine was developed, which the medical experts have answered you can't offer any reasonable explanation why not to take the vaccine. You also offer no alternative to not taking it so what exactly do you want to happen in 2021?

No my doctor friend if you care to look back told me that at the start for the first months she went to an empty covid ward once a week and did nothing, so who covered her patients appointments then? I also said nightingale hospitals, but you make up your own lies.  So have we a situation now where covid patients irrespective of what their condition is take full precedence over every other medical condition - maybe if they triaged them a bit better, there were less than 10 in ICU so if you have a cough do you get a bed ahead of everyone else?

I don't see the 10pm news every evening telling how many daily deaths there were due to cancer, or how many new diagnosis of cancer or other illnesses, it's a covid state.  I also don't see any news outlet mention that the hospitals were a shambles before covid due to no executive for 3 years and no investment.

Again - what do you suggest is done Seany

I mentioned previously I am not in charge, I have not sought to be in charge, I do not get paid ridiculous money to be in charge,  so the point is mute.

If I described you as clueless presumably you would concur?

Another one of you "mute points". Please explain?

I would conclude you are akin to Milhouse who feels they are somehow morally, intellectually or educationally superior that the other 18 active members on this small irrelevant board, but sure you all can't meet in the pub I suppose so knock yourself out, whatever turns you on.