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Lads, gotta question that I'd like to see your opinions on. Firstly, I will clarify that I am split with the SJ case. I think anything he were to win with or for Kildare could not but be somewhat tainted. I believe there is nothing greater than winning something with a group of men who you've grown up with or soldiered with for years. If, in particular, an "outsider" were to be the primary reason you won though, to me, there would be something missing. And by "outsider", I mean someone who transferred to you only because they smelled a medal.
However, I do also resent an organisation trying to enforce a rule that in certain cases, restricts a player from fulfilling his ambition and/or potential and in cases affecting his actual love ofthe game and what he can get out of it. To explain what I mean, here's the question:
Take the example of a fello born into a small "weak" parish in a small "weak" county. Or indeed, even a strong county. It may not matter which. He loves the game to his fingertips and is blessed with talent. Is that fella to be resigned to playing with a club that will never get anywhere, never come close to a junior championship perhaps, never mind a senior, to playing with guys whose ambition is a million miles off his own and treat football as jst a bit of craic? If his county is relatively strong; then is that a substitute for a third of a yr playing drivel with a going-nowhere club, if it's a weak county then he's doubly f***ed. For someone like that, would they not at least be entitled to compete? In my opinion, I'd have no problem with this guy finding a way to move.
While it's not exactly the same as SJ's case (I wouldn't compare any county team to a junior club with no ambition, all county players have ambition) I think the fundamentals are the same, or at least incredibly similar and most importantly, both cases would be governed and judged by the same rules.
I think it's very easy to be romantic and talk about "ethos" not every case is identical, even though the particulars might be. And the gaa has to have a set of rules which are black and white, no? So is this guy supposed to accept the lot (and club) life (or bad luck) has given him? If you think so then having the same set of rules applied isn't a problem, but if like me, you don't agree, then there's a serious problem with the rules and how they could be implemented across a cross section of cases.

Quote [If it's "more power to him" to give someone the finger, in full view of the nation, where do we stop? How many fingers are acceptable? Will it be mooning next?]

I'm not condoning raising the middle finger or giving them the 2 fingers gesture either Hardy, I was referring more to Bryan Cullen and his "3 Leinster titles gesture". I don't see much wrong with that as a response to receiving aggro - better than turning round and splitting someone anyway. I agree that Vaughan's 2 fingered gesture was unsightly and wrong but if he'd pumped his fist at Rooney instead (and I don't mean indicating he was going to thump him!) then I would have no problem with that.

I reckon this whole thing is bullsh*t. I think anyone that has ever played the game knows that in all likelihood, the guys involved in the much publicised "taunting" incidents were subjected to either a little mouthing themselves before the incident or some off the ball shenanigans throughout the game. Now, I don't know what exactly happened to instigate the Dublin Laois incident and I do believe the Dublin lads went too far in roping in the crowd with them but I do know that the likes of Darren Rooney is no saint himself and may well have merited some form of payback for earlier indescretions. I'm not saying this was totally the case here, just that its not always as black and white as the tv shows and anyone who's ever played the game knows this. Similarly, Tommy Freeman reacted after scoring the goal in the Ulster Final where he was being marked by Conor Gormley. Now, I'm a big fan of Gormley, think he's a class act and merits an All-Star this year, but having seen him in action a few times, most recently against Meath where he "man-marked" Bray in the second half, there is no doubt that he engages in an awful lot of pulling and dragging off the ball to spoil his opponent. To me this is a much bigger problem than the so called taunting of players after scoring a goal/point. Sean Cavangh was also mauled off camera on countless occassions when he went to make a run off the ball, all under the eyes of the linesman but nothing was done about it. If these players want to stick it in their opponents faces after burying a goal, then they're well entitled to in my opinion. Anyone that plays the game has probably heard the phrase about how best to deal with constant fouling or off the ball stuff is to beat them on the scoreboard and let them know about it. F*ck it, its a man's game. There are no feelings being hurt here. To hear the "victims" bleating about it after, a la Rooney's "I'll never be able to look at them guys in the eye again" makes me cringe. The off the ball stuff is part and parcel of it (but shouldn't be let run wild either!) and if someone who is getting subjected to it wants to point to a scoreboard or raise their fingers in indication of how many titles they've won then power to them I reckon.

Why only if Longford and/or Offaly are involved? Since they're game ended in a draw then it affects neither's scoring difference nor has no impact on any of the other teams.

How many games they play is irrelevant. The idea behind the theory is that a footballer in Wicklow makes as many sacrifices as one in Armagh. While this may not have been the case 10 years ago it is rapidly becoming so. They train from October/November onwards till Mid-June at the earliest before they are knocked out of all intercounty competition. Take into account that increasingly they are asked to maintain weight programmes throughout the year and it is quite clear intercounty football is almost a 12 month commitment. Dessie Farrell's desire to reward all players equally eradicates the elitism criticised so readily by many posts here. The efforts made by all players up until after the first round of the c'ship will not vary to that great a deal, thus justifying equal standing for all. I think most players who go on to play for the most successful teams later on in the c'ship would acknowledge that these games bring their own rewards as regards titles, national recognition, personal recognition, etc.  And the point I was trynig to make Magpie was that a small amount of money towards the players does not necessarily mean the floodgates will open and professionalism will arrive and destroy our game.

Lads, I could get the head taken off me here but nonetheless - I don't see any problem with county players getting a small sum for the effort they put into the game. I know a friend of mine who plays for a "small" county. He rarely goes out and lives in the gymn. He might take a drink 5 or 6 times a year. He will probably never win a major title. While I understand many of your views with regard to the effort other ordinary members of the gaa put in, bare in mind that on any given night that person can go out and enjoy themselves and turn up at their trainin/coaching session the next day nursing a "small" hangover (i.e. it'll be alright so long as they can physically take the session which should of course be a given). Can the intercounty player do that? These guys have no lives. I know the rewards can be great but what if your playin for a weaker county? In some cases its not that eeasy either to walk away and say "I want a life" because there is alot of pressure on players of a certain ability to play and represent their county. I acknowledge though that there can be pressure on underage mentops too to stay coaching in a club because no one's willing to take over. My point is, if every manager at intercounty level, and 90% of club managers are gettin large sums for their troubles, then why begrudge the guys that are doing the most to promote these games and generate this money a tiny fraction of it? €127 a week doesn't have to evolve into "pay for play". There should still be lots of money left to feed into the grass-roots.