Tyrone V Monaghan AIQF 2015

Started by never kickt a ball, August 01, 2015, 08:20:10 PM

Previous topic - Next topic

straightred

Quote from: INDIANA on August 08, 2015, 08:45:05 PM
Quote from: straightred on August 08, 2015, 08:37:37 PM
Quote from: INDIANA on August 08, 2015, 08:31:46 PM
Quote from: straightred on August 08, 2015, 08:27:55 PM
Quote from: reddgnhand on August 08, 2015, 08:25:05 PM
Quote from: charlieTully on August 08, 2015, 08:21:35 PM
Quote from: Put Up That Flag on August 08, 2015, 08:13:07 PM
Will be great to see what a proper footballing team like Kerry will do to a team of cynical cheaters who can only win games by dishing out cheap blows on the opposition and getting opponents sent off, there is very little football ability in them, if there was all irelands for dark arts they would be going for 13 or 14 in a row

but that's the thing, there is football in them, they were excellent today and have been one of the most consistent teams in the country for 15 years. that's what makes it so disappointing when they revert to the crap.

Tony McCann shouldn't have went down like that and he should get a ban but there were 2 teams out there today.

Naw - not this time. It just won't cut it. Monaghan's problem was they just didn't know how to be as cynical

Monaghan's problem is they don't score enough. Same as ever. They have a template to win an Ulster Championship.

They have no template to win AI Titles.

They need to focus on underage and get winning them at that level first.

I don't necessarily disagree with that but it wasn't my point (its not a perfect formula either - look at cavan). I'm sick of watching football where the perpetrators are a few steps ahead  of the ref. That's Tyrone all over and Cavanagh in particular. Duffy never stood a chance

Look Tyrone have never been any different. At times they are pathetic in the way they drag the game through the mud. They truly can be a disgrace at times in the manner in which they drag the game to a base level typically seen in a Games of Thrones Episode.

But they have a brilliant manager and great development system which we ended up copying. They produce multi-adaptable , highly skilled and conditioned players in sufficient numbers to excel at inter county level. I genuinely admire them for that. When they have a weakness in an area of the pitch they put emphasis on it in the development system to ensure it doesn't happen again. That's why they are so good.

Unfortunately though they also teach some of their players to be scumbags. Why I don't know. But it's a pity because it allows everyone to forget how good some of their players are. But only they can change that

we can agree on all that.I wont deny however that I really hope Kerry stuff them (and me following Kerry is a rare event). 

imtommygunn

Quote from: INDIANA on August 08, 2015, 08:31:46 PM
Quote from: straightred on August 08, 2015, 08:27:55 PM
Quote from: reddgnhand on August 08, 2015, 08:25:05 PM
Quote from: charlieTully on August 08, 2015, 08:21:35 PM
Quote from: Put Up That Flag on August 08, 2015, 08:13:07 PM
Will be great to see what a proper footballing team like Kerry will do to a team of cynical cheaters who can only win games by dishing out cheap blows on the opposition and getting opponents sent off, there is very little football ability in them, if there was all irelands for dark arts they would be going for 13 or 14 in a row

but that's the thing, there is football in them, they were excellent today and have been one of the most consistent teams in the country for 15 years. that's what makes it so disappointing when they revert to the crap.

Tony McCann shouldn't have went down like that and he should get a ban but there were 2 teams out there today.

Naw - not this time. It just won't cut it. Monaghan's problem was they just didn't know how to be as cynical

Monaghan's problem is they don't score enough. Same as ever. They have a template to win an Ulster Championship.

They have no template to win AI Titles.

They need to focus on underage and get winning them at that level first.

It's not about templates to win ai titles. It's about being able to vary tactics when it counts. There has to be more than one way to break teams down.

Donegal last year and monaghan this year play the ultra defensive counter attacking game well but when faced with it really struggle to adapt.

INDIANA

Quote from: imtommygunn on August 08, 2015, 08:51:15 PM
Quote from: INDIANA on August 08, 2015, 08:31:46 PM
Quote from: straightred on August 08, 2015, 08:27:55 PM
Quote from: reddgnhand on August 08, 2015, 08:25:05 PM
Quote from: charlieTully on August 08, 2015, 08:21:35 PM
Quote from: Put Up That Flag on August 08, 2015, 08:13:07 PM
Will be great to see what a proper footballing team like Kerry will do to a team of cynical cheaters who can only win games by dishing out cheap blows on the opposition and getting opponents sent off, there is very little football ability in them, if there was all irelands for dark arts they would be going for 13 or 14 in a row

but that's the thing, there is football in them, they were excellent today and have been one of the most consistent teams in the country for 15 years. that's what makes it so disappointing when they revert to the crap.

Tony McCann shouldn't have went down like that and he should get a ban but there were 2 teams out there today.

Naw - not this time. It just won't cut it. Monaghan's problem was they just didn't know how to be as cynical

Monaghan's problem is they don't score enough. Same as ever. They have a template to win an Ulster Championship.

They have no template to win AI Titles.

They need to focus on underage and get winning them at that level first.

It's not about templates to win ai titles. It's about being able to vary tactics when it counts. There has to be more than one way to break teams down.

Donegal last year and monaghan this year play the ultra defensive counter attacking game well but when faced with it really struggle to adapt.

I don't agree tommy they are two entirely different templates for many counties. Fermanagh can win Ulster next year. they can't win the AI though.

Donegal (pre 2015) and Tyrone could win both with the same template. The other Ulster teams just can't transition from attack to defence in Croke Park in sufficient numbers to beat your Kerry, Mayo's and Dublin's.

Mickey Harte has always had a big picture vision for Tyrone. Winning Ulster was never his aim. Winning AI's is- and their structures reflect that.

ONeill

Great win an all. But Tiernan McCann. Hang yer head in shame. Embarrassing.

Monaghan gutless which was a surprise. Allowed Tyrone to bully them all over the field.

0-18 good scoring. Sean immense.
I wanna have my kicks before the whole shithouse goes up in flames.

omaghjoe

Quote from: Sidney on August 08, 2015, 08:39:42 PM
Meyler was hard done by with his black card.

Cavanagh and Donnelly should both have been black carded.

Cavanagh pointing to his shoulder after he clotheslined a Monaghan player was one of the most pathetic things I've ever seen.

No exaggeration there then

;D

Throw ball

Quote from: heffo on August 08, 2015, 08:23:53 PM
Quote from: Lamh Dhearg Alba on August 08, 2015, 08:20:07 PM
Quote from: Put Up That Flag on August 08, 2015, 08:13:07 PM
Will be great to see what a proper footballing team like Kerry will do to a team of cynical cheaters who can only win games by dishing out cheap blows on the opposition and getting opponents sent off, there is very little football ability in them, if there was all irelands for dark arts they would be going for 13 or 14 in a row

Maybe McCann had been watching old Aidan O'Mahony DVD's before the game. Or the way the Dubs closed out the 2013 final.  The hysteria about Tyrone on here is brilliant,  people incapable of thinking for themselves.

Dublin committed two cycnical fouls in the dying minutes of the 2013 final which was only a fraction of what Mayo had done the year previous.

To compare that to the porfolio of cynicism under St Mickey is nonsense - no team could hold a candle to Tyrone on that front.

That is the problem. For me Monaghan and Tyrone are teams of a similar standard. The difference is that Tyrone are masters of controlling the game from start to finish, many times with cynicism. All the best teams can be cynical but on that front Tyrone are by far the masters and have been for a long time.

charlieTully

Donegal really struggled breaking Monaghan down and were making silly shot selections racking up wides, yet Tyrone seemed to create point scoring opportunities at ease today. Why the difference, is it building up a head of steam through the qualifiers and perfecting things or were Monaghan just not at the races today?

Sidney

Quote from: omaghjoe on August 08, 2015, 09:04:16 PM
Quote from: Sidney on August 08, 2015, 08:39:42 PM
Meyler was hard done by with his black card.

Cavanagh and Donnelly should both have been black carded.

Cavanagh pointing to his shoulder after he clotheslined a Monaghan player was one of the most pathetic things I've ever seen.

No exaggeration there then

;D
Nah, Tyrone would never do exaggeration, mate.

imtommygunn

The way harte's teams play benefit from more games though to fine tune his systems. That doesn't mean he doesn't go out to win ulster- it just means the way he plays gets better with more games.

I guess in some respects i agree with you but i think tactically the big guys really need more than one hand. Very surprised monaghan didn't have that to be honest. Even moving mcmanus out to half forwards and trying longer range points would have been a start. Just changing personnel is not enough.

It's where i think it'll be very interesting this year with gavin. Dublin may win the ai but with what's left at some point they won't steam roll teams and how will they adapt. Especially if fundamental things like half back line goes missing happens...

Scoring Zone

Personally, one what I thought was a brilliantly executed ruthless performance by a Tyrone team against a very tough opponent was massively tainted by the last 10 minutes - that McCann incident is completely indefensible, its everything you want the game not to be and hopefully internally he his absolutely nailed to the wall by everyone. And then for oneill to wade in and start messing when his team is a winning position was utterly moronic and gutless and should never be given the opportunity to play for tyrone ever again. The tyrone jersey was not left in a good place by meyler, the 2 macanns and oneill, but flip the coin Donnelly, McNabb, Harte and the two cavanaghs had stellar days and I think that today gave an over-rated Kerry outfit a lot to think about - Kerry still favourites but the way they controlled and stifled monaghan today was very impressive.

and to McManus, the man is pure gold to watch, easily in the top two forwards in the country he deserves to play in the later stages of the AI and hopefully he does that in the future

omaghjoe

Quote from: Sidney on August 08, 2015, 08:49:06 PM
Quote from: INDIANA on August 08, 2015, 08:45:05 PM
Quote from: straightred on August 08, 2015, 08:37:37 PM
Quote from: INDIANA on August 08, 2015, 08:31:46 PM
Quote from: straightred on August 08, 2015, 08:27:55 PM
Quote from: reddgnhand on August 08, 2015, 08:25:05 PM
Quote from: charlieTully on August 08, 2015, 08:21:35 PM
Quote from: Put Up That Flag on August 08, 2015, 08:13:07 PM
Will be great to see what a proper footballing team like Kerry will do to a team of cynical cheaters who can only win games by dishing out cheap blows on the opposition and getting opponents sent off, there is very little football ability in them, if there was all irelands for dark arts they would be going for 13 or 14 in a row

but that's the thing, there is football in them, they were excellent today and have been one of the most consistent teams in the country for 15 years. that's what makes it so disappointing when they revert to the crap.

Tony McCann shouldn't have went down like that and he should get a ban but there were 2 teams out there today.

Naw - not this time. It just won't cut it. Monaghan's problem was they just didn't know how to be as cynical

Monaghan's problem is they don't score enough. Same as ever. They have a template to win an Ulster Championship.

They have no template to win AI Titles.

They need to focus on underage and get winning them at that level first.

I don't necessarily disagree with that but it wasn't my point (its not a perfect formula either - look at cavan). I'm sick of watching football where the perpetrators are a few steps ahead  of the ref. That's Tyrone all over and Cavanagh in particular. Duffy never stood a chance

Look Tyrone have never been any different. At times they are pathetic in the way they drag the game through the mud. They truly can be a disgrace at times in the manner in which they drag the game to a base level typically seen in a Games of Thrones Episode.

But they have a brilliant manager and great development system which we ended up copying. They produce multi-adaptable , highly skilled and conditioned players in sufficient numbers to excel at inter county level. I genuinely admire them for that. When they have a weakness in an area of the pitch they put emphasis on it in the development system to ensure it doesn't happen again. That's why they are so good.

Unfortunately though they also teach some of their players to be scumbags. Why I don't know. But it's a pity because it allows everyone to forget how good some of their players are. But only they can change that

Scum is as scum does.

So where would be place Tyrone on the scum level then?

Presuming Directors of Genocide to be at the top, followed by murders, rapists, drug dealers, thieves, drunk drivers. Where would Tyrone fit in there?

stew

Quote from: ONeill on August 08, 2015, 09:01:17 PM
Great win an all. But Tiernan McCann. Hang yer head in shame. Embarrassing.

Monaghan gutless which was a surprise. Allowed Tyrone to bully them all over the field.

0-18 good scoring. Sean immense.

Finally a man among ye!
Armagh, the one true love of a mans life.

omaghjoe

Quote from: Sidney on August 08, 2015, 09:08:04 PM
Quote from: omaghjoe on August 08, 2015, 09:04:16 PM
Quote from: Sidney on August 08, 2015, 08:39:42 PM
Meyler was hard done by with his black card.

Cavanagh and Donnelly should both have been black carded.

Cavanagh pointing to his shoulder after he clotheslined a Monaghan player was one of the most pathetic things I've ever seen.

No exaggeration there then

;D
Nah, Tyrone would never do exaggeration, mate.

Except I was talking about you

Darby

Quote from: omaghjoe on August 08, 2015, 09:11:27 PM
Quote from: Sidney on August 08, 2015, 08:49:06 PM
Quote from: INDIANA on August 08, 2015, 08:45:05 PM
Quote from: straightred on August 08, 2015, 08:37:37 PM
Quote from: INDIANA on August 08, 2015, 08:31:46 PM
Quote from: straightred on August 08, 2015, 08:27:55 PM
Quote from: reddgnhand on August 08, 2015, 08:25:05 PM
Quote from: charlieTully on August 08, 2015, 08:21:35 PM
Quote from: Put Up That Flag on August 08, 2015, 08:13:07 PM
Will be great to see what a proper footballing team like Kerry will do to a team of cynical cheaters who can only win games by dishing out cheap blows on the opposition and getting opponents sent off, there is very little football ability in them, if there was all irelands for dark arts they would be going for 13 or 14 in a row

but that's the thing, there is football in them, they were excellent today and have been one of the most consistent teams in the country for 15 years. that's what makes it so disappointing when they revert to the crap.

Tony McCann shouldn't have went down like that and he should get a ban but there were 2 teams out there today.

Naw - not this time. It just won't cut it. Monaghan's problem was they just didn't know how to be as cynical

Monaghan's problem is they don't score enough. Same as ever. They have a template to win an Ulster Championship.

They have no template to win AI Titles.

They need to focus on underage and get winning them at that level first.

I don't necessarily disagree with that but it wasn't my point (its not a perfect formula either - look at cavan). I'm sick of watching football where the perpetrators are a few steps ahead  of the ref. That's Tyrone all over and Cavanagh in particular. Duffy never stood a chance

Look Tyrone have never been any different. At times they are pathetic in the way they drag the game through the mud. They truly can be a disgrace at times in the manner in which they drag the game to a base level typically seen in a Games of Thrones Episode.

But they have a brilliant manager and great development system which we ended up copying. They produce multi-adaptable , highly skilled and conditioned players in sufficient numbers to excel at inter county level. I genuinely admire them for that. When they have a weakness in an area of the pitch they put emphasis on it in the development system to ensure it doesn't happen again. That's why they are so good.

Unfortunately though they also teach some of their players to be scumbags. Why I don't know. But it's a pity because it allows everyone to forget how good some of their players are. But only they can change that

Scum is as scum does.

So where would be place Tyrone on the scum level then?

Presuming Directors of Genocide to be at the top, followed by murders, rapists, drug dealers, thieves, drunk drivers. Where would Tyrone fit in there?

When that's your defence, you might just have a problem.

Throw ball

Quote from: Scoring Zone on August 08, 2015, 09:09:19 PM
Personally, one what I thought was a brilliantly executed ruthless performance by a Tyrone team against a very tough opponent was massively tainted by the last 10 minutes - that McCann incident is completely indefensible, its everything you want the game not to be and hopefully internally he his absolutely nailed to the wall by everyone. And then for oneill to wade in and start messing when his team is a winning position was utterly moronic and gutless and should never be given the opportunity to play for tyrone ever again. The tyrone jersey was not left in a good place by meyler, the 2 macanns and oneill, but flip the coin Donnelly, McNabb, Harte and the two cavanaghs had stellar days and I think that today gave an over-rated Kerry outfit a lot to think about - Kerry still favourites but the way they controlled and stifled monaghan today was very impressive.

and to McManus, the man is pure gold to watch, easily in the top two forwards in the country he deserves to play in the later stages of the AI and hopefully he does that in the future

Well said