Referees getting more protection

pauly2 · November 04, 2014, 11:30:55 PM

There is a motion set for congress now that managers who speak about referees in the lead up to a fixture or indeed after the fixture in a derogatory way will face a side line ban. The most untouchable people in the GAA and they are getting even more protection now. Only in the GAA..... Why are referees not sat down after games in all county level fixtures and asked to give feedback on their performance in terms of decisions given etc. Why is there not more assessors at club games to witness the frustration they cause with decisions that are out of no rule book to be found??
Instead of making them answerable - the GAA offer more protection.. Madness..

Milltown Row2 · November 04, 2014, 11:42:41 PM

Quote from: pauly2 on November 04, 2014, 11:30:55 PM
There is a motion set for congress now that managers who speak about referees in the lead up to a fixture or indeed after the fixture in a derogatory way will face a side line ban. The most untouchable people in the GAA and they are getting even more protection now. Only in the GAA..... Why are referees not sat down after games in all county level fixtures and asked to give feedback on their performance in terms of decisions given etc. Why is there not more assessors at club games to witness the frustration they cause with decisions that are out of no rule book to be found??
Instead of making them answerable - the GAA offer more protection.. Madness..

They are sat down afterwards and game analysed for them by their assessor/marker/mentor, some teams would need to do it also considering the amount of mistakes they make, and the vast majority of the fouls being deliberate to boot, I don't think a referee, at that level sets out to purposely make a mistake, do you think that? Next time count up the amount of mistakes a player does in a game then compared it to a referee.......

sligoman2 · November 05, 2014, 12:41:02 AM

It's impossible for one man to referee an inter-county game without making some bad calls and some no calls- that is a fact.

It's time to get two refs - I'm blue in the face saying this for the last 3 years.

Never beat the deeler · November 05, 2014, 01:35:05 AM

We need more guidance for our referees.

The way the rulebook is written, and the non-definition of a tackle means that there is a lot left up to interpretation.

Every single game has a litany of calls that could have gone either way depending on the team/ref/time on the clock/time of year etc.
It's a thankless task

What the GAA should be doing is:
Set up a 'rules' team to decide how they want certain rules interpreted
Go through clips and find a number of similar incidences
Release these clips, with a description of what the outcome should have been
Explain the subtle differences why there was a free in for one clip or a free out for another
At least this way there can be some benchmark, and when discussing games we will know what the 'correct' decision would have been, whether we agree or disagree

Milltown Row2 · November 05, 2014, 07:23:50 AM

Referees every year attend a training course and to be fair to the referee association they have the main referees doing the video analysis of the games. Carrying out breakdowns of tackles and a discussion about it. Then a test is carried out. Don't pass means no championship games for you (club level) like most things some referees take things and change it. Not perfect but two referees is silly. What if they both call things differently in each half? Players be wild confused ffs

blewuporstuffed · November 05, 2014, 08:16:55 AM

I cant see two referees being workable either to be honest.
What we need is a better definition of the rules and a simplification of the rule book to try and make the referees life easier.

pauly2 · November 05, 2014, 08:27:29 AM

They are sat down afterwards and game analysed for them by their assessor/marker/mentor, some teams would need to do it also considering the amount of mistakes they make, and the vast majority of the fouls being deliberate to boot, I don't think a referee, at that level sets out to purposely make a mistake, do you think that? Next time count up the amount of mistakes a player does in a game then compared it to a referee.......
[/quote]

Yes a player makes mistakes for sure but my point is - in game A a player bends to pick the ball of the ground that is moving towards him at pace and there is nothing - in game B the same scenario - its a free for deliberate pickup.
How many times have you heard club or indeed county players say when they hear the referee announced for their upcoming game - ah sure we will get away with this and that with him. Or ah jaysus he is a bollix and nit picks at everything. It is happening too often. If intercounty referees sit down and watch their games back and they have made blatant mistakes during the game - they should be dropped for the next round of fixtures or not paid for the game in question. There are too many big games being decided by these people for it to continue as it is at present. And don't throw out the old line - there would be no games without them - I am aware of that - but they need to be held accountable for their actions.
A player makes a mistake - he is answerable to his team mates and the management to justify it
management make mistakes they are answerable to the club committee or county board to justify them
A referee makes mistake(s) and nothing - and now we are not even allowed to say anything about them in the press for fear of being suspended from the sideline for a game. Its a joke.

Down Follower · November 05, 2014, 10:23:03 AM

Lads I refereed a game last week between two teams in my own club!! Sort of senior team v u21 team. Within 5 minutes I was a b****x. Do it right for f*** sake was shouted at me on numerous occassions, and not in a jovial manner. The aggression coming from a player when you give a free against him is unreal. They may not even say or do anything, but you can see it in their eyes.
Referees have an impossible job. The only person who thinks they have made the right call is themselves. 1 against many.

sligoman2 · November 05, 2014, 01:18:02 PM

Quote from: Milltown Row2 link=topic=25233.msg1416063#msg1416063 date=. Not perfect but two referees is silly. What if they both call things differently in each half? Players be wild confused ffs
/quote]

Why is it silly? It works in basketball, in school soccer (in the usa), in hockey etc.. It's a thankless and in my opinion impossible job for one man or woman to handle alone. Stopping managers from criticizing refs doesn't solve the problem of bad calls and bad no calls, it's a futile attempt to cover up a major issue.

We should be trying to improve the quality of referring, not trying to silence those who are impacted by it. We're putting a band aid on a wound that needs surgery and stitches.

blewuporstuffed · November 05, 2014, 01:22:57 PM

Quote from: sligoman2 on November 05, 2014, 01:18:02 PM
Quote from: Milltown Row2 link=topic=25233.msg1416063#msg1416063 date=. Not perfect but two referees is silly. What if they both call things differently in each half? Players be wild confused ffs
/quote]

Why is it silly? It works in basketball, in school soccer (in the usa), in hockey etc.. It's a thankless and in my opinion impossible job for one man or woman to handle alone. Stopping managers from criticizing refs doesn't solve the problem of bad calls and bad no calls, it's a futile attempt to cover up a major issue.

We should be trying to improve the quality of referring, not trying to silence those who are impacted by it. We're putting a band aid on a wound that needs surgery and stitches.
Apart from the pratcicalities of making it work on the pitch ebing dificult, it just isnt feasible for club games, where it is ahrd enough to get enough referees to ref all teh games as it is without needing 2 for each game.
its a non runner.

StephenC · November 05, 2014, 01:32:42 PM

2 refs the way to go. Split responsibilities broadly between halves of the pitch. In your half, you are responsible for the on the ball stuff, while the other ref is responsible for the off the ball stuff. Switch when it goes over the HW line. If there's a dispute, senior ref make the call.

Of course it would be difficult to get 2 refs at club games but you can't crib and dreesh about the standard of refereeing and not be willing to put more effort in to get it right.

blewuporstuffed · November 05, 2014, 01:49:23 PM

Quote from: StephenC on November 05, 2014, 01:32:42 PM
2 refs the way to go. Split responsibilities broadly between halves of the pitch. In your half, you are responsible for the on the ball stuff, while the other ref is responsible for the off the ball stuff. Switch when it goes over the HW line. If there's a dispute, senior ref make the call.

Of course it would be difficult to get 2 refs at club games but you can't crib and dreesh about the standard of refereeing and not be willing to put more effort in to get it right.

not difficult, impossible.
I know in tyrone they have barely the number of referees needed to cover a full round of fixtures every week, without needing double that ammount.

Fr. Cyril McDuff · November 05, 2014, 02:10:45 PM

A Ballinderry and Derry player got a 48 week ban last night for comments made about a referee on twitter. Be interesting to see if it sticks after the inevitable appeal.

http://www.derrynow.com/article/6496

pauly2 · November 05, 2014, 03:04:57 PM

Quote from: Fr. Cyril McDuff on November 05, 2014, 02:10:45 PM
A Ballinderry and Derry player got a 48 week ban last night for comments made about a referee on twitter. Be interesting to see if it sticks after the inevitable appeal.

http://www.derrynow.com/article/6496

Some interesting comments on here folks - the two referee thing might work but the problem is numbers of referees per county to facilitate this. The most interesting thing is the fact that people are starting to get fed up with the referees doing their games and making mistakes and being answerable to no one.

This case above is interesting - in the comfort of his own home the night after a game a player puts his opinion up on social media and now faces suspension..
What about the referees at club games who point the finger at players, talk down to them, make derogatory comments to them during the course of a game, speak to managers like they are shit on their shoe - and nothing. Equality...

I was at an u14 game this year and was walking past the referee after half time going towards the dugout when he said to the 4 players in midfield - I wish he would hurry up - I have a feed of pints waiting on me when this f*****g game is over.
My lads were disgusted at this. Where is the equality. If I as a coach start talking to players about going for a feed of pints after a game or a training session - I would have parents galore onto me with complaints. But the untouchables - they can say and do as they please..

screenexile · November 05, 2014, 04:31:38 PM

Quote from: pauly2 on November 05, 2014, 03:04:57 PM
Quote from: Fr. Cyril McDuff on November 05, 2014, 02:10:45 PM
A Ballinderry and Derry player got a 48 week ban last night for comments made about a referee on twitter. Be interesting to see if it sticks after the inevitable appeal.

http://www.derrynow.com/article/6496

Some interesting comments on here folks - the two referee thing might work but the problem is numbers of referees per county to facilitate this. The most interesting thing is the fact that people are starting to get fed up with the referees doing their games and making mistakes and being answerable to no one.

This case above is interesting - in the comfort of his own home the night after a game a player puts his opinion up on social media and now faces suspension..
What about the referees at club games who point the finger at players, talk down to them, make derogatory comments to them during the course of a game, speak to managers like they are shit on their shoe - and nothing. Equality...

I was at an u14 game this year and was walking past the referee after half time going towards the dugout when he said to the 4 players in midfield - I wish he would hurry up - I have a feed of pints waiting on me when this f*****g game is over.
My lads were disgusted at this. Where is the equality. If I as a coach start talking to players about going for a feed of pints after a game or a training session - I would have parents galore onto me with complaints. But the untouchables - they can say and do as they please..

Not strictly true. . . he tweeted Conor McGregor to come over to Derry as there were 2 referees needed killing!!