Would you be in favour of a second tier?

[imtommygunn]

It's only been going a couple of years. I definitely think the interest has improved(we couldn't compete against what we were playing against top level and were far too good for all bar one or two in the ring). Standard too soon to tell but the Christy ring was detrimental to the standards because the gap between top and bottom was so big.

[Blowitupref]

It was called the Tommy Murphy cup and there was so little appetite for it that we scrapped it. Why would it succeed the 2nd time around?

Maybe we should ask the millions of Brit's that votes for Brexit and have since changed their mind.  Things change, attitudes change and that is a good thing.  Having competitive games is more enjoyable to play and watch than non competitive games.  John Horan seems to have his act together, he sees the need for change and is trying to do something about it and I applaud him for that.  If you don't learn to change you get left behind.

Horan is a president and in the GAA you have no power in that role but it's a platform to voice your opinion off a lot as he has done.

GAA President John Horan is a Dub! He has no idea of the plight of the weaker counties. He is looking for a quick fix way of sorting out the mess that has been left from Financially Doping Dublin. This is just another level of the Super 8's - a new way to have more higher profile games in Croke Park and sell corporate Boxes and Premium seats. The lower tiers will be left hidden away (just like the lower level Hurling competitions) and will become less a financial burden and less an administrative burden. Out of sight out of mind.

For the millionth time, the lower level hurling counties are getting a much higher profile than they ever did in the old system. Donegal, fermanagh, tyrone and hurling teams like that never would've been heard off years ago. At times you wouldn't have known they had a hurling team at all. Now they regularly get their games covered in the irish news etc. That's down to the fact they are playing in relevant competitive competitions for their standard. This line used on here that we can't have tiers because the hurling counties have gone from wall to wall coverage to being forgotten about is absolute garbage and can we all stop peddling that lie.

Without looking it up do you know who any of those teams were playing this weekend?  Donegal BTW conceded a whopping 7-22(43) today and more proof if ever needed that tiers doesn't stop such hammerings.

20 point win for Limerick today in the hurling tier 1 competition 

[lenny]

It was called the Tommy Murphy cup and there was so little appetite for it that we scrapped it. Why would it succeed the 2nd time around?

Maybe we should ask the millions of Brit's that votes for Brexit and have since changed their mind.  Things change, attitudes change and that is a good thing.  Having competitive games is more enjoyable to play and watch than non competitive games.  John Horan seems to have his act together, he sees the need for change and is trying to do something about it and I applaud him for that.  If you don't learn to change you get left behind.

Horan is a president and in the GAA you have no power in that role but it's a platform to voice your opinion off a lot as he has done.

GAA President John Horan is a Dub! He has no idea of the plight of the weaker counties. He is looking for a quick fix way of sorting out the mess that has been left from Financially Doping Dublin. This is just another level of the Super 8's - a new way to have more higher profile games in Croke Park and sell corporate Boxes and Premium seats. The lower tiers will be left hidden away (just like the lower level Hurling competitions) and will become less a financial burden and less an administrative burden. Out of sight out of mind.

For the millionth time, the lower level hurling counties are getting a much higher profile than they ever did in the old system. Donegal, fermanagh, tyrone and hurling teams like that never would've been heard off years ago. At times you wouldn't have known they had a hurling team at all. Now they regularly get their games covered in the irish news etc. That's down to the fact they are playing in relevant competitive competitions for their standard. This line used on here that we can't have tiers because the hurling counties have gone from wall to wall coverage to being forgotten about is absolute garbage and can we all stop peddling that lie.

Without looking it up do you know who any of those teams were playing this weekend?  Donegal BTW conceded a whopping 7-22(43) today and more proof if ever needed that tiers doesn't stop such hammerings.

20 point win for Limerick today in the hurling tier 1 competition

I think we all agree that there'll always be stuffings. The point is how many people would've bet on Waterford to lose by 20. They are obviously underachieving or had a really bad day. We all would've been happy to bet on Tyrone or Dublin to win by more than single figures v Antrim and Louth. Those games were pointless and predictable. Even with tiers there will be occasional big defeats. They generally won't be predictable though.

[MayoBuck]

The football championship has been far better than the hurling so far. The football leagues were also miles better than the hurling equivalent. The difference is the hurling pundits will never criticise their sport. Unlike the football pundits who keep pushing the 2nd/3rd tier agenda which makes the general public think there is nothing positive going on in the sport.

[imtommygunn]

It's hard to know as we get to see so little of it! I love the hurling but there is a bit of a Munster championship overload.

[From the Bunker]

Looks like the Golden Goose Munster Championship has had a bit of a wobbly! You'd be thinking there'd be Waterford and Clare supporters that will not be venturing out the next day.

[MayoBuck]

Armagh v Cavan sounds like a classic on the radio as well!

[BennyCake]

It's hard to know as we get to see so little of it! I love the hurling but there is a bit of a Munster championship overload.

Yeah you really can have too much of a good thing. They're really flogging the Munster championship to death at this stage.

[Sportacus]

Armagh Cavan nail biter today, great.  Antrim have been in an Ulster Final more recently than either.  The answer for Counties like Antrim is to get their house in order, not drop out of the competition.

[Blowitupref]

From the INDO.

There is no disputing that change is needed in Gaelic football. But why take away the hopes of so many players who have earned the right to dream of a big day by introducing a two-tier championship? There has to be a better way.

In life, and sport, timing is everything and Dublin's hammering of Louth last Saturday provided the perfect springboard for GAA president John Horan to proclaim the need for a tiered championship two days later on RTÉ Radio.

"There's an appetite out there within the organisation to go ahead with a tier two Championship and now is the time to grab that while the appetite is out there," said Horan.

There was plenty of support for Horan's comments in the echo chamber that is social media, but what happens when the surface is scratched a little bit deeper.

On hearing Horan's words I set about contacting players from so-called weaker counties to gauge their reaction to potentially being excluded from competing for the Sam Maguire.

I was met with frustration, suspicion, exasperation and definitely a lack of appetite. The players I contacted want change alright but they also want help - they want more resources and better structures within their counties so they can improve. They certainly don't want to be demoted to a secondary competition.

Before last weekend's Leinster quarter-final, Laois manager John Sugrue was talking structures in local publication Laois Today and he said: "Sure feck it, we'd probably be better off with a two-tier championship. We'd be better off if these kind of games didn't happen, inconveniencing lots of people who want to see the top eight play against each other. I think we should just whittle it down and have the best teams playing each other all the time and let everyone else play in back fields around the country."

His frustration is clear. He painted a very grim picture. And with resources in media outlets already stretched, how would these games be covered? Who would promote this competition? Would it be relevant?


A GPA survey revealed last year that almost 60 per cent of the members would support splitting the championship. But two years earlier, a GPA survey showed that Division 4 teams unanimously said they would boycott a proposed 'B' championship. So it would be interesting to see the breakdown of the most recent vote, to hear exclusively from those who would be affected. It's easy for those at the top to vote for something they will never have to face.

Separating weaker counties from the chasing pack will only widen the gulf between the top and bottom and for most there will be no way back.

Having the opportunity to compete at the top level is why players spend at least nine months of the year training, eating right, skipping nights out, missing holidays and ultimately giving their all. The commitment is huge and it's the same in every county - the players in Louth and Dublin work equally as hard, surely they deserve to be treated equally.

Having more games is great, exciting ones are even better, but having meaningful ones trumps the lot. For these players, a shot at a big team, the chance to cause an upset is a bigger carrot than three tight ones in a competition no one really cares that deeply about.

There is a new generation coming through who have different values, priorities and experiences. They have more opportunities and are exposed to a whole lot more because of social media. The world is a smaller place for the next generation.

This is where the players of the future will come from. Of course playing for your county is still held in high esteem but it certainly isn't the be all and end all for many.

Will doing the same training just to play in a secondary competition hold the same appeal as a chance to slay a lion in a meaningful game? Is this something a new generation of players will commit to? I'm not so sure.

There appears to be a disconnect between those driving this second tier proposal and the generation of young people who will shape what the GAA looks like tomorrow.

As for one-sided games, no matter who Dublin play outside the top few teams at the moment, it will be a mismatch and relegating half the country won't stop that.

I speak to players on a regular basis. Every player I meet, regardless of where they are from has the same dream, they want to test themselves against the best and they want to win. It's not realistic for everyone but it should be respected.

There are other options for the GAA to consider, such as an open draw, a Super Bowl format, a Champions League style competition - these, I suspect, are all much more palatable ideas for players than having 'A' and 'B' championships.

Ultimately success starts with a dream. Why take that away from so many?

[trailer]

From the INDO.

There is no disputing that change is needed in Gaelic football. But why take away the hopes of so many players who have earned the right to dream of a big day by introducing a two-tier championship? There has to be a better way.

In life, and sport, timing is everything and Dublin's hammering of Louth last Saturday provided the perfect springboard for GAA president John Horan to proclaim the need for a tiered championship two days later on RTÉ Radio.

"There's an appetite out there within the organisation to go ahead with a tier two Championship and now is the time to grab that while the appetite is out there," said Horan.

There was plenty of support for Horan's comments in the echo chamber that is social media, but what happens when the surface is scratched a little bit deeper.

On hearing Horan's words I set about contacting players from so-called weaker counties to gauge their reaction to potentially being excluded from competing for the Sam Maguire.

I was met with frustration, suspicion, exasperation and definitely a lack of appetite. The players I contacted want change alright but they also want help - they want more resources and better structures within their counties so they can improve. They certainly don't want to be demoted to a secondary competition.

Before last weekend's Leinster quarter-final, Laois manager John Sugrue was talking structures in local publication Laois Today and he said: "Sure feck it, we'd probably be better off with a two-tier championship. We'd be better off if these kind of games didn't happen, inconveniencing lots of people who want to see the top eight play against each other. I think we should just whittle it down and have the best teams playing each other all the time and let everyone else play in back fields around the country."

His frustration is clear. He painted a very grim picture. And with resources in media outlets already stretched, how would these games be covered? Who would promote this competition? Would it be relevant?


A GPA survey revealed last year that almost 60 per cent of the members would support splitting the championship. But two years earlier, a GPA survey showed that Division 4 teams unanimously said they would boycott a proposed 'B' championship. So it would be interesting to see the breakdown of the most recent vote, to hear exclusively from those who would be affected. It's easy for those at the top to vote for something they will never have to face.

Separating weaker counties from the chasing pack will only widen the gulf between the top and bottom and for most there will be no way back.

Having the opportunity to compete at the top level is why players spend at least nine months of the year training, eating right, skipping nights out, missing holidays and ultimately giving their all. The commitment is huge and it's the same in every county - the players in Louth and Dublin work equally as hard, surely they deserve to be treated equally.

Having more games is great, exciting ones are even better, but having meaningful ones trumps the lot. For these players, a shot at a big team, the chance to cause an upset is a bigger carrot than three tight ones in a competition no one really cares that deeply about.

There is a new generation coming through who have different values, priorities and experiences. They have more opportunities and are exposed to a whole lot more because of social media. The world is a smaller place for the next generation.

This is where the players of the future will come from. Of course playing for your county is still held in high esteem but it certainly isn't the be all and end all for many.

Will doing the same training just to play in a secondary competition hold the same appeal as a chance to slay a lion in a meaningful game? Is this something a new generation of players will commit to? I'm not so sure.

There appears to be a disconnect between those driving this second tier proposal and the generation of young people who will shape what the GAA looks like tomorrow.

As for one-sided games, no matter who Dublin play outside the top few teams at the moment, it will be a mismatch and relegating half the country won't stop that.

I speak to players on a regular basis. Every player I meet, regardless of where they are from has the same dream, they want to test themselves against the best and they want to win. It's not realistic for everyone but it should be respected.

There are other options for the GAA to consider, such as an open draw, a Super Bowl format, a Champions League style competition - these, I suspect, are all much more palatable ideas for players than having 'A' and 'B' championships.

Ultimately success starts with a dream. Why take that away from so many?

What's this guys point? Sure this is exactly what's happening at the minute.

[Sportacus]

Trailer I'm intrigued as to why you are on this thread every five minutes pushing for a two tier system.  As a Tyrone man, why is it such a big deal to you? 

[armaghniac]

Trailer I'm intrigued as to why you are on this thread every five minutes pushing for a two tier system.  As a Tyrone man, why is it such a big deal to you?

Likely because he thinks Derry will be in the lower tier.

[trailer]

Trailer I'm intrigued as to why you are on this thread every five minutes pushing for a two tier system.  As a Tyrone man, why is it such a big deal to you?

The football championship is full of poor games, in front of poor crowds with little to no interest. Munster and Leinster football championships are dead. Gone. Like a dog that has been run over by a lorry we're allowing it to limp on in severe pain out of some hazy long lost nostalgic view. Euthanise and dispose of immediately.
It could be a wonderful competition, played in front of large crowds. It could be run off in a high intensity burst. With real interest and buy in from all counties. Solving scheduling issues for clubs up and down the country. But no, we must persist with this outdated rigmarole of drawn out provincials and back doors that is grossly unfair if you're an Ulster county. It doesn't help any weaker county no matter what anyone says. They're not getting better. They're not winning provincials or All Ireland's. It's time to filter and condense.
It suits the stronger counties to have weaker teams. But a championship were every game is a big game would be a different matter, at all levels/ tiers.

[Keyser soze]

Trailer I'm intrigued as to why you are on this thread every five minutes pushing for a two tier system.  As a Tyrone man, why is it such a big deal to you?

The football championship is full of poor games, Will tiering do away with poor games??? How many bad games has there been this year so far?
in front of poor crowds with little to no interest...  what proof do you have for this?

Munster and Leinster football championships are dead. Gone. Like a dog that has been run over by a lorry we're allowing it to limp on in severe pain out of some hazy long lost nostalgic view. Euthanise and dispose of immediately. The Leinster championship is dead solely because of the behemoth that is the current Dublin set up, otherwise there are probably 5 or 6 teams who think they would have a good chance of winning it.


It could be a wonderful competition, played in front of large crowds. It could be.... wtaf are you talking about, you want to radically change the whole intercounty setup because it could be wonderful, sure i might as well make the facile counterargument that it could be crap.

It could be run off in a high intensity burst. With real interest and buy in from all counties. Solving scheduling issues for clubs up and down the country. If you seriously think that there is even a single second's consideration being given to the scheduling of club games as a factor in tiering you need your head examined.

But no, we must persist with this outdated rigmarole of drawn out provincials and back doors that is grossly unfair if you're an Ulster county. It doesn't help any weaker county no matter what anyone says. They're not getting better. They're not winning provincials or All Ireland's. It's time to filter and condense.
It suits the stronger counties to have weaker teams. But a championship were every game is a big game would be a different matter, at all levels/ tiers.

Additionally if you think that there is a single second's consideration being given to the advancement of weaker counties you need a second visit to the head examiner.

The proselytizing for tiering is all coming from people with a financial stake in the game, it another inch on the road travelled from the GAA being a community based organisation to becoming a commercial organisation.