Man Utd Thread:

Started by full back, November 10, 2006, 08:13:49 AM

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Insane Bolt

My son supports United and he said it's strange the amount of stick Jose gets from the press, given that he has won more trophies at United than Liverpool, Spurs, Arsenal and Chelsea combined. Strange the relatively free ride Klopp, Pocc et al get.

el_cuervo_fc

Quote from: Insane Bolt on December 07, 2018, 08:27:49 AM
My son supports United and he said it's strange the amount of stick Jose gets from the press, given that he has won more trophies at United than Liverpool, Spurs, Arsenal and Chelsea combined. Strange the relatively free ride Klopp, Pocc et al get.

Liverpool suffered for years with the likes of Roy Hodgson managing, buying mediocre players and owners who were basically running the club into the ground.  Fast forward to now, where you have owners backing a manager who shows a bit of passion towards the club, fans and players.  They are in much more exciting position now than they have for years.  As time goes on expectations will rise, but the club is in a much better shape now than it has been for a long time.

United have a high level of expectancy following Fergie, and whilst it's been nice to see the United fans squirm for a change, I hate everything that Jose represents.  It's all about him and everything else is second.  I enjoyed his first season at Chelsea when he seemed like a breath of fresh air, but after that he just comes across as an egotistical whinge bag.  He'll do his best to sabotage all around him then blame everyone else for his failures.  The only reason he hasn't walked is he's waiting on the big pay off.

United Fans should be a lot more vocal about how he's treating the club.

HiMucker

Quote from: Insane Bolt on December 07, 2018, 08:27:49 AM
My son supports United and he said it's strange the amount of stick Jose gets from the press, given that he has won more trophies at United than Liverpool, Spurs, Arsenal and Chelsea combined. Strange the relatively free ride Klopp, Pocc et al get.
It doesn't matter what he has won. If you have been a **** on your rise to the top don't be surprised that people stick the boot in on your way down. If someone like Pellegrini was in charge now getting the same results, he wouldn't even get half the abuse.

J70

#43293
Quote from: Insane Bolt on December 07, 2018, 08:27:49 AM
My son supports United and he said it's strange the amount of stick Jose gets from the press, given that he has won more trophies at United than Liverpool, Spurs, Arsenal and Chelsea combined. Strange the relatively free ride Klopp, Pocc et al get.

Err... context??

1. Liverpool were an utter shambles when Klopp took over.
2. The trophy thing is irrelevant. Klopp's remit was to rebuild Liverpool to challenge for the Premier League and become Champions League regulars. Had Liverpool won that penalty shoot out against City in the League Cup final in Klopp's first season, would that have made one iota of difference in the grand scheme? All that really matters is that Klopp is rebuilding the club on the league and champions league front. Which he is clearly doing. The rest is fluff and irrelevant absent league performance. Just ask Mourinho. Or Van Gaal. Or Dalglish after his second run at Liverpool.
3. City are an unprecedented force in the premier league era. Remember the days when Ferguson used to talk about only being able to lose four or five games if you wanted to challenge? Think Chelsea may have hit 100 points once, but City are going to do it as a matter of course.


Insane Bolt

Quote from: J70 on December 07, 2018, 11:11:37 AM
Quote from: Insane Bolt on December 07, 2018, 08:27:49 AM
My son supports United and he said it's strange the amount of stick Jose gets from the press, given that he has won more trophies at United than Liverpool, Spurs, Arsenal and Chelsea combined. Strange the relatively free ride Klopp, Pocc et al get.

Err... context??

1. Liverpool were an utter shambles when Klopp took over.
2. The trophy thing is irrelevant. Klopp's remit was to rebuild Liverpool to challenge for the Premier League and become Champions League regulars. Had Liverpool won that penalty shoot out against City in the League Cup final in Klopp's first season, would that have made one iota of difference in the grand scheme? All that really matters is that Klopp is rebuilding the club on the league and champions league front. Which he is clearly doing. The rest is fluff and irrelevant absent league performance. Just ask Mourinho. Or Van Gaal. Or Dalglish after his second run at Liverpool.
3. City are an unprecedented force in the premier league era. Remember the days when Ferguson used to talk about only being able to lose four or five games if you wanted to challenge? Think Chelsea may have hit 100 points once, but City are going to do it as a matter of course.

Trophies are irrelevant......ok Ted😜 My point is United have won more than all the other 'top teams' combined, finished runners up last season....yet Jose is the one getting stick. Klopp has been good for Liverpool,but they have won nothing.....Pochettino at Spurs....again won nothing.

rodney trotter

#43295
Liverpool will eventually win a trophy under Klopp. They have been in 3 finals since he took over. Not as if they are getting nowhere. A bit of luck and they could have won at least of those finals.

They are playing good football. He has improved the defence. United are awful in comparison

Insane Bolt

Quote from: rodney trotter on December 07, 2018, 12:34:51 PM
Liverpool will eventually win a trophy under Klopp. They have been in 3 finals since he took over. Not as if they are getting nowhere. A bit of luck and they could have won at least of those finals.

They are playing good football. He has improved the defence. United are awful in comparison

Then the obvious question is for football fans......would you be happy/content if your team were playing good football but winning nothing?

Geoff Tipps

Quote from: Insane Bolt on December 07, 2018, 12:50:00 PM
Quote from: rodney trotter on December 07, 2018, 12:34:51 PM
Liverpool will eventually win a trophy under Klopp. They have been in 3 finals since he took over. Not as if they are getting nowhere. A bit of luck and they could have won at least of those finals.

They are playing good football. He has improved the defence. United are awful in comparison

Then the obvious question is for football fans......would you be happy/content if your team were playing good football but winning nothing?

Rather that than sh*t football and winning nothing!

Geoff Tipps

Quote from: Insane Bolt on December 07, 2018, 12:23:14 PM
Quote from: J70 on December 07, 2018, 11:11:37 AM
Quote from: Insane Bolt on December 07, 2018, 08:27:49 AM
My son supports United and he said it's strange the amount of stick Jose gets from the press, given that he has won more trophies at United than Liverpool, Spurs, Arsenal and Chelsea combined. Strange the relatively free ride Klopp, Pocc et al get.

Err... context??

1. Liverpool were an utter shambles when Klopp took over.
2. The trophy thing is irrelevant. Klopp's remit was to rebuild Liverpool to challenge for the Premier League and become Champions League regulars. Had Liverpool won that penalty shoot out against City in the League Cup final in Klopp's first season, would that have made one iota of difference in the grand scheme? All that really matters is that Klopp is rebuilding the club on the league and champions league front. Which he is clearly doing. The rest is fluff and irrelevant absent league performance. Just ask Mourinho. Or Van Gaal. Or Dalglish after his second run at Liverpool.
3. City are an unprecedented force in the premier league era. Remember the days when Ferguson used to talk about only being able to lose four or five games if you wanted to challenge? Think Chelsea may have hit 100 points once, but City are going to do it as a matter of course.

Trophies are irrelevant......ok Ted😜 My point is United have won more than all the other 'top teams' combined, finished runners up last season....yet Jose is the one getting stick. Klopp has been good for Liverpool,but they have won nothing.....Pochettino at Spurs....again won nothing.

I don't know a single United fan who would not rather Klopp or Poch to Mourinho. Why do you think that is??

Milltown Row2

Quote from: Geoff Tipps on December 07, 2018, 12:54:44 PM
Quote from: Insane Bolt on December 07, 2018, 12:50:00 PM
Quote from: rodney trotter on December 07, 2018, 12:34:51 PM
Liverpool will eventually win a trophy under Klopp. They have been in 3 finals since he took over. Not as if they are getting nowhere. A bit of luck and they could have won at least of those finals.

They are playing good football. He has improved the defence. United are awful in comparison

Then the obvious question is for football fans......would you be happy/content if your team were playing good football but winning nothing?

Rather that than sh*t football and winning nothing!


A bit like Arsenal I suppose or Spurs..

the one season when Liverpool are above Utd in terms of points and its like Liverpool are winning the league, their fans have written the season off because they sit behind City, without playing them! they have a fantastic team and well capable of beating City home and away but lack confidence, which is where Klopp doesnt..

As for Liverpool being a shambles before Klopp took over? You were one slip away from winning the league FFS!  It seems blaming other clubs for being brilliant is the reason why Liverpool are still waiting on winning the league
None of us are getting out of here alive, so please stop treating yourself like an after thought. Ea

J70

Quote from: Insane Bolt on December 07, 2018, 12:23:14 PM
Quote from: J70 on December 07, 2018, 11:11:37 AM
Quote from: Insane Bolt on December 07, 2018, 08:27:49 AM
My son supports United and he said it's strange the amount of stick Jose gets from the press, given that he has won more trophies at United than Liverpool, Spurs, Arsenal and Chelsea combined. Strange the relatively free ride Klopp, Pocc et al get.

Err... context??

1. Liverpool were an utter shambles when Klopp took over.
2. The trophy thing is irrelevant. Klopp's remit was to rebuild Liverpool to challenge for the Premier League and become Champions League regulars. Had Liverpool won that penalty shoot out against City in the League Cup final in Klopp's first season, would that have made one iota of difference in the grand scheme? All that really matters is that Klopp is rebuilding the club on the league and champions league front. Which he is clearly doing. The rest is fluff and irrelevant absent league performance. Just ask Mourinho. Or Van Gaal. Or Dalglish after his second run at Liverpool.
3. City are an unprecedented force in the premier league era. Remember the days when Ferguson used to talk about only being able to lose four or five games if you wanted to challenge? Think Chelsea may have hit 100 points once, but City are going to do it as a matter of course.

Trophies are irrelevant......ok Ted😜 My point is United have won more than all the other 'top teams' combined, finished runners up last season....yet Jose is the one getting stick. Klopp has been good for Liverpool,but they have won nothing.....Pochettino at Spurs....again won nothing.

Talk about selective reading... did you miss the words "context" and "shambles"?

Liverpool are currently on a steady, upward trajectory. Are United?

As for the trophies... all those McKenna Cups must mean that Tyrone men were thrilled with Mickey Harte and his senior team's performances for the first half of this decade.

As a Liverpool fan for decades, I couldn't give two fucks about the League Cup or the FA Cup. Europa Cup, if they end up in it, similarly, with its Thursday night games affecting the league (yes, if you make the semis, you'd like to win it and get that Champions League guarantee, but you wouldn't be too bothered up to that).

Those trophies are pleasant window dressing on top of a good league/champions league
performance, but in themselves, fairly meaningless. Progress in the league and champions league is the barometer.

Do United fans look back fondly on Van Gaal winning the FA Cup or Mourinho beating a very young Ajax in the UEFA Cup, or are they more concerned about how far United are away from even hinting at being able to challenge City?

Liverpool ended 2012 with a league cup and an FA Cup final loss after being denied a legitimate goal pre-goal line technology. Given the horrible league performance (and probably his handling of the Suarez-Evra scandal) and despite the esteem in which Dalglish was held, FSG made the right call and not too many fans disagreed.

Spurs... up and coming coach, playing very good football with an excellent first eleven but no squad depth. Some might question why Poch is staying there rather than why Spurs are happy with him.

J70

#43301
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on December 07, 2018, 01:04:32 PM
Quote from: Geoff Tipps on December 07, 2018, 12:54:44 PM
Quote from: Insane Bolt on December 07, 2018, 12:50:00 PM
Quote from: rodney trotter on December 07, 2018, 12:34:51 PM
Liverpool will eventually win a trophy under Klopp. They have been in 3 finals since he took over. Not as if they are getting nowhere. A bit of luck and they could have won at least of those finals.

They are playing good football. He has improved the defence. United are awful in comparison

Then the obvious question is for football fans......would you be happy/content if your team were playing good football but winning nothing?

Rather that than sh*t football and winning nothing!


A bit like Arsenal I suppose or Spurs..

the one season when Liverpool are above Utd in terms of points and its like Liverpool are winning the league, their fans have written the season off because they sit behind City, without playing them! they have a fantastic team and well capable of beating City home and away but lack confidence, which is where Klopp doesnt..

As for Liverpool being a shambles before Klopp took over? You were one slip away from winning the league FFS!  It seems blaming other clubs for being brilliant is the reason why Liverpool are still waiting on winning the league

Klopp took over 18 months after the 2014 close call.

A lot of shit, and Liverpool's first team quality and performance, went down in that time. Brendan had totally lost the plot. Firmino as a wing back FFS in his final few games. Suarez and Sterling up and gone. Fielding the reserves at the Bernebeu. Ballotelli and Benteke. Gerrard retired. Stoke 6 Liverpool 1. It was a mess.

Milltown Row2

Quote from: J70 on December 07, 2018, 01:14:44 PM
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on December 07, 2018, 01:04:32 PM
Quote from: Geoff Tipps on December 07, 2018, 12:54:44 PM
Quote from: Insane Bolt on December 07, 2018, 12:50:00 PM
Quote from: rodney trotter on December 07, 2018, 12:34:51 PM
Liverpool will eventually win a trophy under Klopp. They have been in 3 finals since he took over. Not as if they are getting nowhere. A bit of luck and they could have won at least of those finals.

They are playing good football. He has improved the defence. United are awful in comparison

Then the obvious question is for football fans......would you be happy/content if your team were playing good football but winning nothing?

Rather that than sh*t football and winning nothing!


A bit like Arsenal I suppose or Spurs..

the one season when Liverpool are above Utd in terms of points and its like Liverpool are winning the league, their fans have written the season off because they sit behind City, without playing them! they have a fantastic team and well capable of beating City home and away but lack confidence, which is where Klopp doesnt..

As for Liverpool being a shambles before Klopp took over? You were one slip away from winning the league FFS!  It seems blaming other clubs for being brilliant is the reason why Liverpool are still waiting on winning the league

Klopp took over 18 months after the 2014 close call.

A lot of shit, and Liverpool's first team quality and performance, went down in that time. Brendan had totally lost the plot. Firmino as a wing back FFS in his final few games. Suarez and Sterling up and gone. Fielding the reserves at the Bernebeu. Ballotelli and Benteke. Gerrard retired. Stoke 6 Liverpool 1. It was a mess.

Bar losing the CL final, was last year a mess as Utd were 2 in the league and Liverpool 4th, having previously been further up the league in previous seasons. is the upward curve you talk about steady or change from year to year?
None of us are getting out of here alive, so please stop treating yourself like an after thought. Ea

GetOverTheBar

Back to the Pochetino links this morning.

Do you all think he would go to United at this stage? Assuming Spurs qualify for UCL this season and the backdrop of the new stadium next season.

Geoff Tipps

Quote from: Milltown Row2 on December 07, 2018, 01:30:41 PM
Quote from: J70 on December 07, 2018, 01:14:44 PM
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on December 07, 2018, 01:04:32 PM
Quote from: Geoff Tipps on December 07, 2018, 12:54:44 PM
Quote from: Insane Bolt on December 07, 2018, 12:50:00 PM
Quote from: rodney trotter on December 07, 2018, 12:34:51 PM
Liverpool will eventually win a trophy under Klopp. They have been in 3 finals since he took over. Not as if they are getting nowhere. A bit of luck and they could have won at least of those finals.

They are playing good football. He has improved the defence. United are awful in comparison

Then the obvious question is for football fans......would you be happy/content if your team were playing good football but winning nothing?

Rather that than sh*t football and winning nothing!


A bit like Arsenal I suppose or Spurs..

the one season when Liverpool are above Utd in terms of points and its like Liverpool are winning the league, their fans have written the season off because they sit behind City, without playing them! they have a fantastic team and well capable of beating City home and away but lack confidence, which is where Klopp doesnt..

As for Liverpool being a shambles before Klopp took over? You were one slip away from winning the league FFS!  It seems blaming other clubs for being brilliant is the reason why Liverpool are still waiting on winning the league

Klopp took over 18 months after the 2014 close call.

A lot of shit, and Liverpool's first team quality and performance, went down in that time. Brendan had totally lost the plot. Firmino as a wing back FFS in his final few games. Suarez and Sterling up and gone. Fielding the reserves at the Bernebeu. Ballotelli and Benteke. Gerrard retired. Stoke 6 Liverpool 1. It was a mess.

Bar losing the CL final, was last year a mess as Utd were 2 in the league and Liverpool 4th, having previously been further up the league in previous seasons. is the upward curve you talk about steady or change from year to year?

The upward curve under Klopp is steady:

8th and a couple of final appearances in mickey mouse cups
4th
4th and CL final appearance
2nd as things stand.