Fermanagh v Dublin AIQ/Final

[AZOffaly]

Jeez lads – an awful lot of guff being posted on here. Supporter reactions do not equal player reactions.
The Fermanagh players standing in front of me in the Hogan Stand were a sombre looking bunch, as you'd expect after a comprehensive 8pt defeat. To me they seemed embarrassed and awkward with what was happening around them, and Eoin Donnelly, who has been a fantastic captain this year, made a number of attempts to get the players towards the tunnel. There seemed to be a few light hearted comments between Dublin & Fermanagh players immediately after the game – I'd imagine Sean's goal being the main topic.
The supporters, myself included, got a bit over-excited, but that was driven by the last 15minutes – the Sean/Cluxton incident, the booing from the Hill & some good scores from Sean and Conall Jones towards the end of the match. Appreciation for a better season than any of us expected. Applauding the supporters in the circumstances was the right thing to do – and I think was more a consequence of the majority of Fermanagh supporters being in the Hogan Stand around the tunnel area. Perhaps if we had the budget for a PR company the players may have been instructed differently. There was no "lap of honour", as some seem to be suggesting.
Surprised at McGuinness comments on player/family interaction which probably happens at least a good hour after the game has ended. If family are slapping you on the back and telling you they are proud of what you achieved this year – how is a player supposed to react?

Erne Man, what I am talking about was immediately after the final whistle. It was the players together on the pitch, smiling and looking relieved.

I have no problem with them interacting with their fans and friends, in fact it's one of the great things about our games. I have no problem with them being proud of their efforts over the year, or of the fans standing 100% behind them. That's all good stuff.

I just thought the reaction IMMEDIATELY on the final whistle was strange, and not one I was expecting from any team losing a game like that.

[The Hill is Blue]

Hard to see Cluxton getting another All Star after Sunday's performance. Discuss.

There are very few players in any position who contribute as much to the overall performance of their team as Stephen Cluxton does to Dublin. He is irreplaceable at the moment and well deserving of an All Star.

[Syferus]

Hard to see Cluxton getting another All Star after Sunday's performance. Discuss.

There are very few players in any position who contribute as much to the overall performance of their team as Stephen Cluxton does to Dublin. He is irreplaceable at the moment and well deserving of an All Star.

Ye've only made the semi-final ffs! No one deserves an All-Star yet, particularly by the standards of All-Stars, ie ignoring everything up till late August.

[The Hill is Blue]

Hard to see Cluxton getting another All Star after Sunday's performance. Discuss.

There are very few players in any position who contribute as much to the overall performance of their team as Stephen Cluxton does to Dublin. He is irreplaceable at the moment and well deserving of an All Star.

Ye've only made the semi-final ffs! No one deserves an All-Star yet, particularly by the standards of All-Stars, ie ignoring everything up till late August.

You have a point there 

[Hound]

Jeez lads – an awful lot of guff being posted on here. Supporter reactions do not equal player reactions.
The Fermanagh players standing in front of me in the Hogan Stand were a sombre looking bunch, as you'd expect after a comprehensive 8pt defeat. To me they seemed embarrassed and awkward with what was happening around them, and Eoin Donnelly, who has been a fantastic captain this year, made a number of attempts to get the players towards the tunnel. There seemed to be a few light hearted comments between Dublin & Fermanagh players immediately after the game – I'd imagine Sean's goal being the main topic.
The supporters, myself included, got a bit over-excited, but that was driven by the last 15minutes – the Sean/Cluxton incident, the booing from the Hill & some good scores from Sean and Conall Jones towards the end of the match. Appreciation for a better season than any of us expected. Applauding the supporters in the circumstances was the right thing to do – and I think was more a consequence of the majority of Fermanagh supporters being in the Hogan Stand around the tunnel area. Perhaps if we had the budget for a PR company the players may have been instructed differently. There was no "lap of honour", as some seem to be suggesting.
Surprised at McGuinness comments on player/family interaction which probably happens at least a good hour after the game has ended. If family are slapping you on the back and telling you they are proud of what you achieved this year – how is a player supposed to react?

Erne Man, what I am talking about was immediately after the final whistle. It was the players together on the pitch, smiling and looking relieved.

I have no problem with them interacting with their fans and friends, in fact it's one of the great things about our games. I have no problem with them being proud of their efforts over the year, or of the fans standing 100% behind them. That's all good stuff.

I just thought the reaction IMMEDIATELY on the final whistle was strange, and not one I was expecting from any team losing a game like that.

You have explained yourself a number of times, but you're just ignoring what people (who were at the match) are saying in response.

The laughing and smiling at the end was totally to do with the two calamitous goals and nothing to do with being happy about not being hammered. And it was far from every player who was laughing and smiling.

[AZOffaly]

Jeez lads – an awful lot of guff being posted on here. Supporter reactions do not equal player reactions.
The Fermanagh players standing in front of me in the Hogan Stand were a sombre looking bunch, as you'd expect after a comprehensive 8pt defeat. To me they seemed embarrassed and awkward with what was happening around them, and Eoin Donnelly, who has been a fantastic captain this year, made a number of attempts to get the players towards the tunnel. There seemed to be a few light hearted comments between Dublin & Fermanagh players immediately after the game – I'd imagine Sean's goal being the main topic.
The supporters, myself included, got a bit over-excited, but that was driven by the last 15minutes – the Sean/Cluxton incident, the booing from the Hill & some good scores from Sean and Conall Jones towards the end of the match. Appreciation for a better season than any of us expected. Applauding the supporters in the circumstances was the right thing to do – and I think was more a consequence of the majority of Fermanagh supporters being in the Hogan Stand around the tunnel area. Perhaps if we had the budget for a PR company the players may have been instructed differently. There was no "lap of honour", as some seem to be suggesting.
Surprised at McGuinness comments on player/family interaction which probably happens at least a good hour after the game has ended. If family are slapping you on the back and telling you they are proud of what you achieved this year – how is a player supposed to react?

Erne Man, what I am talking about was immediately after the final whistle. It was the players together on the pitch, smiling and looking relieved.

I have no problem with them interacting with their fans and friends, in fact it's one of the great things about our games. I have no problem with them being proud of their efforts over the year, or of the fans standing 100% behind them. That's all good stuff.

I just thought the reaction IMMEDIATELY on the final whistle was strange, and not one I was expecting from any team losing a game like that.

You have explained yourself a number of times, but you're just ignoring what people (who were at the match) are saying in response.

The laughing and smiling at the end was totally to do with the two calamitous goals and nothing to do with being happy about not being hammered. And it was far from every player who was laughing and smiling.

Fair enough. I don't think I'm ignoring what people are saying though, I just don't believe it's because of some sort of review of the year. You seem to think it's because of the nature of the two goals so it's actually you ignoring what the lads are saying . If it's the latter, then fine. I still think it's weird after losing a quarter final, but fair enough.

I'm not ignoring anyone though, I'm just disagreeing

[Hound]

Jeez lads – an awful lot of guff being posted on here. Supporter reactions do not equal player reactions.
The Fermanagh players standing in front of me in the Hogan Stand were a sombre looking bunch, as you'd expect after a comprehensive 8pt defeat. To me they seemed embarrassed and awkward with what was happening around them, and Eoin Donnelly, who has been a fantastic captain this year, made a number of attempts to get the players towards the tunnel. There seemed to be a few light hearted comments between Dublin & Fermanagh players immediately after the game – I'd imagine Sean's goal being the main topic.
The supporters, myself included, got a bit over-excited, but that was driven by the last 15minutes – the Sean/Cluxton incident, the booing from the Hill & some good scores from Sean and Conall Jones towards the end of the match. Appreciation for a better season than any of us expected. Applauding the supporters in the circumstances was the right thing to do – and I think was more a consequence of the majority of Fermanagh supporters being in the Hogan Stand around the tunnel area. Perhaps if we had the budget for a PR company the players may have been instructed differently. There was no "lap of honour", as some seem to be suggesting.
Surprised at McGuinness comments on player/family interaction which probably happens at least a good hour after the game has ended. If family are slapping you on the back and telling you they are proud of what you achieved this year – how is a player supposed to react?

Erne Man, what I am talking about was immediately after the final whistle. It was the players together on the pitch, smiling and looking relieved.

I have no problem with them interacting with their fans and friends, in fact it's one of the great things about our games. I have no problem with them being proud of their efforts over the year, or of the fans standing 100% behind them. That's all good stuff.

I just thought the reaction IMMEDIATELY on the final whistle was strange, and not one I was expecting from any team losing a game like that.

You have explained yourself a number of times, but you're just ignoring what people (who were at the match) are saying in response.

The laughing and smiling at the end was totally to do with the two calamitous goals and nothing to do with being happy about not being hammered. And it was far from every player who was laughing and smiling.

Fair enough. I don't think I'm ignoring what people are saying though, I just don't believe it's because of some sort of review of the year. You seem to think it's because of the nature of the two goals so it's actually you ignoring what the lads are saying . If it's the latter, then fine. I still think it's weird after losing a quarter final, but fair enough.

I'm not ignoring anyone though, I'm just disagreeing

The review of the year was the acknowledements to the crowd.
The laughing was the goals - probably one of those jokes were "you had to be there"!

[AZOffaly]

Fair enough. Didn't come across like that, but I'll take your word for it. It's credible

[twohands!!!]

I was looking at the hammerings dished out by Dublin and Kerry in the All-Ireland semis in the late 70s/early 80s. Not much has changed.

The only thing that has changed is the media exposure. The whole notion of a widening gap is a fallacy. Only 3 'new' teams have won an AI in the last 40 odd years. 20 teams have won titles but if that 8 teams won them from 1957 backwards!  So for the last 60 odd years the cup has been shared between 12 teams with a Kerry and Dublin having 28 of them!!!  The gap has always been there and frankly always will. That's the way of sport and rarely will it change.

Another thing that has changed is the qualifiers - it gave Kildare a 2nd bit of the cherry in terms of getting a hammering.
I'd imagine that for a fair chunk of the bottom 16 teams that if they were drawn against Dublin and Kerry in the same year, the odds of receiving 2 hammerings would be fairly high.
Before the qualifiers the worst teams only had to worry about receiving 1 hammering - now depending on how the qualifier draw goes, they have to worry about two.

The record of the Division 4 teams this year was played 20, lost 17.
2 of the wins were where 1 Division 4 side played another and the sole win against a team outside Division 4 was Laois's disaster against Antrim. Forget the talk about a two tier system the bottom-level needs to be kept apart from the middle level otherwise there will still be teams just making up the numbers and not competing. If they are not going to be competing for Sam anyway, at least have them at a level where they get competitive games.

[Darby]

Dublin deserve the most funding. Do they deserve 51% of the funding? No. They get 1.46 million from central council, Cork are in 2nd with 69,000. But at least Cork, Tipp, Kerry, Kilkenny, Mayo etc can attract excellent sponsors and fundraising. Professional approach has gone through the roof since 2003, and now money is more important than ever. Even up what you give to everyone, see a difference. It's not rocket science.

For the record, I'm not bashing Dublin. Dublin and Kerry are not just helped by cash. They both have an outstanding tradition which has helped breed success.

[FermGael]

Where to begin? I think it's better to start at the beginning.
At the start of the year Fermanagh were third favourites to get relegated to division 4. We were not given a chance of promotion and McGrath would have been under a bit of pressure as some Fermanagh people were questioning his tactics and if he could adapt to the modern game.  We had lost another couple of quality footballers to retirement in Barry Owens and Tommy McElroy and we had a largely young untested team. 
We won promotion quite convincingly finishing top of the league and were then defeated in a league final by Armagh. 
Beat Antrim in the first round despite playing terribly and had managed to keep in touch of Monaghan until we had a man sent off.   Then we hit the qualifiers where McGrath set the team a target of playing football in August which they achieved.
Then we played Dublin and got beat despite a spirited last 10 minutes.The scenes at the end of the match were a lot to do with where the majority of the Fermanagh were sitting which was around the middle of the Hogan.
What choice did the players have? Walk down the tunnel in a huff, ignore the fans ? I can just imagine what sort of reaction that would have gotten.   All they did was thank the supporters for there support but if you listened to most of the Fermanagh interviews after the match you could see the focus was all ready about an Ulster title next year.  That has to be the focus.
In fairness to Fermanagh we are blessed in having a first class school that has been producing county footballers for the last 25 years in St Michael's and we have been very competitive at schools level across Ulster.  But our underage record has been terrible.  We have won one or two minor games in the last 20 years.  That's where our issue is.  That's why Club Eirne was reformed this year as a way of raising money for the county.  According to an interview in last weeks paper we have now over 120 members each giving between £500 and £1000 per year.   Events like a qualifier run make that an easier sell. 
We also have a number of players who have not made themselves available for one reason or another ( and I do not include Seamie Quigley in that as that ship has sailed FFS Malachy O'Rourke, Peter Canavan and now Pete McGrath have now all omitted him from there panels for one reason or another). Next year should be an easier sell to some of those players who will have seen how much the Fermanagh set up has progressed.
In 2003 we got thumped by Tyrone in an All Ireland quarter final.  17 points I believe.  A year later we were back and managed to get to the next stage. The 04 team were a special group of lads but always remember some of the best players in the county refused to play for them that year.  A certain Donegal manager springs to mind.

As for Jim's article I think he missed the point.  In fact I remember Donegal getting a hammering one year from Mayo in a quarter or semi final by at least 10 points I think and they regrouped even better the next year.  He has a short memory.  As others have stated if the Gaa really want to help weaker counties they will increase funding. Any 'a' and ''b' tiered championship will just increase the gap between top and bottom. Crowds will be there for the 'a' tier games but it will be die hards only for the 'b' games.  That means even less money at the gate for the weaker counties. The issue is funding and the Gaa have to deal with it. 

Fermanagh had a good year and the hope now is to build on it next year in division 2 and then push on for that Ulster title.

Oh and Cluxton made a mistake.  He's the best keeper in Ireland by a country mile.  The pinpoint accuracy of his kickouts was amazing.

[wanderer]

I might be in the minority but I watched the game back and I don't see all these players who were celebrating getting beaten?? I Have spoken to a few of the players since and they were somewhere between bemused and grateful for all the support and goodwill they had received this year. Obviously they shouldn't have stayed on the pitch and acknowledged their families, club mates, friends and neighbours but they stupidly thought that the GAA had something to do with communities in their uncoached and poorly media trained minds.

Personally I would rather have a team that is able to acknowledge that they lost to a better team, rather than blame fixture scheduling, referee's and every other reason & conspiracy under than sun. 

As a Fermanagh man I am proud of the team doing close to their best (not their best, as I believe there is more to come) but all success is relative and at the end of the day there will be 31 failures of counties in Ireland based on the criteria in this thread, and come the 3rd weekend in September I have no doubt Dublin will be 1 of 31

[rrhf]

Ignore the cynical bastards

[trileacman]

Where to begin? I think it's better to start at the beginning.
At the start of the year Fermanagh were third favourites to get relegated to division 4. We were not given a chance of promotion and McGrath would have been under a bit of pressure as some Fermanagh people were questioning his tactics and if he could adapt to the modern game.  We had lost another couple of quality footballers to retirement in Barry Owens and Tommy McElroy and we had a largely young untested team. 
We won promotion quite convincingly finishing top of the league and were then defeated in a league final by Armagh. 
Beat Antrim in the first round despite playing terribly and had managed to keep in touch of Monaghan until we had a man sent off.   Then we hit the qualifiers where McGrath set the team a target of playing football in August which they achieved.
Then we played Dublin and got beat despite a spirited last 10 minutes.The scenes at the end of the match were a lot to do with where the majority of the Fermanagh were sitting which was around the middle of the Hogan.
What choice did the players have? Walk down the tunnel in a huff, ignore the fans ? I can just imagine what sort of reaction that would have gotten.   All they did was thank the supporters for there support but if you listened to most of the Fermanagh interviews after the match you could see the focus was all ready about an Ulster title next year.  That has to be the focus.
In fairness to Fermanagh we are blessed in having a first class school that has been producing county footballers for the last 25 years in St Michael's and we have been very competitive at schools level across Ulster.  But our underage record has been terrible.  We have won one or two minor games in the last 20 years.  That's where our issue is.  That's why Club Eirne was reformed this year as a way of raising money for the county.  According to an interview in last weeks paper we have now over 120 members each giving between £500 and £1000 per year.   Events like a qualifier run make that an easier sell. 
We also have a number of players who have not made themselves available for one reason or another ( and I do not include Seamie Quigley in that as that ship has sailed FFS Malachy O'Rourke, Peter Canavan and now Pete McGrath have now all omitted him from there panels for one reason or another). Next year should be an easier sell to some of those players who will have seen how much the Fermanagh set up has progressed.
In 2003 we got thumped by Tyrone in an All Ireland quarter final.  17 points I believe.  A year later we were back and managed to get to the next stage. The 04 team were a special group of lads but always remember some of the best players in the county refused to play for them that year.  A certain Donegal manager springs to mind.

As for Jim's article I think he missed the point.  In fact I remember Donegal getting a hammering one year from Mayo in a quarter or semi final by at least 10 points I think and they regrouped even better the next year.  He has a short memory.  As others have stated if the Gaa really want to help weaker counties they will increase funding. Any 'a' and ''b' tiered championship will just increase the gap between top and bottom. Crowds will be there for the 'a' tier games but it will be die hards only for the 'b' games.  That means even less money at the gate for the weaker counties. The issue is funding and the Gaa have to deal with it. 

Fermanagh had a good year and the hope now is to build on it next year in division 2 and then push on for that Ulster title.

Oh and Cluxton made a mistake.  He's the best keeper in Ireland by a country mile.  The pinpoint accuracy of his kickouts was amazing.

Forgot that. p***k.

[nrico2006]

Monaghan has a bigger population than Fermanagh,

They have double the "GAA minded" population of Fermanagh.
Fermanagh have to be quite pleased with their 2015 achievements overall, (yet have no shiny cup or cupeen to show for it all) and were enjoying a rare big Championship day out in Croker so good luck to them.
However will they ever ( or Leitrim, Longford or Carlow ) ever have a big day out with a chance of winning there?

You're a Roscommon man correct? You tell them !

Roscommon a County with 10 All Ireland Titles across the grades, one of very few (Galway/Meath/?? ) Counties to have beaten Kerry in All Ireland Finals in all four grades of football, reached 2 U21 Finals in this decade, Won a Club AI this decade, are now ( maybe briefly) a Div 1 team, Won a Minor AI in the last ten years, Have countless Provincial Titles ( 12 in the 21st Century).
Yeah sure how could we think we might do better than Fermanagh, Leitrim, Carlow or Longford. Mind you the latter aren't doing badly at underage in recent years either.

Greatest county of all time™

Tyrone have also beaten Kerry in minor, u-21 and senior finals.