A United Ireland. Opening up the discussion.

[playwiththewind1st]

For the benefit of those who claim to be Nationalists but are stuck in a partitioning mindset and also stuck in the 19 30s -
The Irish Free State went out of existence EIGHTY YEARS AGO today.

#OTD in Irish History – 29 December:  stairnaheireann.net
Constitution Day (Ireland)


1937 – The new Constitution of Ireland (Bunreacht na hÉireann) repealed the 1922 Constitution, and came into effect on this date, after having been passed by a national plebiscite the previous July.

Sure - we were completely sold down the river in December 1921. So those bits afterwards don't matter that much.

But if that hadnt happened what could ye use to justify the big chips on your shoulders?
In any case it took ye a long time to do anything about it

We were waiting for you lot to sort out the 26 county theocracy situation first. Took ye long enough to make a start on that.

[Rossfan]

Ye'd want to sort out ye're own theocracy before we'll let ye join us.
It's one of Tony's proudest boasts that Nordies are so much less secular than us 26 Co folk.

[imtommygunn]

I don't go to mass any more but one of the last masses i was at was a 26 county priest preaching on how secular we had become...(with powerpoint slides and everything...)

[playwiththewind1st]

It's one of Tony's proudest boasts that he is so much less secular & sane than us 26 Co folk.

That's nearer the truth.

[AQMP]

Some interesting figures in the latest Lucid Talk poll in the wee 6.

First preference votes (Feb 2018)

DUP:  33.6%
SF:     32.4%
UUP:  10.3%
SDLP:  8.6%
ALL:  8.0%
TUV:  2.3%
GRN:  1.9%
PBP:  1.7%

Age Breakdown: Aged: 18-44

SF:  38.7%
DUP:  29.2%%
SDLP:  9.1%
UUP:  8.6%
ALL:  7.8%

Some food for thought for Unionists there...

[RedHand88]

Some interesting figures in the latest Lucid Talk poll in the wee 6.

First preference votes (Feb 2018)

DUP:  33.6%
SF:     32.4%
UUP:  10.3%
SDLP:  8.6%
ALL:  8.0%
TUV:  2.3%
GRN:  1.9%
PBP:  1.7%

Age Breakdown: Aged: 18-44

SF:  38.7%
DUP:  29.2%%
SDLP:  9.1%
UUP:  8.6%
ALL:  7.8%

Some food for thought for Unionists there...

"DUP call for eligible voting age to be raised to 45."

[armaghniac]

In 20 years the two big nationalist parties would be 45% (36+8) and the two big unionist parties 40% (31+9). Now you'd had TUVS, PBPs and so on as well. But clearly nationalism is the bigger block. The belief always was that the middle ground would stick with the status quo, but Brexit has shown that the status quo isn't always entirely stable.

Interesting times, indeed.

[RedHand88]

In 20 years the two big nationalist parties would be 45% (36+8) and the two big unionist parties 40% (31+9). Now you'd had TUVS, PBPs and so on as well. But clearly nationalism is the bigger block. The belief always was that the middle ground would stick with the status quo, but Brexit has shown that the status quo isn't always entirely stable.

Interesting times, indeed.

What this doesnt take into account is that the majority of those passing the 18 mark are Nationalists, mostly SF. So the difference in 20 years will be greater than it looks here.

[AQMP]

In 20 years the two big nationalist parties would be 45% (36+8) and the two big unionist parties 40% (31+9). Now you'd had TUVS, PBPs and so on as well. But clearly nationalism is the bigger block. The belief always was that the middle ground would stick with the status quo, but Brexit has shown that the status quo isn't always entirely stable.

Interesting times, indeed.

If I were Arlene and Doddsie I'd dust off that agreement they ran away from sharpish!

[armaghniac]

In 20 years the two big nationalist parties would be 45% (36+8) and the two big unionist parties 40% (31+9). Now you'd had TUVS, PBPs and so on as well. But clearly nationalism is the bigger block. The belief always was that the middle ground would stick with the status quo, but Brexit has shown that the status quo isn't always entirely stable.

Interesting times, indeed.

What this doesnt take into account is that the majority of those passing the 18 mark are Nationalists, mostly SF. So the difference in 20 years will be greater than it looks here.

It does, more or less, take this into account.
Basically I am assuming that in 40 years time the current 18-44 figures will be the proportion and 20 years is half way there.

If I were Arlene and Doddsie I'd dust off that agreement they ran away from sharpish!

Yet, the U105 discussion showed that DUP supporters had hardened against the Irish language act, although the DUP had lost some voters. This is their problem, unlike  SF they have done nothing to prepare their lot for change, so they become more extreme and some of the more reasonable people simply stop voting for them. The unionists have lost their way, instead of making NI a reasonably balanced place so that you wouldn't be bothered with a united Ireland they have beaten the Lambeg drum louder, this makes the ultras feel better but it also means that nationalists and even middle of the road people find NI intolerable. They do not have the leadership to change, when even the likes of Paisley was overthrown.

[BennyCake]

Irrelevant figures. Whether it's SF or DUP with the greater votes, they still won't agree on nothing.

There's a million unionists in the North or near it. Do you think they're just going to go away overnight?

[armaghniac]

Irrelevant figures. Whether it's SF or DUP with the greater votes, they still won't agree on nothing.

There's a million unionists in the North or near it. Do you think they're just going to go away overnight?

Some will go away, rather than live in a united  Ireland. The rest will get on with it.

[johnnycool]

Irrelevant figures. Whether it's SF or DUP with the greater votes, they still won't agree on nothing.

There's a million unionists in the North or near it. Do you think they're just going to go away overnight?

If they're as democratic as they tell us they are then they'll accept the will of the voting public.

[Jim_Murphy_74]

Some interesting figures in the latest Lucid Talk poll in the wee 6.

First preference votes (Feb 2018)

DUP:  33.6%
SF:     32.4%
UUP:  10.3%
SDLP:  8.6%
ALL:  8.0%
TUV:  2.3%
GRN:  1.9%
PBP:  1.7%

Age Breakdown: Aged: 18-44

SF:  38.7%
DUP:  29.2%%
SDLP:  9.1%
UUP:  8.6%
ALL:  7.8%

Some food for thought for Unionists there...

I think this shows that the dreaded "demographic bomb" that many Unionists politicians feared (but claimed wouldn't happen) could come around quicker than they thought.  To tackle this the onus is now on Unionism to act.  Nationalists parties just have to avoid dropping the ball (Keep the sliced pans off the heads, worst nutters off twitter) and they will get their majority.

For example the DUP should be embracing Irish, rights issues etc.  to make sure that they make their vision of Northern Ireland attractive to as many people as possible.  Instead they are battening down the hatches in case of losing a few nutters to the TUV.  You would wonder what informs their strategists.

/Jim.

[Applesisapples]

Jim is correct. But the Unionist psyche is such that they'd rather lose all than give ground. There may be 1m unionists in 20 years time but there will be 1.2 m nationalists and they will have to face up to it. The GFA though was designed in such a way that roles would reverse but the institutions remain, if they ever get started again. In those circumstances I hope nationalists show more generosity than currently being displayed by unionism.