Documentaries

Started by 5 Sams, July 14, 2013, 08:56:14 PM

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Jeepers Creepers

Quote from: Fear Bun Na Sceilpe on September 17, 2020, 10:20:40 AM
Anyone else think it odd that in the wake of this overdue documentary most social media mentions are rounding on the south rather than on the perpetrators?

These aren't new overnight revelations but far alot in the South they are.

brokencrossbar1

Quote from: Harold Disgracey on September 17, 2020, 09:22:34 AM
Growing up in Portadown none of this is new to me, and it continued into the 90s with Billy Wright and his crew. Watching the families, a lot of them I know very well, brings it home as to how easily it could have been me standing in their place. I suppose we were lucky enough only to be put out of our house in what is now a loyalist area in 1972.

The show means an awful lot to me as I would know a number of the families very well. Very few people round our way would not have known someone who wasn't impacted by the Donnelly's bar attack or the Reavey's killings. I was born on the 17th December 1975, the same day as Roisin Brecknell. Our mothers were in hospital together, our fathers would have spoken to each other in the hospital. They spoke with each other about going for a drink but my dad couldn't go as he had to look after my older brother and sister.  The 19th December was Black Eye Friday, the workmen from a local joinery factory were out for their Christmas party. My uncle was one of them. My great uncle was also there as he was a regular. My family members were lucky. The sliding doors of the universe meant my father picked up my siblings from my granny. There would have been a strong chance he would have been beside or close to Trevor when he died.

I went to Cullyhanna primary school, as did Roisin Brecknell, and Alan and Mark. The boys were older, round the same age as my brother. They were friends in primary school. I vividly remember my brother went to their house for a birthday party wearing his new jeans and they were all climbing walls and he ripped the shite out of the jeans. My mother went spare. Roisin and I would always have been in the same groups in early primary school because of our age. We were friends, as much as a boy and a girl can be friends at 7 years of age!

As I got older, and interested in football I would have heard about 2 football competitions between Cullyhanna and Silverbridge. The Trevor Brecknell and the Michael Donnelly Cups. The names never meant anything to a 10 year old who's friends or their brothers always boasted about having won medals on these cups. Most of my friends were either Bridge or Cullyhanna men....I chased the glory with Cross at the grand old age of 8!  It was only later in my life that I understood what those cups were. I knew about the Donnelly's attack. I knew it had been bad. I would have been out to Donnelly's for years as a child, to the shop and later to the Post Office when it moved from Nan Savages round the corner. My mum would have collected my Granny's pension and her Ireland's Own and People's Friend. I didn't understand but knew something wasn't right.

As I became a teenager it became clearer to me. I became more aware of our local history, my mum tried to keep us sheltered. We were not political. But you become aware of it as it's staring at you daily. As I got older my views hardened but never that hard. We are tight round our area and even if we don't agree with some things that happened most people understand why they did.

As I go older I became friends with members of the Reavey family but still didn't know as much as I should. I found out what happened. I know them very well, Eugene Reavey is a man I admire more than most people in the world. His desire to see justice done and his unfailing love of the GAA makes us kindred spirits and his dignity in such dreadful circumstances is amazing.

Will this program make any difference? Who knows but if it educates people as to what really went on then it has made a difference. Both British and Irish governments have covered this up so I would not expect there to be anything from them.

general_lee

Eugene Reavey's dignity in the face of the most brutal circumstances is admirable. His message of peace and reconciliation is something I don't think I'd be able to reciprocate had I been in his shoes. Likewise Alan Brecknell.

J70

Reading these personal accounts drives home how lucky some of us were just to grow up in a time and place where we didn't have to deal with this shit. I grew up in south Donegal in the 70s and 80s about ten miles from the border, but due to simple geology (i.e. mountains/bogland) and the closing of remote rural border crossings, we were in actual fact pretty far removed from what was happening, even in geographically close areas such as west Tyrone and north Fermanagh. Yes, you'd obviously hear about it, but as a kid, I never personally knew anyone who was hurt or involved. Even once older, you'd hear about so-and-so locally who might, say, have got caught up in internment, but that was about it.

Itchy

So after all that not a sniff of a follow up from RTE, Newstalk, Indo, Times, Miriam O Callaghan, Matt Cooper, Ivan Yates and the rest of our media heros. 120 people accused murdered by the British security forces and their chums and nothing.

Yet, prior to the 2020 General Election the Murder of Paul Quinn was brought up and his family used to bash Sinn Fein and that was across the board on all platforms, wall to wall coverage.

So is there anyone out there that is still stupid enough to believe that the mainstream media in this country are anything but corrupt lackies of the powers that be?

GetOverTheBar

Quote from: Itchy on September 18, 2020, 11:21:08 AM
So after all that not a sniff of a follow up from RTE, Newstalk, Indo, Times, Miriam O Callaghan, Matt Cooper, Ivan Yates and the rest of our media heros. 120 people accused murdered by the British security forces and their chums and nothing.

Yet, prior to the 2020 General Election the Murder of Paul Quinn was brought up and his family used to bash Sinn Fein and that was across the board on all platforms, wall to wall coverage.

So is there anyone out there that is still stupid enough to believe that the mainstream media in this country are anything but corrupt lackies of the powers that be?

Nobody gave a sh*t about Paul Quinn during that whole disgraceful agenda. It was actually vile to see that being played out in public for a particular political end.

Taylor

Quote from: GetOverTheBar on September 18, 2020, 11:30:48 AM
Quote from: Itchy on September 18, 2020, 11:21:08 AM
So after all that not a sniff of a follow up from RTE, Newstalk, Indo, Times, Miriam O Callaghan, Matt Cooper, Ivan Yates and the rest of our media heros. 120 people accused murdered by the British security forces and their chums and nothing.

Yet, prior to the 2020 General Election the Murder of Paul Quinn was brought up and his family used to bash Sinn Fein and that was across the board on all platforms, wall to wall coverage.

So is there anyone out there that is still stupid enough to believe that the mainstream media in this country are anything but corrupt lackies of the powers that be?

Nobody gave a sh*t about Paul Quinn during that whole disgraceful agenda. It was actually vile to see that being played out in public for a particular political end.

I said that at the time - Paul Quinn's murder was used for political gain. That was pretty clear.

The lack of media attention isnt really that shocking is it?

Unquiet Graves has been released for quite some time. RTE refused to show it earlier.
Everyone in the media knew the content of the show.

Imagine the bombers & murderers of your own people in your capital city getting next to no coverage.

The lack of media attention shows their true colours.

Boycey


brokencrossbar1

It was long overdue to be shown but the reaction, or more correctly lack of reaction, is symptomatic of what the general approach to the north has been for the last 100 years. We, in the wee six, are the tint of the litter and we are lucky that we haven't been put down a long time ago. Our 'heroes' do not have the legitimacy of the Pearse's, Connolly's, Collins, Dev or whoever fought against the perfidious Albion for all those years, well at least until 1920. Our suffering is not as bad as the poor Irish men down the country to warrant actual support and assistance. We were not burned out of our homes, we were not kept under effective military control for decades, we were not abused, targeted nor discriminated against. And if we were all of these sure it was our own fault, isn't that right Regina?

I would ask any of the 'ruling' parties to imagine one day in the life of Eugene Reavey, or Alan Brecknell, or any of the families from Monaghan or Dublin bombings. They can never appreciate not want to appreciate what went on up here.

BennyCake

Quote from: Itchy on September 18, 2020, 11:21:08 AM
So after all that not a sniff of a follow up from RTE, Newstalk, Indo, Times, Miriam O Callaghan, Matt Cooper, Ivan Yates and the rest of our media heros. 120 people accused murdered by the British security forces and their chums and nothing.

Yet, prior to the 2020 General Election the Murder of Paul Quinn was brought up and his family used to bash Sinn Fein and that was across the board on all platforms, wall to wall coverage.

So is there anyone out there that is still stupid enough to believe that the mainstream media in this country are anything but corrupt lackies of the powers that be?

Same in every country. RTE and Dublin government are Britain's bitch. Always were.

Main Street

Quote from: bannside on September 17, 2020, 08:31:59 AM
The assertion was that many hawks in the RUC/UDR wanted to escalate violence and indiscrimate sectarian killing in order to bring matters to a point of civil war. The UVF decided that shooting up a school in Beleek was a bridge to far, and I never rhought Id say it, but fair play to the person or persons at that meeting who influenced that outcome!

Things were bad, very bad, but had that event been sanctioned the troubles would have got ten times worse. Every moderate on both sides would have stepped up to get involved.
There was nothing so bad that could not have been worse,  but that's not a comforting factor. The bad stuff that was enacted was state sanctioned, that's the bad part of it. When all the forces of the state are fully employed in enacting the atrocities in order to save the state, there is no fall back to what is commonly understood to be justice.
The 'your side is just as bad as our side' is not an argument when the State sanctions atrocity.

sid waddell

Quote from: Main Street on September 19, 2020, 12:15:38 AM
Quote from: bannside on September 17, 2020, 08:31:59 AM
The assertion was that many hawks in the RUC/UDR wanted to escalate violence and indiscrimate sectarian killing in order to bring matters to a point of civil war. The UVF decided that shooting up a school in Beleek was a bridge to far, and I never rhought Id say it, but fair play to the person or persons at that meeting who influenced that outcome!

Things were bad, very bad, but had that event been sanctioned the troubles would have got ten times worse. Every moderate on both sides would have stepped up to get involved.
There was nothing so bad that could not have been worse,  but that's not a comforting factor. The bad stuff that was enacted was state sanctioned, that's the bad part of it. When all the forces of the state are fully employed in enacting the atrocities in order to save the state, there is no fall back to what is commonly understood to be justice.
The 'your side is just as bad as our side' is not an argument when the State sanctions atrocity.
The implications are, or at least should be worse when it is state sanctioned, as opposed to a group like the IRA - but the hurt inflicted on the families of the victims is equal no matter who commits an atrocity


sid waddell

Quote from: GetOverTheBar on September 18, 2020, 11:30:48 AM
Quote from: Itchy on September 18, 2020, 11:21:08 AM
So after all that not a sniff of a follow up from RTE, Newstalk, Indo, Times, Miriam O Callaghan, Matt Cooper, Ivan Yates and the rest of our media heros. 120 people accused murdered by the British security forces and their chums and nothing.

Yet, prior to the 2020 General Election the Murder of Paul Quinn was brought up and his family used to bash Sinn Fein and that was across the board on all platforms, wall to wall coverage.

So is there anyone out there that is still stupid enough to believe that the mainstream media in this country are anything but corrupt lackies of the powers that be?

Nobody gave a sh*t about Paul Quinn during that whole disgraceful agenda. It was actually vile to see that being played out in public for a particular political end.
It was completely legitimate to bring up the Paul Quinn murder, as it was the Robert McCartney murder, and the Northern Bank robbery

Sinn Fein still have serious questions to answer as regards all of these, they have not convinced in the answers they have given, Mary Lou McDonald couldn't answer the questions put to her abut the Paul Quinn case and Conor Murphy when she was asked these questions in the final election debate earlier this year - and it's not as if she didn't have advance warning she would be asked about it

Ascribing bad faith motives onto others for your own self serving, bad faith reasons is not an argument, it's total deflection

That is as bad faith a motive as it would be if somebody from the British government ascribed a bad faith motive to the makers of Unquiet Graves


Main Street

Quote from: sid waddell on September 19, 2020, 12:33:36 AM
Quote from: Main Street on September 19, 2020, 12:15:38 AM
Quote from: bannside on September 17, 2020, 08:31:59 AM
The assertion was that many hawks in the RUC/UDR wanted to escalate violence and indiscrimate sectarian killing in order to bring matters to a point of civil war. The UVF decided that shooting up a school in Beleek was a bridge to far, and I never rhought Id say it, but fair play to the person or persons at that meeting who influenced that outcome!

Things were bad, very bad, but had that event been sanctioned the troubles would have got ten times worse. Every moderate on both sides would have stepped up to get involved.
There was nothing so bad that could not have been worse,  but that's not a comforting factor. The bad stuff that was enacted was state sanctioned, that's the bad part of it. When all the forces of the state are fully employed in enacting the atrocities in order to save the state, there is no fall back to what is commonly understood to be justice.
The 'your side is just as bad as our side' is not an argument when the State sanctions atrocity.
The implications are, or at least should be worse when it is state sanctioned, as opposed to a group like the IRA - but the hurt inflicted on the families of the victims is equal no matter who commits an atrocity
There is no resort to justice when the state sanctions atrocity but the IRA were subject to the so called justice of the state.
Even a moron like yourself  should be able to tell the diffference and how the scales of "justice" served was perceived.

sid waddell

#209
Quote from: general_lee on September 17, 2020, 01:21:16 PM
Eugene Reavey's dignity in the face of the most brutal circumstances is admirable. His message of peace and reconciliation is something I don't think I'd be able to reciprocate had I been in his shoes. Likewise Alan Brecknell.
I found it very strange some years back when Joe Brolly wrote about the Reavey murders in detail one week - I think as a rebuttal to a vague suggestion by Jarlath Burns that the Irish flag might not be flown at GAA matches - Brolly was asserting that the GAA should not lose its essential Irish nationalist identity - and then the next week he vilified the Creggan Kickhams club because some of Peadar Heffron's team mates did not support his decision to join the PSNI in early 2002

It was appalling what happened to Heffron when he had his life ruined by a car bomb - but Brolly did not seem to understand how a lot of Catholics would have had deep suspicion of the PSNI, at least in the early part of its existence, and that that was a totally legitimate opinion to have

I couldn't understand Brolly's stance - even though I think Heffron's decision to join the PSNI was a brave decision which I think was ultimately vindicated - because the new force required people like him to take such courageous decisions if it was to have any chance of being successful

However I could certainly understand how some people would not have felt the same way at the time